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DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 09:31 PM
Original message
Protesters Take Over Oaxaca, Mexico
July 21, 2006, 1:28 PM EDT

OAXACA, Mexico -- Protesters have taken over the center of folkloric Oaxaca, making tourists show identification at makeshift checkpoints, smashing the windows of quaint hotels and spray-painting revolutionary slogans. Police are nowhere in sight.

It's not the tranquil cultural gem beloved by tourists from the United States and Europe. A month of protests to try to oust the governor have forced authorities to cancel many events, including the Guelaguetza dance festival.

Most tourists are staying away, costing the city millions of dollars.

The protests follow other eruptions of civil unrest and class conflict that have plagued President Vicente Fox as his term winds to a close.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/world/wire/sns-ap-mexico-oaxaca-unrest,0,5081323.story?coll=sns-ap-world-headlines

Wow, they took over the entire town! Oh my.

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Barkley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
1. Mexico is the USA second largest source of foreign oil behind
Canada.

USA Leading Sources of Foreign Oil
U.S. Net Imports by Country
(Monthly Thousands of Barrels per day)
Nov-05/ Dec-05/ Jan-06/ Feb-06/ Mar-06/ Apr-06

1. Canada
2,102/ 2,408/ 2,159/ 2,144/ 2,084/ 2,112

2. Mexico
1,554/ 1,487/ 1,581/ 1,611/ 1,507/ 1,443

3. Venezuela
1,237/ 1,485/ 1,512/ 1,453/ 1,505/ 1,349

4. Saudi Arabia
1,368/ 1,471/ 1,368/ 1,451/ 1,358/ 1,592

5. Nigeria
1,246/ 1,246/ 1,185/ 1,366/ 1,194/ 1,097

http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/dnav/pet/pet_move_neti_a_EP00_IMN_mbblpd_m.htm
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Mr_Spock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 10:38 AM
Response to Reply #1
70. Amazing how few people are aware of this.
False & deceptive rhetoric runs very deep in this area.
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Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
2. Anyone here been there?
I'm stuck up in the frozen north, so I know very little about the area. Is this some small four-digit thing with a few tourist attractions, a Mexican New Orleans, or something in between?
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melnjones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. haven't been there...
but we have a lot of immigrants from Oaxaca in my city, many of whom have a native heritage and speak Mixteco. Often Spanish is their second language (with varying degrees of fluency in Spanish) and we even have had a few Oaxacan Mexican immigrants who really don't speak Spanish at all. Anywhere where there is a large native population you'll find a good amount of poverty (and the southern states tend to be poorer than the northern anyway), so I'd imagine that regardless of the amount of tourism that the area gets, the lack of whatever source of revenue is a big deal.
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. It's a huge city with a largely Indian population
meaning a mixture of several American tribes. It's a center for weaving, pottery, and silver work and represents some of the finest work being done in all three areas.

I was hoping to get down there within the next year.

Oh, well. They've never been shy about revolution in Mexico and they won't be this time, either. Most people have just about nothing to lose and everything to gain if they can finally manage to topple the handful of rich colonial families that have really been running things there.

I like the country and I love its people. I wish them the best and I sincerely hope it spreads northward.
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. I've been there - long ago. I believe it is the largest city south of
Edited on Fri Jul-21-06 10:33 PM by higher class
Mexico City between MC and the Guatemalan border.

There is the State of Oaxaca and the city of Oaxaca. Just checked the State of Oaxaca is the fifth largest in Mexico.

"Known as "Tierra del Sol," the state of Oaxaca is blessed with mountains, lakes, and a beautiful coastline on the Pacific Ocean. Part of the state is located on the Isthmus of Tehuantepec, a narrow strait where only 210 kilometers (130 miles) separate the Gulf of Mexico and the Pacific Ocean. Mountain ranges dominate the landscape.

The state is a prime tourism destination, combining the beaches of Huatulco, Puerto Escondido and Puerto Angel with colonial gems such as the city of Oaxaca and ancient archaeological wonders like Monte Albán and Mitla. Oaxaca is actively promoting rural tourism. There are rural hostels and outstanding community museums throughout the state."
snip

state.http://mexiconetwork.info/oaxacaprofile.htm#basic_facts

So sorry to hear they messed with the hotels.

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brook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Not such a small place.
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TlalocW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. I have
It's a beautiful city. In the main parts of town, all the buildings are old and well-kept up. Corporations are kept at the edge of town (McDonalds, etc.). The zocalo (main square) is gorgeous, and it has great food. It has several Spanish-language schools so it's not uncommon to see a lot of gringos there, but it's not a New Orleans by any means. The craziest it got was during the Guelaguetza festival. There are parades most every night. Many people who are carrying various things in it will hand something to you for you to carry and be part of the parade. One day is set aside for a show in the local outdoor stadium/stage for all the various indian tribes of Oaxaca state to come and do their traditional dances. It's also surrounded by beautiful countryside and small art villages specializing in small painted animals, weaving, and pottery.

I spent part of the summer of 1994 there, taking my last Spanish class for a major. I'd really like to go back.

TlalocW
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #2
13. It's a pretty big city
Oaxaca is a beautiful city, & a pretty major one. It's the capital of the state of Oaxaca, in southern Mexico. There's a really strong Indian influence there, w/lots of different cultures. I'd say it sort of is a Mexican New Orleans - famous for it's architecture & cultural heritage.
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Lisa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 12:09 AM
Response to Reply #2
16. my landlord visited there last year
He was visiting his sister (a relief worker with a Mennonite charity). He really enjoyed it -- lots of historical and cultural attractions, and not catering as much to overseas tourists (e.g. with fancy resorts, places he tends to avoid).
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 01:18 AM
Response to Reply #2
19. oh god tons of people have been there -- it's BIG TIME
it is v. much beloved by the older hippies but really anyone who likes folk art is into that place

i used to work a tiny bit w. a man who had an art gallery of art he got from oaxaca

i'm afraid i'm a heathen and never made time, my time in mexico is more crass i guess, the birding areas or the medical tourism areas rather than getting all arty and spiritually evolved

but you will get no shortage of replies from visitors there and i strongly suspect that many of the visitors are quite sympathetic and will be happy to come home w. an exciting tale, i wouldn't expect this to turn violent knock on wood

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Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 01:24 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. I am become clued. Thanks, all! (n/t)
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
3. I'd suggest the Mexican Elections Tribunal quickly install the
man who won the Presidential election: Andres Manual Lopez Obrador. I would bet that would quickly cool down the situation.



:kick:
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Laotra Donating Member (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #3
39. Schmobrador
People of Oaxaca don't need "calming down" by and party or politician. They voted to punish PRI, but does not mean they wan't PRD in place. They wan't self-rule, new constitution based on direct and participatory democracy, based on traditional indigenous way of governance. Not only in Oaxaca but in whole Mexico.
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
5. Way to go, protesters! Viva Obrador!
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
10. Here's a map showing Oaxaca.....


Also a site concerning an upcoming festival in October, with photos:

http://www.food-of-the-gods-festival.com/optionals.htm
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
11. Boy am I glad I decided not to go THERE in 2 weeks
:scared:
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #11
17. I don't know about that. It sounds like a pretty exciting place, where a
revolution is being born. See

http://www.narconews.com/Issue42/article1964.html

Consider the source of this article: AP and Newsday. Corporate news monopolies.

The AP/Newsday article stresses supposed window breaking and minor vandalism--which these kinds of corporate news sources always--ALWAYS!--exaggerate. Further, only two such incidents are cited, and both are second-hand accounts. (The reporter did not see anything--and, for all we know, given AP's extremely unreliable reporting, they were inaccurate or entirely made up.) They also stress MONEY, MONEY, MONEY. But what's happening in Oaxaca is a revolt against money and its influence. They evaluate everything in terms money value and inconvenience to tourists and the well-off, and they explain nothing.

For instance, the narconews explains that the tourist festival (which the AP/Newsday article admitted was too expensive for the people who live there--$42 a head) was REPLACED with a FREE festival that everyone could attend. The AP/Newsday article describes the protesters "taking over" a Oaxaca museum, as if they were just anarchists. The narco news article explains WHY. Last year, the governor they are trying to oust (Ruiz)--whom the protesters accuse of rigging state elections in '04--converted the public-accessible government offices into the museum and removed government offices outside of town, to avoid the frequent public protests that were occurring there. The local citizens have REOPENED these buildings and SET UP THEIR OWN GOVERNMENT. They consider the current governor oppressive and illegitimate. He is the one who ordered the tear-gassing of local teachers who were on strike, on June 14, when the teachers were sleeping in a campout protest--the trigger of this large revolutionary movement. A figure of one million people is stated in the narco news article as participating in these protests. The Fox government does not dare move against them with police forces, because it is such a big protest. The protesters have formed the Popular Government of the State of Oaxaca, based on a traditional (no doubt Indian) form of consensus government (without political parties), called "usos y costumbres" ("practices and customs"). This form of government is recognized in the Constitution for the State of Oaxaca.

Anyway, you see my point. One person's "anarchy" is another person's "order." The gassing of teachers conducting an orderly strike--and catching them asleep--is DISORDER. It is an act of war on the local population. This citizens formation of their own government is an attempt to RESTORE order. It may be undisciplined and may have attracted a few youthful anarchic elements, but it is very serious in its purpose and involves mature persons of high stature. These people are not threatening anyone. They are creating community and self-government. The protests in Oaxaca are very similar to the peaceful, democratic, leftist revolutions that have been occurring throughout South America, often led by indigenous people, campesinos (small farmers), the poor and others who have been excluded by fascist governments, and ill-served and mistreated by them, for decades, and centuries. This is a profoundly important and very widespread movement. And it is not going to go away.

As Evo Morales, the first indigenous president of Bolivia, has said: "The time of the people has come."

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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #17
22. I don't want to see a revolution being born
I want to see a lot of birds. x(

(especially not a revolution where foreigners get it)
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 03:04 AM
Response to Reply #22
25. foreigners aren't gonna get it
you'll be fine

this "revolution" has been on and off for quite a few years now and i don't know of any tourist being harmed
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Laotra Donating Member (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #22
38. "The foreigners"
Many of narconews reporters are gringos, and they have geen "getting it" not from the peacefully rebelling people but from the corrupt and violent regime.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #11
20. yeah hold out for veracruz in early october :-)
Edited on Sat Jul-22-06 01:26 AM by pitohui
seriously when i went to the river of raptors a few years back it was when it was pretty "hot" in chiapas which is not that far away but we weren't noticed or bothered at all

but no one goes to veracruz unless they're a birdwatcher or an oil industry person i guess

during the same time a friend of mine (an art teacher, in case it ain't obvious) actually rode a bicycle -- and i don't mean a motorcycle -- all the way from texas to chiapas during this conflict and, again, no one bothered him a bit, although they prob. thought he was a little crazy, don't remember how long it took, but he had a sabbaticall from his job as teacher, it was several months for sure, he had a blast and no one tried to harm him

i don't think these people are looking to harm americans or start a war, they just need a bigger share of the mexican economy, my impression anyway



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katinmn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-21-06 11:34 PM
Response to Original message
12. I've been checking in at Narco News. Great in depth coverage
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watercolors Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. thank you for web site
We have been trying to keep up with what is going on in Mexico, have traveled to many parts and hope to make another trip this year.
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 12:03 AM
Response to Original message
15. Alright Mexicans!
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IndyJones Donating Member (583 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-24-06 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #15
80. Glad to see them protest their government. I keep hearing people
say that the people can't protest because of fear or whatever, but the fact is, if they are all pissed off enough, they will uprise!

Good for them!!
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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 01:16 AM
Response to Original message
18. it's been too long since i've been down there.
for all those DU'ers who haven't been to some of these areas in mexico, they are absolutely stunningly beautiful, as are the inhabitants. I can't stress how amazing our neighbor is to the south. So rich with their own proud history and culture. Mexico is a treasure, we are blessed to be their neighbor.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #18
24. as an interesting (or not aside)... no free speech in mexico
mexico does not allow foreigners (whether legally or illegally present) in their country to participate in any form of civil protest, write editorials for a newspapers, etc.

those are crimes under mexican law

http://mexico.usembassy.gov/mexico/eacs_warden_MexicoCity.html

The U.S. Embassy advises its citizens in Mexico to avoid demonstrations that may be held in support or protest of labor disputes, election results or other causes in Mexico. U.S. citizens are encouraged to avoid any large crowds during active demonstrations. Also, U.S. citizens should avoid participating in demonstrations and other activities that might be deemed political by the Mexican authorities. The Mexican Constitution prohibits political activities by foreigners, and such actions may result in detention and/or deportation.

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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 03:07 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. yes it's good to be aware of that
as a matter of courtesy i don't tell other people how to run their country but as a general rule you don't go down to any latin american country and tell people how to run their lives

we should clean up our own mess and when visiting mexico just relax and be visitors not politicians in my humble view

seems a simple matter of good etiquette
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 03:10 AM
Response to Reply #26
27. it's also
markedly different than the USA

in the USA, foreigners are not prohibited from any of the above activities

but then of course, we have far more freedom of speech

are u consistent and say that no foreigners should tell americans how to "run their lives"? or does that only apply to "latin american countries"?

i think criticizing a nation, any nation, is fair game, whether foreigner or local

however, under the mexican constititution doing that in mexico happens to be illegal

in stark contrast to our greater freedoms in this nation

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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 04:48 AM
Response to Reply #27
29. well let me put it this way
i don't care if someone comes to usa and starts giving advise on how to run my country because usa is the superpower of the world and can take such advice or leave it

it's all abt the imbalance of power

it may be that someone from mexico comes here and tells my gov't something but it is not the same as me going to mexico and telling them what to do

the usa and the cia have a history

i don't want to be perceived as thinking i am "better" than a mexican and i "know" better than a local, just seems a tad wrong

at some point we have to trust that the people who actually live there will take the best decision to improve their lives

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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #29
42. double standard
imo, that's a silly double standard

come to the USA and criticize us. fine

come to mexico and criticize them. icky

that's silly imo. yea, sure the CIA has a history. so does the mexican govt. so does every govt. on the face of the earth

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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #42
56. youre comparing apples to oranges.
Edited on Sat Jul-22-06 07:14 PM by SlavesandBulldozers
nobody every said Mexico was the same or had the same freedoms as the US.

I've been in Mexico and army personnel with assault weapons, roughly the age of 16, have peered in my car and smiled at me. The way I see it they are ahead of the curve on this, and Mexico is essentially the realization of every Republican dream in many ways with their rich/poor disparaties, militarized police, etc.. regardless. .

Nobody ever said it was the same dude. I never said they had the same rights. For one, who has more prisoners, and who imprisons more people per capita if you wanna write more paragraphs about freedom. I'll wait for your response. ALl I said was that it was great place with great people.
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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 06:58 AM
Response to Reply #56
66. who has more prisoners, and who imprisons more people per capita
still waiting on this. Figured you'd know since your so interested in comparative constutional freedoms and whatnot.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #66
76. this is
relevant to SPEECH how?

nice strawman and irrelevant tangent

i didn't say the US was freer

i said it was freer in regards to speech.

your reading comprehension sux

hth

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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #42
65. perhaps when Mexican leaders start mulling over kicking out
all Americans who are there it will matter. That's your point right, that's what youre getting at. You don't really like Mexicans in the US very much do you.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #65
77. wow
nice little stalinist personal attacks

and total irrelevancy

i like free speech

i support the right of mexican nationals to state their political views while in the USA

i ALSO think that US nationals should have the same right in mexico

if that is hard for you to understand, then maybe you can continue with your bigotry, assumptions, and prejudice

it seems your forte
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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-24-06 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #77
79. my bigotry LOL!
stalinist too!
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-24-06 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #79
82. yup
it's a twofer

good on ya!
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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #42
72. who has more prisoners, and who imprisons more people per capita
still waiting on this. Figured you'd know since your so interested in comparative constutional freedoms and whatnot.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #72
78. the USA
imprisons far more people

i am not sure how this is relevant to SPEECH

mexico has, in general, much harsher laws than the US in regards to drugs and some offenses. and more lenient in regards to othersw

they also have exceptionally corrupt police forces



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IndyJones Donating Member (583 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-24-06 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #42
81. agreed!
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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 06:37 AM
Response to Reply #26
32. as a general rule you don't go down to any latin american country and tell
people how to run their lives".

a general rule the US has ignored from day 1. ;)
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 09:23 AM
Response to Reply #32
34. Which is exactly why
Edited on Sat Jul-22-06 09:26 AM by Marie26
Mexico has that rule. The US has a long, long, history of meddling w/Mexican elections. This law is less aimed at tourists joing a protest, & more aimed at actual agents of the US gov. that could try to bribe, organize, steal votes, etc. to get the result they want.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #34
45. utter double standard rubbish
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #45
48. Baloney
Why don't you try reading up on Mexican history a little. But somehow, I don't think you're posting this out of concern for Mexican free speech rights, anyway.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #48
51. and somehow
i would expect you to attack my motivations (stalinism 101) when you don't have an argument

i believe in free speech

that holds for mexican citizens in the USA

that holds for US citizens in mexico

no double standards here

you can live with your double standards. i'll live with free speech. that's preferable to me

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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #45
58. it seems to me you'd rather them not have free speech here.
is that your point? if so your argument makes a lot more sense.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #34
50. Absolutely correct. One has only to drive oneself to do a little reading
to discover this pattern has been consistant throughout Latin America and the Caribbean.

How people can remain in the dark about it is simply beyond me.

Mexico's concern should be directed toward allowing and protecting rights of the people who live in Mexico, not visiting idiot right-wingers, or agents representing power-mad, right-wing defectives like Nixon, Reagan, and the Bushes, as they attempt to control internal affairs in other countries, where they have no business meddling whatsoever.

Some people are poorly constructed in character. They are Republicans.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. this isn't about any "wingers"
left, right, or whatever

the point is that the USA (RIGHTLY) allows free speech for foreign nationals

mexico does not

that is bad policy

all this handwringing, that it's wrong for americans etc. to go to latin america and criticize a country, but ok for a latin american to come to the USA and criticize the USA

BOTH should be ok if one is consistent (which you are not) vis a vis free speech and political protest

mexico does NOT recognize ANY right of foreign nationals (Whatever their political persuasion) to engage in the political debate.

the USA ***does*** recognize that right

our system is superior in this regards, and i am not afraid to say it

i don't curry to double standards. it seems here a lot of people think free speech only goes one way

that's discriminatory, and agains the fundamental concepts of free speech which shouldn't apply selectively

i'll go with voltaire, and other bastions of freedom. you can go with your silly anti-freedom double standards

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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #52
54. The term "right-wing" is actually a flowery euphemism, when a
blunt term is far more accurate.

There is a slight difference between the U.S. and Mexico: Mexico has not meddled in U.S. internal affairs.

You can't compare them, no matter how many lobotomies you've had.

It's still not anyone's business how another country operates. It's obligation is to ITS OWN PEOPLE. PERIOD. If you don't want to feel all doubly standarded beyond your coping skills, stay the hell out of Mexico.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 12:53 AM
Response to Reply #54
61. it's obligation
last i checked, people of mexican nationality (here legally and illegally ) recently marched and spoke out as to their opinions as to immigration policy.

that's a good thing, nu?

is it a bad thing for foreigners in OTHER countries to do the same, when they have political opinions?

according to you, it is

if it is not your business how another country operates, then i guess you have no "business' in regards to the operations of israel/lebanon/somalia/rwanda/bosnia/pakistan/india or any other country

are you ok with forced female clitorectomies? apparently, that's not YOUR business if it doesn't happen in your OWN country. are you ok with forced abortions and vicious dictatorship in china? apparently, that's not your business. are you ok with forced clitorectomies, death penalty for adultery, imprisonment of homosexuals in other countries? apparently, NONE of these things are your business and you have no right to say anything about these policies

what a bunch of complete rubbish

you amaze me
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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 07:10 PM
Response to Reply #52
59. whoa.
:popcorn:
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 12:54 AM
Response to Reply #59
62. dood
</keanu>

i got my first tube ride today

whoa

<keanu>

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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 06:55 AM
Response to Reply #62
64. let's review
Me: "Mexico is a treasure, we are blessed to be their neighbor"

You: "Mexico doesn't allow free speech, or street protests, for pretty much anybody. America lets people from other countries protest." -waves American flag-

Me: WTF? All i said was that Mexico is cool.

You: -insert Keanu joke-
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #64
74. mexico
the mexican people (like people everywhere) are a treasure

the mexican govt. is SERIOUSLY messed up, to include their political system

the most obvious proof of this is the example that people flee illegally from mexico into our country by the millions and the same thing does NOT happen the other way

as for the aforementioned policy on speech - i disagree with it, and stated my opinion of same

that's all i did.

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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #32
43. latin americaN
WHAT the heck does the fact that a country is LATIN american have to do with anything?

it's ok to go to canada, greece, the USA, or Belgium and criticize but not Mexico, Costa Rica, or Nicaragua

these, imo, are silly double standards. no govt. is above criticism

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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 06:35 AM
Response to Reply #24
31. huh
Edited on Sat Jul-22-06 06:41 AM by SlavesandBulldozers
they don't have the right to free speech, yet they protest en masse when there's election fraud. we do have some semblence of a right to free speech and americans don't fill the streets when there's election fraud. suppose its the power of television?

you mean they don't build free speech zones as a courtesy to their people?

Do you think they may need a lesson in freedom from us, preferably delivered by our military?

anyway, how come I knew that the moment I posted something positive about mexico somebody would copy and paste an example of how I was off the mark?

is it that you can't stand to hear something positive at all or is it mexico or mexicans that bother you?

i've attached a picture of the pyramid at Chichen.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #31
44. i just returned
from mexico btw. visit there often

regardless, they do not have AS much free speech as us

one example is that they limit free debate to legal citizens, not legal or illegally present aliens

that is a huge restriction

imagine if the US suddenly prohibited free debate from all people in this country who were not citizens

Neil Young, Chris Hitchens, George Galloway etc.

not allowed to comment on the USA while in the USA. not allowed to write editorials. not allowed to participate in street protests, etc.

get real
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High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #44
47. I think you are alone in being disturbed by this Mexican law.
But enjoy your indignation.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #47
53. oh sorry
i didn't realize that censorship and failure to recognize freedom of speech is ok when it is done by a latin american country, but icky when it is done in the USA

or that the double standard of "no free speech in latin america" because they are apparently special is a stance that a freedom loving person would hold

my bad

live with your discriminatory double standards

i think mexico's policy is bad. and i aint afraid to say it

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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #53
55. youre also not afraid to go there.
which was my fucking point before you began your diatribes.
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 12:48 AM
Response to Reply #55
60. i'm not afraid to go to
costa rica, nicaragua, panama, canada, england, israel, egypt, mexico, bali, or england

i've been to all

it does not therefore follow that i don't disagree with many policies of many of these countries

lack of freedom of speech for foreigners and safety for foreigners has no correlation i am aware of, so i am not sure what your point is

i stand by my statement. mexico is wrong to forbid political speech by foreigners (legal or illegal) and we have greater freedom of speech for allowing same

on my last mexico trip, i happened to be there right as this last (disputed election) came in



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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 07:03 AM
Response to Reply #53
67. you missed the whole point. but i think you knew that.
you characterize the poster you responded to as hating freedom because he's not comparing Mexico to America.

By that logic, then, you hate freedom. You hate Mexican sovereignity. You would impose your values on a sovereign nation. Freedom-hater!
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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 11:43 PM
Response to Reply #67
75. i didn't say he hated freedom
i am saying that imo freedom of speech should apply to foreigners and locals alike

in ANY country

and that silly double standards are just that - silly
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SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #44
57. Christophers Hitchens. . .right. . .
Edited on Sat Jul-22-06 07:06 PM by SlavesandBulldozers
anyway, yeah wow they limit debate? And that separates us from them I suppose?

It seems you have turned my positive comments about Mexico into a conversation about illegal immigrants. Now why the fuck would you do that?

As far as them not being allowed to participate in street protests: uh,


they protest all the time man. Thay have a very well organized student movement, you should look into it sometime.


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sgxnk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #57
63. i brought up the distinction
and i posted the US govt. link to point out the distinction which i find interesting

comparative criminal and const. law regarding speech is a subject i am intensely interested in, and have studied for years.

this is one example, and i brought it up

i think mexico is wrong in their policy (it's actually in their constitution iirc), and i will say so

i think many countries have serious flaws in regards to free speech, especially many of those that PURPORT to have free speech (canada comes to mind), and as a student of comparative constitutional law, the contrasts fascinate me

i think that is ONE area where the US clearly trumps nearly every nation on earth. on our laws regarding free speech . in many other areas, i prefer other systems (like i prefer the UK tort system for instance), but in regards to speech, we have some really good laws. but not mccain-feingold (rolls eyes)
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #24
35. Unless that person is JOHN NEGROPONTE and his Thug, Hooligan agents


"I'm pleased to announce my decision to nominate Ambassador John Negroponte as Director of National Intelligence . . . John brings a unique set of skills to these challenges."

George W. Bush
Nomination Ceremony
February 17, 2005
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 02:56 AM
Response to Original message
23. It's a really important city. The indigenous cultural center.
Many of the people in Oaxaca are Indios-- they still speak their original languages. It's a really wonderful place. A very leftist population as well. These are the folks who got all their land stolen from the white Mexicans. I'm not surprised.

I really loved it there. Too many white hippies permanently stoned on mushrooms living there though.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 04:37 AM
Response to Original message
28. Thanks for all these informative posts! Oaxaca sounds totally intriguing
especially because of the indigenous rebellion! But I didn't know about the Mexican law forbidding foreigners from political speech or action. I have a friend who attended the WTO protests in Cancun (where the amazing third world country rebellion against the WTO occurred, led by Brazil, and supported by millions of campesinos around the world), and I didn't hear a thing about restrictions on foreigners at protests, and there were many foreign protesters. Although not directed at Mexico, the protests certainly would have nettled Vicente Fox and his corporate cabal. But the Mexican police were well-behaved.

I wonder who and what this law was aimed at. And would it include, say, Karl Rove writing Calderon's attack ads against Lopez Obrador, or Bushites pouring over ChoicePoint Mexican voter data and feeding purge data to PAN? (--two likely violations of the Mexican law).

I'd go there anyway, if I could, just to see democracy and the Latin American Leftist revolution in action. I think it would be thrilling. People who fear Latin American revolutions are living in the past. The New Left revolution is not threatening. It is entirely peaceful. And Mexicans have never been anti-foreigner. They are the kindest, friendliest people in the world.

The people who are rebelling in Oaxaca are teachers and farmers and union members, people with a substantive investment in the community--it is not any wild-eyed kind of thing, from what I've read. It is a very serious and deepseated, and well-organized. I would love to witness it, even it I had to keep my lip zipped.

We need that revolutionary spirit here! Our democracy is dying--or rather it's being killed by the Bushites and Corporate Rulers. We need inspiration.

Imagine 1.2 million people coming out to protest a stolen election! That is very impressive!

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Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 05:07 AM
Response to Original message
30. Viva la revolución de la gente!
I read that article. Farmers, miners, teachers, apparently workers from all walks of life--they're upset and they won't be stomped on any longer by the rich and powerful. They demand to be heard. Let their voices ring!
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raggedcompany Donating Member (399 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 07:39 AM
Response to Original message
33. I spent two and a half weeks in Oaxaca
Left a bit of my youth there in a way. Wonderful town. It makes me sad to hear that protesters are damaging buildings, vandalizing, etc. Stupid, stupid stupid.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #33
36. You may want to check Peace Patriot's post #17
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2405744#2406144

If you've read American papers concerning demonstrations over the years, you'll remember the unfortunate truth that corporate media tends to misstate situations concerning protest events wildly.

You must remember the outrageously bogus things written concerning the population in New Orleans after the hurricane/flood which were shown later to be absolutely beyond all doubt total fantasy, all regurgitated racial fear and hatred.

Considering these many, many deliberate attempts to discredit legitimate protest over the years, a lot of people tend to regard what they hear/read like this with skepticism, and not simply swallow it whole. If you helplessly let the media form your reactions for you, you will be misled.
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Laotra Donating Member (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 10:17 AM
Response to Original message
37. LOL!
Newsday is bit late and out of touch...

Oaxaca has been taken over by first striking teachers since May and now citizens movement that grew out of the teachers strike after the PRI governor send 3000 police to kick out the teachers. It was the police that got kicked out, and now the citizens movement has taken over not only Oaxaca City but mony other municipalities which had been ruled by party-politics (most Oaxacan municipalities have been ruled by indigenous traditional direct democracy). The governor, whose resignation the citizens movement demands, is not in control but the rebelling people's movement, lead by teachers. If Cameron wins by making deal with PRI, he is likely to send the federal army to quell the revolution in Oaxaca.

AFAIK, Guelaguetza dance festival is not cancelled, only the commercial touristy show-event, it's now genuine people's festival.

Narconews has reported extensively about Oaxada, check: http://www.narconews.com

Latest stories:
http://www.narconews.com/Issue42/article1964.html
http://www.narconews.com/Issue42/article1966.html
http://www.narconews.com/Issue42/article1977.html
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Laotra Donating Member (479 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
40. The Popular Assembly lodges legal denunciation of Governor Ruiz
http://narcosphere.narconews.com/story/2006/7/22/105442/616

The Popular Assembly lodges legal denunciation of Governor Ruiz
By Nancy Davies,
Posted on Sat Jul 22nd, 2006 at 10:54:42 AM EST
Acting as alternative government of the state of Oaxaca, the Popular Assembly of the People of Oaxaca (APPO) has moved on the legal front to oust the governor of the state. On June 21 the nine-page legal complaint was handed to the national Congress.

Based on the Constitution of the United States of Mexico, APPO issued its formal denunciation of Governor Ulises Ruiz Ortiz. The denunciation calls for revocation of his post as Governor of the Free and Sovereign State of Oaxaca.

The call for Ruiz’ removal was composed and signed by seventy-two civil organizations, and members of CIESAS, the top-ranked institute for the study of society and anthropology in Mexico. It was handed to the legislature of Mexico on July 16, one month after the governor ordered a pre-dawn attack on sleeping teachers from the teachers union Section 22. Some teachers were accompanied by children and family members in their encampment in the zocalo of Oaxaca City. The attack was made by police supported by helicopters firing tear gas canisters.
Within days the teachers’ strike had changed into a state-wide popular social movement, with its single demand the removal of Governor Ruiz. Ruiz is a member of the Partido Revolucionario Democratico, the PRI, which has controlled Oaxaca for more than seventy-five years.

The denunciation is being circulated to the national and foreign press. Meanwhile, outbreaks of the struggle to control town governments continue throughout the state. On July 20 the blockade and occupation of the government buildings for the legislature, juridical offices, and executive offices of Oaxaca organized by APPO were carried out.



http://narcosphere.narconews.com/story/2006/7/22/105442/616

FORMAL APPLICATION FOR IMPEACHMENT AND REVOCATION OF THE MANDATE OF C. ULISES ERNESTO RUIZ ORTIZ, CONSITUTIONAL GOVERNOR OF THE FREE AND SOVEREIGN STATE OF OAXACA
HONORABLE CONGRESS OF THE UNION

Based on what is available in the Political Constitution of the United States of Mexico in articles 1, 8, 39, 74 section V, 76 section V, VI and VII, article 110 second paragraph, as well as what is stipulated in the Federal Law of Administrative Responsibilities of Public Servants, articles 5, 6, 7, 8 and 10, and in virtue of the fact that in Oaxaca constitutional order has been disrupted and legality and state of law violated, the undersigned, members of Oaxacan civil society organizations, submit for consideration to this Honorable Legislative Assembly the present Formal Application for the Impeachment and Revocation of the Mandate of C. Ulises Ernesto Ruiz Ortiz, Constitutional Governor of the Free and Sovereign State of Oaxaca.

1.EXPOSITION OF MOTIVES

1.1 Background

State elections of August 1, 2004 opened up a complicated political situation in Oaxaca and have shaped a cycle of political repression that still has yet to end. The victory of the candidate from the New Citizens’ Force of the Revolutionary Institutional Party (PRI), Ulises Ruiz Ortiz, was challenged by the opposition coalition We All Are Oaxaca which argued that there was fraud in the electoral contest. This election was settled in the Electoral Tribunal of Judicial Power of the Federation the 17th of November of 2004. During plenary session, the Electoral Tribunal declared valid the election in favor of the elected Governor Ulises Ruiz Ortiz (Juicio de Revisión Constitucional Electoral Expediente SUP-JRC-205/2004). ANEX 1

The victory of the PRI to government and the majority of the local councils inaugurated a process of citizen mobilization and denouncement of electoral fraud. Meanwhile, the municipal elections of October of that same year, 2004, as much through the channels of the political parties as through “usos y costumbres”, installed an unpublicized scenario consisting of a close struggle for the local powers. This electoral process of 2004 will go down in history as one of the most violent processes in the political tradition of Oaxaca. If it is that, in fact, elections in Oaxaca “are judged by the number of deaths that they bring” these elections do not pass the test, given that within only two months 5 political assassinations were recorded: Guadalupe Avila Salinas (San José Estancia Grande), Serafín García Martínez (Huautla de Jiménez), Lino Antonio (San Agustín Loxicha), Faustino Acevedo Bailón (San Blas Atempa) and Enrique Martínez (San José Tenango). (Reporte del Colectivo por la Democracia, Oaxaca 6 October, 2004). ANEX 2

From the beginning of the current state administration headed by Ulises Ruiz Ortiz, there were grave violations of the Political Constitution, of the section of individual guarantees, that caught the attention of national and international human rights’ bodies. During the period between January and July of 2005, the government of Oaxaca received warnings and observations from: the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights, the High Commissioner of Human Rights of the United Nations, the North American State Department, the Central Intelligence Agency, Amnesty International, the Inter-American Press Association, the Ecumenical Office for Peace and Justice of Germany, and at the national level, the National Commission for Human Rights (CNDH). (El Cambio Inconcluso. Avances y Desaciertos en Materia de Derechos Humanos Durante el Gobierno de Fox. Informe Human Rights Watch, 2006). ANEX 3

In the year 2005 alone the CNDH sent out three warnings to the Government of the State of Oaxaca, for the following reasons: a) For violation of the freedom of expression and society’s collective right to receive information, committed against the journalists Jorge Fernández Menéndez, Leopoldo Mendivil, warning 04/2005 on 18 March, 2005. b) For violation the of legal securities in the illegal detention by the Oaxaca Procurator of Justice's Office, committed against Jaquelina Lópes Almazán, Samuel Hernández Morales, Carlos Cruz Mozo Y Giloberto Canseco Carmona, warning 08/2005 on 19 April 2005 c) For violation of the right to freedom of expression and information, committed against the newspaper Noticias, warning 013/2005 on 10 June 2005 (VI Informe de la Red Oaxaquña de Derechos Humanos, Oaxaca, México) ANEX 4

The human rights’ situation that currently prevails in the State of Oaxaca is symptomatic of the national situation, given that a climate of flagrant and systematic violations of human rights persists in this entity. This situation has reached a level of utmost gravity and is evolving towards a set of circumstances that put to serious risk Oaxaca 's peaceful coexistence, governance and institutional order.

In this political environment, the functions of the governmental bodies of the state – the Local Congress, the General Secretary of Government, the State Procurator of Justice’s Office, the Secretary of Citizen Protection, the Office of Public Security—serve to deepen this grave crisis. It is precisely these bodies that contribute to the breakdown of the legal order , the violations of constitutional guarantees, the detoriaration of institutions , and the degradation of fundamental human rights. Without doubt Oaxaca is going through a process of political recession, to the point of showing signs of authoritarianism.

1.2 Violations of Human Rights and Constitutional Guarantees

A brief but necessary count of the human rights’ violations and of the situations that could constitute infringements of the constitutional guarantees of this state, carried out by the Government of Ulises Ruiz Ortiz between December of 2004 and June of 2006, can be resumed as follows:

Illegal detention of social and political leaders. Although the number of political prisoners of the state government is to date unknown, it is worth mentioning a few of them: of the organization Consejo Indigena Popular de Oaxaca (CIPO), 23 people were detained in the forced evacuation of the 22nd of December of 2004; of the organization Coordinadora Oaxaqueña Magonista Popular Antineoliberal (COMPA), which is at the root of the conflict in the municipality of Santiago Xanica, 7 people were detained; of the Juquileño Citizens’ Movement, in the violent evacuation of the municipal palace, 69 people were detained; of the municipality of San Juan Lalana, in which the people initiated a caravan march to the City of Oaxaca demanding respect for their political rights, 19 people were detained; of the Popular Revolutionary Front 5 people were detained; from both the Frente Unico Huautleco and from the municipality of Mazatlan Villa de Flores, 1 person was detained. All of these arrests were made for political motives or against resistance movements, affirming the fact that Ulises Ruiz’s government has filled the prisons with political prisoners in his first six months of government. (VI Informe de la Red Oaxaqueña de Derechos Humanos, Oaxaca, Mexico 2005). ANEXO 5

Other violent events in this period include the following: In the municipality of Maztlán Villa de Flores Ángel Ortega Prieto and Pedro Carrera were assassinated, also due to motives of a political nature. In San Blas Atempa, during the violent eviction of the Popular Council during the month of March of the year 2006, 10 persons were detained and 94 orders of apprehension are still to be executed. As a result of the failed forced evacuation of the teachers from the historical center of the City of Oaxaca the 14th of June of 2006, 14 oaxacan teachers were detained. There exist 10 criminal charges relating to the abuse of authority, robbery, damages, and injuries that have been brought to the Special Attorney of Teacher Issues. Similarly, during this same period political crimes were committed against César Toimil Roberts, the Municipal President of Ixtepec City, Oaxaca.

1.2.2 Violation of the Right to Freedom of Expression and Society’s Collective Right to Information

Attack on Liberty of Expression. The assault on the printing presses of the newspaper “Noticias” on November 30, 2004, one day before Ulises Ruiz Ortiz took over the office of governor, and the July 17, 2005 kidnapping of 31 workers following the violent eruption upon the buildings of that very newspaper, under the pretext of a strike implemented by people outside of the business, followed by the harassment by the State Police of independent sellers for distributing the newspaper, constitutes one of the strongest offenses to freedom of expression that has occurred in this state. With such actions the government of the state infringes the Political Constitution of the United States of Mexico, the American Convention on Human Rights, the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, and the Declaration of Principles on Freedom of Expression. (Comisión Nacional de Derechos Humanos, warning 013/2005. June 10, 2005). ANEX 6

1.2.3 Violation of Political Rights and the Right to Free Election

Political Rights and the Right to Free Election. In addition to the official city councils voted in by the elections of 2004, 5 popular city councils have been created in municipalities of the state, since due to the violations of their right to a free election these municipalities have had no other option than to set up their own authorities on the margin of the state institutions. These city councils are in: Jalapa del Marqués, San Blas Atempa, Santa Catarina Juquila, San Juan Lalana and Mazatlán Villa de Flores. In these city councils violent evacuations have occurred as well as other actions of force on the part of the State. The interpretation that has been made of these events is as follows: a) Lacking a capacity for dialogue and political operation, the government has opted to offer repressive responses rather than political ones to the municipal conflicts, b) the local movements are set on affronting the regional cacicazgos without fear c) the internal disintegration of the PRI and the violation of rules by regional officers and local representatives is generating a deterioration of the political life in a high number of Oaxaca municipalities. (Análisis de Coyuntura Politica, Servicios para una Educación Alternativa A.C. EDUCA. February 2005.) ANEXO 7

1.2.4 Violation of Territorial Rights

Agrarian Conflicts and Territorial Rights. It is well known that in the state of Oaxaca a high number of agrarian conflicts continue to persist. A few years ago a historical number of 600 territorial conflicts was reached, 10% of which have been considered of high intensity. Nevertheless, during the present administration, territorial conflicts have stemmed from confrontations and ambushes in the regions of Sierra Sur, Mixteca, Costa y Papaloapan; up to the present time there have been at least seven deaths, seven wounded, 60 displaced families and five houses lit on fire in these zones. Within this context it is important to mention the conflict that arose between the communities of Santa Cruz Nundaco y San Isidro Vista Hermosa in 2005. This situation has resulted in 3 injured and 38 detained, among them 16 children. Despite the appearance of having reached a solution, the agrarian problems have intensified during the current administration and in some cases have surpassed the point where the government could have the capacity to act as an intermediary.

1.2.5 Violation of the Right to Freedom of Religion

Attacks on the Right to Freedom of Religion. In only the first two hundred days of government there have been 14 assaults on Catholic temples, involving the robbery of sacred art, including the recent desecration of the Metropolitan Cathedral. The most serious of these attacks was the assault on the Sanctuary of Santa Catarina Juquila and the kidnapping of Father Alberto Pacheco, at the hands of unknown culprits. All of these situations constitute events of utmost seriousness, lest we forget that the crime of Father Mauro Andrés Carreño, which occurred in 1998, has yet to be resolved.

1.2.6 Violations of the Rights of Women

Crimes Against Girls and Women. According to data from the INEGI between 1999 and 2003, 351 homicides of girls and women occurred in the state of Oaxaca; the local press reports 267 homicides between 1999-2005 and the Procurator-General of Justice’s Office reports 52 assassinations between January 2004 and June 2005, along with 26 violations in the last year and a half. An investigation by the Federal Congress of 10 entities of the state confirms that feminicide exists in Oaxaca. Though the numbers themselves clearly illustrate the seriousness of the problem, the administration of Ulises Ruiz has neither taken effective action nor allocated the resources necessary to attend to this phenomenon that affects the entire society. While the governor of the state assures he is committed to protecting the human rights of women, in reality, inefficiency, lack of sensitivity, and negligence dominate within the bodies of government in charge of the issue. (Archivo Colectivo Huaxyacac, Network of civil organizations that work with gender and women issues Oaxaca 2005).

1.2.7 Violation of International Agreements on Human Rights Issues

Vulnerability of Public Institutions of Human Rights: The State Commission on Human Rights (CEDH) of Oaxaca currently lacks credibility; The naming of its head, Jaime Mario Pérez Jiménez, placed in doubt the government’s commitment to supporting the consolidation of truly autonomous human rights organizations. The President of the State Commission on Human Rights is plainly identified with the political group currently in state power, having acted as legal advisor for Ulises Ruiz Ortiz when he was campaigning, and in addition has played a questionable role when it comes to defending human rights. Civil Society’s independent human rights organizations have broken formal relations with said commission. The CEDH has been accused of being a decorative institution, whose role has become subordinate to the government’s interests. Its silence and failure to react in the face of events that have shaken the national consciousness has been shocking. Included in this list of events, just to mention a few, are massacres of peasants, jailings of indigenous prisoners, violence against women, persecutions of social leaders, political instability, and misgovernance. (Profile of the Ombudsman, “Para Todos los Derechos del Pueblo, Un Verdadero Defensor,” Colectivo por la Democracia, Oaxaca 2005.) ANEX 11

1.2.8 Violations of the Right of Suffrage

In Oaxaca practices of vote buying and conditioning continue to persist. There can be found numerous evidences of irregularities that constitute electoral crimes, such as: stockpiles of materials and food provisions in official warehouses, delivery of tools and food provisions, applications for electoral credentials, payoffs for assisting campaign meetings, and promises of public services or fulfillment of social programs. The Government of the State has taken advantage of the marginalization and extreme poverty within the state, especially in the indigenous areas. Of these practices, the most distressing is the conditioning of the vote of 10,000 taxi drivers who are allowed by the state government to operate irregular franchises, This was done by the current administration precisely in anticipation of the electoral contest to allow them to manipulate the taxi drivers, who now become hostage to voting for the PRI and the Alliance for Mexico.

1.3 Repression of the Teachers’ Movement

For more than over 25 years the teacher movement in Oaxaca, year after year, has presented the state with concrete labor demands. On May 15, 2006 70,000 teachers mobilized to demand the rescaling of their salaries due to the increase in the cost of living in the state. From the beginning, they proposed contributing 600 million in order to reach the 1,400 million pesos necessary (Noticias, May 16, 2006). Enrique Rueda Pacheco, leader of the teachers, appeared fully willing to negotiate a solution. However, according to the head of the teacher union, the government had initiated a campaign against the teachers consisting of radio and televisions spots presented by a State Association of Family Parents in order to create a current of public opinion adverse to the movement. According to the head of the teachers, in statements to the press on May 15, this was done to establish a current of opinion that would allow the use of the “politics of force.” (Noticias, May 16, 2006).

Faced with no negotiations and unwillingness for dialogue on the part of the government, on the 22nd of May the teachers decided to set up an encampment in 50 streets in the center of the city of Oaxaca. The encampment began May 23, and its members announced they wished to dialogue directly with the governor of the state. Meanwhile, the president of Coparmex José Escobar Gómez, asked the government and the teachers to “initiate a dialogue and to try and do so as quickly as possible, as the losses suffered from only 2 days of the teacher’s encampment are great.” (Noticias 24 May 2006). Ulises Ruiz Ortiz took no notice of these pleas and practiced a policy of deaf ears. He argued that the government had offered what it could and would offer nothing else. In place of dialogue the governor initiated a campaign of support for his policy and against the teachers, summoning the presidents of municipalities and pressuring them to declare themselves against the teachers. 23 days later, the government did not only refuse to dialogue but put into action what the head of the teacher union had predicted, “the politics of force” ANEX 13

In an attempt to forcefully evict the teachers from their encampment in the city center, at 4:30 a.m. on the 14th of June the police surrounded the teachers and pushed them back to evacuate them from the city, invaded the facilities of the teacher’s union, destroyed the facilities of “Radio Plantón,” burned the belongings of the teachers, and from an helicopter belonging to the State Public Security Office the police fired tear gas, paralyzing gas, and pepper gas. These devices not only landed on the streets of the historic center, but on homes and public buildings like the Oaxacan Museum of Contemporary Arts, where 6 containers of these “stun bombs” were recovered. These gas bombs affected the teachers, as well as the men, women, and children who reside in the historical center, and the police themselves. The governor that day made false statements; false in the sense that they argued the evacuation had been performed in a peaceful manner and that the different police corps involved carried no firearms. In fact, however, different types of firearms where indeed used.

In this repressive action motivated by the government of the state, participated the following police corps: the Special Operations Police Unit (UPOE), the Tactical Intervention Ministerial Unit (UMIT), the State Preventive Police, the Special Operations Group of the City of Oaxaca (GOE), and the Municipal Police. This operation also had the support of the helicopter with license plate number XAUCJ, arms of high caliber R-15, and gas bombs and gas grenades of tear and pepper gas.

The Red Cross attended to 172 people which where transferred to various hospitals throughout the city. The Secretary of Health attended 31 people. In the ISSSTE hospital 19 people were admitted. In the IMSS hospital 85 people were attended. Additionally, hundreds of people with less serious afflictions such as confusion, burns, injuries, high blood pressure, anxiety and fear were attended that day by medical volunteers, medical students, and rank and file workers of the Section XXXV of the Social Security. ANEX 16

2. BASIS AND MOTIVATION

The police operation implemented by Governer Ulises Ruiz Ortiz, was a great failure with great social costs to the civil population. This action only served to show the government’s incapacity to govern Oaxaca in a harmonious manner. The response of the government to these events was to state “In Oaxaca there is nothing happening.” This statement is consistent with the administration’s manner of exercising power; a policy of repeating lies and concealing the truth.

This review of the data and other information about the severity of the conditions in the State of Oaxaca clearly demonstrates a political crisis and outlines a sequence of social instabilities that could completely fracture the system of governance in Oaxaca. There exists an evident deterioration of political relations and a tendency towards the escalation of social conflicts, this due to the null and void division of powers, the biased application of the law, the persecution of social leaders, and the apathy of the government towards the conflicts of diverse characters present in Oaxaca.

The Government of the State of Oaxaca is responsible for acting and failing to act in manners that have resulted in harm to the public interest, some of these are: affronts to the democratic institutions of the state and the federation; systematic and serious violations of individual and social guarantees; the infraction of federal laws and the Constitution; the usurpation of tax money and the abuse of authority; attacks on the right to free suffrage.

Considering all that precedes, we consider that it is appropriate to initiate the process of impeachment of the Governor of the State of Oaxaca, Ulises Ruiz Ortiz, given that as a result of his actions the government has violated the Political Constitution of the United Sates of Mexico and the Federal Law of Administrative Responsibilities of Public Servants. In accordance with the General Constitution, article 110, which establishes that “…Governors of the States…may be subject to impeachment…” It additionally states that “ The Chamber of Representatives will process the corresponding accusation to the Chamber of Senators …considering the accusations the Chamber of Senators will decide on an suitable sentence, and apply the sanction under a 2/3 vote of those present at the session…”

3. OAXACAN SOCIETY FORMALLY DEMANDS IMPEACHMENT

In Oaxaca constitutional order has been notoriously broken and legality and the state of law have been violated. Faced with all of this we consider it urgent that the Federal Government intervene through the Congress of the Union—the Chamber of Representatives as accusatory body and the Chamber of Senates as a judge of sentence-- so that in compliance with its attributes and abilities, the constitutional order that has been so violated may be restored in the State of Oaxaca.

Therefore, based on what is available in the Political Constitution of the United States of Mexico in articles 1, 8, 39, 74 section V, 76 section V, VI and VII, article 110 second paragraph, as well as what is stipulated in the Federal Law of Administrative Responsibilities of Public Servants, articles 5, 6, 7, 8 and 10, we request the beginning of the process of impeachment of the State Executive with the aim of the removal of Ulises Ernesto Ruiz Ortiz from the office of Governor of Oaxaca.

Oaxaca de Juárez, Oaxaca. June 15, 2006.

Ana María Hernández Cárdenas
Miguel Ángel Vásquez de la Rosa
Margarita Dalton Palomo
Mario Hernández Martínez
Juan Carlos Martínez

OAXACAN CIVIL SOCIETY

Consorcio para el Diálogo Parlamentario y la Equidad AC (Oaxaca), Colectivo Nueva Babel AC, Centro para los Derechos de la Mujer Ñääxuiin AC, Grupo de Apoyo a la Educación de la Mujer GAEM, Liga Mexicana por la Defensa de los Derechos Humanos AC, Comité Civil de Resistencia Civil San Blasena Zapoteca, Universidad de la Tierra en Oaxaca AC, Centro de Encuentros y Diálogos Interculturales AC, UCIZONI AC, UNOSJO SC, Fundación Comunalidad AC, Centro de Apoyo al Movimiento Popular Oaxaqueño CAMPO AC, Organización de Agricultores Biológicos ORAB AC, Centrarte AC, Sinergia para el Desarrollo Integral Sustentable AC, Ojo de Agua Comunicación, PROCAO AC, Centro Anhata, Ixcaxochitl AC, Orgánica San Agustín, Espiral por la Vida AC, Iniciativas para el Desarrollo de la Mujer Oaxaqueña IDEMO AC, Foro Oaxaqueño de la Niñez, Centro de Apoyo al Niño de la Calle de Oaxaca CANICA AC, Grupo Mesófilo AC, Centro de Estudios de la Mujer y la Familia AC, Nueve Lunas SC, Grupo de Estudios sobre la Mujer Rosario Castellanos AC, Centro de Atención y Formación Humanista AC, Alternativas para la Equidad y la Diversidad AC, Habitantes del Centro Histórico de la Ciudad de Oaxaca, Pueblo Jaguar AC, Comité de Vigilancia Ciudadana, La Ventana AC, Binigulazaa AC, Promotora de Servicios para el Desarrollo PRODER SC, Centro de Derechos Indígenas Flor y Canto AC, Capacitación y Planeación Comunitaria AC, Observatorio por los Derechos Humanos y la Democracia, Centro Regional de Derechos Humanos Bartolomé Carrasco AC, Red Oaxaqueña de Derechos Humanos, Semilla del Sur, Codice AC, Chamixezacui AC, Niño a Niño México AC, Colonias Unidas de Oaxaca AC, Asociación de Educación e Integración del Niño Dawn Oaxaqueño, Escuincles Traviesos AC, Yeni Navan SPR de RL, Vecinos del Fraccionamiento Casa del Sol, Red de Cafeticultores 5 de diciembre AC, Sociedad de Producción Rural La Esperanza de RL, Sociedad Cooperativa Oganización de Mujeres Eloxochitecas, Margarita Magón de R. L., Consejo Central Indígena de Eloxochitlán, Unión de Comunidades Campesinas Marginadas AC, SPR de Apicultores de Eloxochitlán de RL, Lina Herrera, Nallely Moreno Moncayo, Instituto de la Naturaleza y la Sociedad de Oaxaca, INSO SC, Servicios para una Educación Alternativa EDUCA AC, Centro de Derechos Humanos Ñu’uji Kandí AC, Tequio Jurídico AC, Eccos AC; Enlace, Comunicación y Capacitación Oaxaca, AC; Taller de Desarrollo Comunitario AC, Xochipilli AC, DECA Equipo Pueblo AC, Tendiendo Puentes AC; Taller Bambú de Litografía y Grabado, Clínica del Pueblo Ana Seethaler, Centro de Desarrollo Comunitario Centéotl AC, Cooperativa de Mujeres TEJA TREIG, AC, Centro de Formación AC, Asamblea Comunitaria Indígena Mazateca y Nahuatl.

(Official translation from the Popular Assembly of the People of Oaxaca)



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stepnw1f Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
41. any Photos???? (nt)
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
46. Well, posters, here's one for the record books!
Talk about sneaky, dirty, low-life propagandizing from a U.S. newspaper. The Miami Herald, which caters to the completely extremist, right-wing raving lunataic segment of the Cuban population has decided to engage in a little more post-election perception manipulation in extreme favor of Felipe Calderon:
Posted on Sat, Jul. 22, 2006
MEXICO
Calderón's views rooted in devotion to the churchMexico's apparent president-elect, Felipe Calderón, traces his political roots to a turbulent period in the country's history when public expression of religion was banned.
BY KEVIN G. HALL
McClatchy News Service

MORELIA, Mexico - The roots of Felipe Calderón's likely ascent to Mexico's presidency lie in one of the darkest periods of the country's history, when the public expression of religion was banned, Roman Catholic churches and chapels were closed and priests were forbidden to wear clerical garb or voice opinions on public affairs.

Calderón's father was among the many who took up arms in defense of the church, and it was that sense of persecution that led him in 1939 to join with other conservative Catholics to found the National Action Party, or PAN in its Spanish initials, the party whose banner Calderón appears to have carried to victory.

Unless Mexico's Federal Electoral Tribunal overturns the disputed July 2 election, Calderón will be the first Mexican president whose life is steeped in the brand of conservative Catholicism that gave rise to the Cristero guerrilla movement, which fought against the anticlerical policies of Mexico's ruling generals from 1926 to 1929.

How Calderón's background will affect church-state relations in Mexico, which until the 1990s had some of the toughest laws separating church and state in the world, is unknown.
(snip/...)
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/15096651.htm

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


(You remember their readers as the ones who thought there was a manifestation of the Virgin Mary in the bathroom mirror at Elián Gonzalez's great uncle's house (possibly a result of Lázaro's being drunk again), who thought God sent dolphins to surround and protect Elián during his ordeal (they didn't hear correctly that Sam Ciancio, the man who found the kid was FISHING FOR DOLPHIN FISH (not the mammals), whose kids are instructed at the Lincoln-Martí schools that Nixon was the victem of political games, etc., etc., etc.)
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #46
68. Interesting. What lies they won't tell?
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-22-06 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
49. America Ignores Mexican Election Fiasco
America Ignores Mexican Election Fiasco
by Randy Shaw‚ Jul. 21‚ 2006

The July 18 New York Times included another lengthy story on the after-effects of Ukraine’s controversial 2005 election. Although this contest involved presidential candidates unknown to most Americans, and occurred in a country with little strategic connection to America, the story of people taking to streets in an “Orange Revolution” to protest election fraud dominated our media for weeks. This ongoing coverage of alleged Ukrainian election fraud stands in sharp contrast to the scant coverage of alleged improper ballot counting in Mexico’s recent election. Even Intense media coverage of the US Senate’s recent immigration hearings ignored links between Mexico’s denial of democracy and increased immigration to America. Why did protests in a distant country that little impacts America get broader and more sympathetic media attention than similar events in Mexico? Once again, the answer involves both politics and race.

The politics of the Ukraine do not usually make the list of top-100 issues of importance to Americans. Yet in 2005, the American media was running daily stories on reports of election fraud that apparently cheated the pro-West presidential candidate out of victory.

Why such major coverage? One reason is that the American government supported the candidate cheated out of victory. Another reason is that the American media is not troubled by scenes of Eastern Europeans taking to the streets in the way that they are when covering mammoth protests in Bolivia, Venezuela, Mexico, and other Spanish-speaking countries.

What is astonishing about the media silence about Mexico is that America has recently had millions take to the streets over immigrants’ rights, and both the left and right are focused on the issue. People on all sides agree that there is a connection between Mexico’s internal politics and increased immigration.
(snip/...)

http://www.beyondchron.org/articles/Why_America_Ignores_Mexico_Election_Fiasco_3503.html
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #49
69. It's only a time bomb being ignored!
Edited on Sun Jul-23-06 10:16 AM by lonestarnot
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 11:03 AM
Response to Original message
71. Now you've seen EVERYTHING! Note this NY Times headline:
Loser in Mexico presidential vote adds fuel to protesters' ire
By James C. McKinley Jr. The New York Times

Published: July 23, 2006


MEXICO CITY As he fights his election defeat in court, the losing leftist candidate in Mexico says he has been the victim of a broad conspiracy among the incumbent, election officials, other party leaders and business tycoons to rob him of the presidency.

The candidate, Andrés Manuel López Obrador, charged in an interview Friday that the July 2 vote had been plagued by fraud and by widespread human errors. He made it clear that he would not accept any ruling from the special electoral court short of an order to recount all 41 million ballots.

How far he would take acts of civil disobedience to protest the results would be guided by "the feelings of the people," he said.

Without a recount, he said, the peace of the country is in jeopardy, a threat his opponents have said amounts to blackmail.
(snip/...)

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/07/23/news/mexico.php

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


And yet right-wing clowns continue to label this paper "lib'rul." Simply astounding.






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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-23-06 01:30 PM
Response to Original message
73. Whenever I see "Oaxaca"
I think of what good grass they use to grow. Now I have another reason to respect Oaxaca!

"The protest leaders, a mix of trade unionists and leftists, say their fight is not with the tourists but with Gov. Ulises Ruiz, whom they accuse of rigging the state election in 2004 and using force to repress dissent. Ruiz belongs to the Institutional Revolutionary Party, which has governed the state since 1929."

Sounds like it's time for a change!

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