EPA OK'd plan to dump nerve agent into Delaware

[UpInArms]

http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/111-02262006-618484.html

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency won't oppose the U.S. Department of Defense and DuPont Co.'s plan to dump a wastewater byproduct of a deadly nerve agent into the Delaware River.

The agency said it's assured of a safe treatment for up to 4 million gallons of caustic wastewater created in the treatment for VX, a chemical weapon with a pinhead-size potency to kill a human. DuPont is treating VX for disposal at its Newport Chemical Depot in Indiana.

The agent, once neutralized, would be shipped to DuPont's Chambers Works plant in Deepwater, N.J., for discharge into the river.

"EPA believes that all of our previously identified ecological concerns have been resolved," said Walter Mugdan, director of the agency's Environmental Planning and Protection division in New York, in a letter released Friday to CNN and obtained by The News Journal in Wilmington, Del.

The agency's position angers opponents of the disposal plan. They're concerned the wastewater would harm the Delaware, which supplies drinking water to millions. Furthermore, opponents say the EPA's opinion is premature and raises more questions about the wastewater's effects on river health.

...more...

Aren't you glad that we have an "Environmental Protection Agency" that takes care of the environment? :sarcasm:

(on edit: fixed headline)

[zanne]

1. More news that's so hard to believe...

This news is so crazy, you might as well say we're turning over management of 21 of our ports to the UAE. It's just ridiculous.

[rodeodance]

7. dumping to a river?--is that the only alternative (or least expensive)

[Canuckistanian]

26. C'mon, be reasonable here

That's just ludicrous.

[sattahipdeep]

2. Seven sites in the United States

...The Newport plant, the only place VX was manufactured

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050510/NEWS01/505100420

...The United States is under an international agreement to destroy its chemical weapons
stockpile by 2007, although a five-year extension probably will be sought.

...Chemical weapons, including in VX-loaded weapons, still are stored at seven
sites in the United States.

:hi:

[Whoa_Nelly]

23. Wonder where the seven sites are... n/t

[Kagemusha]

3. Uhhhh... wastewater byproduct does not = the original nerve agent

That headline is just dead wrong, which is not criticizing the poster. I know the LBN rules. I'm just saying, it's dead wrong and has no basis in the reporting.

[wordpix2]

10. what does waterwater byproduct contain? I wouldn't trust it in my river

[Kagemusha]

12. Hey, if I was a chemist I'd tell you

Take acids. When you neutralize an acid with something that's a base (think vinegar), you create salts. Not table salts, but other kinds of salts. A salt is a zero Ph value chemical compound that's neither acidic or basic. So while I have absolutely no idea what specific by-product is created here, the difference between a deadly nerve gas and a flavor of salt is, chemically speaking, VERY massive. It's like the difference between carbon dioxide and carbon monoxide. It's just one atom's difference, but the consequences to exposure are massively different as a result.

But knowledge isn't politically convenient.

Edit: The article does say that what they wanna dump is caustic, which I think is heavily to the base side of the Ph scale. So basically it's real bad stuff if it falls on you as an individual. In a river it'll get diluted and react with stuff in the water that will fully neutralize it. This isn't VX, though. And that's plain from actually reading the damn entry...

[Canuckistanian]

27. The question is

What exactly is the compound and what is meant by "neutralized"? And how complete was this "neutralization"?

Even if there are zero traces of actual VX, there might be other harmful components.

[phylny]

18. You'd be surprised what it contains (and what it doesn't contain).

My husband works for a large, large corporation, and in his career, he's often had to (legally) discharge wastewater into rivers or the Great Lakes. The water he discharged was (had to be!) cleaner than the body of water he discharged into.

In fact, today he told of a time when the wastewater he was discharging had too *little* fluoride (didn't match the fluoride found in the body of water) and that they had to go out and buy a bottle of fluoride to add it to the discharge so that it was legal.

He's worked in many states, and to be honest, the EPA is tough and unrelenting, in his experience.

YMMV.

[Solon]

24. You should see what paper mills do...

their wastewater is anything but clean, and the chemicals they dump into rivers and streams will make you tear up and have allergic reactions from a mile or more away from said river or stream. You see white foam float down, etc. etc. Then again, where I live, you swim in the rivers and you can get a host of diseases, part of the rivers, especially the Missouri, has a bunch of Meat Packing plants and other things, and they dump the leftovers straight into the river, the smell alone will make your head swim, thankfully that is quite contained, but I wouldn't recommend eating the fish out of the river, that much is certain.

[Kagemusha]

30. The article's clear the stuff's not neurotoxins (anymore), that's all.

I really do wish I knew what the hell was in it, or that someone who does know would explain it to the public. But it's not VX. (anymore)

[phylny]

31. Perhaps the petroleum industry has different standards.

My husband's grandmother lived near a paper mill in southern Virginia. My goodness, the air in the town just reeked. I couldn't imagine how anyone could live there.

[wordpix2]

38. I used to live in a pulp mill town & the smell's enough to knock you over

but "there's nothing emitted that can hurt you." Yeah, right.

[ramapodem]

4. Well...

The Delaware River has enough pollutants at least by where i live. Won't make much a difference to the river. :sarcasm:

[Judi Lynn]

5. UpInArms, the link has disappeared. I found another article on the same

story which may be helpful. Thanks for the original post, by the way:

EPA Drops Objections to Wastewater Plan
By Associated Press
11:33 AM PST,February 25 2006


DOVER, Del. -- Citing new safety assurances, the Environmental Protection Agency has dropped objections to a plan to treat chemical weapon wastewater at a DuPont Co. plant and discharge it into the Delaware River.

DuPont has been seeking a lucrative Army contract to treat 2 million to 4 million gallons of chemicals left over from a disposal operation in Newport, Ind.

Delaware and New Jersey opposed an earlier version of the plan. Officials feared that traces of VX nerve agent, other toxic byproducts and basic pollutants would reach the river even after treatment at a DuPont plant in New Jersey, across the river from Wilmington. A pinhead-size droplet of VX can quickly kill an adult.
(snip)

"I'm skeptical in the sense that I need to review the evidence, and I think my staff has the same attitude," John A. Hughes, secretary of Delaware's Department of Natural Resources and Environmental Control, said late Friday.

New Jersey Gov. Jon S. Corzine also remains concerned, said spokesman Brendan Gilfillan.
(snip/...)

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/politics/wire/sns-ap-nerve-agent,1,3310663.story?coll=sns-ap-politics-headlines

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Nerve gas plan revived

Sunday, February 26, 2006

By JEFF MONTGOMERY
Gannett News Service

WILMINGTON, Del.
The Environmental Protection Agency has dropped its objections to a plan to treat and dispose of chemical weapon wastewater at a DuPont Co. plant along the Delaware River.

The agency cited changes to the treatment scheme and new safety assurances. Based on the new information, the "EPA believes that all of our previously identified ecological concerns have been resolved," said Walter Mugdan, director of the EPA's Environmental Planning and Protection division in New York.

DuPont wants a lucrative Army contract to treat 2 million to 4 million gallons of a caustic chemical soup left over from an operating VX nerve agent disposal operation in Newport, Ind. VX is a deadly military nerve agent.

Delaware and New Jersey opposed an earlier version of the treatment and disposal plan. Officials in both states pointed to concerns that traces of VX, other toxic byproducts and basic pollutants would reach the river even after treatment in DuPont's wastewater operation at its Chambers Works plant in Deepwater, Salem County.
(snip/)

http://www.courierpostonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060226/NEWS01/602260398/1006

[zann725]

6. I'd ask where Biden's "voice" was in all this, but....

n/t

[Betsy Ross]

8. I know a ranch in Texas that could use some water...n/t

[madmark]

9. who is making these fucked up decisions

[goforit]

11. Every Dem state will get the shaft.

[nicknameless]

13. Off to Greatest.

[CONN]

14. EPA only BELIEVES all previously identified ecological concerns fixed

And note that death from inhalation or exposure to VX on the skin can occur within minutes.

Hey, if it's in Indiana why not dump it in Lake Michigan if it's so safe? Why ship it all the way to Delaware to dump in the river a few miles from the Atlantic.

Heck, if it's so safe why not bottle it and give it to EPA staffers to drink.

[wordpix2]

39. of course, EPA now top heavy with Bushbots

[salin]

44. and the simply ignore scientific evidence offered by anyone not

towing the bushbot line.

[Pavulon]

15. The News just gets dumber

They never say what they are dumping. It would help the reader to know if they are dumping some nasty OP or some phosphate.

[jhain]

16. been following this

MANY MAny people oppossed.
Trucking it from INDIANA to NJ!?

WHYYYYYY??????????????

How would you like to end up in a traffic accident with that truck??

[Pavulon]

17. Are they

shipping VX or other chemicals? The article does not say what they are shipping. BTW there are millions of gallons of very nasty chemicals moved by rail and truck every year.

It sounds like a byproduct of a breakdown of vx into other chemicals.

[IronLionZion]

22. you don't transport 4 million gallons by truck nt

[Solon]

25. And transporting Nuclear waste by railway is also stupid...

I have 3 tracks near me where said nuclear waste will be transported though on the way to NV.

[Canuckistanian]

19. News Flash: "EPA name change - Proposal to Change Name to'EA'"

"Why the Hell not?", responded an anonymous mid-level staffer, "It's not like we actually have any duties around here other than to put out press releases".

[wordpix2]

40. DU contest: rename EPA. "Environmental Pollution Agency." Any others?

[jsamuel]

20. Don't SH*T where you eat...

[IronLionZion]

21. The article doesn't jive with the headline

They're not dumping a nerve agent.

1. It's a wastewater byproduct
2. It's been treated in Indiana before going to NJ
3. The Delaware river is a big ass river and has much worse already in it. I would NOT swim in it.
4. Bush's EPA doesn't protect the environment, but they won't allow nerve agents into our rivers either.
5. Save the mass hysteria for something worthwhile like peak oil or our budget deficit.
6. This is not an attack on UpInArms because you probably didn't understand the situation.

Cheers

[jberryhill]

33. Drinking Water?

It's weird that the article mentions that the Delaware River "supplies drinking water to millions". Not south of Philadelphia it doesn't. The DuPont Chambers Works plant, where the reactor is to neutralize the already non-VX caustic product, has been leaking nasty crap into that particular stretch of the river for decades. Nobody eats or drinks anything out of that river from Claymont down to well below New Castle, where the Delaware opens up into the bay. AFAIK, the nearest drinking water intake is some 30 miles UPSTREAM from the plant.

Destroying the VX stock was a good thing. It was much more hazardous for all concerned to have that nerve agent sitting around in the first place. However, getting rid of the VX did leave a caustic mess that needs to go somewhere. Dumping it into a fresh water body like Lake Michigan is a much worse idea than the stretch of Delaware River where the saline content already renders it unfit for use as intake for drinking water. Nobody gets drinking water downstream from the discharge site.

The problem is that DuPont lost all credibility on safety and environmental issues long ago, and cannot be trusted without independent oversight into what, exactly, they are proposing to discharge. It's a shame, because there is probably a "best" way to do this, but they blew the immense trust they used to have.

[free4now]

36. I live on the Delaware in NJ

And noone around here drinks from the river. EEWWW

There are a few plants operating on the delaware, Rohm and Haas, Dupont PSEG (Electric and Gas co) to name a few.

They all dump.

[wordpix2]

42. just great, let's designate the Delaware the "National Dumping River"

[InkAddict]

28. Permafix in Dayton (Great Miami River dump of treated VX averted)

http://www.ohiocitizen.org/campaigns/dayton_vx/dayton_vx.html

Sometimes, when you lose, you WIN!!!! Sorry about NJ's Delaware River...

[lovuian]

29. I swear Bush wants to poison us

its amazing!!!

[wordpix2]

43. * wants to keep us busy fighting these env'l nightmares to take eyes off

Iraq War and his coming impeachment

[lala_rawraw]

32. Dupont, always... from WWII to now, count on them...

Time to fully boycott Dupont out of existence.

[jllindblad]

34. Clarification

Hello, I am Jeff Lindblad, a public affairs officer with U.S. Army Chemical Materials Agency, which has the job of safely eliminating the U.S. chemical weapons stockpile to include the nerve agent stockpile stored at the Newport Chemical Depot, IN (topic of his forum). I have read the above posts with interest. I would like to first make clear that the Army is not, or planning to, transport or discharge VX nerve agent into the Delaware River. The Army’s chemical agent destruction facility in Indiana uses a chemical neutralization process called caustic hydrolysis to destroy the VX nerve agent. The VX is mixed with sodium hydroxide and hot water, which creates a reaction that destroys the agent. As a result, a caustic byproduct/wastewater is produced made up of 85 percent water, four percent sodium hydroxide, and 11 percent organic phosphorous and sulfur-containing salts. The wastewater is not VX and exhibits no characteristics of VX agent. It has a pH greater than 13 and is corrosive–industrial strength liquid drain cleaner has a greater pH and is more caustic/corrosive.

Prior to biotreatment at DuPont, the caustic wastewater will undergo a chemical oxidation process, where greater than 97 percent of the small amount of its phosphorous compounds will be effectively removed. Following that, the wastewater will undergo further treatment using the facility’s New Jersey approved and permitted two step carbon/biotreatment process. The resulting discharge to Delaware River will be at a much better level than those levels required by the state of New Jersey. The EPA found this phosphonate removal technology adequate in addressing the ecological concerns for discharge of the effluent into the Delaware River.

The Army is awaiting the results of the final follow-on assessment to the April 2005 CDC Report on the transport and treatment of the caustic wastewater at DuPont’s Secure Environmental Treatment Facility. The major findings of that report are:

- the potential hazard of the caustic hydrolysate is predominantly associated with its corrosive and caustic properties and not nerve agent effects;
- the corrosive and caustic hazards of the hydrolysate do not preclude handling or transportation and the precautions in the transportation plan meet the Department of Transportation regulations to safely protect the public, personnel, and environment;
- the DuPont Secure Environmental Treatment process should be capable of treating the major components in the caustic wastewater; and,
- more information is needed to determine the ecological risks of discharge of the treated waste (EPA has since stated their concerns have been resolved).
The final report is expected in April. If you wish to review more information on this project, you can access our web site at www.cma.army.mil or call 1-800-488-0648. Thanks for taking the time to read this rather long post.

Fact sheet on the caustic wastewater http://www.cma.army.mil/docviewerframe.aspx?docid=003673559

Jeff Lindblad
Public Affairs Officer
US Army Chemical Materials Agency

[sattahipdeep]

35. Clarification?

Chemical weapons, including in VX-loaded weapons, still are stored at seven
sites in the United States.

:hi:

[free4now]

37. Thank you

No Thank you for taking the time to write it!

[Mithras61]

41. Thanks for the clarification and information, Jeff...

I'm not a chemist, but the information you have provided is easily understood by evcen those as ignorant of the processes as I am. I'm sure that we all appreciate the additional information.

[salin]

46. Thanks, Jeff... its that last point that is of concern, to me

that the there are ecological concerns that the EPA now says is okay.

In recent months/years several instances have come into the public knowledge where the EPA has tilted their findings by simply silenting or ignoring data that doesn't agree with the desired outcome. In fact the point that there is a predetermined desired outcome - and that of late there are examples of cherry picking data to prove that predetermined desired outcome is worrisome, and sadly begins to call into doubt other "concerns have been resolved" declarations by the EPA - fairly or not.

[wordpix2]

47. thanks, Jeff, but I'm still not convinced, based on these points:

snip:

- the DuPont Secure Environmental Treatment process SHOULD be capable of treating the major components in the caustic wastewater; and,
- more information is needed to determine the ecological risks of discharge of the treated waste (EPA has since stated their concerns have been resolved).

I have put emphasized phrases in bold.

IMHO, knowing BushCo's terrible environmental record and the people he puts in place to head his agencies, I have NO CONFIDENCE in EPA any longer, although I know there are career employees there who are deserving of trust. Unfortunately, like the CIA under Tenet during the "uranium in Niger/WMD" claims before we went to Iraq, these knowledgeable, honest voices tend to be drowned out and finally silenced as they head up the chain of command.

I would prefer to hear from career EPA scientists and not a PR guy whose statements are sanctioned by BushCo heads of the Army and EPA working hand in hand with DuPont, which has a long history of environmental disasters.

[sakabatou]

45. Because deadly nerve agents aren't deadly until the EPA says so!

:sarcasm: