(Virginia Gov. Timothy) Kaine questions surveillance

[sabra]

http://www.timesdispatch.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=RTD/MGArticle/RTD_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1137833764244

Kaine questions surveillance

WASHINGTON -- Virginia Gov. Timothy M. Kaine, previewing themes of his response to President Bush's state of the union speech, today questioned Bush's program of warrantless surveillance and took issue with proposals to cut the size of the Army Reserve and National Guard.

"Whether it's a technical violation of the law or not, I think the clear intent of the law has been bypassed," Kaine, a Democrat, said about the National Security Agency warrantless eavesdropping program.

"Leaders who do that suggest you can treat laws and rules in an instrumental way and when it serves your purpose you don't need to follow them. And I think that that's dangerous," Kaine said at a breakfast meeting with reporters.

On the positive side, Kaine commended the ways that Bush rallied the nation after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11 and said Bush has refrained from "the kind of immigrant-bashing I see happening in a lot of politics, including sometimes, politics in Virginia."

[kevinbgoode]

1. Yeah....right. . . .

How about this gem?

"The new governor said he was hoping to deliver "a different vision" rather than a point-by-point response to Bush, and he emphasized results-oriented management, public service, bipartisanship, and such issues as health care and jobs that matter to people"

I hardly think the Commonwealth of Virginia, with its history of bigotry and zeal for anti-civil rights laws can be served up as a model of bipartisanship to the rest of the nation. We could not have selected a more "conservative" figure to deliver this "response," which increasingly appears to be nothing more than pandering to the Right in an foolish attempt to peal off evangelical voters from the Repukes.

I won't be watching this "response." Governor Kaine has nothing positive to say to MY community because his state has done nothing but attempt to demonize us.

[swimboy]

3. I'd respond but I'm too busy demonizing myself.

[ernstbass]

12. Are you referring to the state that elected the first black govenor?

How bigoted of us!

[kevinbgoode]

21. Isn't that the same state that wouldn't let that black governor

marry a white woman?

[mahatmakanejeeves]

17. his state has done nothing but attempt to demonize us

On behalf of MY commonwealth, I apologize for Patrick Henry (the first governor), Thomas Jefferson (the second governor), George Washington (a president named George who was not a disgrace to his office), George Mason, the Virginia Declaration of Rights, the Bill of Rights, the Virginia Statue for Religious Freedom, James Madison, the....

I am sooooooooooooooo sorry.

[kevinbgoode]

22. And what exactly do all those things mean to the gay residents

of Virginia?

[EarlG]

2. Argh

I have no problem with Tim Kaine and I'm glad he kept the governor's mansion in VA in Dem hands. But this is a great example of why Dems suck at getting a national message out. Look at this quote:

"Whether it's a technical violation of the law or not, I think the clear intent of the law has been bypassed."

I mean, come on. Try, "The president broke the law."

It's shorter, it's more direct, it rolls off the tongue. And most importantly, they have to defend against it.

Sure, it's scary - they'll come out in droves, foaming at the mouth, screaming, "How dare Tim Kaine say that the president broke the law?" But the message is out there, and they're on the defensive. And then we say, "How dare Tim Kaine say it? Let me repeat: the president DID break the law."

"Whether it's a technical violation of the law or not, I think the clear intent of the law has been bypassed." Doesn't exactly fit on a bumper sticker, does it?

[sabra]

4. and he will be giving the Dems response tonight? Hmm...

[swimboy]

5. You are so right.

Why do our leaders always use 18 or more words when 5 will do the job?

[SaveElmer]

6. Because unlike Republicans...

They actually know 18 words!!!

[Skip Intro]

7. Agree. Say it Tim. Loud and Clear. "The president Broke The Law"

This bothers me more than the Alito outcome.

How many times do the Dems get a national audiecne, on every channel?

[underpants]

15. Get ready for the brow

Tim tends to raise one eyebrow (his left) for extended periods of time.

Just a side note.

[ninkasi]

19. No, definitely not bumper sticker material

Your post reflects my own feelings...we preface sayings with "if", and "maybe", and try so hard not to appear mean, that we dilute our own message. It is, and was illegal to perform warrant-less wire taps, and we should come out and say so.

If Bush brings up health care, we should respond by pointing out the Medicare Drug program, which is in shambles, and benefits big business. We should never give them an opening by qualifying our statements, unless there is a strong reason to do so.

Why should we tip-toe so much around a party which insults us by using terms like the Democrat Party, instead of the Democratic Party? I'm tired of playing too nice, and tired of caring what the shrill right-wingers want. We're not going to win them over anyway, and I believe that moderates on both sides would appreciate if we would speak up louder, clearer, and more unified.

[SaveElmer]

8. Like it or not...

Warner and Kaine have opened a path for Democratic victories in traditional red states. Kaine is a good guy. He is a centrist, and takes positions I do not like on some issues (particularly gay rights), but overall we are better having him there.

[kevinbgoode]

9. What exactly is a "centrist" in a state

run by Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson?

[SaveElmer]

10. Right here...

btw: Kaine took both Lynchburg and Virginia Beach...

[mahatmakanejeeves]

18. I hope

he shoots up some Botox into his left eyebrow. The raised eyebrow thing gets on my nerves.

[Penndems]

20. Right here, as well:

[hatrack]

11. Slashing! Memorable! Gutsy! A real stem-winder, I tell you!!

"Leaders who do that suggest that you can treat laws and rules in an instrumental way :wtf: and when it serves your purpose you don't need to follow them."

:boring: :boring: :boring:

[IndianaGreen]

13. Kaine is also opposed to LGBT rights

This motherfucker does not speak for me!

I have a poll about this in GD:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2424930

Should a Klansman give the Democratic response? Or a homophobe? Or a Nazi? Or a pro-Alito Democrat?

[Pastiche423]

14. Who picked him for the rebuttal?

[hatrack]

16. Wally Cox was dead, hence unavailable

:eyes: