FBI investigates willful destruction of Bible

[rucky]

FBI investigates willful destruction of Bible

by Klaus Rohrich - Canada Free Press

Wednesday, July 19, 2006

The FBI is investigating the willful destruction of a Holy Bible in Chattanooga, TN as a possible hate crime. It appears two Tennessee men went out, purchased a Bible, shot it repeatedly with an assault rifle and threw the desecrated scripture on the doorstep of a Presbyterian church in downtown Chattanooga. The two men recorded their actions on video and then posted them to the web site MySpace.com.

The right Rev. J. W. "Willie" Preston of the Chattanooga Chapter of the Coalition of American Independent Revivalists (CAIR) lodged a formal complaint with the FBI, requesting that the act be investigated as a possible hate crime.

FBI agent Tim Burke announced that an investigation into the matter has been launched with a view toward charging those responsible with a hate crime.

The video, entitled "Kill the Bible" was posted to the social networking web site a month ago and is believed to be at least a year old, said Rev. Preston, who is the spokesperson for CAIR.

A man who identifies himself as "mully88" posted the offending video to the MySpace.com site. The video shows the man purchasing a Holy Bible at a bookstore and taking it to a wooded area where the book was shot repeatedly with what appeared to be an assault rifle and was then taken to the Chattanooga church where it was thrown to the ground outside the church’s main doors.

more...
http://www.canadafreepress.com/2006/klaus071906.htm
_____________________________________

Would you like a side of Theocracy with your Fascism?

[BushOut06]

1. Replace "Bible" with "Koran", and "church" with "mosque"

Would you consider that a hate crime?

[rucky]

3. Replace "The Bible" with "Huckleberry Finn"

What's the crime, here?

[Hosnon]

10. You don't see the difference between the Bible and Huck Finn?

[rucky]

11. It's a sin, but not a crime.

like adultery, and coveting asses.

[afrosia]

16. Isn't it Ox?

It's a shame though because my neighbours' oxen are fucking nice!

[afrosia]

17. I don't

both have morals, both are entertaining. Only difference is that nobody has yet interpreted Finn to be literal. But they will. Lord of the Rings will too I bet!

[muriel_volestrangler]

22. Huck Finn has more literary merit, and less violence? (n/t)

[ixion]

25. no, they're both works of fiction

what's the differeence? :shrug:


Oh yeah, Huck Finn is a much better book. :-)

[pokercat999]

27. Huck Finn is reality based.

[LynnTheDem]

20. Funny how they (rightwingnuts) totally miss the irony, isn't it.

All part & parcel of the "we're superior" mindset.

[radfringe]

2. so when do the repubs

present a constitutional amendment banning bible desecration?

[shadowknows69]

4. Kind of glad I never produced that one video

My friends and I had actually shot a video of a guy in an easter bunny suit telling tasteless Jesus jokes on the front steps of a local church. I decided later that was in too bad of taste even for me so we scrapped it. I think I would probably have been strung up in my hometown if we had gone ahead with it.

[benburch]

5. The crime consists of throwing it at the door of the church.

For example... If I took a doll that looked a little like you, stabbed it through the heart and left the doll on your doorstep, I would have made a terroristic threat to you.

Otherwise, using a bible as target practice is fine.

[Sam Odom]

7. I think not

throwing a book (it is a JUST a book) down with holes in it isnt a crime. IMHO

[YOY]

9. Um yeah...

Just like burning a cross in front of someone's house really is just burning some wood.
:eyes:

Blowing holes in the book is just fine...hell even burning a cross is still free speach (although connected with racist assholes...it is perfectly legal.) The moment you do that to intimidate others with threats of violence it becomes a hatecrime.

HOWEVER, Putting it on the steps of a church makes the church folks think they could be next.

That's a hate crime.

Look, I'm not all that religious, but what they did fit the definition of hate crime.

[Sam Odom]

13. Hate crimes are P.C. legislation

I'm not a fan, period.

Bluntly... If a black guy with a gun robs a black guy and calls him a nigger while robbing him of 300.00 is no different than a asian guy robbing a black guy in the same manner. Both should be punished severely and equally.

[theHandpuppet]

28. I agree with you, YOY

And I'm not religious, either.

Here's the legal definition of a hate crime: http://www.answers.com/topic/hate-crime

Now what needs to asked is whether the men who did this did so out of malice or an intent or intimidate (hate crime), or whether this was their very bad idea of a joke (stupidity).

[rucky]

8. The church didn't even know until they saw the video on the web.

I haven't seen the video, but I doubt that church was anything more than a prop.

Misdemeanor at best - not anywhere near a Federal hate crime (which they won't implement when gay people are targeted and murdered)

[Cronus Protagonist]

18. No, THIS is a crime (graphic)

http://bushspeaks.com/home.asp?did=220

[Warren Stupidity]

38. "made a terroristic threat to you."

No Ben, you might have made a threat, but not a terroristic threat. It is just a threat, and at that it is just barely a threat. Had the stabbed doll been accompanied by a letter saying something like 'this is what is going to happen to you unless ...' that would be a threat.

"The 1st Amendment prohibits the government from punishing a person for making a threat without proving that it was made with the intent to threaten the victim.

Paul Cassel lived in a remote area of the Mojave Desert where the federal government planned to sell lots to settlers.

Cassel told prospective buyers that drug dealers, child molesters and other unsavory persons lived nearby and posed dangers in the area.

When persons continued to express interest in purchasing building lots, Cassel threatened to burn any new construction to the ground.

The 9th circuit said threats are insufficient for a conviction, noting "Speech may be deemed unprotected by the 1st Amendment as a 'true threat' only upon proof that the speaker subjectively intended the speech as a threat."

Inf.: U.S. v. Cassel, 03-10683, 9th Circ., May 24. The circuit consists of Alaska, Arizona, California, Hawaii, Idaho, Nevada, Oregon and Washington.

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa4441/is_200508/ai_n16059336

Threats have to have an intent to harm backing them up.

[Sam Odom]

6. Nice!!

I knew where you were going because I've seen the real story.

I also agree... I see no crime. If this is a crime then burning a USA Flag in front of a war memorial which offends someone is a crime.

[truthisfreedom]

12. PAPER ATTACK! PAPER ATTACK! next person to tear a page in a newspaper

is under investigation.

[KatyMan]

15. A lot of birds

would get arrested, methinks... :)

[951-Riverside]

14. If they did the same to a Qu'ran/Koran people would be outraged here

They would be screaming Freeper this, nazi that, kill whitey, you name it. Personally I don't mind what people choose to do with someone elses little story book it just seems like Islam gets much more repect here than Christianity.

[rucky]

21. Outrage is perfectly legal, as well.

Should the FBI be involved?

[soup]

32. They did.

hint: read the whole article.

[tsuki]

19. We need a Constitutional Amendment that forbids shooting of

the Bible.

[soup]

26. no doubt.

unless it's on film recounting the origins of man and the universe as presented by NRA's Charlton Heston. ;)

[sugapablo]

23. I dunno....

It's not the act of shooting a book that's a crime here....It's the intimidation factor.

What was the motivation behind the act? Why did the perpetrator go out of his/her way, buy a bible, shoot it, and place it on the steps of the church?

This person knew this act would get a particular response from those at the church. If the response this person wanted was for the church members to be fearful, fearful because of their religious beliefs and what could happen to them because of their religious beliefs, than I can certainly see how a hate crime could have been committed.

[Warren Stupidity]

39. It is not a crime it is free speech.

No threat was made. A video was made. It seems that this was a work of art.

[sugapablo]

43. Ahh..

Burning a cross on a black families lawn, or delivering swastikas to a synagogue, or other such things is "art" so long as a video is made?

You don't see ANY threat implied by such actions? How naive are you?

[TheWatcher]

24. FBI Inverstigates Bible Destruction.......

Ignores the destruction of Democracy, Rule Of Law, Civil Liberties, Vote Fraud, Stolen Elections, and any crime committed by Bushco.

Proletariat still mostly apathetic and asleep.

In other news, most Americans Still prefer American Idol to freedom.

Film at 11.

[soup]

29. What an odd little 'related story' linked in the article

>> As folk filed into the church, a group of masked anarchists sprang up from nowhere like threatening storm clouds out of the blue. Group members threatened to murder the Christians--all for trying to make their way inside to attend services.

At the normally peaceful Universalist Church, the uttered death threats were followed through with violence when a group of anti-Christian rioters, their faces hidden from view by bandanas and brandishing six feet of PVC pipe, attacked and threatened to murder the lone occupant of one car.

With the driver held hostage in his vehicle, the rioters smashed windows, ultimately destroying the vehicle before fleeing the scene "like cowards", in the words of the Rev. Flip Benham, National Director, Operation Save America.
>snip<

But the rioters were allowed to go free.

"One of Jackson's police officers on the scene stated that they (police) could do nothing because the rioters refused to identify themselves when asked," said Rev. Benham. "The police refused to control the situation and would not even take a report until congregants volunteered to handle the situation through church lawyers."<<
http://www.canadafreepress.com/2006/cover071706.htm


the police could do nothing because the rioters refused to identify themselves when asked?? what the heck?

edit to add link

[POAS]

35. Now we get to the nub of the story

Yhe church is Unitarian, supportive of issues such as homosexual marriage while the attackers appear to be affiliated with "Operation Save America", an anti-abortion group. SO this doesn't appear to be a series of attacks and imtimidations against a Christian group but rather an attack by a group of "Fundamentalist" Christians against other Christians who disagree with their narrow view of the Bible.

In the context of the other "riot" it is clear that the church was not getting support from the local authorities and had to turn to ferderal law and authority in the same way b;acks had to do in getting their rights upheld in the south in the 50's and 60's.

Hate is on the rise in this country, and with it come crimes of intimidation by the haters.

[soup]

42. Aha. Thanks for the additional info, POAS.

I thought it was odd that the police 'looked the other way' and no arrests were made. Your post helped clarify it.

(Sorry for the delayed response. I needed some time out for morning hugs and smiles from our 1 yr old granddaughter.)

[moobu2]

30. I cant see a hate crime in simply leaving a damaged Bible at a church.

If there had been a note left that say’s “your next” or something then yeah maybe, but just leaving the Bible there isn’t threatening. This sort of thing isn’t the same as burning a cross in an African Americans front yard because of the long history of violence associated with that act.

[Cocoa]

31. the church's lawyer is named "Bubba"

a serious story, but

:rofl:

CAIR’s legal director, W. S. "Bubba" Williams complained that the desecration of the Holy Scriptures was comparable to burning a cross. "By throwing a bullet-riddled bible at the church, we believe the perpetrators went beyond the limits of free speech by taking part in an overt act of religious intimidation."

[Vinca]

33. The world is going to hell in a hand basket and our FBI

is investigating goobers shooting at Bibles? Give me strength.

[Zero Division]

34. Sometimes it pays to actually read the linked article. Hint....hint.....

And, yes, that story about the anarchists attacking church goers (including a UU church--one of the most liberal, unauthoritarian churches you can find) is very suspicious. A story like that, if true, would have been huge at FOX news, at the very least.

[POAS]

36. I agree but

if one couldn't see the "hate crime" aspect involved from the first article I doubt the perception would improve much from further reading. It would just amount to turning a blind eye from one page to the next.

[OKNancy]

44. this is a right-wing site

readers shouldn't let the name of the site fool them.

---
It's also an editorial if readers would read the whole thing.

[moobu2]

37. This site isn’t a legitimate news source

[mhr]

40. But, The Fundies Were Against Hate Crimes Legislation

That would protect minorities and now want that same type of law to protect them today.

That's a foul - you can't have it both ways.

[QuettaKid]

41. something is NOT right with this story. Last week I read the

exact same thing, only it was a Koran and a Mosque. Sounds like some sort of PsyOps to me.

[Moderator]

45. Bad source and an editorial

This is an unreliable right-wing site
If readers will check, this article is actually an editorial.