US vetoes sale of Spanish planes to Venezuela

[Judi Lynn]

Friday, January 13, 2006

US vetoes sale of Spanish planes to Venezuela

By: ThinkSpain

The US government announced yesterday that it has decided to turn down a request for a licence to permit the sale of twelve Spanish-made planes to Venezuela, because they use American technology. The deal would have been worth around €500 million. An option to replace US-made components with similar parts manufactured in Europe is not considered to be economically viable.

According to reports in this morning's ABC and El Pais newspapers, the US ambassador in Madrid, Eduardo Aguirre, informed Foreign Affairs minister, Miguel Angel Moratinos (archive photo), when they met yesterday. Mr Aguirre later phoned Defence minister, José Bono, as well as the planes' manufacturers, EADS-CASA, to break the news personally.

The reports also claim that the decision was taken on the grounds that they consider that Hugo Chávez's government, "despite having been elected democratically," has "systematically" undermined democratic institutions, and the "actions and frequent declarations" of Mr Chávez's government contribute to instability in the region, and that the sale of the planes "has the potential to complicate the situation."
(snip/...)

http://www.thinkspain.com/news-spain/10319

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

United States formally prohibits arms sale to Venezuela
By h.b.
Fri, 13 Jan 2006, 08:14

Email this article
Printer friendly page


The United States ambassador to Spain, Eduardo Aguirre - Photo EFE

The United States government has formally prohibited Spain from selling 12 military planes and eight frigates to Hugo Chávez in Venezuela, because they contain North American technology. The United States Ambassador to Spain, Eduardo Aguirre, met yesterday with the Spanish Foreign Affairs Minister, Miguel Ángel Moratinos, to inform him of the decision. Following the meeting Aguirre also spoke by phone with the Defence Minister, José Bono, and also with the company building the planes, CASA.
Washington considers that the sale could de-stabilise the region.

The Spanish Ministry for Defence has indicated that the sale will still go ahead however, despite the United States action, and they intend to substitute the US technology with that from Italy, France or Great Britain.
(snip/)

http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publish/article_1937.shtml

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Brazil Says US Wants to Block Airplane Deal with Venezuela
By VOA News
12 January 2006



Brazil's foreign minister has said he has seen indications the United States wants to block a sale of Brazilian-made military aircraft to Venezuela.

Foreign Minister Celso Amorim told reporters Wednesday he intends to discuss the matter with U.S. officials and try to convince them not to prevent the sale. He says he believes Venezuela is a threat to no one and that disagreements over internal policies should not restrict transfers of technology.

Mr. Amorim's comments came after Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez Tuesday alleged Washington wanted to veto his deal with Brazilian aircraft-maker Embraer because the planes use U.S. technology.
(snip/...)

http://www.voanews.com/english/2006-01-12-voa17.cfm

[dutchdemocrat]

1. American Facists.

n/t

[mrbill]

2. scary Venezuela and their scary leader.....

che once thought about a united south america.

it might really happen someday.

on edit: spell check harpy.

[pinerow]

22. Just what is scary about Chavez or Venezuela...?

I mean other than the fact that more and more Brown folks are heading the government...and spare the Venezuelan Media reports...they may as well be written by Brit Hume....:wtf:

[cantstandbush]

37. But we give this stuff and more to Israel who turns around and sells or

gives it whoever they want to...like they did with S. Africa during apartheid days.

[dutchdemocrat]

3. Venezuela donates more heating oil to U.S. poor

Venezuela donates more heating oil to U.S. poor
Thu Jan 12, 2006 6:46 PM ET

By Jason Szep
WINDHAM, Maine, Jan 12 (Reuters) - Venezuela expanded a controversial program on Thursday of subsidizing costly home-heating oil for the U.S. poor with a pact in Maine, upping the ante in a political brawl with President George W. Bush.

The donations deepen an ongoing spat between oil-rich Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez and Bush, who calls Chavez a threat to democracy in Latin America. Socialist Chavez says Bush is trying to undermine his political support.

Venezuela, where per capita income is about 1/10th that of the United States, donated 8 million gallons (36 million litres) of heating oil at a 40 percent discount to Maine, the third northeastern U.S. state to receive what Venezuela calls its "humanitarian aid."

"This helps Chavez portray America as fundamentally weak," said Bruce Everett, a former executive with the Exxon Mobil Corp who teaches petroleum economics at the Fletcher School at Tufts University in Massachusetts.
(snip/...)

http://today.reuters.com/investing/financeArticle.aspx?type=bondsNews&storyID=2006-01-12T234600Z_01_N1233184_RTRIDST_0_ENERGY-USA-VENEZUELA-PICTURE.XML

[RC]

4. The bu$h administration doesn't understand what democracy really is.

"...that Hugo Chávez's government, "despite having been elected democratically," has "systematically" undermined democratic institutions, and the "actions and frequent declarations" of Mr Chávez's government contribute to instability in the region,..."

[IndianaGreen]

11. Instability to US and transnational corporations

Make no mistake about it, when they speak of US interests, they are not speaking of the interests of the American people, but the interests of Wall Street.

We need our own version of the Bolivarian revolution in America, starting with the creation of Bolivarian circles in our communities. Let's topple this government from the ground up!

[High Plains]

27. The Bush administration knows what it is talking about

After all, they are the experts on "systematically undermining democratic institutions."

Guantanamo
Holding US citizens without charges for years
Warrantless spying on US citizens
Spying on Quakers and peace moms
and so on
and so on
and so on

[Charles19]

49. To them Democracy is code word for submitting to the will of the

United States. It really has nothing to do with elections or democratic institutions. As far as they are concerned anyway. It certainly means something to us though.

[Divernan]

5. When 3rd world countries reap benefits of their own natural resources. . ,

Now that Venezuela has control of its own oil, it can afford to become a player on the international scene and to develop its own air force. Cheney's decision to try to block this just pushes other countries into developing competitive technology with US companies. Once these competitive technologies are available, the rest of the world will flock to them if only to thwart US/ Cheney's imperial ambitions. I could see the Spanish govt. even underwriting such technological development by one of its own companies because it will open up a very large market independent of US participation. Alternatively this stupid policy decision by Cheney just strengthens the ties between Latin American countries and the European Union (Spain, UK, France, etc.)

(None of you think Bush or Condi have authority to make this policy decision to interfere with Spain/Venezuela/Brazil, do you? It had to be Cheney.)

On edit: What is ALSO surprising about this story is that there are still some manuafacturing items which are being made in the US instead of Japan/China/India.

[EuroObserver]

13. Spain appears to say it can go ahead anyway

(Playing down any diplomatic fallout).

http://www.elpais.es/articulo/elpporesp/20060113elpepunac_2/Tes/Exteriores/califica/comercial/decision/EE/UU/negar/venta/aviones/Venezuela

El Ministerio de Asuntos Exteriores ha dicho hoy que la negativa estadounidense a permitir la venta a Venezuela de 12 aviones de fabricación española que incluyen tecnología norteamericana no obecede a una "represalia" por parte de Washington ante las relaciones que mantiene con Madrid, sino que se trata de una "decisión comercial" de la empresa estadounidense suministradora de esa tecnología a la española EADS-CASA... "La no concesión de la licencia es una decisión de la empresa y se refiere a los elementos tecnológicos que llevan esos aviones y no a la totalidad de los aviones", ha subrayado.

--> The (Spanish) Foreign Ministry said today that the US negative on permitting the sale to Venezuela of 12 Spanish-manufactured aircraft which use some US technology is not the result of a "reprisal" on Washington's part for the relationship between Venezuela and Madrid, but, rather, is a purely "commercial decision" on the part of the US company which supplies the technology to the Spanish company EADS-CASA... "The non-conecession of this license is a decision made by the company and refers to technoloical components used in these aircraft, not the aircraft as such", (the spokesperson) stressed.

<snip>

Según el responsable de comunidación de Exteriores, EADS-CASA "tendrá que buscar alternativas si quiere seguir adelante con esa exportación". Anoche, fuentes del Ministerio de Defensa indicaron a Europa Press que los componentes de tecnología norteamericana instalados en los aviones vendidos por el Gobierno español a Venezuela pueden sustituirse por otros procedentes de distintos países, ya que, según estas fuentes, existe tecnología similar en Italia, Francia o Reino Unido.

--> According to the Foreign Ministry spokesperson, EADS-CASA "will have to look for alternatives in order to go ahead with this export order". Last night, (Spanish) Defense Ministry sources told Europa Press that the American technological components installed in the aircraft to be sold to Venezuela can be substituted by other components produced by various countries, since, according to these sources, there is similar technology made in Italy, France and the UK.

[Judi Lynn]

14. Thanks for posting that translation, EuroObserver! Really helps.

It's tremendous seeing that Spain hasn't just crumbled, fearing _Bush's murderous wrath. It would always be possible to learn _Bush suspected SPAIN of trying to buy some uranium, too, and was begging to get bombed.

That's the way it goes when a man feels he's too big and too powerful to be checked. It's excellent knowing that sale will probably go through anyway.

[Zodiak]

40. Great post, and well-thought

but I would like to correct one small oversight. The article only said it was American "technology" that was in the aircraft. The article makes no mention of the country of manufacture.

[cliss]

51. Yes, I'm sure Cheney was behind this.

Probably Don Rumsfailed too. I recall last year; Hugo Chavez purchased 100,000 Kalashnikov rifles from Russia. There was alarm in the White House. Rumsfailed said, "I can't imagine why they would need those". Chavez was in the process of organizing militias; there were some clandestine activities going on outside Venezuela, and he was suspicious about US motives.

In my opinion, the most important point about this article is that they WENT AHEAD anyway. Notice? Small countries are giving the finger to the US. They're being blatant about it. It's almost like they are taunting us.

That's the most dangerous part of this development. We're seen as a Paper Tiger around the world. We say things that we don't mean; we threaten, posture, get involved in ridiculous melodrama, and then we back off.

Why do we do this? I always get the feeling that the White House has been cut loose from reality. They just jump in to serious negotiations, shoot off their mouths and manage to piss off just about every country on earth.

THAT'S the biggest damage Cheney has wrought. He's turned us into a pariah. In the process, he's made the world very unstable.

People around the world LOVE the idea that we're hurting. Stan Goff wrote, "The beast bleeds, and a billion people are watching and cheering".

Edited to add: last October, the India Times ran a story about how the US pressured India to vote against Iran. It said that the U.S. delegate called the Indian minister "retarded, and stupid". Unbelievable.

[no_hypocrisy]

6. Fine. In the spirit of democracy and free enterprise, Venezuela will

probably go shopping in China or Russia.

[Judi Lynn]

7. China buys from Venezuela. It's been in the papers. Oil. n/t

[PsychoDad]

8. Looks like they'll be buying from Russia....

What do you think?


Peace

[Judi Lynn]

9. They've already bought the guns Rumsfeld had to make so much noise about.

It was simply beyond him to wonder why they wanted to update their ancient weapons after _Bush started funding the opposition, and backed the coup which failed. He couldn't imagine why they would want to protect themselves. It seemed to hurt the son of a social pervert.



Rumsfeld with his good friend,Islam Karimov,
the man who boils his political prisoners.

[xxqqqzme]

44. Is that a cane in rummy's hand?

what's wrong w/ the vampire? casket lid hit his hip as he jumped in the coffin @ sunrise?

[cosmicone]

45. Russian fighters and bombers are better than American anyway

Indian airforce kicked the USAF's ass two years in a row using older Russian fighters modified and retrofitted in India.

[apple_ridge]

50. Really? I highly doubt that.

Please post the story.

[cliss]

52. Guess who is standing right behind our Dear Friend

Islam Karimov? That's Douglas Feith. One of the signers of the PNAC documents. One of the original Project for the New American Century. So, how's it going lately, Douglas?

Look at the glimmer in Feith's eyes, as he smiles at his Guest. That's Douglas's kinda Man. Boils his opponents. That's the way!!! Why can't we do that here, he thinks.

Now Douglas Feith resigned recently from the Pentagon. It seems that something happened....I don't know the real story. But someone here on the DU probably does.

[izzie]

10. That is one crazy story.

I do not know what our army would do with our China making stuff for them. What country makes anything that does not have some thing from other countries in it? Please do not say we thought every thing up.

[IndianaGreen]

12. The socialist government of Spain will proceed with sale

Bush has united the world against his dictatorship. It is time we all unite against Bush, and stop appeasement of his policies.

[Toots]

15. Russian technology is every bit as good or maybe even better so why drive

people away from American business? We are driving them into our competition's hands. Funny way to support American Industry....:shrug:

[EuroObserver]

16. Latest Spanish government response

http://yahoo.reuters.com/financeQuoteCompanyNewsArticle.jhtml?duid=mtfh47841_2006-01-13_14-30-43_l12212611_newsml

UPDATE 3-Spain plans Venezuela plane sale despite US move
Fri Jan 13, 2006 09:30 AM ET
(Adds Spanish government response)

By Adrian Croft

MADRID, Jan 13 (Reuters) - Spain said on Friday it planned to go ahead with the sale of planes to Venezuela, using substitute technology, after the United States blocked the sale of the EADS-CASA (EAD.MC: Quote, Profile, Research) aircraft with U.S. components.

The United States said late on Thursday it had refused an export licence for Spain to sell 12 transport and maritime surveillance planes containing U.S. technology to Venezuela's left-wing government.

The aircraft are part of a $2 billion Spanish deal, signed in November, to supply ships and planes to Venezuela.

Spain's defiance of U.S. President George W. Bush's administration looks set to further chill relations hurt by Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero's decision, immediately on taking power in April 2004, to pull out Spanish troops from Iraq.

<snip>

Spanish Deputy Prime Minister Maria Teresa Fernandez de la Vega said Spain aimed to fulfil the contract with Venezuela using components from another country.

"There are contracts that have been signed with another country -- in this case with Venezuela -- that of course should be fulfilled. The company will look for substitute technology," she told a news conference after the weekly cabinet meeting.

/more...

[acmejack]

17. Spain-Venezuela deal barred by US

The US has blocked the sale of 12 military planes to Venezuela by a Spanish firm, Spain has confirmed.

The aircraft contain protected US technology, and EADS-Casa will now have to assess whether it is financially viable to use European parts instead.

The US had objected to the sale when it was signed in November, saying it could destabilise South America.

Both Madrid and Caracas have said the equipment - including eight patrol boats - is for defensive purposes.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4609696.stm

[ugarte]

18. Lesson: do not buy from US defense firms

Buy elsewhere without the political strings attached.

[CottonBear]

19. Bushie is the one who wants to destabilise South America.

I suppose the Faux News crowd will be groovin' on this story all weekend.
Nothing like another evil Hugo Chavez story to scare the sheeple into total submission. :(

[murray hill farm]

20. Where else could..

Venezuela purchase these items...or the same equipment without the "protected US technology"...one would hope that such a place exists outside of the USA...there must be other outlets. Russia?

[400Years]

21. Spain is going to sell them the stuff anyway

Using european technology.

[saigon68]

24. I'd buy from the Chinese

Their stuff is made to be operated and repaired by the average person. Its more reliable too.

[shanti]

23. petty little hitlers

:grr: :mad:

[KDLarsen]

25. Worst. Excuse. Ever.

How on earth can 12 transport and maritime surveillance planes have "potential to complicate the situation" in the Central America? By discovering drug runners & being able to dispatch forces to fight them?

Worst. Excuse. Ever.
Worst. President. EVER!

[Hyernel]

26. The World, again, tells Bushco to suck it.

[makeanoise22]

28. Like Bush knows a thing about democracy!

"despite having been elected democratically," has "systematically" undermined democratic institutions, and the "actions and frequent declarations" of Mr Chávez's government contribute to instability in the region, and that the sale of the planes "has the potential to complicate the situation."


Right King George, right!

[dapper]

29. CNN: U.S. blocks Spain warplanes sale

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe/01/13/spain.planesales/index.html

MADRID, Spain (CNN) -- The U.S. government has blocked a planned sale of 12 military aircraft from Spain to Venezuela on the grounds that the planes contain U.S. military technology, and cannot be transferred without approval from Washington, a U.S. embassy spokesman told CNN.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do we have to get permission to sell a car to someone?

:wtf:

Dap

[tatertop]

30. Seems to me there must be plenty of countries selling warplanes

What happened to that awesome new Russian fighter?
Aren't those for sale?

[depakid]

31. Venezuela will just buy from Russia... or China

and probably get better aircraft, a better deal and won't be reliant on the US for spare parts....:think:

[400Years]

32. they said they are going to sell them the planes anyway

just without the parts made by u.s. companies.

they will use european parts instead

[Zynx]

33. We are also trying to block a sale by a Brazilian company(Embraer)

to Venezuela on the same grounds. The Embraer planes are just training planes that are actually turboprops and we still are trying to block it.

[kenny blankenship]

35. AFter we left Vietnam to the Vietnamese we blocked India from sending

water buffalo to Vietnam. Seriously. SOmething like 2/3 of the country's livestock was destroyed by the war, in a country that depends on agriculture just to live and we blocked a neutral country sending them water buffalo.
(Guess we claimed it would violate our patents on bullshit or something)

[Chipper Chat]

34. Venezuela is the new Cuba.

So Chavez will be 3rd-fingering us for the 50 years. Worked OK for Castro.

[TheBaldyMan]

36. Is that the deal to sell military transport planes and patrol boats?

If it is then Bu$hCo is indulging in petty and vindictive politicking. I wonder what the Spanish government is going to make of it?

there are details on the BBC News site on the story I'm thinking of at the link below:

BBC News - 28th Nov 2005: Venezuela-Spain arms deal signed

[MGKrebs]

38. BOO!

Just thought I'd scare any administration officials that are looking in.

;-)

[oblivious]

39. I guess this is pretty bad news for US component manufacturers.

Who's going to want to use them now if there are alternatives. Even much more expensive alternatives would be preferable to losing sales.

As if US manufacturing didn't have enough challenges.

[Crunchy Frog]

41. The silver lining:

this sort of incident could decrease the attractiveness of American military technology on the international market. I doubt that other governments like having those kinds of strings attached to the technology that they use. I expect that it will make other vendors of military technology look far more attractive.

[wakeme2008]

43. You are so right..

IMHO from this point on I would bet Spain only uses non-US parts so they do not have to kiss Bush's ass to make a sell.

[TacticalPeek]

42. U.S. Bars Spain's Sale of Planes to 'Antidemocratic' Venezuela

January 14, 2006
U.S. Bars Spain's Sale of Planes to 'Antidemocratic' Venezuela
By RENWICK McLEAN

MADRID, Jan. 13 -The United States will not allow Spain to sell military aircraft with American technology to Venezuela, saying the sale would aid the increasingly "antidemocratic" government of President Hugo Chávez and would destabilize the region, the American Embassy announced Friday.

The Spanish government, led by Prime Minister José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero, said it regretted the decision, but vowed to move forward with the deal after acquiring the necessary technology elsewhere.

Under the accord, which was signed in November, Spain agreed to sell Venezuela 12 transport airplanes and 8 patrol boats for about 1.7 billion euros, or $2 billion.

Because the airplanes, which are not yet built, were to contain American technology, Spain was required to obtain a license from Washington before completing the sale. Neither Spanish nor American officials would describe the technology.

more
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/14/international/europe/14spain.html?pagewanted=print



Spain should have laundered them through Halliburton, bundled with some nuclear device triggers.

[Crunchy Frog]

46. I feel sad when I find myself rooting for my own country

to get royally screwed. But sadly, that's what it's come to.:-(

[fujiyama]

47. Yeah that Pakistan

is a bastion of democracy, isn't it? How much have we DIRECTLY given them? Several billion? :eyeS:

What a bunch of bullshit.

[Ben Ceremos]

48. Luckily, Spanish sovereignty

trumps American petulance. Spain is selling the equipment to Venezuela...just going to replace American built systems with European components. I wish to thank Bushco for giving European aerospace and guidance systems research and development this economic boost and the impetus to further improve our military technology. Tip of the hat to the fools in charge of 'murka...duh.

[cliss]

53. I think it was $4,000,000,000.00

in loans that we forgave. Pervez Musharraf struck the Jackpot when he made friends with George Bush.

That's not all: last year the U.S. gave the Dictator who was not elected - he grabbed power through a coup - several fighter jets with nuclear capability. I can't remember if we sold them or GAVE them.

Bush Giveth and Bush taketh away.

[Greyhound]

54. The irony in this fiasco is that their (shrubCo.) actions only further

weaken our position and standing in the world, and encourages the exodus away from us. The Venezuelans will get their aircraft and ships, the companies that deal with them will make their profits, and our economy will lose another customer. What a bunch of evil fucks.