Army Stops Many Soldiers From Quitting

[54anickel]

Orders Extend Enlistments to Curtail Troop Shortages

snip>
According to their contracts, expectations and desires, all three soldiers should have been civilians by now. But Fontaine and Costas are currently serving in Iraq, and Eagle has just been deployed. On their Army paychecks, the expiration date of their military service is now listed sometime after 2030 -- the payroll computer's way of saying, "Who knows?"

The three are among thousands of soldiers forbidden to leave military service under the Army's "stop-loss" orders, intended to stanch the seepage of troops, through retirement and discharge, from a military stretched thin by its burgeoning overseas missions.

"It reflects the fact that the military is too small, which nobody wants to admit," said Charles Moskos of Northwestern University, a leading military sociologist.

To the Pentagon, stop-loss orders are a finger in the dike -- a tool to halt the hemorrhage of personnel, and maximize cohesion and experience, for units in the field in Iraq, Afghanistan and elsewhere. Through a series of stop-loss orders, the Army alone has blocked the possible retirements and departures of more than 40,000 soldiers, about 16,000 of them National Guard and reserve members who were eligible to leave the service this year. Hundreds more in the Air Force, Navy and Marines were briefly blocked from retiring or departing the military at some point this year.

edit to add link (DOH!)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A36979-2003Dec28.html

[diamond14]

1. keeping 40,000 soldiers from leaving service.....draft coming up...

BTW...where's a link to the article??

[54anickel]

5. Added the link, sorry! Must be jammy time for me ;-)

[the_boxer_]

25. Any Army of "One?"

[proud patriot]

2. link ?

I'd like to send that out

[proud patriot]

3. Here it is

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A36979-2003Dec28.html

[PartyPooper]

4. This is a short term problem which will be resolved in 2005.

The draft is coming back! Didn't ya' hear?

[54anickel]

6. Certainly looks like a given now, doesn't it? n/t

[Solly Mack]

7. Retirements are going through in our company

and stop-loss isn't being applied to those currently serving non-conus in Iraq or Afghanistan-though it does apply to all that are pending to go over.

Our company is also ETS'ing, Chaptering and PCS'ing. And we are a shortage MOS..a very shortage MOS.

Talk of stop-movement will halt PCS'ing(whihc affects my family)..but not ETS'ing or Retirement...unless pending to deploy.


The Current stop-loss applies to those not in country and pending for deployment.

However, the entire military is short and they are scrambling for warm bodies..since so many are opting out and not re-enlisting.

[nadinbrzezinski]

11. Yep I can see it

I am lucky that my hubby will retire, SOON.. but he is in the USN... and active duty...

But this enrages me... since I can see a Draft comming and both Wolfie and Rummy are on record that they need a Draft.

[CivilRightsNow]

28. I dont know about retirement...

But I do know that if you recently served, there is a timelimit stipulated in which you can be recalled if needed.

They will do that before the draft.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

31. "both Wolfie and Rummy are on record that they need a Draft."

Link? I would love to have that in B&W.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

22. ENGLISH please? ;)

[ConcernedCanuk]

26. RE: "ENGLISH please? ;)"

.
.
. . Confused? - You bet !


From


ETS Emergency Temporary Standards
ETS End Term of Service
ETS Expiration Term of Service ??
. . out of a choice of 53

PCS Permanent Change of Station
PCS Permanent Change of Situation
PCS Permanent Civilian Status
PCS Posterior Cruciate Sacrificing
. . out of a choice of 71

MOS Military Occupational Specialty
MOS Maintenance Operations Squadron
MOS Margin of Safety
. . Out of a choice of 51



From:

And re Chaptering - "No entry found for chaptering."

I share your confusion !

[Solly Mack]

35. LOL Sorry

ETS End Term of Service
PCS Permanent Change of Station
MOS Military Occupational Specialty

Chaptering: being released from your contract for breaches(conduct, behavior(not the same) and other assorted reasons for being tossed from the Army.

Sorry

Talking in "alphabet" becomes second nature...

[tridim]

8. That's going to do wonders for morale

I'm sure the families of these soldiers aren't too happy about this. Call me crazy, but aren't contracts supposed to be legally binding? Or are soldiers now denied legal rights and representation just like the "terra-ists" in Gitmo?

[NNN0LHI]

17. This is mentioned in all military contracts. Need to read the small print

But it is in there.

Don

[aquart]

9. Bet those military absentee ballots

won't get counted in 2004.

[lebkuchen]

16. If they even receive ballots, considering stop-loss

Send abesentee registration cards to the deployed and help them at least get a ballot.

[LWolf]

41. Ya think?

The DNC ought to be working energetically to make sure the troops get their votes counted in '04.

[proud patriot]

10. Must read outstanding article

I'm so mad I could spit ...

I hate that the pentagon is jerking our soldiers around

[Military Brat]

12. Indentured servants, or slaves at the service of Massah bush?

So the commanders in the field don't want to spend the time to train new troops? That's something Rummy and Wolfie and * should have thought of before launching Operation FUBAR.

God help us, the impending draft has grown from a low rumble to a thundering roar.

[Pale_Rider]

13. The draft is coming, the draft is coming ...

... and soon!

[htuttle]

19. The draft is already here

People forced to stay in the military due to stop loss orders are no longer volunteers.

[Dover]

14. Elect Kucinich and bring them HOME!

Why are people accepting the inevitability of a protracted war and the draft, when there are other alternaives?

[Mairead]

20. Exactly! Kucinich is holding the door open. It's our choice

whether we walk through to peace and freedom. It's an easy thing to do, too--just send him some money now and vote in the elections.

To paraphrase Frank Lloyd Wright: we can use a pencil in the voting booth or a rifle in the streets. It's our choice, and we're in the process of making it now. What's it going to be?

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

15. I thought slavery ended in 1865?

My understanding is, without a draft, the longest the military can require a volunteer to serve is six years. At least that's the way it was when I was in during the mid 1970s.

[underpants]

18. a finger in the dike

Well well well isn't that something

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

21. How the #$@& does fondling Ann Coulter help in any way? (nt)

[loudnclear]

23. And the Arabs and Muslims really know how to out wait us!

In a war of attrition...we lose!

[moroni]

24. Not surprising and not unusual.

This happens regularly, depending on mission requirments. It happened to me. I was extended at the convenience of the government for 90 days past my ETS in 1976 to complete a specialized mission. You don't even have to have special skills per se. If you are in place, you finish it or at least keep stay until replaced.

Big turn over in theatre personnel coming shortly. Count on some staying to insure specialized theatre training is completed. Passing on the corporate mind so to speak.

This is Breaking News?

[Bandit]

27. There may be legal recourse here

When I signed up I signed what was referred to as a legal binding contract. I would think this is a breach of contract. I would have a lawyer look into this if it were me.

[NNN0LHI]

29. Dout it

http://www.join-snafu.org/recruiter/contract.htm

<snip>How Long?

The military recruiter may tell you that you can enlist for 4 years, but the truth is, "FOR ALL ENLISTEES: If this is my initial enlistment, I must serve a total of eight (8) years.” (Section 10.a.)

Furthermore, the military can, without your consent, extend your active duty obligation during times of conflict, “national emergency,” or when directed by the President. Section 10.b. says “my military service may be extended without my consent until six (6) months after the end of that period of war.” Section 10.d.4. says “When determined by the President that it is necessary to support any operational mission, I may be ordered to active duty as prescribed by law, if I am a member of the Selected Reserve.”



Before you consider enlisting in the military, you need to take a closer look at the realities of military life and the promises made by your recruiter. Contact us at [e-mail] for more information.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

30. This is the meat of the matter

Everyone signs up in blocks of 8 years total.

Most do 4 active, then the other 4 is in the 'inactive reserves'.

Inactive reserves don't actually have to drill or anything, they are just subject to recall until that 8 years is up.

Active reservists can transfer to Inactive Ready Reserves at (almost) any time, but the guys in IRR are actually more likely to get called up to fill holes in other units.

[Bandit]

36. Things do change ~ When I was in your obligation was six years

Two years active two years active reserve and two years inactive reserve. I don't recall any clause that said could be extended. There was a draft still in effect then so I'm sure things are somewhat different now. It was almost forty years ago that I was in.

[tom_paine]

32. Slave Army for a Slave Nation

How apropos for the Amerikan Empire.

How apropos will it be after the other shoe drops following the Re-Appointment of the Emperor and the Draft is reinstated.

How swiftly we went from the Victors Over Totalitarianism (Nazis and Soviets) to the Totalitarians themselves.

Just a short leap, wasn't it? Shorter than I'd ever imagined.

NOTE: A funny irony that we used Slave Soldiers to defeat Hitler. Now we ARE Hitler (but "kinder and gentler")

[raifield]

33. Slave Soldiers?

Uh, what? Who?

Now, I'll admit I don't have statistical data to back up any claims I make, but I was under the impression, however naive you may think it, that a majority of the soldiers fighting World War II were volunteers who enlisted when the war broke out.

If I have understood your comment correctly (which is that the soldiers fighting World War II were unwilling draftees), we should have not bowed down to a draft and let Hitler engulf all of Europe. That would have defintely been preferable to a draft. Right? Right?

And I'll go as far to say that in a situation such as that and only that, where there are thousands of people being killed every day (see conquest, holocaust, misc. military deaths ) and no one had the military to fight off such a thing (US did not in 1939), I would support a draft. Please note use of logic in that and only that, destorying the claim that I am all gung-ho for a draft. Hell, if/when there is one, I'm going to be one of the first to go, if I don't make it to Canada first.

Of course, you may have been sarcastic or I might be misunderstanding the whole thing. In which case, my apologies.

[wingnut]

34. Sorry, but

they signed up for this.

[Bandit]

37. Not the National Guard

They signed up to help their state during emergencies. They didn't sign up to be active army soldiers involved in war like activity.

[NNN0LHI]

38. Did they sign up to protect America or oil pipelines for Halliburton?

Please be specific when you say they signed up for this. Thanks in advance.

Don

[KittyWampus]

39. This Must Be Unbearably Difficult For The Soldiers& Their Families

:(

[dusty64]

40. Scary and in need

of a :kick: