Wore my Kerry/Edwards Button Today...Target is Anti-Free Speech

[Roland99]

And the guy at the register when I was checking out commented on it and said, "Nice button." I said, "Thanks." and he started saying he had one before but someone complained and Target made him remove it.

:(

[Renew Deal]

1. He should not be allowed to wear it while he works there.

Unless Target doesn't care. But they can restrict him.

[el_gato]

13. Why because he is a slave? Do you check your humanity at the door

when you go to work.

I don't buy into your workers = slaves mentality.

[Carni]

25. How would you have felt if it were a "bush cheney" button

I don't know about you... but as a shopper if I encountered an employee with a Bush/Cheney button, I would have gone off and raised hell with a manager and then I would have accused Target of campaigning for Bush/Cheney.

In other words they won't let the guy wear his button because of nutcases such as myself!

[Debi]

29. You're right.

I should'nt have to answer the telephone the way my employer has directed...I should be able to pick up the receiver and yell, "What the hell do you want?!" Otherwise I'm just conforming to that slave mentality pounded into my head in exchange for wages!

Why should I have to wear clothes to work at all? How dare my employer force me to do that just because I work here?

Why should I come to work if I don't want to? My employer should just pay me a wage for being an employee.

If I dare to do what my employer directs, I'm just buying into a slave mentality.

<sarcasm off>

[Bandit]

30. Employees are ambassadors for their company

Most companies do not allow their employees to be politically active on the job. Business should be neutral so as to not alienate it's customer base.

[SidDithers]

43. Your other responses on this thread show just how ignorant you are...

Get down off your high horse and stop complaining about "The Man" trampling on the rights of the individual worker.

I'm not going to repeat the same argument that others have posted here, because you've already shown that you're just going to ignore what is said anyway.

However, Target, as a corporation, deserves more than just your derision.

http://www.forbes.com/maserati/cx_aw_1023giving.html
Target is at the top of the list of America's Most Philanthropic Companies.

As the saying goes, edjumacate yourself.

Sid

[Piperay]

49. Big difference

the worker at Target can quit anytime he wants, he is not a slave. If the Target worker decides politics is more important to him than working at Target he is free to find a paid job on a campaign.

[Placebo]

2. Well if he is a Target employee...

I can understand them not wanting their workers to politicize the shopping experience. Wouldn't want to offend anyone, and people don't come to Target to be bombarded with partisan politics when they just want to checkout their toilet paper and cereal in peace.

[Roland99]

3. Unless he was "preaching" to customers, I see no problem with it

I bet if he wore a crucifix necklace or an AIDS pin or something like that nothing would have been said.

[Placebo]

4. They probably would.

I don't think it's too much to ask to keep your uniform or whatever they have to wear, devoid of anything not related to Target, like a name-tag for instance.

[iamjoy]

5. Can't Blame Target On This One...

I mean, as long as they are consistent that no political, etc paraphenelia may be worn by employees while on duty. Imagine a Bush supporter came in and chose to confront him over it - the employee would have a hard time standing his ground without offending the customer. Then the customer could complain that the employee was rude (even if it wasn't true). Nope, better for all involved if large companies restrict such displays. I don't think free speech protection requires companies to extend it to their employees. It's like people who want to pierce their lip and get a job at Disney. Can't do it. Plenty of other companies open minded about that sort of thing. Fortunately, mine is - my manager just laughed and rolled her eyes when she saw the Kerry lanyard holding my ID badge & that I had given Kerry buttons to some of my co-workers (that I knew supported him)

[CrowNotAngelGRL]

6. I could see

why they wouldn't want it. The "Target" I go to has them wear just a red shirt and khaki pants so they're all the same. I bet they wouldn't get good press if it was heard about a fight (verbal or not) dealing with the election. Wouldn't look good and people might be weary of shopping there for a while and they'd lose business. So definietly understand.

[el_gato]

14. I can. Your rights are not eliminated at the door

Unless you're one of those people with a plantation mentality.

Working somewhere does not mean you should give up your rights.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

31. But you also don't have a "right" to work there.

Target is just trying to make money. They don't want their employees pissing anyone off. Besides - it's a dress code issue. Can you wear whatever YOU want to work? That's speech too.

[iamjoy]

41. Exactly - And Codes of Conduct Too

Those can limit some free speech. I'm sure anyone in customer service has had a time they wanted to tell the customer something Dick Cheney said on the floor of Congress - but kept our mouth shut for fear of losing our job.

A little dicey where it comes to wearing a cross or Jewish star, etc. They could ban that, there would be a lawsuit that likely would come out in favor of the employee. But that doesn't mean political buttons, etc are allowed - after all, the "Do Not Call List" does not apply to religious and political organizations but does to the people selling water softener.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

46. Like bumper stickers

The story we heard about the woman being fired for not taking off her Kerry sticker - that was wrong. However, if she used her car for company business (as I used to do) - going to clients and things of that nature in her own car, then I would have said she should take it off. But she wasn't, and so the employer was in the wrong. And evil. But she came out better anyway. I wouldn't have wanted to work for that a$$hole.

[ISUGRADIA]

7. Not really anti-free speech at all

a company should be able to tell an employee how to behave on the job within reason. If they have a consistent policy and do not allow Bush buttons while restricting Kerry buttons, it's just good business sense.<P> How would you feel if the cashier had an "Abortion Kills Babies" button on?

[Roland99]

10. To be honest...wouldn't bother me.

I think it's time for political correctness to come to an abrupt halt.

[Carni]

27. See, that would also piss me off

Why would I want a sermon at the store?

I am there to shop, not to have some idiot spread the word about their anti-abortion stances and "baby killers"

My stance isn't "PC"...PC would be standing there and acting like their Christian Reich button wasn't a problem.

[el_gato]

15. Bullshit

I don't care what they wear, it's your right as a human.

Fuck that slave mentality.

Get off your knees.

[alphafemale]

24. Uh...get off your knees and march out the door.

It's not slavery if you can quit.

But either quit or agree to a few simple dress code rules if you're going to "exchange labor for cash."

Employers at retail places have to be strict about such things or the button war would get way out of hand.

Or...do you want to see someone with pics of aborted fetuses on their chest as you pay for your bread and milk?

[Lex]

8. Oh please.

Target doesn't want political buttons OF ANY KIND on its employees and that is pretty much standard in the industry.

[scarletwoman]

9. It's a pretty standard workplace policy for jobs dealing with the public.

How would you feel if you were confronted with a store full of employees wearing bush/cheney buttons?

It's only common sense to avoid partisan displays in a business that depends on the good will of ALL its customers. No business is going to risk alienating up to 50% of its clientele by allowing its workers to engage in open partisanship -- that would be stupid.

sw

[el_gato]

16. That don't make it right

I don't give a fuck what someone wears. You need to stand up for your rights and they should not be negotiable at the door just because you are exchanging labor for money. This exchange of labor for money does not mean you have to give up your freedom.

But hey, I believe that your rights have primacy over the needs of greedy corporate pigs at all times.

[MsTryska]

32. Uh...yeah it does.

I exchange 8 hours of my freedom a day for wages.


as long as i'm on the clock, i'm my company's bitch.

that my friend, is the real world.

[JohnnyRingo]

11. I'm afraid that political expression at a check out would...

...open the door for an employer to make it part of a "uniform".

Then again... I go to this sub shop in town where the owner has Kerry signs in the window and posted throughout inside.

He hangs the newspaper on the bulletin board and the day after the 1st debate he had the front page with Kerry/Bush....He drew blackened eyes on Buxh.

Best. Subs. in town.

[SKKY]

12. I would have to agree with Target on this one...

...as an employee, you're a representative of the company, and it could be construed as Target the company supporting Kerry. Wouldn't we think it was a bit "odd" if we get our Lattes at Starbucks from someone wearing a Bush/Cheney button?

[el_gato]

18. No, as a citizen you have inalienable rights

But hey, I just believe in freedom and not licking managments boots.

That's just me though, since I don't live on my knees like alot of american drones.

[mondo joe]

40. You need to read the first amendment

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

[Sparkle]

17. I side with Target on this.

[el_gato]

19. Yeah, they own you, you have no rights, you are a slave

bend on over, since you think the desires of management are more important that the rights you have as a human being.

[MsTryska]

23. Would you be saying the same thing if

A guy was wearing a "kill fags kikes and papists" button on?

[mondo joe]

38. You have the right to seek employment elsewhere.

Working at Target doesn't rob anyone of their rights, constitutional or otherwise.

The only slave mentality expressed here is your odd notion that people have no choices.

[el_gato]

20. The slave like mentality around here is amazing

You should not be willing to give up your constitutional rights just because you are exchangin labor for money. How people came to internalize this crazy idea is beyond me. Perhaps it's the drone syndrome. The idea that just because you are working somewhere means you have to give up your rights.

[grace0418]

26. I don't think it's slave mentality

that seems a harsh just because people don't agree with you. I know if I was in the line at Target and the person working the register was wearing a button that said Bush/Cheney or "Fuck You Liberal!" or "Kill Gays" "KKK" or "I love guns!" or any number of things, I would be really upset. Target has the right to want to maintain a pleasant environment for their customers, and I support that. Yes, some places take that too far in the name of customer service, but I don't necessarily think that keeping partisan politics off the chests of employees while they are at work is abusing their rights. If Target made employees remove KE04 bumper stickers from their cars or fired employees for attending political rallies on their days off, that would be another story.

Just because people have the right to free speech doesn't mean it should be exercised at all times in all situations. We would never be able to exist as a society if we couldn't maintain some level of civility.

[mondo joe]

36. There is no constitutional right to work at Target

You want to work at Target, you agree to their policies.

No one is forcing anyone to work there.

I support Target on this: your politics and religion are yours, for your time, not when you are representing the employer.

[Bridget Burke]

45. So what do you do for a living?

Most of the SDS'ers I knew in the old days were trust fundies. It was so hip to be o-so-radical. Now they're good little Republicans, hoping for another tax cut.

Target has a dress code. So what?

[Atman]

21. I carry extras with me when I go out

and give them to anyone who asks me about the one I'm wearing.

[MsTryska]

22. Target reserves the right to deny any sort of

"flare" on their employees uniforms.

[Debi]

28. Isn't it 15 pieces of flare?

and that's the minimum!

I agree w/Target.

Anyway, isn't Target a 'good guy' in that they pay a "livable wage" and offer employees benefits unlike the evil empire of Wal-Mart?

Uniformity is important in the service industry. If the employees of the corporation were'nt dressed in a uniform manner who would customers seek out for assistance? Anyone who looks like they know what's going on?! And what if that person that was sought out for assistance had on what the customer would consider objectional propaganda? Would they not request the assistance? Would they leave the store? Target does have to make a profit and that means catering to all political parties.

[MsTryska]

33. You';re exactly right....

altho this one time, i was in Abercrombie and Fitch and I needed help with something, and I asked the guy sorting through sweaters next to me.


He said.."uhh..i don't work here, but thanks for the compliment".

Who could blame me, the guy looked like all the other guys working there - young, bony and dressed head to toe in A&F.

[Debi]

35. I get it from people at Hy-Vee after Church on Sundays

I guess since we're there at the same time each week people just assume that we work there (Hy-Vee doesn't seem to mind as long as I'm polite to the people)(now if I could just roll that into a discount on my groceries!!!) :evilgrin:

Agree with your post above - I never thought I'd get to the point in my life where I thought rebillion has it's place, but the desire for housing and food got me there.

I worked for a Republican law firm in the past and would place Dem stickers on my note pads just to tweak my bosses - they usally got thrown away when the cleaning crews came by in the evening.

[MsTryska]

39. Exactly. Rebellion has it's place and time.

And there is nothing that says you can't work the system from the inside.


You pull more flies with honey than with vinegar, and open rebellion in certain situations is more like vinegar than anything else.

[Arkana]

34. I have two...a normal Kerry/Edwards logo

and an old-fashioned one, you know--the one you can order from the campaign that says "The Right Choice For America--John Kerry and John Edwards".

[Free2BMe]

37. yea, and on conserva radio...

the cry is "if you see a republican, hug him/her and hang on tight...Big crybabies...

[Obamarama]

42. Target isn't a culprit here....

I think this is pretty much a no-brainer. It's cool the guy was sporting a Kerry button, but I don't expect political, religious or moral guidnace from the checkout people at Target, or any other commercial venue for that matter. This isn't some Draconian, anti-free speech ploy, it's called common sense in terms of corporate policy. Anyone who thinks otherwise should perhaps pick up the clue phone.

Frankly, I think we should me more appalled at the lack of common sense, social skills and general intelligence of today's retail clerks. I've run across some GREAT ones, but the majority are idiot robots who can think for themselves.

[SidDithers]

44. Target is not anti-free speech...

they are apolitical. There is a difference.

Sid

[nickinSTL]

47. Politics at work, esp. in a public position, are inappropriate

Sorry.

I don't wear Kerry buttons to work, and I don't go around telling people my beliefs. I make it a policy not to engage customers in discussions on politics, because I think it's inappropriate.

I'll discuss politics with coworkers, away from the public, if they are also interested in the discussion.

I take it you either don't work, or have a non-traditional workplace. Most places, especially if you work with the public in any capacity, would restrict your wearing of political items while working.

[Piperay]

48. If someone at the register had on a chimp

button I would sure be pissed off. :mad: I think it wrong for employees to wear political buttons for any candidate.