Driver using alternative fuel faces fine

[deadparrot]

Source: Winston-Salem Journal

Thumbing your nose at oil sheiks can cost you in North Carolina.

Bob Teixeira, a Charlotte guitar teacher, took a stand against U.S. dependence on foreign oil last fall and spent $1,200 to convert his 1981 diesel Mercedes to run on vegetable oil. He buys soybean oil in 5-gallon jugs at Costco, which costs him about a third more than diesel.

Despite his good intentions, the state fined Teixeira $1,000 for not paying motor-fuel taxes. North Carolina officials also told him that to legally use veggie oil here, he’d have to first post a $2,500 bond.

Such penalties have also been levied against other North Carolina drivers whose vehicles were powered by alternative fuels.

Read more: http://journalnow.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=WSJ/MGArticle/WSJ_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1173351566923&path=!localnews&s=1037645509099

[Selatius]

1. The government serves the corporation in America. n/t

[sakabatou]

2. Way to get us off foreign fuels

-_-

[robinlynne]

3. This has to be illegal. I'm not a lawyer, but I'm sure this man can countersue.

criminal. transportation itself is not illegal. One need not pay a tax to walk. or ride a bike. and vegetable oil is already taxed when you buy it....

I hate this government.

[A HERETIC I AM]

4. Walking or riding a bike is not the same as driving a car.

I think it sucks too, don' get me wrong, but your analogy seems to be a bit off here. You don't really need a paved road or stop lights to cross an intersection safely when you walk. There is a difference between walking, riding a bicycle and driving an automobile as they relate to the infrastructure required and therefore the cost involved in putting it in place.

There was another case not long ago of a fellow in Illinois that is going through the same thing except he made his own biodiesel. The state wanted him to post a bond of several thousand dollars because they said he was a "fuel producer" and wanted to regulate him like a full size refinery. He made biodiesel in his garage at something like 100 gallons at a time. It is absurd.

[trogdor]

36. So eating cheeseburgers is also a violation when you ride your bike.

And I guess if you fart, you're violating the Clean Air Act. sheesh.

[A HERETIC I AM]

44. Care to explain what appears to be the huge leap you have made?

I am pretty sure i am not an imbecile but i have no idea what point you are trying to make.

[Socal31]

5. Here in CA,

I pay upwards of 10 cents/gallon to pave roads and go into the state general fund. If I have to pay it to drive on the roads, you should..no matter what fuel you are using.

However, people like him should be rewarded for actually trying to do something right, by making the cost of fuel a write-off.

[gulfcoastliberal]

6. Really makes you wonder why auto tech hasn't changed in 100 years

And adds credence to the stories of collusion between the state/auto makers/oil sheiks to suppress technology.

[rmgarrette64]

43. Say what?

Auto tech hasn't changed in 100 years? Are we on the same planet?

This is an absolutely astonishing statement. Horsepower, fuel efficiency, noise muffling, frame materials, basic design. Good lord, really... Hasn't changed in 100 years, right.

You want something that doesn't run on gasoline - say so. Don't make a dumb statement like that. And suggest any fuel that has a greater efficiency, portability, and ease of extraction than gasoline. Maybe we'll figure something like that out some day, but it's not there today.

R. Garrett

[tinrobot]

7. The EPA also views veggie as illegal

All fuels need to be EPA tested and approved so they meet emissions standards. Veggie is not an approved fuel. It's very difficult to test veggie oil because it comes from a lot of different sources and is not standardized.

They don't enforce this law right now, but they can at any point.

[JBear]

15. Emissions standards

Correct me if I am wrong, but the emissions standards for a 1981 diesel car were virtually nonexistent. Using veggie oil he will produce less particulate emission, current carbon CO2 and only slightly more NOx than if using diesel. As far as road taxes go, why not set up a way to pay into the road taxes independent of fuels? Why not tax a vehicle at purchase for its road use?

J. in NC
using B100 with road taxes paid.

:bounce:

[19jet54]

8. It's about the tax money!!!!!!!!!!

... it is about the money (TAXES) for the government, not about the environment. You are taking money away from the politicians & they don't like it. Try not paying IRS & see what happens? It is always about the money!

[cape esperance]

31. A constituent and his money are soon parted!

I agree - it is all about taxes and politicians using my money
to do whatever they want to with them in order to stay in
office!

[paparush]

37. Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner!!

NC is the nickel and dime you to death state.

[MatrixEscape]

9. Why be so befuddled or enraged?

When you factor in the cost of making vegetable oil from an agricultural standpoint, it is not even a break even deal. The amount of petroleum used to create it -- from farm vehicle and transportation fuel to the petro-chemicals utilized for fertilizer, herbicides and pesticides) it is clearly not a viable solution to our dependence on oil. Oil is the lifeblood of modern civilization and there is no current transfusion that will continue to fuel it should the supply be limited one way or another. You have to really look into how ubiquitous the use of this commodity is in every aspect of your life to appreciate that fact. Modern life equals oil for now and the near future and there is nothing obviously viable to totally replace it at this stage.

We must change our overall view of life and the needs we have been taught to be accustomed to and require as a beginning step to a workable solution. That is a remark that nobody steeped in the supposed benefits of modern life wants to grapple with and realistically deal with. It requires rapid transformation, change, and a new way of thinking and living. Human beings seem to be very stubborn, across the board, when it comes to change and "sacrifice".

And yet, there are ways to see and experience this all from a new kind of perspective that is not religious or political and it is from a very intimate and direct vantage point:

http://www.sensiblyeclectic.com/news/index.php?/archives/5507-On-Becoming-Comfortably-Unplugged.html

One way or another, a mutation in our personal paradigms is in the making. That transformation will either be forced upon us by the powers that be or circumstance, or we will anticipate it, prepare, and take whatever action is necessary to survive and prosper in more practical, reasonable, and organically functional ways.

[Shipwack]

10. It doesn't apply to this case, but...

There are people that have converted vehicles to run with -waste- vegetable oil. While vegetable oil in general might not make sense as an oil alternative (but it'll look better when oil is $5 a gallon), using oil that will otherwise be thrown away might.

There are other factors... vegetable oil vehicles emits fewer deadly exhaust gases then gasoline does.

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=4&article_id=7818

[MatrixEscape]

11. One can ...

Applaud any short-term solutions that people find to help balance the troubling energy equation we face.

I just wouldn't want that kind of thinking to divert us from the important issue of sustainability. There is only so much "used" vegetable oil to recycle as fuel. That is especially so when you consider the billions of barrels of oil that are currently consumed across the board in the process of usage that we call modern life.

Sustainability is not an issue that will simply go away or yield to profitable, upstart, short-term solutions. Again, petroleum, and not any other sort of chemical or process, is the total life-blood of every factor of our current way of life from food to clothing to transportation, and so on. This commodity is not at all just about who has the most or a certain country's dependency upon it it is about the complete and total impact and effect it now has upon our world view and the resulting life-style it supports.

This is very critical and impacting issue that will not go away or yield to superficial and ungrounded policies or fixes. It is going to be a thorn in our collective sides until we are able to grasp it and make realistic attempts to deal with the problem as it stands before us, glaring and threatening as it is. This is no time to stick our heads in the sand and rely on hope and the panaceas we are going to be offered in exchange for our complacency and cooperation in the short-term. This is an in-your-face actuality that deserves our attention and effort if we are to make any kind of reasonable transition into a new and functional area that is post-petroleum oriented.

Do we want to survive and prosper in the long-run, or would we rather ignore the facts at hand and be entertained and beguiled to death. That is the ultimate quesiton before us and it is as serious as an iceberg in the path of the Titanic.

[JBear]

16. Fuel economy of production

MatrixEscape, you are dead wrong about biodiesel. It actually has a roughly 3:1 energy balance (you get roughly 3x the fuel energy out of what goes into its development cycle). While that is not true of corn based ethanol, biodiesel has a VERY positive return. The down side is that even if all of the veggie oil we grow in this country were produced into biodiesel it would run the diesel needs of this country for less than 1 month.

That said, I am certainly advocating conservation, reuse and the myrad of things we can do to decrease our overall energy use.

J. in NC
Running B100 with road taxes paid

:bounce:

[MadHound]

18. But you're thinking in terms of land based crops

There are a lot of people out there who are working on biodiesel produced using oil bearing algae as a feedstock. A physicist by the name of Michael Briggs at the University of New Hampshire figured out that we could supply all of our current fuel needs with 15,000 sq. miles of water surface.

Since algae is used as the first step of wastewater treatment in many towns, this would be a boon for them, and also for the small farmer. The first runs of algae based biodiesel are being done right now in New Zealand.

[papau]

28. Do you have a source (link) on the New Zealand bio-diesel from Algea runs?

That news is by far the best thing I've heard of late! :-)

[MadHound]

29. Here you go!

<http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/1/story.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10381404>

Amazing how the rest of the world is coming to grips with this problem, while the oil companies and their political lackeys just continue to drive this country into the ground.

[papau]

46. A nice application that would help cities and towns - not a algae farm/power plant but a good

idea.

Of course in the US our current law would demand the bio-fuel product be standardized and emission tested with special permits required by all - in other words - it could not be sold in the US.

Some southern state (N. C. - http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/599471.html) recently ran a fellow into trouble because he bought veggie oil and used it to run his car - threw a tangle of taxes and regulation at him.

[NJCher]

20. not even close, not even a vision

We must change our overall view of life and the needs we have been taught to be accustomed to and require as a beginning step to a workable solution. That is a remark that nobody steeped in the supposed benefits of modern life wants to grapple with and realistically deal with. It requires rapid transformation, change, and a new way of thinking and living. Human beings seem to be very stubborn, across the board, when it comes to change and "sacrifice".

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You and a few others keep saying this and I keep hoping it will happen but nothing ever happens. Leaf blowers still blast away, three at a time, on neighboring properties, ruining the soundscape and using fuel for nothing but property vanity. Huge SUVs lumber down the road and nobody seems to bat an eye that it's taking $75 for a fill. Airplanes and helicopters manage to traverse back and forth overhead, ruining peace and quiet.

I would love love love for it to all come to a stop and if I had to live off the fat of my ass for a long time, so be it. The week following Sept 11 was quiet and peaceful. I would like it to be like that, sans the grief.

THE OP reports the pioneers of change being harassed by the system. The federal government should pass a law exempting people using alternatives from any taxes until a wide variety of ways to transport ourselves are devised. We should have as much choice there as we do when we go to the store for laundry detergent.



Cher

[markbark]

12. Sounds like we need another change:

I pledge allegience to the cash
Of the Corporate States of America
And to the Republicans for which it stands
One nation, under surveillance
Purely risible
with "liberty" and "Justice" for all*

*that can pay

--MAB

[JHB]

17. Someone will stick "under God" in there...

...just like they did with the present pledge.

And they won't care about the rest of it, just as long as those two words are there.

[liberal N proud]

13. Everything to protect the oil company profits

We went to war for the Oil Companies why would this surprise us? From a Fundie state no less.

We are screwed as long as the oil companies have a strangle hold on Washington.

[moose65]

23. you can't blame this on "fundies"

North Carolina has been controlled by Democrats for years. The Governor and both houses of the legislature are Democrats. This is a mess that will take both parties to clean up.

[liberal N proud]

38. Everyone I know in North Carolina is a fundie

I ass-u-me-d that because everyone that I meet from North Carolina was a fundie republicon that everyone was. I must know all of them then. We have 3 mfg plants in NC.
I guess I should pay better attention, huh.

[moose65]

42. Eh, that's all right

We certainly have our share of fundie republicans, as well as quite a few liberals. NC actually has almost 600,000 more registered Dems than Repubs, but many of them are old-school, segregationist Dems who never changed their party affiliation. If the oxymoronic term "Fundie Dem" has any meaning, then we have plenty of THOSE in NC!

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

14. This is certainly petty of NC

But it depends on how the fuel tax law is written. I wonder how they collect fuel taxes from electric vehicles.

As for the EPA not testing this, yeah, I suppose they should test, but a handful of food-burning cars in the state is not going to have any impact on air quality. If the trend takes off, then EPA should get moving on this.

To me, the "alternative fuel" trend is very scary. As more vehicles burn vegetable products or alcohol, then more food will be taken off the food market and diverted to the fuel market. This could cause widespread famine. Price will decide if the corn goes for tortillas or for t-birds.

I applaud Teixeira's experiment, but we need to look at the unintended consequences of this trend, and how to avoid depleting the world's food supply.


edit: no pun intended on the "petty of NC", even though Mr Richard Lee Petty was one of the best fuel-burners to come out of North Carolina.

[wageslave71]

19. I'm from NC

and not too many years ago there was some discussion about dropping the fuel tax and being taxed on the number of miles driven in a year. That mileage was to be assessed at the annual vehicle inspection. The obvious down side to this is a 10 mpg monster would enjoy the same tax rate as a 60-100 mpg car, so the incentive to conserve would be reduced.

The assholes running the General Assembly like Joe Kiser (R-Lincoln) will side with the one's financing their campaigns.

[whistle]

21. Free trade is faux trade, this is the Boston Tea Party "deja vous all over again"!

[Irreverend IX]

22. The upside of this is...

It seems pretty much impossible to get busted for fuel tax evasion as long as you don't have a bumper sticker advertising your use of vegetable fuel. The only reason the guy got caught is that revenue officials happened to notice his sticker. So convert your car but don't advertise the fact.

[A HERETIC I AM]

45. No shit. I was thinking the same thing.

Fill your car in your garage or driveway and don't tell anyone - not even a neighbor what you are filling it with.

How the hell would the state ever find out you stopped going to gas stations?

Sheesh....i just re-read that sentence. Sounds so damned Soviet-Statish it makes me sick, like we have to hide from the KGB or something.

[wageslave71]

49. Unlikely, but not impossible

On-road and off-road diesel fuel (for farm equipment, generators, etc) are dyed different colors. I know of farmers being fined for running off-road diesel in their trucks. It's as simple as pulling a sample out of the tank.

[razzleberry]

24. soybean oil costs ?? v. diesel .n/t

[keith the dem]

25. Cut me an Effen break

I don't care what you burn or how low your emissions are, Here in the US we only pay for a fraction of the true environmental and social costs of motor vehicles. for instance, the damaging runoff from highways and parking lots, the medical costs of accidents, the floods caused by paving over most of suburbia so you can have a convenient parking spot. The problems with cars go way beyond what comes out the tail pipe.

I've heard the tax should be about $5/ gallon to pay for the true costs of running a car.

Although this may be a step in the right direction, this guy must also pay his share to use the roads, and we should all bear some responsibly for the impact of our motor vehicles.

As an engineer, I find it comical that people think our environmental crises/ global warming can be solved with alternative fuels or higher mileage cars. These changes, while helpful, are only baby steps. We need a major change in our transportation strategy, high speed rail, bicycles, discourage suburban sprawl just for starters.

[TreasonousBastard]

26. Perhaps chickenshit, but the state has a right...

to enforce its tax laws.

The point is a tax on auto fuels, not what kind of fuel is being used. If he managed to run the car on home heating oil, kerosene, agricultural fuel, or anything else with lower taxes than on the gas station pump he'd be in the same bind.

[gravity]

27. The laws aren't designed for personal alternative fuel production

The government was just following the laws on the books, which are designed to stop people from avoiding fuel taxes. The good news is that even the state Governor thinks the law is unfair.

[happygoluckytoyou]

30. AGREE.....AND THEN NOT

I understand that they were following the rules on the books--- and agree that he should pay the "back tax"--

Though there should be a ParisHilton get-out-of-jail-free card issued on the penalty, given what is obviously his good intention...

As more people try to push these initiatives ahead, I am sure the word will get out on the appropriate procedures

[Javaman]

32. Now do you see why we are kept on the oil teet of the world?

Any more questions?

[jmowreader]

33. Call it deja vu all over again

When they started collecting road taxes by taxing fuel, the trucking industry went apeshit--with good reason. In the winter, you didn't shut down a diesel engine in the really cold parts of the country. (Diesels return excess fuel from the fuel rail to the tank, said fuel is warm from having been in the fuel rail, and said warm fuel keeps the fuel in the tank from gelling.) You also run refrigeration units on diesel. If you bought two gallons of diesel, one of them would be used to push the truck down the road, while the other would be used to run the reefer, keep the truck running overnight, idle while they were unloading freight from it or "other" things that don't include pushing the truck down the road. Charging road tax on each gallon of fuel would be unfair because not all of that fuel was used to damage the road, right? So they came up with a system where they'd sell you a tax sticker for the side of your truck and give you a stack of reporting forms, and you'd pay taxes on each mile driven in a lump sum. In return, the fuel at the truck stop is sold without taxes added.

Farmers screamed even louder--some of their uses don't involve public roads at all. If you've got your own tractor and your farm's all on one side of the road, you'll drive the public roads two times--once to bring the tractor home from the dealer, and again when you trade it in. But you're on the tractor a lot. Shit, a lot of tractors don't have license plates. Why pay road tax on something that isn't even licensed?

Now, all was good. The only people who burned diesel were farmers and truckers, and they reported their mileage.

And then the terrible thing happened: Mercedes-Benz introduced diesel cars to America. My family knew someone who had one way back when; until he convinced the state of Idaho to sell him a road-tax sticker, he had to leave it parked because no one would sell him fuel.

(In the meantime...the states and Canadian provinces joined together to form the International Fuel Tax Agreement. In the OLD days, if you regularly ran through fifteen states you needed fifteen tax stickers, one for each state. Now, you run one IFTA sticker and file one report with your own state; you report the miles you ran in each state and your state pays each of the other states you ran in. There are four states--according to DOT Authority.com, they're New York, Kentucky, New Mexico and Oregon--that have additional road-use taxes, but they're not germane to this discussion because they're based on weight and no car weighs 18,000 pounds, the lightest starting weight of the four states.)

If you guys are going to burn all this weird shit, all this waste vegetable oil, homemade biodiesel, electricity, acetylene, wind, cutting holes in the floor and using your feet like Fred Flintstone did or "other fuels known or unknown," you're gonna have to run IFTA stickers on your cars.

I don't see this as discriminatory or "discouraging" the use of alternative fuels at all. The simple fact is, roads aren't free. Road tax pays for them; you should have to pay road tax no matter what fuel you use.

[progressoid]

34. So, what's going to happen when electric cars make a come back?

[robinlynne]

41. I'm waiting for one.

[doodadem]

35. What about hybrids?

I'm sure they are not putting a separate tax on hybrids for the amount of time they are running off electrical, and not gasoline. How would they even track it?

[RamboLiberal]

40. In case you missed it they are talking about using GPS

or black boxes in cars that will track your miles. Some states are already talking about switching from a tax on each gallon of fuel to a tax on each mile you drive. IMHO they better tack on the weight of the vehicles for a heavier Hummer or Big Ass pickup or SUV will do more damage than a Prius.

[bamacrat]

39. Thats not fair at all,

how can the govt say they want to develop alt fuels and fine people when they do it themselves. Even more proof that the govt is bought and paid for by the oil companies.

[NeoGreen]

47. Do they tax the hay for...

Amish horses?

[Flabbergasted]

48. KR