Gas prices don't scare buyers of big SUVs: After 2-year slump, demand rebounds

[Newsjock]

Source: San Francisco Chronicle

In these days of nearly $4-a-gallon gasoline, a three-ton SUV that practically requires a bank loan to fill 'er up would seem to be a tough sell.

Americans, however, are not shunning these beasts. Far from it. Auto industry figures show that after a two-year slump, sales of the gas guzzlers are up over 2006 -- in some cases, way up.

The numbers for large SUVs rose nearly 6 percent in the first quarter of 2007, and the April figures were up 25 percent from April 2006, according to automakers' statistics provided by Edmunds.com, an automotive research Web site.
The bigger the guzzler, the better the numbers. Sales of GMC's Yukon XL were up a whopping 72 percent last month, and the totals for its Chevrolet sister, the Suburban, rose 38 percent. Topping off the tank on either one can cost as much as $120.

Read more: http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/05/20/SUV.TMP

---

Sunday front-page story

[Viva_La_Revolution]

1. f*ck'n greedy sheeple

they'll be the death of all of us. :mad:

[Decruiter]

111. n/t

[MountainLaurel]

2. So, is it denial

Or just denseness?

[Gormy Cuss]

3. Nah. The house is in foreclosure and a nice roomy SUV is cheaper than most rents.

Truth be told, it's probably another sign of the stark difference between the haves and the have nots in our society.

[gobblechops]

20. I will go with number two

Denseness or better yet psychopaths

[Megahurtz]

100. It's Selfishness.

In Full Bloom under Bush.

[kestrel91316]

104. It's called conspicuous consumption. It's like wearing a big sign

around your neck that says "I'm rich and you aren't - so there!"

[Redstone]

4. Assholes.

Redstone

[bluestateguy]

5. People who buy SUV's are upper middle class or rich, that's why

They will simply pay the higher gas prices. The people (and we have some here at DU) who cheer on the high gas prices thinking that it will force people out of their SUV's are misguided. This is simple economics.

[nytemare]

8. I am hoping that Congress will end up understanding

that money spent on fuel will not be spent elsewhere. The profits of Walmart and Target have fallen. I'm sure that wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that the folks who need to save money shopping at those places have had to tighten the belt. Prices are higher because of fuel, inflation is up because of fuel, finally, the minimum wage is going up, some, but not enough to keep up with inflation, and crazy fuel prices. But, as long as the higher ups at the oil companies are raking in the dough, they don't care.

In July or so last year, when gas prices reached their previous peak, now being the new peak, oil was 77 bucks a barrel. Now, fuel prices are more, and oil is 63 bucks a barrel. Congress needs to fucking do something to reel these asshats in.

Sorry for the small rant.

[Mrspeeker]

11. well

I work a gas station and it actually is forcing people to buy smaller vehicle's, and or at least get em talking about it. I'm not lying. I really do see it all the time, the so called "working man" downgrading to a smaller truck or car,
which defies the logic that a working man needs his truck, so there for the emission requirements are much more lenient than that of a car. Which is what got us in the whole mess/loophole in the first place.
And I don't really know if there is a middle class anymore... LOL

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

60. Welcome to DU, Mrspeeker and I think many people are rethinking the wisdom of gas

guzzlers.

MKJ

[Mrspeeker]

99. O thanks :)

You no, I brain stormed about it, and came to the conclusion that these articles, printed in alot of papers are just commercials for its ok to own a SUV now because see...everyone is doing it.
Its the only logical explanation.

[superconnected]

133. Bingo! That's what I thought when reading it.

[durablend]

25. 'Zactly!

The haves and have mores don't give a damn about the rest of us! And you're exactly right about how it's ridiculous to think that higher gas prices will force them out of those SUVs. They'll whine and bitch about the prices for awhile, but then pay it...the rest of us will have to suffer.

[datahead]

47. I've owned SUV's for ten plus years,

and I will have to say I've never made it to upper middle class. middle class maybe, but not upper middle class. I will say however, I now drive a small four cylinder somewhat (lol) American made car.
Being they don't make station wagons anymore, the american families really have no choice but to buy these types of cars. Now that my kids are grown and have kids of their own they have their own cars,(yes it's a SUV.) and I'm mot hauling around a ton of crap, two kids, the dog, etc, my wife and I find it very nice to get back to a small car. That being said, I will have to say that the SUV, market has gotten a little crazy. I.E. The Escalade, Navigator, and other small tanks are to me useless gas hogs and a total waist.

Earlier this week at Purdue university, they announced they have figured out how to extract hydrogen from water using aluminum alloy rods to use the hydrogen as a on demand alternate fuel. I will lay a dollar to a doughnut that the oil companies are going to sweep this under the rug so fast it will make your head spin. I had the opportunity to meet a person in the late 70's that took a standard holly carburetor on a Chevy V-8 and redesign the carb where his Chevy truck got a little under a hundred miles to the gallon of gas. He promptly sold it to the oil companies and retired. We never heard a thing about it again. Personally this is the kind of mentality, that we have to stop. There are all sorts of gadgets and research going on that we the people will never see due to big business coming along and shelving it due to the greed of the almighty dollar. Not to mention the oil companies produce just enough fuel to control the fluctuation of rising gas prices. Summer and Winter fuels my ass. Gas is gas! Those of you that think that this isn't being fueled (Pardon the pun.) by big business have their blinders on. We need to start looking at new technology, and giving grants for research in these fields, and making these new technologies available to the people. Not sweeping them under the rug until big business can make an extra buck on these technologies.

Do I have a solution? Well, First we need to monitor big business a little better. Make the management more accountable for their actions, with real jail time for CEO's and upper management, and go after the companies that are controlling the market for their personal gain. Stop the money that is pouring into the pockets of politician's from lobbyist backing these companies. But on the other hand, reward these companies for new development of alternate fuels, and cars that help the environment. Sounds easy right? I've always been somewhat of a dreamer, and I still have hope for this wonderful nation of ours. I still believe in "We the People", but Americans have to stop being sheep, and stop wondering around behind a corrupt administration (I.E. Rumsfeld, Chainey, and Rice.) that is built around big money.

[silverojo]

53. I get your point...to a point. :-)

<<Being they don't make station wagons anymore, the american families really have no choice but to buy these types of cars.>>

There is a choice--people can buy minivans, which get better gas mileage (because they're lighter than SUV's), have more room, and a lower base, which means they're easier for kids to get into and out of. :)

[datahead]

58. I couldn't agree more.. Mini -Vans are cool.

I forgot about the minivans.. I guess I started rambling more about the other stuff. (Oil companies, Etc.) I tend to do that on occasion about the things I'm passionate about.

[Auntie Bush]

146. Hey, don't forget us little old ladies!

[silverojo]

149. I'd never forget little old ladies

After all, my mom's one of them! :D

Nothing like a minivan for transporting a wheelchair, walker, etc. Decent mileage AND plenty of room to haul stuff!

[MADem]

88. VW makes station wagons, don't they?

Ford used to make an Escort wagon...and the Taurus. Those were good station wagons.

[dysfunctional press]

132. sorry, but you lost me with the carburetor nonsense...

http://www.snopes.com/autos/business/carburetor.asp

[superconnected]

134. I like your point but

First we have to monitor congress.

We have to do it from the state level where they are voted in, because they themselves will not vote in a bill that makes collusive deals illegal.

They have to be immediately ousted when they take any corporate or private donations that represent interest on something the diplomat has voting rights on. Until that happens, corporations will continute to run and loot America.

And we need to make mandatory prison sentences and be willing to put the Pelosis and obamas in there. We can't support corruption just because we like them.

That's the only way to stop this.

[DainBramaged]

137. Urban legends- the xxx mpg carburetors

http://www.snopes.com/autos/business/carburetor.asp

your quote

I had the opportunity to meet a person in the late 70's that took a standard holly carburetor on a Chevy V-8 and redesign the carb where his Chevy truck got a little under a hundred miles to the gallon of gas. He promptly sold it to the oil companies and retired. We never heard a thing about it again.

Read the Snopes link above. Just making modifications to a carburetor with specifics regarding the size (1 or more barrels) or engine size (could it have been a de stroked 231 cu in v8 in a body less truck with the aerodynamics of a brick?) Just adds to the urban legends surrounding the gazillion mile per gallon carburetors.

PS

You can't get that mileage with the Toyota Prius and it uses batteries and fuel injection.


PSS: Wildwood weed, great song welcome to DU!

:hi:

[ikojo]

67. not necessarily true

I know a woman who lives on disability income. She drives a jeep grand cherokee. She complains constantly about gas prices but will not sell or trade in the jeep. In q few days she is driving from MO to Florida.
I hqve NO pity for her bad choices.

[A wise Man]

102. You forgot about those here at DU

that Cheer on the high prices with stock options in the oil companies.I'll go along with "SELFISH".

[gravity]

113. Exactly

If you can afford a Hummer, changes in the price of gas are just a small fraction of the cost of the vehicle.

[Initech]

6. It's official: America is the stupidest country on the planet.

$4 / gallon and these gas-guzzling fuck you mobiles are still selling like hotcakes. Argh, it sickens me. :argh:

[napi21]

7. Well, I don't know about SF, but that's sure not the case here in GA.

I stopped at the Ford Dealer last week to buy a small part that was a dealer only item. I was SHOCKED at the inventory they had in SUV's and full size trucks! There were 4 lines of about 20-25 each line! All the Dealers I know are crying about nobody wanting these beasts. Everyone I know talks about how either they or their friends are trying to sell the ones they have, but most of them are still financed and they can't get any $$ for them at all!

I'm sure there area few people who just won't give them up, but it's like they said on some Money Show today, "If you drive a Ferrarri, you don't care that gas is $4.00 a gal but the average guy sure does!

[KoKo]

78. Then what some DU'ers here say is true! The Rich can still afford them and are

buying them to "show off." A great status symbol..bigger than in the old days when having a BMW or Mercedes was the clue to your financial situation. These days one can lease a Beemer or Mercedes and appear rich...but it takes REAL MACHO to Drive a Yukon or the others of that Hulk!

Lot's of the 1% who own the rest of us are just the folks who want to look "real" but BIG! No puny Beemer or "establishment" Mercedes for those folks. It's "Macho..Macho Man/Woman" for them. Looks good at Football games and NASCAR rallies.

[BrklynLiberal]

9. Stupid, selfish, ignorant dimwits. They don't care about anything or anyone but themselves.

A perfect example of the success of the PR campaign co-managed by the media, big oil and Bushco. Of course, Big oil and Bushco are really one entity. The media is not too far removed either.

[Lorien]

10. So, when the MSM cites supply and demand as the cause of high gas prices

we know just who to blame. :puke:

[geomon666]

12. I swear I hate people. n/t

[boilinmad]

90. yeah....

.....me too.

[Megahurtz]

101. And I been right there with ya. n/t

[Strelnikov_]

13. "first quarter of 2007"

Considering prices did not start increasing until Q2, and in April most people probably thought it was a momentary blip, the premise of this article makes no sense.

Journalists, what can you say . . .

[IthinkThereforeIAM]

14. I saw that...

... also, how many of the sales were discounted (i just got a "special $1000 offer" by snail mail from the GMC dealer) SUV's that have been sitting on their lots for six months?

[krkaufman]

115. Exactly what I was thinking. The election season price drop ...

... combined with the unbelievably short-term memory of American consumers and massive manufacturer & dealer discounts and rebates, I am sure played a large role in this purchase blip. (And are we still offering that ridiculous tax rebate/credit for SUVs?)

[kath]

45. Great visual aid showing how much gas prices came down right before the election...

Fuckers.

[sanskritwarrior]

83. Tighten your tinfoil

it went down even further after we won........What does that mean that big oil wanted the Dems to look good their first few months :eyes:

I drive a truck, I'll pay the cost and I am far from rich, I will drive what I want when I want to as the ability of freedom to do what one wishes to do is quintessentially American.......

[krkaufman]

116. "quintessentially American", indeed. n/t

[Chovexani]

123. Word to the third

I love how he said that without any sense of irony. :wtf:

'Course I'm just a treehugging Pagan hippie that gets made fun of 'cause my dream car is a Prius. No joke, it was at work the other day when this jackass in my training class was going on about how when we get on the sales floor he's gonna buy an Escalade and put dubs on it (lame ass spinning rims, ugh). Mind you this kid is a cheesehead from Wisconsin and probably learned what a dub was on MTV. Honestly at least in my parts the MTV gangsta wannabe set are about the only ones still buying these massive fucktheplanetmobiles. Them and the nouveau riche yuppie assholes in Scottsdale with their stupid goddamn vanity plates (I swear I've never seen so many asinine cutesy vanity plates until I moved to AZ).

When they get plug-in capacity on the '08-'09 Prii I'll sell plasma if I have to...I'll be on it like Bobby Hill on chocolate-covered french fries. In the meantime I'm working on my FICO score. :(

[krkaufman]

128. We're on the same page. I've got the Prius ('06), but my (realistic) dream car ...

... is the Pluggable version. (The add-on PHEV kits are a tad too rich for me, at present, and my warranty is too fresh to risk losing it.)

What's a FICO?


Re: kids dressing and acting "street"... Calling my nephew a "streetard", and explaining why, seemed to help curb that sorta behavior.

[Chovexani]

129. I'm totally stealing "streetard"

:rofl:

FICO is just a fancy term for your credit score...my problem is I'm young and don't really have a credit history, which makes things tough. It's this Catch-22 where no one will give you credit because you don't have any, but you can't build credit without getting any. :(

I just succumbed to the devil plastic 'cause I was able to get special employee pricing through the bank I started working for, and I'll just have to take it from there.

The plug-in kits scare me too, 'cause I'm not really a car person (though researching the Prius is sure turning me into one). How are you enjoying yours? I always like to hear from Prius owners 'cause they love their cars like Mac-heads love our computers. :)

[krkaufman]

131. FICO... gotcha; thanks.

Re: my Prius. Love it. (Not that I don't have some complaints or wishes; but they're dwarfed by the bennies -- including a 55MPG highway trip this weekend -- and that hope for a future plug-in capability.)

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

127. So, when Mom was harping about not being wasteful...

...she was being unamerican?

[Erika]

15. The GOP Elitists have no problem with flipping us the bird

As they continue to support the ME countries as our troops fight there. Fuck them.

[lithiumbomb]

16. just some perspective

GM has introduced a number of new full size SUVs over the past 12 months, replacing some much older models. Some of them are car based, which while still not perfect is an improvement over a heavier truck based model. I'm not sure what incentives are out there at the moment, but it's also probable that there is some cash on the hoods of these brand spankng new trucks. There's a lot more that affects car sales than any one item. What happened in the 90s and early 00s is people who were in passenger cars got into SUVs. I would be interested to find out if this up tick in sales is people moving from cars to SUVs, or people trading in their old SUV for a new one. This is just a short term uptick, I would hold out to see what the long term trends are before getting too alarmed. It's hard to argue with $3+ gas prices.

[krkaufman]

117. They're getting closer and closer to 'em ... but just not quite willing to call the new vehicles ...

.... station wagons.

[LibDemAlways]

17. It's just another way that people with a bunch of money

show it off. There's a tract of McMansions near me that has a giant SUV parked in just about every driveway. One idiot has a hummer painted like a giant American flag with an arrow-toting eagle on the side. There are two more hummers on the same street and a sea of Suburbans, Yukons, Armadas, Escalades, etc. The women all drive them one-handed - the other is occupied holding "cell" to ear. Stepford has nothing on this place. Bunch of goddamned sheep with no sense, no ability to think for themselves, and no concern whatever for the planet they inhabit.

My daughter has a friend whose step-dad drives a hummer. The kids got together after school one day at a sandwich shop and I was forced to talk to Mr. Hummer for a few minutes. "So, which American Idol contestant do you like?" was his opening line. It went downhill from there.

[saigon68]

19. The women all drive them one-handed - the other is occupied holding "cell" to ear.

See this more and more often

[wakeme2008]

21. Scary to watch

I sat in my car for around 4 minutes waiting for a lady to parallel park a mini-van with a cell going in one hand. :scared: She finally gave up on the cell and was able to park it the first time phone free.

[Iris]

73. ha! I'm surprised she didn't give up on the parking space.

But I guess that might have meant she had to walk more than 10 paces to her destination.

[LibDemAlways]

31. It's an epidemic. Dropping my daughter off at

school and picking her up is a nightmare. Giant SUVs everywhere, being driven by inattentive people who are gabbing on the phone. I have to drive with my hand in close proximity to the horn and have been forced to use it frequently to avoid being hit.

[Ilsa]

37. I've asked about making it illegal to do this: if a car is in Drive and

on school property, no cell use. Never got a response from my legislator. I guess she drives on school property with a cell on her ear.

[KansDem]

50. If it wasn't a tool for business or a toy for the affluent...

Cell phone use while driving would have been illegal a long time ago.

[Thor_MN]

51. How about mandating a cell phone disruptor in every vehicle

range of about 10 feet, on if vehicle is not in park, fines for disabling the device. Cell phones are fine for emmergencies, but there is no reason whatsoever to use one while driving.

[Ilsa]

69. And I only want them not in use in the school parking lot. nt

[silverojo]

150. I always pull over and stop B4 using a cell phone

First off, it really throws off your coordination to hold a phone to your ear, esp. while taking a corner. I'll never forget when I first used a cell phone (this was before we knew of the dangers while driving), and damn near rolled our Olds.

Since then, it's an unspoken family rule: The passenger uses the cell phone, the driver DRIVES. If the driver's alone, she pulls over and parks somewhere, THEN makes the call.

[Megahurtz]

103. Yeah And TINY Women Too.

Ever see any of those Women jump out of the S.U.V. in a parking lot with Cell in hand?
Most are at least 5'2 or under! :scared:

Holy Crap and they are driving a fucking truck??? :banghead:

[Ezlivin]

27. Jeebus but that sounds like the DFW area

I, too, live surrounded by McMansions and SUVs. Of course the SUVs have the obligatory Xian Fish Symbol on the rear hatch, a trophy-wife with cellphone pressed to a coiffed head and a "W" sticker on the rear glass. There's a "contemporary" church on nearly every corner, generally "pastored" by a young, attractive couple who earnestly want to reach the world for Christ, but do so from an upscale setting.

I'd rather have the Depression and genuine people than all this faux bullshit.

[LibDemAlways]

35. My LA suburb is close enough to the movie studios

to attract people who work in that business. We don't have the mega-church influence, but we do have a serious snob infestation. The McMansion tracts are up on a hill and have had some problems with teenagers breaking into unlocked SUVs and taking laptops, cell phones, etc. You'd think these people would get a clue, lock their cars, and take their toys inside. Hell, no. They want to gate their little enclave and have petitioned the local city council to do it. One guy explained that they need the gates because of their "affluence." He actually had the nerve to say that at a public forum. So far the council has been holding firm - no gates.

By the way, instead of the fish symbol and "W" sticker, these idiots go with the little stick people depicting all members of the family including the dog or some sort of cutesy sports reference like a baseball that looks like it is half sticking out the rear window. The trophy wives around here are all size 0 and wear sweats and baseball caps almost exclusively.

[Coventina]

36. Wow, if I had heard that guy saying that they "need" a gated community

I would have probably ended up in jail, and the video of "melee at local town meeting" would be on the "humorous" news bit all over the country.

:mad:

[LibDemAlways]

40. Many people around here went into serious debt to buy

one of those tract mansions. The houses are so close together you can hear what's going on next door, but the people up there have convinced themselves they're living in a remote corner of Beverly Hills (30 miles away), and they have the attitude to go with it.

And I'm with you. The urge to punch them out is very tempting.

[DBoon]

42. I wouldn't punch them out

I'd let the air out of all 4 tires of their SUV.

That would actually cause them more distress than an assualt to their person.

[AnneD]

109. Please remember.....

some of those vehicles are working vehicles. I use to live in the mountainous country. An SUV or 4WD was essential and the only safe vehicle. I would go down the mountain for supplies and to do laundry once a week. We walked around our mountain town whenever we could, but even then sometimes it was hard. Many folks had working ranches and they were essential to run a farm.

Lots of times truck and SUV in the city (at least in Houston)are used for their high profile. Flooding is a real issue and these lower cars flood out. I can understand use in some instances. I think some of this is foolish, but I would not cause damage-it might be a working man's car.

[krkaufman]

119. You'll want to be careful of taking such action, nowadays...

Ref. this: http://www.courttv.com/news/2007/0524/arson_ap.html

[EnviroBat]

142. Wow, Arson is a little too extreme, but tagging SUV's

with "Tiny Penis Trasport" bumper-stickers is an absolute riot!

[happyslug]

79. Yes, they Better, The Courts have NOT permitted Gates on Public Roads.

And the Conservatives on the US Supreme Court are unlikely to Change the rule. Basically the Courts have ruled that a Community CAN gate its Roads PROVIDED the people living in the new gated area pay back to the community the cost to build and maintain any Public road the General public is now cut off from using. The basic Concept is Public Roads means Public Access. If Government money is spent to build the road, the road MUST be open to the public (and by the public that means everyone, not just the taxpayers of the Community involved). Thus your local Council MUST keep the roads open.

Now, even if this person comes up with the money to pay back the Community for the costs of the Roads, the courts MAY still deny gating the community if the roads lead to other Communities (You can NOT block people coming from another Municipality from going into your community). Thus you can NOT make a Public road private if that cuts off people access, even people who live in other municipalities. This is gated in with the freedom of Movement (And why railroads, Toll-roads and even the interstate Highway System were built AWAY from existing roads, or existing roads were moved to accommodate the Railroad, Toll-road or Interstate highways but such pre-existing roads remained, often not maintained but still existed).

My point is it is HARD to transfer a Public Road to a Private Road, even if the Residents wants it. Thus ALL the gated Communities I know of build their own Road system to avoid the issue of transferring Public Roads to Private use.

[LibDemAlways]

86. The argument that the local officials used was that putting

up gates denies people access to the "open space" that surrounds the community. That open space is rattlesnake territory and no sane person would venture into it, but nonetheless, apparently public access must be maintained.

Thanks for your informative response. The people who want their tract gated obviously are unaware of the legal ramifications - surprising, because quite a few of the residents up there are lawyers!

[krkaufman]

118. If they council doesn't go with the gated community plan ...

... expect the enclave to be putting in a call to Blackwater.

[southerncrone]

62. Amen to that, brothers & sstsers!

;)

[southerncrone]

63. Holy typo! Make that "sisters".

[Ishoutandscream2]

70. Yep, Are you in Rockwall?

You describe my town to a T.

[Skittles]

89. ditto, Ezlivin

try Collin County - so much phoniness :puke:

[silverojo]

54. Jesus, Mary, and Joseph

<<One idiot has a hummer painted like a giant American flag with an arrow-toting eagle on the side.>>

Wow, what an American he is...someone should tell him he's "supporting the terrorists" by using Middle Eastern oil, and maybe that type of language would sink into his foot-thick skull. Or perhaps a simple, "If you support the war, enlist and help fight it!"
And y'know what's hilarious? The H2 Hummers are actually a Chevy Tahoe chassis with a fake Hummer body on top. You can tell a REAL Hummer, because it's more square, often wider at the base, and really looks like a military vehicle. Imbeciles!

<<There are two more hummers on the same street and a sea of Suburbans, Yukons, Armadas, Escalades, etc. The women all drive them one-handed - the other is occupied holding "cell" to ear. Stepford has nothing on this place. Bunch of goddamned sheep with no sense, no ability to think for themselves, and no concern whatever for the planet they inhabit.>>

When I started seeing SUV's made by Cadillac and Mercedes, I knew the end of civilization was not far away....

<<My daughter has a friend whose step-dad drives a hummer. The kids got together after school one day at a sandwich shop and I was forced to talk to Mr. Hummer for a few minutes. "So, which American Idol contestant do you like?" was his opening line. It went downhill from there.>>

Well, of course he wouldn't want to talk about the weather...not when he's belching noxious emissions into the air. :mad:

[southerncrone]

61. Let me guess, you live in TX.

[LibDemAlways]

80. No. Southern California. The town isn't named

Stepford, but it should be.

[shanti]

82. arggggh!

i work with those "american idol" folks, and know exactly what you mean! :argh:

[LibDemAlways]

85. The guy barely knows me, but assumes I devote my

evenings to watching some half-assed "talent" competition on tv. When I told him I don't watch the show, he was shocked. "You don't watch American Idol???" I half-expected him to add, "What are you, a communist?"

[Chovexani]

124. So that's what Hell looks like

:scared:

[diamidue]

18. My aunt/uncle just bought one.

I think they figured it was a good car to take trips in - kind of an alternative to (and using less gas than) a motor home: big, roomy and comfortable. Plus they need space to accommodate their cats...

They're both pretty old now & they belong to all these neo-con organizations. I'm sure they probably believe global warming is left-wing nonsense.

[OneBlueSky]

22. because there's no national policy on energy conservation . . .

hard to believe I know, but there are still a substantial number of Americans who trust the government to give them accurate information and tell them the truth . . .

if the government says (or suggests by inaction) that there's no problem, who are they to argue? . . .

[krkaufman]

120. And so many people believe that the news media would be criticizing govt officials ...

... for hypocrisy, lies, mistakes, etc.

And so they're led like good little sheeple....

[Double T]

23. This proves that greedy selfish americans are exactly like bush.......

they don't give a shit about the environment, global warming and climate change. There is NO HOPE for this nation anymore.

[razzleberry]

24. some people don't like bending down, to get in a car

for reasons I can only guess at.
So they buy some, high off the ground, bus like thing.

could someone explain to my why 99% of vehicles these days are nerdy four-doors?

[durablend]

33. But they sure like 'bending over' at the gas pump!

"Thank you sir...may I have another?"

[silverojo]

56. What's wrong with 4-doors?

We had a two-door, and it was VERY hard to get into the back seat. Our four-door also gets much better mileage.

Not everybody is healthy enough to be a contortionist, you know....

[Megahurtz]

105. ROFL!!!

:rofl:

[durablend]

26. You have to remember one thing

I think everyone (here) has figured it out by now, but all these "feel good" stories are directed at the demographic with money. Same as how they'll keep harping on how "the economy is great but for some reason a majority of Americans just don't want to understand that"...the haves and have mores are obviously flourishing while the rest of us are drowning.

[PSPS]

28. Be aware that these SUV "buyers" are getting them for free.

DOn't forget that there's still the gas-guzzler tax allowance that says if you buy a "vehicle" that is over 6,000 pounds GVW and claim to use it more than 50% in a business, you can deduct its cost entirely as a section 179 expense (up to $100,000.) In other words, you get the SUV essentially for free. (There is no such allowance for a vehicle weighing under 6,000 pounds.)

Plus, as pointed out elsewhere, this is a thinly-veiled ad piece. Very common in today's news.

[kirby]

76. I hope you are not a tax accountant

Being able to depreciate something (normally or under section 179) is no where near the same as it being 'free'. It just means you do not pay taxes on an equivalent amount of income. (Think of it as a discount of 28% if you are in the 28% tax bracket).

That being said, its still a ridiculously warped tax policy that makes no sense. What was supposed to benefit 'small business owners' who used Pickup trucks and Boxcar Vans for their business, has turned into an incentive for those larger SUVs. (Not all SUVs are > 6000lbs GVW). Considering that SUVs are the main sellers from Detroit, I would not be surprised to see many Democrats (at the urging of the Detroits lobbying) having supported this as a way to boost the failed US auto industry.

[krkaufman]

121. I was just wondering, in another thread, if that provision had been repealed of de-loopholed.

Are you sure it's still out there?

(Interesting comments. Thanks.)

[july302001]

sold a house?

If they recently sold a house in California and moved into a slightly smaller one, they probably think they have a bunch of cash for the payment and gas. They may be getting a dealer rebate as well.

All the same, it's an atrocious concept.

I remember when driving a Bimmer or Mercedes down the LA Freeway was showing off one's wealth.

[july302001]

29. sold a house?

If they recently sold a house in California and moved into a slightly smaller one, they probably think they have a bunch of cash for the payment and gas. They may be getting a dealer rebate as well.

All the same, it's an atrocious concept.

I remember when driving a Bimmer or Mercedes down the LA Freeway was showing off one's wealth.

[DemoTex]

30. My R/W neighbors, who drive a monster Buick and an Expedition ..

My GOPer neighbor test-drove my Prius last night and LOVED it. He said that he will probably buy a Prius for himself and a Mini Cooper for his wife.

BTW: R/W neighbor also introduced me to Kevin Mertens last night. Keven was John Edwards' SC campaign manager in 2004 and has served as P/R director for Biden. Mertens is running for Greenville City Council as a Democrat.

[silverojo]

151. A "monster Buick"?

Where the hell did they find one of those, at a vintage car show?

Today's Buicks are small, even the sedans. The Buick Century looks like a Toyota now, compared to its former glory.

Why can't they make hybrids of larger cars, so people can have leg room AND use less gas? :(

[skids]

32. SUVs are a must have...

...to drive over the potholes left behind after we get our property taxes cut. So sayeth the republican playbook.

[ileus]

98. Where do you live that actually cut property taxes...

I may move there...our's is heading up 40-50% this year for the fun of it.

[skids]

110. Western MA...

There are basically two extremes out here. Blue towns that spend money at the drop of the hat on just about anything they can, and the redder farming towns that kick out anyone who wants to do stuff like fix the roads. (On the bright side, those towns don't end up with incestuous and rampant development projects like the others -- but they take it to an extreme and end up living in a craphole.) Oh, but for a breath of fresh moderation.

[krkaufman]

122. Well, it may not be "for the fun of it"

It's been long-projected -- for 6 years, anyway -- that Bush's irresponsible tax cuts and cutting federal spending on states & localities would simply result in higher state & local taxes to make up for lost (federally subsidized) revenue.

[Deja Q]

34. The demographics of those buying the SUVs - apart from being closet cretins,

what are their factors?

I doubt they're poor or working class. All the people I know of are not happy with gas prices right now; it's taking away their ability to purchase niceties, which is paramount to our economy.

[Iris]

74. There was an article in the Atlantic a few years back about the personality traits of SUV owners.

Not very flattering. One thing I distinctly remember is that they were often insecure in their marriages.

[sanskritwarrior]

84. Well there is me

Early 30's
Half White Half Indian (subcontinent type)
SFC (Sergeant First Class) in the Army
Drives a 2004 Ford F-150
My base pay minus all allowances is roughly 42,000 dollars a year


Wife

early 30's
White
Schoolteacher
Drives a 2005 Jeep Grand Cherokee
She makes 32,000 a year

We are both from Texas

We live in Hawaii, we are far from rich, we just prefer to drive SUV's and Trucks, and I don't appreciate anyone telling us how to live our lives......So there is one demographic for you.......Both vehicles were paid off from my last tour to Iraq.

[Megahurtz]

106. Well Thanks For Your Contribution

to Global Warming. :sarcasm:

[kestrel91316]

107. Then we will assume you "prefer" to get reamed at the pump, too.

To each his own......

:shrug:

[sanskritwarrior]

114. Don't really care gas costs what it costs, I need it, I pay for it

[stimbox]

140. Hey Sarge.

I don't appreciate anyone telling us how to live our lives.

You are in the Army, right. Isn't there always someone telling you what to do? ;)

Can't you get diesel versions of both of those vehicles?
There is a bio-diesel maker in Oahu.
http://www.biodiesel.com/Oahubio.htm

[silverojo]

152. So being a vet gives you permission to rape the ozone layer?

Sorry, but veterans are human too, and all humans are going to suffer from the damage we're doing...military service will not make you exempt.

You shouldn't view this as people telling you how to live, but as a desire to help save this planet from ruin. As a military man, you should have learned long ago that being in the military is about PROTECTING our country, not destroying the air your countrymen breathe....

[Nihil]

97. Apparently, most are brain-dead GOP supporters ...

... with a major "f*ck you" attitude problem.

Sort of explains why the world's in the state it is at the moment ...

:shrug:

[Ilsa]

38. I wonder if height and girth has something to do with this also.

We have alot of tall people in Texas, and we have a lot of folks with serious girth. I know of people who are so big, their arms don't reach the steering wheel any more so they have to be chaufferred. Others want the extra space for their girth so they don't feel crowded.

Either way, it is somewhat sickening that people think they need the beast for physical reasons. But I bet these people are in the minority.

[LibDemAlways]

41. The average SUV driver in my neighborhood is a

woman who stands 5'4" and weighs 90 pounds soaking wet. The big guys drive Ford trucks.

[Ilsa]

43. I live in one of the fattest states in the US. nt

[silverojo]

57. The answer: a van or minivan

We used to have a van, which got great gas mileage for its size (in overdrive, it used about the same amount of gas as our car!). My aunt, its primary driver, was very overweight, and it was plenty big for her. She was also able to drive minivans comfortably.

As for height, it doesn't get better than the average van. Headroom out the wazoo.

Vans are the vehicle of choice for handicapped people. So there's basically no reason to get a gas-sucking SUV.

[benEzra]

94. If you compare within the same size and engine class,

minivans don't really do any better than SUV's re: mileage. Yes, minivans beat the ginormous SUV's, but are pretty comparable to midsize SUV's.

We recently sold our Chrysler minivan and bought a V-6 sedan; lack of gas mileage (mid 20's on the highway) was a major reason, along with the van's age.

[silverojo]

153. A V6 sedan?

We have one, and its mileage is no better than that of a minivan. In fact, the full-sized customized van we used to have got mileage almost as good as our sedan, provided you used Overdrive instead of Drive.

Minivans are much lighter than SUV's, and that's why they get better mileage. Yet they're capable of seating just as many people comfortably. :)

[tiredofthisstuff]

39. First Thing To Come To mind

[DBoon]

44. Veblen on "conspicuous consumption"

Conspicuous consumption of valuable goods is a means of reputability to the gentleman of leisure. As wealth accumulates on his hands, his own unaided effort will not avail to sufficiently put his opulence in evidence by this method. The aid of friends and competitors is therefore brought in by resorting to the giving of valuable presents and expensive feasts and entertainments. Presents and feasts had probably another origin than that of naive ostentation, but they acquired their utility for this purpose very early, and they have retained that character to the present; so that their utility in this respect has now long been the substantial ground on which these usages rest. Costly entertainments, such as the potlatch or the ball, are peculiarly adapted to serve this end.

...

From the foregoing survey of the growth of conspicuous leisure and consumption, it appears that the utility of both alike for the purposes of reputability lies in the element of waste that is common to both. In the one case it is a waste of time and effort, in the other it is a waste of goods. Both are methods of demonstrating the possession of wealth, and the two are conventionally accepted as equivalents.

http://www2.pfeiffer.edu/~lridener/DSS/Veblen/CONSPIC.HTML

He was talking about the robber barons of the late 19th century, with the satirical view of an anthropologist studying some distant "primitive culture"

Deliberate wastefulness is a sign of great wealth, and those with the greatest wealth need help from others in order to be sufficiently wasteful

[bkcc]

46. As a life-long New Yorker....

I never understood this. Now that I've moved to Southern California, I see it every day. It really is some kind of herd mentality that if there's a cool car to have, then you must have it as well.

I have friends here who are so oblivious to anything environmental, which truly surprised me when I first arrived. I had always thought that Californians were supposed to be so much more informed and progressive. Now I see that the majority of people are pretty much clueless no matter where you go. And as for Southern Californians and gas? Well, let's just say I know more than a few who can't fathom walking 5 blocks to the store when it's just so much more convenient to drive.

*sigh*

[DBoon]

49. As a life long-Californian

it makes no sense to me either.

My idea of a cool car is a VW diesel converted to take bio-fuels.

And I'd much rather walk 5 blocks than deal with the hell of parking.

[Lance_Boyle]

91. No conversion necessary for biodiesel.

If your VW TDI came from about '96 or later, no conversion necessary. Now, if you want to burn straight veggie oil (SVO), you need a conversion kit (about $2000). But for biodiesel (all the way up to B100), just pump it in and go.

[kestrel91316]

108. My idea of a cool car in CA is a BIKE, but on the streets of LA it's a no-go.

[silverojo]

59. California is mostly Republican

Except for metro areas like SF and LA (but even those places have mostly-Repuke suburbs).

As for walking 5 blocks to the store, I don't fault people for that. How are you going to haul groceries home without a vehicle? Especially in places like SoCal, where everyone with sense knows you have to buy your water because the tap is so filled with pollutants. How, pray tell, is one person with only two hands supposed to carry, say, 6 or more gallon jugs of water AND their groceries for five blocks? Depending on the size of their family, that's quite a haul you're expecting people to carry for nearly half a mile.

The problem is that people are buying SUV's they don't need, and not combining their errands to save gas. It would also help if people moved closer to their work...even with a small car, if you're commuting 20 miles to and from work each day, you're using just as much gas as an SUV that only drives in town.

Every 5 miles adds 1 pound of pollution to the air. Think about it....

[burrowowl]

65. I lived in France for 20 years and

had a little cart to carry groceries home in, plus string net sacks. Also you always had a friendly neighborhood small grocer, bakery, pharmacy, etc. nearby. In some areas of ABQ a grocery store is 5 miles away, work 10 to 15 (we have good bike paths but there are dangerous areas and 60 year olds are not up to biking).
The urbanscape has to be rethought and densified to make mass transit viable, here most bus service stops at 6:00 pm and many get out of work later.

[Iris]

75. umm. . .get a cart?

[silverojo]

154. A cart, LOL!

Unless you steal one from a grocery store, you're not going to find one sturdy enough to carry a family's load of groceries. Where are you going to put several gallon jugs of bottled water (because city water is unfit to drink), in addition to a gallon of milk? Canned foods are pretty heavy, too. And, pray tell, how are you going to keep perishable foods cold/frozen between store and home, when you live in the desert?

Also, how the hell are disabled or elderly people supposed to haul such a heavy load home? I have trouble lifting ONE gallon of water at a time out of the freakin' trunk of our car, and there's no damned way I could cart a week's worth of groceries, water, and milk home.

Furthermore, our nearest grocery store is 6 miles away, and it's a very LONG walk between the bus stop and my home, and the bus stop and the supermarket. Only a complete idiot would attempt pushing a heavy load in 115-degree heat.

Should you think this is only a problem for desert dwellers, consider this--winter always brings on a rash of heart attacks among people merely shoveling snow. Imagine those same people trying to push a heavily-loaded cart through the snow, in subfreezing temperatures?

Please, get a freakin' clue about real life before you spout unrealistic suggestions.

[Odin2005]

48. If you can afford a Hummer gas prices don't bother you.

The Have Mores that can afford those dick extenders are totally disconnected from reality, thats why the Dow Jones is still sky high and the MSM keeps spewing BS about the "roaring economy" despite us being in a recession for 6 years.

[fedsron2us]

52. When the oil runs out we will run everything on stupidity.

It is the only commodity in the world of which there is an infinite supply.

[southerncrone]

66. And apparently grows in exponential leaps every day!

[MasonJar]

55. STUPID and arrogant and unpatriotic and need I say stupid. Go, "morans," go!

[Pachamama]

64. It's moments like this after reading this news, that I seriously question the future of humans on

this planet and whether we will survive, and then I realize it ain't looking so good for the human race and that Planet Earth would be better off without us....

Shocking and disgusting....

[hatrack]

68. If so, then $5 gasoline is all but inevitable

This country is stupid beyond belief.

[Javaman]

93. And you had any doubt before?

:rofl:

[agincourt]

71. Another example,

Of the obscene disparity between rich and poor in this crazy country. Some people could afford 20.00 a gallon gas and it wouldn't make a dent in their lifestyle.

[blues90]

72. I don;t know why this amazes me but it does

It also horrifies me to think that people still have no idea of what these things do not only to the environment but to the troops and big oil profit . It also tells me that people are not as aware as I hoped they would be . So much for getting out of Iraq .

[Sapere aude]

96. You do the same to the troops and big oil profit only on smaller scale I suppose.

You don't buy gasoline? You walk or ride a bike where ever you go?

[RedEarth]

77. How depressing.......I detest big SUV's and big trucks.... absolutely hate em.

[happyslug]

81. SUV have been DOGS since at least 2001, when gas started to go up.

Thus comparing 2007 to 2006 numbers is really meaningless, you need to look at 1999-2001 period to get a feel for how "Big" this jump in sales really is. I suspect it is NOT MUCH, it is a lot compared to 2006 and 2005 (and maybe even 2003 and 2004) but I suspect it is still WAY BELOW the number sold in the late 1990s till about 2001 when the price of gasoline started to go up.

Remember this is a Statement from MARKETERS, they like PUSHING ANY GOOD NEWS, even if is is not. For example Marketers will yell "Sales are up 100& this year" while ignoring that last year sales was down 1000% from the previous year.

Lets look at the number given in the Article. It states a 24% drop in sales from 2004-2006, then a 72% sale increase between 2006 and 2007 (And the real drop occurred between 2001 and 2004, a fact ignored in the Article).

Lets us say 1000 units were sold in 2004. A 24% drop means 760 units were sold in 2006. 72% increase over 760 is 1307 units. A good increase, but lets look at the more popular seller, the Suburban (There are More Chevrolet Dealers than GMC Dealers in the US so Chevrolet ALWAYS sold more Suburbans than GMC sold Yukons). The 38% increase comes to only 1038 units sold ( which is .38 Percent increase in sale, NOT the 38% being bragged about).

Basically GM is selling roughly the same number of Yukon/Suburbans as it did in 2004, which was a POOR YEAR FOR SUVs. Now GM MUST sell these SUVs to survive, thus GM will hide any bad news and bragged about any good news, even if the news is achieved by manipulating the figures. Remember the old saying, Figures don't lie, but liars Figure. GM is trying to show it can stay in business, GM is trying to get people to buy SUVs when Gasoline is $3 a gallon. Thus GM will concentrate its news releases on any good news, even if you carefully look at the numbers the news is NOT that good. What GM needs is SUV sales like in had in the 1990s not in 2004 or 2006 and it does NOT look like GM is achieving that goal.

[MADem]

87. Morons!! Unless they're planning on parking them and living in them after they lose their homes! nt

[Javaman]

92. Once again, the stupid lead the charge over the cliff.

man, this shit gets so exhausting sometimes.

:banghead:

[benEzra]

95. I do hope these SUV buyers stay the heck out of the left lane...

few things in life bug me more than somebody who buys a gigantic SUV that gets 12 mpg around town, and then drives it like a cement truck to "save gas." Because invariably, they will grab the left lane at stoplights and the passing lane on the freeway, which they must think is the barge lane instead of the passing lane. I HATE getting behind an SUV that is crawling away from the light at a bicycle pace or going 59 mph in the passing lane, forcing all the fuel-efficient cars behind them to crawl as well...

:rant:



Give me one of these instead:



:loveya:

[Doremus]

126. It's nice but not so fuel efficient at 22/29 mpg.

The Ford Escape hybrid SUV gets 34mpg highway. I'm no fan of SUVs, just the opposite, but DH and I are car-shopping right now and were surprised to learn there was a larger vehicle that got decent mileage.

Honda Accord (28/35), Toyota Corolla (32/41), there's a whole bunch of mid-size cars that beat any Volvo. VW is another maker that doesn't seem concerned about gas mileage. :shrug:

We're looking at the Toyota Matrix (29/34) because we need some cargo room for our business. If it weren't for that, I'd be in a Prius for sure. That is one slick car!

[EnviroBat]

156. I know what you mean...

It's like being behind a 4-wheel drive dumpster with a billboard nailed to it. Fuggin infuriating. The driver is usually oblivous to the world around them, with head and cell-phone planted firmly up ass.

[cyr330]

112. Won't they have fun?

Gas is now $3.76 here in San Francisco. I wonder how much it will cost to fill up one of those behemoths that regularly roll off to the suburbs every evening? Thank god I can walk to work!

[crim son]

125. For some, the SUV is a step down.

My well-to-do neighbors have put their twelve passenger van into early retirement and have replaced it with... an SUV. To them, it's a savings. :eyes:

edited for typo

[DainBramaged]

130. Wow another bash big Amurikan SUV's thread

I guess the Nissan Titan (wow penis envy at it's very best), Honda Ridgeline, and Toyota Land Cruiser (toot toot little land schooner) get a pass?

[superconnected]

135. Gee wonder why...

:eyes:

[DainBramaged]

136. Brilliant reply, one of the 10 smartest in human history

your lack of comment regarding the rice burning penis extensions speaks wonders.

[Nihil]

138. I think you'll find that most people round here ...

... are equal-opportunity SUV-haters, not specific to US-built ones.
The digs at the US car industries are - as you well know - about their
lack of sensible response to not only the oil supply issue but also to
their economically superior foreign competitors.

The main dig is to those city/suburb-living morons who buy SUVs (from
whatever country) simply as a sign that they have more money than brains
and more pennies than penis.

:hi:

[Maeve]

139. I always liked the term "more dollars than sense" eom

[EnviroBat]

157. Nope, not a bit.

Stupid looking, and wasteful just the same. The Honda Ridgeline is one of the stupidest looking vehicles on the road next to this:



or this...

[ShortnFiery]

141. Good! I hope it goes up to $5 this summer.

Every time I pass an Eco-Terrorist in a Hummer or big a**ed SUV, I laugh and laugh and laugh ... you reap what you sow MF! :rofl:

[SleeplessinSoCal]

148. 18 mpg highway...

http://www.theautochannel.com/vehicles/new/reviews/2002/gap0139.html

[bleedingheart]

143. some people buy cars because they need the room...

our family has a Prius and a minivan.

The minivan is old but very reliable...and we can haul our kids and grandma around with it...we take grandma to a lot of places and so when hauling 5 people around...it is a good car.

Now the Prius...we could haul grandma around...but it would be a bit tight...and if we take a long road trip with her...we need room

I also coach soccer and I haul my kids and some other kids to and from practice...and I have all the equipment in the car and refreshments...and chairs for grandma when she comes along...

Eventually I think...we may not need such a big car anymore...but...it is convenient..

We are renting a car when we go out west (we are flying there..) it is a minivan...but it seats 7 and we will have 6 people that we will be hauling around...would it be better to take two cars?

to be honest...my minivan has a lot more room than most SUV's...in fact I have been in SUV's that have been very very cramped...I couldn't understand why someone would build a big car that is not so roomy...

[Maeve]

144. Agree--I drive a Caravan

Four kids, gotta be able to transport them...and it is easier to get my great-aunt in and out of than a smaller car. Hubby drives a much smaller car (carries five if the back three are small and/or friendly), but uses the van when he has a lot of equipment to carry.

My mom drives a boat of a car--makes her feel safe, but I'm not sure is actually IS safer. I look forward to being able to get a cute little car someday when the kids are gone.

[bleedingheart]

145. my husband has always wanted a sporty little two seater

I keep telling him that we will trade in our car when our last one graduates from college...because until then...we are going to be hauling children and stuff around for a while.

I know a lot of older folks who still own min-vans because they are hauling grandkids around...it never ends...

:-)

[pstokely]

155. will they ever make a hybrid minivan?

nt

[Oreegone]

147. My SUV fantasy

Making up bumperstickers and sticking them on all the SUV's I see.

They would say, I SUPPORT THE SAUDI ROYAL FAMILY
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[bamacrat]

158. YEah a guy in my office just told me he just bought a jeep.

He said it was for his midlife crisis.