BBC: Three UK bombers visited Pakistan

[allemand]

Three of the four London suicide bombers visited Pakistan last year, officials there have confirmed.

Mohammad Sidique Khan and Shehzad Tanweer arrived and left together, and spent three months in the country. (...)

The three men, all from the Leeds area of northern England, were tracked by a system called Pisces in which everyone who comes into Pakistan legally, via any port of entry, is photographed.

Mohammad Sidique Khan, 30, and Shehzad Tanweer, 22, flew into Karachi together on Turkish Airlines flight 1056 on 19 November, 2004 and both left on Turkish Airlines flight 1057 on 8 February this year





More:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/4693001.stm

[madeline_con]

1. "... everyone who comes into Pakistan..."

I'm not up on British passports. Don't they have to have an equivalent to our visa to travel to most places?

EDIT: I can't leave it at that!



a."War on Terror" means a need for tighter security, theoretically

b.Osama "may" be in Pakistan or along its border.

c.People traveling to and fom Pakistan (and a few other countries) should be scrutinized (especially those of a certain age and gender with Muslim names ), even at the risk of accusations of :wow: racial profiling.

d. They had family their before this started, why the shock about them going there?

e. who really did this? Could Bushco be trying to justify their methods?

[Frederik]

6. It's common for young British-Paksitanis to

visit Pakistan. Almost everyone does it. Nothing suspicious about having visited Pakistan, in and of itself.

[madeline_con]

20. Except there's a major "War on Tera" that Britain is in, too.

Shouldn't these things be scrutinized earlier than after the fact?

Or is their equvalent of Homeland Security the joke ours is?

[dArKeR]

2. I'd love to have police go through all the people on these tapes

I wonder how many groups of terrorists could be found.
Say a group of IRA. Say a group of white supremacists. Say a group of anti-capitalists. Say a group of child molesters. Say a group of wife beaters. Say a group of ex-military with explosives training...

[allemand]

5. I doubt that you will find another group of people among the 55 killed n/t

[dArKeR]

7. How do you know the bomber or bombers were killed?

[allemand]

9. It's what Scotland Yard is saying:

We can now confirm the identity of a third man who travelled from West Yorkshire and who died in the explosion at Edgware Road. He was Mohammed Sidique Khan, aged 30. We believe that he was responsible for carrying out that attack.

We can also now confirm the identity of a fourth man who arrived in London with the three men from West Yorkshire and then died in the explosion between King's Cross and Russell Square underground stations. He was Germaine Lindsay, aged 19. We believe that he was responsible for carrying out that attack.

We have previously named Hasib Hussain, aged 18, who died in the explosion on the bus in Tavistock Square, and Shahzad Tanweer, aged 22, who died in the explosion at Aldgate. We believe that they were responsible for carrying out these respective attacks.
http://cms.met.police.uk/news/major_operational_announcements/terrorist_attacks/police_investigation_continues_into_the_7_7_bombings

[Media_Lies_Daily]

10. Does that make it any more true than what the FBI tells us?

[dArKeR]

14. This is just about the same you could write about each of the people

who died. Who they are, what they did, which bomb killed them. I just don't see any 'normal' evidence which shows who the killer(s) are. The kind of evidence we'd see on Perry Mason or the FBI TV show. Sorry, I'm a brainwashed product of TV.

[allemand]

16. How about the explosives found in the car they used to travel to Luton?

Tanweer had rented the car.

Or how about forensic evidence like the typical decapitation of a suicide bomber (Hasib Hussain, Tavistock Square)?

[dArKeR]

21. I'm honestly not up on this specific story. But I don't know I've seen

a hundred stories over the last 5 years where stuff like this comes out and then months/years later it's published that (for example explosives) it turned out the chemical was from wife's make-up kit... or he had spilled the package of Mircle Grow plant fertilizer which was the source of chemicals...

[stickdog]

23. Who were those extra explosives for -- their ghosts or reincarnations?

Or how about forensic evidence like the typical decapitation of a suicide bomber (Hasib Hussain, Tavistock Square)?

How about it? Do you have a link for that?

Because here's what I read a few days ago:

http://www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050712/ZNYT03/507120398

On Saturday, Andy Hayman, who is in charge of Scotland Yard's antiterrorism unit, announced that the four bombs set off in London each contained less than 10 pounds, or 4.5 kilograms, of explosive material. Mr. Hayman said that investigators had determined by the shape of the twisted metal that the bombs had most likely been placed on the floor of the trains, near doorways. He said it was unclear whether the bomb on the bus was on the floor or on a seat.

[allemand]

31. Hussains decapitated body was the first to be identified:

The breakthrough began with forensic officers picking their way through the carnage of the number 30 bus at Tavistock Square on Thursday and Friday. Amid the bloodstained wreckage of the Stagecoach bus, they recovered one particularly disfigured body in which the force of the explosion had led to decapitation.

None of the other victims, it is understood, had met such an end. The injuries were noted: suicide bombers are often decapitated by the force of the explosives they strap to their bodies. Together with eye-witness claims of a young man rummaging around in his rucksack moments before the bomb had exploded, it seemed to indicate a pattern. But who was he?

The body met Hussain's description, which had been sent out from Hendon. Officers stepped up the line of inquiry. The task now would be to track his movements back, hoping that his distinctive blue jacket would reveal his presence.
http://news.scotsman.com/uk.cfm?id=1641602005

The extra explosives could be an indication that at least one or perhaps all of the bombers expected to return after carrying out their mission.

[Nihil]

26. That struck me as odd ...

> ... forensic evidence like the typical decapitation of a suicide
> bomber (Hasib Hussain, Tavistock Square)?

... for two reasons:
1) The "typical decapitation" phenomena is associated with suicide
belts - harnesses with the bombs/explosives attached directly to the
bomber's body. The head is "launched" at high velocity, somewhat like
a champagne cork.
2) The bomb was on the top deck of a *roofed* bus. The photos showed
that the roof was blown off - two very large pieces landing on cars
going the other way. If the head was decapitated by the above action,
how did it survive the crushing impact against the roof? If the head
was blown off by the explosion of the bomb, it would have been spread
like jam across the inside of the roof as the shockwave would not have
severed the roof supports in time to give it a free trajectory.

Yet another oddity for perusers of the media to puzzle over ...

[malaise]

3. Ridiculous

their relatives are from Pakistan. Does this mean anyone who has grandparents or relatives in a non-western country is a terrorist if they go for a visit.

[allemand]

4. We already know what they did, there is enough forensic evidence for that.

But the fact that they traveled to Pakistan is a strong indication that a Pakistani group or possibly even al-Oaeda was involved in the bombing.

[Frederik]

8. Not such a strong indication

It is very common for young British-Pakistanis to visit Pakistan, and to stay there for a few months or a year. In and of itself, it signifies nothing. The interesting part is to establish who they met when the were there, and if there is any overlap in their Pakistani acquaintances.

[allemand]

17. Acquaintances like Zeeshan Siddiqui:

WHEN Zeeshan Siddiqui ran away from his West London home in 1999 he left a scribbled note for his parents saying that he wanted to become “a holy warrior”. (...)

His arrest in April barely rated a mention at the time, even though Pakistani authorities were accusing of him being linked to some of al-Qaeda’s most notorious figures. (...)

Security sources in Islamabad have told The Times that earlier this year Siddiqui, a college dropout, met one of the British bombers — Shehzad Tanweer — who quit his university course in Leeds to go to Pakistan.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,22989-1698573,00.html

Pakistani security officials privately told The Times that Mohammad Sidique Khan, Shehzad Tanweer and Hasib Hussain — all from Leeds — met known al-Qaeda suspects during their trip. They spent most of their time in the company of figures from outlawed militant groups.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,22989-1699024,00.html

[Media_Lies_Daily]

11. "We already know what they did"? "We" who?....

I wonder how many people travel to Pakistan from the UK and vice versa?

[allemand]

13. There is forensic evidence about their involvement in the bombings.

Of course, if you doubt statements by Scotland Yard...

:shrug:

[stickdog]

24. First, the story is bullshit. Second, even if it weren't, it indicates

nothing.

If an Irish-American visits Ireland, does that make him or her a suspected terrorist?

[1932]

12. They're suspects for other reasons. This is just a fact they're adding to

the collective knowledge of what these guys have been doing recently.

[malaise]

15. Well I'll pay attention to other facts

because people visiting the birthplace of their families is more the norm than the exception.

[allemand]

18. London bomber visited Israel - Israeli official

Mon Jul 18, 2005 11:34 AM GMT
By Dan Williams

JERUSALEM (Reuters) - One of the suspected bombers in the London attacks visited Israel in 2003, an Israeli government official said on Monday, bolstering a news report the British-born Muslim helped plan a Tel Aviv suicide bombing.

The official said Mohammad Sidique Khan, who police believe blew himself up on an underground train in London on July 7, arrived in Israel on Feb. 19, 2003, and left the next day. The official declined to speculate on reasons for the visit.

Israeli daily Maariv said on Sunday that Khan was suspected of helping plan a pro-Palestinian suicide bombing by two fellow Britons of Pakistani descent on April 30, 2003. Three Israelis were killed in the attack on Mike's Place bar in Tel Aviv.

But Israeli security sources played down the report, which cited no proof. "This is not a concrete finding," a source said on Sunday.

More:
http://ca.today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2005-07-18T153357Z_01_N18256141_RTRIDST_0_NEWS-SECURITY-BRITAIN-ISRAEL-COL.XML

[stickdog]

25. The MOSSAD keeps pushing this link, huh? From 7/11:

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3111121,00.html

‘London, Tel Aviv blasts connected’

German newspaper: Explosive material used by British terrorist who blew himself up on Tel Aviv beachfront in 2003 very likely the same as that used by terrorists who staged London attacks last week, Mossad tells Brits

By Roee Nahmias and Ronen Bodoni

TEL AVIV – The terror attack in London last week may be tied to a suicide bombing on Tel Aviv's beachfront in April 2003, German newspaper Bild am Sonntag reported Monday.

According to the paper, Mossad officials informed British security authorities that the explosive material used in the Tel Aviv attack on Mike’s Place pub was apparently also utilized to stage the series of bombings in London on Thursday.

Moreover, the Mossad office in London received advance notice about the attacks, but only six minutes before the first blast, the paper reports. As a result, it was impossible to take any action to prevent the blasts. "They reached us too late for us to do something about it," a Mossad source is quoted as saying.

According to the German report, the Mossad relayed an analysis of the explosives used in the Mike's Place attack to British security officials. Mossad sources are quoted as saying there is "high likelihood" the explosives used in Tel Aviv were the same ones used in London.

[StrafingMoose]

28. Right...

They knew he visited Israel 2 years before to help set up a bombing, and let him go back in the UK?

Oh, they probably found out about this AFTER the UK bombings...

[allemand]

19. Bombers ‘met chief plotter’ in Karachi

STARING confidently ahead as he arrives in Pakistan for what is believed to be a rendezvous with the mastermind who plotted the London attacks, one of the bombers, Mohammad Sidique Khan, hands his British passport to immigration officials.

Behind him in the queue of arrivals at Karachi airport is Shehzad Tanweer, 22, who told his family he was heading for a religious school. (...)

Pakistani authorities have told The Times they know the identity of the British-born mastermind whom the British authorities are desperately trying to track down. “We believe this is where they could have met their mentor,” one Pakistani security source said. “They did not appear to go to where they told their families they were heading, and they have no obvious connection to Karachi, which was the centre of previous al-Qaeda operations.”

More:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,22989-1699410,00.html

[stickdog]

22. Alert: This story is FULL OF SHIT!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/west_yorkshire/4693243.stm

Education Leeds, the body which runs the city's schools, said Khan was employed at the primary school in Hunslet between March 2001 and December 2004.


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=15729250&method=full&siteid=94762&headline=the-suicide-murderers-name_page.html

ANOTHER raid was carried out at Lees Holm, Dewsbury, where Mrs Patel's (Khan's Indian mother-in-law) married daughter Hasina (Khan's Indian wife), 27, is believed to have lived with her husband.

It is thought Hasina reported her husband missing to police last week.

A neighbour said: "No one really knows him round here. They moved in at Christmas but he's never been seen at the mosque. He's a mystery."


http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/world/12138795.htm

Mohammed Sidique Khan, 30, born in Pakistan and another of the suicide bombers, is known in his neighborhood as an exemplary community worker. A father of an 8-month-old baby girl, Khan was a popular former teacher of children with learning disabilities.

[Tom Bombadil]

27. Wrong again Stickdog

Education Leeds, the body which runs the city's schools, said Khan was employed at the primary school in Hunslet between March 2001 and December 2004.

The original report said they were in Pakistan from 19th November 2004 to 8 Feb 2005. It is entirely possible that the school terminated his employment Dec 2004, 12 days after he left, when it dawned on them that he wasn't coming back.

A neighbour said: "No one really knows him round here. They moved in at Christmas but he's never been seen at the mosque. He's a mystery."

An anonymous source. Can we rely on this, considering you've disregarded so many other anonymous sources in previous posts. Plus, the Mirror is a bollocks tabloid and can't be trusted. The report even got Tanweer's age wrong, said he was 24 not 22.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[allemand]

30. Khan and his estranged wife had already separated:

According to reports, Sadique had separated from Hasina late last year when she became pregnant with their second child as they had many disagreements about his “approach to life”. A critical factor in the separation of Khan and his wife was his growing religious fervour.
http://www.telegraphindia.com/1050717/asp/foreign/story_5000174.asp

Khan visited his estranged wife and 14-month-old daughter Maryam just a couple of times a month.
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/this_britain/article299460.ece
(article already in the archive, but you can google that phrase)

The Independent is a much better source than The Mirror...