Obama will be assassinated if he wins: Nobel winner Lessing

[GliderGuider]

Source: AFP

STOCKHOLM (AFP) - If Barack Obama becomes the next US president he will surely be assassinated, British Nobel literature laureate Doris Lessing predicted in a newspaper interview published here Saturday.

Obama, who is vying to become the first black president in US history, "would certainly not last long, a black man in the position of president. They would murder him," Lessing, 88, told the Dagens Nyheter daily.

Lessing, who won the 2007 Nobel Literature Prize, said it might be better if Obama's Democratic rival Hillary Clinton were to succeed in her bid to become the first woman president of the United States.

"The best thing would be if they (Clinton and Obama) were to run together. Hillary is a very sharp lady. It might be calmer if she were to win, and not Obama," she said.



Read more: http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp/us_vote_nobel_literature_britain_sweden_lessing

[jlake]

1. I despise this kind of negative thinking.

Even if the fear is legitimate - I cannot stand it.

[Adsos Letter]

8. OT, but... I do like the picture of Senator Clinton in your sig...

and who cares what the Brits think anyway...I'm sure Senator Obama has take that possibility into consideration, and made his choice accordingly...

[cbayer]

17. Keep your voice down. My husband (a brit) is in the room.

[Adsos Letter]

22. ...no way...

:D

[cbayer]

33. Way. And when he gets all that british rage up, well....don't say i haven't warned you.

[Adsos Letter]

69. ...I am impressed by his potential...

...but comforted by his distance... :D

[wolfgangmo]

29. If you consider ...

... that the Brits have the best press coverage of American politics, maybe we should pay attention.




On the other hand Lessing has always been a bit of a firebrand.




Still, her comment has merit and is something we need to consider. Americans are heavily armed and more than a little unstable at times. After all SOMEONE shot Kennedy and it wasn't Saddam.

[aquart]

54. Uh, not to be funny but any candidate is a target. Any president.

After Bhutto, it's clear it's just as fashionable to kill a woman candidate.

Frankly, I think he's the right wing choice and it's not their guns he has to worry about. Since, IMO, he's all hot air, his biggest danger will be his fanatic supporters. They are the ones who will feel most betrayed.

[JanusAscending]

85. I beg to differ...

I was flipping channels on Super Tues. evening, and came upon Fox noise just in time for the California vote to come in for Hillary. That was the night that they had "turdblossom" commentating. They let out a WHOOP!!! when it was announced that she won!! Don't tell me that they don't want to run against her!! They are even willing to cross party lines to vote for her, to make SURE SHE'S THE ONE!!:rant: :nuke: Did anyone else out there see this, that can back me up???

[JanusAscending]

84. Let me tell you something........

If that son of a bitch made it through 7 years without getting assinated, here or over there in foreign country's, I think they can keep Obama safe. I've been concerned about this too, at the beginning, but no more. I'm tired of being afraid, aren't the rest of you?? The only way this could possibly occur, was if it were a Secret Service INSIDE JOB !! I believe since the assination of JFK, TOO MANY EYES would be on them. I detest the idea that the OP even brought the subject up!!! By the way, I'm a very peaceful person, and wouldn't kill a fly , but, if I were a gun owner, there have been many times in the past 7 yrs. that I would have been willing to sacrifice my life for this country!!

[mahina]

86. I had a person I phonebanked give this as his reason for not supporting Barack.

A sweet old Hawaiian man, so salty and so funny, but he said "I stay ske'd da buggah not goin' make it past da firs' yea"

We talked a while, I told him if they could keep W alive for the last 7 years, they can do the same for Barack. Crazy people shoot kids in schools, shoot salesladies at malls, but you can't choose a weaker President because there are crazy people in the world.

We ended up with his support, but Lessing isn't the only one.

Having watched W zoom by in his SUV caravan with the helicopters overhead, I can't imagine Barack being such an asshole. His goodness may make more opportunities than W's carefully screened ways. I do pray the security people are wise, and would for Barack or Hillary.

[tblue37]

207. Look at this image:

Having watched W zoom by in his SUV caravan with the helicopters overhead. . . .

The Bush motorcade always reminds me of those used by rightwing dictators in banana republics.

[California Griz]

108. Your missing some important points

Those that oppose Bush have real morals. If someone did do it what do you get Cheney. Those who would try and kill Obama have no morals. I think if you were old enough to have experienced the Kennedys and MLK you have to believe this is a possibility. Obama needs to do as Bush pick someone as VP they would hate even more.

[frazzled]

10. When you're 89 and British, you sometimes have odd notions about American politics

I love Doris Lessing--but I read The Golden Notebook when I was 20. That was 38 years ago. She's a great writer and a great feminist. Prognosicator of American politics? Not so much.

[aquart]

55. Because it's silly to think an American president will be assassinated?

It's the reason we have the Secret Service, isn't it? To cut down on that?

[melody]

59. Because it was a disingenuous attempt to promote Clinton while putting Obama at risk

The assassinations of our political leaders didn't solely originate inside this country.
One day, when the vampires have sucked us dry and gone onto better blood territory,
we'll find this out.

[cloudythescribbler]

18. I concur -- after all, talking that way could make it more likely...

I think the collar in the pic of HRC there though looks well on her (yes, I know it's "sexist" to note that sort of thing, but I would think her advisors would think about issues like that)

[LaStrega]

87. took the words right outta my mouth n/t

[JerseygirlCT]

165. Me too. nt

[BlackmanX]

208. If they didn't get bush, they won't get Obama

[Megahurtz]

228. Exactly. n/t

[Gman]

224. Nobody likes bad thoughts, but...

that doesn't make them go away. We had a conversation with friends at dinner last night and the consensus was that we would expect the RW to take a shot at Obama were he to be elected, or even if he's nominated and looks like he will win in November. If Obama gets the nomination, the Secret Service would be very wise to triple his protection.

[Orsino]

226. She's 88, and remembers a different America. n/t

[KittyWampus]

2. Doris, maybe in your next life you'll realize society changes. 88 years old. Sad.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

16. I must be VERY old but it seems to me it wasn't centuries when Martin, John and Bobby were murdered

And the official version of the story given in each case, and the alleged assassin, never seemed to have a really legitimate cause. Behind all these assassination was a very truth we don't know. This country cannot be trusted.

[screembloodymurder]

20. Really?

When it comes to human nature change is painfully slow. Maybe you'll understand that better when you're 88 and have a Nobel Prize.

[cbayer]

40. Good one!

[Orrex]

46. How does a Nobel Prize for literature grant her any special insight into human nature?

Do they give you a special serum to drink when they present the award?

[man4allcats]

66. Re: "Do they give you a special serum to drink when

they present the award?"

No, they don't, but novelists generally do have an insight into human nature. That's why they're novelists. In the case of the United States, this country is pretty racist. While I certainly hope Lessing is wrong about this, I don't think it is a far-fetched idea, and for those who have mentioned her age as a factor (and I do note that you did not), I don't think her age has anything to do with it. Lessing has simply and unfortunately for the United States, reasonably stated a valid concern.

[Orrex]

71. Well, we could quibble about novelists' insights, but that's beside the point

;)

I think that people are bristling at the certainty implicit in her declaration. No one with open eyes will deny that the US is a racist backwater, but for Lessing to make such a statement outright seems pointlessly inflammatory.

Every President is a potential target for assassination by an asshole with a grudge. Whether it's the President who freed the slaves, or the first Catholic President, or just the unlucky jerk who happened to be in office after some sick fuck watched Taxi Driver.

on edit: That's not to imply that I think that Kennedy was shot because he was Catholic; I just meant to compile a list of unique and irrelevant factors that preceded assassination

[man4allcats]

83. Re: "I think that people are bristling

at the certainty implicit in her declaration."

I'm sure you're right. People are bristling as well they should be. I do not agree, however, that Lessing's statement is "pointlessly inflammatory." I was fifteen years old when JFK was assassinated (I will acknowledge that you may remember it too), and I do not want to go through anything like that again. Even if Bush 2 were assassinated I think it would be wrong though I'd be more than happy to see him justly hung at The Hague for the many crimes he has committed. I do however agree with your point that there are often unique and irrelevant factors that preceded assassination.

Good luck to Obama, and best wishes to the United States, a country that threw away a constitutional government for a fascist state.

[DemBones DemBones]

210. You do know that the

"unlucky jerk who happened to be in office after some sick fuck watched Taxi Driver" had a VP whose son was having dinner the next day with the sick fuck's brother, right?

One of those odd coincidences that occur whenever some "lone nut" kills somebody in public life.

The "unlucky jerk" was lucky enough not to die.

[Forrest Greene]

73. A Certain Insight Into Human Nature

...is what earns things like Nobel Prizes for Literature.

[EFerrari]

123. Doris Lessing grew up in South Africa and has been thinking

and writing about class, race and gender for many years. If anything, she could make the serum.

[Lorien]

130. Her special insight into human nature is in large part what makes her

literature successful-thus leading to the prize. Not the other way around.

[TankLV]

198. umm - maybe it's her INTELLIGENCE? These people are the "cream of the crop"

and the TOP of the human race...

so I'd say, BECAUSE of their SUPERIOR intellect and other qualities that enabled them to get the Nobel Prize in the FIRST place, that her EXCEPTIONALITY is already a given....

[LanternWaste]

237. I think the award is an effect rather than the cause.

I think (all other things being equal) the award is an effect rather than the cause. Illustrative of special insights into human nature rather than the vehicle itself.

[EFerrari]

137. Lessing has been writing about societal changes for more than fifty years. n/t

[NC_Nurse]

3. Well, THAT's a cheery thought. Yikes.

Is this how bad we look to Europeans? Ouch.

I really think she's wrong, but I suppose someone might try.

[wolfgangmo]

44. Look to Europeans?

This isn't just how we look to Europeans, this is how we look to everyone.



America is the only country in the world which constantly and loudly proclaim that we are the best at everything.



We are like an obnoxious co-worker who walks into work every morning and then loudly proclaims, "I am the best person here and the rest of you suck. You will never be as good as me." It would take you about 1 week before you killed him buried the body. THIS is how the rest of the world sees us.



Not very pretty, is it? Respect is earned. We need to start trying again.

[Ghost Dog]

109. I can confirm that this is a fairly common opinion here in Spain:

If Obama is elected, they will simply rub him out.

And, people are not thinking this would be for racist or nutcase (un)reasons, but, rather, à la Kennedy, because it appears that Obama would not be very inclined to work with or for the BFEE-style 'Shadow Government' or even for 'corporatism über alles' as per the usual we have seen far too much of.

[provis99]

190. you stole that joke from Lewis Black!!

Good choice; Black speaks the truth!

[Prophet 451]

168. Yes, yes it is

I think she has a point but such is the right's loathing of Hillary, I actually think she'd be more at risk.

[mwb970]

234. Well gee, the right hates McCain too.

He had better watch his back as well.

[Prophet 451]

235. Sure, but not to the same degree

I know a lot of righties hate McCain but it's not the same level of visceral loathing they feel for Hillary. As far as they're concerned, McCain isn't one of them but Hillary, she's Satan.

Note: That doesn't mean she shouldn't be elected or that you shouldn't vote for her if you think she's best for the job.

[bluestateguy]

4. Hey lady, stay out of OUR presidential race!

Arrogant Brits still can't get over the butt-kicking they got here over 200 years ago!

[cbayer]

38. You did not just say that? You are kidding, right? (I'm just jokin wid u)

[wolfgangmo]

39. Dear Blue State Guy

If the Brits hadn't been heavily involved in a war in Europe and hadn't had the the under-provisioned dregs serving their military here, then you would be singing "God Save the Queen" before football games.




We didn't kick their ass. They didn't put up much of a fight.

[Dhalgren]

90. Finally! Someone who has actually read the history!

You are absolutely correct. Britain gave up the Colonies, they did not "lose" them....

[Oak2004]

144. Yes, but more like the US "gave up" Vietnam

The Brits were going broke fighting a very unpopular war, and indeed had much bigger (military) fish to fry. They could have stayed in America indefinitely, just as the US could have stayed in Vietnam indefinitely and France could have remained in Algeria indefinitely. But had any of these governments tried that tactic, it would have been a race to see what happened first: national bankruptcy, or the party in power being involuntarily invited by angry citizens to be the guests of honor at a public lynching (real or metaphorical).

That's how insurgencies work. Insurgencies aim to make it too expensive, in money and blood, for their opponents. That's how we're getting our asses kicked in Iraq. We're likely to, in the end, win every major battle of the war. We will likely achieve every military objective we set. But we're still going to lose, because either we get out or we'll go bankrupt or angry citizens will rid themselves of their government by some means or another. The French government in fact collapsed trying to hold onto Algeria.

[arcos]

60. Just like the US stays out of foreign elections, right?

:sarcasm:

[Voltaire99]

102. Never underestimate the American potential for violence. Ask Wallace, JFK, RFK, MLK, etc.

Nor, as your post amply illustrates, should we understimate the potential for homegrown stupidity. She's the Nobel Laureate, fool; when you've done 1/1000th of the living and thinking that Lessing's accomplished, let us know.

[Prophet 451]

169. OMG

The US runs the world, feels perfectly happy about screaming about Hugo Chavez and you get pissed when a Brit offers an opinion on your presidential race? Look up "American arrogance" some time.

[saltpoint]

5. Doris, my darling, pour yourself a strong pint of something and

shut the hell up.

I'm not at ease with people predicting political assassinations.

[Cha]

215. It's awful..to put it out there in

such a dreadful way. I'm sure Obama and Michelle have thought about it because they have security now due to threats by frothing idiots but they're still willing to do what it takes in order to help our country.

Doris Lessing seems pretty full of herself to advise as such..she obviously hasn't done her homework on hilary, either.

[saltpoint]

217. Hi, zidzi. Yes. It was the bluntness of it in a public setting, I think,

that seemed so off-putting for me.

Also, we all would wish the best for any public figure, no matter who it is.

Nice to see you.

[Cha]

218. Nice to see you as an

Obama supporter..I smiled when I saw your very recent avatar! :)

[saltpoint]

219. : ) I'm still powerfully homesick for The Carolinian, but I've never been

a Clinton Democrat.

I like Obama's book, AUDACITY OF HOPE, which I'm enjoying right now.

[Cha]

220. Well, your rational, thoughtful

posts are an asset to whomever you like. :hi:

[saltpoint]

222. Kind thanks, good person. Now,

let's go out and whup us some Republicans!

[LiberalFighter]

6. What is the basis for her claim?

If Bush hasn't been then the odds are that anyone else would be slim.

[Prophet 451]

170. JFK, RFK & MLK

Ever notice that it's only liberals that get assassinated?

[Olney Blue]

7. Michelle Obama voiced concerns about this before the race.

But they had the guts to run anyway. Fortunately, they have plenty of security.

[AlinPA]

23. Who is in charge of the security now? "Homeland Security"?

[Olney Blue]

49. Secret Service, which I presume is part of Homeland Security

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/05/03/obama.protection/index.html

[verges]

72. Are They?

Are they? I thought they were still under the Treasury Department.

[Alexander]

79. Secret Service is part of the US Treasury Department.

[Yael]

9. Shows how well we have projected Civil Rights to the world

That, or she is almost 90 and not up on current events like perhaps in her younger years.

[libertee]

25. we live north of the Mason Dixon line and were treated rotten in

Virginia and West Virginia...racism is alive.

[Yael]

27. I don't deny that. I deny that it is as prevalent as it was when I grew up

in Georgia.

[littlebit]

11. She is not the first person to say that

If he does get the nomination I hope they keep him safe.There are way to many nut cases in this country.

[thunder rising]

12. The good news is the the Secret Service is WELL aware of the threat and I believe that Barack

is the 2nd most protected person in the US. They know that if they allow something to happen to him it will be an indictment of their competence.

[Forrest Greene]

75. What Consequences Have We Seen

...say, in the last eight years, for indictments of competence?

[Baby Snooks]

76. You have forgotten about the Kennedys

The Secret Service didn't stop the assassinations of the Kennedys now did they? The also didn't stop the attempts to assassinate Ford or Reagan now did they? You think suddenly they know how to stop assassinations? Or to be perfectly honest, in some cases they deliberately don't?

This country is not a democracy and hasn't been for a long time and some believe the Kennedy assassinations were when the democracy died. If you look carefully at the history of this country between 1963 and the present, they are probably right.

[northzax]

232. well, yes, they have learned

you can no longer get close enough to the President to shoot him. Presidents don't work rope lines anymore, they live in bullet-proof glass bubbles, being shuttled from one secure location to another. An assassination of a President at this point would almost HAVE to be an inside job, no one else can get close enough without massive security.

[cbayer]

13. My daughter says the same thing.

She is terrified for him. I thought she was just being hysterical.

[A Brand New World]

36. Honestly, my husband and I are both afraid that this will happen too.

There are too many wacked-out racists in this country who are egged on by the likes of Limbaugh, et al. But as someone else pointed out, if the Secret Service can protect **, the most despised idiot of the world, then they can surely protect Barack Obama.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

14. This person is assuming that Americans are ALL racists

Sure, I've heard this meme from good old boys here in Arkansas--but they themselves don't mind working with blacks, and aren't blatantly racist-they fear the KKK down the road would do it --a group that is an embarrassment to the folks around here, including natives. I really think the truly racist groups are small in this country, and those who would resort to violence smaller yet.

[cbayer]

31. Check out Southern Poverty Law Center's Intelligence Project.

http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intpro.jsp
you may underestimate what is really going on in parts of this country.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

115. Thanks for the link

no, I don't think I'm underestimating the level of hate in these groups. My point was that I don't believe they have the level of support from the general population that they used to have back in the '40s, '50s, and even '60s. Frankly, when I moved here, and found out about the KKK outfit, I was disgusted, assuming that the locals were at least tacit supporters. Until I started talking with them. The small businessmen with whom I associate as an office manager were ashamed to have them around. The Chamber of Commerce denounced them (pragmatically, because they felt it was bad for business-I was told that some national chains won't locate here because of them), but it goes well beyond that. I have yet to find anyone (except the family that makes up the majority of the members of the KKK group)who says anything negative about blacks or who tries to refuse employment to blacks. My boss (who has made several anti-Islamic comments and who has shown gender bias in hiring)took on a young black man for our summer helper part time (summer is our busy time and we need extra help). He instructed me to take any customer off his list who refused to allow Reggie to service their account, or who made any negative comments. I took this as significant, because this is a very small business, and you don't throw customers away without cause.

[cbayer]

146. No question that tolerance in general has improved.

But some groups, who have been driven even further underground, are pretty scary.

[143tbone]

37. Being black would probably not be the reason. N/T

[Doctor_J]

65. No she isn't

She's just assuming that after 20 years of hate radio filling the minds of 20 million or so demented right-wingers, one of them will act on the constant calls for violence.

[auburngrad82]

112. It only takes one person to pull a trigger.

I am an Obama supporter but I don't doubt that he will be a lightning rod for extremists. I seem to recall that one of the reasons Colin Powell didn't run was that his family feared that this would happen if he was to win.

[roseBudd]

15. she is 88 n/t

[libertee]

21. Age has nothing to do with it..she isn't the first person who has mentioned

this and a good portion of this society is racist. I pray they are all wrong..

[roseBudd]

120. Wanting to assasinate & actually being able to pull it off are vastly different

[TankLV]

200. and FAR more EXPERIENCED and has FAR more KNOWLEDGE than the rest of us...

glad you can count...that's a start...

[Mira]

19. I wouldn't worry too much. They kept GWBush alive, didn't they? N/T

[dflprincess]

32. Bush has not been a threat to the status quo which keeps him safe

I doubt that Obama will be much of threat to it either. I imagine there are crackpots that might try to go after him, but I believe the Secret Service can stop an actual "lone nut".

[Mira]

43. I beg to differ - what has kept bush safe from the wrath of millions,

and the murderous actions of some who contemplated assassination would be the fact that he all but had towns closed down, manhole covers welded shut, protection bubbles around him, no dissenters able to get near him, hidden and unspecified travel routes, and millions over millions of tax dollars spent to keep him isolated and safe.

I do not see that there is anything Bush has initiated or executed or thought up that was "status quo".

[dflprincess]

57. Let me know what Bush did to threaten the existing power structure

I must have missed that story.

As I said, the Secret Service can handle average citizen dissenters by keeping him isolated and his schedule a secret. But if Bush had pissed off those who have benefited from his policies by maybe waking up one morning and deciding to roll back the tax cuts and use the money for poverty programs, I'm sure someone would have gotton to him and Cheney would be president today.

[TankLV]

201. bush is a COWARD and only appears before PRE-APPROVED and HAND PICKED crowds...

NO democrats allowed, no one but his idiot synchophants...

THAT's why he is still alive...

Kennedy and the others weren't afraid to meet EVERYONE - and Clinton is LOVED by EVERYONE but the disgruntled repukes and the secret service can take care of them...

[riverwalker]

24. Can we just ban any talk of this?

Please, we will get enough of it in months to come, can't DU be the ONE refuge we have?
Many of us were of age in the 1960's and still carry the trauma of what we lost.
We can fight about Hillarys ankles and Obamas nostrils, but the A-word should not be mentioned.

[patrice]

26. Uhhhh, almost 90 yrs old ? My 88 year old mother-in-law tells big Fibs constantly.

[TankLV]

202. and you're mominlaw is no NOBLE LAUREAT...

sorry - but this gal is the CREAM of the CROP of HUMANITY...

your mominlaw is NOT...

[man4allcats]

28. I love Doris Lessing, but

I certainly hope she is wrong about this. I confess, though, that I have thought of it myself. The United States is a remarkably racist nation. In spite of the dangers, I personally would like to see Obama get the nomination and have him choose Hillary as his running mate. Any potential assassins would, I believe, think twice about assassination with Hillary in the wings. They would accomplish nothing with their despicable act since Hillary is more than capable of handling the job and certainly in that situation would brook no bullshit from anyone.

[Kahuna]

30. You ought to be ashamed of yourself for posting this KKKrap.

For the record, any president can be executed.

[Prophet 451]

171. How is this KKK?

She didn't say it was a good thing, she just observed that she thopught it was a danger.

[newmajority]

34. Who recommended this SHIT??

I hope they have pizza for dinner, if you know what I mean..... :grr:

[fujiyama]

35. There are racist nutcases out there

that would hate the idea of a black person becoming president, but these folks are for the most part marginalized and disorganized. Obama's security staff seems pretty tight, so I think an Obama presidency secret service will be busy, but they'll be busy with Hillary as well. A lot of irrational and virulent hatred towards her.

[rwheeler31]

41. Sad that this man lives in another time.

[EFerrari]

122. Doris Lessing is a woman. n/t

[stillcool]

42. Why is this Late Breaking News?

Musings by someone from another time, another age, and another place...we already have plenty of those here.

[BygTex]

45. Odd statement.

I consider this a real oddity considering that Obama carried the bulk of the Deep South so far. Seems to me, that if racism was a big issue, it wouldn't be so.

[EFerrari]

129. Welcome to DU, BygTex.

It is an odd statement. You have to wonder if it was taken out of context to sensationalize it.

[cbayer]

47. The amount of ageism and xenophobia in this thread is pretty startling.

[LiberalHeart]

119. Exactly what I was thinking. Incredible.

[Prophet 451]

172. My thoughts entirely

Especially given how much the USA intereferes in the rest of teh world, it says something that one elderly Brit offering an opinion gets this much flack.

[TankLV]

203. and IGNORANCE of her ACHEIVEMENTS...

appalling...not to mention the hidden sexism, too...

[cbayer]

48. Oh, but the good news is that racism is way down.

[Beregond2]

50. Lessing

Just goes to show you can win a Nobel and still be an irresponsible idiot. What the hell does she know about the situation in contemporary America? And how dare she make such a "suggestive" public statement? Ridiculous old cow.

[TwilightGardener]

51. She's 88. That's her mindset.

[cbayer]

52. And just a little sexism to top off the night. Good night.

[graywarrior]

53. Does this mean we'll have a terror attack if a dem wins?

[yava]

58. Bobby Kennedy

I was at that time at what was called the MIT student center watching TV with fellow students when it happened.
From the images, it was clear that the shots did not come from where they later said they came from.

[graywarrior]

61. It's possible that it could happen.

It's possible that it won't.

[melody]

56. Lessing hates Yanks, big surprise - but she's still an idiot to say such a thing

To suggest such a thing is madness -- and it won't happen. The BFEE (and their globalist buds) don't
assassinate here anymore ... they character assassinate. That's why they went after Clinton as they did.
They learned quickly that when you kill people, you create martyrs.

All Obama has to be is alert and aware. And stay away from young interns with close ties to Intelligence.

[yava]

63. Its possible

So we need to MAKE IT impossible. If terrrists can die American democracy by killing a black candidate for the White House, why worry abour Afghaniraqiranistan?

[NJCher]

98. really?

The BFEE (and their globalist buds) don't
assassinate here anymore ... they character assassinate.

One word, now a verb: Wellstone.



Cher

[melody]

111. Wellstone wasn't a President but yes I think he was assassinated

Let me amend that -- they don't assassinate PRESIDENTS anymore. They murder left, right and center (well, mainly
left and center) but they don't kill Presidents. I don't think they thought JFK, RFK and MLK were going to become
tragic folk heroes. I think they thought Wellstone was little-known enough to get away with it. The last assassination
attempt was Bush's against Reagan and that failed.

[proud2BlibKansan]

62. She must not realize how deeply the right HATES Hillary

[yava]

64. Triple protection for Obama

Triple Obama's protection now and tell the FBI its their priority job. Appoint someone like a super-coordinator for the 16 spy/security agencies to look for any one who may want to do it. Send in infiltrators, listeners, put up a special budget, protect the man and protect democracy while its still partly there.

[GliderGuider]

67. Exactly!

Forewarned is forearmed.


BTW, the knee-jerk reactions from some here are disturbing. You guys are not helping your reputation, y'know.

[EFerrari]

127. Here's a bit from a 1999 interview re the Clintons and pols in general:

Q: What about the current American political scene?

Lessing: I was in New York when Clinton was elected the first time, and everyone I knew was in a state of mad euphoria. I wondered what had happened to my hard-headed friends? Almost everyone I knew was drunk on this great white hope. The next time I was in New York, no one had a good word to say about Clinton, but everyone was in love with Hillary. She was the last word. It's all so unreal. Of course, it's no different in England. Here everyone was besotted with Tony Blair. He was a new face. Do people never learn?

Q: Are all politicians the same?

Lessing: All politicians are not the same. I've never felt that way. What is the same is that voters get very excited about new faces, like Clinton and Blair - and they have unrealistic expectations that the world will change overnight. A cynical old hand like myself knows that it won't.

Q: If you could have an hour-long TV program on the twentieth century, what would you want to communicate?

Lessing: That we always seem to be surprised by events, especially by catastrophes, but also by wonderful events. Look at 1990, the year that the Soviet Union collapsed and apartheid in South Africa collapsed and the Berlin Wall came down. I don't know anyone who foresaw those events. It seems to me that as a species we are constantly trying to adapt ourselves to the unexpected. In the meantime, we talk as if we are in control, and we're not. This seems to me to be the truth about the twentieth century. Here we sit with the most dangerous thing going in Yugoslavia. I find it terrifying. We're bombing Belgrade to bits, and we've been told the most amazing lies about it all.

http://lessing.redmood.com/theprogressive.html

Part of what's happening in the AP piece is that the press has tried to make Lessing seem batty since she first started writing because she did challenge the status quo so much. Sort of the same treatment Chomsky and Zinn get from the corporate media.

[unkachuck]

68. Doris, you may be right...

....but still, that's an awful lot of negative vibes....may I recommend a book:

....Bowel Care in Older People, by Jonathan Potter

[NoodleyAppendage]

70. F' YOU, YOU OLD BAT. Nobel laureate of Idiocy and Fearmongering, Doris Lessing.

The Brit intelligencia isn't know if its racial sensitivity...one must wonder if her machinations reveal a latent racism and hostility to blacks.

J

[jkshaw]

96. Classy post

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

101. Right, she was banned from South Africa for campaigning against apartheid

She was raised in what is now Zimbawbwe.

Her first book was about racial conflict in colonial Africa and presents such a searing examination of the white presence in that continent that no South African publisher would touch it.

Obviously the foundations of a latent racist.

[NoodleyAppendage]

158. O.K., then let's chalk up her fearmongering and stupid statement to DEMENTIA.

Watson has said some racist and stupid things as of late, so being a Nobel laureate does not insulate a person from criticism.

J

[Prophet 451]

173. How f'ing stupid are you?

Lessing has no dog in this fight so assuming she's trying to cut Obama down is just dumb, as is assuming she's deliberately fearmongering. She's offering an opinion on how she sees things. If she's wrong, fine but that doesn't mean she can be slandered at will.

[NoodleyAppendage]

175. Doris Lessing is a well-known feminist. Her opinion is tainted by bias towards a woman President.

Read a bit behind the lines and get back to me. Hmmm...well known feminist offering an opinion that Clinton would be the safer choice because Obama could get assassinated. Self-serving fearmongering, and you know it.

http://www.dorislessing.org/theprogressive.html

[Prophet 451]

177. Bullshit

For future reference, telling someone "and you know it" is essentially just browbeating them.

So what if she's a feminist? She's a well-known anti-racism figure as well. And there is a big difference between commenting on the danger to Obama and actively endorsing Hillary. If recognising a potential danger is fearmongering, then Al Gore should be imprisoned.

EDIT: That's also fucking insulting to both feminists and black people, to suggest they can't look past their own commonality with a candidate.

[TankLV]

206. pssst - your SEXISM is showing - along with your lack of intelligence...

just sayin...

[TankLV]

205. ahh - but her Nobel Prize does prove her SUPERIORITY to most...

now, since you are not even in fit to wear her shoes, what's YOUR excuse for your innane comments?

[Voltaire99]

103. Welcome to my Ignore list.

Dipshits are always welcome!

[NoodleyAppendage]

156. Welcome to mine. Returning the favor. n/t

j

[EFerrari]

124. Doris Lessing

Biography
From the pamphlet: A Reader's Guide to The Golden Notebook & Under My Skin,
HarperPerennial, 1995
Doris Lessing was born Doris May Tayler in Persia (now Iran) on October 22, 1919. Both of her parents were British: her father, who had been crippled in World War I, was a clerk in the Imperial Bank of Persia; her mother had been a nurse. In 1925, lured by the promise of getting rich through maize farming, the family moved to the British colony in Southern Rhodesia (now Zimbabwe). Doris's mother adapted to the rough life in the settlement, energetically trying to reproduce what was, in her view, a civilized, Edwardian life among savages; but her father did not, and the thousand-odd acres of bush he had bought failed to yield the promised wealth.

Lessing has described her childhood as an uneven mix of some pleasure and much pain. The natural world, which she explored with her brother, Harry, was one retreat from an otherwise miserable existence. Her mother, obsessed with raising a proper daughter, enforced a rigid system of rules and hygiene at home, then installed Doris in a convent school, where nuns terrified their charges with stories of hell and damnation. Lessing was later sent to an all-girls high school in the capital of Salisbury, from which she soon dropped out. She was thirteen; and it was the end of her formal education.

But like other women writers from southern African who did not graduate from high school (such as Olive Schreiner and Nadine Gordimer), Lessing made herself into a self-educated intellectual. She recently commented that unhappy childhoods seem to produce fiction writers. "Yes, I think that is true. Though it wasn't apparent to me then. Of course, I wasn't thinking in terms of being a writer then - I was just thinking about how to escape, all the time." The parcels of books ordered from London fed her imagination, laying out other worlds to escape into. Lessing's early reading included Dickens, Scott, Stevenson, Kipling; later she discovered D.H. Lawrence, Stendhal, Tolstoy, Dostoevsky. Bedtime stories also nurtured her youth: her mother told them to the children and Doris herself kept her younger brother awake, spinning out tales. Doris's early years were also spent absorbing her fathers bitter memories of World War I, taking them in as a kind of "poison." "We are all of us made by war," Lessing has written, "twisted and warped by war, but we seem to forget it."

In flight from her mother, Lessing left home when she was fifteen and took a job as a nursemaid. Her employer gave her books on politics and sociology to read, while his brother-in-law crept into her bed at night and gave her inept kisses. During that time she was, Lessing has written, "in a fever of erotic longing." Frustrated by her backward suitor, she indulged in elaborate romantic fantasies. She was also writing stories, and sold two to magazines in South Africa.

http://www.dorislessing.org/biography.html

[Ellen Forradalom]

74. She's entitled to her opinion

But since when is she Nostradamus?

[Forrest Greene]

77. Boy

...the truth hurts, doesn't it?

[IsItJustMe]

78. Fear mongerer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mitchum]

80. why should I pay attention to a science fiction writer...

Nobel or not?

[EFerrari]

132. Lessing has written in many genres. n/t

[mitchum]

139. True, but for quite awhile now she's been dwelling in Galaxy X472...

rather than Room 19 :)

[EFerrari]

140. Sometimes I think writing SciFi would be a nice break from this joint.

:)

[mitchum]

141. I don't know how much of a break that would actually be

:)

[alfredo]

81. Any Dem president runs the same risk.

I think she has it backwards. The right hates Hillary so much, if she was Veep, they would not harm a hair on Obama's head.

[Raejeanowl]

82. Thanks A Rot, Lessing

For keeping the discussion of this horrifying scenario afloat. And we especially appreciate the implicit racism in the suggestion that the Clinton/Obama pairing would be preferable because it would be the calmer choice.

[IndieLeft]

88. Nobel Laureate is a Fucking Fool!

This isn't the 1960's. I guess because she won her Nobel Prize and she's 88 she feels she has her pulse on the nation. Woo hoo! Her ideas aren't relevant to today. Doesn't she know that if Obama wins then the kind of change that she doesn't believe exists has already happened.

What so a man of African American and White heritage should wait another 80 years to run as president?

This woman is a fool!!! How did she win her prize? I wonder.

[daleo]

89. She has a valid point about the danger of assassination

Obama could be in danger, if he presents much of a threat to the status quo. The Secret Service might just "slip up", should that be the case. That would be true for any president or any presidential candidate who presents a threat to the established order (not that I necessarily think either of them actually do pose any real threat to the established order).

Then there is the lone nut factor. It is to his credit that Obama is willing to run, regardless of the somewhat elevated risk. Same goes for Hillary Clinton - I don't doubt that there are "lone nuts" that would kill either because of psychotic racial or gender animus.

It does take courage to run for high office or to stand up for the disadvantaged (MLK, JFK, RFK, etc.), and it is heartening that there are people with that courage.

As for criticizing Lessing, someone asked her a question and she gave an opinion. That's well within her rights. Insulting her because of her age is really beyond the pale.

[karlrschneider]

91. What an idiot! Americans would never assassinate their own President!

...

[Eurobabe]

92. Terra, Terra, Terra

What is she getting residuals from Bushco? :eyes:

Don't quit your day job Doris. :hi:

[CANDO]

93. He already has a SS contingent as large as the POTUS.

That's saying something about the whacko's who may be out there.

[lovuian]

94. She's not the only one who has said this

A another accurate predictor has said Obama is in grave danger the closer he gets to winning the nomination

[countmyvote4real]

95. Oh come on.

Nothing has happened to an arrogant, murderous, lying tyrant. Not even impeachment.

What makes her think that Obama's race could possibly motivate such an action?

Oh. Right. Sorry.

[BrotherBuzz]

97. Why don't you knock it off with them Negative Waves!

Why don't you knock it off with them Negative Waves! Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here. Why can't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change" - Oddball (Kelly's Heroes 1970)

[ursi]

99. what an outdated old fucker

[NJCher]

100. Outsource his security!

As president, Barack Obama should not depend on the Secret Service or any other gov't protection. He should, in the fine tradition of republicans, outsource his security. I would not in any way, shape or form depend on the U.S. government's "security" apparatus as it is abundantly clear there is a fifth column in this government and has been since the assassination of the Kennedy brothers and MLK.

In regard to comments about the certainty (tone) of Doris Lessing's statement, let's remember that age has its privilege. I know people in that age category and they think that just because they've lived so long, they can say things any way that they want and to hell with you if you don't like it. The longer I live, the more I understand that POV!

Cut a little slack.



Cher

[goodgd_yall]

104. Why the vitriol against Lessing---I've heard this same thought from Obama supporters

It's not spoken about in the public arena, but the thought is there.

[RamboLiberal]

105. She's 88 and has lived through some of the worst of our past

I'll trust the Secret Service to keep any of our presidents safe. And I also live in the knowledge that any president can be assasinated by a nutcase or a conspiracy. Reagan got shot very early in his presidency and two nutbags took shots at Gerald Ford.

With all the hatred formented against Bill Clinton by the talking wingnuts on the right I always lived in fear for his life. Would things be any different for Hillary? She certainly forments hatred by some. And even McCain has his enemies.

I think it is to the credit of the Secret Service there hasn't been a nutcase gotten close since Reagan. I don't like how the Bush Admin used them in some cases to keep those who dissented away, but I do think of all the federal LE agencies they are a good group who don't want to lose a president or candidate on their watch no matter the politics.

[EFerrari]

133. Well, the so called conservative movement has brought on

a resurgence of "some of the worse of our past". Hate crimes are up all over the country.

I agree that McCain is probably just as much at risk. The wingers have been fostering their base's god given right to hate in public for decades now.

[Not a robought]

106. Sometimes words that appear to reflect wisdom

when stripped down to their essence reflect cynicism and nothing more no matter who they come from.

[OKthatsIT]

107. They won't need to assassinate Obama

Bloomberg is going to join the race.

Come on folks..it doesnt matter who's President. It's still going to be Centrist and we're still going to live in an ever growing police state.

Just because America is full of sleeping sheep.

[Pharlo]

110. 100 + posts and no one has suggested

that perhaps the Clinton camp didn't start this as part of an overall strategy to get Obama to stepdown?

You people are slipping. :sarcasm:

[ohio2007]

117. Actually , connecting the dots is last on the knee jerk reactionaries list

since they refuse to think out of the US political box

http://www.albawaba.com/en/news/221876

Face it, Obama already insulted Islam when he denied being Muslim...... as if it was a dirty thing...

And you know how upset they get over cartoons made in Europe. I suspect if he were to end up like Bhutto,
the better choice of the knee jerks would be to point the finger at the CIA/FBI for refusing to provide proper sucurity....
"inside job" and all the tin foil that makes it grow.
;)
:sarcasm:

[Honeycombe8]

113. He might be. He might be. All the more reason to elect him.

We don't NOT choose our leaders because of fear of repercussion against the leader, do we? Of course not.

There is always some out there who doesn't want something to happen. Who hates someone else.

Lincoln and Kennedy were assassinated. Reagan was shot. There was an attempted assassination of Ford.

There are always crazies around wanting to shoot people. We shouldn't base our presidential decisions on the number of crazies we think are out there willing to kill him or her. (There are no doubt plenty of gun-toting redneck men who will not like the idea of Hillary in office.)

[Highway61]

114. Dennis and/or Edwards as VP

Nothing would ever happen to him..."they" dread those two more than anything!

[jpak]

116. Go away

n/t

[ileus]

118. What a dumbass....get a clue Brit boy, this isn't the 60's

[Lorien]

134. Doris Lessing is a woman.

She's also extremely intelligent. I'm guessing you don't live in the South, because it's still the 19th century in some areas down here. I grew up in a large college town in the North and never heard a white person say the "N" word in my 24 years living there. When I moved down here it was less than a year before I heard both a plumber I had hired (and never rehired) and a city worker use the "N" word. A young black man with a Northern accent once came to do some pest control work around the house and I asked him if he had moved here from a Northern State. He said that he had, so I then asked him if it was just me, or did it seem like the KKK is still alive and well down in this state? He said "Oh, hell yeah. I get called "boy" and "n*gger" every week on the job here. I even had one old white guy send me off a job site yesterday. He called the company and asked for a white worker instead. The ignorance is unbelievable down here." I mean hell, the still fly the confederate flag! The same hate that existed in the Civil War era is alive and well in many parts of the US. Sad, but true.

[NashVegas]

121. Let's Just Hope He Picks a Good VP, If He Wins

and not run from it.

[boricua79]

125. Maybe Obama should do what Dave Chapelle suggested...

run with a Mexican Vice-President.

You could kill the President, but you're just opening up the Border. :sarcasm:

[Emillereid]

126. I like Lessing as a writer but not as a prognosticator of the future - this

kind of thinking is SICK. Maybe it's old age! Why would the first black man be more likely to be murdered than the first woman - there are going to be sickos who hate them no matter what.

[truthisfreedom]

128. As if this is a reason not to vote for him. Ronald Reagan was almost assassinated.

bush was almost killed by a pretzel, a bicycle, and Jeff Gannon. Rectum, you nearly killed 'im!

[Lorien]

136. She never stated that he shouldn't be President

her observations were about the sad fact that America has not evolved beyond racism. I think that she has a valid point, and that if Obama is chosen as the Dem candidate he'll need a little more secret service than most.

[Not a robought]

145. yes she did, very clearly...

"Hillary is a very sharp lady. It might be calmer if she were to win, and not Obama,"

[EFerrari]

147. "It might be calmer" is not "he shouldn't be president". n/t

[Not a robought]

149. Then tell me what Hillary being sharp in that statement

has to do with his assasination potential if she isn't doing an endorsement of one over another?

[EFerrari]

150. Lessing is not shy. If she were simply endorsing Obama, she would say it

outright. I think you may be in the wrong forum.

/Oopa. I meant, if she were endorsing Clinton.

[Not a robought]

152. Avoiding the question?

How else are you attempting to parse what she said? Again what does her Hillary have to do with his assasination potential?

And don't tell me where to post.

[EFerrari]

153. She's essentially suggesting that Hillary be Obama's shield.

Isn't she? That's not a ringing endorsement of Clinton's leadership potential, is it?

And I haven't told you where to post. You, I'm sure, can read Skinner's guidelines as well as anyone.

[Not a robought]

155. How does that work exactly?

n/t

[EFerrari]

157. I don't understand the question. How does what work?

Lessing is saying that Obama is at risk. In her opinion, it would be better if Clinton got the nomination because in her opinion she would be less at risk. (I don't think I agree with that.)

Lessing doesn't seem to be speaking from any partisan position but a more clear eyed assessment of US culture than most of us want to know. And, were you familiar with her work, you'd know that she'd have no compunction about telling posters at DU who she would prefer, had she a preference, and very directly.

[Not a robought]

159. Thanks you answered the question

I don't have to be familiar with her work to understand her compunctions. It's clear enough from her words what she was saying regardless of why. There is no basis to make an assumption that Hillary would be less at risk.

[EFerrari]

160. Imho, both Clinton and Obama are at risk, and I'd toss in McCain, too.

This culture has willfully fostered inappropriate public displays of hatred for decades now. How surprising would it be for some idiot to act on that kind of encouragement?

We've a lot of digging out to do in that department.

[Not a robought]

164. It wouldn't be surprising at all

Sadly it's almost expected.

[Prophet 451]

174. That's not an endorsement of Hillary

Given that Lessing lives in a sane country (yes, that was a joke), she doesn't have a dog in this fight. Recognising/commenting on the dangers to Obama doesn't necessarily equate to endorsing Hillary.

[Not a robought]

180. Do people not read anymore?

Lessing, who won the 2007 Nobel Literature Prize, said it might be better if Obama's Democratic rival Hillary Clinton were to succeed in her bid to become the first woman president of the United States.

And you don't see how people might interpret that indirectly to be inflammatory? How about parsing and splitting the hairs on this one?...

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-02-10-lessingobama_N.htm

In October, she told a Spanish newspaper that the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks were "neither as terrible nor as extraordinary" as many people think.

Here I'll state something more profound: who cares what Doris Lessing thinks.

[Prophet 451]

181. Good for you

If you don't care what she thinks, fine.

Frankly, no, I don't see how a recognition that Hillary would be in less danger than Obama could be considered inflammatory (albeit, I think she's wrong there, the hatred the right have for Hillary is like nothing I've ever seen).

And pragmatically, she's right about 9/11 too. There was nothing unusual about the attacks except scale. Since 9/11, the US has pretty much been fouling it's pants with fear of the entire planet, the rest of the world learned how to deal with terrorism without invading half the middle east or destroying teh foundation of the country.

[Not a robought]

182. Right and the US is no better than Iran

because executions still take place. There's a lot to fix, but I've heard all the moral relativist arguments before. Cynicism is the lowest common denominator, it's not profound and it's affect is to instill doubt. Still don't see how it's inflammatory?

[Prophet 451]

183. Don't try playing that f'ing game

Every time I say something about the US, Americans start saying how much better they are than Iran. Yeah, you're better than Iran, so what? This is a child's game: Compare yourself to one of the most repressive regimes on the planet instead of comparing the nation to similar nations. It's like an entire country suffering from the fallacy of the excluded middle.

No, I still don't see how it's inflammatory. Nowehere did she say the hatred for Obama was a good thing, nowhere did she say that he should be shot, she recognised a (realistic, IMO) danger.

Yes, Lessing is a cynic, so am I. Actually, I'm more aof a cynic because I still think there's a reasonable chance that Chimpy will attempt to impose martial law before the election but either way, expressing an opinion does not justify the abuse Lessing has received here.

[Not a robought]

184. Hostile much?

Not playing any games. But please, continue to parse away.

[LanternWaste]

239. It seems much less a judgment and much more an observation... n/t

It seems much less a judgment and much more an observation...

[rocktivity]

131. That's why Edwards should be his VP

Obama wouldn't have to worry about being assassinated if there's danger of him being replace with a even MORE progressive president!

:headbang:
rocknation

[Lorien]

135. Wow, DUers are playing the "attack the messenger" game as well as the Right

today! Maybe it would be helpful to know who Lessing is before you slander her:

(snip)

Lessing was educated at the Dominican Convent High School, a Roman Catholic convent all-girls school in Salisbury (now Harare).<12> Lessing left school aged 14, and thereafter was self-educated. She left home at 15 and worked as a nursemaid, and it was around this time that Lessing started reading material on politics and sociology that her employer gave her to read.<9> She began writing around this time. In 1937, Lessing moved to Salisbury to work as a telephone operator, and she soon married her first husband, Frank Wisdom, with whom she had two children, before the marriage ended in 1943.<9>

Following her divorce, Lessing was drawn to the Left Book Club, a communist book club<2>, and it was here that she met her second husband, Gottfried Lessing. They were married shortly after she joined the group and had a child together, before the marriage also ended in divorce in 1949. Gottfried Lessing later became the East German ambassador to Uganda, and was murdered in the 1979 rebellion against Idi Amin Dada.<9>

Writing career

Because of her campaigning against nuclear arms and South African apartheid, Lessing was banned from that country and from Rhodesia for many years.<13> Lessing moved to London with her youngest son in 1949 and it was at this time her first novel, The Grass Is Singing, was published.<2> Her breakthrough work, written in 1962, was The Golden Notebook.<11>

In 1984, she attempted to publish two novels under a pseudonym, Jane Somers, to demonstrate the difficulty new authors faced in trying to break into print. The novels were declined by Lessing's UK publisher, but accepted by another English publisher, Michael Joseph, and in the US by Alfred A. Knopf.<14>

She declined a damehood, but accepted a Companion of Honour at the end of 1999 for "conspicuous national service".<15> She has also been made a Companion of Literature by the Royal Society of Literature.<16>

On 11 October 2007, Lessing was announced as the winner of the Nobel Prize for Literature.<17> At 87, she is the oldest person to have received the literature prize<18> and the third oldest Nobel Laureate in any category.<19><20> She also stands as only the eleventh woman to be awarded the Nobel Prize for Literature by the Swedish Academy in its 106-year history.<21> She told reporters outside her home "I've won all the prizes in Europe, every bloody one, so I'm delighted to win them all.

(snip)


Lessing has fought against apartheid; she knows how dark human nature can become. As a native Northerner living in the south, I have to say that I agree with her; I think that some racist Assh*le may indeed try to assassinate Obama. Of course, sexism is alive and well too, so the same could be said for Hillary. Sadly, our society is not as evolved as many here wish to believe.

[EFerrari]

138. The sexism on this thread alone is enough to give you a stomach ache.

Yikes.

It also makes me sad to see how little of her work people have read or they would know she's not a man, a Yank hater, out of touch, batty or a "dumbass" or an irresponsible idiot or an old cow. *

Let alone that the struggles of the 60s are in no way over or that as a successful woman, she doesn't know to a T how much hatred simply being successful can engender.

Before we let the corporate media put a wedge between us and our leading intellectuals, people need to remember that liberals are often used this way in the press. Think of the out of context quotes from Vidal or Zinn or Vonnegut put out there precisely to discredit them and elicit the very response posted over and over on this thread.

* I forgot "outdated old fucker.

[GliderGuider]

161. Sexism, ageism, racism and xenophobia, all on triumphant display.

It doesn't matter that Lessing is 88, nor that she's a woman, nor that she's a foreigner. Those objections are nothing but red herrings being dragged around to divert attention from her unpalatable but plausible message.

If Obama were to be assassinated subsequent to victory, it wouldn't be by a nutter (though it would be made to appear to be) and it wouldn't be because he's black. It would be through careful planning because he represented a threat to the powers that be. The Secret Service wouldn't be of much help in such a case, they would be either outmaneuvered or suborned at some level, as they have been in the past.

Frankly, though, I disagree with Lessing -- I don't think Obama is at much risk. He is at least as pragmatic a corporatist as Clinton. He's perfectly capable of seeing which way the the wind is blowing and accommodating himself to the facts of life.

I'd have been much more worried about Kucinich, and somewhat more worried about Edwards. Either Obama or Clinton would make a fine figurehead for our alien overlords.

[EFerrari]

162. I agree with you about the actual "threat" Obama or Clinton, for that matter,

represent to the corporati.

But, it gets tricky when you compare the reality to the hype.

At this point, any Democrat better have damn good security because they are running against acting out haters. I never thought I'd see this day (again).

[cbayer]

163. I know! Isn't that interesting?

I think you really hit a nerve posting this piece and the lesson seems to be that fear brings out the worst in people. All of a sudden it's ok to be a bigot.

[pitohui]

187. thank you, lorien, this woman did more to fight racism and sacrificed more than anyone scolding her

amazing to see internet warriors who have risked NOTHING to help advance the cause of civil rights jump all over a woman whose fight for equal rights for blacks meant being banned from the country where she was raised (the then rhodesia) and also south africa, as well as being banned from travel to the united states

here's a woman who is pretty much the perfect package of intelligence, decency, and common sense, who has risked much to draw attention to injustice, and a bunch of uneducated armchair warriors are jumping on her because of a quote almost certainly taken out of context (keeping in mind the press has never much liked her because she was a communist at a time when only the communist party in rhodesia was willing to have black, brown, and white meet equally together)

i think we've all had her fear, that obama will be killed, or that hillary will be, as bartcop has said many times, strangely enough, it's only the democrats who for whatever reason the secret service fails them at the right moment

we are in a fight against evil, real evil, the kind that trades our blood for a profit, and to think these folk will play fair is a dream

all this "killing the messenger" is stupid and only shows how amazingly ignorant some people are about the life and achievements of one our greatest living writers -- as churchill once said, the lie is heard round the world while the truth is still pulling its boots on

lessing is on our side, let's leave trashing her to the freepers

[InkAddict]

142. Sadly, the thought crossed my mind as well but wondered

why THEY would wait as long as post-election.(Washing out the cerebral cells). Not as an excuse, but this family has personally just come through what amounts to Naomi Klein's Step 1/pre-torture, personal economic "softening up" shock. It's as though, now that we're disposed/invisible/irrelevant, anything can come to mind, and it does, so we're seeking forgiveness and empathy for those NEGATIVE vibes--just to get the trauma out of the system--before we yell 'STOP' on the fear. Complex group complex PTSD's a b****ch to overcome. Giver her a break, she's old and her mind's been through a lot, fantasy and otherwise.

[Zynx]

143. I've heard this theory before, but I think the best basis for it is all the hate

that is spewed in right-wing talk radio about Obama supposedly being a Muslim, which is a total lie, and how that might inspire some nutjob to think he would be saving the country from Muslim rule. However, those nutjobs tend to be lazy and I put a 99.999999% probability such a thing would never happen. That said, 1 in 11 U.S. presidents have been shot and killed and there have been serious attempts on many more.

[cbayer]

148. Although there are some who reject this OP

It certainly has stirred up some of the more interesting discussion/debate I have seen here. And it has been respectful for the most part. This is a scary subject, particularly for those who lived through the assassinations of our earlier heroes. And we don't like to acknowledge that there are American terrorists. But I think it's been a really interesting discussion.

[sofa king]

151. She and Wyclef Jean.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pq_3OheqzU

But you know what? If Obama is willing to go for it, I'm willing to vote for him.

It's worth watching Wyclef's take on it, above. He's not suggesting he'd be killed just because he's black. He's suggesting he'd die because of his social agenda.

Maybe someone really is going to have to risk life and limb to change things for the better.

Wouldn't you, if you had the chance?

[EFerrari]

154. Do they have any choice at this point? Probably not,

judging from their SS details. And, judging from the rabid, hate spitting callers into Washington Journal.

The way this remark was presented is stupid and likely, purposefully so. But at some point we're going to have to deal with more than two decades of Republican hate mongering.

[Prophet 451]

179. I'll give Obama this much...

...The man must know he's a target, so I have to give him an A+ for sheer guts to stay in the campaign.

[IndyOp]

166. This post is, IMO, very, very negative. I am putting you on my ignore list. (n/t)

[galledgoblin]

167. shot at? good chance, but a successful assassination?

I very highly doubt it.

Obama is already under secret service protection and has been since the earliest days of his campaign... and since JFK not only has the secret service become even better, but medical practices have as well.

people took pot shots at Ford and shot Reagan, and both lived well into their old dottering years.

[Prophet 451]

178. OK, good point

I think Lessing is assuming, as most people do, that an assassination attempt would be successful.

[Prophet 451]

176. She has a point

Pretending she's endorsing Hillary is just plain dumb.

Lessing has a point here, the US still has many racial problems (although, credit where it's due, it has come a long way in the last thirty years) but the right's loathing of Hillary is such that I suspect she would be even more of a bullet magnet. Of course, that doesn't mean one shouldn't vote for him/her on those grounds. One cannot make decisions about who to support based on fear.

[MrSlayer]

185. So the message is: Vote for Hillary to save Obama's life?

Such bullshit.

[pitohui]

189. the message is: learn to read critically

if you don't know anything about lessing, about her work for civil rights or her support for feminism, then i suppose you could take what you took from this piece

it is however a disgrace for anyone who reads english not to have read lessing and to be that unfamiliar with her life and work

the message is, if you are a progressive, if you are for women, if you are for equal rights for all races, then expect to be smeared and slammed and have your words twisted

even if you're 88 and have a nobel prize, don't worry, you will still be slapped down for being so bold as to take a stand, the right wing media will make sure of that

when you have been banned from several countries, including the one where you were raised, because of your stand on civil rights, you come back here and feel free to criticize doris lessing, who has risked far more in this cause than you ever have or ever will

[MrSlayer]

193. I'm not seeing the relevance of what you are saying.

What does her life's work have to do with making a ridiculous statement like the one in the link? What bold stand is she making? What is she really saying if it's not what I think she's saying? Obviously I must be missing something. Help me out.

[pitohui]

195. i say again: learn to read critically

this woman has been smeared by various gov'ts and various media for her entire life

she is far more progressive than you are and has achieved far more than you have, and for that reason the "junk" pop media has to shit on her -- when you stand up for a cause, then somebody is going to make you stand down

read critically, if you don't see the "spin" in this brief article then you need to examine your own ability to read media

[MrSlayer]

204. This isn't helping me.

I don't care if she's the most progressive person the world has ever seen and it doesn't matter how much she's accomplished. I have over 50 years yet to reach her age, I may one day dwarf her accomplishments so whether or not she's done more than me is irrelevant. I'm not seeing what cause she's standing for and I'm not seeing anything except "Don't vote for Obama because he'll be killed" in the text.

Are you saying the media is making this up to make her look bad? Are you saying her words have been twisted in some way? Are you saying that because she's so progressive and has struggled so for various causes that she's free to say anything at all and not be questioned? What the hell are you saying?

If I'm unable to read critically then you are unable to write clearly. You are being very vague about what it is you think she actually meant. How about a straight answer?

[EFerrari]

225. I don't understand why you're so upset. The woman is giving an opinion

not telling anyone how to vote.

Another thing I thought of today. Since she's been involved with social justice movements all over the world, I wonder how many friends she's lost to assassins.

[femrap]

186. If he is the nominee, why wouldn't they

send in the jackals in October, 2008? Chaos ensues. Martial Law declared.

[MasonJar]

188. I truly worry about Hillary and Barak being the target of a crazy man/woman if elected.

My daughter used to cringe when she'd see Clinton and Gore out running together on the city streets. She was very worried for them. When one of the two wins the election, we must protect them vigilantly.

[GeniusLib]

191. Political Violence is a European Thing

One of the positives of the political situation here is that no matter how heated things have gotten (2000 and 2004 elections,etc.) Americans generally will not resort to violence to pursue political ends.

[TankLV]

196. umm - 4 presidents, huey long, MLK, bobby, the list goes on...

I'd say it's a particularly AMERICAN "thing"...

[GeniusLib]

213. Nothing in the past 35+ years

as compared to the rioting and coup's seen all over the world at nearly every contested election.



It's tough to imagine a president being hated more than Shrub and nobody has tried anything with him.

[pitohui]

199. ever heard of the kennedys or martin luther king or for that matter most of american history?

americans do resort to violence to get their way, and you can't even tell the story of this country if you don't talk about racially motivated violence

to say that violence is likely is just to be realistic

we do have a history of killing black leaders, king, malcolm x, plenty of the black panthers were either killed or set up to be jailed, it does seem to be a pattern

obama knows the score and he has the courage to stand up anyway, there is nothing wrong with admiring the man and his courage, for that matter, i think hillary has the same risk and that she too is to be admired, because they both know damn well the risks are real

[DemBones DemBones]

211. You should consider changing your user name if

you're going to post off-the-wall things like that.

[my2sense]

192. Some feel as though he is not

being adequately protected - on purpose.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4472863

[TankLV]

194. Horrible thought -

but if they were BOTH on the ticket - they would each be the other's "life insurance" policy...

[fascisthunter]

197. Three Other People Have Said the Same Thing to Me

I honestly can say if I agree with that, yet I can see why people would feel this way. That is sad testament to how average people think of their country's government.

[Karenina]

209. It's quite a common opinion on this side of the big pond.

It reflects more the perception of America as a violent, racist, eat-their-own-and-everyone-else nation than anything else.

[DemBones DemBones]

212. Do people on your side of the Atlantic also fear

for Hillary Clinton if she's elected?

If you look at this thread, you can see how very sexist many people who claim to be liberals really are.

Not to mention the hate for old people and foreigners. Perhaps we just have a lot of, um, "guests" here tonight. I hope that's it.

[Karenina]

214. No similar fears for Hillary BECAUSE

female heads of state are not an overriding hot bbutton issue. We have one. The difference in perception can be summed up in one word: Katrina.

[fascisthunter]

223. You Nailed it.....

"America as a violent, racist, eat-their-own-and-everyone-else nation..."

Sad but true... don't forget: over-cocky and arrogant.

[Common Sense Party]

216. NPR's "Talk of the Nation" discussed this. MANY African-Americans

are seriously worried that Obama would be assassinated.

I had no idea of the level of fear.

[superconnected]

221. I arrived at the same conclusion days ago. It's enevitable.

I fully understand the fear.

I don't think Hillary should run in his place though. I still think he should run and win, and choose his VP wisely.

[Divine Discontent]

227. um....

FEAR!!!!!!!!!

[McHatin]

229. Well of course...

if some Brit with Pakistani ancestors was prime minister, those vicious, dirty, racist Brits would kill him, within the first week at least....

What an arse.

[EFerrari]

230. Does Britain have a history of assassinating progressive leaders

as we do?

[kestrel91316]

231. Put Edwards or Clinton in as VP. It will serve as insurance against

assasination, just like Cheney. Maybe even Kucinich!!

[denverbill]

233. Maybe so, but Hillary ain't exactly much less likely to be targeted.

The right-wing hate machine has been spewing out such venom about the Clinton's for the last 16 years that there is a whole hard-core cadre of nutjobs who consider her literally the devil. Personally, I'd wager the wacked-out Clinton haters outnumber the crazy racists. Pure speculation on my part of course.

[CRH]

236. She is only making an observation that has crossed many realists minds, n/t

[LanternWaste]

238. That this thread has received as many responses as it has

That this thread has received as many responses as it has indicates to me that she (Lessing) is tapping into a possible latent fear, and maybe it's better that this conversation gets some play, rather than a Victorian suppression of our emotions so that we feel better.

With the Democratic win in Nov., there will be an unprecedented target for either racists or misogynists (I figure one's as bad as the other). And in contemporary American history, I think we can agree that those are about the two angriest demographics out there.

They're the base of both Bush and Rush. They are the Timothy McVeigh's and David Koresh's of America-- simply add one more "insult" (a female or black President) to them and we have five thousand loose canon's with lit fuses.

Maybe the article in the OP and is something we should carefully examine and consider before discarding it as though it were nothing more than an idle post on FR. :shrug:

[pegleg]

240. Any President risks assassination, but shirking opportunity

is the alternative. I think Obama is brave enough and smart enough to be a realist. Life has no guarantees. God be with him.

[Hekate]

241. Blunt. She reveals the fear that dare not speak its name. She remembers 1963-68 all too well.

Don't some of you think that others of us who lived through that dreadful time fear that too? Obama is inspirational to me, but there's always a nagging fear at the back of my brain, a part of me holding my breath.

Democrats who want to change the world, and get close to doing it, are at special risk, whether they are white or black. And now that we have a female Democrat getting close to the office, one who has been demonized by the RW for 20 years, she is also a target.

The Secret Service is protecting both of them, and although they can't assure 100% safety, they are (as far as we know) still competent and can head off a lot of trouble.

Hekate