A White House Warning on Contempt Charges

[kskiska]

Source: NYT

The Justice Department would be likely to block any efforts by Congressional Democrats to seek contempt charges against present and former White House officials for refusing to give information to Congress, a White House spokesman said Friday.

Congress and the White House have been moving toward a constitutional confrontation over the administration’s invoking executive privilege to prevent any testimony about its role in last year’s dismissal of federal prosecutors.

A White House spokesman, Tony Fratto, said Congressional threats to have presidential aides charged with criminal contempt would probably end in failure. “It has been the Justice Department’s long-held view that the law does not permit Congress to require a U.S. attorney to convene a grand jury or otherwise pursue a prosecution” when someone refuses on the basis of executive privilege to testify or turn over documents, Mr. Fratto said.

The administration’s warning that contempt citations would fail is the latest salvo in an escalating legal clash between the White House and Congress and appears intended to discourage Democrats in Congress from pursuing the charges against White House officials.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/21/washington/21attorneys.html?_r=1&hp=&adxnnl=1&oref=slogin&adxnnlx=1184987325-ZItIJEXZllusZLgx4B0Xtw

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

1. Bring it on, part deux.

MKJ

[babylonsister]

2. Who are they trying to convince? I'm waiting for a good response, but I'm

pretty sure there will be one. And I hope it won't be pretty.

[tularetom]

3. Well, I guess that's it then

Might just as well pack up everything and go home. They just said nothing can be done that executive privelege trumps everything.

Nixon was right - "If the president does it, that means it cannot be illegal."

Too bad Clinton failed to realize this. All that impeachment bullshit could have been avoided.

[aquart]

4. Whatever happened to Nixon?

[PurpleChez]

31. I think he's a roadie for Cypress Hill now.

Is Cypress Hill even still active? I'm like way out of touch.

[cutlassmama]

13. I was thinking the exact same thing about President Clinton today.

The only appreciable difference I can think of is that it's "war time" now and when he was in office it wasn't.

[PurpleChez]

33. You're missing the most important distinction:

The Chimpenfuehrer is a Republican, Clinton was a Democrat. BIG difference. Long before Chimpy was a blip on the national radar -- at least as far back as the immediate post-Iran/Contra Hearings days -- Republicans and conservatives had adopted the mindset that they can CLAIM to be all about Law and Order (which, by the way, are the copyrighted names of Chuck Norris's fists if I'm not mistaken) and yet pick and choose which laws actually apply to them (i.e., they can openly violate or ignore any laws that they determine for themselves to be unjust -- Chimpy's signing statements are merely the logical culmination of this philosophy). I cite the Iran/Contra era because the party of zero tolerance had no qualms whatsoever about adopting would-be felon Ollie North as a hero, while insisting that the kid down the street who got busted with a doobie do hard time. I don't even think of it in terms of "evil" or morality...these are just the greediest, most self-centered bastards in history and they will gain and maintain power by any means necessary. One of the saddest things is how successful they've been at roping millions of powerless people to support their power-grab, by invoking Jesus and Family Values and whatnot.

[BadGimp]

40. I heard Chuck Norris...

..is soo tough, he dosen't do push ups. He pushes the World down!

[PurpleChez]

47. My favorite was that his tears cure cancer

but, of course, he has never cried. I came up with one of my own: "That sound you heard in the middle of the night? That was Chuck Norris's beard growing."

[Vincardog]

5. DimSon wants to sent it to be decided by his Unitary Exec. Friendly court. BULLSHIT

[stillcool]

6. I really kind of like this part....

Congress has another route to enforce its will, an inherent power of contempt. But that has not been used since early in the 20th century. It has long been deemed unwieldy in the modern era as it entails Congress stopping all work to hold its own trial and imprisoning any offenders in the basement of the Capitol.

Would they sell tickets?

[wtmusic]

8. A modern-day dungeon

with rats and water dripping and cool stuff like that? :D

[stillcool]

9. I've seen so many of those pics...

of the boys in prison garb....but having them right there in the basement...how nice! I'd like it to be like a petting zoo. During the daytime anyway. At night...let the games begin.

[PurpleChez]

35. Yeah! Bring in some Disney Imagineers (TM)

and install some skeletons chained to the walls. They could sing "A Pirate's Life For Me." Or just screech at deafening levels at random intervals. And there could be a robotic dog with a big ol' ring of iron keys in his mouth, just out of reach. Damn, if I were cooler I'd go hunt down a picture from Pirates of the Caribbean (the ride), maybe photoshop in the usual suspects' faces, and post it. But that would be time taken from reading "The Deathly Hallows."

[here_is_to_hope]

43. Yeah, like the rats would stick around!

I doubt the rats would last more than a day with these bastards.

[coalition_unwilling]

52. You mean "water boarding," don't you? -n/t

[ClayZ]

11. That would be quite a "fundraiser"!

K and R

[PurpleChez]

34. Imprisoned in the basement???!!!111!!!

I hadn't heard that part before. That's precious! No, seriously...I'm fascinated by things like the crypts under St. Peter's Basilica...I wonder if there is actually some area, set aside since the Capital was built but never spoken of, that is reserved for this purpose. I know it ain't gonna happen, but I just love the idea of Alberto Gonzales in an actual DUNGEON.

[Turbineguy]

44. The repugs

would have to let all those girls and boys they keep down there as sex slaves go.

[PurpleChez]

48. Girls? I don't think there are any girls....

[chknltl]

62. Cheney maintains a coffin there.

It has bits of kitten fur and dirt in it, not sure what that's all about though.

[PurpleChez]

64. and the soil of his native land,

wherever that may be....beneath the surface of Mars perhaps?

[Bongo Prophet]

46. The same basement they put Conyer's hearings in? Oh, that would be ironic.

I would maybe watch that on c-span. :popcorn:

Maybe a slow leak filling the basement would loosen some tongues...


... but that would be torture.

And "WE don't DO torture. Heh."

[wordpix]

59. hahahah, that would be ironic

[Lone_Star_Dem]

54. Learn something new everyday!

I did not know about this option. I find it fascinating and am sure it will be the source of many a great fantasy for me in the future.

[wordpix]

58. "imprisoning any offenders in the basement of the Capitol" ---bring it ON, WH asses!

This is definitely the next step. GO FOR IT, CONGRESS! The BFEE needs to be brought to justice.

[Rene]

7. Where are the honest people in DOJ....WHERE are any honest Republican Congress people?

Are they all g-- d---- crazy? STOP this administration in it's tracks. We've all got to call Repubs and demand that they stand up for the U.S. Constitution and against this White House group of looneys/criminals.

[badgervan]

12. Sold Out

To power. Long ago. When bushcheneyrovegonzo go down, they are done for, politically.

[PurpleChez]

36. I know we all dream of the day Bush is gone, but

has anyone really discussed what Bush is gonna do after the Presidency? I mean...will anyone actually have the grapes to make him the director of their conservative think tank? Are people going to be paying six-figure speakers fees to listen to him giggle and snort about how he never ever did anything wrong? Nixon at least had all sorts of foreign policy achievements to write about but even he was in self-imposed seclusion for a long while after leaving office. The Chimp is a relatively young man...he could have a quarter century or more to live with his "legacy" of being one of the most hated world figures of the past fifty years.

[go west young man]

42. He'll probably get a job as shoeshine boy at Citibank or as a

"Fluffer" at Faux News.

[PurpleChez]

49. Maybe one of his old frat brothers could set him up with a nice job,

perhaps as a fire-watcher. Of course, if frats are involved, he'd have to something humiliating and grossly homoerotic first, like play "Baby Elephant Walk" with Cheney, Gonzo, and Rummy.

[shanti]

61. a life of leisure

that's what he'll be doing...work? please! :eyes:

[wordpix]

60. or resigned. Who would want to take orders from gorGonzola?

[DeSwiss]

10. ...

“It has been the Justice Department’s long-held view that the law does not permit Congress to require a U.S. attorney to convene a grand jury or otherwise pursue a prosecution” when someone refuses on the basis of executive privilege to testify or turn over documents, Mr. Fratto said.

Well then, that only leaves impeachment as the only option doesn't it??? You don't need the DoJ for that.....



K&R!!!

[creeksneakers2]

14. Impeach Gonzalez first!

It may be necessary to impeach Gonzalez to overcome White House claims of executive privilege. Gonzalez deserves it anyway. A Gonzalez impeachment would get the media to pay attention, and it would be a good boot to the nuts of W who thinks he can shove Congress around.

[Lasher]

15. Why is a White House spokesman telling us what Justice Department policy is?

I thought the White House was supposed to have sorta like an arms-length relationship with Justice. Otherwise people might get an impression that the White House is trying to politicize the Justice Department.

[tanyev]

20. Looks like the DOJ is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Bush Cheney & Assoc., Inc.

[annabanana]

38. How quaint. Not in this "post 9-11 world". . . . n/t

[EFerrari]

16. Good luck with that, you felons.

:)

[Hulk]

17. Call the bastards!!

I'm a democrat, as registered. But for the sake of the country, push these bastards on the "executive privilege" crap. Now it's the chimp, but tomorrow it may be Adolf himself. This idiot has pushed the line beyond reason. Call them on it NOW....and then impeach both the sons of bitches!

[Seabiscuit]

18. Someone should tell the WH that Congress is not powerless.

The ball is clearly now in Congress' court. Let's see what they are willing, or not willing to do.

The first step, of course is to exercise their contempt powers, which IMHO opinion they should have already done last week when Harriet Weirdo failed to appear.

[Divine Discontent]

19. Harriet Weirdo

very befitting name for her. she always make me feel odd when I see her... bizarre person.


www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<--- top '08 items & antib*sh stickers!

[MagickMuffin]

21. A White House Warning on Contempt Charges

Source: NY Times

WASHINGTON, July 20 — The Justice Department would be likely to block any efforts by Congressional Democrats to seek contempt charges against present and former White House officials for refusing to give information to Congress, a White House spokesman said Friday.

Congress and the White House have been moving toward a constitutional confrontation over the administration’s invoking executive privilege to prevent any testimony about its role in last year’s dismissal of federal prosecutors.

A White House spokesman, Tony Fratto, said Congressional threats to have presidential aides charged with criminal contempt would probably end in failure. “It has been the Justice Department’s long-held view that the law does not permit Congress to require a U.S. attorney to convene a grand jury or otherwise pursue a prosecution” when someone refuses on the basis of executive privilege to testify or turn over documents, Mr. Fratto said.

The administration’s warning that contempt citations would fail is the latest salvo in an escalating legal clash between the White House and Congress and appears intended to discourage Democrats in Congress from pursuing the charges against White House officials.

The administration sought on Friday to tamp down suggestions that a crisis was looming. “Obviously there are a number of steps that would have to occur before we reached a juncture where such a legal position could be considered,” said a senior Justice Department official who spoke on condition of anonymity because he is not authorized to talk about legal strategy in this case.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/21/washington/21attorneys.html?_r=3&hp=&adxnnl=0&oref=slogin&adxnnlx=1184987325-ZItIJEXZllusZLgx4B0Xtw&pagewanted=print

---

SORRY Didn't see this was already posted.....


So, it appears as though the White House will put the kibosh.......

And no matter what Congress does to try and make the Bush Regime/Cartel/Cabal accountable they have their people in place to kill the investigation....

[Unreconstructed Lib]

22. Inherent contempt and impeachment, NOW!

[sellitman]

30. Welcome to DU and yes.....

Inherent contempt and impeachment, NOW!


Followed by a trip to the Hague!

[Unreconstructed Lib]

50. Thank you, and I second The Hague.

:hi:

[krispos42]

23. Impeach Gonzo

Start there. And every single fuckin' time some sycophanic Bushie says "'It has been the Justice Department’s long-held view that the law does not permit Congress to require a U.S. attorney to convene a grand jury or otherwise pursue a prosecution' when someone refuses on the basis of executive privilege to testify or turn over documents", impeach the cocksucking, motherfucking, son-of-a-bitch traitor until we find someone that actually remembers "Constitution First".

It may have to be the god-damn janitor, but we'll find somebody eventually!

[aquart]

24. I wonder if Justice Roberts realizes he doesn't need George.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

28. the only power the robes have stems from

a quaint old document. If Bushistas (despite friendships, payoffs, blackmail or whatever) continue to rip apart the constitution, eventually, they start attacking the robes' authority and power. And no one likes that. except perhaps today's democrats, some of whom still don't get it.

[fasttense]

25. There are numerous other avenues still open to the Congress.

There is inherent contempt, there is Impeachment of Gonzo, the bushes and dick, and there is possible legislative action/changes (longest most risky avenue). However, I believe the bushes are going to push this right into the dancing supremes' lap. Just like they did the 2000 presidential vote. The bushes believe they have bought and paid for the supremes and that the black robed junta will keep their unitary executive butts out of the sling.

And I believe the bushes are right.

[cassiepriam]

26. Ding ding ding. You win....... the WH could care less what congress does.

[BootinUp]

27. Take that warning and shove it n/t

[Ian David]

29. Could you find a Governor willing to order his National Guard units to effect an arrest? n/t

[whistle]

32. Justic Department under orders from Attorney General Gonzales

...Shrub's* lap-dog will block attempts by Congressional Democrats

[spanone]

37. Checks and Balances-------GONE.

Dick Tator

[Maribelle]

39. It's time for Congress to invoke its inherent contempt powers

Why Inherent Contempt

http://www.talkleft.com/story/2007/7/20/185912/487

Let’s cut to the chase: the president and his team are arguing that once the White House claims executive privilege, there is no recourse. The president is accountable to literally no one — not the Congress, whose subpoenas can be ignored, or the federal judiciary, which can’t hear a case that cannot be filed. We’re talking about what is, in effect, a rogue presidency.

In the face of this assertion, I believe the Congress has no choice now but to commence inherent contempt proceedings against those witnesses who refuse to testify based on the Bush claim of executive privilege. The claims, according to Bush, can not be tested in court. More.


What is inherent contempt?

Under the inherent contempt power, the individual is brought before the House or Senate by the Sergeant-at-Arms, tried at the bar of the body, and can be imprisoned. The purpose of the imprisonment or other sanction may be either punitive or coercive. Thus, the witness can be imprisoned for a specified period of time as punishment, or for an indefinite period (but not, at least in the case of the House, beyond the adjournment of a session of the Congress) until he agrees to comply. The inherent contempt power has been recognized by the Supreme Court as inextricably related to Congress’s constitutionally-based power to investigate.
Between 1795 and 1934 the House and Senate utilized the inherent contempt power over 85 times, in most instances to obtain (successfully) testimony and/or documents. The inherent contempt power has not been exercised by either House in over 70 years.

[Vinca]

41. Apparently it's now official: he's king. nt

[AllyCat]

45. I want inherent contempt charges as much as any American, but

I really wonder if this increasingly spineless Congress will do it. They are afraid of a VETO for God's sake! I can't see them pushing this either.

We have to get loud and in their faces, write letters to the editors, get our own interviews on TV, whatever it takes to get this in front of the American sheeple so they wake up and start making even more noise.

My God, do we ALL have to be sent to Iraq before people wake the f*** up???

[tabasco]

51. Your governments are belong to us.

Resistance is futile.

This would be a great time for Congress to save the Nation.

[lovuian]

53. It only shows Congress where they stand

Nowhere and bow down to the master King George able to do what ever he wants

No Law No Justice Nothing

How long for Americans to realize the sham of the government

these are Interesting times

[Rene]

55. Call their bluff....there's get to be an honest person in DOJ somewhere.

[Disturbed]

56. Will Rep Conyers invoke Inherent Contempt?

Under the inherent contempt power, the individual is brought before the House or Senate by the Sergeant-at-Arms, tried at the bar of the body, and can be imprisoned. The purpose of the imprisonment or other sanction may be either punitive or coercive. Thus, the witness can be imprisoned for a specified period of time as punishment, or for an indefinite period (but not, at least in the case of the House, beyond the adjournment of a session of the Congress) until he agrees to comply. The inherent contempt power has been recognized by the Supreme Court as inextricably related to Congress’s constitutionally-based power to investigate.
Between 1795 and 1934 the House and Senate utilized the inherent contempt power over 85 times, in most instances to obtain (successfully) testimony and/or documents. The inherent contempt power has not been exercised by either House in over 70 years.

Rep Conyers said that he would issue just that if Josh Bolton refuses to present documents and fails to appear on July 23, '07. We shall see.

[wordpix]

57. Sarah Taylor, Josh Bolten & Harriet M. all get exec privilege? WTF? I thought that was reserved

for presidents who were obfuscating, not their underlings. :wtf:

[DrDan]

63. congress holds the purse strings

if the WH wants to play this game, then Congress needs to play their trump card.

It is time to return to a balance of power.