Lawmaker aims to stamp out abortion

[Freedom_from_Chains]

Looks like the theocrates are making their move in Indiana


By Bill Ruthhart and Mary Beth Schneider
[e-mail]
Abortion would be outlawed in Indiana unless necessary to preserve the life and health of the mother under a bill filed today by Rep. Troy Woodruff, R-Vincennes.


The measure, House Bill 1096, would define life as beginning at conception, and make it a

Class C felony, punishable by up to eight years in prison, to perform an abortion. There would be no exceptions for victims of rape or incest.
Woodruff said he thinks the bill would pass the legislature overwhelmingly if put to a vote. If the abortion ban becomes law, he said it could end up before the U.S. Supreme Court as a possible venue to overturn the landmark 1973 Roe versus Wade case, which legalized abortion.

Also today, the House Roads and Transportation Committee approved a bill that would create an "In God We Trust" license plate. The bill is sponsored by Rep. Woody Burton, R-Greenwood, who said he has at least 1,000 petitions requesting the new license plate.

Last year, the bill was approved in the House, but failed to receive a hearing in the Senate. Burton said he was more encouraged this year because Senate President Pro Tempore Robert D. Garton told him the bill would get a hearing this time around.

The roads and transportation committee passed the measure by a 7-1 vote.

The House Judiciary Committee also met this morning and established a subcommittee to explore the details of a bill that would prevent notes of sympathy or apology from being used in a lawsuit, including medical malpractice. That bill is sponsored by Ralph Foley, R-Martinsville.

[villager]

1. "What's the matter with Indiana?"

And to which neighboring state will rich little Hoosier girls go for *their* abortions?

[Freedom_from_Chains]

4. They have a serve case of Republicanism

which is looking to become fatal.

[villager]

17. it usually is

n/t

[northzax]

7. michigan and illinois, I'd think

Why is this guy wasting taxpayer money on this? We all know that the courts will strike it down, again. Don't you think the Indiana Attorney General has more important things to do that fight a losing battle like this in the courts?

[Freedom_from_Chains]

13. I wouldn't place my bets so fast

It looks to me like they are planning on Alito to restore America to her true Christian principles.

[villager]

18. so... women's underground railroad to Canada...?

n/t

[Megahurtz]

40. Maybe. n/t

[northzax]

21. good luck with that

it ain't going to happen. Even with Alito, they simply don't have the votes to over turn this level of precedent. ten bucks says that the Supreme Court would refuse to hear this case. Why would they? it's already been decided multiple times, there is nothing new in this law to justify overturning Roe.

[Justitia]

24. I really, really wish I had your confidence. -eom

[Freedom_from_Chains]

26. And normally I would agree with you on that

But America is a country which is currently undergoing a major upheaval politically, socially, and theisticly, so history does not have the same value that it normally would have.

[Hobarticus]

43. Agree. This is radioactive, and the GOP knows better

Look, in spite of all the God-fearin' folk writing their congressmen, our elected officials know that the nation favors a woman's right to choose, whether they agree with the procedure or not. Period.

The GOP has had YEARS to do something about abortion. They'll invent issues and nibble around the edges, but they'll never be able to take it head-on and restrict abortion by law. Reagan made promises, Bush 1 made promises, they run Congress now....nothing, nada, zilch. Why? Because they KNOW their asses would be out the door. They can rant n' rave about the sanctity of life and regurgitate the propaganda, but any politician with an IQ above room temperature knows that it's career suicide to take this on, unless they're a fire-breathing kookaburra or don't plan to be in office much longer (see above).

[Gronk Groks]

68. It's career suicide, unless they're a fire-breathing kookaburra...

...don't you mean cuckoo-bananas???
He doesn't plan to be in office much longer and I don't think he has an IQ above room temperature.

[Maine-ah]

91. I'd have to agree with you.

It would be political suicide.

[HockeyMom]

45. Spent my summers at uncle's house in Indiana

during the 50s. My Dad and Uncle would CONSTANTLY go across the border to buy beer and booze in Illinois. You don't think the same would happen with abortions?

They will ONLY stop (unfortunately) the "dirt poor" women. It will be no big deal for a middle class woman, of which there are many MORE in the 21st century, to cross the state border. I can also remember the flack it caused between NY and NJ back in the early 70s when it was legal here but not in NJ.

These people are simply CLUELESS. To those who DON'T know this, I can remember a MAJOR argument at the time of the signing of Roe was BECAUSE of women traveling across state borders for abortions.

Look it up.

[IndyOp]

52. That people in Indiana can travel to another state is not the point -

"Their plan" is to make abortion harder and harder to access. First Indiana, then Ohio, Kentucky, Tennessee and so forth. We should not allow them to ban abortion in any state - period.

Also, those dirt poor women are the ones who most need access. I am writing my lectures for Developmental Psychology right now and am working on "Attachment Disorder." Unwanted pregnancy is one 'risk' factor for attachment disorder, which is associated with depression, post-traumatic stress disorder and even, sociopathy (think Jeffrey Dahmer, Adolph Hitler, Saddam Hussein).

I think their big next step is to keep Medicare and Health Insurance from covering the procedure so that only the wealthy can afford treatment.

The only way to stop them is to stop them. Not slow them. Stop them.

[Bridget Burke]

82. "Waiting periods" add to the problem.

More states are enacting laws that require a woman to see the abortion provider & be given "educational" materials on the procedure. Twenty-four hours later, she can get the abortion. Not only the dirt poor would have a problem with taking two days off from work & family responsibilities, driving to another state & paying for a motel. Then driving back immediately thereafter.

Complications are rare but they do occur; wouldn't a woman be better off at home, able to get medical care immediately if needed? Would emergency rooms in an "abortion-free" state be able to treat post-abortion problems--or would they be expected to call the cops?

[AuntiBush]

56. Exactly!

They could have used that money to say... Oh, I don't know. Maybe save some homeless, parent-less babies, maybe?

Un-real!

[saigon68]

28. Indiana has always been a progressive state

Look at their minority program for swift justice



Marion Indiana, 1930

On the night of August 7, 1930, three young African Americans -- Thomas Shipp age nineteen, Abram Smith eighteen, and sixteen-year-old James Cameron -- faced the hideous wrath of a lynch mob in the Ku Klux Klan-dominated town of Marion, Indiana. Only Cameron survived. The black youths had been involved in the robbery-inspired murder of Claude Deeter, 23, a white factory worker from nearby Fairmount, Indiana, and were accused of sexually assaulting Deeter's white girlfriend, nineteen-year-old Marion resident Mary Ball. While the latter charge was never proven, such charges, however spurious, were easily assumed by racist whites and frequently served to incite lynch mobs to commit even greater atrocities. Both Shipp and Smith were snatched from a jail cell only a block and a half from the giant oak tree where their bodies were soon to hang lifeless, beaten and hanged to death by the furious mob -- their grisly fate documented in a graphic if also infamous photograph. Cameron was badly beaten and nearly suffered an identical demise, but was saved at the last moment by the intervention of a "voice" from the crowd. "That boy didn't have anything to do with any killing or raping!" shouted the voice. Cameron's mysterious benefactor was never identified.

[SKKY]

76. The slogan from their license plates several years ago read...

..."Wander Indiana". It would appear some of them wandered too far.

[Tesha]

84. They'll (eventually) go to...

> And to which neighboring state will rich little Hoosier girls go for *their* abortions?

They'll (eventually) go to Ontario.

Honestly, I'm at the point where I think the Republicans should either
shit or get off the pot. They claim to be opposed to abortion, yet
because it's a positively wonderful campaign issue for them, they
never want to actually stop it.

In the not-very-long-run, it'd be far better for all of us if they
actually *DID* stop abortion in a few places. This might finally
convince the great somnambulent public that Republicans really
really are not good for them, that they don't care *ONE DAMN WHIT*
for women's rights, and that any normal working stiff who votes
Republican is a fool.

Tesha

[Justitia]

2. So you can rape a woman & force her to have your baby in Indiana?

Well, isn't that just lovely.

So happy to know that women who are raped or molested by their family mbrs are treated so kindly in the Hoosier State.

[Hekate]

75. Apparently so; reduced to less than the status of brood mares

...because brood mares are at least valuable enough to be "saved" for prize studs and not any passing animal.

Hekate

[patdem]

3. WTF does a licence plate with 'In God We Trust" have to do with

woman's choice? Are they putting it to a vote OF THE PEOPLE..or just a bunch of white men who want to control reproductive rights of women?

[Freedom_from_Chains]

5. Well, seeing how Indiana was the first state called for Bush

in the 04 election, it looks like we are going to be the first state to start giving up our rights wholesale for the glory of Jaysus.

[sarcasmo]

36. Time to get the F out of Indiana and come up north to blue Michigan.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

41. Actually, my wife and I are thinking

that it may be time to get the F out of the country.

[IndyOp]

50. I know somone at work - she is clerical, her husband is in

construction, one son works at Walmart - and she does not believe that Indiana voted for Bush in '04. Her family is good country folk. She emphasizes that Indiana is a Union state and that everyone she knows, and her husband knows voted for Kerry. I don't have a 'feeling' for how Indiana voted, but I thought her take on it was interesting.

[AwakeAtLast]

65. Indiana didn't even vote for Clinton, let alone Kerry!

I couldn't tell you the last time this state voted for a Democratic President.
It's too late to look it up now, but I'm fairly certain this state has consistently
voted for Republicans.

We have had many more Democratic Governors, maybe she is confusing the two.

[Zhade]

79. Choice, and the right to marry, isn't up for a vote of the people, either.

Rights are not kept or rescinded based on popular vote. They are inherent.

[wtbymark]

6. I'll bet a million $....

they did this to get it into the SCOTUS - bet ya , bet ya, bet ya
They would love to tear this country apart

[Freedom_from_Chains]

9. It has to start somewhere, but yes, I'm sure that's the plan.

In the interim, we can still be jailing and convicting those godless doctors who dare to defy us.

[Scooter24]

12. You would win your bet...

Woodruff said he thinks the bill would pass the legislature overwhelmingly if put to a vote. If the abortion ban becomes law, he said it could end up before the U.S. Supreme Court as a possible venue to overturn the landmark 1973 Roe versus Wade case, which legalized abortion.

[EC]

38. And to make sure at election time we'll hear more about

this than Abernoff...

[Scooter24]

8. They are purposely passing an unconstitutional law

for the sole purpose of trying to get a changed Supreme Court to put their stamp on it?

Watch it get struck down at the federal district court and rejected by the circuit court and supreme court. And I hope that judge has some harsh words in his opinion for the Indiana legislature.

This is an utterly irresponsible use of the legislature.

[northzax]

11. yeeh, the first line of the judgement should read:

"look, idiots, were you not listening the last 200 times we struck this exact same law down? Stop wasting our time."

[IndyOp]

53. With Alito on SCOTUS? I don't think it will. (nt)

[adigal]

61. So - we protest his office and his home

and everywhere else the man may ever go. If Supreme Court justices think they can take away our rights and then go home to their nice, peaceful existence while poor or raped women are being forced to have babies or are having dangerous illegal abortions, well, we just have to change the rules, won't we?? If they want to be political, then they better be prepared to deal with the protests.

[IndyOp]

63. I am on your side, just commenting that we ought to find Alito now -

so we don't have to protest him later.

:hi:

[Justitia]

10. Here's the republican who kicks raped women in the teeth

http://www.state.in.us/R64/

and of course I mean to include ALL women, not just the raped and molested, but he thinks ALL women should be forced to give birth as a punishment for simply being women (and female victims).

He has only sons, no daughters, so what the fuck does he care about anyone else's daughters?
I feel sorry for his wife. How does she deal w/knowing what he thinks of women?

I knew Indiana was really RW, but I had no idea it was this sadistic.

[Lars39]

23. Men like this

need their precious "manhood" slammed repeatedly in a heavy door.
I'm so tired of these damned fundies.:grr:

[DELUSIONAL]

32. I vote for that solution!!

[FrankLee]

34. Watch this, then agitate - Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness

http://www.sundancechannel.com/film/?ixFilmID=6439&rname=The%20Sundance%20Channel%20Schedule

LIFE, LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS
directed by Tiffany Shlain
2002 - 13 mins - Color

Brief Nudity, Adult Content

Frogs and fundamentalists play important roles in Tiffany Shlain’s wry primer about personal liberty in contemporary America.

CURRENT SCREENINGS on the Sundance Channel

Friday 01.06.06 at 07:15 PM
Sunday 01.08.06 at 01:35 PM
Sunday 01.08.06 at 02:45 PM
Sunday 01.08.06 at 06:45 PM
Wednesday 01.18.06 at 11:15 PM

Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness, a genre-busting short film that playfully deals with the serious issue of a woman's right to choose, was screened at the SUNDANCE Film Festival in January 2003, the 30-year Anniversary of Roe Vs. Wade. The Film was directed by Tiffany Shlain, founder of the Webby Awards. Honored by Newsweek as one of the "Women Shaping the 21st Century," 35 year old Shlain spearheaded the project in an effort to raise awareness among young people about the threats facing a woman's right to choose.

"This film is both satirical and serious," said Ms. Shlain. "We use laughter to open people up to this important subject, then maybe they'll pay attention to the new risks that our right to choose faces."

Skillfully updating the 1950's school documentary, the 14-minute film offers up political and social satire regarding the current state of reproductive rights. Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness examines the erosion of reproductive rights in the United States by interweaving the decline in amphibian populations with fictional stories of a conservative politician, a young couple, and a right-wing activist.

The Film was funded in part by Planned Parenthood Golden Gate, which is known for its award-winning activist technology and efforts to diversify the movement. "It's critical to highlight the tenuous position that choice faces today," said Dian J. Harrison, President and CEO of Planned Parenthood Golden Gate. "We financed the making of Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness to send the public a powerful message about the importance of reproductive choice and why it is critical to work to protect it."

For this Film, award winning filmmaker Tiffany Shlain partnered with her long time collaborator, co-writer Maya Draisin, and co-writer and Emmy Award winning producer Xandra Castleton. This Grottofilms production was produced by Castleton. For a full list of credits and additional information about the film please go to www.lifeliberty.net

About the Video Project: The Video Project is a leading distributor of activist documentaries and political films. The film is available to institutions and consumers at www.videoproject.net/llph.html or by calling 1-800-4-Planet. Review copies available.

http://www.lifeliberty.net/press_releases.html

[superconnected]

57. There are women getting abortions because of severe

developmental defects, and issues that put the womens health on the line too.
Then of course rapes. And heaven forbid the right wing accept a 13 yo accidently gets pregnant with her 13bf's kid, or that anyone accidentally get pregnant. Many women do not want to/or are not psychologically prepared to have children. Who was the lady that drowned her 5 kids in texas...

This will also up young girls suicide rates when they accidently concieve and don't see a way out, and/or up the teenagers leaving the baby to die under the house incidents.

Too bad the right wing doesn't have any compassion for women and the choices they make. It's a pure patriarchy. And like all patriarchys, it's ugly.

[China_cat]

14. If their law about the plate is anything like the one

here in SC, you aren't allowed a specialty plate unless someone with an opposing view also has one. So, anti-choicers got shot down for their 'choose life' plate but the 'in god we trust' crowd got theirs. The latter got their plate and the secular humanists got one that says 'in reason we trust'.

Got one on our van.

[Sirveri]

73. I'm out in North Charleston.

All I ever see are In God We Trust, they overwhelm the normal state plates.

[China_cat]

74. That's where I am too.

We're the odd ones in this neighborhood.

[prolesunited]

81. I would go for "In Satan We Trust"

just to piss them off. :evilgrin:

[China_cat]

95. The word 'reason' invokes the same ire.

[baldguy]

15. If he REALLY wants to end abortion

Start with mandatory & comprehensive sex education in every school starting in kindergarten, with free condoms & contraceptives available starting in the 6th grade including explicit instructions in their use. We could virtually eliminate abortion in 5 yrs.

Otherwise, he's just throwing a bone to the christo-fascists to prove his loyalty.

[Justitia]

22. He doesn't. This is about enslaving women's bodies & sexual punishment.

They don't give a crap about the resultant "baby". Kid is on it's own, pulling itself up by it's diaper straps.

It's a way to exert moral authority and paternalistic physical control.

[Jade Fox]

106. Not to mention: why aren't these morans....

pressuring drug companies to come up with easier-to-use and safer birth control methods? Because they want to punish women for having sex, not end abortion.

[Ilsa]

16. So if his wife got pregnant by having an affair with another man,

it could become illegal for her to get an abortion. What if Troy transported her across state lines to get an abortion? Could we put him in jail then? Or if he tried to talk her into having an abortion? Someone, please, proposition his wife and take away her birth control so they can finally figure this out.

[Justitia]

19. He could ask that hypocrite, former rep Bob Barr, all about that. -eom

[Freedom_from_Chains]

20. The possibilities are endless

but most likely we would just stone the adulteress wife to death. It's the age of compassionate conservatism don't you know.

[Ilsa]

27. Oh. I forgot. Would that happen before or after she gives birth? Or

is it before or after she bleeds to death from a coathanger?

[Freedom_from_Chains]

29. Like I said, the possibilities are endless.

[Maddy McCall]

25. Thank god I live in Mississippi.

Who'd ever have thought I'd say that? :shrug:

[Lars39]

31. Mississippi only has one abortion clinic for the whole state.

And the fundies are doing their best to regulate it out of existence.

[Maddy McCall]

71. I'm aware of that. I'm also aware that the women who run it have more....

determination and fortitude in their pinky than most DUers have in their whole bodies.

Jackson's Women's Health Organization will never shut its doors...the abortion battle is ages old in Jackson, and the WHO still stands. Susan Hill, who runs the clinic, is a ballsy woman who has NEVER backed down from a fight with the pro-lifers. And she has many prominent Mississippians on her side--they don't lend their name to the fight, but they lend their dollars to it.

I'd bet everything I own that the WHO will still be operating in Jackson a decade from now, if Roe V. Wade still stands then.

[Lars39]

92. But bottom line, there's still just one.

Horrible that it's gotten to this point. :(

[kilaana]

30. Unbelievable..

Er, make that un-fucking-believable.

I have GOT to get out of Indiana!

By the way, you can e-mail Rep. Woodruff via the link on this page

http://www.in.gov/cgi-bin/legislative/contact/contact.pl

Then he "will thank you for your input and will get back to you as soon as possible."

Of course he will...

[EC]

33. How can they enforce this without evading the privacy

of the woman and the Dr's "confidentual records"? And how can they not offer an alternate license plate for the others that Don't trust God?

[Justitia]

35. If they make it illegal, there is no right to privacy for illegal acts. -

[EC]

37. So does that mean that EVERY WOMAN'S medical files

are fair game for perusal? Or every doctors records? How would the separate possible law breakers from the innocent? Would they have to have some other evidence that a woman seeked and got an abortion, or just search all records for pregnant women and then just watch to make sure they gave birth?

[Justitia]

39. I'm sure they'd get into however many records they'd want. The bar for

snooping into private citizens these days is really, really low.
If you are female, it's even lower than that.

[Eurobabe]

42. I am so glad I am getting the fuck out of this country!!

My German is coming along great.

[Book Lover]

44. The only way to completely eliminate abortion

is to remove every uterus from every woman in the world.

[Justitia]

46. But then how do you punish women for having sex? Only pregnancy works.

Which is why they are also against birth control.

If you get rid of the uteri (?), it will be like the Free Love 60s all over again - LOL!

:party:

[Book Lover]

47. Ah. I hadn't thought of that

Well, you can always count on ignorance about STD's!

[Betty]

48. That's right, only men should have sex.

women who have sex are jezibels.

[EC]

59. or every dick... n/t

[eleonora]

49. kick and recommended

this is outrageous and an attack to our rights as women.

I have another solution. Let's sterilize all adulterous men caught in the act. Then we'll be even.

[Xenotime]

51. What a fundie freep!

This guy is a crack!

[Freedom_from_Chains]

64. Unbelievable as it may seem, the freepers haven't posted this yet.

[Charlie Brown]

54. Not even for rape/incest?

Sheesh. What an ass.

[BurningDog]

110. To play the "devil's" advocate here.

If you're going to ban abortion on the grounds that you think that its the taking of human life, inconveniencing a woman to carry a child for nine months to term is the lesser of two evils. Its the people who say "ban abortion, EXCEPT in the case of rape and incest" that are contradicting themselves, because then they're putting convenience above the taking of life.

[AuntiBush]

55. Jefferson Just Rolled Over in his Grave... Again!

Separation of Church and state.

The Republican politicans are using religion to spur again, brother against brother.
Sad.

[RazzleDazzle]

58. Link?

[Freedom_from_Chains]

62. Oops, forgot that

http://www.indystar.com

[area51]

60. "There would be no exceptions for victims of rape or incest."

This is part of the reason why I call the nazi party the pro-rape party. It's obvious they hate women.

[AwakeAtLast]

66. That is also why I think this will be defeated

Maybe I'm too optimistic, but I don't think it will pass with that provision.

[Justitia]

67. Well, he's consistent w/the GOP platform position - NO EXCEPTIONS

EVER.

This has been the absolute GOP Platform position on abortion forever.

I wonder if many self-labeled republicans even know that about their own party?

I bet a lot of them think the GOP is permissive w/abortion for rape, incest, deformity, LIFE or health of the mother.

Memo to lurking repubs - THEY'RE NOT, NO EXCEPTIONS.

Get to know your own party's positions and what you are voting for, assholes.
This Indiana asshole is entirely consistent with his national party.

[Bridget Burke]

83. Hey, you just KNOW those women brought it on themselves....

By wearing lewd clothing & leading men on. Or being out of the house after dark.

And young girls can cause problems at home; remember Lot's daughters! Better to marry them off early so they can't lead their male relatives into temptation.

[Tesha]

85. Actually, they brought it on themselves by voting for Republicans.

Payback sucks.

Tesha

[Bridget Burke]

96. How do you know all of them voted Republican?

Some of them are still too young to vote.

My post was sarcastic. Too bad yours isn't.

[HuffleClaw]

69. doesn't one clown or another try this at least once a sesson?

i'm pretty sure i've read stories like this before. nothing ever comes of it.

[Straight Shooter]

70. He filed this just in time to serve as a distraction for spying & Abramoff

Isn't that special? :sarcasm:

[krkaufman]

72. Sounds like a petition for "In FSM We Trust" is needed n/t

[hippiechick]

77. Bill would make abortion illegal in Indiana

Oh and of course it's a MAN who wants to overturn Roe. :mad:

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060106/NEWS02/601060475

By Mary Beth Schneider and Michele McNeil
Abortion would be illegal for most women in Indiana, including victims of rape and incest, under a bill filed this week in the Indiana House.


Indiana's legislators have chipped away at abortion for decades, imposing waiting periods and other restrictions, but the measure proposed by Rep. Troy A. Woodruff, R-Vincennes, is the first direct attempt in years to outlaw most abortions.The only exception allowed under House Bill 1096 would be for women whose health or life would be permanently impaired if a pregnancy continued. The bill would define life as beginning at conception and make it a felony to perform all other abortions. Anyone convicted would face up to eight years in prison.

Woodruff said he expected the bill to easily pass the House. But Senate President Pro Tempore Robert Garton, R-Columbus, and Gov. Mitch Daniels questioned the prospects of the proposal.

In Indiana, 11,458 abortions were performed in 2003, the most recent year for which the Indiana State Department of Health has data. That's down from 12,109 in 1999. Nationally, the number of abortions has dropped, too. In 2002, women had 1.29 million abortions, down from 1.36 million in 1996, according to the Guttmacher Institute, a nonprofit group with offices in New York and Washington that researches reproductive health.

Woodruff said the time is right for Indiana to confront this issue. "It's something I've prayed about, and it's weighed on my heart," said Woodruff, who also is an aide to U.S. Rep. John Hostettler, R-Ind. "It's an emotional issue," Woodruff acknowledged, but he added that he thought most Hoosiers support a ban.

An Indiana law banning most abortions most likely would be challenged in the courts and could end up as a test case before the U.S. Supreme Court to possibly overturn the landmark 1973 Roe v. Wade ruling, which legalized abortion nationwide.

... start dialing and emailing, folks ...

[salin]

78. Hippiechick, is it me...

or is it getting even more embarassing to be living in this state? These folks are getting more emboldened and more strident and more... embarassing. I cringe, these days, when I see this state's name in a news item.

Btw :hi:

[davsand]

87. I always thought Missouri was worse.

I used to sell kids' books in a territory that covered Illinois, Indiana, Wisconsin, and Missouri--oh and a small part of Iowa too, I guess. I will tell you all that IMO, rural Indiana was nuts, but Missouri was worse. I could COUNT on getting calls from Indiana and Missouri about the content of the kids' books every season. Usually it was people calling about stuff like "witchcraft" and "satan worship" in the books. I'd get the occasional call from the other states, but Missouri was the worst.



Laura

[salin]

88. heh... my initial reaction

to this... Great... at least Missouri is worse... we're number two, we're number two! Sarcasm aside, I think that some of the craziness in rural indiana has made its way to the statehouse - and these folks are emboldened to believe that they are the majority (the far wacky side) - but most of Indiana is actually pretty common-sense driven - and hence in the past much of the wackjobs sorta kept on the fringe. This modern era (so to speak) where they feel so emboldened to try to lead the statehouse is dang uncomfortable, and disturbing to this hoosier.

[davsand]

89. Indiana is a lot like Illinois, I think.

We have some VERY conservative areas downstate (I'm in one of the few liberal bastions outside Chicago) but we are saved by Chicago and Metro East St Louis area from being terribly conservative in who gets elected statewide. Even that hasn't been enough to save us from a string of GOP Governors like Edgar, Ryan, and Thompson. Blaggojevich, our current Dem Gov, really WAS a stroke of good timing and good organizing.

I would expect that you have some areas that are better for Dems than others. Indy and Bloomington should be pretty decent, maybe Northern Indiana--the more metro areas...

I do agree that Indiana people are pretty pragmatic overall. I do think that many of your Dems are a bit more conservative than the liberal masses here at DU, however. I expect that they are typical of a lot of the downstate Dems here in Illinois--Dems but not wildly liberal. Socially conservative Dems, maybe is a good way to refer to them. I can't feel that most are happy with some of what I hear about the Leg doing over there.




Laura

[Proud Liberal Dem]

80. I'm not too worried....yet

The only silver lining in this is that our governor, who is GOP AND Pro-Life, doesn't seem very supportive of the legislation nor eager to use this as a challenge to Roe V. Wade so, even if this does pass (by some miracle) it's going to be immediately blocked in the courts and the Governor and the AG are probably NOT going to fight it all the way to the Supreme Court like the person who introduced this bill is hoping. And that's even if it passes in the first place, which is also seriously in doubt. People may support a lot of restrictions on abortion, however from what I have observed relatively few people actually think that it should be banned outright. Another silver lining to all of this is if this DOES pass and the governor and the AG take this fight to the courts (at taxpayer expense), it will likely turn a lot of people off to the GOP, which, of course, ultimately works in our favor. Although I've been critical of our governor (Mitch Daniels) on many occasions and for many things, he does seem rather progressive (by Indiana standards) or at least "libertarian" on social issues so far. At the very least, he definitely does not seem to be in the pocket of religious conservatives in our state.

[depakid]

86. Indiana again

I think maybe that state beats Oklahoma & Kansas for "most stupid and intolerant things done per capita."

Is there something toxic in the water there?

You expect these stories to come out of Texas & Florida, given their populations and the sheer number of fundies, but I guess I don't understand hoosiers.

[rocktivity]

90. This law would establish a religion

because life beginning at conception is a belief, not a fact.

Priest: "Life begins at conception."
Minister: "No, life begins after birth."
Rabbi: "You're both wrong. Life begins when the youngest finishes college and the dog dies."

:headbang:
rocknation

[oneoftheboys]

93. Hmmm...

Could this be a test case for Alito...?

[Honest_Abe]

94. Politics...

Rep. Woodruff made a HIGHLY unpopular vote last year in favor of Indiana going onto Daylight Savings time. He made his vote after a great deal of pressure from the Republicans, in direct violation of his own campaign promises. His consituents are furious. Most people outside Southern Indiana don't understand how politically charged the time issue is.

IMHO, Rep. Woodruff introduced this bill for political cover. It's a diversion. It's using one national wedge issue to divert attention from a local wedge issue. He's learning from the Karl Rove School of Politics.

[Moderator]

97. kick

[daa]

98. Bill Would Make Abortions Illegal In Indiana

NDIANAPOLIS -- A Republican lawmaker has filed a bill to make abortion illegal in Indiana, saying if it became law, it could ultimately be a vehicle to get the U.S. Supreme Court with new members to overturn abortion rights.

But Gov. Mitch Daniels said Thursday that his sense was "it would have a very limited prospect of ultimate success."

The bill by Rep. Troy Woodruff of Vincennes would change Indiana's feticide law to make it a Class C felony, punishable with a two- to eight-year prison sentence, to perform an abortion. The only exception would be when carrying a pregnancy to term would pose a "substantial permanent impairment of the life or physical health of the pregnant woman."

Woodruff said he filed the bill Wednesday in part because there will be a new U.S. Supreme Court and a state must pass a law and then appeal it to the highest court to see if the landmark 1973 Roe v. Wade ruling would stand.

"Also the people have never had an opportunity (through their lawmakers) to vote on the matter," Woodruff said.

The bill likely will be assigned to the House Public Policy and Veterans Affairs Committee. Chairman Marlin Stutzman, R-Howe, said he agrees with the bill but is uncertain whether he can schedule it for a hearing. He said with a short session that is to end by March 14, he will only have three committee hearings, and such a controversial bill would take up at least one entire meeting.

"The bill is very close to my heart," Stutzman said.

Daniels said he was a "supporter of the right to live."

But he questioned whether it have any prospect of success and whether any time and money spent on it would lead anywhere.

"Ultimately for this to change, I think, first the heart of the country and maybe ultimately the view the courts take of states' rights to place some limits would have to evolve," Daniels said.

http://www.theindychannel.com/news/5866441/detail.html

[KamaAina]

99. Swell. That's about as constitutional as...

let's just say, hypothetically, an out-of-control pResident spying on U.S. citizens. :sarcasm:

[bluestateguy]

100. How would he enforce the law?

He owes us that explanation, at least. What happens to a woman and her doctor if an illegal abortion is performed? And what kind of enforcement mechanisms will be in place to ensure that the law is followed?

[acmejack]

101. It's all they want, to challenge Roe.

Indiana is really loving being the water-boy for these creeps.

[roguevalley]

102. no exceptions for rape and incest huh? Check his closet. Gotta

be dirty in there. What a completely futile person. If I hear of ONE MORE MAN who HATES WOMEN TO THIS LEVEL, I will explode. May this guy get something horrendous that stem cell research could have cured.

[NVMojo]

103. Why don't they stamp out nepotism, cronyism, greed and unethical

Republican corruption first? They obviously have too much time on their hands to be focusing just on people's individual sex organs and spiritual beliefs. Dumb asses.

[depakid]

104. That's mostly next door in Ohio

another place I thoroughly do not understand.

[VegasWolf]

105. One word! Psychos! nt

[MetaTrope]

107. Abortion aims to stamp out lawmakers

Turnabout is fair play...

[Deja Q]

112. No, homosexuals do that. That's why Brokeback Mountain has been ruining

marriages all over the country and turnin' men gay, don'cha know. :crazy:

[BlueIris]

108. Those wishing to stamp out abortion can start promoting vasectomy.

I know this solution to the epidemic of unintended pregnancy isn't going to appeal to the Indiana misogynists, but--SERIOUSLY. It's got to start happening among the pro-choice lobby on the left, and in the medical community. The best way to prevent pregnancy is by keeping sperm out of the vagina. Smart, non-misogynist doctors and sexually active adults know this, even if they won't admit it. If the medical "professionals" of America started putting the same pressure on men to prevent pregnancy and abortion through this most reliable strategy, instead of unreasonably and illogically putting that pressure on women, offering those women risk-laden, health-damaging and intolerable "options" for doing so, while flat-out lying to them about their affiliated risks and side-effects and charging them THREE TIMES what men pay for reproductive health services, the abortion rate in this country would plummet.

Fellas? Figure it out. Stop being so unjustifiably selfish. Stop being so inexcusably and willfully ignorant. Stop expecting your female partners to do all the meaningful work to prevent pregnancy, including enduring the excruciating and traumatizing brutalization that the health "care" system subjects women to in order to get the most basic kinds of screening required to obtain any form of effective birth control. Stop thinking that your expectation that she use hormones to prevent pregnancy is "no big deal," even if it exposes her to intolerable side-effects, cancer, depression and other unacceptable pain. Just because the misogynist doctors and non-self-respecting female citizens of the world have taught you that it's okay to treat a woman like a veritable masturbation bucket doesn't mean that it is. DO YOUR PART. Stop being lazy, callous and hateful. There are better sterilization options for you than her. They carry less risk. They're not as invasive. They hurt less. They're cheaper. They don't impact your ability to have or enjoy sex, they don't damage your sexual health in a way that damages your overall health and they're reversible.

And ladies? Stop tolerating misogynist indifference regarding this issue from your male partners. Just because he doesn't know anything about what you go through doesn't mean his behavior is acceptable. It simply isn't right that you have to basically be tortured in your GYN's office, use carcinogenic hormones that can impair your day-to-day functionality, kill your capacity to achieve sexual satisfaction and be told by society and the "men" you share your bodies with under these inhumane conditions in order to enjoy the pleasures of sex without pregnancy are justified in dismissing, ignoring or marginalizing your agony. If you're worried about ever finding a man who will make the not-so-significant sacrifice that is taking control of his biology to prevent pregnancy the way most men in our sorry excuse for a civilization demand that you do, don't be. I meet real men each day who consider taking personal responsibility in this area of mature, equal relationships par for the course. And besides, any man who expects you to compromise your health and well-being for whatever sex may happen between you even when he is unwilling to take any remotely equivalent action--is not worth your time. Or anyone's time. He's not an adult, and he doesn't respect--or actually give a rat's ass--about the women in his life. You and your reproductive health deserve better. Expect it. Demand it.

[JerseygirlCT]

109. Quick! Send them an emergency copy of the US Constitution! nt

[Deja Q]

111. I hope the lawmakers' wives get raped.

A harsh statement, yes. I apologize for the crudity, but sometimes "tough love" is the only measure available. They are so gung-ho on having their way, they won't even see reason. Therefore, unreasonable commentary shall follow - even though it's said in the name of far greater reasoning.

We'll also see just how true to the word these cretins are. And I bet they won't be. The usual double-standard.


Oh, my comment is tame. Recall the Biblical verse reading "suffer the death of thy neighbor". If more people did that pre-emptively, our history and our present would be far less steeped in blood and bloodlust.

[superconnected]

113. No, not their wives. That's crass

If you want the law makers pay then hope they get raped. Leave the women out of it.

And no, I don't hope anyone gets raped.

I hope these people's wives and daughters leave them and never speak to them again.