Sex Offenders Rally For Rights

[WindyInPA]

Fri Sep 16, 7:04 AM ET


Sex offenders are rallying against growing restrictions on where they can live and work in Central Florida.

It is unprecedented in Brevard County for sex offenders to gather publicly and loudly to demand better treatment, but they hit the streets of Palm Bay Thursday because it is one city considering some of the tightest new restrictions of all, WESH 2 News reported.

<snip>
Berger is the driving force behind a proposed law that has registered sex offenders and their families so angry. Berger believes employers should supervise employees who are sex offenders and should inform their customers.

"If you're going to go under someone's home and there are children present, because of the propensity to be enamored with children, that a person has the right to know who's going into their home," Berger said.

Some cities are passing laws that would make it illegal for sex offenders to live there. Now Palm Bay might make it virtually impossible for sex offenders to work in the city.



http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/wesh/20050916/lo_wesh/2939355



:wtf:They have far too many rights now!

[bluestateguy]

1. Not all sex offenders are equal

A certified child molester is someone I have no sympahty for at all. None.

BUT, sometimes these laws sweep up people who probably don't deserve it, like a 19 kid who has sex with his 17 year old girlfriend. The girl's father gets mad, calls the cops, boy goes to jail, and then he has to register as a "sex offender". That's just silly.

[OneBlueSky]

4. these kinds of laws are also generally harsher on gays . . .

because of rampant homophobia, a 19-year-old guy who has a relationship with his 17-year-old boyfriend is generally viewed much more negatively than if it were a guy and his girlfriend . . .

also, a 19-year-old woman having sex with a 17-year-old boy wouldn't be anything to get too excited about to many people . . .

[berni_mccoy]

9. Don't forget internet porn

In some states, you can be considered a sex offender if you download porn to your computer, you are caught, and you can not prove the age of the people in the videos.

[livefrom]

17. Where is that?

I had not heard of that law, I knew the web site operators have to be able to prove the age.

[DrDan]

23. you got that right

to group child molestors with those who happen to relieve themselves outside is criminal in itself

[Mairead]

33. Yes, 'status' offenders should never be on such lists

It seems to me that the way these lists are being mis-used has little to do with protection, but lots to do with scapegoating. It's a very primitive, pre-rational, rightwing thing to do. And unless people sober up, I bet it won't be long til merely making it impossible for the offender to work or live won't be enough--they'll have to start in on the family, too.

The new witch burnings. :(

[Yupster]

38. Anyone remember the story a few months ago

where a girl ran out in front of a car and almost got hit, the driver jumped out of the car and grabbed the girl and started to yell at her to never jump in front of cars again or she'd get herself killed.

That guy's punishment included permanently registering as a sex offender even though all agreed including the prosecutor that the guy's crime (asault?) had nothing at all to do with sex.

[sui generis]

2. not to blindly defend anyone

especially someone who IS a danger to the community - the term "sex offender" covers a very wide range of offenses.

You could be branded a sex offender in some states if you got caught skinny dipping at the lake, and not on the fun side of the lake.

I personally don't think that having a legal double standard for sex offenders solves anything. There needs to be a very narrow specific definition of what constitutes a sex offender (I think most people mean "sex predator"). If it constitutes a special class of crime then it needs to be treated uniformly in every state.

"They have far too many rights now" is not a progressive thing to say in my book for all the obvious reasons.

[kweerwolf]

3. So true ... unfortunately

I've heard of cases in jurisdictions that don't have laws covering public urination where a young man is charged with indecent exposure for peeing behind a tree late at night when he can't find an open restroom. Then he gets saddled forever with a "sex offender" title.

Anyone seen the movie "The Woodsman" with Kevin Bacon? That film really drives home what convicted sex offenders go through. Not that I defend their actions, but I certainly can't condone some of the outright bigotry they face either.

[Gyre]

21. "You could be branded a sex offender in some states if you got caught ..."

I don't think so. Indulging in a bit 'o hyperbole? If not, I'd like to see your sources.

Gyre

[Xithras]

30. Not hyperbole

Here in California, people have been charged with indecent exposure for crimes as minor as peeing on a tree in a forest. Indecent Exposure is legally considered a sex crime, and a conviction can lead to the requirement that you register as a sex offender.

And I personally know a guy who picked up a woman in a club (21 and older only), took her home, and slept with her. The girl turned out to be 16 and got into the club with a fake ID, but that didn't stop the DA from charging him with a sex offense. The judge took pity on him and he only ended up with time served and a few years probation, but he's a registered sex offender for life.

Simply because he assumed that the woman he slept with was telling the truth (he couldn't even have checked her ID...it was fake, remember?)

[mongo]

34. Here's some sources:

Maine
Plaistow Deputy Chief Kathleen Jones said there is an average of five or six registered sex offenders in Plaistow at any time. She said the only problem the department has had with sex offenders in the 20 years she has been on the force is failure to register, which some sex offenders may not realize they have to do annually because laws change from state to state.

Jones also said that not every person on the sex offender list has necessarily committed an egregious crime such as rape or molestation because a conviction of indecent exposure, even in cases such as public urination, can land someone on the list.

http://www.seacoastonline.com/news/rock/04012005/news/73224.htm

Michigan:
Michigan law states a person cited for disorderly conduct while urinating in public is defined as one who is engaged in indecent or obscene conduct in a public place.

Newton said someone with three disorderly conduct offenses is likely to be placed on the state's sex offender list.

http://www.statenews.com/article.phtml?pk=28103

California:
Many states passed laws after that deadly incident. The California law, which was passed in 1996, allows the public access to names and information on all high-risk and serious sex offenders registered in the state. The types of offenders who must register with the state can also include those convicted of lesser crimes, such indecent exposure or urinating in public, though information on their whereabouts is not publicly disclosed.

http://www.napanews.com/templates/index.cfm?template=story_full&id=7F1E43D3-6C7F-4415-87E2-5FCEADC230B9

Much easier to call something hyperbole than to do a 5 minute google search, isn't it?

[Gyre]

37. Still hyperbole!

It's a scenario which if you think about it is probably fair (though pretty improbable). What are the chances that somebody who isn't a "weenie-wagger" is going to get actually arrested and convicted 3 times for indecent exposure?

Sex offender registration for a person who always has his dong hanging out where strangers can see it isn't a bad thing from my perspective. I wouldn't want him living on the way to my kid's elementary school. Would you?

Gyre

[mongo]

41. It's 3 times in Michigan

But not in other states. How many other ways can you get labeled?

How about having sex in a car in a place you thought was deserted enough?

How about being picked up for prostitution? A woman alone with a condom in her purse is enough to be charged in some states.

People with financial means never get put on the list unless they commit a heinous crime - even most child molesters will get pled out to a lessor offense if they have resources to hire their own lawyer.

But poor people get put on these lists all the time. We get postcards anytime someone moves into the area. One a few months ago listed the offense as "sodomy".

Also, once you are on the list, you can't get off of it. If you move to a state you will be put on the list, even if the offense you were convicted of is not a listable offense in that state.

We are setting very bad precedent here. They made lists in nazi germany too.

[TankLV]

42. For public urination? Really?

I could give a fuck about that - I've done it myself.

And I hardly was "waving my dong around".

Glad you aren't in charge.

[stlsaxman]

35. In MO anything besides the missionary position between husband and wife

is considered sodomy and is a federal offense.

The only thing keeping many married couples in Missouri from being put behind bars and tattooed permanently as deviants is the right to privacy. Gov. Matt Blunt wants to rid of us that constitutional right as well.

Hyperbole? No.


edited for spelling.

[MadHound]

5. A few objections to your post

First off, not all sex offenders, depending on the state you're in, are rapists and pedophiles. Some get on the list simply for the act of being drunk and pissing in public. Or being a seventeen year old having consensual sex with your sixteen year old girlfriend. These people get put on the list of sex offenders, and are demonized for the rest of their lives. This is inherently wrong, and measures should be adopted to correct it.

Second, even if all of the people on the sexual offenders list deserve to be put on it, continuing to restrict these people on where they can live, work, travel, etc. is going to lead to nothing but disaster. The old saying of "when you have nothing, you have nothing left to lose" applies here. When a sexual offender is driven to extreme circumstances, through his forced inability to work, have a home somewhere, provide a decent living for himself, somewhere along the line this person is going to snap from the pressure, and commit even more atrocious crimes.

Third, this whole notion of continuing to punish the criminal, even though they've paid their debt to society, is a huge slippery slope that we shouldn't even be approaching, much less going down as we are now. Today it is the demonization of sexual offenders, and since this is a class of criminal that even hardened criminals loathe, society approves, and cheers on every draconian measure that is brought into play. However what people fail to see is that this is setting massive legal precedence, and while today it could be sexual offenders that are getting this treatment, tommorrow it could, and probably very well will be, other criminals who've paid their debt that are getting this treatment. Thieves, murderers, drug dealers, DWIs, etc. etc. This is what we're giving our tacit approval to, and are now setting into the granite of legal precedence.

Fourth, this sort of demonization whips up the lynch mob mentality in this country, and that is never a good thing. It leads to innocent people dying and vigilante justice, something that we as a civilized society are supposed to be above.

So before we continue with this madness, before we set anymore legal precedence I think we should step back and think on this rationally, cooly and calmly. Otherwise some of us could very well wake up ten years from now and find that we've been cast out of our community simply for having served a stint in jail for oh, say, possessing dope or some other innocous crime.

[the other one]

18. Eloquently spoken. nt

[BiggJawn]

25. Save your breath...

I used to try and point out to the "DU Anti-Paedophile league" the very points you and others raised in their posts.

Wanna know what the reaction was?

Somebody told me to take my "personal issues" and blow them out my ass.

Funny....Some of the responses to my posts I could actually feel the spittle flying off the screen, and they tell *ME* I have "issues"?

[MadHound]

27. Oh I hear you, I've engaged in these exercises in futility before

But you never know, somebody reading it might just take it to heart and take the time to think the matter through instead of doing the typical knee-jerk reaction. One can only hope.

[TankLV]

43. Well said - couldn't agree more.

[meow2u3]

6. Translation: Pedophiles and others lobbying for absolute license

Transation into English: Rapists, wife beaters, and pedophiles to abuse women and/or kids without any fear of punishment, except maybe punishing the victims for exposing them as the predators they are. republican family values :grr:

[Spangle]

12. Doesn't cover most of those you listed! But covers alot whome you didn't!

Wife beaters and child abusers are not sexual offenders. So this list doesn't cover them.

However, it does cover people WHO SHOULD NOT be on that list.

[TroubleMan]

22. Bullshit

Once they're found guilty they should be punished harshly (the rapists, chesters, predators, ect). Put them in jail for a long time.

After they're out and they've served the appropriate amount of jail time society has deemed their punishment, that's it. They should be allowed to become regular people again. If you don't like it, lock them up for longer.

You INCREASE THE CHANCE OF RECIDIVISM when you don't let them rebuild their lives. In other words, your discrimination against them is more likely to make them be a repeat offender, which is the opposite effect you wanted.

[OneBlueSky]

7. whatever happened to the notion that once you've served . . .

your sentence, you should be given a fresh start? . . . setting aside for a moment the fact that "sex offender" covers a whole lot of territory, I don't understand the logic of singling out this particular crime for lifetime punishment . . . why not murderers? . . . or those convicted of domestic violence? . . .

[Spangle]

14. Because of the research done on Child Molesters

The research shows they will repeat. Hence the need to track them. The list wasn't suppose to be used so that people could HARRASS them. Which is what is going on now. And they do have a POINT.

However, persons sentenced for statatory rape, peeing behind a tree, etc.. Oh PLEASE! Maybe the person peeing behind a tree.. but the rest? They payed for their crime and shouldn't be on this list.

[noonwitch]

19. You're right about the harrassment issue regarding the registries

The registry is for both law enforcement use and for the public. It's so that you know where not to let your children hang out, trick or treat, or whatever. It's not so you can go to the guy's house and picket loudly with 50 other neighbors, when you could be out there watching your kid so that he doesn't end up abused by someone who is not on the list.

[BiggJawn]

29. Oh, if they only "picketed"...

See that story last month about the vigilante who used "The List" to locate, stalk and gun down 2 offenders in his area?

(8-30-05)
Killings of 2 Bellingham sex offenders may have been by vigilante, police say

By Jonathan Martin and Maureen O'Hagan
Seattle Times staff reporters

BELLINGHAM — Last Friday night, a man claiming to be an FBI agent dropped in on three Level 3 sex offenders living together, supposedly to warn them of an Internet "hit list" targeting sex offenders.

The man was not an FBI agent, but he may have been enforcing a hit list of his own creation.

Two of the roommates were found dead early Saturday of gunshot wounds, and Bellingham police are investigating a crime that authorities say may be one of the nation's most serious cases of vigilantism aimed at sex offenders.

[truthisfreedom]

8. the plight of the sex offenders? gee... i can't figure how it can be spun

in their favor. doesn't seem too intelligent to group together in public either. there is no solution to this.

[mongo]

10. The solution is to narrow these laws

so that only violent sexual predators are caught up in these lists.

[ninkasi]

15. That'll never happen

because it makes too much sense. In addition, I can't say that I completely trust our justice system. How many are in prison now who were wrongly convicted?

[Endangered Specie]

11. Riiiiiight...

:nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity:

[underpants]

13. Oooh oooh where can I sign up to march for them?

Let me know so I can make sure I avoid going there.

I know it covers a lot of offenses but you know what, tough luck.

[Endangered Specie]

16. Way I see it, they should still be in prison

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

26. Exactly!

:nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity::nopity:

[Megahurtz]

31. Rofl!

:rofl:

[TroubleMan]

20. Once you're out of jail, you should be considered a normal citizen.

There shouldn't be any "sex offenders" list or anything like that. You don't give people a chance to change their lives. You sentence them to amount of jail time you think they should be in, and once they're out, they should be able to rebuild their lives.

The problem is that the chesters, the ones everybody is worried about, are gettting too light of a jail sentence. The real child molesters should receive heavy sentences. If you molest a child or rape somebody, you should do some heavy jail time. However, most of them are not getting long sentences (20 years or more). Also, the chesters get out on parole a lot earlier, because they're not usually the types to make trouble in prison. That should stop, too.

If the person gets out and commits another crime, you make it so they'll never get out.

All this "registered sex offender" stuff is bullshit. Just lock them away for a long time (the chesters and rapists).

[fishnfla]

24. One of the harsh laws keeps them out of hurricane shelters

Some people here on DU were all bent out of shape about that one.Sex crimes in shelters? "Never would happen", said they.

I wonder what those folks would say after what happened in NOLA?

Look, the worst sex offenders are predators and opportunists, they will seize any opportunity to get away with their shit. They need to be watched evry step of the way

[applegrove]

28. **** ***!

[NorthernSpy]

32. very unexpected...

I've never heard of convicted sex offenders staging a rally before.

:think:

[ck4829]

36. My girlfriend is 17, I'm 20...

We can't do 'anything' because we're Islamic.

But, I wonder what would happen if another couple did do something and they were the same age.

I've heard that it is true that a person would have to register as an offender.

This seems wrong.

I'm not defending the people who committed criminal activities.

But, if they are going to purge the community of Sex Offenders, they better check which ones actually committed a crime first.

[Princess Turandot]

39. In NYS, most 'age of consent' convictions do not go on the registry..

I believe that the offender has to be over 21, or there needs to be at least a 5 year difference between the parties. Age of consent is 17.A 21 year old convicted of rape, statuatory or otherwise of a 16 year old, would go on the registry.

I don't know about other states.

[BadGimp]

40. Sex Offenders are people too!

shields up...