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JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
125. Saudi Arabia, Burma, North Korea,
Mon Feb 2, 2015, 06:34 AM
Feb 2015

President Karzai, Bashar al-Assad... this list goes on and on when it comes to human rights violators.

I'd stop with the (speaking from US foreign policy POV) hypocrisy, stop giving money to financiers of the Wahabbi global terrorist organization. All these bombs, CIA installing Al-Maliki as Prime Minister (and that's just Iraq), and Al-Assad himself for Syria is why they're there.

I disagree why Obama continues to use "tensions" to block torture photos & other crimes committed by the US government but he is right they certainly will use it for propaganda for recruiting (my position is NOT to do these things in the first place)

----

After the 9/11 attacks, the United States quickly declared a "war on terror." In the conduct of that war, the United States invaded Afghanistan and then Iraq, imprisoned hundreds of captured "enemy combatants" without trial, tortured suspected terrorists, drastically ratcheted up homeland security, conducted drone strikes and/or targeted assassinations in several countries, and conducted a vast campaign of electronic surveillance at home and abroad.

Virtually all these actions were designed to detect or eliminate actual terrorists or prevent them from carrying out deliberate attacks. In other words, whether offensive or defensive in nature, they were actions designed to win the war by thwarting or eliminating existing terrorist organizations.

But what about the parallel problem of terrorist recruitment? The other way to defeat terrorism is to make it harder for movements employing terrorist methods to recruit new followers, and to gradually marginalize the radicals within the societies in which they were trying to grow. There was a lot of talk about trying to do this immediately after 9/11: The State Department commissioned a task force report on public diplomacy toward the Arab/Islamic world, George W. Bush’s administration hired a series of public diplomacy czarinas, and various experts offered advice on how the United States could undercut Osama bin Laden’s message and rebuild the country’s dubious image in that part of the world. This goal also underlay Barack Obama’s initial outreach to the region and especially his infamous Cairo speech in June 2009.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/07/26/our-one-sided-war-on-terror/

Austin, Texas — The Islamic State terrorists who have emerged in Iraq and Syria are neither new nor unfamiliar. Many of them spent years in detention centers run by the United States and its coalition partners in Iraq after 2003. Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, the leader of the Islamic State, spent nearly five years imprisoned at Camp Bucca in southern Iraq. A majority of the other top Islamic State leaders were also former prisoners, including: Abu Muslim al-Turkmani, Abu Louay, Abu Kassem, Abu Jurnas, Abu Shema and Abu Suja.

Before their detention, Mr. al-Baghdadi and others were violent radicals, intent on attacking America. Their time in prison deepened their extremism and gave them opportunities to broaden their following. At Camp Bucca, for example, the most radical figures were held alongside less threatening individuals, some of whom were not guilty of any violent crime. Coalition prisons became recruitment centers and training grounds for the terrorists the United States is now fighting.

This process began when coalition forces arrived in Iraq in 2003 and detained alleged terrorists with little preparation or oversight. Although soldiers tried to document the circumstances behind the detentions of Iraqis and foreign fighters, the process broke down under the pressure of fighting, the shortage of trained Arabic speakers, and the fog of war.

Simply being a “suspicious looking” military-aged male in the vicinity of an attack was enough to land one behind bars. There were 26,000 detainees at the height of the war, and over 100,000 individuals passed through the gates of Camps Bucca, Cropper and Taji. Quite a few were dangerous insurgents; many others were innocent.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/02/opinion/how-america-helped-isis.html

The problem is that we felt much the same way for years about the Taliban. potone Feb 2015 #1
It will take all of... YvonneCa Feb 2015 #13
We didn't even TRY in Afghanistan, remember? MH1 Feb 2015 #21
Trying is where we screwed up in Iraq JonLP24 Feb 2015 #124
Cut off ISIS' supply of money from KSA and GCC elites. We know who the funders are - just do it. leveymg Feb 2015 #2
I agree ...You can cut off the funds and it wont stop the killings. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #4
ISIS wouldn't last a month without constant financing from Jeddah and Doha. leveymg Feb 2015 #8
We broke it and made a safe haven for them glasshouses Feb 2015 #3
Air support for the Kurds & Iraqis seems to be working tabasco Feb 2015 #5
This message was self-deleted by its author Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #6
The PKK has apparently decisively defeated ISIS in Kobani. But we can't help them because, um, KingCharlemagne Feb 2015 #7
What, exactly, are you talking about? tabasco Feb 2015 #83
The PKK is the Kurdistan Workers' Party (Partiya Karkeren Kurdistani). While I don't have any links KingCharlemagne Feb 2015 #110
Roosevelt knew we needed to go against the Nazi's long before the American people could be jwirr Feb 2015 #9
Ahhhhhhhhhhhh.....very good. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #10
Reminds me of that PNAC document CJCRANE Feb 2015 #14
I know that there are many who believe that regarding 9/11. And to be fair FDR was accused of jwirr Feb 2015 #16
CJ...How does the world stop ISIS ? Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #17
No response ? Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #42
We'll find out soon enough CJCRANE Feb 2015 #44
So you can envision a scenario where you would support the use of US ground troops? Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #47
If they release the rest of the 9/11 report and the Iraq Inquiry report soon CJCRANE Feb 2015 #48
I wanted to know whether YOU would support the use of US troops. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #50
I don't support the use of US or foreign troops in the region. nt CJCRANE Feb 2015 #51
Thank you. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #53
+100 ND-Dem Feb 2015 #33
It's was Hitler's declaring war on the U.S. that actively involved the country in Europe Lurks Often Feb 2015 #20
I don't blame him for this since he had no idea in 1945 JonLP24 Feb 2015 #127
Do something? 99Forever Feb 2015 #11
******** Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #12
ok then what? qazplm Feb 2015 #15
Apply, lather, rinse, repeat.. 99Forever Feb 2015 #18
99...Take a stand. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #26
We get the fuck out of other nations business... 99Forever Feb 2015 #111
Saudi Arabia, Burma, North Korea, JonLP24 Feb 2015 #125
ISIS was just forced to abandon a city (I forget which one) because of the bombing campaign. randome Feb 2015 #28
A guerilla group just kicked them out of northern iraq. It's not like they're some magic invincible ND-Dem Feb 2015 #34
They think they are. Bomb them with cubicles and they'll come around! randome Feb 2015 #54
as i said: guerillas just kicked them out of iraq. somehow their fearsome invincibleness did not ND-Dem Feb 2015 #67
Everybody LiberalElite Feb 2015 #19
Thats what i was getting at . Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #24
I really don't like IS. And think there's little we should do about it directly. Igel Feb 2015 #22
Choices: AngryAmish Feb 2015 #23
Air, fuel Munitions H. Cromwell Feb 2015 #25
Yours is the first tactical military response. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #27
Let Kurdish communist separatists deal with it. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #36
Another ******** Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #39
***** yourself. if you can't rebut the argument, why resort to disguised name-calling? ND-Dem Feb 2015 #41
Using military force WILL NOT defeat ISIS. They'll just morph into another terrorist group BlueCaliDem Feb 2015 #37
Not enough discntnt_irny_srcsm Feb 2015 #45
Cut off their funds by freezing their bank accounts. You don't think ISIS is caring millions of BlueCaliDem Feb 2015 #29
Sounds wonderful. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #30
Yeah. History on war itself. eom BlueCaliDem Feb 2015 #35
But then we miss out on the righteous bloodshed as we smite the wicked. Boring Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #64
Historical proof of what JonLP24 Feb 2015 #128
I'm not an ISIS propaganda expert JonLP24 Feb 2015 #129
Under principle of ' Never Again' need international military force on point Feb 2015 #31
This can be largely a local affair. Comrade Grumpy Feb 2015 #32
Grumpy... I was waiting for you. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #40
The goal is not to throw Turkey out of NATO, but to change it's behavior. Comrade Grumpy Feb 2015 #120
That is because they don't like Assad JonLP24 Feb 2015 #131
Wow... "needs to be pressured to behave" Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #138
+1000. nt. polly7 Feb 2015 #76
Yet another existential threat to humanity? guillaumeb Feb 2015 #38
And I think that is the problem with those trying to say our best response is "Stay out of it" stevenleser Feb 2015 #58
world cop guillaumeb Feb 2015 #60
Your rhetoric is not an answer to the question posed by the OP. Try again. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #63
Au contraire guillaumeb Feb 2015 #80
Nope. The answer to what to do about ISIS is not "America bad" stevenleser Feb 2015 #85
ignore the point 101 guillaumeb Feb 2015 #86
You have no point that addresses the question of the OP. Nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #97
Actually, yes. They did answer the question. Hissyspit Feb 2015 #89
No, they didn't. Nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #96
Off the top rope for the win with one simple word... "blowback." Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #88
thanks guillaumeb Feb 2015 #94
The cave man thinking on this thread amounts to "Enough gasoline will put out that fire." Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #99
Nope, that is not an answer to the OP, or alternate suggestion to mine. Nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #95
You mean your "bomb our way out of this problem we bombed our way into" was serious? Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #100
choices guillaumeb Feb 2015 #115
No, it means that person has to come up with an idea of some sort, they didn't. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #117
re: "So what do you want to do about it?" discntnt_irny_srcsm Feb 2015 #43
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2015 #46
start a REAL war....or not, decision needed quadrature Feb 2015 #49
You don't have any tough choice to make at all. Hissyspit Feb 2015 #90
Not much. Donald Ian Rankin Feb 2015 #52
Great honest answer. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #55
I wish I had a better one. Donald Ian Rankin Feb 2015 #66
Mexican Drug Cartels Astrad Feb 2015 #56
+100. It's interesting to see who's for US intervention. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #70
Have Congress issue Letters Marque and Reprisal authorizing Zetas to eliminate Daesh AngryAmish Feb 2015 #81
My ideas would violate the Geneva Convention I suspect Generic Brad Feb 2015 #57
Porn, drugs, booze and video games. Just air drop that shit on top of them all the time. Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #59
amen guillaumeb Feb 2015 #65
Step 1: stop funding the problem Man from Pickens Feb 2015 #61
+100 ND-Dem Feb 2015 #68
One critical flaw in the logic of your post... crusades are awesome! Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #72
they should be taken out militarily asap. samsingh Feb 2015 #62
Erect Bogeyman, wave flag, declare we need protection, give more money to the MIC. Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2015 #69
I could take Rhinodawg's posts about ISIS more seriously if he wasn't also running around here alcibiades_mystery Feb 2015 #71
Green energy. Remove the impetus for the western energy industry to be there. Marr Feb 2015 #73
Great answer. I agree. nt CJCRANE Feb 2015 #105
Want? Send Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, & Co. moondust Feb 2015 #74
They wouldn't know how to clean up GP6971 Feb 2015 #77
I think it's worth a try. n/t moondust Feb 2015 #78
Scott Walker agrees that we "should do something". Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2015 #75
Deal with the source of the ISIS problem. Take three steps back in international actions since 9/11 kelliekat44 Feb 2015 #79
Obama's military has been smart so far Warpy Feb 2015 #82
You're like their publicist whatchamacallit Feb 2015 #84
Terrorists, your game is through cause now you have ta answer to America, Fuck yeah! So lick my butt Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #87
I think we should fuck some more shit up. Hissyspit Feb 2015 #91
Thing about the middle east, dig that hole deep enough you'll hit oil someday right? Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #103
Now hear me out, The US Gov puts a bounty, dead or alive, of $500 a head on ISIS ChosenUnWisely Feb 2015 #92
you want shit blown up and people killed KG Feb 2015 #93
Not people, brown people big difference. Brown people we want to kill are savages and savages Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #101
You aren't defending ISIS, are you? WinkyDink Feb 2015 #102
If that is what you are reading you have a serious reading comprehension issue. Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #104
Is it OK if we support the Kurds in their efforts to get fucking ISIS out of Kurdistan? Warren Stupidity Feb 2015 #119
This message was self-deleted by its author Exultant Democracy Feb 2015 #121
well, like we did after WWII in Japan .... which went from dictatorship to democracy. kwassa Feb 2015 #98
Because the Islamic State continues to expand the battlefield by directing its followers Agnosticsherbet Feb 2015 #106
Yes, ISIS = Nazi Germany whatchamacallit Feb 2015 #107
We should get the hell out of the ME! napi21 Feb 2015 #108
Air support of reliable friendlies on the ground. MannyGoldstein Feb 2015 #109
Stop being a crutch for regional powers, get out of dodge making in clear to the local TheKentuckian Feb 2015 #112
Really ? I guess I'll just say... Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #113
Whatever is done, it must be a united world wide effort pathansen Feb 2015 #114
I'm not sure that will happen. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #116
They've stepped out on civilization. Warren Stupidity Feb 2015 #118
Number two is why ISIS is there JonLP24 Feb 2015 #126
You forgot a few options. Their social media policy shows some vunherabilities... Violet_Crumble Feb 2015 #122
Syrian Women Know How to Defeat ISIS JonLP24 Feb 2015 #123
Get the hell out of the Middle East! Chemisse Feb 2015 #130
I prefer containment. Vattel Feb 2015 #132
"Everybody" makes your statement wrong. LWolf Feb 2015 #133
Well, I guess i meant "the vast majority of people here". Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #135
That's why LWolf Feb 2015 #140
I've always felt not flooding the region with money and weapons would be a good start. raouldukelives Feb 2015 #134
Execute a prisoner of theirs every time they kill a civilian. Waiting For Everyman Feb 2015 #136
Thank you for your honest response. Rhinodawg Feb 2015 #137
I imagine a lot of people don't pretend to have absolute answers... LanternWaste Feb 2015 #139
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