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In reply to the discussion: Ironically, once you decide a person or group is "stupid," you are relieved from thinking about them [View all]Orrex
(63,172 posts)203. Again and again you misstate my position
And you pretend that I don't understand yours.
Honestly though, you act like words haven't historically been used and intended as violence.
Nowhere have I suggested that, so I have no need to respond to that false claim.
They are used against people of color and homosexuals and women constantly. You're pretending as if that can't be the case. That there's nothing there because on the scale those little words can't harm somebody.
Equally ignoring this bit of scolding condescension because it depends on your false claim above.
And it is simple. When you insist on telling somebody that he or she is stupid, what is your angle? You are just saying it matter of factly? You don't actually intend to insult them? You don't want them to feel shame or humiliation? Clearly, from the posts on this subject, claiming that would be bullshit.
Significantly, I note that you are not stupid, and as such I refuse to accept that your question here is genuine.
In identifying a Trump voter "stupid," or more specifically "fucking stupid," I am calling them out for a disastrously terrible decision that is already having serious worldwide negative repercussions. These are adults who are making stupid decisions that will cause real and lasting harm, and I'm not at all interested in your scolding admonitions. By their stupid actions we shall know them, and therefore I call them out for their stupidity.
Frankly, Squinch has already destroyed your entire position from top to bottom, so rather than having me rehash those posts, I encourage you to read them again for yourself.
If you want to engage in that, they are not going to be destroyed because of your approach, they will just be even less likely to hear us. They will feel your intentions as violent. It doesn't fucking matter if they themselves are violent. That is so beside the point.
This once again is the scolding admonition that we must "reach out to" and "understand" and "empathize with" the unrepentant Trump voter, to which I say again: fuck that.
Short of an actual catastrophe, no amount of reasoning or evidence or fact will persuade them that their vote for Trump was a terrible decision, so it is simply a waste of effort to try. Before you scold me again, that's not dehumanizing anything: it's recognizing futility and cutting my losses.
I'm not pulling this out of thin air, either. Since January I've already spoken with dozens of Trump voters who are blaming Obama (excuse me: they're blaming "Barry HUSSEIN Obummer" for the consequences of Trump's actions, and they reject any proof or evidence to the contrary. In these interactions I am much more sympathetic than I am here, owing to the different format and venue, but it makes no difference. They aren't interested in my empathy or my understanding: they are certain of their beliefs, and anyone who challenges them is some kind of anti-American gay-loving Liberal snowflake.
Further, this is why Liberals lose: Conservatives pull every dirty trick they can manage in order to undermine and disenfranchise Liberals--all while those same Liberals are blithely taking the high road straight into irrelevance. Fuck that.
Look, you can keep on scolding me if it helps satisfy your sense of sanctimony. Your argument has been completely destroyed at least several times in this thread by at least several different DUers, and despite your calls for understanding, it's clear that you're much more interested in preaching than in understanding the views of your fellow Liberals.
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Ironically, once you decide a person or group is "stupid," you are relieved from thinking about them [View all]
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
OP
Hitler and his followers were deplorable and degenerate. As I said some were very intelligent.
DemocratSinceBirth
Feb 2017
#7
I do think there comes a time when one does need to de-humanize an enemy and fight.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#18
They dehumanize me everyday. They want to ban muslims, stop and frisk me, deport my family
bravenak
Feb 2017
#110
They may very well be unreachable and action may be necessary to revoke some power from them
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#20
I agree with you but DU is a place for venting. And largely falling in line with the group.
KittyWampus
Feb 2017
#5
Um, okay that was cute, but tell you what, rather than assuming your logic sucks, as the poster I
JCanete
Feb 2017
#135
thinking that there is a pronounced inferiority that people have in an area such as intelligence,
JCanete
Feb 2017
#170
no. to do something stupid is not the same as to be stupid. To err is not the same thing as to be an
JCanete
Feb 2017
#176
To call somebody stupid is to make assumptions about the context via which they came to their
JCanete
Feb 2017
#184
as I said elsewhere it has all the baggage. You can mean it and hear it one way, but people will
JCanete
Feb 2017
#188
Well, far be it from me to use a word according to its definition around here...
1965Comet
Feb 2017
#191
nonsense, you're playing games. When we have posts that say, "Yes, we are saying you are stupid!"
JCanete
Feb 2017
#194
Except that theoretically jaywalking is victimless. It certainly isn't knowingly intended to insult
JCanete
Feb 2017
#202
I'm not pretending. I clearly just dont' know what your position is. You denied that words intended
JCanete
Feb 2017
#204
What does stupid mean to you? You might have a very specific sense of its definition. It has a hell
JCanete
Feb 2017
#178
oh, we aren't having a conversation. The closest thing you came to addressing in my post was that
JCanete
Feb 2017
#180
"I won't let the fact that the Lego Batman Movie was produced by Steven Mnuchin detract from my..."
DemocratSinceBirth
Feb 2017
#95
So what's your red line? Obviously, racism and misogyny are not. How about
KingCharlemagne
Feb 2017
#13
I am not certain where that line would be - the line where I decide others are so deviant they need
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#39
Violence doesn't alleviate beliefs but often neither does informing of facts, debate, or dialogue.
manicraven
Feb 2017
#157
Condescension and self congratulation doesn't seem to be off limits for them either.
Squinch
Feb 2017
#103
No, "stupid" is actually more than just an insult. It's a measure for a person's intelligence.
DetlefK
Feb 2017
#15
Well, for me, you would have to go much further in order to even assert there is an objective
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#32
I think they're stupid and I also would like to see that change. Don't you think they were ripe for
BeckyDem
Feb 2017
#16
Yes, I do think they were ripe and susceptible to a bully who exploits their prejudices about
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#33
Frankly, and perhaps my standards are ridiculous, but I saw some of that in this past presidential
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#42
Never heard of it before. I looked at one review from the NYT and I am curious what you think
BeckyDem
Feb 2017
#152
I think the stuff about neurophysiology is somewhat tangential to the main point of the film.
Crunchy Frog
Feb 2017
#163
I would like to view it myself. I think you would agree there is no one decisive
BeckyDem
Feb 2017
#185
These people are darlings. We should put them on our holiay card list
DemocratSinceBirth
Feb 2017
#17
Exactly. And to be clear, I would not waste any time defending Trump voters.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#34
Oh no. For instance I think about the crazy, degenerate assholes at JPR from time to time
ismnotwasm
Feb 2017
#22
I don't think I said anything of the kind. A bigot is a definable trait, "stupidity" is not.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#44
Excellent points. The global perspective makes the problem exponentially more incendiary.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#45
Fair enough. I am often challenged by when to use "I" "You" "One" "We" etc.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#37
Yes. I understand as best I can - I do not have the same issues as you, obviously.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#43
there's no penalty in American politics if one "looks small and resentful" and there's zero reason
geek tragedy
Feb 2017
#70
It's also true that the greater majority of those objecting to calling racists, racists -
Maru Kitteh
Feb 2017
#65
I agree with your observations and the sentiments you express with much of this post.
Maru Kitteh
Feb 2017
#74
Calling people deplorables is unlikely to raise their awareness of the current political situation.
jalan48
Feb 2017
#58
There are people who think certain races are stupid humans. Do you think that isn't dehumanizing? nt
JCanete
Feb 2017
#76
You can resent it all you want. What works is what matters. Saying you're not going to sit and nod
JCanete
Feb 2017
#78
Like I said, deciding to opt out of that work is entirely understandable. Also, again, nobody here
JCanete
Feb 2017
#115
Yes. Stupid and Deplorable ... exactly correct. There are no two ways about it.
NurseJackie
Feb 2017
#72
and how would you do that? Even if your diagnosis of who can change and who cannot is wrong, I'm all
JCanete
Feb 2017
#82
That's about right. People can choose to do what they want to, but being aware of what
JCanete
Feb 2017
#80
yep, great post! And when you diagnose a people as this "other" you make yourself blind to the
JCanete
Feb 2017
#75
wow, that was super insightful, thanks for chiming in. Changed my mind! what the hell Brav
JCanete
Feb 2017
#113
Like there's really a shortage of lectures for the right wing bigots on DU. LOLZ
KittyWampus
Feb 2017
#93
NAFTA made the Deplorable threaten to sodomize a woman in a hijab ?
DemocratSinceBirth
Feb 2017
#105
My opinion of engaging those ideologies is by calling them out as racists, bigots, sexists, etc.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#159
It isn't about whether their behavior is unacceptable. It isn't about trying to get you to accept
JCanete
Feb 2017
#121
Why should a black woman like me not think it is STUPID to vote for a guy who thinks I'm lazy?
bravenak
Feb 2017
#128
For the same reason that person shouldn't think a black person who doesn't have a job is lazy.
JCanete
Feb 2017
#134
but it won't work. WE don't have the numbers to shame them out of existence. They have bubbles they
JCanete
Feb 2017
#138
As a white folk who used to be a dumbass, or far more dumbass than I am now if you like, I disagree
JCanete
Feb 2017
#140
Understood. Had another post going before reading this, but I think that even if people who don't
JCanete
Feb 2017
#144
...and as an addendum, I don't know how to reconcile that with not making you feel sold out. That
JCanete
Feb 2017
#148
The problem with this argument is that you dont' even think those people are reachable.
JCanete
Feb 2017
#142
To be clear, I am not advocating "reaching them" or anything of the sort.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#149
I bet you're right, because it all really does seem always to come back to the same damn thing
Maru Kitteh
Feb 2017
#117
Deplorables and their apologists are the biggest safe-space, delicate, precious snowflakes
Maru Kitteh
Feb 2017
#136
Just to be clear about how I feel about racism, sexism, etc. - I copy/pasted response 159 below.
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#160
No where in the OP did it say to sympathize for those folks. And that wasn't the intent.
KittyWampus
Feb 2017
#127
It sure did judge the fuck out of us who think that deplorables are stupid as fuck
bravenak
Feb 2017
#130
I'm not in favor of eschewing labels for voting blocs. They self-identified.
WinkyDink
Feb 2017
#118
Ignoring "just words" is not a tenable strategy for people who are not white men.
Maru Kitteh
Feb 2017
#162
Do you mind copy/pasting the part of my OP that advocates "reaching out" and "understanding"?
RadiationTherapy
Feb 2017
#169