R.J. Reynolds to cut 40% of workforce

[UpInArms]

http://cbs.marketwatch.com/news/story.asp?siteid=mktw&guid=%7BD96B8CBE%2D9A31%2D43A9%2DA1BF%2D824E4C4F4030%7D&

NEW YORK (CBS.MW) - R.J. Reynolds Tobacco said it would lay off 40 percent of its employees, or 2,600 workers, as part of a restructuring that is targeting $1 billion in cost reductions by the end of 2005.

The cigarette maker said it would record a charge of $340 million in the third quarter as a result, and revised its full-year earnings outlook to reflect the impact of the charge.

The job cuts are expected to generate $180 million in savings in 2004, increasing to savings of approximately $230 million a year.

...more...

[BiggJawn]

1. I was afraid of that...Sorry....

I'm sorry, but I'm not taking up smoking again.

We salute the "jobless recovery"! <sarcasm>

[Melinda]

2. Thank goodness for the Bush* tax cuts!

Probably would have laid off 40-80% without Whistle-Ass' relief!

/pissy sarcasm

[prolesunited]

3. Prosperity is just around the corner

:eyes:

[TahitiNut]

4. It's Clinton's fault ...

... for not smoking. :eyes:

[okieinpain]

59. THE CIGAR.....

.

[TahitiNut]

62. .... wasn't lit.

[dArKeR]

5. It's Canada's fault for not allowing Cancer advertising in their country!

F1.

[TAH6988]

6. Isn't this to be expected?

Wasn't one of the "goals" of raising tabacco taxes and the law suits against big tabacco to drive tabacco companies out of business?

[Bandit]

21. We could only hope that is the effect

The goal is to reduce unnecessary deaths in America. Not to mention bringing down health costs and pain and suffering by not only smokers but family members as well. When your mother or father has lung cancer a lot of grief is in a household. We can eliminate most of that grief if we try at all.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

26. Actually not because the program Clinton came up with paid them

NOT to grow tobacco which they can't do every other year anyway..so they probably shifted the parcel every year to the land they needed to leave dormant anyway. There's always a loophole if you are a big corp.

[liberalhistorian]

7. Yep, there's that wonderful

"growing and flowing" economy, and the "jobless recovery", thanks to the wisdom of our great leader's tax giveaways to the rich--uh, excuse me, I mean tax cuts!

[lindashaw]

8. Also, yesterday, Sprint said it would send jobs to India...

[Zero Gravitas]

11. Anti-Americanism

The right wing blow hards go on about anyone who disagrees with Bush*'s wars must hate America. How about a CEO who doesn't want to pay an American $50,000 with benefits but would prefer to fire that American and give his/her job to an Indian who gets paid $5,000? Isn't that much more anti-American than expressing a different political opinion?

Why aren't we hearing more criticism of these America(n) hating CEOs?

[phillybri]

9. Their stock is up 11% today....

That's fucked up. Apparently people only represent "costs"....

[slackmaster]

10. Yes, kind of sick isn't it?

Company stocks usually go up in response to layoffs. It's crazy.

[Whoa_Nelly]

12. Not crazy

The stock goes up when news like this hits the streets. People buy, push the stock up, and then sell like crazy when it reaches a within range certain price per share.

[slackmaster]

17. Yes, speculative trading

A company laying people off is bad news but it provides opportunity. So do other kinds of crises like when someone dies of food poisoning at a fast-food restaurant. The stock goes down suddenly and along come the bottom-fishers seeking profit.

[R Hickey]

13. These jobs are going overseas.

Much of the tobacco we smoke is imported. Our American farmers supply a shrinking share of the tobacco used in US cigarettes.

Probably the tobacco is being prepared by workers near the overseas tobacco plantations where it is being grown. The foreign workers cost a fraction of what the American workers would require.

[Kolesar]

14. Cigarettes should not be a cyclical business

So this should not be a symptom of a sick economy. Perhaps something else is going on at RJR.

[TAH6988]

15. How about

the reduction in demand of cigarettes due to higher taxes and all the law suits the tabacco companies lost. You think thing they can stay in business with all that going on?

[stewert]

20. Hey TAH6988 !

Why are you so worried about a company that sells cancer sticks that kill people
going out of business ?

The government should not let them sell a product that kills people, the whole industry
should be put out of business.

BTW, they still make billions. They are only cutting employees to make their profits look
better so the stock price will go up. All the big corporations are doing this, it's a scam.

The money spent on medical problems due to smoking far outweighs the benefits
from selling the cancer sticks. Health insurance costs are skyrocketing partly from the
money spent on people who get health problems from smoking. People who don't smoke
are paying for the health care cost of a person who got sick from smoking.

Here are some stats for you:

Cigarette smoking is the leading cause of preventable illness and death
in the U.S. Smoking is responsible for 87% of lung cancer cases in the U.S.,
and most cases of emphysema and chronic bronchitis. Smoking is also
associated with other types of cancer and many other diseases, such as
coronary heart disease, stroke, slowed healing of wounds, infertility, and
peptic ulcer.

More than 25% of the adult U.S. population continues to
smoke despite widespread knowledge of these hazards.

An estimated 430,700 Americans die each year from diseases
directly related to smoking. This represents one in five U.S. deaths.

In 1993, the estimated health care costs related to tobacco
were $72.7 billion – 12% of all medical costs.

The estimated total economic impact of smoking (direct medical
costs and lost productivity) was $100 billion in 1990.

Birth complications due to smoking cost $1.4 billion per year.

Lost productivity and forfeited earnings due to smoking-related
disability cost $47 billion per year.

http://www.healthchoices.org/GettingBetter/1.asp

Headline:

4/17/02 - Smoking: Pack costs US $7 in health care

Newspaper Article Synopsis:

The CDC has calculated the cost to the nation in terms of lost worker productivity and health care
costs for a pack of cigarettes. For every pack sold in the US it costs $3.45 per pack in health care
costs and $3.73 per pack in terms of lost productivity, putting the total at $7.18. Multiply that by the
total cost of smoking per year ($3,391) and the total US costs is $157 billion.

http://www.biomed.lib.umn.edu/hmed/20020412_smo.html

[toopers]

23. I don't think TAH6988 was worried about the company going out of business.

Rather, he/she was commenting on the fact that this is not related to the economy, but is related to other factors outside the economy. Smoking and drinking are not cyclical, and typically react independently of the economy.

More than likely, the company is having to make cuts because demand for their products, over all, has declined due to the anti smoking campaign.

[TAH6988]

25. Exactly...thanks N/T

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

27. And don't forget they kill their customers unlike other products

[jus_the_facts]

29. ALL *products* are killing people......

...everything mass produced is deadly...from food to gasoline...to well every f'n thing.... :eyes:

[toopers]

31. This will probably be unpopular, but . . .

those who started smoking killed themselves!

[TAH6988]

33. You got THAT right N/T

[jus_the_facts]

34. THOSE WHO BUY GASOLINE...PLASTIC...PAPER.... DO TOO.....

....THE SELECTIVE REASONING IN THIS THREAD IS FUCKED UP!!!! :puke:

[toopers]

35. How's that?

[jus_the_facts]

37. use yer BRAIN......

:eyes:

[TAH6988]

39. Why? Can't you explain it?

[jus_the_facts]

42. Do you drive......do you buy plastic....do you buy paper......

....then you made a personal choice to keep funding the killing of the entire planet.....any more questions? :eyes:

[TAH6988]

43. Sorry, but there is no direct

link between my buying paper and my killing myself. There is a direct link between smoking and various "life-ending" illnesses.

[jus_the_facts]

44. how much more direct do you NEED......

....if you buy paper....then you are personally responsible for polluting the world and causing various *life-ending* illnesses...DUH!! I won't break it down to an elementary level for you to understand...so close your mind and believe whatever the fuck you want too...GOOD DAY TO YOU!

[TAH6988]

45. Then we should all live in caves by your

silly reasoning.

[jus_the_facts]

46. THOSE THAT ARE LEFT AFTER YOUR PERSONAL CONSUMPTION

WILL BE LIVING IN CAVES....THAT'S THE F'N POINT!!! YEAH the tobacco industry are the only really evil ones....don't take any personal responsiblity for killing yourself and your children..and their children...gosh that's really silly? :eyes:

[TAH6988]

47. I don't think they are evil

Nor do I think people who use paper products are evil. Geez, chill out! If you want to get around on horseback and live in caves or tents, go for it. Leave me and my paper products alone.

[jus_the_facts]

48. EXACTLY MY POINT......

.....IGNORANCE KNOWS NO BOUNDS i SEE....LIVE IN BLISS WITH YOUR PAPER PRODUCTS....FOR THEY ARE MORE DEADLY THAN CIGARETTES EVER THOUGHT ABOUT BEING!!!!!!

[TAH6988]

53. Gee whiz!

You jus_don't_get_it.

I didn't know cigarettes could think BTW.

[jus_the_facts]

55. Oh I most definitely DO GET IT......

...and you can take your comment and stick it...don't forget to WIPE! :puke:

....at least I'm not lying to myself about our destruction of the planet....do you know that the people who work at PAPER MILLS have a much greater risk of dying of cancer than the average person?? I know 5 personal friends who've lost parents...spouses...and siblings from cancer from working at our local paper mill..and the RUN OFF from them cause the cancer rate to expound dramatically to the rest of the communnity......so I DO GET IT!!! So sorry you don't :eyes:

[jus_the_facts]

58. ..AND FOR THE RECORD......

.....I turned down an opportunity to work permanently at that paper mill because the short time I worked there on a temp assignment...THE EMISSIONS FROM THIS PLACE STARTED TO EAT THE PAINT OFF MY CAR!!! THAT is a FACT...so don't try to tell me I just don't GET IT!! :evilfrown:

[TahitiNut]

64. Enter the Righteous Brothers ...

You never close your eyes any more when I kiss your lips
And there's no tenderness like before in your fingertips
Mmm, youre tryin' hard not to show it, baby
But baby, baby I know it

You've lost that lovin' feelin'
Ohh that lovin' feelin'
Youve lost that lovin' feelin',
'Cuz it's gone, gone, gone whoaohoh

Now there's no welcome look in your eyes when I reach for you
Baby you've started to criticize every every every little thing that I do
It makes me just feel like crying, baby
'Cos baby, something beautiful's dyin'

You've lost that lovin' feelin'
Ohh that lovin' feelin'
Youve lost that lovin' feelin',
'Cuz it's gone, gone, gone whoaohoh

Baby baby, I'd get down on my knees for you
If you would only love me, love me like you used to do
You know that,
We had a love , a love, a love you don't find every day,
No no, no no, no no no no no no no
So don't, don't, don't, don't, baby don't throw it away

Bring back that lovin' feelin', o-o-oh that lovin' feelin
Bring back that lovin' feelin
'Cuz it's gone, gone, gone whoaohoh

(guitar solo)

We had a love , a love, a love you don't find every day,
No no, no no, no no no no no no no
So don't, don't, don't, don't, baby don't throw it away

Bring back that lovin' feelin', o-o-oh that lovin' feelin
Bring back that lovin' feelin
'Cuz it's gone, gone, gone whoaohoh

Baby, baby, baby, baby

Bring back that lovin' feelin', o-o-oh that lovin' feelin
Bring back that lovin' feelin
'Cuz it's gone, gone, gone whoaohoh

:silly:

[Pepper]

49. Big Difference

People who purchase cigarettes KNOW it is harmful and can kill them, yet the buy the product regardless.

People who purchase paper/plastic products have no other choice... you can't survice in the modern world without these... unless you suggest we all live in twig shelters in the forests and eat leaves and berries.

It's just a sad fact of life.

[jus_the_facts]

50. We'll ALL be wishin' there were twigs and berries to live on......

.....after our consumption of plastic and paper and gasoline....if this is the ONLY way to live then we're all doomed....:smoke:

[Pepper]

51. I know...

The vast waste humans produce makes me sick.

Unfortunately, I don't see a solution. :( I try to buy natural stuff as much as possible and I recycle everything from paper to aluminum to glass...hopefully many more people will wake up and do the same.

[TAH6988]

54. Sure we are

Another Chicken Little.

[jus_the_facts]

56. ..the sky isn't exactly falling....it's just going away...

....while you consume consume consume.....so much for being very progressive minded :think:

[jus_the_facts]

60. if cigarettes were our only problem in this fucked up world.....

....then we wouldn't have much to worry about *wood* we...:smoke:

[TAH6988]

66. I sure hope you use no paper

or no other "modern" products that pollute.

[Muddleoftheroad]

67. Like electricity

Which also pollutes. But wait! Doesn't that power the Internet?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

38. Either way it's one less customer to make money from...no?

Argue your logic all you want...the end result is the same. If people are getting educated about the hazards of smoking and then choose not to they are being personally responsible which leads to less people killing themselves as you say..which leads to less smokers,,which leads to less customers.

[jus_the_facts]

41. the only point I'm trying to make is.....

...if everyone thought the same way about buying GASOLINE...then the entire planet would benefit...but whatever! x(

on edit...not just oil and gas....but EVERYTHING that's mass produced is killing somebody sometime and ALL OF US AT THE SAME TIME!!! :evilfrown:

[TAH6988]

24. I'm NOT worried

I don't care if they go out of business; I despise their product. But, when they do go out of business, I won't be WHINING about the job losses either. See the difference?

[Misinformed01]

16. So they will save 340 million...2 years

after they spent 320 million on the Santa Fe Natural Tobacco company.

I hope NC voters wake up after this latest round of layoffs in the area-

[pw]

18. So they recoup the cost of the cuts in two years

If everything goes well for them. If things change in two years, maybe the cuts end up not saving them nearly as much, or anything at all, but their workers and stockholders are still taking the hit now.

[swinney]

32. Tarheels will not awaken

They want to ressurect Hesse Helms or Lauch Smearcloth.

Our town lost three major employers. Many many who lost jobs were personal friends.

It ain't funny McGee.

Two of largest employers in area are bankrupt after long histories. BI and Cone Mills.

Things are serious, very very serious in America.

Textiles--Electronics. Go to Wal-Mart and find soemthing made in USA.

It is correct to suggest to buy only--made in USA if it is not too late.

clarence swinney burlington nc(home of BI)

[Aristus]

19. Okay, when are we going to get serious, and have tobacco

farmers plant industrial hemp instead? Lots of industrial uses, and nobody poisoning themselves for the profit of billion-dolar companies.

[zbdent]

22. I see this as an absolute sign that the economy has turned the corner

a Right turn from Recession Street to Depression Alley.

Face it, when drug dealers (that's what they are) have to cut staff to save the company, that means that the economy is TRULY in the crapper.

[piece sine]

28. glad we're all so progressive around here!

No possibility, I guess, that people are free to chose their lifestyle even if it shortens their life. Smokers I know ENJOY their cigarettes. The are giving themselves pleasure, albeit at a risk some of us find unacceptable. Just like drinkers enjoy their beer. (But I suppose you think alcohol-makers are drug-dealers too.) I drive too fast, but it's not Honda's fault. And even though some claim I endanger my life my driving over the speed limit (when conditions allow), it's my decision to make. I weigh a higher level of safety against getting to my destination earlier or on-time and MAKE MY OWN DECISION to drive fast. YES, I may get a ticket; there's always a possibility my extra speed might contribute to a collision if I'm not extra alert as a I speed along BUT I want to be free to shape my own life. I don't smoke (TOBACCO....) and I drink only occasionally -- but these are the choices I make without the influence of social nannies. When I run into some kind, dank bud, I make another entire set of risk assumptions, but they are mine to make!

For all the well-intended concern about JOB LOSS around here, I'm dismayed to see that those Americans who work for politically incorrect companies are exempt from our concern. They're not people, some DUers say, "they're DRUG DEALERS!"

Anybody else remember when liberals were distinquished by their opened-minded tolerance of everybody doing there own thing. Now we seem to rival the GOP in minding other people's business for them.... Bah Humbug! I need a drink!

[5thGenDemocrat]

36. Damn right, piece sine

My mother died nine years ago. I don't need another one.
John
You know when the government and the do-gooders get a say in my lifestyle? When I get National Health Insurance and get on the public dime. Until then, one and all can piss off about what I do to myself.

[TAH6988]

40. I agree

Now, please don't turn around and sue the tobacco companies for the choice you made. If you are a smoker that is! :-)

[DemExpat]

57. So Progressives want National Health Insurance......which will bring

more social control over behavior.......a nanny......less freedom of choice......

Some liberals want it all, don't they?

:shrug:

:hi:

DemEx

[Fovea]

61. there's always a possibility my extra speed might contribute to a collisio

Or even a fatality...
A email buddy of mine was killed by just such a free spirited driver who also abhored social nannies this weekend. My friend, of course also wanted to be free to live his own life, but a free spirited American who had only been released from jail a few hours before on a possesion and dui charge swerved while drunk, crossing the lane at high speed and killed him.

My buddy, Ken Kifer, was a 58 year old writer, retired teacher, cycling and fitness activist-- and someone who was living a simple existence living in a solar powered cabin in the woods. He was a father, a valued member of the community, and he was killed by someone who made a series of stupid, but enjoyable choices.

Why am I going off on this? Partly because I am so unbelievably pissed off about Ken's death.

Yeah, people should have the right to make a choice like tobacco, or even ganja, but speeding, blowing traffic lights, driving drunk, or road rage, no. The cost of the stupid tobacco choice should be a nice offsetting sales tax to pay for that lung transplant later on. The price of driving fast, impared, or in a limbic rage should be life long pedestrianism. The cost might be a friend's life.

[piece sine]

65. whoa!

It's your mis-reading of my response that crossed the line. I admit to driving fast to make a point about personal liberty and you have me all but convicted of DUI and smashing into people head-on and killing them!

Did I endorse running red lights? You make it sound like I enjoy vehicular homicide and practice it on weekends, in my spare time.

As a consolation, I extend my condolences on the unneccessary loss of your buddy (It sounds tragic) but his MURDERER did far more than make a "stupid but enjoyable" choice...his murderer committed murder.

SPEED itself does not kill. Oh to be in Europe again, where there are ofte no posted speed limits on select roads and people get from here to there just fine.

[donsu]

30. they are not going out of business - they have successfully addicted

asia and poorer countries and are moving the work there where they can pay slave wages and pollute all they want.

[AntiCoup2K4]

52. The fact is that tobacco companies no longer need to sell cancer sticks...

.....in order to stay in business. RJR owns Nabisco, so they could sell carbohydrate addiction rather than the somewhat deadlier nicotine addiction. Phillip Morris owns Kraft and God only knows what else, so they too could go completely out of the tobacco business without going bankrupt. Actually, I've been boycotting all Nabisco and Kraft products simply because they DO continue to market death. Perhaps if they went out of the cancer business, I would reconsider.

[InkAddict]

63. Carbs+Refined Sugar = Obesity

which I believe was touted as equal, if not a greater threat, when compared to smoking!

Live free(with respect) or die (controlled)! Lately, the latter seems more realistic in AmeriKa.