U.S. probe finds unprovoked killings in Haditha

[kurth]

U.S. probe finds unprovoked killings in Haditha
Wed May 31, 2006 8:42 PM BST
By Will Dunham

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A preliminary military inquiry found evidence that U.S. Marines killed two dozen Iraqi civilians in an unprovoked attack in November, contradicting the troops' account, U.S. officials said on Wednesday.

President George W. Bush said he was troubled by news stories on the November 19 killings of men, women and children in the town of Haditha, and a general at the Pentagon said the incident could complicate the job for the 130,000 U.S. troops in Iraq. "Allegations such as this, regardless of how they are borne out by the facts, can have an effect on the ability of U.S. forces to continue to operate," Army Brig. Gen. Carter Ham, deputy director for regional operations for the military's Joint Staff, told a Pentagon briefing.

Forensic data from corpses showed victims with bullet wounds, despite earlier statements by Marines that civilians were killed by a roadside bomb that also claimed the life of a Marine from El Paso, Texas, Lance Cpl. Miguel Terrazas, a defence official said. "The forensics painted a different story than what the Marines had said," said the official, speaking on condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of the matter.

The official said there were wounds that would not have been caused by an improvised explosive device. "Did someone shoot somebody just for the sake of taking him out?" the official said. "Bad things happened that day, and it appears Marines lied about it." ...

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2006-05-31T194155Z_01_N31195013_RTRUKOC_0_UK-IRAQ-USA-HADITHA.xml

[MindPilot]

1. "unprovoked killings in Haditha"? Got that right.

This whole fucking war was "unprovoked".

[ixion]

2. indeed... how do you separate 'collateral damage' from 'unprovoked'?

aren't they one in the same?

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. 
[link:www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules.html|Click
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[MindPilot]

7. Welcome to DU silvertip!!

If you put in the http:// it will be automatically formated as a link.

[CoffeeCat]

3. I am seriously wondering why...

...the truth about this incident has been made public and is being investigated.

Stuff like this probably happens all of the time in Iraq.

Tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis have been killed in this war. We know our military is
conducting raids in residential neighborhoods. We also know that resident in Fallujah had chemical weapons used on them. We've seen the pictures of dead Iraqi children. Remember the countless stories about Iraqi families--including children--who were gunned down as they drove through checkpoints? No one ever investigated those bodies. We got a canned version of events, and that was that.

Atrocities are happening everywhere in Iraq--and have been since day one. If anything, our government has gone to great lengths to downplay, and hide, civilian deaths.

Don't get me wrong. I'm glad to see that this incident is getting attention and
that someone is doing something--instead of hiding it. I'm shocked actually, that
the truth is getting out.

It just seems odd--that in the midst of a massive killing spree--that all of a sudden
one incident is being investigated and publicly denounced by the military.

[Ripley]

5. Leaks of Words and Pics

Some Marines documented this with their cell phone cams. Some spoke out. That's why we are hearing about it. Frankly, it is old news to a few of us, but New News for Main Street America. Just like Abu Graib .. pictures cannot be denied when admissions are delivered in conjunction.

Of course, You are absolutely right .. How many times has this happened? Falluja was far worse than this.

We're on the Highway to Hell, fo sho.

[MindPilot]

6. This is the one that slipped out. It is the speeding ticket at Indy.

This is the one the brass can hang on a few enlisted men--the "bad apples"--and walk away. That will make all the other incidents that did happen under direct orders seem to vanish.

No high-ranking officials will be harmed in the scapegoating of these Marines.

[Ripley]

8. I disagree.

Vehemently. The Marines are not scapegoated when they chose to position the children, women, disabled old men into positions in their homes and then execute them with a shot to the head. They CHOSE to commit outright cold-blooded murder on unarmed innocents.

Of course I agree this is all BushCo's fault and all of those bastards from Junior down to the CO of the unit should be tried at the Hague.

But let us not pretend these Men did not have a choice.

[MindPilot]

9. Yes but...

Perhaps scapegoat is not exactly the right word. The Marines should not have done what they did, of course. But my point is they will take ALL the blame and those who sent them there, those who set the standards that allowed those men to even think that kind of terror was an appropriate response to their situation, and those who failed to adequately train and supervise the men in their command will likely walk away clean.

Like Abu Garab, those guys probably didn't think that shit up on their own and they weren't or certainly shouldn't have been unsupervised. At some point, a standard is set and it appears that a) this is not an isolated incident, and b) the standard is that torture of anyone who may have information is OK, so it's a very small step from that to terrorizing and executing civilians is OK.

Bottom line: the Marines should not have committed murder, but the real responsibility lies with the command that let them do it.

[brentspeak]

10. Wait a minute -- are you a witness to these alleged American crimes?

[maxsolomon]

12. i wasn't aware that this was a court of law

we can say anything we want on here.

i didn't WITNESS GWB sniffing coke or passing out drunk. but it probably happened just like we think.

[brentspeak]

13. "we can say anything we want on here"

It's kind of pointless to ask that - who said otherwise? But your analogy is as unwieldy as a sack of potatoes.

[maxsolomon]

14. i see the 'innocent until proven guilty' spin everywhere

wait for the facts, says AA's big eddie. not reflective of the marine corp, says paul hackett.

i'm sick of it. murkins need to accept that atrocities are part of war. if they don't like it, then we shouldn't go to war.

[OKIsItJustMe]

11. Okay, now for the investigation of the cover-up

http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/05/29/marines.haditha/

Sources: Lawmakers told to brace for Haditha fallout

...

The formal findings of investigations into the matter are several weeks away, said Gen. Peter Pace, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. Pace cautioned against a rush to judgment.

"There are two ongoing investigations," he told CNN. "One has to do with what happened. The other investigation goes to why didn't we know about it sooner than we knew about it."

Pace said the investigations may not be complete for "a couple of weeks," adding, "We should not prejudge the outcome."

...