China grows in superpower status

[Robbien]

By Sushil Seth

Monday, Dec 20, 2004,Page 8

China's relations with Southeast Asian countries are on an upswing, as demonstrated at the recent ASEAN summit in Laos. The Free Trade Agreement with ASEAN countries is supposed to become the economic powerhouse for regional economies.

The leading English newspaper of the largest Southeast Asian country, Indonesia, was full of praise. Mindful of the fact that it will hurt Indonesia's manufacturing sector from Chinese exports, the Jakarta Post still opined: "Nevertheless, taking a deeper look, it can be concluded that the potential upsides will outnumber the downsides, and the potential gains will outweigh any losses." It approvingly quoted Indonesia's Trade Minister Mari Pangestu to the effect that "a FTA with China will lead to the formation of a regional production center with China as the core and countries in the region as alternative supply sources or complements to China."

<snip>

What has brought this about? Economics. The US is still the global economic powerhouse; it reportedly absorbs about 40 percent of China's exports, accounts for about one-third of Japan's exports and 20 percent of exports from South Korea, Taiwan and ASEAN countries. Despite this, there is a perception that China is an emerging superpower with limitless scope for economic opportunities for the region.

The US is also suffering from an image problem and because of the war in Iraq and its focus on global terrorism, Washington appears to be neglecting the Asia-Pacific region. China has been able to slip into this political vacuum, emerging as a benign power interested in lifting the region politically and economically.

much more about China's easy does it plan:
http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/edit/archives/2004/12/20/2003215975

[The Backlash Cometh]

1. Meanwhile. Bush's policies of disenfranchisment makes us weaker.

[Thurston Howell IV]

2. Funny how our sole superpower status is beginning to evaporate

A couple of years ago, a couple of Ivy League intellectuals proclaimed decades of unchallenged US power in world affairs. In just a few short years, one can easily see that we will face increasing competition from China.

The Nation magazine's cover article for this week is about the rising power of the European Union.

With Bush pissing away the economic power of the US in 4 short years, we can begin to see that we will be forced to have a more humble foreign policy in the years ahead. But not before Bush screws things up some more.

[Chicago Democrat]

3. Its a quid pro quo for our aggressive Empire building financed with

Chinese and Japanese and British purchase of TBills.

[sweetheart]

5. myths sustained by perception and appearances

... were supported by soft power, and indeed, based on the global
openness to that soft power, there was a soft-empire... that has
folded soo dang fast, its impressive.

Frankly, the most damaging thing of all, was the reselection of
bush. Prior to this, the world could think the whole thing an
aberration, and anomaly short on corrected. Now it seems, the
planet must tolerate the american nazi regime until it goes down
in flames... and everyone's making as much distance as they can.

[cliss]

29. I agree.

"Myths". I get the feeling that so much of our world-class superiority is nothing but image.

"The world's strongest economy". I wonder. As Rome burns, I look at the newly released financial figures. They show that if we are not bankrupt by now, we will soon be.

"The world's most powerful military". Really? Stan Goff writes that dollar for dollar and man for man, we're the world's most inefficient military. We are hemorrhaging financially in Iraq. The insurgents spend $1.00, we spend $1,000,000.

"The world's premier #1". Another myth. Try India. They are the world's biggest democracy. They just elected their prime minister. Their elections went off without a hitch and no one contested the results, as far as I know. Our recent elections? hmmmm

I'd say we should change our myth to Dictator Deluxe. After all, we represent only 3.8% of the world's population. Maybe I should say Thank God for that.

[Art_from_Ark]

17. One of those "Ivy League intellectuals" wouldn't have happened to be

Francis Fukuyama, would it? You know, the guy who said that history ended with the end of the Cold War?

:crazy:

[MADem]

22. I found his thesis very America-centric

...when I read it several years back. The End of History, indeed!

Funny, back when I was a youngster in Europe during the Kennedy administration, some of our family's "know-it-all" (as BushCo might term them) European friends were talking about China in the same terms that some Americans are finally getting around to now! Such a "DUH!!!" moment!!! It stuns me how we finally come around to really THINKING about how shit works, and then have the cojones to act like we thought it up....!

I so wish we could rejoin the world. I really hate being a member of the society of assholes in the eyes of most nations. We're really so much better than that, we have so many strengths, it's just a crying shame that the lunatics have taken over our land. It's enough to make you depressed, and want to overeat or something. What to do? I guess I'll have some FRENCH fries on the side, some FRENCH dressing on my salad, and some FRENCH's mustard (and HEINZ catsup) on my Boca Burger!!!

[w4rma]

4. The US is no longer the superpower. China is the sole superpower, now.

Right now. Not later. Now.

Anything China asks for, the Repukes in control of our government crawl to the Communist Party in China's feet and do it.

When has Bush or any Repug stood up to China within the past 3 years? They haven't. Bush and the rest of the Repugs have successfully made the U.S.A. #2 to China, now. And we're dropping. The U.S. will be #3 to the EU, next. But at least the US won't be behind Russia.

[wankawanka]

6. i dont think we are number two yet to china but it could happen

[sweetheart]

7. Until china can accept the human right to freedom of religion

it will not be a superpower. Superpower's are not intimidated by
people's religious choices. As well, superpowers don't need to use
torture on their own citizens in tibet.

When china can accept the free travel and practice of tibetan
buddhism.. (the real thing), not the propped up charade they're
manufacturing, it'll not be able to promote the hidden grace of
human enlightenment that makes a nation a super power.

[neweurope]

8. You are being ironic, right?

I agree with your mentioning the oppression in Tibet of course. But the "freedom of religion" thing seems sweet observing the overwhelming influence Old Testament Fundamentalists (I refuse to call them Christians) seem to have in the US right now.

"(China) 'll not be able to promote the hidden grace of
human enlightenment that makes a nation a super power." Well. If that is what makes a super power in your eyes - then the US definitely is a super power no longer. And torture in China - true. But let's talk about torture in the US for a change.

And, no, it is not an IMAGE problem (as the article said) the US is suffering from.

[sweetheart]

10. Hmmmm.

I wasn't really commenting on the US... but ok. I know of several
fully enlightened teachers in America and western europe. China
killed them all, or drove them out with its tibetan invasion and
has not yet gotten any back.

I'm not talking about political enlightenment. I mean the real deal,
not something you'll see on DU particularly. Generally these folks
travel the world helping people heart to heart, beyond the cults
of nation states, helping those in maya to discover self realization.

Full mystical realization is veiled in our world, disbelieved by
the secular media state, yet nevertheless, the root power behind the
power of human cultures. When you kill your "christ", you face
a dark age, and china has had theirs since killing off the tibetan
enlightened in 59.

America, unlike your broad brush, is not bush, and the blue states
are a superpower on their own, without bush and his southern state
christian mafia sickos. As much as i dislike him, and deplore the
torture in american prisons, and .... all thtat... i was saying
that china, in order to complete its transition from developing
to mature power, must drop its fear of free religion.

You'll find, if you hang out in the better parts of the US (blue),
that there really are enlightened people holding satsang, who are
not connected at all to the political nazi insurgency that in truth
dominates a small sector of media-america... and has inflated itself
to appear as the country as a whole.

You, in new europe, should know that better than any, as your own
nations, like romania and poland, have suffered greatly by the
oppression of free religion.. and at the end of the day, it was this
particular oppression that made the iron curtain what it was.

I would hope we can discuss the human rights of one state, without
constantly referring to the deplorable benchmark of the bush nazis.
When i can write so freely on chinese DU, then perhaps. Until then,
it seems that there are some merits still retained in the US,
contrary to the detractors who must refrain from being truly
anti-american, as it does them no favours.

[neweurope]

11. I agree with some things you say about the spiritual part. BUT

"and has inflated itself to appear as the country as a whole." That may be so - and even most probably is - but that's not the way international politics work. People don't say: Oh, such nice people, the Americans, just have a bad president, and therefore I forgive the guy who just killed my child." It's US-soldiers that are doing the killing and mistreating (and, yes, I know most of them are victims, too - in a way).

Yes, we in Europe know about supression. We are very consciously trying to learn from our experiences. But really I do not think that the Iron Curtain was caused mainly by the oppression of religion. It was caused by one thing and one thing only: The strife of two superpowers for geopolitical dominance. And the whole world had to suffer for it in one way or the other.

I think our difference is mostly that you want to put the term "superpower" in a broader context while I use the old term - meaning only economical, geostrategical and military power.:)

[sweetheart]

14. Geopolitical dominance

I see what were the warsaw pact nations as less to do with the
soviet union per se, and rather the legacy of the brutal barbarrossa
invasion of the east decades earlier, and the iron curtain of that
east, as a scab on a very slowly healing scar.

In this regard, there was indeed a superpower clash, but as no clash
really happened there, except ideology... the difference in ideology
was on one hand, the western standard of free religion and free
speech, and in the USSR satellites, much less so. You could say
it was the clash of superpowers, but on the ground, the difference
in societies, that i saw in eastern germany years ago, was the
stifling sense that dissent was a way to be in prison, and certainly,
religion and enlightenment being the unfettering of the human
spirit from ALL bondage, the outlawing of enlightenment.

That said, all society cults seek to fetter their citizens to keep
them under control, but in western liberalism, we've learned how to
do that without restricting the spiritual overly so... granted, you
can find a million exceptions, but the difference i would refer to
in response is living enlightenment.

Political america is indeed an ugly behemoth, yet outside the nation
state, one is only really aware of foreign-policy america, and though
you might think that reading DU gives you proxy to the inside, it
is a poor substitute for all the parts of america that are not
political... and much of the country is just that. In order for a
decent person to survive in america, it is generally necessary to
unplug entirely from the political america, as it is toxic, foul
and rude. (media americana). Enlightened teachers, generally are
entirely unplugged, realizing that their service must be to awaken
individuals, who have a ripple effect by their daily lives in to
a greater world... and indeed, america is a puberty teenager of a
nation.

Frankly, i see superpower as a propaganda term to separate ones self
from others. If we simply call america a power, then we must realize
that the world is made up of many, some greater in population,
some older, many wiser. And indeed, when confronted with such
a multipolar view, the american right seeks to distinguish itself
by its military prowess, but that said, if you can deal with said
power without going to war, the power is weak.

I too live in europe, in a part of britain, that is historically
and politically quite distant from westminster. Culturally, the
far north of scotland is closer to the old fishing fleets that used
to come in from denmark, russia and scandanavia, as it used to take
4.5 hours by car to get just to inverness, and it was easier to get
to norway or denmark than london.

In this regard, one could say that north scotland is not politically
aligned with the warmongers, given that the elected party these
parts is liberal democrat, against war and authoritarian tyrrany.
The german fleet of WW1 is sunk of scapa flow not far away in
orkney, a monument to hubris of times past, and a reminder that
superpowers come and go, until they sink and rust beneath the waves
of time.

[neweurope]

18. If it were just a matter of "unplugging from the political America"

then I as a German need not ever feel ashamed of what my country did some decades ago. Then I could simply say "I was born after the war and my parents in a way were victims of their time, also", couldn't I? Neither would I have to be ashamed, ever, of what my country may be doing wrong right now. I'd simply "unplug" and point to everything that's good and right in my country and I'd be happy. I don't think it's as easy as that. I for one deeply feel the burden of my country's history and even though I cannot personally be blamed I still feel it is a burden I'm carrying. And I deeply feel my responsibility for what's going on right now, small as my means of influence may be.

As to "religion and enlightenment being the unfettering of the human
spirit from ALL bondage" - well. I agree with you: enlightenment surely is all that, religion COULD be all that. But it seldom is. Maybe we could substitute "God" - whichever concept of God - instead of "religion"; then I would agree with you. "Religion" much too often has been a means of oppression and narrow-mindedness, the contrary of enlightenment.

[sweetheart]

24. My german inlaws

Have never shared any "guilt" with me, nor my spouse. We're generations
on, and i am equally sickened by the american evils in viet nam, as i
am iraq, and what my german family members feel of a great war they
were not even born in.

My grandpa's in-law were in the nazi army, and one of them, unrepentent,
as one can expect any bush-GOP-nazi to be equally unrepentent long after
they are defeated.

I have different views than yourself regarding the nazis, as i believe
in reincarnation. The people running the american nazi-gop are the
SAME souls from germany reincarnated. That is why they're doing the
same thing. Multi-life karma is repeated like a drum, and nobody need
feel guilty except the great fools who let them get away with it.

For a german person who saw hitler coming to power, and got out of the
way, perhaps out of the country, there is no need to feel guilt, no?
Methinks, the post-ww2 occupation laid a heavy trip on the german
civilians for something that many really were innocent of... being
alive, and supporting their government is no crime, or we could arrest
the whole of washington DC and have a mass hanging.

Crime, in my view, is personal. If you kill someone wrongly, that's
your problem, not the civilian taxpayer who paid your wages.

[neweurope]

25. If you EVER felt proud of let's say an American Gold medal

at the Olympics then you have to feel the shame for your country's wrongdoing, also, no?

I believe in reincarnation also. What you say - the nazi GOP are the Germans reincarnated - sounds pretty hopeless, though. I'd rather believe in bettering one's karma and not in floating around the same level birth after birth. My goodness, that would scare me.

[sweetheart]

26. Identity politics and growing up

I am inspired when someone from ANY country wins a gold medal, who
really busted their bum to get there. But i'm certainly not an example
case, most americans being steeped in culture of nationalism by the
media.

I myself remember several past lives, including my last one being
executed by a chinese PLA soldier outside the rubble of our shelled
monastary in tibet. He shot me in the face... yet i recall his cool
expression and the little red star above the brim of his hat.

Figure about 3-5 years between lifetimes on average. Now look at when
the american leadership was born.... 40's 50's... Many buddhists i know
in america are well aware of this group who reincarnted in america to
achieve their experience of imperial glory and a white-race christian
state. Take a look at rumsfeld, and look at his soul, not his body..
and see the inner nazi... and he's just one of the crop.

I think popular views on karma betry the reality. You are re-born in
the state of mind that you die in. If you're out to fight a war of
imperial aggression, you are reborn with that karmic profile encoded
on your spiritual genetics. Real karma is like the forces in quantum
physics.... but it is taught to the public, as in elementary chemistry
that the electrons rotate around the nucleus... (probability fields
is a bit complex for beginners). As well, in advanced karma, there
is no karma, if there is no self. Or rather, by re-ordering the self
by profound samadhi meditation, the karmic DNA of a lifetime is as
well re-ordered, and this rapid evolution of a soul through death-like
re-ordering yet whilst not dying, is the short path tibetan rebirth
process. The tibetan book of the dead, describes this re-formation
of the consciousness after being liquidated in the dharma kaya
(the pure light of reality). That said, the pure light, liquifies
the karmic profile, and any act in life, that mirrors the pure light
(God in western talk), is beyond karma, as without ego-self-acting,
there is no karma. Thus they say that enlightened people, who have
melted away the karmic DNA entirely, are no longer subject to the
laws of karma.

So back to seeing something about the american leadership. George
bush was not a nazi, as far as i see (though cheney was). Bush was
an infamous pope of the middle ages (i think Innocent III). Who
started a series of terrible pogroms against jews, that centuries
later resulted in the holocaust. It would indeed be karmic justice
if that same soul were to fix his ugly mess by sorting out israel..
just unlikely given that he seems to be repeating his karmic habit
of starting divisive pogroms, race wars and hatreds. Bush subconsciously
remembers his pope incarnation, and thinks he's appointed by God, and
is God's agent on earth, acting through divine right. It must give
him a real rush of endorphins to feel that, and he is mistakenly
recollecting past life images, and bleeding them over in to this life.

Myself, i don't particularly like the Chinese PLA, and anything having
to do with tibet makes my heart leap out of my chest... i LOVE tibet
and its people.... past lives repeat themselves.

So likely, if you were to think of the top 10 places on this planet
that you fancy, but have never visited, likely there is a subcionscious
past life connection. For spiritual folks, realizing this can be
liberating, as it can allow one to let go of those pent up feelings of
self. For a spiritual infant, like the bush cabal, subconscious
feelins of past lives go unquestioned, and are merely acted on, which
is why the nazis are at it again, trying to secure the caspian oil
fields... right on schedule.

Living people from the nazi period will, if they are at all honest,
recall that the bush people are doing it EXACTLY like the nazis
did it. This is no mirage... the same people are involved... and
because the culture does not recognize reincarnation, they've let
them get away with it.

You can never better your karma, you can erase the self that was
bound by that karma. Karma is a raw force in the universe, cause
and effect. But as an object with no mass is not bound by the laws
of mechanical physics, a person who erases their attachment to self
is not bound by the laws of cause and effect "of that self". And
like an onion, deeper layers of attachment to self and ego are
exposed in a complex process of awakening.

There is no hopelessness in realizing that the GOP are really run
by reincanate nazis. Those bastards have been waiting for some time
to take over the US, and grabbed their chance in coup 2000. I expect
things to get only worse and worse until they are either killed,
put in prison or the US is destroyed in war.... that is the nazi
karma, and if the US wants to re-identify its concept of self and
identity around the nazi-profile, then it will be subject to the
nazi-karma.

That said, individual karma, is different for each individual, and
as individual life is a series of spheres of identity, much as
described in astrology-planet views of a complex, multi-"house" self,
and each with identity-karma. We are all related in this massively
complex universal existance... The karma of this world as a whole
is descending, as the population grows by billions and progressively
kills off the planet's surface. The souls who are coming in to this
world to be born, are not higher evolved souls, but rather lower
ones who are seeking basic experiences of self, power and sexuality.

A lesson of karma is to not get caught up in the unevolved mire that
is the majority of soul's lives, but to rise above by not binding
one's self to any concept of self that motivates that inertial mass.
So much depends on one's concept of self, and karma is relative to
that concept. So, sorry for the long explanation, but that is what
i mean that newtonian karma, is eclipsed by quantum karma in the
real world, and simple cause and effect is a child's story, but the
einstinian relativistic view is much closer to how karma works in
the subtle/ occult/ spiritual realms.

[neweurope]

27. Uff, as we say over here. I have to digest this.

And before I digest it translate it properly. The only thing I can say in response is very naive - it is my belief that if one succeeds in becoming "a better person" then in the next life one can start from there. As far as I have understood what you said at forst reading it makes sense to me but maybe we should continue this per PM?

Just one more thing: You wrote that "crime, in my view, is personal. If you kill someone wrongly, that's your problem, not the civilian taxpayer who paid your wages."
In my opinion we are more than tax payers. We live in a democracy. And as citizens of a democracy we have not only the right but even more so the duty to influence the direction our country takes. And therefore we share a common guilt if it's going the wrong way.

[sweetheart]

28. European and American views of government

You hit on a very distinct difference between american and european
views of the public common and government. I'm speaking with the
american view (on an american forum), yet we're both standing in
europe. In america, people say "The government", whereas, in
europe, it is "Our government". The difference being that
american government is not representative of its people, rather a
separate entity that has never ever been, in my life representative
of me, an american citizen. This is due to a series of failures,
starting with corporate personhood and the 2 party system, but reasons
aside, the european view is "right" in my opinion, as it suggests that
even if the government is run by the opposition, it represents ALL
citizens and really does speak for all.

So in american thinking, what "the" government does may be crime, and
what can one do. There is no control that 1/280,000,000th of a nation
can apply to a criminal enterprise, especially one who belongs to the
wrong religion, grew up in the wrong family, has the wrong education,
smoked the wrong drugs and married the wrong mafia family. The
winner-take all political system of the US, absolves the minority of
any representation, responsibility or control, except they are obligated
to pay taxes to support the criminals.

In europe, such views are a bit far fetched, as you point out. It
is the difference of cultures. As europe has developed over many
years with poperty rights being contingent on obligation to the
public weal (common right). Whereas, american property rights are
deemed absolute. Perhaps some day when america has fought a great
war and lost 10's of millions of its people, the ones returning
from war will demand a share of the property they and thier friends
died protecting... as is the case in europe.

All of it, is very much that america is a very new country, and has
not had its french revolution, and YOU are from old europe, where
the people's right to the common is undisputed a century after
your own french revolution.

peace,
-s

[neweurope]

30. Ah well, unfortunately it is not as undisputed as it used to be -

unbridled capitalism is marching strong over here also.

Once more though I see that dialoge educates :) Thank you for your explanations.

I find it remarkable though that in the US where the system "absolves the minority of any representation, responsibility or control" a lot of people are much more politically active than in Europe. I admire this - folks writing their congressmen for instance all the time; I see a lot of this on DU and have a lot of respect for it. I wish the Europeans were a little more like this. Instead most of us seem to think that the opposition parties will do our work for us.

[leesa]

19. Oh Really? I hope you are a Fundie Christian then, because that's the

only religion allowed in the US Superpower now.

[sweetheart]

23. Indeed

Yet, they have not rounded up the buddhists to chuck them in prison
quite yet, and you'll notice that the tibetan buddhists have schools
all over the united states, but not in tibet. Bush'll be deposed
short enough, and like woodrow wilson, he'll be forgotten, even the
hatred he started.

[Robbien]

9. The poorer developing nations aren't just sitting around on their hands

either.

A group of twenty lead by Brazil have banded together to try to fight the stranglehold the WTO has on their economy.

The world is achangin while BushCo is busy with his folly.

[BonjourUSA]

12. China is now in the third world rank for the research and development

[wickerwoman]

13. How so?

They have nukes don't they? And they just had their first manned spaceflight.

China will make it to the moon before the US gets back. How is that third world?

[BonjourUSA]

15. Excuse my English ! I wanted to say

China is now at the third rank in the world for r&d

[wickerwoman]

20. Excuse my lack of reading comprehension.

D'oh. :-)

[0007]

16. bttt

[plasticsundance]

21. A good BusinessWeek article ...

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/04_49/b3911401.htm

America has survived import waves before, from Japan, South Korea, and Mexico. And it has lived with China for two decades. But something very different is happening. The assumption has long been that the U.S. and other industrialized nations will keep leading in knowledge-intensive industries while developing nations focus on lower-skill sectors. That's now open to debate. "What is stunning about China is that for the first time we have a huge, poor country that can compete both with very low wages and in high tech," says Harvard University economist Richard B. Freeman. "Combine the two, and America has a problem."

<snip>

The migration of electronics to China began when the Taiwanese shifted plants and suppliers across the Taiwan Strait in the late 1990s. As recently as four years ago, though, the U.S. exported $45 billion in computer hardware. Since the tech crash, that number has slid to $28 billion as the industry headed en masse for China, which is even more competitive than Taiwan. "All electronics hardware manufacturing is going to China," says Michael E. Marks, CEO of Flextronics Corp (FLEX )., a contract manufacturer that employs 41,000 in China. Flextronics and other companies are hiring Chinese engineers to design the products assembled there. "There is a myth that the U.S. would remain the knowledge economy and China the sweatshop," says BCG's Hemerling. "Increasingly, this is no longer the case."

A visit to Flextronics' campus in the Pearl River Delta town of Doumen vividly illustrates Marks's point. The site employs 18,000 workers making cell phones, X-box game consoles, PCs, and other hardware in 13 factories sprawled over 149 acres. The bamboo scaffolding is about to come down on an additional 720,000-square-foot factory nearing completion. Almost every chemical, component, plastic, machine tool, and packing material Flextronics needs is available from thousands of suppliers within a two-hour drive of the site. That alone makes most components 20% cheaper in China than in the U.S., says campus General Manager Tim Dinwiddie. Plus, China will soon eliminate remaining tariffs on imported chips. In the past five years, electronic manufacturing-services companies such as Flextronics have cut their U.S. production from $37 billion to $27 billion while doubling their China output, to $31 billion. That's likely to double again by 2007.

<snip>

More innovation. Better goods. Lower prices. Newer plants. America will surely continue to benefit from China's expansion. But unless it can deal with the industrial challenge, it will suffer a loss of economic power and influence. Can America afford the China price? It's the question U.S. workers, execs, and policymakers urgently need to ask.