Vatican suspends aid to pro-life Amnesty

[cal04]

Source: correspondents in Rome

THE Roman Catholic Church says it is suspending financial aid to the human rights group Amnesty International, accusing it of having decided to support abortion.

“No more Catholic financing of Amnesty International after the organisation's pro-abortion about-turn,” said the Vatican's Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace today.

The council's president Renato Martino said the move was the “inevitable consequence” of a recent decision by Amnesty's executive council to support access to abortion for women who had been raped or whose health was endangered by their pregnancy.

“Thanks be to God, there is no internationally-recognised right to abortion,” Mr Martino said.



Read more: http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21901869-1702,00.html

[Sanity Claws]

1. Did you mean "pro-choice Amnesty"?

[muriel_volestrangler]

19. The title is what the Australian headline says

Whether they meant "pro-choice" but weren't thinking, or whether they wanted to point out that AI is truly 'pro-life', is open to question.

[ananda]

2. Lordy..

I never did like Maledict and still don't.
Ugghh.

[sinkingfeeling]

3. Yes, we all know how pro-women the Catholic Church has been across its long history.

Guess, I'll just have to double up my contributions to Amnesty.

[yardwork]

4. The real reason is that the current Vatican has no interest in preventing torture.

That's the conclusion I reach from this. I just contributed to Amnesty International. Figured I ought to put my mite in to fight the torture that the U.S. is conducting worldwide.

[kimmylavin]

5. Thanks be to god???

Is he kidding???

Thanks be to god that a woman who was raped must be forced to carry any child that may result?
Thanks be to god that when it comes down to a choice between a woman's life and a fetus, the fetus wins?

Something is seriously wrong when celibate men get to make these decisions for millions of women...

And for Pete's sake, this "pro-abortion" shit has got to stop.
NOBODY is pro-abortion.

[Spangle]

6. It isn't Pro-Abortion

It's Pro-Life and it's Pro-Choice. A women can CHOOSE LIFE for herself.

I don't know why the ones who don't support Choice are called "Pro-Life", cause it isn't. It's death to many, many women.

[kimmylavin]

9. I'll go you one step further...

Its Pro-Choice and Anti-Choice.
Calling it Pro-Life infers that the opposite is Pro-Death.

Regardless, I agree that the positions taken by those who call themselves "Pro-Life" are anything BUT.

[Ilsa]

7. Sometimes in my argument with anti-choice women, I ask them

why they go to the trouble of carefully selecting a man to be husband and father material if the genetic makeup of their kids is unimportant (as is implied to rape victims). I wouldn't have propagated the line of my rapist for any amount of money in the world.

And the man in Texas who won't release the fertilized eggs for his ex-wife to raise on her own can't bear the idea of having his own kids running around. Yet women are expected to give up babies and not worry about them anymore rather than do an early termination, or even stop an fertilized egg from implanting.

[Spangle]

12. It's not even in the same ball park.

What we deal with here, is much different then what those women deal with. WE could carry to term, etc. It would only effect us for a little while. The mental trama would always be there, of course.

But the women that this group is helping, different picture all together. Women who are blamed for being raped. They and their child are out casts. If the women has children, those children might also be in danger. Anyone who helps them might be in danger. So carring the baby until it's born, isn't an option. It's a death sentence to maybe more then just the mother and child.

Many who are against 'choice' do so with some childish unrealistic ideas. One idea which is based upon religus beliefs, says that God will provide. I always point out the story of the man who climbed on his roof to save himself from a flood. He turned away 3 boats saying that God will save him. When he died he complained to God. God pointed out that he sent 3 boats. God gives us the means to save ourselfs, we must make the effort to do some of the work. Making the choice is sometimes the effort that is required.

I ask them if it was their daughter and their family, would they be willing to endure the life time torment and possible death of their daughter and grand-children, all because the neighbors thought the girl was 'bad' and needed punishment to death. Would it have been worth the 'nine quick months' to save the one? If they say yes, they are lying.

[silverojo]

17. We don't know if the pope is celibate

After all, there is a long tradition of child molestation among the Catholic clergy.... :mad:

[AngryOldDem]

21. No, he's not kidding

This guy is about as far right as they come, even by Vatican/Catholic standards. The reality that some women have to face is of little moment to people like him.

[MrPrax]

8. Extremists!

Religious extremists who wallow in rank hypocrisy and lies tend to push authoritarian solutions from male-only Religious Councils because they preach absolutism especially when it comes to women and their rights.

It's kinda funny because you see a lot of propaganda presenting the Catholic church as some benign alternative to fundamentalism, when in fact, it's an institution where many of it's fundamental believes are more extreme than even fundamentalist and evangelical Christianity, like for instance, the ordination of women. Even more funny as this institution has been around for 2000 years and hasn't change one iota in spite of effort to get rid of it, but has reserve the right under legal protection to change society arbitrarily.

[Mike Daniels]

10. So outside of this change what is/was AI's policy on abortion

Based on the article it seems that the Catholic Church supported AI until this recent decision by AI to support abortions in the case of rape or danger to the mother's health.

Is AI against abortion outside of those instances?

[ShortnFiery]

11. "The Vatican" needs to respect that Catholicism is NOT the only Christian denomination.

Arrogant beyond belief. :eyes:

I would take them more seriously if they truly gave as much EFFORT into stopping the underlying strife that causes war, rape leading to unwanted pregnancies.

The Vatican has their priorities screwed up again - but at least we're past The Inquisition. :evilgrin:

[Spangle]

13. It's about using Money to force a belief

Those groups need money to operate. I don't know how much the Vactican donates, but just by saying they arn't, many catholics will think they shouldn't donate either. It's a PR statement so that other groups that believe the same, will more likely learn about it and follow suit.

Flip side, many here learned about the situation and donated. How many are just one timers and how many will continue to give, no one knows. But the Vatican will not be giving their usual amount and that will hurt. If it is a big bite, then the group might have to change it's policies. However, I bet they realized that groups would pull out because of the change and have been expecting it.

The Vatican believes the amount to be big enough to force the groups hand. And if enough extra donations don't come in and keep coming in, it just might.

[ShortnFiery]

14. It's sad because many of us Catholics volunteer in our community without a need

to proselytize. We MUST be loving of all peoples, not just Christians IF we desire to work for Peace on Earth. It must start with both love and tolerance for all of humanity - not just "our kind of people." :shrug:

On Edit: No, I honestly think those of us who believe in Amnesty International and other thoughtful organizations that actively work to end torture will be swayed by "The Vatican."

I fear that we've had our share of bad Popes and Bennedict is alas, another misguided / used soul. :(

[Spangle]

15. Not American Catholics

I don't think they will be swayed. Many look beyond such things. When I mentioned "other groups that think the same", I'm talking about persons who consider this abortion issue above all things. Those will be 'swayed.' It will not matter to those folks how many persons AI saves or all the great things they do. They think that by donating, it's the same has helping kill a baby and that the murder will be on their hands. However, by not donating, (doing nothing) any and all deaths are not their responsiblity. That is the way they are taught to believe. They don't want the 'murder' on their hands. And they don't accept responsiblity for turning their backs on those folks.

Unless it's pointed out that by turning their backs is a moral issue as well, then their hands ARE tied in their heads. And that is where the problem really is.

[muriel_volestrangler]

20. It's an explicit call for individual Catholics to stop donating

A senior Vatican cardinal said yesterday that Catholics should stop donating to human rights group Amnesty International because of its new policy advocating abortion rights for women if they had been raped, were a victim of incest or faced health risks.

Cardinal Renato Martino, president of the Vatican's Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace, accused Amnesty of turning its back on its mission to defend human rights.

"The inevitable consequence of this decision, according to the cardinal, will be the suspension of any financing to Amnesty on the part of Catholic organisations and also individual Catholics," said a statement from Cardinal Martino's office yesterday.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,,2102583,00.html

[WhiteTara]

16. why does the Catholic church hate women

so much?
:shrug:

[CatholicEdHead]

18. I cannot find any abortion stances anywhere in the AI website

The Declaration of Human Rights which they go by also does not have anything on abortion. This seems to be a "sin of omission" matter from the Vatican's point of view. Nothing remotely comes close to the standard "pro-abortion" talking points which are so common at times like this. I guess it was cut the funding unless something explicit was added.

http://web.amnesty.org/pages/aboutai-udhr-eng

[Matilda]

22. But, but - during the Vatican/Banco Ambrosiano scandals

in the late '70s, it was revealed that the Vatican Bank held shares in a company that manufactured
contraceptive pills.

I can muster up some support for an ethical stand even if I disagree with the premise on which it's
based, but hypocrisy is something else.