Panelists allege election tampering

[maddezmom]

Source: Daily Freeman

Panelists allege election tampering
By William J. Kemble, Correspondent
06/02/2007

NEW PALTZ - A panel of educators and a journalist on Friday outlined claims that some elections over the past six years have been compromised by fraud and the improper invalidation of millions of ballots.

Speaking during an evening forum at SUNY New Paltz, University of Pennsylvania Professor Steven Freeman said research conducted in an effort to understand discrepancies between exit polls and reported vote counts during the 2004 presidential election led him to closely follow the 2006 campaign and conclude that Democrats should have picked up even more seats in the House and Senate.

Some election observers have questioned how President Bush was able to carry all-important Ohio in the 2004 election when most exit polls showed Democrat John Kerry winning the state.

"The first set of shocks is that elections can be stolen," Freeman told the roughly 250 people in attendance on Friday. "The remarkable thing is that there is almost no serious debate about this. ... It's a simple matter for a programmer (in states that have electronic voting), and this is something that you can do with a first-year programming course - put in two lines of code into the program."

Freeman said the electronic voting in 49 states is overseen by three companies, and he alleged that all have close ties to top Republicans.



Read more: http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=18417560&BRD=1769&PAG=461&dept_id=74969&rfi=6

[Wilms]

1. Perhaps the reporter got it wrong. But it sure seems Freeman is running roughshod over the facts.

"Freeman said the electronic voting in 49 states is overseen by three companies..."

It's a few more than that. (Though I'll concede, perhaps indeed one of the Big Three have there hands in 49 states.) And in many cases, they don't oversee the election, they just sell the gear and the state and/or another vendor oversees the process.


""One of the companies, the biggest, Diebold, the chairman has been a member of Bush's ... 'Rangers,'" he said."

Uh. That guy resigned a while ago. But yeah, you can link a lot of old stuff off the internet. And BTW, ES&S is the biggest, not Diebold. But Diebold is the appointed poster child so the hell with accuracy.


The article states that, "Friday's forum was sponsored by the group Northeast Citizens for Responsible Media."

They ought-ta kick Freeman in the pants. He gives election reformers a bad name by making inaccurate claims.


And he wonders why even many Dem election reformers don't buy his 2004 exit poll theory.

[bleever]

3. The gist of Freeman's presentation is accurate

even if Wally O'Dell doesn't run Diebold anymore.

And because ES&S, Diebold, and Sequoia maintain proprietary rights over their source code (and other aspects of their machines and methods), he is correct that there is no way to be sure of the accuracy or honesty of the vote counting.

[Wilms]

4. Did I say we could "be sure of the accuracy or honesty of the vote counting"?

Of course I didn't. Perhaps you agree.

Did I point to a lack of accuracy...perhaps even honesty of some of the specific claims he made? You bet I did. Further, I can prove it.

What I'm suggesting is that it's counter-productive to lack "accuracy or honesty" in claims we make against the nation's voting infrastructure when it is "accuracy or honesty" we demand of it.

Is that wrong of me? :shrug:

[bleever]

7. No, your criticisms were completely fair;

I was just saying that it didn't bear on his crediblity on the whole.

But you've got a good point that election integrity is all about accuracy and verifiability.

[Melissa G]

12. Spanking you on this thread, too wilms. Since you were bad in two places

:spank: The reporter conflated accounts and was not as accurate as he could have been, but as reporters go this was not that bad. I suspect you have sat through enough events and then later read reported versions that you should know this. It was also a much bigger event than reported with over 400 folks in attendance.
Steve Freeman tries to be as accurate as possible and suggests you check things out before posting attacks on him.
I still love you even if you were jumping to poor conclusions this second time also 'cuz I know you are usually very good.
:loveya:
Melissa

[Wilms]

13. Hey, hey. I did preface my comments with a suggestion that the reporter blew it.

Set aside sitting through enough events, I've been interviewed myself only to be aghast at what was attributed to me.

I've also worked with reporters from major news sources where the story was written BEFORE we did the interview which was designed to ambush the subject into uttering a specific sound-bite the reporter wanted to polish their essay. It was disgusting.

But I'll admit my own bias, now. The exit poll line of attack has long ago turned into a QUAGMIRE. It is good to note in a BTW kind of way, but given all the shit that was pulled in OH 2K4, I feel way too much oxygen was spent on it especially considering the non-results accomplished. If you're looking for Osama, why bomb Iraq?

As well, I'd be interested to know if Freeman addressed the discrepancy in the NY State exit poll given the use of lever machines there. Please ask him. But I've come to assume that exit polls are not that reliable and what we need is a reliable voting system.

Finally, please go easy with that damn frying pan. I have a back-ache.

:loveya: , too.

Wilms

[MissWaverly]

14. Wilms, have you noticed those bonuses given by Blackwell

to his staff as they walked out the door, ranging from $700 and so dollars up to $7,000+. Ms. Brunner is trying to recall this money, saying that the awarding of bonuses for exiting personnel was not legitimate. But I wonder about the motivation since it was
right after the Nov. 04 election.

[Wilms]

16. Perhaps it's "hush money".

On the other hand, it could be sort of a legal defense fund.

[MissWaverly]

17. or maybe just thanks for a job well done

he never thought anyone would look into 2004

[FtWayneBlue]

2. Ohio '04 WAS stolen.

Between shorting Dem precincts of voting machines, Blackwell's changing rules on registering to vote and provisional voting, Republican challenges of voters, and hanky-panky with the electronic tabulating of ballots, there is enough evidence to make a solid case. Read Conyer's book on it.

I want my country back!

[L. Coyote]

10. Vote-switching may have had the largest impact in Ohio, with over 70% punch cards

The 2004 Ohio Presidential Election: Cuyahoga County Analysis
How Kerry Votes Were Switched to Bush Votes
http://jqjacobs.net/politics/ohio.html


From the Conyers Report: "... we find that there were massive and unprecedented voter irregularities and anomalies in Ohio. In many cases these irregularities were caused by intentional misconduct and illegal behavior...."

In a subset of 166,953 votes, one of every 34 Ohio voters, the Kerry-Bush margin
shifts 6.15% when the population is sorted by outcomes of wrong-precinct voting.

Preface

Simply put, Ohio votes were NOT counted as cast. Many votes were miscounted, and Kerry votes were counted for Bush. Numerous questions have been raised ...

http://jqjacobs.net/politics/vote_switching.ppt

[Seedersandleechers]

5. Every time I read articles like this

it leaves a pain in my gut that makes me want to puke....

[Sancho]

6. Go Freeman...keep on telling 'em!

I'm amazed that the press won't cover this. Even with blondie admitting to caging lists and all the poll evidence and antedotal stories, there is still no one putting this on the prime time. I'm going to keep on telling everyone that I can until we see it the top story of the decade.

:banghead:

[Ethelk2044]

8. We should push congress to require a paper trail

This would make sure all votes are counted in the 2008 election. Everyone please write your congressmen to push to make this happens. It needs to be in place before the 2008 election.

[Divine Discontent]

9. that's the only acceptable choice, I agree.

otherwise they can cheat all they want with no proof... but with a paper trail, one precinct can have people bring in their receipts if need be...

www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<---top 2008 items & antibush wear/stickers

[bvar22]

11. ONE Congressman has addressed this issue.

ONLY one! Dennis Kucinich has authored a bill to mandate Paper Ballots, publicly counted at the precinct!!
All other Democratic Candidates refuse to even speak about Election Theft.

More shocking to me is that the Democratic Party as a WHOLE continues to ignore the issue of Election Theft.

Bread & Circuses?

[bamacrat]

15. If the election in 08 is stolen I really think there will be riots.

There ought to be atleast, I mean how stupid can the people of this country be to think that another crazy repuke would be the best person for the job.

[MissWaverly]

18. they never thought he was the best for the job

and the first time that exit polls didn't match votes was when Poppy Bush ran, since then everything is topsy turvy, first we
have the Supremes using the "Equal Protection" which is supposed to allow blacks the right to vote to overturn an election
in Bush's favor, which is ludicrous, completely ludicrous, and then we have obvious chicanery in Ohio in dozens of locations
and the vote is locked in for Bush despite obvious manipulation, suppression, etc.