U.S. won't use torture to gain intelligence on terrorists, Bush says

[Judi Lynn]

Posted on Sat, Jun. 04, 2005

U.S. won't use torture to gain intelligence on terrorists, Bush says

BY THOMAS M. DEFRANK
New York Daily News

WASHINGTON - (KRT) - President Bush says he won't condone torture to protect America, even if it means losing information about an imminent attack.

In an interview with radio and television news directors, Bush posed "an interesting ethical dilemma," using as an example a top al-Qaida operative captured last month in Pakistan.

"If you're in my shoes, and you thought Abu Farraj al-Libbi had planned an attack on America, would you use any means necessary to get the information from him?" Bush asked. "The decision I have made is `No, we will not.' And let's just pray he doesn't have that information. And when I told the American people we're not torturing, we're not torturing.

"But try that on for an interesting ethical dilemma as the president of the United States," he added.
(snip/...)

http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/news/politics/11813924.htm

[Solly Mack]

1. What a crock of shit. That's the same stupid talking point

all right wingers use...

He's nothing but a liar. He not only would use torture, he does use it...he condones it, he encourages it..he supports it.

He's a war criminal...nothing but.

[tblue37]

27. Yes, and his minions don't even wait for such an

"interesting dilemma," since about 90% of the detainees are innocent bystanders who were swept up in indiscriminate sweeps or sold to them by warlords because of the bounty the US was offering. Who cares? They torture them anyway, just to keep in practice.

[saigon68]

30. They will use the Pakistani and the Egyptians and their Testicle Crushers

The CIA ANONYMOUS AIRLINE will fly tth hooded men and women to be anally raped by OUR ALLIES IN THE WAR ON TERRA

LOL

[LiberalVoice]

2. "Abu Farraj al-Libbi" - Bush

Yeah sure...he pronounced it just like its spelled I bet. :eyes:

[NYC Liberal]

3. "WE" won't torture...that's what so-called "rendition" is for!

Basically he's bullshitting as usual.

[LostInAnomie]

4. He left himself a lot of wiggle room.

What qualifies as "torture" isn't defined.

Not "condoning" it means if the torturer is called on it there will be consequences, but only if they are called on it.

Just because the US won't do it doesn't mean another country can't and then give us the information.

There is a lot of wiggle room.

[applegrove]

5. If you pay only attention to his first line: he is not lying. Torture does

not get information out of the victims. It gets faulty information out of victims.

So if you take it from there you have to ask: "what will you use the torture for Mr. Bush?"

As you were..

[cornermouse]

6. I'm sorry, but he's become obscene.

[ima_sinnic]

7. #(%*&, I hate that man with every fiber of my being

-- notice the loaded "scenario," the "imminent attack on America" BULLSHIT.

YOU DUMB FUCK, you had SO-O-O MUCH WARNING OF 9/11 before anybody was ever tortured, and you did JACKSHIT with it.

these "imminent attacks" are a huge rarity and seem to happen only when convenient for you. Remember the "imminent attack" that was going to come from Saddam Hussein if we didn't blow up Iraq like yesterday??

this antichrist again plays on people's fears and emotions--golly gee whiz, he's right, we could come under IMMINENT ATTACK, we better start torturing them A-rabs to get that information that could save our worthless TV-watching pork-rind-eating Walmart-shopping fat asses from being blown up!

the ONLY one with "vital information" about 9/11 is the scumbag himself, who went to a closed-door hearing on the subject as Cheney's little ventriloquist dummy (WHY THE FUCK WAS HE ALLOWED TO DO THAT??), ripped 28 pages out of an "official WH report," and has managed, still, to evade any kind of meaningful scrutiny on just EXACTLY what his role and that of his friends and co-conspirators was in the events of 9/11. WHEN DO WE GET TO TORTURE HIM??

[izzie]

8. Bush just can not tell the truth about one thing.

Seems to me we have not got a thing from any of these low grade people we have bought from some war lord at tax payers money any how. We have turned the world into hating the USA. lost a lot of money and makes some nuts think we are doing something, even if wrong. As if any of these people know what is going on when they have been in jail for 2 or 3 years. Madness.

[truthisfreedom]

9. ask scott. ask scott what it means. will others use torture on our behalf?

will they? have they? does that explain bush's weasel words?

[Porcupine]

10. They use torture for personal satisfaction.

Case in point; the innocent afghani cabdriver captured and tortured to death for fun. Not to mention the obvious approval of torture by the majority of rightwing pundits.

Torture is part of their culture and religion. They worship torture devices, the cross, and the crown of thorns. What other religion uses torture devices to represent themselves other than Christianity?

* is telling the truth for once.

[FlyByNight]

11. Well, George, how do you explain...

Abu Ghraib? 'Renditioning'? What about active support of national security states/dictatorships who happen to have large oil reserves within or near their borders?

Liar.

:puke:

[lebkuchen]

12. A letter in yesterday's Stripes condones torture

Does this administration NOT have its poop in one pile or what? Christ, talk about a lack of training and mission understanding, which directly reflects on the incompetence of the WH itself...

****************************************

Result of Quran flushings

What is with the flap over these Quran flushings that has brought out the zealots who drag with them all of their fervor, causing death throughout the Middle East? Why are they so easily whipped into frenzy over something like that?

In only the last 20 years, there have been so many instances of mass Bible burnings and persecution of Christians throughout the so-called tolerant lands of Islam that they have become too numerous to count.

Most Muslims, according to literacy statistics for the region, can’t even read or understand the classical Arabic in which the Quran is written and rely on the often-faulty or agenda-driven translation of the local cleric. My guess is they spend an inordinate amount of time looking for an excuse to accuse the Great Satan on the world’s media stage. I am sick to death of it.

They are able to travel to predominantly Christian countries such as France, Germany and the United States and practice Islam in any way they see fit. Try taking a Bible into Saudi Arabia. You can’t; I suppose some Muslim fanatic might try to burn or flush it.

Has it occurred to anyone that flushing the Quran, if they did, indeed, do that, might have been a technique that yielded excellent intelligence findings about terrorist organizations?

Judging from the current worldwide fanatical Muslim reaction to the alleged flushing, those boys at Guantanamo Bay might just be on to something. Keep up the good work, boys. I am sick to death of the worldwide Muslim double standard. Where is their outrage at their own religious intolerance, or, for that matter, where is ours?

Let’s not even ask why there hasn’t been any outcry from the same Muslim clerics and faithful concerning the beheadings of “infidels” and the daily wanton killings of Iraqi “apostates.” Give it a rest.

Mark Nichols
Camp Buehring, Kuwait

http://www.estripes.com/article.asp?section=125&article=29502

[CJCRANE]

18. Response to the article:

a) it's not really clear how many muslims have been "whipped into a frenzy" over the Quran incidents apart from contradictory statements from Scott Mclellan and General Myers
b) it's also not clear if the techniques used at Guantanamo Bay have actually yielded any useful intelligence
c) plenty of muslim clerics have condemned terrorism and kidnappings, but moderate muslims don't particularly make for good headlines on the primetime news
d) comments about Saudi Arabia are relevant, however they are the current admin's "allies"

[lebkuchen]

28. thanks for the feedback

helpful

[Warren Stupidity]

13. liar

They have redefined torture to mean the level of pain associated with major organ failure - i.e. an agonizing near death experience. Anything else is just fine. When in doubt - they ship them out. We don't torture, under the new definitions, we outsource our torturing to our good friends in uzbekistan and egypt, and until recently even syria.

I think they are scared. The thought has crossed their minds that they could actually be held accountable for their actions.

[Deja Q]

14. We weren't torturing in Abu Gharib? Any latest on those traitors?

[Mel]

15. LIAR

as my Granny use to say (that supposed hell he believes in)
"he's going to bust hell wide open"

love the photo Judi Lynn

[quaker bill]

16. Just say the Geneva Conventions will be applied

Disown the memo. Fire Gonzales for writing it. Then he will start being a bit credible.

Anything less is simply Rightwing BS

[0007]

17. Now that Rumsfeld knows how to operate the "Quigi board"

and that Miss Cleo is junior's right hand man....torture is out and the new Shock & Awe of science is in and mandatory for all the generals to know how to read Tarot Cards.

[leftchick]

19. Did y'all catch his being a "crier and weeps for the troops"?

when is the last time he actually met with a family member? And has he met with any that weren't repuke?

:puke:

~snip~

Bush also revealed a sensitive side, admitting he's often reduced to tears when he meets families of fallen soldiers.


Bush said "my obligation" to visit family members is the hardest part of his job.


"I'm a crier, and I weep a lot," he acknowledged. "On the other hand, when it's all over, I feel incredibly strengthened by the strength of the parents or the wife or the kids."

[Lerkfish]

20. ...Again.

:)

[wellst0nev0ter]

21. Are His Lips Moving Again?

eom

[donkeyotay]

22. He's disassembling again

"If you're in my shoes, and you thought Abu Farraj al-Libbi had planned an attack on America, would you use any means necessary to get the information from him?" Bush asked. "The decision I have made is `No, we will not.' And let's just pray he doesn't have that information. And when I told the American people we're not torturing, we're not torturing .

What the capo means is that we're going to give America another jolt of terror, and when it happens, be sure to blame those libruls, not the crime family that's promoted everyone who helped bring you 911 and it's immoral fallout of illegal war, torture and bankruptcy by defense contractors.



:puke:

[truth2power]

23. Bush's mumblings

aren't worth shit! :puke:

Moving on.....

[Bob3]

24. Such a crock such an utter crock of S**t

1) We don't torture - notice he neatly dodges defining torture and the whole outsourcing bit
2) the ticking bomb straw man - they toss this crap up all the time. One - life is not a Dirty Harry film - Two you have to know that if a high official is captured the rest of the organization would assume that any operation that he knew about was compromised and plans would be changed or canceled.
3) Torture doesn't work - people confessed to flying on brooms or conspiring with anti soviet elements to overthrow Stalin. Torture makes people say things that the torturers want to hear.

swine - may his tongue turn to sand in his mouth.

[Straight Shooter]

25. Can anyone say "Downing Street Memo"?

LIAR!

[Pachamama]

31. Can anyone say "Pre-emptive move prior to new torture pix & video release?

Hmmm.....:eyes: Me thinks this is a pre-emptive move in preparation for the very damaging and disturbing new photos & VIDEOs that the courts ordered the Pentagon to release to the ACLU under the FOIA....

[ckramer]

26. The question is

"Should I believe you?"

For a guy invaded Iraq based on lies?

[bamacrat]

29. Not anymore you mean?

[killbotfactory]

32. It's okay, Bush got permission from the Good Lord to lie with impunity

It's for the greater good, see, and you're just out of the loop and wouldn't understand...

[cawe24]

33. I'm sorry, but

Wasn't al-Libbi the one that was identified by other terrorists already in custody as being nothing more than a gofer? I believe the description was something like 'I remember him, he used to get me coffee.' Here's my crackpot left wing theory: they only apprehend "terrorist bosses" that Dubya can pronounce and repeatedly name drop.

[Marnieworld]

34. Presidenting is "hard work"

"Try that on..." Oh you poor baby! I guess all of those people that died in our custody were dead from natural causes huh? No torturing here folks. Clearly we weren't planning on torturing anyone when we were discussing all of the legalities and possible crimes if we were not to follow the Geneva Conventions. That's a just a coincedence blown out of proportion for the liberal media. Speaking of which it is not unusual at all that so many journalists have died in Iraq. Perfectly natural.
:sarcasm: