NYT: Grisly Effect of One Drug: 'Meth Mouth' (in rural South and Midwest)

[DeepModem Mom]

Grisly Effect of One Drug: 'Meth Mouth'
By MONICA DAVEY
Published: June 11, 2005


From the moment on Thursday when the young man sat down in Dr. Richard Stein's dental chair in southwestern Kansas and opened his mouth, Dr. Stein was certain he recognized the enemy. This had to be the work, he concluded, of methamphetamine, a drug that is leaving its mark, especially in the rural regions of the Midwest and the South, on families, crime rates, economies, legislatures - and teeth.

Quite distinct from the oral damage done by other drugs, sugar and smoking, methamphetamine seems to be taking a unique, and horrific, toll inside its users' mouths. In short stretches of time, sometimes just months, a perfectly healthy set of teeth can turn a grayish-brown, twist and begin to fall out, and take on a peculiar texture less like that of hard enamel and more like that of a piece of ripened fruit.

The condition, known to some as meth mouth, has been studied little in dentistry's academic circles and is unknown to many dentists, whose patients are increasingly focused on cosmetic issues: the bleaching and perfect veneers of television's makeover shows. But other dentists, especially those in the open, empty swaths of land where methamphetamine is being manufactured in homemade laboratories, say they are seeing a growing number of such cases.

These are the same towns, in some cases, that have wrestled in recent years with shortages of dentists. They are places where dentists have struggled to sell their practices as populations shrink; where new dentists have been reluctant to settle, out of fear that they will not get enough business to make ends meet; and where political leaders have offered financial incentives to lure young dentists to town. For good or ill, meth mouth is creating more business....


http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/11/national/11meth.html?hp&ex=1118462400&en=51ca0e06dc145407&ei=5094&partner=homepage

[benburch]

1. Ewwwww!

If I wanted speed, I'd want Dexedrine anyway.... (aka Diet Pills)

[PsN2Wind]

7. Back in the good old San Francisco sixties

a large number of the people I knew would knock back a Christmas Tree (dexadrine spansule) in the AM to get the sleep out of their eyes and the pounding out of their heads. No one thought of it as speed, just a little picker-upper. On the other hand, a young girl I knew went from a pretty, bright and sweet young thing to street hag, with missing teeth and holes picked in her skin, in a matter of 4 or 5 months on crystal. Even then we knew that "speed kills !!!"

[benburch]

10. Nothing I have seen about Dexies...

would lead me to believe that they ought to be illegal for adults to buy.

[Catch22Dem]

2. I see it all over the place in Okla.

Disgusts me. By the way, we recently had a meth head here who got high and left her baby in a walker. The baby rolled the walker onto the grate of the floor furnace (common in older homes) and proceded to cook to death over a period of several hours at a temperature of about 250 deg. while a sibling looked on. Mom was passed out and didn't have a clue. How's that for a little feel-good story?

[DeepModem Mom]

3. OMG!

[Catch22Dem]

5. Yeah!

It takes a minute to sink in, but once it does, it hits you like a ton of bricks doesn't it?

[Warpy]

13. Better than the guy here in NM

Who was with two of his sons in a car going down the interstate, speeding out of his brains. For some reason he could never articulate, he pulled over and chopped one kid's head off while the other watched. He then continued on his merry way, eventually throwing the decapitated head out of the car window but keeping his son's torso in the car while the other kid just looked on.

He's on death row, and I'm sure he'll be grateful to go.

Meth is an ugly drug. We got it stopped for decades in the early 70s, but that was before the drug war really got going. There were alternatives around and they weren't terribly expensive.

Kids who can't get grass are killing themselves with meth and some of the inhalants like air conditioner coolant. This is insane! Stop the drug war!

[uncle ray]

18. sorry, but i don't think it's kids that can't get grass

smoking weed and tweaking are completely different highs, some people enjoy both, but they are distinctly different. grass generally makes you relax, while meth is a GO! drug.

[K-W]

70. It doesnt neccessarily matter that they are different.

There is a reason we call them both high's. They both significantly alter conciousness and produce euphoric feelings.

I think you are mostly right, but I think the persisitance of dangerous activities does belie the lack of safer but still appealing alternatives. It might not be supply either, but something cultural, speed could be seen as cool for instance.

[MountainLaurel]

49. The answer to why

He might have done that is the meth users often get visual and auditory hallucinations. Their brain function patterns are almost identical to those of paranoid schizophrenics.

I'm not sure if it's the same case, but in one instance where a meth addict killed their child, it was because the voices were telling him that was a demon and the only way to destroy it was to cut off its head.

[LondonAmerican]

59. Hear hear

It's the phony hysteria over MDMA (ecstasy), GHB and Ketamine that's caused the crystal meth boom. Es are now 25 USD in the States and G isn't much cheaper. None of them causes any of the problems that that meth does and yet they have all the focus of the so-called war on drugs. So now we have the absurd situation where meth is EVERYWHERE (just go to a big dance party if you want to know what I mean) and CHEAP and where safe drugs like E, G and K are not only expensive but also heavily proscribed. No wonder that a lot of people are taking meth instead even though the high is crap and the after-effects are so nasty.

This insane drugs war has got to stop.

[ismnotwasm]

98. Sorry, don't agree

For a while there, maybe still, raver kids were using Ecstasy and viagra. One Kid lost his penis. NOT an urban legand. My son OD'd on Ecstacy and Vit K, lost his vision for a while, had an out of body experiance while in the hospital, along with some permanent nerve damage. I do agree meth is an uglier drug than most. I tell my kids, drugs do what they do, produce certain chemical reactions. (Did you hear that our bodies apparently have natural receptor sites to THC?-My husband has MS, the info was in the latest edition of MS Watch) Yes the drug war has to end, it's bullshit. But all drugs have the potential to harm.

[LondonAmerican]

113. The fact is

that MDMA, Ketamine and GHB/GBL are all MUCH less dangerous than meth, booze or cigarettes.

I never heard that MDMA will cause you to lose your penis. Can you explain just how that happens? That is an urban legend of the stupidest sort. And if someone actually did have some problem with their dick after going out and doing e and viagra have you ever thought that the problem might have had anything to do with -- oh I don't know -- too much VIAGRA? Hmm?

[King Coal]

116. How did he lose his penis?

I'm not sure I want to know, but curiosity will eventually kill this cat.

[sandnsea]

81. That is bullshit

Plenty of pot in Oregon, plenty. Less then an ounce is a court appearance, a ticket. Meth is horrible here and has been for 20 years. The drug war is not responsible for people seeking cheap thrills, whether it's sniffing paint or PAM, or mixing up meth.

[LiberalAndProud]

19. Meth kills children.

In Nebraska a woman sits on death row because she left her toddler at home alone, locked in a bedroom with no food or water for two days. However, the child did not starve to death. He electrocuted himself by inserting a metal object into an electrical outlet.

Mom was out on a meth binge. I will not cry if she meets up with Old Smokey.

[DeepModem Mom]

26. The anecdotal reports of the deaths of children whose parents are on meth

that have emerged here must be only a few of many others. I would like to see some press on this tragic, tragic aspect of the meth crisis.

[Eloriel]

108. Women are losing their children right and left due to these drugs

Not just meth, of course, but meth is incredibly "popular." There's also some indication that it's harder for women to get off the drug. I volunteered as a child advocate in the juvenile court system for a while -- for kids removed from their homes due to abuse or neglect -- and it was almost ALWAYS because of drugs, and increasingly because of meth. Very, very heartbreaking.

[Flammable Materials]

4. Can we stop arresting people for weed and focus on this nightmare? n/t

[benburch]

6. Nope. Potheads tend not to vote Fascist. nt

[JNelson6563]

24. Stupid, inaccurate generalization

FYI

[benburch]

25. Backed up by polling.

FYI

[JNelson6563]

29. Lame

Your pollling results are counter-intuitive to my life experience. I'll go with the latter, thanks.

Julie

[Toots]

30. I am surprised you feel potheads are war mongers

I have noticed the exact opposite. In fact the Hippies (Peace Love dove) were notorious potheads in their day. It was the potheads of the sixties that fought so hard against the war. That is why the right wing hates hippies so much.

[JNelson6563]

31. Um, I don't, I'm disagreeing with one who does

:toast:

[benburch]

42. I think you misread my intention...

I said that potheads DO NOT vote Fascist.

[donsu]

39. agree

nt

[LondonAmerican]

60. um

actually a lot of hippies were speedfreaks as well. it's not like doing pot means you are a good person and doing meth means that you are evil. it's that pot and e and g and k tend to have much less intense aftereffects and much easier comedown than does meth.

[benburch]

41. You don't think the majority of stoners are Democrats?

NORML strongly disagrees with you. Something like 65% of NORML members say they vote Democratic. (And a large number of the rest are Libertarians.)

[JNelson6563]

43. I must have misunderstood you

I thought you asserted most pot smokers ARE fascist supporters. Mea culpa. :toast:

Julie--who probably just needs to smoke one

[benburch]

45. LOL!

I haven't had any in so damned long that I would pass any drug test, hair, blood, or urine invented by man. *sigh*

[K-W]

71. Meanwhile I can probably fail drug tets I havent even taken. EOM

[KittyWampus]

104. I'd Think 65% Of Stoners SAY They're Dems But 30% Never Make It To

the polls to actually vote.

[tblue37]

46. Some do.

A Libertarian is often a Republican who smokes pot.

[newswolf56]

8. A change in arrest policy would help, but...

...that's only treating a symptom. The reason people destroy themselves with meth is that on a very deep level they feel they have no future -- another manifestation of the national socioeconomic failure and the resultant division of America into two classes: haves and have-nots. Oligarchs and serfs. Plutocrats and proletarians.

[firefox]

9. No. Drug policy does not consider harm. It inflicts it.

I agree with you though. Legalizing laughing grass is a no-brainer. But if you do not do what you know you should do, how will anything ever work.

The USG is fighting the pot issue for fear that the whole drug war will come to an end with harm reduction where people might get help instead of prison.

[MisterP]

15. DEA recently said they'd focus on pot and not crack or H

[converted_democrat]

28. Thank you............

When was the last time you heard about someone steeling to support a pot habit? Or prostituting for pot? My parents still live in the Midwest and meth is out of control.
I know the reason they want to go after pot, they want to cut the next peace movement off at the knees, and throw as many "liberals" in jail along the way. I hate to make generalizations, but in college all of the R-wingers were up to their elbows in coke, and the lefties smoked the herb. Oh, and let's not forget lots of brown people of every shade like herb, so besides all the "liberals" they can lock up all the minorities too. The H.R. 1528 will be the end of America as we know it. Germany and Russia had similar "informant" laws before their slide into the darkside. By the time this law passes, they will have 2 years left to round us all up, before the 2008 presidential election. They won't have to "rig" the machines, we'll all be in jail.

[NEOBuckeye]

11. Good Tongue Twister... Try to say "Meth Mouth" three times fast. n/t

[Enraged_Ape]

33. That's actually how dentists check for early Meth Mouth

If two or more teeth fly out when trying to pronounce that phrase three times fast, then you probably have first-stage Meth Mouth.

[LeighAnn]

54. LOL!!! EOM

[aquart]

12. Is Ritalin in this class of drugs?

[Gman]

14. Probably

Ritalin and Adderol are a mix of amphetamine salts.

[nomatrix]

21. I don't think so

Some of the common chemicals used are acetone, anhydrous ammonia, ether, muriatic acid, iodine, lithium metal, camping fuel, propane, sulfuric acid, pseudoephedrine, brake cleaner, drain cleaner and anti-freeze. Ingredients are "cooked" to form the drug, which is then smoked, eaten, injected or snorted.

[LondonAmerican]

62. Yes,

ritalin is close in structure and function to amphetamines, though not technically an ampetamine

[Media_Lies_Daily]

16. I knew a guy in school back in the early 1970s that was doing meth to....

...double-up on his course work. Within a couple of years, he had developed a twitch in one eye and could barely communicate with his professors and fellow students. He tried to never show his teeth when he talked...probably for the reason you discussed.

He was absolutely brilliant before he starting taking meth, but felt driven by his family's expectations. He ended up with a 4.0 in a five-year architecture program, but he was totally burned out when he left school.

[MountainLaurel]

48. Similarly

In some areas, the majority of meth users are housewives who are (initially) tweaking to be able to work, take care of the family, serve on the PTA, and lose a little weight on the side.

[LostInAnomie]

17. When I used to work in a jail...

... every day we would have to send about 10 geekers to the dentist because of meth mouth. Once they were in jail and away from the meth they would notice that their teeth would start killing them and would be on the intercom constantly begging to go to the dentist because their teeth hurt. The dental bills alone were bleeding the county dry, let alone the price on boarding them.

I guess when they were on the outside they would hit the dope when their teeth started to hurt and once they no longer had access the pain became too much.

[DeepModem Mom]

27. Thanks for this report. So the meth, of course, dulls the pain while...

the teeth continue to deteriorate. This drug is BAD.

[okoboji]

20. here is a great example of this

[Jack_DeLeon]

22. Its fucked up what people will do to themselves, but what are you going...

to do. Its thier choice.

People choose to do drugs, just like they choose to eat and not exercise, just like they choose to drink and smoke.

Its thier choice and they themselves have to deal with the consequences.

Locking up people, prohibiting these things, or heavily taxing them arent going to change anything.

[skooooo]

32. This is different...meth is not just "another" drug...

Contrary to what some people said when I started a thread on meth last week, I do not think it should EVER EVER EVER be legalized.

[Jack_DeLeon]

51. It is just another drug...

its no more special or unique than any other drug.

As for you not thinking it should ever be legalized, yeah prohibition of meth certainly has done wonders to curtail its use. :eyes:

I would never use Meth and I think people who use it are fucking stupid, however our bodies are our own others shouldnt be able to tell us how to live or what to put in it.

[skooooo]

53. Consider this....

...when what you put in your body affects the rest of society, then no, you should not have the "freedom" to manufacture meth, contaminate property and put others at risk, rot your teeth out, and then expect the "system" to pay your dentist bills. Grow up and learn about what's going on. THis is BS.

[shanti]

57. thank you

i feel the same way. crank isn't weed by any means.

[Jack_DeLeon]

77. When it affects others...

then the crime isnt the drug use, its what effects it has on others.

If drugs were legalized it wouldnt mean that all of a sudden murder, theft, and violence are legalized those would all still be crimes they arent going again.

What it would do would be to fix our legal system and stop wasting its resources on punishing people who have not harmed others.

you should not have the "freedom" to manufacture meth, contaminate property and put others at risk

There are already laws against that, legalizing meth use would not change that.

rot your teeth out, and then expect the "system" to pay your dentist bills.

I dont see why the government should be paying for anyone's dentist bills, I'm all for changing that.

[Enraged_Ape]

64. It is NOT just another drug, not by a long shot

I don't know of many vintners or pot growers who turn their neighborhoods into haz-mat areas by producing their product.

I agree that the current laws aren't seeming to do too much to stem the meth problem, but that's because our law enforcement system is too tied up with those "dangerous" potheads and ecstacy users. Pull law enforcement off those drugs and focus them on meth, and the world will be a much better place.

[Jack_DeLeon]

78. legalizing meth use...

would not legalize pollution, so nice strawman.

[Enraged_Ape]

82. People cook this shit up in their houses, poisoning their neighborhoods

Legalizing it won't stop that, but you know that.

[MadHound]

86. Have you studied the economics of the black market?

I have, and legalizing meth would do a number of positive things. First off, much like when prohibition ended, legalizing meth would drive the vast vast majority of home meth cookers out of business. Why cook up the shit when you can walk down to the corner drug store and pick it up legally, and cheaper than you production price. Thus, legalized meth would cure the problem of houses and land turning into toxic waste sites due to meth cooking.

Secondly, if meth is legalized, the quality of the end product would improve greatly, thus alleiviating some of the notorious side effects of meth, including meth mouth. Instead of ingesting a substance that is made out of god knows what poisons, legalized meth would be a quality controlled product free of many of the ingredients that are causing problems now.

Third, much like other countries that have legalized some drugs, the US would experience a decline in meth usage if it was legalized, especially if other drugs were legalized besides meth. There would be an intial uptick in usage, much like the euphoria drinking binge that followed the end of prohibition, but then the usage rates would drop drastically. Meth would lose that forbiden taboo mystique, and if you combined this with education programs(paid for by taxes on meth), there would be a serious drop in the usage of meth.

Fourth, there would be a reduction of the secondary crimes associated with the outlaw status of meth. Burglary, assault, murder and many other such crimes that breed when you keep a substance illegal will go way down.

Sorry, but it has been proven time and again that the human race has an inherent need to do drugs of one sort or another. Making these drugs illegal has never solved this problem, only expanded it. It is time that we legalized all drugs, and end this War on Drugs that is doing much more harm than good.

[Enraged_Ape]

88. Nice try, but you'll never convince me this stuff should be...

legalized. I've seen the damage it's done over and over and over and over again. It's horrible.

Fight the good fight. Fight a fight you (and we) can actually win, and try for legalizing of drugs that AREN'T a freaking scourge.

[Jack_DeLeon]

109. So what....

I'm sure when prohibition ended there were still people who were never convinced that alcohol should be legal. There are still people who think it should be illegal.

I've seen the damage it's done over and over and over and over again. It's horrible.

yada yada yada, alcohol, yada yada yada, tobbacco, yada yada yada, fast food.

Fight the good fight.

It all depends on your perspective. IMO ending the drug war and all the associated bullshit that goes with it like police corruption, loss of freedoms and gang violence far outweigh the negatives of a few fucktards ODing on meth or any drug because it was made legal.

[MadHound]

112. So you would prefer to keep the status quo?

Keep having rural houses and neighborhoods turned into toxic waste sites? Thanks for consigning myself, my family and neighbors to such a fate. I guess you live in a nice urban area and don't have to worry about your neighborhood going toxic. I live in the country, and it is a major worry. Legalizing meth would take care of this problem, but nooooo, you would rather it stay legal, and my neighborhood wilt into a toxic waste site. Thanks.

I also guess you would rather continue to see the crime wave that comes with meth go on and on. Legalizing meth would go a long way to stopping this crime wave, but noooo, you would rather see it continue, just to keep meth illegal. What, you live in a gated community and think that such crime won't affect you? Thanks for consigning the rest of us to being ripped off.

And despite your anti drug stance, you apparently want to see the scourge of meth continue, since you don't want to try the one strategy that would cut way back on meth usage, legalizing meth. No, no, you would rather keeps the usage rates high, and consign ever more people to the scourge of meth. How in the hell is that being anti-drug?

And why do you want people to suffer from the ravages of doing a drug that is made out of crap found under one's sink, with the attendant side effects and reactions from shooting up drain cleaner and battery acid. What, you feel that this is what "those" people deserve, since they are meth heads. Never mind that by having legal, clean meth, you and I wouldn't have to be paying for such things as meth mouth and other side effects. Those damn dirty addicts deserve it for becoming meth addicts, eh?

You know friend, there is a definition of insanity that states that one is insane when one continues to do the same thing over and over again, yet expecting a different result every time. Our government is engaging in this form of insanity by continuing this War on Drugs. Prohibition of any substance isn't the way to bring such problems under control, it just exerbates the initial problem, and creates a whole slew of secondary ones. I live in the middle of meth country, I see what the affects of meth are on a daily basis. I also see the effects of keeping meth, and other drugs, illegal, and quite frankly we would be better off legalizing all drugs. I live with the very real possibility that my land will become a toxic waste site, uninhabitable. I would be SOL, whereas if the shit was legal, I wouldn't have to worry about that, or a whole raft of other problems that come with prohibition. Prohibition has proven to be a bust friend, it is time to stop engaging in this collective insanity, and address these problems from a new angle. It is time to legalize all drugs. Think about it.

[LondonAmerican]

115. hear, hear!

[rocktivity]

99. DING DING DING! Enraged Ape, you're our grand prize winner!

I don't know of many vintners or pot growers who turn their neighborhoods into haz-mat areas...

Your post made me laugh because my introduction to meth was via TV footage of a police raid on a house. Once the cops had brought out the suspects, they had to put on jumpsuits and masks before going back into the house to get the drugs. I remember saying, "WTF kind of a drug is THIS?"

:spray:
rocknation

[Enraged_Ape]

111. Thanks, rocknation

I just frankly can't believe why anyone could stick up for, of all things, crystal fucking meth. But I'm sure if there were a post on this forum condemning the North American Man-Boy Love Association (NAMBLA), there would be some jackass running here to defend it.

[LondonAmerican]

65. Exactly

and though tina is evil, it's not anybody's business what drugs anyone else chooses to take so long as they don't tangibly hurt someone else through the use.

this drug war has done NOTHING except enrich the mafia and give leverage to their friends in the government. it's disgusting in its effects as well as in principle and it must be ended before more people's lives are destroyed.

[NickB79]

93. I feel it is special and unique compared to other drugs

Use of crystal meth physically alters the chemical makeup of the brain permanently. After using meth for any length of time past a few weeks, serious damage to the brain begins to take place.

"If anyone doubted that drug use can damage the brain, new studies using brain scans show methamphetamine abusers' brains have damage similar to dementia, as well as considerable brain inflammation."

http://www.sciencentral.com/articles/view.php3?type=article&article_id=218392428

And from CBC News http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/drugs/crystalmeth.html:

"Experts say that crystal meth is one of the most addictive street drugs and one of the hardest to treat. Addiction counsellors say the relapse rate of 92 per cent is worse than cocaine.

The withdrawal symptoms, especially the depression and physical agony, are reported by addiction counsellors to be worse than heroin or cocaine, and often addicts will drop out of recovery programs."

You would be hard-pressed to find a drug more addictive and damaging than crystal meth. Even pure, lab-produced meth will produce the brain damage associated with crystal meth, because the methamphetamines themselves are causing the brain damage.

I'm all for legalizing drugs, as long as they aren't so addictive that they are virtually impossible to get off of. The user would be free to choose whether or not to do meth the first few times, but after that becomes a virtual slave to the drug, incapable of quitting without a proficient (and expensive) recovery program. Even after recovery, many meth addicts require anti-depressants for the rest of their lives to function normally, as that part of the brain needed for regulating emotion is permantantly damaged. I feel the freedom to choose what drugs you want to use should also be accompanied by the freedom to be able to stop using them when you want to. Admittedly, there will always be a segment of our population that will get addicted to any drug, be it weed, alcohol, or meth, but with a recovery rate of only 8% and permanent brain damage, I feel meth crosses the line.

[Jack_DeLeon]

110. and the war on drugs...

is doing oh so much to stop the meth problem right.

Honestly I think people should be free to fuck themselves up and ruin thier lives if they choose, its thier life after all.

I dont think the loss of freedoms, and the violence and corruption cause by the war on drugs are worth it.

[Chicago Democrat]

68. Amphetamines have many medical uses...

and they are legal with prescription. (though they are not prescribed very often these days)


(I tend to agree with you about meth, but remember people are people and this is a chemical, the meth addicts need help getting off and staying off)

[The Stranger]

35. Learn about addiction before posting such incredible ignorance

on what is otherwise an informative thread.

Please.

[Danieljay]

61. I get your point...however......

the crime associated with Meth users stealing to maintain their habit is awful. Its not like people who occassionally smoke a little pot on their front porch on a friday night. The meth problem goes way beyond that. I'm all for liberalization of certain drug laws, that being said, when people have to destroy or steal my property, my time, my tax dollars, and my safety... it goes beyond their choice and their consequences and into my personal life. I'm all for regulating substances that contribute to manufacturing this, prosecuting those who break the law, but I would add in the componant of rehab. If they refuse rehab... a stiffer sentence to keep them off the streets.

[LondonAmerican]

66. Stopping the criminalisation of drugs

reduces the ancillary crime associated with their use. if drugs are easily and cheaply available, say through a system as was used in the uk for heroin before the american government forced them to change their policies, drug use would be much less risky both for the user and for society as a whole.

[Danieljay]

67. true..but can it ever happen?

I'm intelligent enough to know that your assertion is correct...criminalization drives it underground and the crime associated with it. Prohibition proved that. I really don't know what the answer is. decriminilizing is a great idea..but where does it start? Are there some drugs that should be decriminalized as opposed to others? There has to be line drawn somewhere, would you not agree? Meth use is a symptom of a much greater problem but at the same time is not a drug that only affects the user. It affects the very fabric of society. Again, these meth users aren't professionals sitting on the porch lighting up on the weekends. There are many layers to this.

[LondonAmerican]

74. personally

i would not draw a line. i'd legalise all drugs since the principle of making them illegal is so wrong, and it's precisely the users of the worst drugs that need to have their health monitored and to be able to buy their drugs at costs that don't force them to steal.

along with that, i'd be very careful about letting them near their children - in cases involving meth, crack or heroin i'd want the kids removed from their custody so that they cannot do harm.

and you would be surprised who some of the crystal users are. i met a guy who is a senior exec at a well-known firm who goes on meth binges so that he can handle his workload: he simply does tina for days on end and goes through emails, memos, plans, etc., the whole time and it drove his bf crazy until they finally broke up.

there ARE many layers to this.

[Xithras]

97. Untrue with drugs like Meth

Meth makes people useless to society...the nature of the drug forces them to either be constantly under the influence or be seeking it out. It's not like pot or cocaine where you can use it "recreationally". I was once told by a meth addict that it's like food...you can ignore it for a while, but your body tells YOU when it needs more meth, and ignoring it too long causes the logical parts of your brain to start shutting down. Meth is incredibly addictive, and once addicted meth users CANNOT hold jobs or function in any role that requires them to be sober for any extended period of time, on any kind of regular basis. This means that even if legal, meth users would probably still be forced to resort to crime in order to feed their habits.

[LondonAmerican]

114. True with all drugs, even meth...

There is nothing unique about meth -- it causes the same chemical reactions in the brain as does cocaine and as do other amphetamines. The only difference is the duration of the effect and the fact that meth doesn't get you 'high' in any normally accepted sense of the word.

You are ascribing magical characteristics to meth when you say that -- even in its complete absense from the body and brain -- it can somehow cause certain parts of the brain to 'shut down.' Nonsense.

Meth is not a good thing, as I have seen from people I know on the gay scene in London. Some people have weaker characters than others and become 'addicted,' while others manage to use it recreationally and don't become 'addicted.'

In all cases, it would be best if the drug were cheaply and readily available through regulated outlets so that people would not need to resort to crime in order to procure their drug of choice. It shouldn't matter whether anyone can work or not. The fact is that all industrialised countries today have extensive welfare states to provide for the needs of people who will not or cannot work or take care of themselves in a normal way. Why would this be any different?

[sendero]

23. I'm not the most anti-drug guy..

.... you'll ever meet, but I hate, hate, HATE meth - I 've seen what it does and it has no redeeming qualities whatsoever.

[Enraged_Ape]

34. Everything about this drug is destructive

The drug's effects on the health and life of its users, the behavior of its users and how that behavior impacts society, the drug's effects on communities, its effects on the environment...

there truly IS nothing to be said for methamphetamine.

[Pystoff]

36. This causes me to think.

I am a bit of a recluse...I don't care for crowds and people at times. But one thing I do is observe people as much as I can and listen to what they say without being involved in their conversations. Meth users are usually suburban low educated and white from what I've seen (correct me if I am wrong about your neck of the woods). It seems to have devistated many smaller towns and created many new felons (can't vote). These people overwhelmingly vote republican out of ignorance towards their own situations. The DEA wants to focus on pot you say? Well good they are going to loose more right wing votes through meth than they can stop with pot arrests anyways. And I love the weed but I can think and cover my ass because I don't NEED it like a meth user needs his fix and won't make mistakes in a desperate search for it. 3 more years and small town america wont be able to vote for the next gay bashing ,bible thumping, war loving, right wing turd they offer. Yes this is harsh but anyone dumb enough to use that stuff gets what they deserve for their stupidity.

[AngryAmish]

37. Meth is a big problem in the gay community

It is evil stuff. It will spread outside the rural base and become a huge threat.

[Pystoff]

40. Good point

You are right I forgot that the gay community has a problem with meth.

[LondonAmerican]

69. Exactly

meth is a REAL problem in the gay community, as i've seen every time i come back to the states for a party. my bf and i were just at gay days in orlando (great time, by the way!) and though a lot of people at the afterhours were doing e and the atmosphere was very up, there were also quite a few crystal heads as well, who have a completely different vibe about them (inward, not very social, hyper).

tina has also had a bad effect on the music, a lot of which is nasty tribal pots-and-pans noise. the uplifting funky house vibe you feel in london clubs only happened once in a while (though when it did, all hands were in the air and that was an amazing site)

so i'd be careful about being too sure about who uses what kind of drug. i have had friends who were right-wing republicans who used weed, as well as lots of people when i lived in the lower east side in the 80s who shot coke and heroin and who were pretty left in their outlook.

[shanti]

44. low educated and white

got that right. but it's more than just the suburbs. here in sacramento, i see them every damn day riding the light rail, taking their trash bags of cans to the recycle center. the women are the worst. it's so sad to see someone that used to have some looks and potential let themselves go so low. it's like they just don't care about life anymore. i saw a woman get on the train yesterday who looked to be about 50 or so (probably much younger). she was carrying trash bags of cans and was filthy and you could tell by her sunken cheeks that most of her teeth were gone. there are lots of couples too. when the weather warms up, it gets worse.

however, lots of tweakers live out in the country cause it's easy to cook their crank unnoticed.

it's even touched my own family too. my brother did crank, but he's been clean and sober for almost 3 years. it's a terrible, destructive drug. :-(

[LeighAnn]

55. The Skeleton People

They're all over the place. Horrible to be cornered into a conversation with one.

[Brian Morans]

38. Faces of Meth

I know this stuff has been posted before, but...

More faces of Meth here:
http://www.oregonlive.com/news/oregonian/photos/gallery.ssf?cgi-bin/view_gallery.cgi/olive/view_gallery.ata?g_id=2927

[LondonAmerican]

72. amazing

really effective pics. thanks for linking.

[Rainscents]

79. Why meth makes peoples face look horrible? Does anyone know?

[MountainLaurel]

83. Weight loss, for one

Meth basically kills your appetite (it's the illicit version of legal amphetamines such as diet pills) And the fact that you don't sleep for days at a time plays a role.

Also, meth heads often get hallucinations, such as the feeling of bugs crawling over their skin. So, they try to pick the bugs off and end up mutilating themselves.

[Rainscents]

89. I didn't know that... Thank you!

[XemaSab]

47. Any drug that makes you kill your kids

is not okay... when I lived in Sacramento there were stories in the paper all the time of people doing meth and beating toddlers to death. Unacceptable.

Stoner parents may be mildly negligent, but usually are not violent.

[The_Casual_Observer]

50. So much for "family values" red state bullshit!

As if all that bible thumping crap was protecting them from this kind of ugly drug abuse.

[Blue_In_AK]

52. I can't link to your article...

...but it was reprinted in this morning's Anchorage paper. Did that article have that hideous color photograph in it? I nearly choked on my coffee.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

56. The one of the teeth?

If that's what you were referring to, yes it did.

It's simply heartbreaking what I've seen this drug do to people.

[Blue_In_AK]

58. I agree...

I've had personal experience, too -- I mean, not myself personally but people very close to me, including my first very pathetic little husband back in 1968 who was such a meth junkie by age 18 that he didn't have any veins left (I was in full rescue mode). He ultimately was murdered in 1974 -- four years after we split up -- apparently a random act, although never solved. A sweet boy, but a very tragic figure.

[Logansquare]

63. The Faces of Meth

Take a look at this slide show. WTF would anyone do this drug?
http://www.cbsnews.com/elements/2005/04/30/in_depth_us/photoessay692188.shtml

[Ripley]

73. AAAAAAAA EEEEEEEEEEEE KKKKKKKKKKK!!!!!!

Those are horrific! That one woman turned into the Bride of Frankenstein!

[Greyskye]

90. Bride of Frankenstein indeed!

[Enraged_Ape]

75. WTF is with all the facial lesions?

Good Lord.

[Codeine]

84. Tweeking

They tweek out and start picking at any little blemish or zit on their faces. That makes scabs, which they pick at, which get infected and ooze pus, so they squeeze them, which spreads bateria, which makes more zits, which they pick, etc.

Horrible stuff. I live in the traditional capital of meth use (inland Southern California) and you folks are just getting a taste of what we've had for years. Good luck.

[Enraged_Ape]

85. That is absolutely horrible

:puke:

God damn, how could anyone get into that stuff?!! That is just 110% fucked up!!

[tjwash]

91. Tweeking and picking. Slammers are the worst at it.nt

[bluebear200]

100. These folks look good compaired to some....

These folks look good compaired to some that I've seen around here (Central California).

You can tell them from a mile away - heads bobbing about, bodies twitching and arms thrashing about as they repetedly brush back whats left of their yellow-grey hair.

One person I used to call a friend started doing meth and after about six months lost his wife, house, cars, trucks and construction company.

The last time I saw him he was convinced the CIA was spying on him with lasers from every passing airplane and sattelite and was so paranoid he was carrying 2 pistols and a nine inch buck knife.

Paranoia from lack of sleep causes these people to do irrational things and sometimes leads to tragic violence.

Yet around here pot busts are a daily news item while the meth problem gets little coverage.

[bleedingheart]

76. My cousin (17 years old) has "meth mouth"

he has lost most of his teeth and is still having to see a dentist and an oral surgeon.

But he is lucky...he is in a boy's home and is now attending a regimented program.....and they took away his cell phone...which has helped him to keep "out of the loop" of the drug crowd.

Today he attended my nephew's graduation party with permission of the home....and to tell you the truth he used to look a whole lot more like a kid...now he has a haunted look about him..but he is getting better.

[fleabert]

80. holy shit!

that was disgusting. I am even more glad I am not addicted to meth now.

[R Hickey]

87. Native Americans in Northern Wisconsin are awash with it.

I just talked with someone I know who spends time on a reseveration north of Eau Claire, Wisconsin. She said everybody was smoking it. Big problem.

[geniph]

92. I've known a lot of recreational drug users very well over the years,

and I've known dozens of people who could maintain active, productive, happy lives while regularly using all kinds of drugs from alcohol to pot and coke and pills...
BUT I HAVE NEVER KNOWN A METH HEAD WHO COULD JUST USE RECREATIONALLY AND CONTINUE TO MAINTAIN A PRODUCTIVE LIFE.

Maybe they exist. I've never yet met one, and I've known a lot of heads over the years. That stuff is different.

I hate Reefer Madness, LSD-will-make-you-jump-out-of-windows, PCP-will-make-you-rape-and-kill antidrug hysteria that gets totally blown out of proportion by a media frothing at the mouth for the next gory story, but I have yet to meet a meth freak who doesn't go over the top with the stuff. It freaks me out.

[dave29]

94. I was a meth addict until January

I had a "self intervention", was able to come clean with my wife and family after realizing what I was doing to myself and to others.

I haven't had any problems with my teeth - but I certainly was irrationally angry for a good two months once I stopped binging. I was not a daily user, but I used enough to completely change my "persona". When you quit, you want nothing but sugar (a relic of the high - you're body wants to stay "up")... luckily I was educated about post meth use, and managed to avoid all of the pitfalls of it's devestation, including the 20lbs of weight most people put on when they quit.

I ate healthy, took care of my teeth (even while using), and managed to come out of it ok. Had a bunch of blood work done which all came back positive (as in, my body is still functioning normally).

I can see how so many people want to stereotype users of meth - but I am as liberal as they come, not gay, and highly educated. I have had other problems with addiction.

Addiction is truly a national, rather than regional problem.

My dealer had a "Re-defeat Bush" bumpersticker on their car.

[mitchum]

95. Congratulations on that...

and keep clean. I kicked a severe meth addiction over twenty years ago, and was very fortunate in that I did not suffer any lasting ill effects. We are the lucky ones.
Stay strong, dave29 :)

[dave29]

96. thanks and true - we are lucky

so many people have no idea what meth is capable of. I was lucky to be able to recognize what it was doing to me - and on top of that, to care enough to do something about it.

Vigilance is the only road - and I've got not only myself but a strong support group in my corner. I'm not too worried, but then again, you have to always be on guard with these things.

[Enraged_Ape]

105. Congrats to you and mitchum

God, that's just horrible. I can't think of a worse addiction, and you guys have my HIGHEST respect for kicking it.

Paint solvents and freaking angel dust seem almost tame, in comparison. Good Lord. I'm glad you guys are clean and here today on DU to tell the tale.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

101. Here's to you!

I'm honestly thrilled for you. :toast: :)

Keep up the good work!

[dave29]

103. thanks very much

and I will. There is too much going on to fight for than to get sidetracked by a quick fix :)

[bhunt70]

102. This crap is horrible, it truly is an evil drug.

I'm a former user, I've done a lot of shit, but I would certainly take a stand against crystal. It is horrible.

[TexasLawyer]

106. The Anti-drug

I made my very looks-conscious teenage daughter read the article, lest she be tempted to try crystal meth.

[Skypilot 18]

107. It's just too easy to make

There is no way to get rid of meth. It's always been around and it will always be around. It does not matter what form of it you take. Bennies, meth tabs, crank, dexies. they're all the same under the chemical structure. Just a little tinkering here and there. But it's all the same.

That said, I believe speed freaks are sick and in need of medical help. Putting them in jail becomes more expensive in the long run and accomplishes nothing.

Sick people do not belong in prison

[reprobate]

117. Don't forget what Patrick Henry said: Give me librium or give me meth.