Black children left out of Irish schools

[Orrin_73]

Source: Yahoo

DUBLIN, Ireland - Almost all the children who could not find elementary school places in a Dublin suburb this year were black, the government said Monday, highlighting Ireland's problems integrating its increasingly diverse population.

"That overwhelmed me. I'm not quite sure what to make of it. I just find it extremely concerning," said Gerard Kelly, principal of a school with a mixture of black and white students in the nearby town of Swords.

Some parents questioned why white families who had moved this year into the town had managed to overcome the registration deadlines to get their children into schools.

Some also complained that Ireland's school system was discriminating against them on the basis of religion. About 98 percent of schools are run by the Roman Catholic Church, and the law permits them to discriminate on the basis of whether a prospective student has a certificate confirming they were baptized into the faith. Some of the African applicants were Muslim, members of evangelical Protestant denominations or of no religious creed.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070903/ap_on_re_eu/ireland_black_students

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Ireland used to be one of those nations where racism was non-existent, but now Ireland is also changing. That is sad I really like Ireland.

[kenny blankenship]

1. I'm reminded of Stephen Dedalus' employer Mr. Deasy and his nasty riddle

[TheDebbieDee]

2. "Ireland used to be one of those nations where racism

was non-existent, but now Ireland is also changing. That is sad I really like Ireland."

If that's true, then it's only because there was only one race living there!

[Orrin_73]

3. There is also one race living in Russia and other

eastern European nations but there is a lot of racism in those nations, not only against non whites but also against 'foreigners' from other eastern European nations.

[Teaser]

6. "only one race"

First off, race is a meaningless concept, ethnographically speaking. And secondly,
it is definititively not true that Ireland has ever been monolithic in terms of ethnicity.

Scots Irish, Black Irish, Norseman, Travelers, have all made a home in Ireland.

[aquart]

8. Racism was non-existent because EVERYONE WAS WHITE.

Damn, that place felt strange. London felt normal, but Ireland? I kept wondering where they were hiding the rest of the people.

They didn't have Chinese waiters in the Chinese restaurant!

Of course there's that wonderful joke from George Wallace: "Look at Ireland. It just goes to show in a country without Jews, blacks, or indians, people will improvise."

[depakid]

9. Sounds like there may be more than race at play

Seems religion has a role as well... which wouldn't really be surprising.

[niceypoo]

13. They slaughtered each other for centuries because of nationality and religion

and they were all white.

[xchrom]

4. this is surprising -- because when you go to ireland

it is most definitely multi-racial -- with everyone -- on the surface -- thriving.

mostly the irish have been concerned about these things -- and while this is a surprise to me -- i'm hoping it is not widespread.

also the irish have been deeply involved with aid to africa -- so this does surprise.

however though when i think of it -- i must remember that illiteracy is still a major concern if you're not born on the right side of the tracks -- high school drop out rates can still be quite high in some areas, etc.

[mcscajun]

5. Ireland is an EU success story, and that's meant immigration, where

there was little before. For most of modern history, the Irish were leaving Ireland, and there was little reason (except for perhaps retiring Irish-Americans, and those celebrities wealthy enough to live on private estates) to move to Ireland. Since the technology revolution came to Ireland, and again since they joined the EU, the younger Irish are staying, ex-Irish are returning, and it's an extremely popular destination for immigration. Oh, and their health care is, of course, better than ours. I met a group of traveling seniors in Cong one afternoon who informed me that seniors get their medications for Free. Wow. :D

More than 25,000 Africans have settled in Ireland since the mid-1990s. Most arrived as asylum seekers, and many took advantage of Ireland's law — unique in Europe — of granting citizenship to parents of any Irish-born child. Voters toughened that law in a 2004 referendum.

You can guess why the law was toughened when it was. I recall on my last visit in 2005 seeing a poster about a family trying to stay on the basis of a child born there; it was quite the controversy. That's when I first heard to my surprise that, unlike the US, but now like the rest of Europe, "anchor babies" weren't an entree to residency/citizenship.

I hope the good news here is that with the government bringing this out in the open something can and will be done.

[rAVES]

7. What a Disgrace....

*hides*

[entanglement]

10. This is why public schools with strict laws against racial & religious discrimination

are so important.

[FreakinDJ]

11. not a public school

"run by the Roman Catholic Church"

[muriel_volestrangler]

14. But teachers' salaries are paid by the state

In Ireland a national school is a particular type of primary school that is not directly financed or administered by the State. Rather, the affairs and policies of the school are managed by local people, often directed by a member of the clergy, through a local Board of Management. Most schools in Ireland fall into this category, which is a pre-independence concept.

National Schools, established with the Stanley Letter in 1831, are legally multi-denominational, but have become erroneaously regarded as denominational schools following local control for many years by local clergy. Recently, the Catholic Church has instructed local schools to adopt a "Catholics First" admissions policy. If this attempt at introducing religious discrimination in National Schools is successful, it will bring the most significant change to National Schools since their foundation.

There are faith schools at primary level in Ireland. These are small in number and in pupils enrolled, and were establsihed mainly by religious orders like the Irish Christian Brothers. There are also commonly recognised multi-denominational schools established by the Educate Together patronage.

Local people are expected to contribute towards capital expenses of the school, whilst teachers' salaries are paid by the state. The day-to-day business of the school is managed by a Principal or Headteacher, as with other schools. However, the state oversees the curriculum and makes regular inspections to ensure that standards are kept and national policies are followed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_school

[dogfacedboy]

12. The biggest problem in Ireland is the Roman Catholic Church.

That medieval outfit needs to be thrown over a cliff.

[AngryAmish]

15. No racism in Ireland?

I think you don't know the Irish very well.

[tammywammy]

16. Racism doesn't just mean between white versus black

There's always been racism or regionalism in parts of the world. For instance western Europeans vs eastern Europeans. Chinese vs Japanese.

[Henny Penny]

17. Ireland is changing very rapidly, faster than its infrastructure

can keep pace with.

I live very near the town in question. Its basically the commuter belt for Dublin and the population here has more than doubled in the last five years. Not not just because of the numbers of immigrants, but also because of the housing bubble that has forced up the prices of houses in the city so more and more people are moving further out. Where I live, the local national (elementary) school until very recently had about 200 pupils, now they need to find space for about 1000. A change that has occurred in a very short space of time indeed and the buildings just are not there. The pupils are only being catered for in double decker prefabs after a high profile campaign by the parents, parish priest and local politicians etc. The children are from every background.

Most, but not all schools here are still run by the church, for largely historical reasons. But they are attended by everyone, because for most people there is no alternative.

Until recently people saw no need to change but not any more. But these things take time. However if you are a new immigrant in an area with increasing pressure on school places you are going to be at a huge disadvantage because you are going to be out of the loop. You're not going to have your kids name on the waiting list for a place because you simply wont know about it.

"Some parents questioned why white families who had moved this year into the town had managed to overcome the registration deadlines to get their children into schools."

I'm betting this means Polish immigrants have been seen to get preferential treatment and I would say its not because they are white, but because they are catholic and meeting others from the established community at church socials etc has given them a huge advantage in circumventing the red tape. In Ireland knowing the right people is a huge advantage.

As a society we need to change fast and I think we are. Not always for the best.

Are there racists in Ireland? Of course. We are sadly just like any other society in that respect, no better and no worse.

[cigsandcoffee]

18. "Ireland used to be one of those nations where racism was non-existent"

This just isn't true. Irish racism can often come off as jovial and non-aggressive, but it's been as strong and everpresent as in any other European country.

[silverojo]

19. Religious discrimination in Ireland?

Gee, what a surprise! :sarcasm:

People have been dying for decades in Ireland, over religious discrimination. The fact that nobody was shot or bombed in this instance is, at least, a small step in the right direction.

I'll put it to you this way--I'm Irish, white, and was brought up Catholic, but there's no damned way I'd move to Ireland. When abortion is illegal in a country, that kinda tells you that the place is frothing-at-the-mouth conservative. Therefore, a lot of people are going to be racist, esp. in the smaller towns.

If I were a black Muslim emigrating from Africa, I'd stay the hell out of Ireland and move to a more multicultural city like London. The children would have more educational and career opportunities there, anyway....