White House 'Puzzled' Over Rove Flap

[sabra]

<<SNIP>>
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160572,00.html

White House 'Puzzled' Over Rove Flap
Friday, June 24, 2005

WASHINGTON — A White House official said Friday the administration finds it "somewhat puzzling" that Democrats are demanding presidential adviser Karl Rove's (search) apology or resignation for implying that liberals are soft on terrorism.

"I think Karl was very specific, very accurate, in who he was pointing out," communications director Dan Bartlett (search) said. "It's touched a chord with these Democrats. I'm not sure why."

Congressional Republicans earlier joined the White House in standing solidly behind Rove, saying he shouldn't apologize and that he was outlining a philosophical divide between a president who sought to win the war on terrorism by taking the fight to the enemy and Democrats who questioned that approach.

The controversy, fought out in hearings, floor speeches and news conferences Thursday on Capitol Hill (search), was the latest of several highly contentious battles that have soured the already highly partisan atmosphere.

Earlier this week Sen. Dick Durbin (search), D-Ill., apologized after being hit with a chorus of attacks from Republicans about comments in which he compared detainee treatment at the U.S. military prison at Guantanamo Bay (search), Cuba, to the actions of Nazis and other repressive regimes.

<</SNIP>>

[formercia]

1. It's called Blowback

the law of unintended consequences.

[Mark E. Smith]

31. Their Polls Must Be Telling Them Something Awful

This is a strange time for them to be playing the wild card. You'd think they'd be saving that horse shit for October 2006. It's almost like the Bushlings are now taking their lead from lunatic fringe reactionary blogs and USENET.

After this, what do they have left? A near naked Karl Rove in leather shorts and leiderhosen?

[formercia]

39. It's just to create a distraction from DSM

see it works. Instead of talking about DSM, we talk about the worthless stench that comes out of Rove's ass.

[bunny planet]

46. Guess what, we can multitask, just like they can.

DSM
Coingate
Fire Rove
Plamegate
Abramoff/Delaygate
Failure in Iraq
The Diebolding of America
These all need to be hammered home endlessly and simultaneously. This is what the Repukes do, we need to start doing it to.

I personally think we need to get the NYC Fireman to denounce Rove's remarks. They supported Bush in the election, unlike the rest of the country's fire departments backing Kerry, but they might just be ready to change their minds now. They were used by this President and NYC Firefighter's do NOT like being manipulated. I've got some friends in the department I'm going to be feeling out. If they made a public National statement it would be awesomely effective.

[adigal]

60. My husband, who was a NYC firefighter on 9/11

denounced this very loudly and clearly at home. Oh, yes, he did.

[bunny planet]

61. Great, maybe he can get some his fellow brother firefighters to denounce

Bush and Rove's deceptions too. My friend in the Dept., has three brothers also NYC firefighters, they all retired last year. When I last spoke to him about it at Thanksgiving, he was still of the mind that Iraq and Al Quaeda were connected. I haven't broached the topic with him since out of respect for his feelings. His brothers felt the same way at the time. Hopefully they've changed their minds. As you know, the firefighter's were moved that Bush stood on the pile with them with his bullhorn. They were raw from their loss at the time and I guess (in the case of my friend, I can't speak for any other NYC firefighters) it was just too painful to entertain the thought that the President may have used and exploited their emotions for his own agenda. Denial can sometimes be a powerful way of protecting the heart and mind from unthinkable betrayal. This is why I've never pushed it with my friend and actively voiced that I believed Bush lied to everyone, not just the firefighters about the real reasons we are in Iraq and is not pursueing Osama Bin Laden and Zawahiri the way he should be. Does your husband know if any of the NYC Dept. is regretting their backing of Bush in the election?

[adigal]

62. I will ask him to make some calls

I know some wingnut firemen, my brother and ex-friend, love Bush and would do anything for him!! There must be some sane ones, no?? I have not heard that the union has pulled back from their support of him.

[geniph]

73. The IAFF did not endorse Bush

The IAFF endorsed Kerry. There were a hell of a lot of firefighters - including the president of the firefighters' union - in Boston with me last July.

[bunny planet]

93. I know the IAFF did not endorse Bush. They endorsed Kerry.

The New York City Firefighter's Union endorsed Bush though, at least that what was in all the local papers in NY and I believe it got some national coverage as well. I remember because I was quite upset about it, it was an undeserved shot in the arm for His Fraudulency before the election.

[LiberalFighter]

63. Do those firefighters think gw*dipshit...

would had stood with them if he had known that his military jets weren't protecting his ass?

[bunny planet]

65. The NYC firefighters were so traumatized in the days and weeks immediately

after it was understandable that they would want to trust in the President. Don't blame them. Remember, there's a little problem with the media not telling the truth.

[adigal]

98. You're right - and firefighers are, for the most part,

salt of the earth, honest, straightforward types, and it is hard for many of them to conceive that their president and vice president and "condi" and "rummy" would purposefully lie to them.

[leftynyc]

72. I was thinking that

he was waaaay too much of a coward to say this in front of New York's bravest and finest. Slimy little maggot....and that goes for anyone who agrees with him. I'm furious.

[MadisonProgressive]

89. you forgot mediagate

[katty]

53. Karl's bad remarks? why? he's such a sweetheart..we stand by

our Pillsbury Doughboy

[calimary]

69. I'd prefer a kkkarl rove in an orange jumpsuit, handcuffs and leg irons.

Flabby, anemic putz.

[MadisonProgressive]

90. Hey, that's an insult to flabby, anemic putzes everywhere!

[hatrack]

76. Thanks for planting that last image in my brain . . .

indelibly . . .

:puke:

:hi:

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

107. A near naked Karl Rove in leather shorts and leiderhosen?

Damn you!!!! My mind's eye didn't need that one.

[Deja Q]

2. What a pig. The bulk of Dems have been with that president all along.

It's not Dems being soft.

It's a president who's unspeakable in his immoral and illegal acts.

[Roland99]

3. Bartlett's excuse was Rove was referring to MoveOn.org and M. Moore

What a fucking pathetic tool Bartlett is.

I saw him interviewed by Matt Lauer today. Bartlett was visibly irritated.

[alcibiades_mystery]

13. And he was wrong there too

MoveOn did not oppose action in Afghanistan, but action in Iraq. We must keep these distinct, since they are distinct. Bartlett and Rove will try to conflate these, understanding that the American people are seeing the distinction more and more, and that this distinction will hang them, metaphorically speaking.

[kskiska]

25. And Moore isn't even a Democrat.

Wish they'd get their facts straight.

[Roland99]

37. But he's a "liberal"

Like being a liberal is a bad thing.

[William Seger]

43. Exactly

This is really just a strategy to reinforce the Big Lie that the invasion of Iraq had something to do with a "war on terrorism." This is just Rove's version of "When did you stop beating your wife?" And the obvious reason is that the Big Lie is starting to fall apart. But Big Liars know that they'll have more success by simply repeating the lie over and over, rather than showing any sign of backing down.

Here's the thing: this strategy will probably work if Dems get suckered into discussing Rove's comments on Roves own terms. To succeed, Dems should point out, loudly and frequently, that associating the invasion of Iraq was a "war on terror" is a baldfaced scam. Like Judo, use Rove's comments against him to highlight the mendacity of this administration.

[okieinpain]

75. did moore oppose action in afghan.

[CAcyclist]

86. He Questioned It, As did I

He said, "So We're going to invade Afghanistan because Osama bin Laden hid out there - Since when does the government go after the landlord on our behalf? "

I think MM had every right to question the reasoning behind our going to war in Afghanistan, especially since we didn't stick around to finish the job and actually catch OBL.

[rodeodance]

34. I head a bit from Barlett today but not this. Bartlett sure is making the

rounds last few days. He is everywhere.

[katty]

55. Bartlett set out to "frame" the issue and make Dems wrong

by pointing fingers at MoveOn and Moore, they "framed" what Karl
said THEIR WAY--and they will REPEAT THIS OVER,OVER,OVER,OVER....
in the media-this is EXACTLY what they wanted to stir up.

[pinkpops]

85. Time to make another donation to moveon.org

[BlueEyedSon]

4. So, their response is "if the shoe fits...."?

[underpants]

5. Translate: "Why are their panties in a bunch?"

This is just part of the "We are manly men and libs (Dems) are wussies" product line.

[katty]

57. Again, let's keep the DEMS on the defensive...that is their plan

because they will have to start really ramping up LIE MACHINE and keep DEFENDING the DSM and their Iraq invasion.

[Frederik]

6. See, this is what Democrats should have said

when Durbin was criticized:

"We find it somewhat puzzling that Republicans are demanding Durbin's apology"

" I think Durbin was very specific, very accurate, in who he was pointing out. It touched a chord with these Republicans. I'm not sure why."

"Durbin outlined philosophical differences in how to treat prisoners of war"

[LincolnMcGrath]

9. Thank You

[bunkerbuster1]

15. So I shouldn't apologize if I call Bush a "shit-stain."

After all, I'm only being "very specific, very accurate, in who I am pointing out."

[Frederik]

23. According to Rove's logic, you shouldn't

As long as everybody knows who you're talking about. Doesn't matter if it's true or not.

[SammyWinstonJack]

41. Until the Democrats try to use that tactic

Then it will suddenly only apply to repukes. See how that works?

[ixion]

27. exactly... "Durbin was 'puzzled' at criticism"

it's that simple. Why the hell can't they get that through their heads? There are not providing an opposition when they continually cave to rethugs.

[goclark]

35. Right! When will we ever learn!

Durbin DID NOT say anything wrong. He was clear as a bell and when the Torture Photos come out he will be excused by even the worse of them- except the NEOCONS of course.

[Debi]

36. You are correct and this should be used as a learning tool for Dems

when one of ours gets criticized we should rally - not run and hide beneath our senate desks and call press conferences saying that "he doesn't speak for me".

Democrats have to toughen up and stand firm...

I think this was a brilliant move on Rove's part - Durbin (and Dean) say things that make republicans bristle and Dems run and hide and cry. Rove says something that makes Democrats bristle and republicans shrug and say 'So what?'

We need to get stronger.

[acad122861]

52. Rove's statement didn't mention "Democrats"

What he said was "Liberals", and look who starts jumping up and down!
It's a game played by third graders and the Dem leadership fell for it.

[TankLV]

71. The problem is, that Durbin has been proven RIGHT about what he said,

and we are RIGHT about what we say about bunkerboy and the repukes - always - and they are proven WRONG - again!

I demand an apology from bunkerboy and all repukes!

[CitrusLib]

7. 'implying'??? WTF! God, I HATE these guys.

[Beetwasher]

8. Hmm, So That Means NAZI "Touched a Chord" W/ Repubs?

Well, that's their logic isn't it?

[acad122861]

56. The "NAZI" comment was directed at the guards, not the Republicans

Durbin's comments were an attack on the troops guarding detainees taken prisoner during combat operations.

Rove referenced "Liberals", not Democrats; or are those terms mutually inclusive?

[Warren Stupidity]

68. you must be lost

Obviously you typed in the wrong url.

By the way Durbin's comments were not an attack on troops guarding detainees, Durbin's comments were an attack on the policies for the treatment of detainees, policies that are best described as typical of totalitarian regimes such as nazi germany or the former soviet union. It is only fascist Republican a*holes who insist that it is just some 'bad apples' who are doing the bad things THAT WE KNOW ABOUT, and not POLICY directed right from the top and unfortunately implemented by 'the troops'.


Anyhow, welcome to DU, but I suspect your stay here will be rather brief.

[opihimoimoi]

10. The Bush Guys were Puzzled since 2001.....nothings changed....

[Jacobin]

11. These guys are good at conflating IraqNam with 9/11

If you look at the statements carefully, its simply a continuation of that theme....

[alcibiades_mystery]

14. Bingo

Exactly

[alcibiades_mystery]

12. But MoveOn.org did NOt oppose military action in Afghanistan

They should not be allowed to peddle that lie.

The initial speech was a mistake, and a bad misstep for Rove. But the spin has been well-ccordinated with the ongoing PR offensive on Iraq (that included the hearings yesterday, some Iraqi flunkie on Newshour, Cheney on Leslie's show, and stephen Hadley on Charlie Rose). This morning, Bartlett went on the today show peddling this nonsense. He said that Rove was clearly calling out "liberal extremists" like MoveOn, and not those Democrats who supported Bushie's actions. This is a load of shit in several ways. First, while Rove did (falsely) use MoveOn as "evidence" of his claim that liberals sought "therapy and understanding" of the terrorists who attacked us on 9/11, he made no such distinction in the speech itself. it was pretty clear cut: Conservatives believe X, liberals believe Y. Not "these specific liberals," but liberals in general. But, as it turns out, not even those specific liberals (MoveOn) believe what Rove was attributing to them. So it's both a false generalization and a false claim about a specific.

But Bartlett's spin is much more insidious, and is aimed to couple the backtracking on Rove's statement (and the backtracking was obvious on the Today show..."no not Senator's Clinton, kerry and Reid...no never meant that!") with the current PR offensive on Iraq. The implication was that Bush's Iraq Debaq-le was part of the overall strategy, and anyone who agreed with that overall strategy was patriotic, while anyone who disagreed was a liberal terrorist-coddler. Same ole, same ole, I know, but Bartlett's got a brand new bag by tying Rove's serious public error to the Iraq PR onslaught.

[warrens]

16. What a pack of assholes

There wasn't ONE word about attacking the Taliban and Al Qaeda. I was VERY happy to see the Taliban go, and maybe if we had stayed there and finished the job, we'd be home now, not in two protracted wars that have no chance of success.

Assholes, assholes, assholes.

[Mari333]

17. Durbin should not have apologized and Rove should get on his knees

and apologize , but he won't. Anyone with half a brain knows full well that the Iraq war had nothing to do with 9/11 , and that the attack on Iraq has made the US less safe, and created a breeding ground for more anger towards us..for every Iraqi killed, 10 join against the US..Roves strategies make Bin Laden very happy. If there is a treasonous bastard in the US, its Karl Rove.

[bunkerbuster1]

32. Let's spin Durbin's statement.

Far as we're concerned, he never apologized to those ratfuckers, only to those Holocaust victims he may have offended.

Shouldn't we be saying this loud, clear, early and often now?

[UpInArms]

18. message to the f***-nuts at the WHouse:

you are stupid and out of touch -

Your illegal war and your idiotic fiscal policies have damaged this country beyond belief.

Your spin and actions have proven detrimental to everyone in the world.

You are hated - so STFU and learn to apologize for your bad behavior and actions and change your ways.

Perhaps you will avoid those prison cells at the Hague, but you will still be reviled and live the rest of your lifes with the shame that you have brought upon yourselves.

[ckramer]

19. In other words

I guess this is a frustrated reaction related to Dick Durbin's apology from democrats - many thought Dick Durbin's apology took them down. There should be someone on republicans' side doing apology this time, and Karl Rove jumped the gun.

[maxrandb]

20. MSM Carrying Water for Bush Again

I've heard repeatedly on the cables "snooze" channels that Rove was criticizing "liberals", not the Democratic Party. See it's perfectly OK if your just criticizing "liberals", they're all a bunch of "pantie-waste, French wine drinking, surrender monkeys". Liberals should be made to wear gold "L's" on their coats. Only thing is...saying he only criticized "liberals" is a BOLD FACE LIE!!

Look at what he actually said. I've bolded it so that the MSM can easily identify it.

Rove said "the Democratic Party made the mistake of calling for "moderation and restraint" after the terrorist attacks".

Yeah MSM!!! He definitely was only accusing a "small" percentage of Americans as "cowards and terrorist appeasers".

LIBERAL MEDIA MY ASS!!!!!

[w13rd0]

21. Touched a fuckin chord?

After 9-11, you LIED TO US to get us into a war with a nation that had NOTHING TO DO with the attacks, and led the actual perpetrators GO FREE! Dan Bartlett is a traitor to this nation, and should be treated as such.

[thinkingwoman]

22. WH confused....

beatings not improving morale? How can that be?

Increase the beatings!

</sarcasm>

[markus]

24. Call us fifth column, terrorist coddlers and you want to know why?

How the fuck do these people shave in the morning? Is it possible that, like vampires, they just don't appear in the mirror and have servants to shave them?

These are not even people. They are golem. They have no souls.

[bemildred]

26. White House "puzzled" by 5 dead marines and 10 wounded in Fallujah.

When did being clueless become a propaganda technique?
:banghead::banghead:

[dchill]

95. 2000 C.E.

[Mark E. Smith]

28. It's The Last Card They Have

You can only wonder why they're playing it now. It's not like they're going to win any points cashing in this obvious bullshit on a war as incredibly unpopular as this one.

Their polls must be telling them something awful.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[gratuitous]

30. Gee, a political operative in the White House bashes half the country

And the White House can't figure out why those people would object to having their patriotism questioned. Has anyone informed those asswipes that the White House is supposed to represent the totality of the American people, not just the ones they like?

[UpInArms]

33. from the WP

http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/achenblog/2005/06/stalinist_repub.html

I will give Rove the benefit of the doubt and assume his words had some kind of broader, less ridiculous context. Rove knows as well as anyone that liberals are not firing IEDs at our soldiers. He also is enough of a student of history to know that any attempt to muzzle your political opponents for national security reasons (the comfort-to-the-enemy argument) is the first step toward ... wait, let me think of a moderate term that won't get me in trouble like Durbin...okay, toward Stalinism.

My guess is that, as part of some double-secret triple-backloop political strategy, Rove realized he needed to cause a distraction. He informed the president that the poll numbers were looking bad, or that Social Security privatization is about as likely as the resurgence of alchemy. The president said, "Karl, go out there and say something really dumb." By now you should know that nothing happens in the White House political shop except for very calculated reasons. Rove is a red herring. Keep your eye on the big fish.

[Roland99]

38. "Rove is a red herring. Keep your eye on the big fish"

:thumbsup:

[confludemocrat]

45. Huh?

"I will give Rove the benefit of the doubt and assume his words had some kind of broader, less ridiculous context."

And what ultimately is the difference?

See post #40

[dchill]

97. If Rove is the red herring (I believe he is) -

then the fish is VERY big and about to stink real bad, real soon. I think the shit is deep and the stakes are very high. Karl-off has not made much of a habit of public speaking (catapulting the propaganda) or of giving TV interviews, but now has done both on the same day...

Perhaps it has to do with the fact that the US Govt has just admitted to the UN that torture is indeed happening at Gitmo, Afghanistan and Iraq. This should be THE story of the month.

[deacon2]

40. Rule 1 - NEVER APOLOGIZE

Rule 2 - NEVER APOLOGIZE
Rule 3 - NEVER APOLOGIZE
Rule 4 - NEVER APOLOGIZE
Rule 5 - NEVER APOLOGIZE
Rule 6 - NEVER APOLOGIZE
Rule 7 - NEVER APOLOGIZE
Rule 8 - NEVER APOLOGIZE
Rule 9 - NEVER APOLOGIZE...

Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

This is the GOP's response to Durbin's pathetic retraction of a completely correct statement - when taken in context, which these assholes never do. When we show weakness, they come in for the kill. EACH AND EVERY TIME.

Dean has it right. Everyone else is kidding themselves. This is a battle to the death - in every possible sense of the word. I hope we're paying attention as a party. Or we might as well start packing.

[fooj]

42. Offense! Offense! Offense!

Unified voice with a unified message!

peace.

[renaissanceguy]

44. See, they don't eat their own.

They won't back down on this, and Durbin shouldn't have backed down on his words.

http://www.cafepress.com/liberalissues.16781662

[bettyellen]

47. the Families of Sptember 11 were quite clear why an apology is in order...

there is no need to be puzzeled. another case of them playing dumb.


Families of September 11 tells Rove: Stop trying to 'reap' political gain from tragedy
RAW STORY

FOS11 Statement on Comments Made By Karl Rove

As families whose relatives were victims of the 9/11 terror attacks, we believe it is an outrage that any Democrat, any Republican, any conservative or any liberal, stakes a "high ground" position based upon the September 11th death and destruction. Doing so assumes that all those who died and their loved ones would agree. In truth, some would and some would not. By definition the conduct is divisive and, because it is intended to be self-serving and politicizes 9/11, it is offensive.
We are calling on Karl Rove to resist his temptations and stop trying to reap political gain in the tragic misfortune of others. His comments are not welcome.

http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Families_of_September_11_tells_Rove_Stop_trying_to_reap_political_gain_from_0623.html

[Media_Lies_Daily]

48. They've been "puzzled" about quite a few things.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

49. I Pledge Allegience to the Flag, of the Divided States of America

Sounds like this is the pledge that is now being taken in congress every morning,.

[Alizaryn]

50. Suuuurrrrreee they're confused.

THEY PLANNED IT!

[Catfight]

51. Let's do some math...Bush poll numbers 42%...Karl Rove's comment

next week will boost those numbers or maybe not...let's sit back and see.

[jsamuel]

54. Every time Bush is in trouble Rove comes out and says something

Ususally it helps Bush, but this time he took a stance that is insane. Note that his others were too, but the difference is that now with the DSM, torture, and the 15 other bad things that are comming out now, people are looking at this in the same light. Horrible lighting...

It will not help him this time.

That said, keep on the DSM, torture, and any other obvious problems like the whole Ohio 225 million loss before the election cover up. Keep fighting!

[ClayZ]

81. a bird called Killdeer...kkkarl acts the same....

George is his egg! He thinks we are the hawks...

Behavior

As the killdeer nest on the ground their eggs and chicks are easy targets for predators. The parent killdeer have developed special behaviors in order to help protect their young from humans, hawks, and other dangers. One of these behaviors is the "broken wing act, " in which the killdeer drag a wing along on the ground while sending cries out towards the invader. The killdeer often draws the attention away from the nest and then flies away.

Another interesting aspect about the Killdeer is the use of its kill-deer cry to draw predators away from the nest or fledglings. The Killdeer runs away from the nest flapping its wings or flying and crying at the same time.

[Fire Walk With Me]

58. They also puzzle over our reaction to torture, invasions, outsourcing,

the rich getting richer while corporations can take your house if they want to expand...

Why would they understand our upset? They're on the side that benefits.

[PATRICK]

59. Sounds more like absolute glee

than puzzlement. That clearly drips a smug gloating tone which means their strategy is working with impunity and the Dem response has been as they expected.

Gloating is not the act of a propaganda genius by the way, when most of the country IS falling out from under the sway. These are point wars in foggy bottom and the worthless media. The real people are seething with disgust and getting less disposed to heap equal scorn on a lousy opposition party strategy.

But then this is a constant sign that the people are ceasing to matter and the media is a dead dog barking to the master's tune.

My dad always used to express his highest disgust at the "cute" stuff, the scornful sneer whenever these liars were pulling a fast one. A real vomit factor this kind of sly lying.

[LiberalFighter]

64. I'm not sure why Bartlett is such a *u**i** idiot

[Triana]

66. WHY...

..do DEMOCRATS not stand behind their own with UNITY like this when the Repigs are inflamed over their (Democrats') remarks? And WHY do they not REFUSE to apologize - IN UNISON.

WHY?

[LynnTheDem]

67. As we know, the bush Admin aren't very good with puzzles.

Like the puzzle of why EVEN BRITAIN has a MORE FAVORABLE VIEW OF CHINA than they do of America.

Gee there's a puzzle.

[baldguy]

70. GOPukes aren't soft on terrorism.

They positively LOVE it!

[neuvocat]

74. WHAT DO YOU MEAN THEY'RE MAD?

ITS NOT LIKE WE INSULTED ANYONE!!!

Dumb shits.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

77. RW Rule No 1: Never admit you're wrong, because you never are.

RW Rule No.2: Blame "liberals".

i repeat what other DU'ers have said, the Democratic leadership would be smart to respond in like fashion - and that's why I like Dean.

[truthisfreedom]

78. it hasn't touched a chord, guys. it's created the illusion of a divided

nation... rove would like to paint the Dems as the half of the nation soft on terror.

what he's discovered is that we're the half of the nation that's hard on bushco, because bushco is a continuing, escalating source of terror, and we don't want any more 911s.

[geniph]

79. Republicans puzzled that Democrats actually defend themselves

against charges of unpatriotism. Gee. Who could imagine being called TRAITORS would, like, piss people off and stuff. Maybe we're just oversensitive.

:eyes:

How dare Democrats not take whatever abuse Republicans wish to dish out? That's what they're used to our doing.

Please sir, may I have another?

[DrZeeLit]

80. Let's review.... the Chicago Way...shall we?

Here's the "key" to this whole mess.... from "The Untouchables"

I'm thinkin'... they made Durbin apologize, so we make Rove resign (welllll, ya gotta dream)

Malone: You said you wanted to get Capone. Do you really wanna get him? You see what I'm saying is, what are you prepared to do?
Eliot Ness: Anything and everything in my power.
Malone: And THEN what are you prepared to do? If you open the can on these worms you must be prepared to go all the way because they're not gonna give up the fight until one of you is dead.
Eliot Ness: How do you do it then?
Malone: You wanna know how you do it? Here's how, they pull a knife, you pull a gun. He sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. That's the Chicago way, and that's how you get Capone! Now do you want to do that? Are you ready to do that?
Eliot Ness: I have sworn to capture this man with all legal powers at my disposal and I will do so.
Malone: Well the Lord hates a coward. Do you know what a blood oath is Mr. Ness?
Eliot Ness: Yes.
Malone: Good, cause you just took one.

[Must_B_Free]

82. Is this Bush's example for being "a uniter, not a divider"?

[bunny planet]

83. guess what. I'm 'puzzled' that these criminals are still in office.

Really frigging puzzled.

[Miss Chybil]

84. Makes you wish Durbin hadn't backed down, eh?

So, I wonder why so many people get upset when you called them Nazis? It must hit a cord with these people. They know who they are...

[Jade Fox]

96. It sure does....

He clearly empowered the Republicans by apologizing. Now their standing
back smirking, watching us fume.

Bad move, Durbin. Bad, dumb move.

[CAcyclist]

87. My Take On This

The way to respond to these guys is to protest without taking the bait or arguing the details.

I believe it it critical that we DO respond and NOT ignore it, or people will think we are weak.

However, it does no good to argue that we are not what they describe just as it does no good to go round and round with a troll.

Think of these people as trolls, because that is what they are.

Obviously, though we cannot ignore these trolls - they are not going to go away.

So what do we do? We do what Jon Stewart did. We tell them to "stop"

When they pull the innocent act, we say "You know exactly what we are talking about and we insist that they stop it." It doesn't matter if they do as we ask - the point is not to get them to stop, actually - the point is to get public opinion on our side - to show that we are the reasonable and sane ones and they are outside of acceptable behavior.

The general public is fair-minded - they will see that we are being adult and they are being childish. Then we win.

[struggle4progress]

88. Mr. "Go Start War to Get Re-elected" should be in Gitmo. eom

[aion]

91. I would kill every terrorist with the push of a button...if only...

I am vehemently opposed to this war in Iraq. However, my argument then is the same as it is now. If we could kill every terrorist on earth with the press of a magical button, I would push that button. But that is not the scenario we have before us. We push buttons, and the people who die MIGHT be terrorists. That's a different equation completely.

I don't want therapy for the terrorists. I want them dead! But that doesn't mean that I am willing to kill innocent people in order to accomplish that task.

[tibbir]

92. The White House is puzzled

by anything actually questioned by the media concerning it.

[dchill]

94. "The White House is puzzled" -

by reality.

[IowaGuy]

99. A "puzzled Whitehouse"....wow, the bar has got to be real high for that.

<ok - sarcasm off now>

[RPM]

100. those douches would be puzzled...

they don't fucking get it.

[mn723]

101. Stuck in high school

Sometimes I feel like the Bu$h administration is stuck in high school when it comes to maturity. In high school members of clicks stick up for each other no matter what.....this is what Bu$hco does, even when they are obviously wrong they stick up for each other and try to deflect attention from their obvious faults.

Mature adults accept their success and faults with a gracious and humble attitude....the adolescent-esque Bu$hies act like arrogant high school jocks who we all know don't amount to anything when they finally grow up.

[Corgigal]

102. He's not as puzzled as New Yorkers

were on Sept 11, when commercial airliners turned off transponders and flew out of controlled airspace with hundreds of passengers on board, and our defense system did Not A. Nothing, no Federal Govt that day. No information, fighters not launched. Oh no Bush Administration, we are the real puzzled ones. It's not like you guys would use this attack for personal reasons, no, of course not.

[steve2470]

103. They're puzzled ? Either they have brain damage or they're lying

Either reason is a good reason to say " I resign". Georgie boy, now you know what to say so we are NOT puzzled.


Geoooooooooooooooooooooorrrrrrrrrrrrge, I can't hearrrrrrrr you !!!!!!


:mad:

[mitchum]

104. Fuck you, Donnyboy!

a pig is a pig is a pig

[Fight_n_back]

105. They are winning this

That response is brilliant. "You don't have the stomach for war. All you do is demand apologies."

[Catrina]

106. I'm puzzled also

How many Democrats ran to a microphone to say that 'Durbin doesn't speak for me'? And how many Republicans have distanced themselves from Rove? It was Democrats who pushed Durbin to apologize!

Rove got a lot of flack for what he said. The attacks on Durbin lasted a week until he gave in. They should intensify on Rove until he can't take it anymore.

He said that the Repubs were ready for war after 9/11!! We can tie that in to the DSM. They were, we know that for sure because of the DSM. They were ready to use 9/11 minutes, hours after it happened.

Gen. Clark said he was asked to 'tie 9/11 to Iraq' a day after it happened'. He was vilified at the time for saying that.

But the DSM confirms he told the truth, they cynically used the tragedy and were not at all concerned about who was responsible.

That was the difference between the Dems and Repubs that day. Rove was right. Dems had no idea of the secret plans Bush had to go into Iraq. The Repubs WERE ready for war, long before 9/11.

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