Kucinich: Democratic Party owes Fla.

[Freddie Stubbs]

Source: Tallahassee Democrat

By Bill Cotterell
FLORIDA CAPITAL BUREAU POLITICAL EDITOR

Leaders of the national Democratic Party ''owe something to Florida'' and should work out a compromise to prevent such a key state from losing all votes at next summer's nominating convention, presidential contender Dennis Kucinich said Wednesday.

During a brief Tallahassee stop, the Ohio congressman also predicted that the struggle for the presidential nomination will go ''all the way to the convention'' in Denver. He said no candidate should want Florida, with 210 delegates, to be barred from voting then.

''It would be tragedy to be in a position where the Democratic Party says, 'Well, no, we have our rules and no matter what, this is what you've got to abide by.' Look, New Hampshire can stay where it stays and Florida can go to a caucus,'' Kucinich said at a news conference.

New Hampshire is waiting to see how the DNC resolves disputes in Florida and some other issues before setting a date for its primary, which state law requires to be before any other state's.

Read more: http://www.tallahassee.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070830/CAPITOLNEWS/708300388/1010/NEWS01

[William769]

1. He is absolutely right.

[lonestarnot]

2. Again!

:applause: Dennis!

[MaineDem]

3. I wish he had stayed out of the discussion

I'm disappointed in him. Does he realize Washington state is int he same predicament and they've dealt with it?

[William769]

6. ...

:rofl:

[flyarm]

9. DOES WASHINGTON STATE HAVE A DEM OR REPIG GOVERNOR?

AND what is the makeup of their legislature?

fla is repig..

fly

[Orangepeel]

4. His solution sounds the same as everyone's solution: have a caucus

make the primary nonbinding and have a caucus during the allowed time frame. Grandstanding Florida doesn't want to do this.

[rucky]

5. So a political party is deciding that one state's law...

is more valid than another's. Because of an antiquated tradition?

We fault the RNC for using their party's power to influence federal policy, but it seems we're doing the same thing to a (very important) state.

[PurityOfEssence]

7. Once again: this is not "federal policy"

This doesn't disenfranchise Floridians' votes in the election, nor does it affect the workings of the electoral college. What's going on here is that a private organization, the Democratic Party, is enforcing its rules on members. It has every right to do so, and this was amply forewarned.

Florida Democrats in the legislature went in league with Republicans to jump themselves to closer to the front of the line in the primary process in an effort to have more influence (and get more money) than the organization to which they willingly belong had mandated. They knew the rules, they were warned, and they broke them; now they rage like victims for not being allowed to get extremely special treatment.

They want to break the rules of their own organization with impunity, and are squealing like privileged stuck pigs because they weren't allowed to run roughshod all over the rest of us.

I like Kucinich, but this is endemic of the leftist approach: siding with the "wronged" and "victimized" in all instances. In this instance, the Florida Democratic legislators tried to game the system and defy the rules of an organization to which they belong. They got popped with a penalty from their own organization, and they can only rage in childish selfishness that they can't just do as they damned well please.

Howard Dean is a hero here, and only someone with expedient morals or none at all would think otherwise.

No federal policy is being enforced or broken by the Democratic Party. This is spurious, inflammatory bellyaching.

It is nothing short of EXTREME SELFISHNESS, and complaints on the subject betray a complete inability to comprehend the concept of coexistence. Kucinich is being silly here.

The adoption of the stance of the downtrodden is tiresome in cases like this: Florida politicians may think they're "sticking it to the man", but they're really fucking all of the second- and third-tier candidates and the entire rest of the nation by disrupting a very intricate dynamic. The whole attitude is deeply, deeply deplorable and shows a complete disregard for other people. One would expect such egocentrism and solipsism from conservatives, but not from fellow Democrats.

Yeah, the schedule is bad, yeah the first three states have no right to such exalted super-statehood, but if one is a member of an organization, one agrees to abide by the rules. Those rules include punishment for disobedience.

That this even needs to be voiced is amazing.

[flyarm]

11. you are absolutely 100% correct ..and thank you!!

please read PurityOfEssence's post..he/she is dead on..this was to destroy dean and the real dems of the party in fla..and progressives..this was a 100% rahm plan..by the DLC to ram Hillary down our throats..

Rahm did the same thing in the Nov 2006 election to us in fla..he destroyed great dem candidates and in my counties case ran a guy against one of our best dem candidates ..who changed his registration from repig to dem 6 weeks before the primary!

and our great candidates got no money or support from the FDP..zero...

this was a ploy that has been well planned by Rahm..and the DLC..with one candidate in mind!

and to destroy the progressives in Fla!

fly..a 2004 dem delegate fla.

[IndianaGreen]

13. Political parties don't run elections, the states do!

Primary elections are run by the states, under the supervision of their Secretaries of State. States are the ones that set election dates, other than the Presidential election.

You all talk about following rules. Well, guess what? Political parties don't trump state law!

[ProudDad]

24. But, political parties can determine who can come to their "party" (n/t)

[Vidar]

14. I'm a big Kucinich supporter, but Dean is right on this one. Actually

both Dean & Kucinich are usually right, IMHO.

[cali]

17. Fantastic Summary

wish I could rec it.

[subsuelo]

18. Damn the left for siding with victims in all instances

[2rth2pwr]

27. Wow

"Howard Dean is a hero here, and only someone with expedient morals or none at all would think otherwise."

I am not much in to hero worship.

[flyarm]

10. this was a DLC ploy in Fla..to get the votes for Hillary by the DLC

this shit has been planned and executed by the DLC in fla..

the DLC knew exactly what they were doing...

fly..a 2004 dem delegate

[rudy23]

12. Bingo nt

[Jim Lane]

21. The alternative is a three-week primary season

Every state wants to vote early in the process. If the national parties were to just sit on the sidelines and say, "Hey, it's up to each state," then all the primaries and caucuses would occur over the span of a few weeks. That system would favor the candidates with big money and early name recognition. The candidates without the big bucks would have no chance to make their case and build momentum.

The issue isn't just that a highly compressed nomination campaign would benefit Hillary in 2008 (although it would). Leave her out of it. The issue will arise in 2012, 2016, etc. A single one-day national primary, or its near-equivalent (a very short primary season), would inflate the role of money, a role that's already excessive.

I personally think the best solution is a series of regional primaries. The order of holding the primaries would rotate from one cycle to the next. Until that happens, though, I think party action to prevent excessive front-loading is the next-best thing.

[ProudDad]

25. I'd go one step further

One Primary Day -- just like the General...

A three week "primary season".

Full Public Financing of elections. If someone wants to try to short-circuit the system with their own money their opponents get at least the same amount as the traitor(s) spend...

Take back OUR AIRWAVES for substantial and substantive prime-time candidate statements and manageable, REAL debates on the issues.

--------

To further blue-sky -- Proportional representation like real Democracies have and Instant Run-Off Voting...

--------


I know, I know, it would never pass -- never be enacted -- any of it...

That's why I've given up on this corporate capitalist paradise; this failed attempt at democracy... My real hopes lie elsewhere -- this country's a lost cause...

[Jim Lane]

28. I disagree, it's better to have multiple primaries/caucuses

A single national primary would simply reward name recognition and fundraising ability. You can't get around the latter problem through public financing. Who gets the public financing? anyone who wants to run in the primary? Scores of nutjobs will come forward, happy to use taxpayer dollars to buy ads in favor of re-establishing the gold standard or prohibiting the internal combustion engine or disenfranchising women or whatever.

The current system, of a string of primaries and caucuses, isn't all that bad. A candidate can start from a very low position in the polls, build support, and win the nomination (see, for example, Jimmy Carter). The system could be improved if the preferred status of going first were rotated among states or regions. The leapfrogging process, however, is not the way to achieve that.

[burrowowl]

8. K&R

[w4rma]

15. Kucinich is a vanity candidate. Why is Kucinich pulling BS like this? (nt)

[Nihil]

16. A "vanity candidate"?

As opposed to Clinton, Edwards and Obama who are just "vain" candidates?
:shrug:

[Jim Lane]

22. Kucinich isn't pandering or "pulling BS". Look at what he ACTUALLY said.

From the linked article:

"(Kucinich) said no candidate should want Florida, with 210 delegates, to be barred from voting (at the Convention)." Absolutely right, and I'm sure Dean agrees. Floridians deserve to have a say in choosing the nominee, just as everyone else does.

"'It would be tragedy to be in a position where the Democratic Party says, "Well, no, we have our rules and no matter what, this is what you've got to abide by."'" Again, absolutely right, and again I'm sure Dean agrees. Do you think Dean wants 210 Florida delegates to show up at Denver and be denied admittance? So that they can spend the whole week of the Convention parading theatrically around outside the barred auditorium doors, getting extensive media attention and painting the Democratic Party as exclusionary? Damn right that would be a tragedy (for Democrats, at least).

"'Look, New Hampshire can stay where it stays and Florida can go to a caucus,' Kucinich said at a news conference." That's a practical solution that would give Florida an early role and would comply with the Democratic Party's rules. It may not be ideal, if Florida Dems would rather have a primary than a caucus, but it's better than excluding their delegates and it's better than letting the leapfrogging game go unchecked.

[rjones2818]

26. Unlike other candidates

he wants all Democrats to have a say in the nomination?

Just a thought!

Go Dennis! :woohoo:
http://dennis4president.com
Choose Peace!

[subsuelo]

19. From the article:

"State party leaders pleaded in Washington that the date was set by a Republican governor and GOP-dominated Legislature, although some Democratic legislators went along with the change."

How much truth to this statement? (bare with me please I am trying to figure this thing out)

Who were the legislators that went along with it?

[depakid]

20. No one "owes" Florida anything

The state repeatedly shows itself to be "above" both the law- and common decency.

If they don't want to play by the rules- if a majority of their people enjoy accellerating toward 3rd world status- OK. That's federalism. Let them.

[0rganism]

23. "(NH) state law requires (NH primary) to be before any other state's"

What the heck kind of law is this? What if another state makes exactly the same law for itself, who wins then?

This strikes me as absurd, and yet another reason for a fixed rotation of primary dates.

[hayu_lol]

29. Democrats OWE Florida nothing...

This actually has nothing to do with the election. If my memory is accurate, seems like Florida is the state that has not even obeyed their own election laws and rules. Remember the past three elections and the crooked vote counts, the disenfranchisement of hundreds of thousands of voters, Katherine Harris as Secty of State?

Now Florida wants to tilt the mechanism in their favor again. They, as several other posters have said in this thread, tried to 'game' the system and lost.

Florida is already a banana republic...let them slip on their very own peels.