Blow to Machismo as Spain Forces Men to do Housework

[chlamor]

Blow to machismo as Spain forces men to do housework

Giles Tremlett in Madrid
Friday April 8, 2005
The Guardian

Spanish men will have to learn to change nappies and don washing-up gloves under the terms of a new law designed to strike a blow at centuries of Latin machismo.

The law, due to be passed this month, is likely to provoke a revolution in family affairs in a country where 40% of men reportedly do no housework at all. It will oblige men to "share domestic responsibilities and the care and attention" of children and elderly family members, according to the draft approved by the Spanish parliament's justice commission.

This will become part of the marriage contract at civil wedding ceremonies later this year.
"The idea of equality within marriage always stumbles over the problem of work in the house and caring for dependent people," said Margarita Uría, of the Basque Nationalist party, who was behind what is an amendment to a new divorce law. "This will be a good way of reminding people what their duties are. It is something feminists have been wanting for a long time."

Failure to meet the obligations will be taken into consideration by judges when determining the terms of divorces. Men who refuse to do their part may be given less frequent contact with their children

http://www.guardian.co.uk/spain/article/0,2763,1454802,00.html

[Warpy]

1. They can pass all the laws they want

but I doubt anything short of a stick of dynamite up his arse is going to get El Rey de los Pendejos off the couch to do some of the work of the household.

Seriously, wasn't having an unpaid domestic servant around one of the main reasons he got married in the first place?

[leesa]

6. You are so right. Rather pointless law. Although I could think of lots

men I know here that I would love to prosecute under the law! Male privilege ain't going away THAT easily.

[spooky3]

2. Interesting. And I'm not so sure that the actual % is different from

in the US.

As I meet more people from around the world (and I'm lucky to have a job that provides some opportunities), I'm always amazed at how untrue many of my stereotypes turn out to be, so I'm trying hard to lose them!

[Vladimir]

3. "Latin machismo?"

fuck me, the stereotypes are out in force today! This sort of thing is a problem across the world, not just in Spain - but at least they are doing something about it. Don't ya just love it when the left is in power?

[Mugweed]

31. Machismo!

I almost choked on my drink! When I was taking Spanish in high school back in the early 80's, we were taught about the culture of Latin Machismo...really we were. If you think it's a stereotype, you might want to look into what's being taught in public schools. This becomes a "given" after 20 or so years of being taught to generation after generation without question.

Machismo...it always reminded me of the radio broadcasts of the Church of Subgenius...Yakatisma! http://www.subgenius.com/

[DerBeppo]

4. insane

another "free" country doing everything they can to change that.

[Coventina]

8. "Free" for whom?

If the domestic division of labor is so unequal that the nation decides to actually pass a law about it, it must be pretty bad.

Women deserve freedom as well as men.

[David__77]

5. This is a good thing.

Men need encouragement to contribute alongside women for household labor. The status quo is intolerable.

[LivingInTheBubble]

12. Where do you stop

Should women be required by law to bring in the same amount of money as men into the household?

Should men be required to run bubble baths for their wives once a week?

Should women be required to provide sex to their husbands a set amount?

and saddest of all the threat is to deprive fathers from seeing their children, that is a sick punishment. I dont know how it is there but here men are already descriminated against in matters of divorce and child custody.

(I dont have any kids btw in case you think I have an axe to grind)

[meow2u3]

7. If only the states could pass such a law....

requiring American husbands to get off their kiesters around the house and share the burden of household work with their wives. :(

These guys who don't lift a finger to do housework and share in raising their kids are the same ones who bitch about their wives being too tired, and having no time, for sex. Now you know, boys.

p.s. What a way for me to come back after a two-week hiatus from DU.

[Dogmudgeon]

9. Sexism is in full bloom today, isn't it?

--p!

[JoFerret]

24. Yep....a little legal reminder and

...all the apologists and naysayers come out in force. And as fro the freedom argument...well....have to laugh on that one. They are not seding police into the home ya know. merely reminding them of issues of equity and fairness and tying a potential penalty to the outcome.

[Az_lefty]

10. pretty screwed up culture when you have to write this into law.

[chlamor]

13. A collective ethos

is needed. When will we get there?

When I was in Italy I stayed with a family who really kept it "traditional". My first night after dinner I began doing dishes. I was the guest and the meal was awesome so hey the least I could do. The father came over and waved me off poured some wine and essentially told me that wasn't work for me.

Well the mother began screaming at the father, the daughter began screaming at the father, the son began screaming and dish towels were thrown. The mother ended up in tears. I spoke no Italian so I asked Roberto, the son and my friend, what went down. Well it was about the Male-Female "roles" and my doing the dishes ignited the debate.

[Karenina]

35. I was informed

by a Swiss boyfriend, as he was listing the faults of his ex-wife, that she was REQUIRED BY LAW to cook for him! AND SHE DIDN'T!!!

[nolabels]

11. Who in the HELL said Housework was only for women anyway?

I like doing housework cleaning up around the house, taking care domestic chores, etc. I do most of my own repairs around the homestead also so it also gives me time to reflect on what I would like to fix next. My wife does her thing and I do mine (when we are not meeting in the middle)

Being one's own bitch does have it's benefits :evilgrin:

[July]

14. I've only got anecdotal evidence, but

I know a lot of middle-aged guys in Spain who do plenty of child care and housework. And I know one 76-year-old who cared for his mother-in-law right up to her death.

Feminism is also alive and well in Spain.

[mutus_frutex]

15. I have some mixed feelings about this..

I come from a society that is fairly similar to the Spanish society. Maybe a bit more advanced in some senses because the presence of the catholic church is not so obvious and the fact we didn't have 40 years of Franco. But still, a lot of the machismo is there, especially among the older generations. What I've noticed is that younger men and women have a much more egalitarian distribution of tasks. This is especially true of those that were brought up by liberated people from the 60's and 70's.

As I said, I have mixed feelings: On the one hand, I think that this law would be quite good to help lots of women that are in some very ugly situations. It will probably wake up others that haven't realized yet how bad they have it. So, I think that the intentions are right.

On the other hand, us men from these countries already have it very, very bad when it comes to divorce and custody of children. It's virtually impossible for us to obtain custody. This law is bound to hurt those that least deserve it: fathers that WANT to have custody. By giving even more tools to the mothers, this law can probably be abused to make committed fathers look bad.

A proper law would stress the egalitarian nature of responsibility and apply the punishment accordingly.

Finally, I should say that things are going in the right direction: men are becoming more and more responsible. This should be stressed with more education and by showing the rewards that come with such responsibility.

Cheers..

[theboss]

16. How about a law that women need to give men one hour of quiet a night

I mean, if we are going to legislate the activities in a marriage.

[barb162]

17. that's hilarious, n/t

[frustrated_lefty]

22. Hell, man,

I'd be happy with 15 minutes. It's not laziness. It's "jesus christ, I just got home and I picked up everything you wanted from the grocery. Give me a goddam minute to shift gears!"

[BlueIris]

25. Yeah, that'll even up the gross inequity here.

Why people think this comment is funny, I cannot fathom.

[theboss]

26. If you've ever lived with a chatty woman, it's funny

Because after ten hours in the office, I really want to look at paint samples for the bedroom.

[TygrBright]

37. Oh, please....

....like there are no MEN who run their mouths until the women living with them want to shriek and/or hide in the bathroom?

Try being a person of ANY gender who can't bear conversation in the morning, and share a house with someone (of ANY gender) who wakes up as Chatty Ken/Kathy, and see how long you can restrain homicidal impulses.

Or having spent the whole day with boss, kids, neighbors, whatever yakking at you, and spouse comes home and wants to "vent" about her/his lousy day and who said what to whom in that stupid meeting and...

AAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!

"Quiet" is NOT a gender-based issue.

diffidently,
Bright

[Zerex71]

18. When's that law going to get enacted in the US?

[Jack_DeLeon]

19. Its pretty fucking rediculous...

when the government gets involved in who does the chores in one's own household.

[BlueIris]

20. It's 2005. Why can't men pick up after themselves?

Why do women put up with that crap? If he's not even old enough to do his own laundry and wipe up after himself in the kitchen and bathroom, how can you feel he's mature and intelligent enough for a committed relationship?

[rodeodance]

28. it is sort of things-picking up clothes that cause sooo many arguments

how silly!!

[orpupilofnature57]

21. Cleaning house is the best Aphrodisiac I've ever found!! join the human race

[JoFerret]

23. Excellent thinking

...especialy with the connection to divorce settlements. Quite a clever approach really. Go Spain.

[theboss]

27. How about a law that every husband gets sex once a week?

I mean, while we are completely overstepping the bounds here, let's go all the way.

[JoFerret]

29. You seem to have a number of grievances

that must arise from a personal situation that you are now generalizing to everyone else. A little couples counselling may be in order.

[theboss]

30. No, I'm just naturally funny

Ever here the one about the Priest, Minister and Rabbi on the life raft?

[Mugweed]

32. Do go on...

Does it involve Latin Machismo?!!! Yakatisma!!!!

[Orangepeel]

33. stupid and intrusive.

A government sponsored public service campaign? Sure. A law? Stupid and intrusive. I wouldn't want my government trying to legislate what happened within my marriage.

[Placebo]

34. How strange.

"Latin machismo", wtf is that about?

[deacon2]

36. I have nothing to add except -

I bow down to anyone who gets away with using "blow and machismo" in the same sentence.