Activists take credit for juice poisoning

[seriousstan]

LOS ANGELES, Dec. 19 (UPI) -- Animal activists claim they have poisoned 487 bottles of POM Wonderful's juice on the U.S. Eastern seaboard to protest animal testing.

A POM Wonderful spokesman told United Press International the company has not confirmed the validity of the claim, but it was contacted by the FBI regarding the issue. The spokesman said the company is preparing a statement on the matter.

The North American Animal Liberation Press Office distributed a communiqué it received that claimed credit for the juice poisoning and was signed "animal rights militia." POM Wonderful, which makes pomegranate juice, has been a target of animal activists since it was revealed the company uses animals, such as newborn mice and rabbits, to test its juice and show its health benefits.

The communiqué does not detail what substance was allegedly put in the juice but says it isn't lethal.

http://www.upi.com/HealthBusiness/view.php?StoryID=20061219-093253-4881r

[hlthe2b]

1. OH, crap......

Words fail me...

[Pavulon]

2. What a great idea

pull a felony that would probably have a life sentence and if not bs could cause someones unintentional death.

[anotherdrew]

3. well these assholes are going to be in jail for the rest of their miserable lives

I'd love to get my hands on the provocateurs behind this latest madness.

[Last Stand]

143. Uh, Warden, we ordered the Vegan platters. This doesn't taste like tofu.

I have moer than enough of evil-do'ers committing misdeeds under the premise of a benevolent crusade. It's bullshit.

[Swede]

4. Now that's terrorism.

This is perfectly counterproductive to their cause.

[theHandpuppet]

16. Totally correct!

Bunch of assholes who will not only turn people off to their cause but will, I hope, have plenty of time for contemplation behind bars.

[originalpckelly]

105. Yep. I mean they're feeding the animals pom juice...

I think that's actually good. That's like a big treat for a little mousican.

[mike_c]

5. not bright, and not a particularly compelling target for animal rights...

...abuse, frankly. Not that that's particularly relevant, but there is some irony there.

[truthisfreedom]

6. WHAT??? They're protesting the testing of JUICE on BUNNIES by poisoning INNOCENT PEOPLE???

Are they completely out of their minds???

They're validating the claim by the far right that militant animal rights terrorists and ecoterrorists exist.

I think this is a plot to discredit legitimate rights groups by creating hatred for activists in general. In fact, I'm certain of it.

[Infinite Hope]

52. I agree. They're out of control. Juice? OMG!

Talk about taking a principle (not tampering with wildlife) and running with it. I would presume they don't feed their pets scraps, milk, or water from a faucet.

[SemperEadem]

7. It's this kind of disregard for basic common sense

that negates any good organizations like these may do. It is domestic terrorism and they should be prosecuted as terrorists.

[Canuckistanian]

8. Stupid bastards

If you want to make a point, fine. Just don't do it by targeting the innocent general public.

After all, look how much sympathy the Tylenol poisoner got.

[uppityperson]

9. Here are NAALPO's press releases

First is quick press release, second is "full communique".
http://www.animalliberationpressoffice.org/press_releases/pr_06_12_19_pom.htm

For Immediate Release
December 19, 2006
POM WONDERFUL JUICE CONTAMINATED BY ANIMAL RIGHTS MILITIA
Campaign Against Animal-Testing Company Escalates

Los Angeles: A communiqué received by the North American Animal Liberation Press office claims that four hundred and eighty seven bottles of POM Wonderful Juice have been contaminated on the Eastern seaboard of the United States. According to the anonymous statement, “those who drink the contaminated juice won't die like the animals in pom labs, but the diarrhea, vomiting and headaches will hopefully send a strong message that people will no longer allow innocent defenseless animals to be tormented and killed for a health juice ”. Calls to POM about intended actions to protect its customers have not been returned.

POM Wonderful Inc. has been steeped in controversy ever since People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA) discovered that the health juice company was using animals to test pomegranate juice in oxygen deprivation studies in newborn mice. The company also has severed the arteries of rabbits to study erectile dysfunction. PETA has asked POM to join Naked Juice Company and others who do not test on animals.

Animal rights activists in Los Angeles, where POM Wonderful is based, have engaged in demonstrations in the neighborhoods of the top executives of the company, including the company's owners Stewart and Lynda Resnick. During one of several pickets, the husband of one POM executive wielded a fireplace poker at activists, and at another, activists were assaulted by neighbors. Local Santa Monica police refused to arrest those who assaulted the activists, even though it was videotaped, instead choosing to confiscate the recorded evidence.

Several activists have been served with restraining orders by POM, and criminal charges have been filed for using a bullhorn. A web site called www.PomKills.com , created by a local activist, was taken down when POM Wonderful's legal team put pressure on the server host. On October 31 st of this year, Santa Monica Police Lt. Beautz obtained a fraudulent search warrant, which the Press Office has obtained, allowing the unlawful search and seizure at seven homes of local activists.

To read the full communiqué, visit: www.animalliberationpressoffice.org/communiques/2006-12-14_pom.htm

More information on PETA's campaign against POM Wonderful is at www.pomhorrible.com.

http://www.animalliberationpressoffice.org/communiques/2006-12-14_pom.htm
Communiqué from the Animal Rights Militia
Date: December 14, 2006
Institution targeted: POM Juice

received anonymously

in a well coordinated action, 487 bottles of pom wonderful juices were tampered with along the Eastern seaboard in stores like wlld oats, d'agostino's and food emporiums. those who drink the contaminated juice won't die like the animals in pom labs, but the diarrhea, vomiting and headaches will hopefully send a strong message that people will no longer allow innocent defenseless animals to be tormented and killed for a health juice and to line the pockets of profiteers who dont have feelings for those weaker than they are.

at pom one week old baby mice are deprived of oxygen and then their brains cut open and rabbits have their arteries severed so they get erectile dysfunction so that pom wonderful can make money off the pain and suffering inflicted on animals inside the pom wonderful labs.

lynda resnik may have thought she designed a wonderful shaped bottle for her pomegranate juice, but the one week old mice and rabbits who scream in pain, don't think its so pom wonderful. if you want to continue selling juice thats made from the blood of suffering animals lynda, we suggest you come up with a better tamper proof seal.

if people who want to hold a sign and shout to get out the truth out about whats happening inside places that confine and inflict pain and cruelty on animals are being thrown in jail and harrassed by the government, we will fight that much harder from the underground where its safer than holding a sign and yelling the truth. thanks to feinstein and inhoff and the stupid animal enterprise terrorist law that violates the principles that this country is supposed to be founded on, more and more activists like us will choose to retreat into the shadows and fight for the animals underground since the government is making it impossible to do the kinds of things that those who came before us did to oppose injustice, oppression and exploitation.

just because animals cant vote , cant hold a sign or cant lobby and give you dirty money, that doesnt mean that you will be allowed to treat them with disrespect, contempt and then kill them.

this century there are people who care about animals and the earth and will say no to the evil and injustice done to animals, no to the companies that put money and greed above compassion and respect for animals and no to a government that allows animals to be subjected to pain, suffering and death because the animals can't pick up a sign and scream out for themselves.

animal rights militia

I want to find out more of who the hell is claiming this as it seems rather, um odd.

[Gormy Cuss]

21. It does seem odd indeed.

I'd like to see a condemnation by NAALPO on the same page by tomorrow to show that they do no endorse such an action. PETA should also condemn this threat because otherwise its responsible campaign against the company could be undermined.

Most of all I hope the threat is hollow and no tampering has been done.

[harpboy_ak]

29. that's an oxymoron!

PETA should also condemn this threat because otherwise its responsible campaign against the company could be undermined.

PETA? Responsible? I have never seen or heard anything about this organization of vegan extreme loonies that was responsible.

[kestrel91316]

66. PETA will NEVER condemn this.

I'm certain they are delighted, actually. Somebody else is sticking their necks out and getting the heat, for once.

I wonder if this has anything to do with the recent Pamelyn Ferdin debacle here?

[Zhade]

107. Well, they have supported people who commit violence.

So I think you're right.

[SOS]

84. Odd indeed

"the company has not confirmed the validity of the claim"

and from the letter:

"thanks to feinstein and inhoff and the stupid animal enterprise terrorist law that violates the principles that this country is supposed to be founded on"

It just sounds so phony.

[Zhade]

108. That second one sounds like it was written by a freeper.

NT!

[mikelgb]

10. ...

words fail me

[acmejack]

11. !

http://www.animalliberationpressoffice.org/communiques/2006-12-14_pom.htm

[mikelgb]

12. on second thought

they probably just SAID they poisoned it to hurt their sales

[uppityperson]

13. Please note ANYONE could have claimed this.

I want to see what actually happens, who did it before passing judgement.

[seriousstan]

18. Right, I guess the people claiming to do it would never do it, and

ELF never burnt down condos or ski resorts, and the lumber companies spiked their own trees.

There are none so blind.......

[uppityperson]

22. Not saying any of that, just that anyone could claim ding it, whether they did or not

I don't know if those claiming to do it actually did it. I am saying that anyone can claim to have done it and I want to find out who did do it.

In reply to your other press release posting, here is to the communique.
http://www.animalliberationpressoffice.org/communiques/2006-12-14_pom.htm

[Katzenjammer]

137. Think of those "Islamic militants" who turned out to be SAS.

Think of Bushco's "need" to keep the level of fear up.

[Omaha Steve]

14. Watch a couple of PETA videos

I got the PETA Paul McCartney video for Christmas last year. It really opened my eyes. I used to think PETA was way out there. Not any more. Could it be this group did nothing and just released the story to scare manufacturers?

[knight_of_the_star]

24. Still criminally irresponsible

That's within inches of making a threat to a potential of 400 some odd people, not to mention potentially causing a panic. Even if this is false, it is still despiscable, underhanded, dirty, and wrong not to mention undermining legitimate and effective campaigns and tactics. I sometimes wonder if ELF and ALF are just fanatics manipulated into action by RWingers trying to discredit their causes.

[RProser]

26. Sure, videos are always authentic - it's really impossible to

fake anything on tape. And a group like PETA would never, ever, ever do anything dishonest like lie, cheat or steal...unless maybe they thought they could get away with it.

If PETA had their way, medicine would advance not one bit if it relys on animals. They are in the same category as the "save the stem cells" bozos.

And, regardless of whether they (whomever "they" is) spiked the juice or just claimed to have done it will not make a big difference. If you think it matters, get on a plane and after takeoff announce you have a bomb. When they drag you away (assuming you survive the passengers) just tell them that you get a do-over because you were only faking it.

[anotherdrew]

28. PETA in Britain and europe is a different beast in a lot of ways n/t

[AlienGirl]

36. Even if they did release the story without actually poisoning the juice, it's illegal

When they're caught, they will be (rightly) tried for it in criminal court and get the crap sued out of them in civil court.

Morons.

Tucker

[BoneDaddy]

42. That does not matter

to threaten to poison is a crime as well.

Using PETA videos as a justification to poison humans is crap and any reasonable person would realize this.

Shame about this is that these fools just set their "cause" back a few decades. Idiots.

[Omaha Steve]

56. PETA didn't do this

I'm not defending what was done. I just think a lot of people on this board need to realize that animal abuse is criminal too. Break the law, this group (not PETA) did. I do think this is the group that did the documentary I've come to take you home. I hear it is great to watch too.

[The Stranger]

60. And, sure enough, PETA gets defamed as well.

[BoneDaddy]

72. True

but I dont hold PETA accoutable. I respect their views and can see their perspective.

[NorthernSpy]

98. I hate PETA with a flaming passion, and if this incident were to take them down...

... I couldn't be more thrilled.


Me, I absolutely loathe PETA for many reasons, and most recently for their attempts to halt a program that brought convicts from a halfway house to work at a chicken plant. Apparently, they thought that those guys would almost certainly be extra-mean to the chickens. So a program offering some ex-jailbirds a way out of the life was supposed to come screeching to a halt because in PETA's bizarre fantasies, these guys were prolly just drooling over the chance to torture some chickens before turning them into shrinkwrapped drumsticks for America's tables.

Oh, what-fucking-ever...

:eyes:


But much as I detest PETA and their ilk, there are some things about this juice-poisoning case that seem odd to me, and so I think we should wait til we have all the facts before condemnng anyone.

[Infinite Hope]

53. Self-interested promotion that equates to propaganda. n/t

[kestrel91316]

67. Releasing the story is NOT doing "nothing"? This is the exact meaning

of a terrorist threat. Their intent is to FRIGHTEN people who bought the product and scare future business away from the company.

Terrorism, pure and simple. Including economic terrorism.

Catch 'em. Try 'em. Convict 'em. Hang 'em high.

There is no place for this.

[Judi Lynn]

15. That story isn't being done anywhere else, other than your UPI source.

This is hard to grasp.

From the story:

The communiqué does not detail what substance was allegedly put in the juice but says it isn't lethal.

"Those who drink the contaminated juice won't die like the animals in pom labs, but the diarrhea, vomiting and headaches will hopefully send a strong message that people will no longer allow innocent defenseless animals to be tormented and killed for a health juice," the communiqué states.
(snip/)

http://www.upi.com/HealthBusiness/view.php?StoryID=20061219-093253-4881r

[seriousstan]

17. Perhaps you should read the other posts before replying......

http://www.animalliberationpressoffice.org/press_releases/pr_06_12_19_pom.htm

[justice1]

20. If true, It still doesn't justify their actions.

[Zhade]

109. Considering that UPI is now Moonie-owned, that's telling.

NT!

[seasat]

19. Saying it isn't lethal but causes diaherrea and vomiting?

Imagine if someone that is already sick like a cancer or AIDS patient gets ahold of this. What about small children? I give my sons about 8 oz of juice a day (not pomegranate...too expensive). A dose that makes an adult sick could kill an infant. If these folks really did this and it's not a fraud to hurt the POM company then they need to be hunted down and put under the jail.

[NorthernSpy]

32. yeah -- a lot of the people drinking this stuff might be in fragile health to begin with...

... if they're willing to shell out $$$ for this allegedly curative or "health-promoting" juice. There are cheaper things to drink if you're just thirsty.

An amount of a toxic substance insufficient to kill a healthy adult could well pose far more serious problems for a person who is not so hale and hearty.

[Odin2005]

23. Bastards.

[MGD]

25. Typical terroists...pathetic assholes who are too weak and inefectual to attack their real enemies

so they take their frustrations out on innocents and call it a statement.

[anotherdrew]

27. this is the lyndon larouche play all over again n/t

[GreenZoneLT]

30. Not clear on the concept

Aside from just being terrorists who have no doubt pulled a hoax (I'm sure they haven't actually poisoned any juice; that's quite difficult with modern packaging), these idiots don't seem to be clear on what's wrong with animal testing. If they're demonstrating the health benefits of their bogus patent medicine by testing little mice and bunnies, then the shit is supposedly GOOD for the little mice and bunnies. For cryi.

Just goes to show any political movement attracts marginal halfwits.

Or it could just be a "joke" by the sort of people who think "Punk'd" is funny.

Or perhaps it's a PR ploy or stock manipulation scheme by somebody with an ownership interest in POM Wonderful (which sounds like a bad Australian comedy).

[AlienGirl]

35. Juice="GOOD" for bunnies and mice; scalpel to the brain="NOT SO GOOD"

This is dumb terrorism, and ultimately reflects badly on genuine animal rights activists. However, I wanted to point out that you seem "unclear" on the way product testing works. The animals have to be killed and dissected after exposure to the product for some time (in this case, a week or so) to see whether their bodies were affected by the product, and if so, by how much. Perhaps that's a necessary evil if it cures cancer or diabetes; I am pretty sure most reasonable people would think it was a frivolous waste of life to find out if pomegranite juice is a wonder-drug.

Tucker

[GreenZoneLT]

77. Meh. As long as it's quick.

I raised mice for a biology lab once. They were well fed, had clean litter, enough room that they didn't seem stressed. We gased them with carbon dioxide before their little brains were cut out. No worse than raising animals for food.

If pomegranate juice is an effective preventative health treatment (or if it might be), then the little mice and bunnies' lives aren't wasted (any more than any lab animal bred solely for the purpose is). And anyway, I imagine they're not STILL testing; that stuff's expensive.

[Nihil]

78. That figures ...

Raised mice for a biology lab, gassed them and cut their brains out.
Now allegedly in the Green Zone ..

:think:

[NickB79]

140. And your point is?

My degree in biotechnology required various physiology classes, which in turn required practicing dissection and basic surgical skills on animals. I too had to remove the brains of rats, the ovaries of rats, the hearts of frogs, etc, as did all of my classmates. We were mostly pre-med, pre-vet, and biochemistry majors at a large, reputable college in the Midwest. When I went back there this past year to visit professors and tell them of my success in the workplace, they were still training students in the same way.

These classes are pre-requisites for virtually all students studying to go on to medical or vet school. Any doctor you visit, or vet you bring your pet to, has most likely worked on their basic skills on lab animals long before they left the training labs of college. What required classes and experiments have to do with working in the Green Zone of Iraq is something I'm curious to understand. What exactly did you mean by that reference?

[maddezmom]

31. Press Release:POM Wonderful Denounces Cruel Hoax

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/061219/latu110.html?.v=66

[NorthernSpy]

34. The poisoning is fake; is the communique also fake, or is it real?

Did these animal people send a real communique announcing a fake poisoning, or did some other party send a faked communique about a fake poisoning? That part is not yet clear, apparently.


Anyhow, here's that press release:

POM Wonderful Denounces Cruel Hoax
Tuesday December 19, 9:13 pm ET

LOS ANGELES, Dec. 19 /PRNewswire/ -- POM Wonderful, the nation's leading producer of pomegranate juice, announced today that it appears to be the target of a cruel hoax by the Animal Rights Militia, which has boasted to the media and on the internet that it intentionally contaminated bottles of POM Wonderful juices in several retail chains on the East Coast of the United States.

So far, POM has found no evidence of any contamination of its products, and has not received any reports of complaints from customers or retailers. POM is cooperating with law enforcement agencies and is investigating by going into stores and checking its products.

POM said that its primary concern is the health and safety of its consumers. POM is taking this matter very seriously.

POM emphasized that all its products use a tamper-evident cap to ensure that no product is damaged or contaminated before use. POM said this should allow consumers to determine whether the product has been tampered with. POM said it is appealing to all consumers to check the break-away, tamper-evident cap carefully before consuming a product. If the cap shows any sign of tampering, it should not be consumed.

"POM Wonderful is outraged by the boasts of the Animal Rights Militia," said a spokesman for the company. "If it is a hoax, it is a form of blackmail. If actual contamination has taken place, with the intention of injuring innocent people, it is an act of terrorism. Either way, the Animal Rights Militia is trying to scare and intimidate innocent people. That is criminal behavior."

POM also asks members of the news media to show extra caution in publicizing these claims. "We would ask that you be extra careful not to inadvertently be party to a hoax, nor to imply that the media in any way endorses terrorist tactics made in the name of animal rights," the spokesman said.

POM Wonderful said that in recent months, animal rights activists have pressured POM to sign a statement renouncing all animal research. POM refused. "Our research is helping to save human lives," the spokesman said.

POM's priority is to improve human health through sound science. POM has funded more than $20 million on research performed at world-class universities, and it will not walk away from its contributions to advancing scientific knowledge. POM has no intention of diluting or hampering its research in order to satisfy violent extremists.

The vast majority of POM research involves human studies, which has led to breakthrough results on prostate cancer and heart disease, among other findings. As a result of that research, people facing those diseases now have greater hope. Only a small fraction of POM's research involves testing on animals, though it never includes dogs, cats or primates. When animals are involved, testing follows well-established scientific protocol and every effort is made to insure that no harsh or cruel methods are performed. These animal studies help pave the way for eventual human research.

Recently, a handful of animal rights activist have resorted to terror tactics in a crude attempt to disrupt POM's medical research. Masked protesters have stalked POM employees at their homes, screaming profanities and threats of violence and terrorizing their young children. The harassment became so dangerous that a California State Court issued a preliminary injunction barring these protesters from further terrorizing POM employees. Despite this injunction, radical groups have continued to harass employees and their children, at their homes in the middle of the night.

POM supports the rights of everyone to express views. "However, no matter what you think about the best way to pursue proper scientific research, there is no place for terrorism and blackmail in your methods," the spokesman said. "Threatening innocent people does not help anyone."


Source: POM Wonderful

[Taoschick]

46. I'm leaning towards real-fake

ARM has done stuff like this in the past. I don't think they have the capability to actually poison large numbers of any product but they know that the mere hint will cause an economic hit to the company. The animal liberation front has a page on their site about the groups activities:

http://animalliberationfront.com/ALFront/Actions-UK/alfarm.htm

[OneBlueSky]

33. I'm completely against animal testing, but this is just terrorism . . .

and those responsible should be punished severely . . . what the hell are these people thinking? . . .

[Katzenjammer]

138. Maybe the ones responsible are SAS? (not really SAS, but you know what I mean) (nt)

[NorthernSpy]

37. hold on -- don't companies recall entire production runs over "possible traces of nuts"...

That's always happening: So-and-So food company announces a recall; product may contain traces of nuts not listed on the label -- that sort of thing. It seems like a waste, but the company's insurers believe that it is cheaper to recall massive amounts of product than to lose a lawsuit brought by a nut-allergic person who may have been harmed by the "possible traces of nuts".


With that in mind, doesn't this part of POM's press release strike anyone as a little odd?

So far, POM has found no evidence of any contamination of its products, and has not received any reports of complaints from customers or retailers. POM is cooperating with law enforcement agencies and is investigating by going into stores and checking its products.

POM said that its primary concern is the health and safety of its consumers. POM is taking this matter very seriously.

POM emphasized that all its products use a tamper-evident cap to ensure that no product is damaged or contaminated before use. POM said this should allow consumers to determine whether the product has been tampered with. POM said it is appealing to all consumers to check the break-away, tamper-evident cap carefully before consuming a product. If the cap shows any sign of tampering, it should not be consumed.

Huh? This seems an awfully passive response, given that some party has just claimed to have poisoned some of their product! Why aren't they recalling everything if only to limit their liability -- just as other food companies routinely do when faced with much smaller risks? Leaving the juice on the shelves doesn't really seem like due diligence.

What would I do if I were in POM's shoes? I'd recall the stuff, fast. The only way I wouldn't recall the product would be if I not only believed, but actually knew for a fact that no tampering had occurred. But unless POM were the original source of the communique, how could they ever enjoy that level of certainty?


I dunno. Just something I thought of when I read that press release.

[Lurking Dem]

39. That's because nut allergies actually kill people.

They probably had no corroboration that the juice supply had been tampered with in any way or the FBI already knows about the group and it's one guy living in his mom's basement or something.

[NorthernSpy]

40. the question stands, though: why risk even the *remote* chance of selling tainted juice...

... in the face of an explicit warning by some group who claim to have poisoned the stuff?


Usually, when informed of the possibility of tainted or mislabeled product, food companies quickly announce recalls in hope of limiting their potential liability. But this company is behaving differently.

I just can't help noticing that.

[Lurking Dem]

45. You're right - it is odd.

That is why I think there is some reason they knew it wasn't possible.

Maybe more info will be forthcoming. I have been known to drink pomegranate juice and if it had been tainted as advertised it could have killed me, given my medical condition.

There is just too much left out of this story.

[krispos42]

38. Now I have to test my juice by giving some to my cat

Or at least my roommates cat :-)

[BoneDaddy]

41. This is where some on

the left go insane. When people start to mess with people to get their point across, you have crossed the line. YOur "cause" does not have the right to cross over into making people sick.

These nuts need to be found and put away for awhile.

[closeupready]

43. If true, what a bunch of slimey

pigs. :mad:

[LeftyMom]

44. Okay, a few points here.

1. Anybody can send an anonymous communique.

2. If you read it, it looks decidedly sketchy.

3. Apparently reading comprehension is an issue around here, if one takes it at face value (and I wouldn't advise that) the responsible party/parties are ARM, not ALF. If you don't understand the distinction, you're really not equipped to comment on this issue.

[Gormy Cuss]

49. You're right on the first point.

Sourcing is questionable and it could have come from parties on either side of the issue.

On the second, it easy to be dismissive and say that those who don't know the difference aren't equipped to comment but that ignores the real possibility that AR groups with no involvement will be blamed for the threat, hoax or no. Let's face it, to many people it's just alphabet soup --there is no distinction. That's why I said upthread that this could undermine PETA's campaign to get POM to cease this practice.

[slackmaster]

47. The feed pomegranite juice to little mice and bunnies?

What a cruel, nasty corporation.

[LeftyMom]

65. Apparently you missed the "and then they dissect them" part.

:shrug:

[kestrel91316]

68. I don't think they dissect them alive.

I rather think they have been humanely euthanized first.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

[pokercat999]

80. "humanely euthanized " I like that. Maybe that's what

should be done to the CEO's and the lab tech's involved with this juice? Why scare regular folks just buying into ad hype about some juice. If you really believe you're right (the terrorist) have the guts to act DIRECTLY not this bs. Sure it's just as wrong and 2 wrongs can never make anything right.....I'm just say'n

On edit: Before you flame....think. What is justice here? Is it right that these small animals are tortured just because these "humans" can? This was done for profit by a system that has no value for any life form but their own and little enough for them. Ask yourself what is JUSTICE in this case? Certainly not a crime against the general public, but if I was on a jury I could never convict for the like treatment of the above mentioned criminals. This is not a black and white issue to me.

[Zhade]

111. These animals are not being tortured; a dead animal cannot feel pain.

Just pointing that out.

[pokercat999]

120. Thanks

I feel sooooooo much better now :sarcasm:

[Zhade]

122. Oh, my intent wasn't to make you feel good, or bad.

Just to point out that the dead cannot be tortured.

However, that says nothing about how I feel about animal testing. Frankly... I'm torn on it at this point.

[slackmaster]

85. No, I didn't miss that part

I missed the part where someone provided a rational explanation of how that justifies poisoning humans at random.

[LeftyMom]

90. Show me where somebody got poisoned.

Assuming this is legit and not some illiterate lone nut (and I doubt that) it's just a technique to get the product recalled and cost the company money. ARM did the same thing with mars bars (which were being tested on animals) in the UK back in the 80s and mars stopped animal testing.

[slackmaster]

101. I don't know if anyone was, but someone could have been

Messing with the food supply is an act of terrorism.

[LeftyMom]

104. Nobody's found any evidence of tampering.

More than likely if this is even legit (and I rather doubt it) it's a hoax intended to trigger a recall and persistent drop and demand, with no actual product contamination, much as was the case with the mars bar poisoning hoax this appears to be modeled on.

[slackmaster]

112. Perpetrating a hoax like that is still a terrorist act

Use of FEAR to effect some kind of change.

The perpetrators should be made to pay for the economic damage they did, then sent to jail.

[LeftyMom]

114. Oh FFS

Read the email. It would only scare you if you happen to teach English.

If there weren't political points to be scored on this it would have gone straight into the round file, and rightly so.

[IA_Seth]

115. So only proper English is truly terrorism?

I am at a loss hear, I don't see how threats of violence against innocents (whether they were truly to be carried out or not) is a defensible act.

[Zhade]

123. It's indefensible.

NT!

[LeftyMom]

127. I'm not saying it's justified

I'm just saying that an incoherent email that appears to have been written by a lone idiot (presumably a group would assign the writing to the best communicator) is an odd thing to get whipped into a frenzy about.

[damntexdem]

48. Animal liberation is the enemy of humanity --

this is but the latest instance.

[flvegan]

50. Brilliant!

[baldguy]

51. They call it terrorism

When people take action against the corporate ologarchy, but which may hurt others.

But when corporations take actions which hurt & kill & otherwise adversly effect the lives of others - they call it the cost of doing business.

[kestrel91316]

69. My mom taught me when I was a small child that I was NEVER to use

the "but somebody else did it, too" excuse. Two wrongs DON'T make a right.

This threat frightens and therefore harms CONSUMERS. And shareholders (you know, people just like you and me). And by harming the company it harms its employees.

So don't pretend it just harms a deserving, evil "corporation".

[nolabels]

54. They are just imitating our fearless leader * and the other people he wants to..........

use to pick fights with. The recipe: strike fear and obedience into people with the threat of death.
What is so different about *, terrorist and these crazy people :shrug:

[womanofthehills]

55. I'm sitting here drinking Pom juice as I'm reading this

However, I'm in New Mexico not on the E coast. I Soon I'll be afraid to ever go to the store ever again. I'm increasing my garden big time this year.

[geek tragedy]

57. I can't believe I'm the first person to put on their

tin foil hat over this.

This story smells like a fake and a plant. Trying to discredit animal activists as terrorists has been a goal of more than a few big corporations--not surprisingly the Bush administration REALLY goes after "eco-terrorists."

That said, if this is true, those responsible ought to go to jail for the rest of their lives.

[rinsd]

61. Possible but I think a planned hoax is more likely.

Saying you've tainted a product could hurt brand image which appears to fulfill the goal of inflicting financial damage.

Even better is the climate right now with various high profile food bourne illnesses you already have an established climate of fear. Even a hoax could cause alot of customers to play it safe and avoid the brand.

All that said, it could very well be something to get people on board with the "danger" of eco-terror.

[kestrel91316]

70. Funny, I'm more inclined to think the people who have been harrassing

and terrorizing the company and its employees decided to escalate.

[NorthernSpy]

73. you're not -- not quite...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=2659120&mesg_id=2659499

Look, I don't know what the truth is here -- none of us do. Not yet, anyway.

But I do know that in failing to recall their product, this company is behaving differently than other food companies do when made aware of possible contamination of their goods.

And the fact that this news comes just as POM has been put on the defensive by a perfectly lawful campaign by the obnoxious and persistent PETA makes it all even more interesting...

[Zhade]

113. You're not the first - see upthread - but you're right, it's fishy.

Mmm, fish.

[The Stranger]

58. WAKE UP -- ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVISTS ARE NOT "TERRORISTS."

Before we all start visciously attacking animal rights activists, like the good little programmed, mindless fucking sheep we are, realize that not a single fucking person was injured in the slightest way -- at worst this was a hoax.

What is most unbelievably fucking fascinating, is how the corporation comes out with a press statement calling this "terrorism," and immediately posters are on this board parroting that very same meme.

POM Wonderful Denounces Cruel Hoax

Tuesday December 19, 9:13 pm ET

LOS ANGELES, Dec. 19 /PRNewswire/ -- POM Wonderful, the nation's leading producer of pomegranate juice, announced today that it appears to be the target of a cruel hoax by the Animal Rights Militia, which has boasted to the media and on the internet that it intentionally contaminated bottles of POM Wonderful juices in several retail chains on the East Coast of the United States.

So far, POM has found no evidence of any contamination of its products, and has not received any reports of complaints from customers or retailers.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/061219/latu110.html?.v=66

At worst it was a hoax, although it may very well be an agent provocateur at work here.

[Squatch]

59. "At WORST it was a hoax"

Are you daft? At worst, hundreds of people could have seriously gotten sick/hurt/killed.

[The Stranger]

62. Sick/Hurt/Killed by POMEGRANATE JUICE?

What the fuck are you talking about? There was no poison, even the company is saying this.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

63. Hoax makes it sound like a practical joke.

I hope these guys share a cell with that freeper mailing fake anthrax to celebrities.

[flvegan]

64. You obviously haven't had your recommended intake of Kool Aid today.

Look into that. It's easier to drink than to think.

[kestrel91316]

71. The people who are harrassing the company and its employees are

TERRORISTS. They need to find some other way to accomplish their goals - something other than violating other people's rights and doing economic harm because of their quasi-religious beliefs elevating all animal life to the holy status of fetuses.

[The Stranger]

93. You have perfectly (although unwittingly) illustrated my point.

Thanks nevertheless.

[Crandor]

74. Hoax or not, they are still terrorists - look it up in the dictionary

ter·ror·ism –noun
1. the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, esp. for political purposes.

Describes them perfectly, unless you are going to try to tell me their claim to have poisoned the juice didn't qualify as a threat...

[The Stranger]

94. Buy a new dictionary if it says that. Or use your brain instead.

"Terrorism" is a construction applied to SOME FORMS OF VIOLENCE, BUT NOT OTHER FORMS OF VIOLENCE, when to so label it serves the political ends (which may also be violent) of the labeler.

Print that out and stick it in your dictionary.

[IA_Seth]

110. Oh, well thank you Mr Webster...

Funny thing is, the definition that was given before yours is pretty widely held. Don't like it, get a new word bub.

These people are terrorists, and idiots on top of that. Are you honestly defending the right of a group to threaten harm?

[The Stranger]

117. "Defending the right of a group to threaten harm"?

That doesn't even make sense.

[IA_Seth]

118. Well at least that ensures I am not a terrorist!

Lord knows only those who speak approved English are true terrorists.

Let me say it a different way since my point was obviously lost...are you defending the alleged group's right to threaten to harm innocent consumers?

Let me know if you can follow that.

[ScreamingWhisper]

83. No one has to be hurt

for it to be a terrorist act. That's the point. They invoked a sense of danger amongst the random, general populace.
That alone, whether a hoax or not, delivered the groups desired result. They invoked fear.
I say fine them and spend a little bit of time in jail. Maybe they can convert the jail-mice in their cells to lead a revolt to overthrow their bipedal oppressors!

Gee...would I rather have a mouse tested on, or my 10 month old baby?
Opposable thumbs win!

[The Stranger]

95. Oh Bullshit.

Just because you are scared (and others who can see through this don't even give a shit about it) does not make something "terrorism." That is the worst form of herd and mob mentality ever.

[ScreamingWhisper]

97. oh? So it's okay for someone to yell "Fire!" in a crowded theatre?

Because that is the equivalent to saying they had poisoned fruit juice along the Eastern Seaboard.
They used the cheapiest and most dangerous means to get their political message out.

Sorry if you think it's a mob mentality if parents want to protect their loved ones. Likewise,
sorry to read it's a mob mentality to hold those people responsible for damages done to the company's:
1) economics 2) reputation not to mention any mental anguish from the general populace who may have
been feeding their family with the same juices, but not knowing if they'll need to take them to the hospital.

Get a clue.

[The Stranger]

99. Here is my clue: If you yell "Fire" in a crowded theater, you have not committed "Terrorism."

Using your very own example, we have shown that accusing the hoaxers of "terrorism," is bullshit.

And we could also add to your example, that after yelling "fire," no one was hurt, or even cared, really.

And stop using some visceral reaction, such as your "protecting" your loved ones, to view politics and complex issues.

The whole point of the "terrorism" scares have been to create just such a viscreal reaction to get people to vote away their most fundamental human rights.

It is the modus operandi of the Republican Neoconservatives and architects of Guantanamo, rendition, torture, and the "Patriot Act."

[ScreamingWhisper]

106. ....your clue is flawed

All you have demonstrated is that you have very little understanding of being socially responsible.
If you can't see where (hoax or not) actually threatening to do harm to a random lot of 487 people
is a socially (and criminally) irresponsible act. You seem to consider the "oh I was just kidding" factor
as being a magic rubber stamp to negate what could have been a very tragic occurrence.
You actually condone THREATENING total strangers?

I'll say this again...it's not just the resulting injuries (if any) it's the threat to do harm, that makes an act
a source for terror.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And stop using some visceral reaction, such as your "protecting" your loved ones, to view politics and complex issues.
- I will not, because THEY are the missing "X-Factor" in your total oblivious understanding of such a threat.
This group did not threaten the company...they threatened the innocent populace that have no connection to the company
outside of being consumers wanting juice for their family.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I would also suggest you add the Democratic Senators and Congressmen who also voted for the Patriot Act, especially
as this group is rather self-serving by appearance and actions, and beholding to neither party.

You still have no clue, do you?

[The Stranger]

116. Just because something may be "socially irresponsible" does not make it "TERRORIST"

Holy fuck, I can't believe I am having this debate. Sure, it is "socially irresponsible" to jaywalk, or to jump a subway turnstile, but IT IS NOT "TERRORISM."

Just because something "causes harm" or is a "threat" or scares widdle scawed peopuw out there in the big mean world does not mean it is "terrorism."

Stop using your visceral reactions and fear to respond to questions that call for reasoning, judgment and critical thinking.

[Zhade]

124. Neither of those is a threat to others, so those are flawed analogies.

Terrorism is defined as using violence or the threat of violence to make a political point.

This is the threat of violence, i.e. poisoning. As such, it is legally terrorism, even if you disagree with that fact.

Do you support the terrorizing of people to make a point? Any point?

[The Stranger]

129. Bullshit -- those analogies disprove the apparently widely-held belief that "crime" and "terrorism"

are the same thing.

Of course, screaming "Fire" in a crowded theater is a threat to people. At least as much as claiming fruit juice was poisoned. And, of course, screaming "Fire" in a crowded theater is not terrorism. But it may be a criminal act.

Terrorism is defined as using violence or the threat of violence to make a political point.

And your own definition of "terrorism" also fails reductio ad absurdum. If you were to threaten to hit someone unless they voted Democrat or even to read your political posts, most sane people agree that you would not be committing "terrorism," yet your own definition would allow you to be charged with it as a crime of "terrorism." And that would be absurd.

Then comes the obligatory question which seeks to silence the questioning of the concept of "terrorism" -- asking someone if they support it.

Do you support the terrorizing of people to make a point? Any point?

Does questioning what exactly constitutes "terrorism" mean that someone supports it (whatever it actually is), as your question implies?

[Zhade]

136. "most sane people" - another fallacy.

NT!

[Nihil]

125. It does if you use the GW Bush definition of "whatever we don't like"

FWIW I agree with you but you've got more staying power than I have
when it comes to arguing with the "Fuck the animals" crowd.

It's amazing how many crimes can be "excused" or "justified" by that
magic word "terrorism".

[The Stranger]

133. Keep keepin' on.

I think the first step is being able to question what it is.

[ScreamingWhisper]

126. The mere fact that you believe

a jaywalker or turnstile jumper are on the same level as the threatening the health of 487 random people,
demonstrates my point that you have absolutely no sense of proportion in this issue. Terrorism is the threat to do harm,
to others, causing a sense of collective fear.
I have nothing more to discuss you you on this subject, because I honestly cannot understand the inner working
of your own "morality-meter" since you believe the above as you do. It seems your sense of: 1) proportion and 2) cause and effect, are both either immature or stagnant.

[The Stranger]

130. So you issue ad hominem attacks and then leave the discussion?

Nice. But, once again, like so many others, your definition of "terrorism" fails.

Terrorism is the threat to do harm, to others, causing a sense of collective fear.

A bank robber who holds hostages, most agree, has not committed terrorism, at least not for the past 100 years of American law, yet your flawed definition would consider it "terrorism." (And try to remember, we are not talking about it being "good" or condoning it, it would most certainly be a crime (robbery, kidnapping), it just is not "terrorism.").

In fact, the very term "collective fear" is so broad it would never hold up as the definition of a criminal act. Worse, it leaves the crime itself as being so subject to prosecutorial abuse, for example, that prosecution of such a crime could be used for political ends, which is not only absurd, it is dangerous.

[ScreamingWhisper]

142. Didn't leave the discussion. You had not responded for some time, so

I went on with my life, enjoying time with family.
Your analogy of the bank robber is flawed, once again. That would represent a highly focused, finite number of victims who
are directly threatened. They (the victims)and the perpetrator can both see each other. The weapon (if any is shown, this is your analogy, afterall) can be seen.
The context of this REAL scenario is 180 degrees divergent. The weapon (if any) is secretive, unknown. It was a lottery as to who would be affected, random in it's design. Once the random factor is in play, the collective whole ALL react with guarded
anxiety....causing a sense of collective fear.
We obviously don't see the issue the same...and I'm tired of repeating myself so, good day to you.

[MonkeyFunk]

128. It's terrorism

just as surely as sending fake anthrax letters to public figures is terrorism.

[The Stranger]

131. Sorry, but we can't just take your word for it.

If they are going to incarcerate people for decades, we need a bit more.

[MonkeyFunk]

135. Nowhere in my post

did I say that they should be jailed without a trial. Don't be ridiculous.

My point is that THREATENING to have poisoned a product is no different than sending someone a fake anthrax letter.

Both are terroristic acts.

The fact is, I think you just like the motive they had for doing so. That doesn't change the fact that the act itself is an act of terrorism, even if you agree with the cause.

[regnaD kciN]

75. Sounds like a great chance for Alberto Gonzales...

...to stage a massive crackdown on every environmental and animal-rights group in America. :scared:

[LeftyMom]

76. Um, they're already doing that. Google "green scare" nt.

[NotGivingUp]

79. glad you showed up leftymom

i was beginning to feel like i was at a repuke sight with all the nasty comments about PETA.

[LeftyMom]

82. Thanks.

You can always PM me if you feel like maybe one of these threads might slip by me.

[Javaman]

81. "you like-a the juice, huh? the juice is good, huh?" nt

[MGD]

121. She like-a the juice. nt

[Redstone]

86. Well, let's see: The POM people give ANIMALS something that make them healthier,

so these jerkoffs are going to poison PEOPLE?

I give up trying to understand anything anymore.

Redstone

[LeftyMom]

89. You missed a step.

1. they give the juice to animals

2. they kill them and cut them up to see if it made them healthier

3. they use any findings from #2 to promote the ridiculously overpriced juice

[Redstone]

102. Well, screw it, I don't buy POM juice anyway. Another store has

pomegranate juice for three buck a bottle, and it's a bigger bottle than POM.

Redstone

[Guaranteed]

139. Should we be poisoning 9th graders as well for dissecting

animals in biology class?

[NickB79]

141. Why would they still be dissecting animals to this day?

One or two large studies involving a few hundred rats or mice could be carried out over the course of a year, and then the results used for POM's advertising (assuming the results were favorable). After that, there is no reason to continue animal testing. It would waste money and give the company continued unfavorable press. There is no point in testing every batch of POM juice produced on animals unless they radically alter the formula. Carrying out dozens of repeat tests to back up a fairly simple study would be pointless.

The only line of reason that makes sense is that POM carried out animal studies on a few limited occassions some time ago, got the results they needed, and then discontinued them as they were no longer needed. Does anyone have information showing definitive proof that POM is still carrying out animal testing in the past year?

[The Stranger]

96. Good idea -- I would suggest you give up as well.

This appears to be a bit too complicated.

We'll handle it.

[Tight_rope]

87. Dumbasses... "Stupidity is the same as evil if you judge by the results." — Margaret Atwood

[treestar]

88. Is there any confirmation from outside that company?

It could be a cover for a mistake they made.

We still need proof that these animal rights activists exist, separate from the company, like they made the communique to some media or person outside the company, otherwise, there is nothing to show that it was not invented within the company.

Disgruntled employees could be responsible, too.

[LeftyMom]

92. The communique went to the ALPO.

They are definitely not affiliated with POM and that's not an uncommon way to release info on an action, although hardly the only one.

[KamaAina]

91. Be afraid. Be very afraid. Viagra could be next.

The company also has severed the arteries of rabbits to study erectile dysfunction.

D'oh! Why didn't I think of that? :eyes:

Fortunately, there is a perfectly viable solution at hand:

PETA has asked POM to join Naked Juice Company and others who do not test on animals. :rofl:

edit: spelling: didn't mean to insult prefects :-)

[w4rma]

100. despicable antiproductive nutcases. (nt)

[Zhade]

103. Lock them up.

NT!

[Raine]

119. I quit drinking POM months

ago after finding out they tested it on animals plus it's too damned expensive. I'd rather eat a pomagranite.

[Deja Q]

132. The animals were more mature than the 'activists' out to 'protect' them.

There are other ways to voice objections. And other viewpoints to consider. What they did was just outright wrong, stupid, dangerous, and did I mention outright wrong?

[jazzjunkysue]

134. Lock up the unstable cat lovers. This is a new level of nuts. n/t.