Reply #10: I don't think the data exists. [View All]

[Igel]

I don't think anybody would want to collect it.

The problem isn't whether the teachers are educated enough to get a degree or have a teaching certificate. It's whether they know the material needed to teach the classes they're put in charge of. Yes, I've known people teaching classes that they barely could cope with--it had been years since they had taken classes or learned the material and it was the first time teaching the subject.

That said, you don't really need to know much about partial differential equations to teach high school algebra.

But could the cohort of teachers be improved? Sure. In some cases those who go into teaching do it because they need a job and were in the bottom 1/3 of their classes. They aren't as hardworking, they went to less prestigious (and often less rigorous) schools, they don't care as much. In many cases they do care, a lot, but it just takes one indifferent algebra teacher in 9th grade to really mess up an 11th grade physics class.

In some cases the teachers aren't trained well in classroom management, or they feel too sorry to be effectively hard-nosed with the kids that need it (or too hard-nosed with the kids who need a softer touch). They have low expectations of their students, and get what they expect.

In many cases the teachers are worn down. Too much paperwork. Too many restrictions. Too much being jerked around--"this year you teach X because it's essential knowledge, next year Y will be essential knowledge, and you'll be expected to revise how you teach each year to dispose of the previous year's unscientific practices." Too much headwind from administrators and students and parents. Too many threats that are widely perceived to be unjust and unfair, but which exist because the people responsible can't be named and so somebody has to be blamed and threatened. They keep changing the curriculum, not in response to new knowledge but in response to new theories and new political requirements, because the testing requirements have changed.

Pay isn't the point; we pay our teachers more (using purchasing parity power, the only fair way of doing it) and get less, even though we "disproportionately" spend more on athletics (presumably in exchange-rate dollars, making the comparison a bit less than fair). We spend more per pupil than most other countries that get far better results.

Increasing the status of teachers has two pay offs: (1) You get a better qualified pool of applicants so that you don't have to hire, in lean years, crappy science and math teachers. (2) The parents treat the teachers differently and *that* means the kids treat the teachers differently. It also means the administrators treat the teachers differently.

Of course, things aren't going to change. The educational philosophy among theorists and parents in the US is different. You can't just replace all the tired teachers, or provide the flexibility needed to ensure that every teacher is really qualified to teach his/her subject. You can't alter minds and hearts overnight.