Agency: Iran papers are for an atomic bomb

[ECH1969]

A document obtained by Iran on the nuclear black market serves no other purpose than to make an atomic bomb, the International Atomic Energy Agency said Tuesday.

The finding was made in a report prepared for presentation to the 35-nation IAEA board when it meets, starting Thursday, on whether to refer Iran to the U.N. Security Council, which has the power to impose economic and political sanctions on Iran.

The report was made available in full to The Associated Press.

The document was given to Iran by members of the nuclear black market network, the IAEA said. Iran has claimed it did not ask for the document but was given it anyway as part of other black market purchases.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/13754858.htm

[atomic-fly]

1. here we go....

[Poll_Blind]

2. "Do not eat from the tree of Knowledge, said the Lord"

Except the United States is apparently the Lord in this case. Soverign nations cannot even KNOW how to make atomic bombs, let alone actually make them. This is Hegemony.

PB

[megatherium]

13. Hegemony?

If the Iranian leadership really believes the Holocaust didn't happen, I don't want them to get them bomb. Yikes!

Of course, not that our leadership is much less scary these days. (Although letting Iran get the bomb isn't going to help that problem, it might make it worse.)

[jpak]

3. Were they from Niger???????

What a bunch of crap

[jseankil]

8. So the International Atomic Energy Agency is run by Bush now?

or what do you mean by "what a load of crap"

[doublethink]

12. See post #10 .....

and by the way are you getting paid to be here? Just asking. :) Peace.

[jpak]

17. I think there are grounds for healthily skepticism here.

I place little faith on accusations based on unseen documents obtained on the "black market".

Especially when ChmpCo is doing everything it can to justify a strike against Iran.

And we HAVE seen this kind of CRAP before...

[Theduckno2]

19. They certainly look like a paper tiger to me.

Why isn't the international community going after the nuclear black market? That seems to be a more effective way of dealing with this issue. But of course that might get a little too close to the international weapons trade and that would be a no-no.

For me this report is akin to a local sheriff declaring that they will be cracking down on drug users but make little or no effort to catch the dealers.

The timng of this disclosure is HIGHLY suspect to me, along with the idea that blackmarketers gave something away for free (unless they were paid by somebody else???).

I sure expect to hear this in the SOTU tonight. :grr:

edit:spelling

[bananas]

22. LOL - that was my first thought nt

[Canuckistanian]

43. Any Italian intelligence officers invovled?

See, we can't trust anything these days.

[doublethink]

4. Just in time to sneak into King George's speech tonight.

that's just great. What timing huh? Oh the powers that be ... Peace.

[truth2power]

5. "nuclear black market network". Read "Cheney".

The Cabal better get moving. They gotta ramp this up to attack-mode by March. :eyes:

[cantstandbush]

6. Entrapment on an international level. Shades of Niger Shameful!!!

Are there no lengths to which these neocon-PNAC bastards will go?

[IndianaGreen]

7. Nukes are a deterrent to aggression

The Cold War proved that, and Iran now need nukes to protect itself from Bu$h and that other nuclear power in the Middle East, Israel.

[jseankil]

9. Iran supports terror and you want them to have nukes???

No wonder Dems score so low in national security compared to Republicans.

[doublethink]

14. Booga Booga Booga .....

Terror Terror Terror ..... ohhhhh I'm sceeeerrrrrrd !!!!! :rofl:

[jseankil]

27. Iran doesn't support terroa gain Israel?

They are rather open about their support to groups who use terror so what's so funny, your ignorance?

[doublethink]

29. Since when is Israel the 51st state of the U.S.A. ?

and what's 'terroa' anyway? Actually your own ignorance of basic facts is where I start laughing at your silly mantra. :rofl: Now be a good little boy and go to your room before your type of thinking starts WW3. Peace. :)

[jseankil]

35. Let's pass on nukes to everyone sir

Great job, you got me on a typo! Good one, bravo! :party:

Allowing nukes to fall into the hands of a madman who openly wants to wipe an ally off the map is what will start WWIII sir.

[doublethink]

41. See post #16 ...

That guy is another 'madman' as you put it ... he has nukes, has made similar statements, why hasn't he started WW3 yet, or used a nuke? Maybe because he knows his country would be annihilated immediately? Look kid, this argument is really about hegemony, oil, the world economy, and other factors which has nothing to do with this terror, terror, terror, mantra being spewed by the right-wing media at you daily. This isn't a game of 'who sunk my battleship'... but if you choose to believe that, well that's your right. 'Lets pass the nukes to everyone' ... is a bit to naive and elitist a statement for me to continue this discussion ... But I hope you keep an open mind and research for yourself a bit more before backing another 'War' .... Peace. :)

on edit: typo ... :dunce: back at ya !

[doublethink]

30. And furthermore make a decision ....

either go hide under the covers like I suggested in my previous post ... or go enlist and put your silly little neocon chicken hawk ass on the line and fight for what you believe in. Our troops could use the help. :)

[no_to_war_economy]

16. this man definitely has nukes | where is your outrage

[jseankil]

26. Yea, Clinton should have never trusted him /nm

/nm

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jseankil]

36. Take the tinfoil hat off sir.

Is what I said not true sir?

[Catrina]

59. Here 'Sir' you might want to take a look at this from the Pentagon Spy

trial.

OSP-AIPAC SPY CASE REVEALS ISRAELI PLOT TO PLANT IRAN WMD DATA

Wed Jun 15th, 2005 at 09:17:06 PDT

Details revealed yesterday in the indictment against accused Pentagon spy Larry Franklin implicate Israel in a plot to illegally influence United States policy toward Iran. Counts in the indictment show that the Franklin prosecution is not a conventional spy case involving the passing of documents to a foreign agent. Instead, it appears that the OSP-AIPAC espionage conspiracy involved efforts by Israel to use American neocons to "cook the books" on Iranian WMDs, much as occurred earlier with false documents fed to the Bush Administration to justify the March 2003 U.S. invasion of Iraq.

Published details about the indictment unsealed yesterday against Franklin show that the FBI busted up a plot by an Israeli intelligence officer and two AIPAC lobbyists to advance the career of Franklin, get him "by the elbow of the President", and to plant information provided by Mossad in Pentagon documents about Iran.

Details of a Plot Unveiled in Case Against Franklin

BY ELI LAKE - Staff Reporter of the Sun

URL: http://www.nysun.com/article/15374

.......

Same old 'forge the evidence so the PNAC plans can move forward'.

You know, Americans are getting tired of having our soldiers killed based on fake, forged evidence. As an American (are you American?) I would think you would be very concerned about the bad will and the danger this country has been placed in because a bunch of neocons fabricated evidence to fool the American to get us into a war that has been a disaster!

[RaleighNCDUer]

20. And just who would Iran nuke?

The country would be turned to slag 10 minutes after the first nuke lifted off. Think they don't know that?

[Psephos]

60. Israel

Ahmadinejad sees himself not as a politician, but as a figure in a larger religious movement. How do we know? Because he says so, clearly and often. That movement's stated aims are to "wipe Israel off the map." That's a direct quote.

He feels he's God's prime mover in the epic struggle between Islam and infidels, and that he's supposed to prepare the way for the arrival of the Twelfth Imam (an apocalyptic figure). All streams of Islam believe in a divine savior, the Mahdi, who will appear at the End of Days. Ahmadinejad and his cabinet have pledged themselves to work for the return of the Mahdi. Hmm, I wonder how they're going to do that?

Let's hand this nut a nuke amd a free pass, and trust our theories that, naw, he wouldn't actually do something crazy, because, umm, it's not like he's actually crazy, right?

I don't know if it's naivete or intransigence that lets someone decide nuclear armed religious fundies are a good idea. Probably both. We don't have to guess what Ahmadinejad wants to do, because he says it.

We currently have good nonmilitary options available. At some point, they will be off the table, and then we'll have to hope our theories are better than our realities.

Peace.

[Tempest]

10. They were from the CIA

Botched CIA operations may have handed Iran vital information on how to make nuclear weapons and betrayed the identities of America's spies in the country, according to a new book on US intelligence.

The latest account of American intelligence failures includes details of how the CIA allegedly tried to slip Teheran some Russian designs for an atomic bomb, which contained hidden flaws that would have made any device inoperable.

The Iranians, however, were tipped off by the very agent sent to give them the documents.

http://tinyurl.com/7mk46

[jpak]

18. Thank you Tempest

n/t

[HuffleClaw]

11. probably that CIA thing we heard about a while back

'the nuclear black market network'? what crap is that? this is gonna be the 'niger yellowcake' of the iran game.

[stop the bleeding]

15. and that ties in with this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=103&topic_id=66773

[oneighty]

21. Many years ago

a college student declared he could make an atomic bomb from information gathered in the library and other open market sources. He wrote a book, he made some money Readers Digest proclaimed it to the world. Anybody can make an Atomic Bomb Oh My God.

Not that Iran could NOT make an Atomic Bomb. If India, Pakistan, China, Russia, France, England, United States of America and perhaps South Africa, North Korea and Israel can make Atomic Bombs then anybody can given enough time and money.

I sure would like to see the 'How to' plans Iran has. Maybe I could make my very own Atomic Bomb.

Oh I am so scart.

180

[kevsand]

23. "as part of other black market purchases."

Honest, officer, I didn't ask for the heroin. They just put it in with my pot...

[txaslftist]

24. Would that be the document the Iranians voluntarily turned over?

Why yes, it would.

The part left out of the article tells quite a bit about the spin in the source, don't it?

[Javaman]

25. The real finesse' in making an A-Bomb is the explosive lenses...

The principle for making one has been around for years. This isn't like it just dropped out of the sky. (pardon the pun)
Making one from scratch like we did back in the 1940's requires a huge investment.
However, since Iran already has the nuke technology, it's the assembling and detonating part that is hard.
Most if not all nations that try to steal these types of secrets want the design, not the how to. And that design is to make the proper explosive lenses in order to properly implode the bomb in order to cause the atomic chain reaction.

Now a hydrogen bomb is an entirely different story. If they were in the business of making one of those, I would be worried.

[oneighty]

33. Iran is

said to be enriching uranium which in turn suggests a 'gun type'device a much simpler design than the implosion type device and does not require the shaped charge (lens) to create the super-critical mass necessary for fission. A crude gun type bomb would not be feasible for a missile warhead. Perhaps a large truck could deliver it to the target.

180

[Javaman]

42. Wow, didn't know that.

Yes, a gun type of detonation would be far easier to achieve.

But with a gun type, it would still need a fairly potent form of propellant to incite the chain reaction, wouldn't it?

[oneighty]

44. Gun powder would do.

The gun type is very crude and unless highly enriched uranium is available are very large and heavy.

Google uranium bomb and plutonium bomb. Weapons information, pictures and schematics are readily available on the internet for all to see.

180

[daleo]

31. We would need to see this document to judge it

It may be something widely available over the internet for all we know:

"In the brief report obtained Tuesday, however, the agency said bluntly that the 15-page document showing how to cast fissile uranium into metal was "related to the fabrication of nuclear weapon components.""First mention of the documents was made late last year in a longer IAEA report. At that time, the agency said only that the papers showed how to cast "enriched, natural and depleted uranium metal into hemispherical forms."

The agency refused to make a judgment on what possible uses such casts would have. But diplomats familiar with the probe into Iran's nuclear program said then that the papers apparently were instructions on how to mold highly enriched grade uranium into the core of warheads."

A surprising amount of this sort of thing is in the public domain. I don't see how a 15 page report could be all that helpful for such a technically complex project. This isn't a bowling ball we are talking about.

[NativeTexan]

32. Actually, I ALWAYS believed that IRAN was the.....

....REAL threat!! They just weren't on Bush's priority list. I don't believe in pre-emptive war, but hell if you are GONNA have one, it should be at someone who really IS a threat!!! Don't ya think?

[daleo]

37. It sounds like German reasoning in 1941

Come to think of it, Poland isn't the real threat. Now, the Soviet Union, that's another story...

[NativeTexan]

46. Just the opposite...I think....

....Poland was a LIE. The Soviet Union WAS a threat to Germany. Hitler used the Polish lie to START World War II.

[daleo]

50. The Soviet Union wasn't necessarily a threat to Germany

Hitler launched the attack on Russia. It is doubtful that the Soviet Union would have attacked Germany, on the other hand, particularly given the strength of the German military. In that sense the situation is analogous with U.S. vs Iran.

[NativeTexan]

52. True, but....

....Germany, at the time, was being pulled apart....the choices turned out to be Communism or National Socialism (Nazi). Hitler had them afraid of Communism because of the huge presence of the Soviet Union to the east. Poland was accused of attacking a German radio station, when in fact it was staged by the Nazi's, using dead jews in German uniforms. Hell, even HITLER knew that he needed an excuse to go to war. His lies were MUCH harder to prove than Bush's.

[doublethink]

38. NO. The problem is I think .... you and quite a few other ....

Knee-Jerk ... simplistic minded rational types really DON'T understand the consequences of your actions! Yea lets just come out full barrels blasting away! That'll solve it! Don't ya think? :sarcasm: Holly shit man, I will bet you right here and right now ... an attack on Iran will really put the forces of WW3 in high gear. Pakistan already has NUKES and their population overwhelmingly will be SO pissed off at another pre-emptive attack on another Sovereign Middle Eastern nation ... dude get your finger off the trigger and put the gun down. Don't even look at Iran, study the other nations in that area, get a clue first on their neighbors before busting into their house first. Hey maybe if we talk to them .... ? Otherwise get ready to Enlist yourself down the line. Peace and all the best. :)

[NativeTexan]

47. Thanks for the name calling but....

....that isn't correct. Within the so-called "Axis of Evil" (Iraq, Iran, and North Korea), the LAST two, if there was any, were the actual threats. Pre-emptive war is NOT the American way at all! We should NEVER attack when not provoked...NEVER. I was just pointing out that his imaginative "axis" (a FEAR term with remembrances of Nazi's) the one that he ATTACKED was NOT a threat AT ALL!!

Iran can be a problem, but NOT for the U.S.!! It is a REGIONAL problem! Like Democracy is a WESTERN society feature. It is NOT a good working model for Islamist countries still living in the middle ages.

Next time read the ENTIRE post. "I am not in favor of pre-emptive war" was the pre-condition to the rest of the statement. It was ALL SARCASTIC toward the Bush Fascist Party....geez...talk about shooting from the HIP.....

[thinkingwoman]

48. The reason Iraq had to come first

was because it was the harder sell, the bigger lie. So Bush took us in wrapped in fear and on the heels of an apparent victory in Afghanistan.

The problem with Iran is that it is NOT Iraq. Iran is dirty. There are reasons to oppose them. But like you, I stand firmly AGAINST preemptive war.

That being said, didn't the IAEA contradict Bush on Iraq? I seem to remember one of their reports saying no WMDs when Bushco was ramping up to war. Please, anybody, correct me if I'm wrong on this.

[daleo]

51. Iran is dirty?

The country contains soil? The people don't wash? That statement needs clarification.

[thinkingwoman]

53. Sorry...here's what I meant

Iran is doing some of the stuff they are being accused of, as opposed to Iraq not having the WMD that Bushco claimed they had.

Sorry about the shorthand. I should have been more clear.

[daleo]

54. Thanks for the clarification

That makes a lot more sense.

On edit - I mean that the statement is a now a debatable point upon which reasonable people can agree or disagree.

[thinkingwoman]

56. You're welcome. nt

:hi:

[daleo]

61. Likewise. n/t

:hi:

[rooboy]

45. Pakistan created the Taliban. Pakistan has the bomb.

A.Q. Khan was selling nuclear secrets to the North Koreans and Iranians, yet the Pakistani authorities refuse to jail him. And many muslims will tell you that fundamentalist Islam is more virulent in Pakistan than in Iran.

Pakistan is the real threat.

[zbdent]

34. High comedy

Watch the freepturds fall all over themselves pointing out that the UN now says that Iran is dangerous.

So - now the freepturds/Repukes will believe the UN?

[mac56]

49. That's brilliant! That's our response to the wingnuts:

"So....since when do you believe what the UN has to say?"

[USA_1]

39. Iran is not so convinced ...

... meantime it has detained 50 suspects in what is undoubtedly a British and USA created bombing attack in Ahvaz, Iran:

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/wire/sns-ap-iran-bombing-arrests,1,38381.story?coll=sns-ap-world-headlines

2:52 AM PST, January 30, 2006
www.latimes.com
Iran Detains 50 Suspects in Two Bombings
By NASSER KARIMI, Associated Press Writer

TEHRAN, Iran -- Iran has detained dozens of suspects in two bombings that killed at least nine people in a southwestern city last week, attacks Iran blamed on the United States and Britain, state media reported Monday.

The blasts Tuesday in Ahvaz, capital of oil-rich Khuzestan province on the border with Iraq, also wounded 46. Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was to have visited the city on that day but canceled for unknown reasons.

Abdolrahim Fazilatpour, deputy governor of Ahvaz, said about 50 suspects had been detained in the bombings, according to the official Islamic Republic News. He said different groups had claimed responsibly for the attacks but did not elaborate.

Last week, a Web site representing several Arab independence movements focused on the Ahvaz region carried a claim of responsibility in the name of the Arab Struggle Movement for the Liberation of Ahvaz. The group called the attack "revenge for the blood of our martyrs and (to signal) our rejection to the terrorist Ahmadinejad's defiling the land of Ahvaz in his visit."

Arabs make up less than 3 percent of Iran's population, and most live in Khuzestan. Tuesday's attacks were the latest in a spate of violence in the region the government has blamed on Iranian Arab extremists who were allegedly trained abroad and maintained ties to foreign governments.

While Iran has accused the United States and Britain of having a hand in the latest bombings, it has provided no evidence, saying only that the case was under investigation. Britain has about 8,000 troops based just across the border in southern Iraq as part of the U.S.-led force in Iraq.

Government spokesman Gholamhossein Elham said Monday the bombings were designed to make Iran look unstable. "The (real) enemies are those occupiers who have set themselves up in Iraq, particularly Britain," he said.

Iran also blamed Britain for two blasts at an Ahvaz shopping mall that killed six people and wounded dozens in October. After a June bombing in the region that killed eight people, the government blamed Arab extremists with ties to foreign governments, including British intelligence.

Britain has denied any connection to the Khuzestan unrest.

Tensions between the two countries have flared recently over Britain's opposition to Iran's resumption of nuclear activities. The United States and its European allies suspect Iran wants to produce nuclear weapons, and Britain supports moves to refer Iran to the U.N. Security Council, which has the power to impose economic and political sanctions. Iran says its nuclear program is for generating electricity.

Britain also has accused Tehran of allowing Iraqi insurgents to receive explosives technology that has been used to attack British soldiers. Iran denies those allegations.

[USA_1]

40. Ahvaz bombing pictures

http://images.google.com/images?q=Ahvaz%2C%20Iran%20bombing&hl=en&hs=SN5&lr=&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official_s&sa=N&tab=wi


http://tinyurl.com/adpoj


The US/UK terrorism campaign in Iran is in full swing. War is surely to follow unless this imperialism is stopped.

[Not_So_Right_Wing]

55. more propaganda to rally the masses.

didn't we do this already in 2002-2003...?

[raccoon]

57. Hey, you reckon Powell is going to go to the UN and tell us

all about this? :sarcasm:

[Tight_rope]

58. Fuck...Let them make their bomb...hell we got one...what's the big deal!