"Killing people is like squashing an ant:" former US soldier (Pfc. Green)

[Barrett808]

WASHINGTON (AFP) - A former US soldier accused of raping and murdering an Iraqi girl compared killing people in Iraq to "squashing an ant," in an interview with a reporter about a month before the attack.

Steven Green, 21, a former private with the 101st Airborne Division, is under arrest in Kentucky and could face the death penalty if convicted of the March 12 murders of the Iraqi girl and three of her relatives.

Writing in Sunday's editions of The Washington Post, Andrew Tilghman, a former correspondent for the US military newspaper Stars and Stripes, said he interviewed Green several times in February at his unit south of Baghdad.

"I came over here because I wanted to kill people," he quoted Green as saying. "The truth is, it wasn't all I thought it was cracked up to be.

"I mean, I thought killing somebody would be this life-changing experience," Green was quoted as saying. "And then I did it, and I was like, 'All right, whatever.'

"I shot a guy who wouldn't stop when we were out at a traffic checkpoint and it was like nothing," Green was quoted as saying. "Over here, killing people is like squashing an ant.

"I mean, you kill somebody and it's like, 'All right, let's go get some pizza.'"

(more)

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060730/ts_alt_afp/iraqusmilitaryprobe

[IndianaGreen]

1. What a sociopath!

I wonder how many of his buddies feel the same way.

[0007]

8. This boy is from Midland Texas where junior got all his morals

What can one expect?

[xchrom]

12. lol -- junior got his morals from the conservative

folks in new hampshire -- or vermont -- or something like that.

[onyourleft]

13. Please, do not blame

New Hampshire (or Vermont). :P Wasn't he born in Connecticut?

[Critters2]

18. Born in Texas

Daddy was born in CT. Both went to high school in Massachusetts. Don't know of any VT or NH connection.

[TheCowsCameHome]

25. Daddy who? This misfit's daddy? Or Bush's daddy - CT?

[Critters2]

28. Bush's daddy

Old money, born in CT, raised in ME, went to Andover and Yale.

[Critters2]

29. Oops, I"ve wondered off topic, haven't I?

God, I need some sleep!

Sorry!

[TheCowsCameHome]

31. Bush 41 born in Milton, MA - Bush 43 born in New Haven, CT

[Critters2]

33. Hmmm...I was wrong

That's never happened before. Thanks for the correction! :hi:

[devinsgram]

67. Now here is a true human being,

A person who can admit when they are wrong, unlike those on the other side.

[Maine-ah]

61. no, they vacation in Maine.

He grew up in Midland, Texas.

[Zomby Woof]

74. Chimpy was born in New Haven, CT

[xchrom]

24. lol -- nobody wants that son of a bitch.

[saigon68]

26. TYPICAL OF A CERTAIN SECTOR OF THE MILITARY

THE ONES WHO JOIN TO KILL AND ARE REWARDED FOR IT

LIKE THESE GUYS

[City Lights]

16. Prolly got his jollies as a youngin blowin' up frogs.

Just like junior.

[ixion]

2. spoken like a bonafied psycho

:-(

[saigon68]

76. The Israelis or Hezzbolah could hire this guy

But I think he'd only work for the Israelis, he doesn't like Ragheads

[YOY]

3. If it's true, redeaming qualities = 0

Absolutely Zero.

[niyad]

4. is he trying for a section 8?

[Critters2]

19. Already discharged

An honorable discharge early due to a personality disorder. Why that would be "honorable" I can't imagine.

[Raydawg1234]

5. the big question is,

how many others like him are still in the army?

[IndianaGreen]

9. Beaucoup of them!

and the Pentagon is full of them.

[tanyev]

11. And what will they do here once they get back?

:scared:

[Webster Green]

6. Support the troops!

Yeah, right.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

15. This guy is not representative of all troops.

This guy is a sociopath.
Duckie

[Critters2]

20. We actually don't know whether he's representative

I mean, who signs up to kill people? That's what armies do.

[Catch22Dem]

35. I call bullshit on that...

I'm certainly no killer. None of the men and women I served with were killers. I didn't sign up to kill people, and know no one who did. That's not what armies "do." The definition of our military is to support and defend the Constitution. Now, when a dogshit president gets appointed by a corrupt court, then yes, he sends his army to kill, but that's not why the majority join. Shit man, I signed up to go to college and travel. I did both, and got out.

[Critters2]

41. Puhleeze

Most wouldn't know the Consitution from a pizza menu. I know a 3-star AF General who cares less about the Consitution than about his damned pension.

Defending the Constitution. Yeah, right.

[Catch22Dem]

45. Hey, we're talking about the PURPOSE of an army

Not the reality of it.

[Critters2]

47. The purpose of the military is to kill people and break things

The Constitution is its excuse, but not its purpose.

[Catch22Dem]

54. Other way around

The military was corrupted AFTER it was formed, not before.

[qnr]

69. Hmmm. Strange, I spent my time in the military saving people and trying

to fix things. The CG is just as "military" as any of the other services.

[Jamastiene]

66. Thank you and I'd like to add

that many of our national guard members signed up in the national guard with the idea that they would be defending the homeland only, not fighting some rich bastard's bloody oil war. They didn't ask for this. Furthermore, to imply that all our military service people are pychopaths who signed up only to kill is to give the right wingnuts more ammo against us. You CAN support our soldiers and our veterans without supporting this nasty, dirty, underhanded war.

[Anakin Skywalker]

82. Very Good Response.

I agree. Also, there are reasonable people in the military who are against bush and the rightwing's stupid wars.

[saigon68]

27. THERE ARE A LOT MORE LIKE HIM THAN MOST HERE WOULD

WANT TO BELIEVE

They are indispensable in times of war

they love to wallow in blood.

And to the flamers out there, --- how did a psycho like this make it to Iraq-Nam in the first place?

He wanted to KILL and

PERHAPS EVEN RAPE

OOPS HE DID THAT !!!

[YellowRubberDuckie]

37. They've been suckered.

It's not their fault they've been lied to that they're doing something noble for their country.
Duckie

[saigon68]

62. Fault has nothing to do with Rape and Murder

[wickerwoman]

63. But this guy said he joined specifically because he wanted to kill people.

Not because he wanted to defend America. He wasn't suckered- he knew damn well what he was getting into and was even disappointed that killing wasn't all it was cracked up to be.

I think there are a fair number of uniform fetishists and sociopaths who are attracted to jobs like the military or the police and in these times when the military is relaxing it's screening procedures to meet quotas more and more of them are going to slip through.

[54anickel]

50. Now I have Alice's Restaurant stuck in my head!

And I went up there, I said, "Shrink, I want to kill. I mean, I wanna, I
wanna kill. Kill. I wanna, I wanna see, I wanna see blood and gore and
guts and veins in my teeth. Eat dead burnt bodies. I mean kill, Kill,
KILL, KILL." And I started jumpin up and down yelling, "KILL, KILL," and
he started jumpin up and down with me and we was both jumping up and down
yelling, "KILL, KILL." And the sargent came over, pinned a medal on me,
sent me down the hall, said, "You're our boy."

[saigon68]

64. Guthrie was a few Decades ahead of his time

[Seabiscuit]

73. Not really. He was just as spot-on then as he is now.

He wrote that song during the Vietnam quagmire.

[pecwae]

68. Even serving in peace time

I saw more than my share of those consumed with bloodlust. A captain at 4th PSYOPS circulated his original drawing of a troop holding a bloody brain in one hand and a heart in another with the caption "Winning hearts and minds everywhere." He looked like a little nerd and would never see combat, but blood and guts was his dream. SOCOM was bad enough, but the guys in Division were an insane lot!

[newspeak]

80. hmmm, reminds me of Arlo Guthrie

"I want to Kill"--"I want to blow things up, burn things and KILL"--"Son, your our man." (something to that effect) My daughter is in the Army, her boyfriend is in the Army--and they DO NOT WANT TO KILL. She heals, he repairs.

[coalition_unwilling]

77. Support our Oops! (n/t)

[daleo]

7. I wonder how many sociopaths make it to General?

Bush made it to president.

[Critters2]

42. I know one. nt

[coalition_unwilling]

78. RummyDummy made it to Secretary of Defense. (n/t)

[Judi Lynn]

10. The one great adventure he can never accomplish is overcoming

his depravity, and becoming a human being.

That's just out of reach for this guy.

On edit:

Our right-wing idiot NeoCon criminals should be damned pleased with their efforts to steal our government, and launch bogus wars, slaughtering thousands and thousands of helpless victems, using psychopaths like this one, and grinding up and casting aside the more human soldiers who simply got caught in the machine.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

14. I'm not saying this right...

But that is what military training does. It makes killers. I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying that's what they need them for. To kill people. With no remorse. If you have remorse, you aren't useful. That's what you do in war. He's the perfect product of what the training's goal was, and they reached that goal with this one. They fail most of the time.
Duckie

[atreides1]

17. That is such BS

Military training does not make killers, I served for 13 years, and I killed one person during Desert Storm, and it was a life changing experience.

I've been out for 15 years, and so far I haven't felt a need to take any more human lives, so I guess the training failed.

The military trains you to operate in a combat environment, it trains you to react to different situations, it does not train you to kill the first thing you see move, it trains you to kill only when neccessary not becuase they want you to enjoy it!!!!

Green was probably already this way, as are others, all the training did was to bring out who they truly are, and considering the low standards of the military for the last few years I won't be surprised if there are more Green's out there, just waiting for their chance to do the same thing.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

23. They why is it that every Marine I've ever talked to...

has told me they were trained to kill and kill well without feeling bad about it?

[superconnected]

32. you are dead on. The military is training soldiers to kill people.

And that's exactly what they do, when told.

The guy you're arguing with murdered on command.To justify murder he's going to use patrotism or any other idiot excuse. But the truth is, he took a human life - most likely by orders. He'll defend the killing machine (the military) just like parents of dead soldiers defend it. If they didn't they'd have to face the raw truth. Their kid was a murderer who got murdered, and fully deserved to. Their lives are fair game, when they're out killing someone else.

People(some not all) forget that part when remembering a fallen soldier - that they voluntered to run around with a gun and shoot people, and OMG got shot.

[Catch22Dem]

38. But you're talking about Marine infantrymen

That's just a small subset of the overall military. What about cooks, technicians, the guy who calibrates the scales at the hospital, the girl who does the promotion paperwork, etc, etc, etc... Not exactly trained killers. I shot an M-16 3 times in 8 years on a qualification range. They didn't teach me shit about killing anything.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

40. Exactly.

I was talking about a small group.
Duckie

[Critters2]

43. "Kill people and break things"

How many times have I heard vets describe their jobs this way!! Just right for sociopaths.

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

72. I was a jarhead

but never in combat. However, what I remember is being told that if you aren't on top of your game, then you will be the one who gets killed. Kind of like the Georgre C. Scott line as Patton, saying "the idea is not to die for your country, it's to make the poor bastard on the other side die for his".
In no way, shape or form were we taught to kill and not feel bad or feel good. The emphasis was on not gettting you or your squad killed..........

[pokercat999]

65. LOL I remember a ambush training class I had

in 1972. The Sgt giving the class started by shouting KILL< KILL< KILL< KILL, over and over maybe a hundred times, until the whole class was shouting it. Of course that was the "situation" we were learning to set-up. Ambush your enemy on a trail or road and totally destroy them without mercy. I later got to know the Sgt when he transferred to our outfit (MP Investigations) and he was a real sweetheart. We used to laugh about that class all the time, as once I got to know him, I know the hardest thing he could every do was kill someone. His real nature was to help and support others. The class was "acting", however, I'd never want to get caught in an ambush he set-up because he knew his "stuff".

[Catch22Dem]

36. I disagree

I was trained to fix aircraft avionics. So, if I couldn't kill without remorse, does that make me a less effective technician?

ON EDIT: Changed title because I was being an asshole when I shouldn't have. :(

[YellowRubberDuckie]

39. Yeah, but you're not infantry.

I was talking your everyday front line soldier. The ones that are driving up and down the highways in Baghdad to get the insurgents to come out and play. Not the ones that fix the aircraft or the ones who play with the computers or keep things running in the camps. I'm talking about the ones who do the killing, the defending, etc,etc.
Duckie

[Catch22Dem]

46. Right, and I understand that

That's exactly what I was point out though. The military isn't made up of just infantry, therefore the infantry alone cannot be representative of the military.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

48. I should have been more specific.

I suck.

[Catch22Dem]

52. No you don't

In all these years, I have NEVER had an issue with you. You're definitely one of my favs. My problem is, I get defensive when it comes to blanket statements about people in the military, because I know, whether they realize it or not, they're saying that about me. I understood what you meant, and I sincerely apologize for my outburst. I wish I hadn't said it that way, not to you.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

59. Thanks, I appreciate that...

But I do suck for making blanket statements. Most of the time it's accidental. I'm just used to people reading between the lines and realizing I don't mean anything by it. I know far too many viet nam vets who were fucked up by the military teaching them to kill, and I'm a little bitter. They're wonderful fathers and friends and I just wish I could somehow fix them.
Duckie

[Critters2]

44. What were those planes used for? nt

[Catch22Dem]

49. If you wanna call me a killer, go ahead

I mean, you've essentially done that already. How do you know I didn't work on C-9 Nightingales? Ambulance aircraft used for evacuating our troops as well as wounded civilians. I'm just trying to make the point that killing isn't the reason MOST people go into the military.

[Critters2]

51. It is the reason the military exists

and all military jobs enable killing.

[Catch22Dem]

53. ok

[Herkdrvr]

58. It's not that simple

While I will agree that the US military has the potential (and the stated mission) of carrying out violence against enemies, it is also the largest and most capable humanitarian force in the world as well.

I strongly disagree with your notion that people join the military to kill, or that they SHOULD join the military to kill. I didn't join for that reason. I joined, and chose my specialty, due to the myriad of other missions our military provides as a public service for our country, and for the world.

During Hurricane Katrina, for example, it it were not for the US military, thousands more would have perished, and indeed, the very flood protection the city of New Orleans DID have wouldn't have even existed (or would have existed on a much smaller scale) were it not for the US Army Corps of Engineers.

Not to demean the efforts that various organizations gave to help the survivors...after all, every little bit mattered...but no other organization short of the US military could have mounted such a large and massive rescue and recovery operation, as well as restore security in a city where nearly half the police force fled.

Every time you turned on the TV, did you see Red Cross helicopters plucking people from rooftops and flooded waters? Did you see Food Not Bombs C-130s and C-17s delivering 50,000 lbs of food at a time to ravaged areas? And were those folks patroling streets to prevent looting and crime from the Salvation Army? No...all those people and assets were from the US military.

While CNN was interviewing and running clips on Al Gore loaning his private jet to whisk a few dozen survivors to safety, military C-130 crews were quietly evacuating literally thousands of ill and wounded survivors to medical facilities across the country, and on the return trip, carrying in blankets, water, food and other supplies.

It was the US military, as well, that provided nearly 80-90% of the rescue and rebuilding forces in Indonesia and Thailand after the tsunami. It was US military aircraft that did the vast majority of the searches and rescues of Pakistanis after the earthquakes. And despite the tensions, the US military airlifted thousands of tons of supplies to Iran after it's huge earthquake a number of years ago.

Yes, the aircraft I fly can and has been used to carry out combat operations. We fly troops, ammo and other supplies into Iraq every day. We also carry out the wounded, including wounded Iraqis...and despite the busy pace of operations, we spared many of our aircraft to support the Pakistan relief operations at the expense of our operations in OIF. It was also our aircraft that carried Iraqi polling officials around the country during their first free elections in years. So yes, we do execute and train to fly combat troops into a war zone, and then supply them. But that is just the tip of the iceberg. To say that all we do is go around killing people is a pointedly uneducated statement.

As for the guy this thread is about...yes, there are some of those in service...but most of them get discharged. I knew a guy just like that when I joined the Army National Guard many years ago, and he was just as crazy...he was let go as well. The military wants professionals (ie, using your head, and using basic human discretion), not blind killers.

[last1standing]

21. These comments are from a month before the murder took place.

Why the Hell was still in the service? Why wasn't this reported to his superiors? And if it was reported then why didn't they do anything about it? I think we all deserve the answers to those questions. Either this reporter or Green's superiors need some time in jail for this.

[saigon68]

34. Green's superiors were probably urging this behavior on.

[Gully Foyle]

22. Buffalo Soldiers

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0252299/quotes
Ray Elwood: These were my guys. Fighting the dull fight. Soldiers with nothing to kill except time. They know that war is hell; but peace, peace is fucking boring.

Ray Elwood: "When there is peace, the warlike man attacks himself" - that's Nietzsche, and his point is that there really is no peace. There's always some war, somewhere, with someone. And there are no winners or losers either... just those who are still around to fight another day.

[ckramer]

30. I'm sure Steven Green will have a happy golden age

Nightmares? You kidding? Never ever!

[Amonester]

55. Yeah, but wait 'til he gets to the Pearly Gates...

"Thou shall not kill..." O8)

[superconnected]

56. That's what gets me the most about the religious right!

Instead it's all justification for murder.

Until America gets invaded(by someone other than mexico), I don't see a reason for america to be out killing people - "to protect us". I just can't seem to buy into the hate propaganda that the islamics want convert us or kill us. They've not made any press releases telling us that we should convert to islam....

[Minstrel Boy]

57. He told Stars and Stripes a month before the atrocity

that "I came over here because I wanted to kill people," and he wasn't immediately removed from duty?

I know, I know, I shouldn't be surprised. But my humanity can't help but be sometimes.

[me b zola]

60. So why don't we have articles about the other four that have been arrested

Why is Green the only one that we know anything about? The last article that I read about Green a few weeks ago included smearing his mother. Why?

DU has taught me to be a more critical reader and thinker than to just accept these articles describing Green's alleged sociopathology and not question why the emphesis is on him and why no word on the others involved in the atrocity. Why don't we know about their mothers and if they have ever had a dui?

[Blue_Tires]

71. good point

maybe the army is setting him up to take most or all of the blame while the others get a slap on the wrist

[Doctor_J]

70. It's Francis Soyer from Stripes

"Everybody calls me Psycho"

[krkaufman]

75. WTF?!? Why did this reporter not take action at the time?!?

Steven Green ... could face the death penalty if convicted of the March 12 murders of the Iraqi girl and three of her relatives.

Writing in Sunday's editions of The Washington Post, Andrew Tilghman, a former correspondent for the US military newspaper Stars and Stripes, said he interviewed Green several times in February at his unit south of Baghdad.

Had this reporter revealed the details of Green's quotes at the time, the girl and her family may not have been killed.

Of course, that assumes the military would have taken action.

[Julius Civitatus]

79. This is what happens when they let Beavis and Butthead in the army

Some psychological screening would have weeded out this psychopath.
This is sickening.

[anotherdrew]

81. this mad dog needs to be put down n/t