Bush administration moves to sell national forest land

[Roland99]

http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/13833486.htm

WASHINGTON - The Bush administration will unveil a proposal Friday to sell up to 200,000 acres of national forest land in "isolated parcels" ranging from a quarter of an acre to 200 acres, much of it in California.

The sale is part of a National Forest Service plan to raise $800 million over the next five years to pay for rural schools in 41 states, offsetting shrinking revenues from sale of timber from national forests. The Bureau of Land Management also plans to sell federal lands to raise an estimated $182 million over five years.

Environmentalists charge that the short-term gain would be more than offset by the loss of public land. Congress would have to approve the land sales, but it has rejected similar recent proposals.

"I am outraged, and I don't think the public is going to stand for it for one minute," said Wilderness Society policy analyst Mike Anderson. "It's a scheme to raise money at the expense of the national forests, the wildlife, recreation and all the other values that Americans hold dear. It's the ultimate threat to the national forest."

What the hell??? Sell off 200,000 acres to garner a mere $800 million??? How about dropping some of those tax cuts for rich? Freakin' BASTARDS in the White House!!!

[ThomCat]

1. Who wants to bet that there are valuable minerals

under those "isolated parcels" of land?

The bastard! :grr:

[The Backlash Cometh]

29. I wouldn't be surprised if Cheney was first in line to buy up property

which has already been surveyed by the government for valuable minerals.

This is outrageous!

[Sequoia]

36. Pombo says..."He'll have to get around me first!"

God, where is that lightning bolt!!!

[wordpix2]

71. All of BushCo will buy up the land---at $4000/ac., they can buy it all

[WinkyDink]

77. Why are you guys talking about "buying"? Bushco TAKES, baby!

Ain't no money coming outta their pockets!

[enough]

2. "Outraged" is right.

What an evil idea. Sell something irreplaceable in order to generate transient revenue. Maybe we could pay for the Iraq war by selling it ALL off.

[Skink]

4. Let's start with the ranch..

already been cleared for drilling.

[Roland99]

20. Works for me.

[freedomworks]

23. ...uh... that's what all the western states do...

yea, there's probably someone going to profit by this, but...

every western state has raw land in trust to sell parcels off so they can fund education.

None of the Eastern states were required to do that.

Lot's worse things to blow a cork over... like cartoons and stuff... ;)

[lumberjack_jeff]

65. Not Washington

Washington has timber land in trust for schools. The schools receive funding from the timber which is harvested. I don't think Washington sells any significant land holdings.

A big sell-off of public land is a very bad thing, our kids and grandkids will not be able to afford to buy it back.

[glitch]

3. Not hard to see why - the demarcation line between private land

(aka clear cut) and national forest is quite dramatic. You just now it burns the leeches up just to see those trees still standing.

[anotherdrew]

5. naked give away of the nations property to private interests

the price tag should be much higher if these properties are to be sold at all, which they should not be.

Bush is going to get his head handed to him over this, this plan is a total non-starter.

[wordpix2]

73. remember, now eminent domain means taking property for private development

according to SCOTUS, that is just fine

[anotherdrew]

6. whatever happened to the "National Tree Farm" system?

tree farms on unproductive farm land would have prevented this whole matter.

[humus]

66. core of stewards

"tree farms on unproductive farm land would have prevented this whole matter".

People on unproductive farm land (which in turn would become productive and sustainable farm land)
would prevent and solve a lot of matters.


If God is truly just I tremble for the fate of my country - Thomas Jefferson

[cybildisobedience]

7. how about not building detention centers?

There's $385 million right there...

[Thor_MN]

54. Save ?M$ by * not flying around the country defending his inane policies

What is the cost to tax payers to have dumbass flying from city to city, speaking to hand picked audiences to defend the crap that he spouts?

Note to dumbshit: those audiences couldn't care if you pulled down your pants and danced a jig, they have no brains and adore you. If you want to try to defend your policies, you need to talk to real people, you know, the ones that think you are a shithead.

[Tyler Durden]

8. IT'S NOT FUCKING HIS TO SELL.

FascistAsshole
FascistAsshole
FascistAsshole
FascistAsshole
FascistAsshole
FascistAsshole
FascistAsshole
FascistAsshole
INFINITY

[wordpix2]

70. thank you for voicing my thoughts, exactly

[JPZenger]

9. Most Agencies Trade Land, Don't Sell It

Most similar agencies do not allow outright sales of their land. Instead, they trade it. They trade isolated and scattered pieces of land if a private owner gets control of another piece of land they want. Typically, the land that is received in trade must have more value to the public (and usually more acreage) than the land that is given up.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

10. "...much of it in California."

Of course. Just another "fuck you" to blue Cali and the people of the US from the Bush criminals.

Just when I think I can't possibly hate that man anymore...

A slow, painful death from ass cancer is too good for that son of a bitch. :mad:

[shanti]

19. exactly!! he's trying to f*ck with us again!!

:grr: :mad: impeach the bastard!

[Sequoia]

37. Let's just cut off our state and float to Tahiti.

[thecrow]

28. Shouldn't the money go to CA then, instead of 41 states? n/t

[phoebe]

55. that massive fire in S. Cal was result of another "controlled burn"

I wondered how long it would take for * to jump in there with some new ownership ideas.. hours by the looks of things.. It looks like a pattern - controlled burn goes awry, * steps in again..

[CountAllVotes]

11. I wonder HOW MUCH OF IT IS OLD GROWTH REDWOOD!?

:grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr:

:kick: !!!!

[Hell Hath No Fury]

12. Or coastal tracts...

that could bring huge $$$ for some nice GOP-related developer????

[Divine Discontent]

14. exactly...

there's NO other reason for their requests other than to make someone hundreds of millions from it.

everything they do has a profit value in some way...

American workers are suffering troubling setbacks, and the cronies of the Republican party continue to attack not only our barely bearable standard of living that we had just 10 years ago, but our environment. Most everyone I KNOW, a hundred people, are hurting worse since Bush got in.

[VegasWolf]

13. Leave no tree behind!

:sarcasm:

[henslee]

15. Selling off Nat'l Park land? Bush is the enemy.

[stepnw1f]

16. Hostile Corporate Take-Over of Our Country

The robber barons are sucking us dry.

[wordpix2]

74. good way to put it

[donkeyotay]

17. Pombo. Abramoff.

Bush is just paying off more of the fine people who helped him into office so he could bankrupt the American people. I'll bet dollars to donuts that no matter much the disaster stinks to high heavens, there will be a plausible story as to why Merca is going to vote GOP again in 2006... something about keeping us safe or not criticizing the CIC while we're at war with Iraq, Syria, Turkey, Georgia, Russia... the Looong War.

[Roland99]

21. Look at what's going on in San Diego. It's the raping of our nation.

to the profiteering of the Greedy Ol' Party.

[Sequoia]

38. What is going on down there?

[Roland99]

40. Start with this and then do some Googling for Ron Nehring

http://rawstory.com/news/2005/K_Street_pushes_charter_school_plan_0125.html

[Sequoia]

45. Thank you.

[Roland99]

48. You're welcome. It's the Norquist camp's "dreams" coming to fruition.

[anitar1]

75. And Norquist and Company are going to be gathering

signatures for 2 petitions for the Oregon ballot this year. Completely funded by D.C. think tanks and other RW people. Not an Oregonian in the bunch. They can't wait to rape Oregon.I read about this in a AFL-CIO newsletter recently.They want to put a cap on state spending for schools, among other things.I've alerted everyone I know in the state, hoping they will pass it on.

[twaddler01]

18. LAME!

ARgh :mad:

[phusion]

22. We spend $100,000 per minute in IRAQ

By my calculations, we could "raise" that $800 million in a little over 5 days.

[Roland99]

24. And what are the odds that $800 million will go to schools in 41 states?

[Lorien]

53. NIL from every experience we've had with these f*ckers

there's no reason to do this at all. Get out of Iraq, make the uber rich pay their fair share, and everything will be covered. This is another kickback scheme for wealthy developers and other BushCo financiers.

:grr:

[bluerum]

25. They have been selling us out since day one. This is just a more

tangible example of the selling of America.

[fooj]

26. Fuck him. Bring it on, dickhead. Bring it on.

I'm sick of his shit. The man has broken the law. Arrest him. Now.

Peace.

[The Backlash Cometh]

27. Okay, where do we sign up for the revolution?

Our country is under attack.

[Roland99]

30. Anywhere and everywhere. We'll let Steve Earle lead us in song....

I was walkin’ down the street
In the town where I was born
I was movin’ to a beat
That I’d never felt before
So I opened up my eyes
And I took a look around
I saw it written ‘cross the sky
The revolution starts now
Yeah, the revolution starts now

The revolution starts now
When you rise above your fear
And tear the walls around you down
The revolution starts here
Where you work and where you play
Where you lay your money down
What you do and what you say
The revolution starts now
Yeah the revolution starts now

Yeah the revolution starts now
In your own backyard
In your own hometown
So what you doin’ standin’ around?
Just follow your heart
The revolution starts now

Last night I had a dream
That the world had turned around
And all our hopes had come to be
And the people gathered ‘round
They all brought what they could bring
And nobody went without
And I learned a song to sing
The revolution starts now

[katty]

50. from within&for sometime now-the PTB's are wondering...gee

how long do you think we can keep this up without any real rioting in the streets?! wow, the 60's look like WW3 in American compared to now-such a deal!

[Joey Liberal]

31. It's Bush's war against America n.t

[katty]

32. here is CA, good luck...liberals have the upper hand and the $$$

[SillyGoose]

33. If we need the money so badly to build schools in rural areas, then

can the tax cuts for the rich or the tax breaks for mega-corporations! OMG...instead he wants to sell off national forests to build schools. No doubt this move will benefit some corporate interest somewhere. With this SOB you only need to follow the money trail...there ALWAYS is a money trail with this slimeball. My head is exploding.

[katty]

46. they'd never do that-rather sell off American land to the

highest bidder-the definition of bush&cronies presidency is rape and pillage 24/7.

[savemefromdumbya]

34. Bush and cheney are a danger to the planet

they don't care about global warming, pollution. They want to drill for oil in your backyard. He had the audacity to say that WE are thirsty for oil?

[rodeodance]

35. NO. STOP

[Robb]

39. Here's the list:

http://www.fs.fed.us/land/staff/spd.html

85K acres in California, 20K in my beloved Colorado.

[Roland99]

41. Damn, >4,500 acres in the Daniel Boone National Forest

Won't be for retail development.

$20 bucks says coal or other natural resources are under the top soil supporting those trees.

[Megahurtz]

44. I wonder if Bohemian Grove

is part of that 85?:sarcasm:

[katty]

47. Never

[GoddessOfGuinness]

49. Ouachita in Arkansas...

I wonder how many Ivory Billed Woodpeckers are there?

This list is huge...I feel sick...

[Number_6]

42. Perpetuity

There is a category of land protected *from our Government* and
from robber barons by Theodore Roosevelt, via something he
enacted to prevent the plunder of these lands not for a year,
not for 100 years, but forever. Do these national forests
qualify? If so, is Bushco scrapping that federal forest
protection along with the Constitution?

[Raster]

43. It's time to make corporations and the wealthiest 5% of citizens

pay their FAIR share, which they don't in any shape, form or fashion. This is but another attempt to shift the cost of government to the least available to afford it. The public lands belong to all of us and should not be sold to enrich a few.

You know, you're always hearing what a great guy Warren Buffet is. Why the hell don't some of these filthy fucking rich "great guys" stand up and do the right thing? Why is it that they may disagree with these robber baron policies, but they still take the fucking money and cry crocodile tears all the way to the bank. We are being shafted. And by "we" I mean the 80% of us that pay for this country and get 5% of the benefits. It's time to reinstate progressive income taxes on the wealthy. And it's HIGH-FUCKING-TIME that the corporate leeches pay their fair share. If class warfare is what is takes, sign me up!

[fasttense]

51. If the bush* regime thinks selling America to the robber barons is a good

Why don't they sell the White House and the capitol. They are only being used to house a bunch of crooks anyway.

[madmark]

52. these guys will continue to explore every avenue of maladministration

they are capable of imagining.

[IDemo]

56. A former Idaho Governor (Democrat) and Interior Secretary under Carter :

When the idea was first raised to sell off public lands to cover the costs of Katrina:

http://www.idaho-democrats.org/ht/display/ArticleDetails/i/720080

Cecil Andrus: Selling off our public lands is wrong
Tuesday, December 27, 2005

Selling off our public federal lands to pay for the damage of Hurricane Katrina is like selling your backyard to cover the costs of a fire in your garage. It doesn’t make sense.

Yet, there are some in Washington, D.C., who are pushing a plan to sell off 15 percent of all the lands held by the Forest Service, the Bureau of Land Management and other Interior Department agencies. States like Idaho with a lot of federal acres would be first on the chopping block.

Idaho has about 33 million acres of federal public lands. Selling of 15 percent of those would equal more than 5 million acres. That’s more than the entire Boise and Sawtooth National Forests combined. And the 15-percent limit doesn’t necessarily apply to a state-by-state approach – there’s no limit in the proposed legislation to how much could be sold in any one state.

Here in Idaho, our public land is our working capital. We use our natural resources, such as timber and grazing, and we enjoy the recreation that comes with them, such as hunting, fishing, camping and hiking.

Yet, our public lands are more than the sum of its parts. Over the years of my life, as I have driven and flown around this beautiful state, I’ve seen the prettiest blue waterfalls, the most stunning high desert cliffs, the most breathtaking forests. But just as much as the scenery, I love the fact that it belongs to all of us. None of us owns it, yet we all share it. That’s one of the most central concepts of being an Idahoan – it’s what makes us who we are.

I can’t imagine why anyone from Idaho would want to auction off this irreplaceable treasure. I know that Jerry Brady, Democratic candidate for governor, has stepped up to defend Idaho’s public lands, and I commend him for it.

Once we sell off this land, it’s gone. The old Will Rogers adage is true: “They ain’t makin’ it no more.”

Sure, you can horse-trade for a few acres here and there. We did some of that when I was Secretary of the Interior under President Carter. But in all my years managing the Interior Department, our goal was always to make public land more open and accessible to the people; not sell it to the highest bidder so private landowners can put up fences, like they’ve done in Texas.

I’m sure some people will say that Idaho has plenty of public land, so we can afford to sell off some of it and still have plenty. But selling land isn’t the same as selling potatoes, microchips or some other commodity. Rural land can be bought strategically, so that purchasing 100 acres can effectively close off 1,000 acres or more, depending on road access. This kind of buying allows one private citizen to make a minimal investment but still locks out huge tracts to everyone who doesn’t own a helicopter.

Also, in the current political atmosphere, there’s a strong potential for dishonesty. It seems like every day, more headlines are coming out of Washington, D.C. about politicians corrupted by greed. What do you think would happen if the entire West were opened up to land speculators? Who do you think would be the winners and who will be the losers?

I’ll tell you who. It will be the high-dollar campaign contributors and the big-time power brokers who will own the best and most valuable lands. The hunters, fishermen, campers and other recreationists will be left out, but they won’t be the only losers. It will also be the family rancher, the small-town outfitter, the restaurant owners and hotel operators and all their employees.

Idaho and the West are not for sale to the highest bidder. Our heritage, our culture and our future depend on keeping this irreplaceable resource open for all.

Cecil D. Andrus,

Former Idaho Governor

[Democat]

57. Democrats need to get the NRA to help fight this, Bush is hurting hunters

The best way to derail this would be to get the NRA to fight against it.

[lovuian]

58. He's raping and pillaging America and the Congress is

letting him do it!!!

Americans are not going to stand for it!!!

[Hissyspit]

59. Friday news dump.

These people have no shame.

[antonialee839]

60. The little maggot would sell the White House again if he could.

[Name removed]

61. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Moderator]

62. Kick

[fed-up]

63. Ridge (fire) lookout land (CA) on sale list-(Bush Nat Forest sell-off)

there is a small map at the story

http://www.chicoer.com/newshome/ci_3497664

Article Launched: 02/11/2006 12:00:00 AM
Ridge lookout land on sale list
By STEVE SCHOONOVER - City Editor

"Interested in buying Sawmill Peak? Well, if the Bush administration's proposal to sell off national forest land goes through, you might get the chance.

The peak that's home to the fire lookout watching over Paradise and Magalia is among properties on the list of potential sale candidates released Friday in Washington, D.C.

...

All told, as much as 309,000 acres of national forest could be sold under the proposal, including 85,465 acres in California, far more than any other state. Next closest is Idaho, with 26,194 acres proposed for the block.

More than 41 percent of the sales in California would come from our two local forests, the Plumas and the Lassen."

[alfredo]

64. Some of our forest land is being sold because timber sales have

dropped due to over harvesting. The strip mining industry will probably buy it and scrape it clean.

(Daniel Boone National Forest- Ky)

[sellitman]

67. This bastard never stops

If there is a way to screw up this world and more than it already is these evil bastards will find a way.

BASTARDS!!!

[wordpix2]

68. * pays for irresponsible looting of Treasury by stealing our national land

just as I thought.

We need to STOP THIS THEFT OF OUR LAND!

[wordpix2]

69. this * theft of our land will bring a paltry $4,000 per acre, selling our

natural history, heritage and wildlife for a song

[earth mom]

72. This has me spitting and hopping mad.

I don't dare post another word or they will surely come and get me! :grr:

[sakabatou]

76. Just think of privatised companies doing highways

It's the same thing.

[Nothing Without Hope]

78. ***COMBINE THIS WITH THE $7 BILLION royalty giveaway to BIG OIL

and the scale and true expense to the taxpayer of this outrage becomes clear:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2106894
thread title (2-13-06 LBN): U.S. Royalty Plan to Give Windfall to Oil Companies
Comment/excerpt: NY Times. Excerpt: “The federal government is on the verge of one of the biggest giveaways of oil and gas in American history, worth an estimated $7 billion over five years. New projections, buried in the Interior Department's just-published budget plan, anticipate that the government will let companies pump about $65 billion worth of oil and natural gas from federal territory over the next five years without paying any royalties to the government.”

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x415385
thread title (2-14-06 GD): Get ready to be really pissed off......
Comment/excerpt: Cites Yahoo News article for gas/oil royalty giveaway. The poster comments: “The White House is going to waive $ 7 billion in oil and gas royalties that were extracted from public land. No big surprise, right? Well ,they are advocating *right now* the sell-off of our public lands because they are "out of money". The public land sell off would earn 1 billion$ , which the White House says they "desperately" need. Here's the kicker - this oil and gas that was extraqcted (and to be royalty free) came from the SAME NATIONAL FOREST AND BLM lands they now want to sell off to make money!!!! HUH??????”

[november3rd]

79. Another Example of Terror

This is a form of terror that doesn't make it into the news--crimes against the American people and the environment. This latest land "privatization" scheme of the Bush Administration sounds like another corporate giveaway to Bush's and Gale Norton's cronies. How much of the money is going to wind up in Tom Delay's and Jack Abramoff's legal defense funds, once the shell game is over?

The blitz of catastrophic news is so forceful right now, and Congress's oversight function is so inert, that this action compares with the intimidation and humiliation of uncharged innocent prisoners at Guantanamo.

In the end, we are responsible for letting our government get away with this horseshit. If our representatives aren't doing the job then we have to take direct action and either light a fire under their ass, or work around the Congressional bottleneck. But we cannot take another 2-1/2 years of this!

"Ukraine" BushCo!!!!!!!!!!!!

[zann725]

80. As if Global Warming wasn't happening fast enough? Sell Nat'l Forests?!

Words don't describe these people...their lack of conscience...or lack of love for natural beauty (forests) and resources. Just worship for the all-mighty dollar.

God save us! (And I'm not even religious.)