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kristopher

(29,798 posts)
34. Seriously? You are disputing the fact that prevailing winds saved Tokyo?
Fri Dec 20, 2013, 04:12 PM
Dec 2013

That is one of the most absurd statements I've seen here. Tally the amount of fallout that blew out to sea and then aim it at Tokyo and let me know what the response would have been. Thyroid cancer has absolutely nothing to do with the abandonment of an area because it is hit with heavy fallout.

"A sample size of 2" is what you need to reconsider. You can dispute it all you want but the fact remains that the observed failure rate for nuclear reactors is far higher than you are suggesting. You are engaging in a form of data trimming that is explicitly designed to suggest a higher level of performance than the history of nuclear power has delivered. The fact that reactor designs vary widely is true, but so is the fact that the 26 relevant failures are spread across the range of designs with one common element - human imperfection.

This discussion shreds the premise you are trying to deploy: http://www.democraticunderground.com/112759049#post23

This snip benefits from the context provided at the link, but it catches the meat of the matter:

Even universities erroneously use subjective probabilities (iii), not frequencies (ii), to assess nuclear-core-melt likelihood, particularly when pro-nuclear-government agencies fund their studies. For instance, although the classic, Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT)-authored, government-funded, reactor-safety study had frequency data for various nuclear accidents that already had occurred after decades of US-operating experience, it did not use them; instead the MIT authors used subjective, pro-nuclear assumptions and conjectures about these accident probabilities (Rasmussen, 1975). When independent, university mathematicians compared US nuclear-accident-frequency data, reported from operating experience, with MIT guesses (iii), they discovered that all ‘guesses’ were far too low, by several orders of magnitude. None of the nuclear-accident-frequency data, based on reactor-operating experience, was within the theoretical, 90% confidence interval of the MIT ‘guesses.’Yet there is only a subjective probability of 10% that any of these true (frequency-based) probability values (for different types of reactor accidents) should fall outside this 90% interval. The conclusion? University mathematicians said that MIT assessors were guilty of a massive ‘overconfidence’ bias toward nuclear safety, a typical flaw in most industry-government-funded, nuclear-risk analyses (Cooke, 1982).


The love professed by nuclear supporters for adherence to the data seems to suffer from a certain failure of objectivity.

Seriously, the OP was perfectly clear, but you needed it restated just to pretend you weren't hiding. Now you come back with this litany of irrelevant objections that are clearly masking a fear of addressing the perfectly legitimate question posed.

If you can't engage in a sincere discussion about such an obvious and profound aspect of the use of nuclear power, then why would you think anyone should listen to you about anything related to the topic?




One more nuclear energy mishap and you can write nuclear energy off as history madokie Dec 2013 #1
Here is an interactive map showing population around nuclear plants kristopher Dec 2013 #3
Population INCREASES near nuclear power plants. PamW Dec 2013 #4
So we have your vote kristopher Dec 2013 #6
kristopher's DESPERATION! PamW Dec 2013 #8
OK kristopher Dec 2013 #10
Pretty PUNY mushroom cloud. PamW Dec 2013 #14
Why do people move there? For jobs! Starboard Tack Dec 2013 #42
I just looked randomly at three madokie Dec 2013 #7
100% WRONG!! AGAIN!! PamW Dec 2013 #2
If you don't calm down you're going to have a heart attack madokie Dec 2013 #5
I'm NOT upset!! PamW Dec 2013 #9
You coulda' fooled me madokie Dec 2013 #13
NOT at ALL!!! PamW Dec 2013 #18
You think you could get by with talking to me like this in person madokie Dec 2013 #21
Why is it any way inappropriate? PamW Dec 2013 #26
BALONEY!!! PamW Dec 2013 #11
I don't give a damn if you're Jesus Christ or Gawd himself madokie Dec 2013 #15
Why would there be anything wrong with it??? PamW Dec 2013 #19
You just don't get it do you? madokie Dec 2013 #23
PamGreg isn't upset kristopher Dec 2013 #12
I wonder the same think madokie Dec 2013 #16
kristopher's retreat... PamW Dec 2013 #22
I don't feel sure I understand the question phantom power Dec 2013 #17
I was wondering the same thing NickB79 Dec 2013 #20
You have your 'clarification' kristopher Dec 2013 #25
One could say... PamW Dec 2013 #27
You're making a personal attack to avoid an uncomfortable question kristopher Dec 2013 #28
They may have been the most gungho... PamW Dec 2013 #31
Anyone familiar with near misses like Davis Besse knows that we've just been lucky. kristopher Dec 2013 #32
100% WRONG!! AGAIN!! PamW Dec 2013 #35
Right.That football sized hole in Davis Besse's reactor head is something the Japanese did. kristopher Dec 2013 #37
How does that relate.....?????? PamW Dec 2013 #38
You didn't, in fact, offer any clarification NickB79 Dec 2013 #33
What would happen to our investment and our plan to move away from carbon? kristopher Dec 2013 #24
OK, I think I see... phantom power Dec 2013 #30
Seriously? You are disputing the fact that prevailing winds saved Tokyo? kristopher Dec 2013 #34
Mathematical ILLITERACY at play PamW Dec 2013 #36
More like either illiteracy or deliberate misdirection on your part kristopher Dec 2013 #40
You don't understand sample sizes??? PamW Dec 2013 #43
That isn't relevant at all to your attempt at data trimming ... kristopher Dec 2013 #44
'Shoot the messenger' is THE go to strategy the nuclear industry uses against any and all critics. kristopher Dec 2013 #47
The consequences are clear enough. 2013 is going to be the worst year for accumulation of... NNadir Dec 2013 #29
So one needs to be a misanthrope to hold nuclear energy dear cprise Dec 2013 #39
Um...um...um... NNadir Dec 2013 #41
Why on earth would a smart guy like you have expected "this time" to be different? GliderGuider Dec 2013 #45
Go on NNadir, listen to GG... Join the dark side. n/t cprise Dec 2013 #46
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