Obama concedes remarks were ill chosen

[journalist3072]

Source: AP via Yahoo News

Obama concedes remarks were ill chosen

By JIM KUHNHENN and CHARLES BABINGTON, Associated Press WriterS
22 minutes ago

MUNCIE, Ind - After a full throated response to criticism that he is condescending, Democrat Barack Obama on Saturday conceded that that comments he made about bitter working class voters who "cling to guns or religion" were ill chosen.

"I didn't say it as well as I should have," he said.

As Obama tried to quell the furor, presidential rival Hillary Rodham Clinton hit him with one of her lengthiest and most pointed criticisms to date.

"Senator Obama's remarks were elitist and out of touch," she said, campaigning about an hour away in Indianapolis. "They are not reflective of the values and beliefs of Americans."

At issue are comments Obama made privately at a fundraising gathering in San Francisco last Sunday. He explained his troubles winning over working class voters, saying they have become frustrated with economic conditions:

"It's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."





Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080412/ap_on_el_pr/obama_clinton;_ylt=AryLJZpznnmKgbCWvwf2NtGs0NUE

[suston96]

1. Oh yes! His concession is - uh - brilliant.....! nt

[niceypoo]

22. Too funny....

I had a similar thought upon seeing the title of the thread.

[TankLV]

96. same here...

words DO matter - except when they don't - or - ahh - have to be explained away that they REALLY didn't mean what they were, except...

god every obamabot head must have a LOT of headaches...!!!

[Yael]

2. Here -- have a straw

[MethuenProgressive]

5. Is that a cocaine reference?

I read they use straws.

(DUbama Class 101: take the most innocent of comments and Spin them into something to be outraged over. For instance, if a non-believer evrr uses the word 'straw' accuse them of making a cocaine reference and are therefore racists.)

[Yael]

8. Only you would make that connection

[movonne]

13. You are a nut....if you have nothing good to say about your choice

for president then just...STFU...you sound like faux news...

[SoFlaJet]

3. yes but will he

denounce AND reject? That's what I like about the guy, he isn't afraid to say when maybe he fucked up-unlike the idiot we've had to suffer through since January 2001 who NEVER admits nuthin'.

[Joe Chi Minh]

36. His only mistake was to concede an inch to them. They have no love of truth. It is simply seen

as a weakness and attacked as such. He should never apologise for using the primary colours of the nursery. They are the very colours used by the Republicans (and Republican-lites), so unqualified attacks in rebuttal are the only appropriate way in which to respond. Such rebuttals will always be subtly nuanced in comparison with their wretched target

It is the cardinal rule of our British royal family, when dealing with our gutter press (or, rather, disdaining so to do): "Never apologise. Never explain". Obama should have kept piled in, instead of seeking to nuance what he said, for the benefit of right-wing half-wits.

[Kurovski]

42. I was thinking along those same lines.

Now will Clinton spin it as "Obama says he was wrong" and completely submerge his true intent?

[dogfacedboy]

54. He didn't fuck up. He spoke the truth. I'm angry that he backed down. n/t

[MethuenProgressive]

4. Oh no! The DUbamas have been saying His Quote was Wonderful and Accurate!

Here comes the tornadic spin as the fanatics all claim they were actually saying the opposite of what they've posted to get in line with BO's latest gyrations of the truth.
:rofl:

[journalist3072]

6. ROFL!!!! So true indeed!! Speak on it!! eom

[Petrushka]

11. Wonder if any'll follow his example and "concede", too. (eom)

[VeraAgnes]

16. The Pennsylvania and Indiana

Primaries are just 10 days from today ...I'm not sure if the voters will forgive and forget the insulting comments by April 22. I'm pleased to have him recognize his overstated comments,as this will help him in North Carolina and the following Primaries.

[niceypoo]

23. There is a massively recommended thread going on about how BRILLIANT the comment was...

Blind partisanship and reasoning do not go hand in hand

[Politicalboi]

32. Because it was accurate

But Hillary knows Americans who support her especially are stupid and wouldn't understand what he said. Talk about working with the media. Hillary is taking every shot at him about this and the media is now her friend. The Clintons are Vultures and she can't do it herself so she waits till Obama says something that she knows is true and twists it to help herself.

[tavalon]

50. If you think this benefits here, you are sadly mistaken

Even my friends who are for her are cringing. This Rovian tactic shouldn't work for anybody but it definitely doesn't work for anyone but Rove. Senator Clinton might have thought she owned this discussion but she was punked, big time. Senator Obama won this round.

[defendandprotect]

34. I support Obama's original comments --- it is the GOP and the DLC which are "elitist" ...

and the workers who are being dumped on ---

I think the workers know that --- !!!


Meanwhile, HRC is averaging $18 million a year ---
and McCain is married to the Anheiser Bush heiress --- at least a couple of hundred million there!

[TankLV]

97. must not disagree with the "annointed one", don't you know that?

:rofl:

[Zhade]

101. It still was. He shouldn't have apologized to conservative assholes like you.

NT!

[The Straight Story]

7. See, he is not articulate....

:rofl:

[madfloridian]

9. He damn sure better do it or Hillary will keep pounding him with GOP talking points.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1985

Even CNN and the NYT caught her at it this time. They must get those talking points on their blackberries. LOL

[LiberalFighter]

10. At least Hillary is helping Obama by slamming him with GOP talking points.

Now is the time to weather criticism... not a month or less before the November election. He will have time to fine tune his rebuttals and show that he has the qualities to be a president.

[Petrushka]

15. If he wants--you know-- to "fine tune his rebuttals", he might begin by--you know--

breaking--you know--his habit of you-knowing.

[madfloridian]

18. And she can quit nodding her head...

everytime someone is talking.

[barb162]

47. He can quit strutting around like he's the cat's meow.

Because he isn't.

[tavalon]

51. There are worse habits

At least you can tell there is a brain working there while he uses the spacing words. Nothing going on behind the doofus in the WH who uses all sorts of spacing words. If "you-know" is the worst thing we will have to look forward to for the next eight years, we will be on easy street, you know?

[dogfacedboy]

55. LOL. "You Know" is actually a "Chicagoism".

People here in Chicago constantly pepper their speech with that. I don't know why, as I'm not a linguist. I just know it's there, you know?

[indimuse]

12. A face in the Crowd.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ph1-IN_jV7c

K&R!! America is mean ~ Michelle Obama

[Berry Cool]

14. This article should be pointed to the next time someone accuses the media of being pro-Obama.

It closes with Hillary's remarks:

Clinton struck hard, calling Obama's comments "demeaning." The increased attack showed that Clinton is eager to hold on to her working class support and is looking to open new questions about Obama's judgment that would make voters and Democratic officials reconsider their support for the Illinois senator.

"I was raised with Midwestern values and an unshakable faith in America and its policies," she said. "Now, Americans who believe in the Second Amendment believe it's a matter of constitutional right. Americans who believe in God believe it's a matter of personal faith.

"I grew up in a church-going family, a family that believed in the importance of living out and expressing our faith. The people of faith I know don't 'cling' to religion because they're bitter. People embrace faith not because they are materially poor, but because they are spiritually rich.

"Our faith is the faith of our parents and our grandparents. It is a fundamental expression of who we are and what we believe."

In short, it was designed to say: Take THAT, Obama! Why do you hate the Second Amendment, Senator Obama? Why do you hate the Baby Jesus, Senator Obama?

What a bunch of bullshit.

"People embrace faith not because they are materially poor, but because they are spiritually rich." Baloney. Many a person has turned to religion--very deeply and sincerely--because it offered comfort and hope to them for wealth in a world of the spirit despite their earthly poverty. Why, otherwise, was the conversion of slaves to Christianity such a success in this country? It was selling people pie in the sky by and by when you die. Don't build up treasures here on earth, build up treasure in heaven. Easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to get into heaven. Considere the lilies of the field, they neither toil nor spin.

The appeal to people who are bitter, hopeless, ignored or hated, down on their luck, has been an essential element of Christianity since it began. Because, of course, it was an essential element of Judaism. Yes, you may be toiling and oppressed and surrounded by enemies now, but if you believe in God, he will send you someone who will help lead you out of the wilderness and set you free.

If people are honest, they will admit that religion has always been a refuge for people whom life has made bitter. Whether it transformed their bitterness into spiritual richness or just made it worse.

All Obama was saying was that it's classic for politicians to use wedge issues like guns and religion to distract people who are economically suffering, to get them to vote for yet another "savior" who will protect their guns and their religious beliefs (and prejudices) but who is actually going to take more and more of their MONEY away.

And THAT is the TRUTH.

[CANDO]

28. Grand Slam! A--fucking--men.

Why is it that people have a hard time recognizing truth when it slaps the living shit out of them? No, instead they distort reality to fit their fantasies. Barack Obama simply is too much for people to handle because he is the extremely rare politician who comes along once in a generation who dares tell the truth. Simply put, "we can't handle the truth". Of course people seek refuge in faith and lash out at perceived villains for their predicament. The perceived villains are often planted in their minds by the very real culprits of their disenfranchisement.

[Igel]

39. Keep in mind that Obama was raised essentially agnostic.

But some 20 years ago he decided to embrace a form of Xianity, and decided to raise his children in it.

Was he bitter, hopeless, ignored, or hated, down on his luck?

No. I don't think so. If he was, he's beyond help.

If his kids stick with it, will it be because they're bitter, hopeless, ignored or hated, down on their luck? Again, no.

It's classic for some people to think that the reasons for a person's behavior are the ones that they most want to believe are true. Some people turn to religion because they're poor and embittered; some, simply because they're looking for something to believe in. Painting with a broad brush is bad, whichever side does it.

Obama? Clinton? Their brushes are the same size in this flap.

[Wizard777]

17. I'm disappointed that Obama can be made to back away from the truth.

So how much longer before he's telling bold faced Clinton lies? Obama needs to realize that he doesn't have to play their game. Not playing their game is exactly how he got to where he is. If he keeps them honest and playing his game. Obama can only win. If he tries to play their game Obama can only lose.

[ForPeace]

19. I'm with you, Wizard

nt

[Frisbee]

20. Agreed n/t

[aquart]

21. "Bold faced Clinton lies." LOL!

Obama has been lying to your face with the sincerest possible expression since day one. "Clinton lies." LMAO!

Personally, I think Obama's a great back-peddler.

[TankLV]

98. yep...

[Zhade]

106. TUZLA. Video proves she lied. You fail.

NAFTA. Paper trail proves she supported it despite her lie that she didn't. Ooops, you fail again.

[FlyingSquirrel]

29. Me too.

[fshrink]

31. He didn't back away

he conceded that the phrasing could have been better. Concessions like that, I can take.

[defendandprotect]

35. I agree --- he shouldn't have backtracked on this .....his comments are

spontaneous and human and humane ---

He should ENLARGE on those comments --- not backtrack --

And not delusional as HRC's big Bosnia lie was --- !!!

[Wizard777]

41. The new stories comming out of Pa don't even mention it.

They are more concerned with their relatives in Iraq. I was reading an article and an old WWII Vet was saying he liked Hillary's experience. But you ballance that against her gullibility. If I were Barack I would make a commercial of Colin Powells UN Speech where he's showing the satalite photos of teh mobile biological decontamination unit. Then cut to say, Hillary It's just a fire truck. Hillary there is no need to bomb these people for three days over a picture of a fire truck. America If that's what "experience" gets you. Who needs it?

[defendandprotect]

44. Love the comments re Iraq/WMD . . .

I don't get "Hillary's experience" however ---

Granted, she's had her years in the Senate --- and voting for war!!!

But the whole back-seat driving thing as First Lady, I don't buy ---

[nachoproblem]

37. His "concession" was anything but that

Here's a link to the video of his remarks in Muncie. http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x117695

As you might imagine, many of the reports take only one sentence, in some cases only part of one sentence, to play up his apology and make it look like he backpedaled, leaving out the part where he restated his point about "bitterness" just as strongly.

As many have observed, Obama's strength is his ability to speak about things with blunt honesty and not as if he is talking to children. The people who think he should apologize, because being babied is exactly what they want, will try to see the apology they want whether it is there or not.

[happygoluckytoyou]

24. BITTER ISNT THE HALF OF IT.....GOBAMA

JOHN "THE REPUBLICAN" MCCAIN AND HILLARY "REPUBLICAN LITE" CLINTON ARE OUT OF TOUCH...
WHY ELSE WOULD THEY DEFEND THE WAR...EVER!!! DID SOMEONE SAY THE CLINTONS EARNED $110 MILLION
LAST YEAR.... GUESS THAT $4 GAS IS HITTING THEM PRETTY HARD

JOHN "THE REPUBLICAN" MCCAIN AND HILLARY "REPUBLICAN LITE" CLINTON ARE OUT OF TOUCH...
WHY ELSE WOULD THEY DEFEND THE WAR...EVER!!! DID SOMEONE SAY THE CLINTONS EARNED $110 MILLION
LAST YEAR.... GUESS THAT $4 GAS IS HITTING THEM PRETTY HARD

[dbmk]

25. Seeing the whole speech...

.. shows how clearly that bit is taken out of context. He generally still means what he said, and makes no excuses about it. And thats a good thing, btw.

[DS1]

26. I thought it was a great speech! The people watching thought it was a great speech

The media is just Dean-Screaming him

[barb162]

48. What the media did to Dean was terrible.

Here, they're just reporting Obama's words verbatim. He suffers from foot-in-mouth disease.

[bow-tie]

27. Republicans DEMAND

apology and democrats PLEAD for forgiveness. What is this shit? When did a puke EVER apologize for anything they said or did?
Fuck you fundies with you bible and your guns, got that, FUCK YOU! Apology will not be coming.

[benEzra]

52. You're assuming that working-class rural gun owners and churchgoers are repub fundies. (n/t)

[Zorra]

30. Ouch. Ill chosen is an understatement. Anti-trade?

What the hell is that supposed to mean? That people should embrace NAFTA?
:shrug:

[President Kerry]

45. He didn't say or suggest that..

His opposition to NAFTA is well-known. What he said is that some poor economic policies over the past 2 decades have left people with those negative sentiments. Which he understands and acknowledges better than either of his opponents.

Nobody can say with a straight face that people have not become more negative in this country - look at constant immigrant-, china-, etc bashing on TV. Lou Dobbs' cult is the living proof of how astute Obama's original statement was.

[defendandprotect]

33. HRC is averaging $18 million a year and calling Obama "elitist" . . . ?????

"Senator Obama's remarks were elitist and out of touch," she said, campaigning about an hour away in Indianapolis. "They are not reflective of the values and beliefs of Americans."

"It's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."

What is HRC saying ... ?
That she is against any gun controls?
That she is against gay marriage?
That the GOP isn't driving anti-immigrant sentiment -- ?
That she supports all the trade agreements which have taken jobs overseas?

Maybe she is trying to say that the GOP hasn't exploited these issues above more important issues, like medical care?

Maybe she wants to even say that the GOP hasn't exploited "GOD" --- ???

[derby378]

38. Thing is, Hillary would say the same thing about guns as Obama did

She wants to bring back the semi-auto ban her husband signed into law. She is on record as supporting confiscation of guns from law-abiding Americans in the event of a natural disaster such as Katrina. Obama and Clinton really aren't that far removed from each other in terms of gun control.

[nichomachus]

40. Well she might have

before she declared herself a gun-loving churchgoer

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5473483&mesg_id=5473483

[creeksneakers2]

43. All candidates misspeak

Obama went way off the tracks on this one. Even if what he were true he shouldn't have said it, and its not true. Suppose 60% of people in small Pennsylvania towns are obese. Should Obama say Pennsylvania small towns are full of fat people?

Obama made it worse by repeating the insults while apologizing for them. And he says he should have said it a different way. Somebody might ask him what words he should have used.

Obama is our guy now so I'm behind him 100%. Still, he ought to make a clearer apology and refute what he said and then move on.

Democrats shouldn't apologize if they've done nothing wrong but in this case Obama goofed up and an apology is a good idea.

[President Kerry]

46. I just don't agree that it was insulting.

There is an explanation to why this country has become so xenophobic and so focused on GGG (god guns gays). He offered his view. If anything he has acknowledged a segment of people that have been particularly screwed and neglected by the government over the past 20 years. He's brutally honest.

[benEzra]

53. It's insulting to those who own guns or believe in God...

and believe strongly in the importance of same, to say they/we do so as an emotional crutch.

Half of gun owners are Dems and indies (including me), and I suspect around half of people who believe in God are also Dems and indies.

The gun issue was so big in the '90s through '04 because the DLC initially wanted it to be big; they thought that supporting new gun bans would allow them to triangulate right-leaning authoritarians by looking "tough on crime." Banning popular nonhunting guns was the #1 legislative priority through much of 1994. It backfired badly, of course, and the party wisely dropped it in '06 (thank you, Howard Dean).

Dems who own guns are not xenophobes, are not fundies, and do not own guns as an emotional crutch. Painting all rural gun owners as closet freepers is not wise.

[tavalon]

49. That's rich

Previous First Lady and current Senator Clinton is accusing Senator Obama of being out of touch. That is just so rich. If he is out of touch, well, pot, meet kettle. Too, too ironic. I think my meter just broke. :freak:

[Moderator]

56. kick

[brooklynite]

57. Obama says he 'mangled' Pa. remark

Source: Philadelphia Inquirer

The debate spurred by Barack Obama's comments about small-town Pennsylvania raged on yesterday with the senator acknowledging he had "mangled" what he meant to say.

In a meeting with the editorial boards of The Inquirer and Daily News, Obama said he had let several thoughts run together when he said nine days ago that people were "bitter" about lost jobs and "cling to guns or religion."

"The problem was that I just mangled it, which happens sometimes," he said.

The thoughts that ran together, he said, were that people who feel abandoned find stability in their traditions but also are vulnerable to politicians exploiting wedge issues.

Read more: http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news_update/20080415_Obama_says_he__mangled__Pa__remark.html

[JKaiser]

58. He sure did

[Mugsy]

66. The Hell he did.

I'm looking for a "You're damn right I'm bitter!" bumper sticker.

[BearSquirrel2]

89. Yes but ...

Yes but, are you clinging to god and guns.

The bitter is NOT the problem. It's the clingy part. I do not think those folks cling to god and guns because they lost their jobs. They clung to those things while they had their jobs.

Are they bitter ... yes. Hillary is playing the wrong card on this one.

[MethuenProgressive]

59. Oh, no! And every BO follower here said every word was well chosen and His meaning perfectly clear!

BO spins away from His DU backers - again!
:rofl:

[MercutioATC]

75. That's not true. Many here said the word choice could have been better.

They were intelligent enough, however, to realize that what he said wasn't an attack on small-town America.

You really need to be more careful when using absolute statements like "every BO follower".

[leftofcool]

60. Yet no apology to rural voters

[MethuenProgressive]

61. from link, voters heard from:

"I was very insulted by Barack Obama," a woman says, followed by a man saying: "It just shows how out of touch Barack Obama is."

Says a second woman: "I'm not clinging to my faith out of frustration and bitterness. I find that my faith is very uplifting."

[JKaiser]

86. He needs too.. He is making himself look like a arrogant jerk.. Maybe his true colors

[islandmkl]

62. he may have 'mangled' the sentence...

but he did not mangle the truth...

people are bitter, worried, scared, depressed, and hopeless concerning our current state of affairs...

not everyone, of course, but far too many to be fooled by this false controversy...

Obama's words are not what is wrong with this country, and people know that...

to deny the underlying feelings you can find on any street in any town or city in America is to deny that THERE IS A PROBLEM WITH THIS NATION...

you deny...most of us want a change in direction and a great number of people are willing to listen to the REAL message, no matter how 'mangled' a couple of sentences can appear to be...

[robcon]

64. I think you overstate the issue to try to salvage something from the statement.

You statement, islandmkl, "people are bitter, worried, scared, depressed, and hopeless concerning our current state of affairs..." is nonsense.

I think this is pure spin. Some people are some of those things. Most working-class people are not any of those things. Get real. I'm working class (work for a retailer) and Obama's accusation is insulting. Most people don't take their cues for how to feel about their life from who is the president of the country.

I'll vote for Obama - anything would be better than another Republican - but Clinton would make a better president.

[islandmkl]

65. insulting?

with all that is going on in this country...you are being 'insulted' by this?

YOU can believe there are only SOME people...

that is exactly why HRC is not the presumptive candidate she was 'ordained' to be...

explain why BO has more money, more donors, more SUPPORT across the board...

because things are not going well in this country, and MOST, not SOME, people know we must make changes to salvage our nation...

spin, my ass....sounds fox-like...

[robcon]

71. More spin... you doubt that working class people are insulted by Obama?

Are you that removed from middle class people to believe that their religious beliefs, their pro-gun/pro-hunting beliefs and their anti-immigrant/anti-NAFTA beliefs have no other basis than their bitterness at their life?

As I wrote above... get a life, or at least talk to real people if you don't have one. Don't suggest "more money, more donors, more SUPPORT across the board" is anything but spin to offset the offense that Obama made against believers, pro-gun people and anti-NAFTA people.

[CANDO]

88. Get real robcon....

the fucking Republicans have been exploiting guns and religion for at least two generations now. It may not apply directly to you because you choose to play along with the caricature world that the corpo-media created out of Hillary's feigned indignation. See though the bullshit for once. The man was not attacking small town America. I'm not college educated, but damn sure knew what the man was saying and he was spot on. Get a clue already if you don't think people do "cling to guns and religion" at the ballot box. It's called Republican Electioneering 101. I'm just god damned fed up with this motherfucking election when we have people in our own party who are just as fucked in the head as the evil bastards we've been fighting against. Hillary plays along with the Republican play book because she is fucking DESPERATE. Her desperation scares the hell out of me. Sorry people, I thought I could actually vote for her if she could win by legit means, but every day she acts more Republican by her scorched earth campaigning, it turns me against voting for her IF she somehow "won" the nomination. There is something you Hillary backers have never come to grips with, and that is this nomination was NEVER HERS FOR THE TAKING! That is why we have elections. You're "bitter" because this was not a coronation. Get over it. Millions of us Democrats knew from day one she would never be our first choice. But the corpo-media helped create her into this heir apparent to the throne of the Presidency. Didn't happen, get over it.

[TankLV]

79. and he's LOSING that "support"...

he's losing any "gains" he may have made in the past...

HA HA....

[TankLV]

78. "Obama's accusation is insulting." That's it in a nutshell...

no amount of spin by all obama's campaign staff here on DU can change that...

[TankLV]

77. OBAMA is what is "wrong" with this country. PERIOD...

NOT
READY
FOR
PRIME
TIME

[muryan]

91. I was under the impression that this country had problems

before this presidential primary started. Apparently i'm just way off, and Obama is responsible for all the evils of the world. Thanks for clearing that up.

[haymakeragain]

100. Oh My God, like that Crown Royal shot was "just right"

Obama should have worded it differently but what he said was spot on. He didn't say everybody, but he did speak the truth, many are bitter. But Hillary's sudden rush to become some blue-collar maiden is "prime time"?

That's an amazing mis-characterization of what happened. You don't really believe that do you?

[indimuse]

63. curious...

For a man that likes to talk as thought 'WORDS' matter the most, Obama sure is spending a lot of his time running from his statements.

[harun]

68. Why do you think that is? Don't you notice that we haven't discussed

an issue for at least two months?

Rovian tactics at its finest, argue about nonsensical bullshit so no one notices the wrong person gets nominated/elected. That way no one discusses: health care, taxes, jobs, the economy, the occupation of Iraq, etc.

[TankLV]

80. yeah - words DO matter - and obama is certainly screwing up ROYALLY...

and don't forget he CONTINUES to INSULT gay persons - ME - too...

[BearSquirrel2]

90. I believe ...

I believe all the pro gay marriage people are out of the election now. Why single out Obama?

[TankLV]

93. What the fuck are you spewing? you make no sense whatsoever...

just like the rest of you obamabots...

[haymakeragain]

102. You are way, way wrong, sorry to point it out to you, but

that's the truth. Plus it is obvious that the gay marraige issue is clouding your rhetoric. The words Obama used, in that particular order were not perfectly placed, but the sentiment is spot on. People are bitter and they are gripping onto those sentiments and to religion and to guns. But his wording has been chopped up too. 95% of the times I've seen it referenced it only includes guns and god, right-wing wedge issues for certain, and I MEAN FOR CERTAIN. So for supposed progressives to be band-wagon jumping onto right-wing memes is beyond the pale. So stop it.

As for the gay marriage issue, please stop holding the Democratic party and our front-runner hostage to your tunnel visioned desires. We on the left have been with the GLBT community all along. Me personally too. We have taken hit after hit after hit and stayed on your side, our side, the only side, equality. Now we have a candidate that we like better than your chosen candidate and you are beating us up over our guy wanting to take an incremental step on the gay marraige issue and that is a deal breaker, the point of your spear? Did you ever think that you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater? Obama might be backing "civil unions" over "marraige" because it is the right thing politically at this moment. He has stated that he is for equality, but that is not enough. I don't remember Hillarious saying "it's gay marraige all the way or nothing", did I miss that? Please show me if I did.

We are on your side, stop pretending that we are not. You treat Obama and his supporters like we are fundies with regard to "marraige". We are not, so again, stop it.

[Malidictus Maximus]

67. What he said was quite accurate.

The way he said it sucked.

Now, I like the guy, great speaker, charismatic, honest for a politician... but I don't understand how anyone could say that his remarks DID NOT imply a condescending attitude towards churchgoers and firearms enthusiasts (no, it is NOT about hunting). The *CLEAR* implication was that guns and God are the crutches of losers, at least clear to the people in the 'fly over' states.

Now, one could make an argument that (fulminations and fanaticism regarding) guns, god, gays and immigrants are things used to distract voters who have been screwed over by the corporate machinery, are wedge issues used by Rovian operators, or are opiates offered to the masses, and many make those arguments well, even those I disagree with.

That doesn't change the fact that you don't have to be a right winger, or a Hillary partisan (I'm neither) to say that those comments really do sound like a Harvard educated lawyer condescendingly noting that those poor, ignorant folks don't know what is best for them (again, might be the truth- it will go down in history as amazing that so many people being screwed over by the Republicans and Republican policies kept voting for them due to the magnificently effective use of wedge issues and other strategies)

[Postman]

69. It wasn't a "clear implication" at all...

I think it has alot to do with your ability to think.

His point was that these people have turned to other things for security because the Government, due to conservative policy's, has been turned into the boogeyman (see Thomas Frank's "What's The Matter With Kansas")

[Bluenorthwest]

73. Sure and of course

But while I agree with his points in general, they are very much in opposition to the Senator's own actions in other states, where he himself campaigned with a 'Faith and Family Tour' that used preachers and singers well known for divisive Fundamentalist attitudes to pander to religious voters. When confronted with complaints about the openly spoken anti-gay messages on that tour, the Senator defended the bigots, said he would always be listening to them and called them 'good, decent and moral people' while refusing to apologize or even to promise there would be no more open speech against any minority by any religious group in the Senator's name.
In some places, it seems, religious bigots are clinging to faith, and in other places, religious bigots are merely expressing family values. McClurkin is 'Faith and Family' but the same relgion in Penn is 'clinging' out of desperation? How does a candidate produce a long series of religious based events and then criticize the religion of others with a straight face?
The big picture is what needs to be addressed here. Why is religious bigotry acceptable in SC to the point of paying for bigots to speak bigotry without apology, and yet in other places it is like a symptom of economic desperation?

[TankLV]

81. because it involves GAY PEOPLE - he's the WORST person in his "record" on gay issues...

and CONTINUES to insult us on that one...!!!

[haymakeragain]

105. You are over-playing your hand.

You might want to rethink it.

[Life Long Dem]

70. This is nonsense.

Somebody say they are not angry, upset, bitter or whatever word you want to use over Bush and the state we are in.
If you can say that your on the wrong side.

So why are we wasting our time with this then. Because once again Clinton avoids the issues.

[nvme]

72. someone please help feed the media beast

It is apparent that the media is hungry for a story. After so many years of being spoon fed by the administration the media has come to expect its feeding. The days of the media going out to forage for its own nourishment for truth are over. It has come to crave the pettiness and lies.(not to imply anything about hill and bama's latest bickerings are or are not true). the fact is the media is no longer guardians of truth.
Leafing through the headlines, Oil has hit another high on speculation that a pipeline is not running at full capacity. The Dollar has fallen yet again. cHina is buy up large chunks of various companies. These are significant stories that affect EVERYONES'S dinner table. If they want to talk about "The Surge" then perhaps the surge in food would be apropo.
We as concerned individuals must not get caught up in the base arguments of who is elitest or not. the question that are tantamount are whether our economy is collapsing. Insisting our candidates talk about, even better do something about these issues, would be nice. Yet the issues are not being adressed.
We need effective leadership. At this point, No clear leaders are emerging because we keep buying the hype. If you keep swallowing the bullshit that is being put out there then you in fact deserve to eat it. "Not this time" should be the mantra for all.

[acmavm]

74. Of all the things this guy has said and done, this is one thing that

I agree with him on. I think he was being honest and had a momentary slip and spoke the truth.

Of all the things for people to get pissed off about, I really don't think this qualifies.

[TankLV]

76. no doubt about it - his campaign is IMPLODING...

Hillary got MORE votes - close to TEN PERCENT - in the Clark County re-vote this past Saturday - now that it was done FAIRLY without INTIMIDATION and SHENANIGANS by obama's campaign...

when it was dcne originally last January - they were only one or two percentage points apart - altho HILLARY still won it all...

now to take away the IMPROPERLY gained delegates from obama to rectify the situation...

[9119495]

82. Except you'd have to take from her in New York

where the voting machines gave Obama zero votes in some precincts...but that would probably lead you to think Hillary Clinton's shitty campaign is imploding, no?

She is done. She lies. She is shit.

[haymakeragain]

103. You're a one issue voter, obviously,

and think that it is ok to beat down Obama over his not giving you every bit of what you want. "Marraige" is a word, the law is the law. If he supports equal rights regarding the law, then he gives you all that you are legally entitled to. It is your job yourself to fight for that word. Have at it.

[JoFerret]

83. I think he said exactly what he meant to say

And to me it is in keeping with his other words and behavior.
Folks - this is a divisive figure and he has many snowed. The mask slips off all the time. Supercilious and patronizing attitudes are hard to hide well.
He has shown himself capable of deeply sexist campaign tactics and used the race to perfection.
And as for trashing the Clinton economic record and linking it to Bush - he should apologize for that not for saying what he thinks about the white rural working class.

[KansDem]

84. So?

How much of the King's English has Bush mangled over the years? And how much of that did CorpMedia cover with as much excruciating detail?

And why we're at it, why hasn't CorpMedia asked Bush why he sat and did nothing after being informed by his chief-of-staff that America was under attack?

Seems to be some inconsistency here...

[WyldRogue]

85. And the hypocrisy begins...

... some of you think Obama's 'bitter' comment is worse than the * Administration lying us into an unjust war on a country that had nothing to do with 9/11, outing a NOC agent, lied time and time again as I cannot post EACH damn lie that * and his ilk have spewed forth for over 8 years but god be damned, Obama uttered the words 'people are bitter'

It is this exact hypocrisy that now swayed me over to the Obama camp as Clinton has gotten off the issues and decided to run a smear campaign since the start of the PA Electorate invasion.

If his words are so damn harsh, then you clowns must think that *'s words are 'golden flowers falling upon your heads like heavenly feathers from our Father above'

Shame as I held out hope that Clinton would stay on the issues and she has not done so....

And I am only 1 Independent voice...

[Orsino]

87. He shouldn't be waffling now. He was right.

It's the MSM and the opposition that's mangling his words.

[tidy_bowl]

92. He only looks worse...

...with all this 'explaining'. Why can't he just apologize for saying something stupid and the people for forgiveness. It would all go away then and be a non-issue. Quit the spin.

[haymakeragain]

104. It's already a non-issue.

He just said he worded it badly, no biggie. I concede that he could have worded it better.

[treestar]

94. All this furor over that?

What hypersensitive babies were are becoming in this country.

Personally, I hate it when they fawn on us and go on about how great we are. As if we are that type of weak person who likes that.

[JoFerret]

95. He meant what he said

imo

[TankLV]

99. except when he didn't - which is an awful lot it seems....

words matter - indeed...