Carter Says Hamas May Accept Right of Israel to Exist (Update1)

[FourScore]

Source: Bloomberg

Former U.S. President Jimmy Carter, who helped broker peace between Egypt and Israel in 1978, said that Israel's enemy Hamas may accept, under certain circumstances, the Jewish state's right to exist.

Hamas leaders told Carter that the group would accept a peace agreement negotiated by the leader of the rival Fatah group, Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas, on condition that the agreement is submitted to the Palestinian people for approval, the former president said in a speech in Jerusalem.

"Hamas leaders said they would accept a Palestinian state on the 1967 border and the right of Israel to live as a neighbor, provided the agreement was submitted to the Palestinian people for overall approval," Carter said....

SNIP

...Syria believes that nearly all its differences with Israel have been resolved and that talks "just need to be reconvened," Carter said in Jerusalem after meeting with Syrian officials in Damascus. Syria is eager that the U.S. play a "strong role" in talks with Israel, while in the meantime, the U.S. is opposing talks, Carter said...



Read more: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aZISzFwf8RY8&refer=home

[mulsh]

1. See, that's why Carter should never be allowed to talk to Hamas.

No wonder Israel didn't assign him a security detail.


:sarcasm:

[rAVES]

3. What you actually think the US or Israel want any reasons to have to acknowlege Hamas?

not on your life, this would be a disaster for them.

[RaleighNCDUer]

4. Spreading democracy in the middle east only counts if they

elect people we like.

[Wilms]

7. Right.

Or if we Shock and Awe them with it.

[Igel]

31. Precisely.

He's gotten a great concession from Hamas, getting them to repeat the same offer they've made repeatedly.

Oddly, he seems to think it's novel. By late '70s standards, it is, I guess. It helps that he didn't read the fine print: Give us everything you've got to give, and we'll give you a temporary truce, the maximum allowed. Then, when the truce expires, we can negotiate from a peace treaty: Of course, you'll have only Tel Aviv and Haifa to bargain with, but that's cool by us. And if we don't like that, we'll offer another truce for the Negev, and work on getting the rest of the waqf back 10 years later.

Because it's waqf land. And that's non-negotiable.

[JeanGrey]

41. ROFL. Jimmy needs to go home and stay there. Hamas

will never change.

[ohio2007]

79. well...isn't this the definition of INSANITY ?

Doing the exact same thing over and over yet expecting a different result every time

[OregonBlue]

2. Go to Yahoo and rate this story up!!! Link below.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080421/ap_on_re_mi_ea/carter_israel

[alfredo]

5. This would be great. It throws a wrench in bush's phony peace accord talks.

You can't negotiate peace if you exclude major players in the conflict.

[KillCapitalism]

6. Carter accomplished more in this one trip

than that pathetic excuse for a Secretary of State we have has accomplished in the past 4 years.

[tomtomtom]

49. I happen to like our first black

Sec O' the State, very noble to not even think of a run for VP under the repubs.
I think she's been through enough.

[harun]

60. That is because the current administration doesn't want peace

they supposedly support Israel, but in reality they just use AIPAC political support to meet their ends.

[Javaman]

8. wow, who would have thought that opening a dialog would result in this????

not moron* or his* room full of dopes, that's for sure.

I wonder what revenge condi, I have never ever had an original idea ever, rice is plotting against Carter at this moment?

funny to think that at the beginning of this year moron* stated that there would be a peace accord in the middle east, I bet he* didn't expect it to come in the form of a former Democratic President, huh? LOL

[pegleg]

9. If this is for real, it's great news for all. Israel should not be asked to

agree to only one thing. And that would be that they should relinquish their right to pray at the wailing wall in Jerusalem - something they were not allowed to do prior to 1967. Otherwise they should cautiously talk to Hamas. Hopefully the rockets will cease.

[pegleg]

10. It sounded too good to be true, but maybe all is not dead yet

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080421/ap_on_re_mi_ea/syria_hamas_israel

[Uncle Joe]

11. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, whereismyparty.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

12. Hamas offers truce in return for 1967 borders

Source: MSNBC

DAMASCUS, Syria - The leader of Hamas said Monday that his Palestinian militant group would offer Israel a 10-year "hudna," or truce, as implicit proof of recognition of Israel if it withdrew from all lands it seized in the 1967 Middle East War.

Khaled Mashaal told The Associated Press that he made the offer to former U.S. President Jimmy Carter in talks on Saturday. "We have offered a truce if Israel withdraws to the 1967 borders, a truce of 10 years as a proof of recognition," Mashaal said.

In his comments Monday, Mashaal used the Arabic word "hudna," meaning truce, which is more concrete than "tahdiya" — a period of calm — which Hamas often uses to describe a simple cease-fire.

"Hudna" implies a recognition of the other party's existence.

Read more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24235665/

[no_hypocrisy]

13. And what happens on Day One after ten years has passed?

Does Israel get the land back? Does Hamas start shelling Israel proper?

How about something permanent?

[Warpy]

16. Neither side trusts the other, and it's no wonder.

I think that ten years is the trial period. I doubt either side could muster much enthusiasm for restarting the war after they'd had a peaceful and prosperous 10 years.

I doubt Israel would do it because it involves abandoning a lot of real estate and it involves absorbing a huge population it has no infrastructure to support. The West Bank was colonized mostly because housing in Israel is prohibitively expensive.

However, it's a start. Nobody ever believed the Egypt-Israel peace would have lasted this long 30 years ago. A ten year peace there would be a miracle and, if respected by all sides, would probably be the start to real security for Israel and for the Palestinian Arabs.

[RaleighNCDUer]

17. This isn't the Civilization game - the end of a truce does not mean

automatic hostilities.

Ten year truce would mean ten years of no conflict - of finding political solutions to intransigent problems. It would be a cooling off period during which a functioning Palastinian state could be established. After ten years of peace, neither side would be anxious to return to conflict.

Why would Israel get back lands that never belonged to it?

[ohio2007]

78. another 37th parallel in the making is what you are suggesting

The "truce" will be broken by many incidents of rocket attacks...err...in the name of self defense....accidental target range rocket practice

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

18. You have to crawl before you can walk.

This has been a point of major conflict for decades... a 10-year truce would be an enormous first step.

[Ian David]

21. If we build at least one Club Med in Palestine during that 10 years, the truce will become permanent

[JerseygirlCT]

58. Exactly.

That's not a deal I'd take, I'll tell you that.

[ohio2007]

77. Hamas couldn't sit idle for ten years. They will wipe the name of Israel off the map well before the

ten year cease fire expires. Turn over the land and watch them continue the "scorched earth" policy within one week of the turnover.

[Crunchy Frog]

14. Really, I would hope that if Israel were to withdraw to its 1967 borders,

that that would be enough for permanent peace. Not that this is ever going to happen.

[JerseygirlCT]

59. The problem for Israel, is who is going to enforce that peace?

Who will enforce the deal?

The US? Alone?

Until the other Arab nations decide they are interested in peace, a solution isn't going to happen. Until enough pressure is brought to bear on the solution, it won't happen.

The peace deal between Egypt and Israel worked because Egypt actually gave a hoot about how they were seen in the world, and because the US was a respected entity in the region, and to both partners. That's not at all the current situation.

[MercutioATC]

15. That's a major concession by Hamas standards...

...and would also be a major concession for Israel.

I like to think that war breeds war and peace breeds peace. I'd like to see this be at least a 20-year offer so we could get an entire generation of Israelis and Palestinians who have lived under the truce.

[Roland99]

19. It's a deal that makes sense to me.

Much has changed in Israel's military capability in the last 41 years. The occupied territories no longer need be.

But, will Hamas keep to their word for 10 years? 5 years? 2 months?



Peace has to start somewhere, though.

[JoDog]

23. The offer only covers Hamas

not other splinter groups. There's also a chance that the rank-and-file could see this as a sign that the leadership has gone against the wishes of Allah, and stop taking orders.

[darue]

34. the rank and file will get to vote n/t

[JeanGrey]

42. Much has changed militarily? Like what? Israel could wipe

out that entire part of the continent if they so desired.

[Roland99]

51. You just answered your own question.

[JeanGrey]

54. Maybe I misconstrued your answer. Hamas is not to be trusted.

They will never keep a peace with Israel.

[Roland99]

62. But how can peace be achieved without the first steps toward it?

You want the status quo?

[JeanGrey]

71. No - but you cannot expect Israel to give up everything and

be set up for the slaughter it isn't happening.

[annabanana]

72. everything? what's "everything"?. . . n/t

[JeanGrey]

73. Oh maybe the right to exist for starters?

[Roland99]

75. Um, give up everything? No, just the lands they occupy illegally.

[JeanGrey]

76. What illegal lands would that be? The ones Israel won when they

were attacked? Perhaps you think we should give California, Texas, New Mexico and the rest to Mexico as well?

[Torn_Scorned_Ignored]

20. Jimmy Carter

talked to the Hamas leader on his recent visit.
He probably should have gotten the crystal engraving Bush was given.

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/01/11/
A group of Catholic nuns offered Bush another inspirational boost, presenting the president with a slab of crystal with a carved phrase from the sermon’s so-called Beatitudes: “Blessed are those who are peacemakers, for they will be called children of God.”

[Ian David]

22. And when Bush touched it, his eyeballs started to bleed and his hands caught fire. n/t

[Hugabear]

24. LOL - Israel give up the land they STOLE in 1967?

I don't see that happening. Israel will refuse this latest overture, and then they'll blame Hamas for the resulting hostilities.

[Indenturedebtor]

30. Stole?

In May 1967, Egypt expelled the United Nations Emergency Force (UNEF) from the Sinai Peninsula, which had been stationed there since 1957 (following the 1956 Sinai invasion to allow for a free Suez Canal), to provide a peace-keeping buffer zone. In reaction to Israeli-Syrian tensions, Egypt amassed 1000 tanks and 100,000 soldiers on the border, closed the Straits of Tiran to all ships flying Israeli flags or carrying strategic materials, and called for unified Arab action against Israel.<4> In response, on June 5, 1967, Israel launched a pre-emptive attack<5> against Egypt's airforce. Jordan, which had signed a mutual defence treaty with Egypt on May 30, then attacked western Jerusalem and Netanya.<6><7><8> At the war's end, Israel had gained control of the Sinai Peninsula, the Gaza Strip, the West Bank, eastern Jerusalem, and the Golan Heights. The results of the war affect the geopolitics of the region to this day.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6_day_war

I hardly think "stole" is the proper term. If my neighbor comes over with a gun and attempts to "steal" my house, and I "steal" his instead so that he won't try to "steal" my house again then who is the culprit here? Israel is no angel of a state, but try to see both sides of the issue. I am not a bigot so I am not blind to the cause of the Palestinians...

I don't know that Israel will accept this but they should enter into negotiations here at the very least if not outright accept it. The Golan however is an issue between Israel and Syria entirely. When you go there you will see why Israel had to take the Golan, or just read about the 6 day war.

Good job Carter in getting something started here.

[darue]

35. so you think Israel occupied Egyptian or Jordanian land?

the Palestinians were trapped in the middle and didn't start or engage in hostilities.

[Zynx]

37. Israel was attacked in a war of extermination. They took land to give

themselves a little more breathing space.

[Hugabear]

39. "they took land"

And I'm sure that all the Palestinians living on that land that was taken see it that way.

[darue]

44. NO - they weren't attacked they preemptively attacked Egypt because they assumed

American efforts were well underway to smooth things out and prevent the war. Johnson was PISSED.

[JerseygirlCT]

61. Just like, say, every other major country in the history of the world?

They didn't "steal" anything. They won it in a war in which they were attacked by nearly all their neighbors - neighbors with the intent to destroy Israel entirely.

As I've said before, if we were going to redraw boundaries from every military change in borders, we'd be busy for thousands of years just figuring it all out. Europe alone would take centuries.

There's been plenty of wrong done by all sides in the ME. We can't start from some artificial time point and say "here", THIS is where things were as they should be, and where they should return. All of that is part of the negotiation.

Israel was willing to negotiate the Negev with Egypt for peace. They might be willing to do the same if they ever have a real negotiating partner for the Palestinians. But that's theirs to negotiate.

[Ian David]

25. The Green Line

<snip>

From the 1960s onward, the term "Palestine" was regularly used in political contexts. Various declarations, such as the 1988 proclamation of a State of Palestine by the PLO referred to a country called Palestine, defining its borders with differing degrees of clarity, including the annexation of the whole of the State of Israel.

Most recently, the Palestine draft constitution refers to borders based on the West Bank and Gaza Strip prior to the 1967 Six-Day War. This so-called Green Line follows the 1949 armistice line; the permanent borders are yet to be negotiated. Furthermore, since 1994, there has been a Palestinian Authority controlling varying portions of historic Palestine.




The Origins and Evolution of the Palestine Problem:1917-1988

The question of Palestine was brought before the United Nations shortly after the end of the Second World War. The origins of the Palestine problem as an international issue, however, lie in events occurring towards the end of the First World War. These events led to a League of Nations decision to place Palestine under the administration of Great Britain as the Mandatory Power under the Mandates System adopted by the League. In principle, the Mandate was meant to be in the nature of a transitory phase until Palestine attained the status of a fully independent nation, a status provisionally recognized in the League's Covenant, but in fact the Mandate's historical evolution did not result in the emergence of Palestine as an independent nation.

The decision on the Mandate did not take into account the wishes of the people of Palestine, both Arabs and Jews, despite the Covenant's requirements that "the wishes of these communities must be a principal consideration in the selection of the Mandatory". This assumed special significance because, almost five years before receiving the mandate from the League of Nations, the British Government had given commitments to the Zionist Organization regarding the establishment of a Jewish national home in Palestine, for which Zionist leaders had pressed a claim of historical connection since their ancestors had lived in Palestine two thousand years earlier before dispersing in the Diaspora.

During the period of the Mandate, the Zionist Organization worked to secure the establishment of a Jewish national home in Palestine, where both Jews and Arabs could live side by side. The Arab people of Palestine felt this design to be a violation of their rights. They also viewed it as an infringement of assurances of independence given by the Allied Powers to Arab leaders in return for their support during the war. The result was mounting resistance to the Mandate by all Arabs, followed by Arab violence against the Jewish population.

More:
http://www.solarnavigator.net/geography/palestine.htm

[Name removed]

36. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hack89]

26. I wonder how the right of return fits into all of this

that is the real sticking point.

[JerseygirlCT]

32. Me too. nt

[SlingBlade]

27. Sounds reasonable to me, Why Not ?

This is something that most of those who have been serious about peace
have brought to the table.

If this is what it takes then I say DO IT.

[acetylyne]

29. Exactly why the US and Israel didn't want him to go

With a real peace offer on the table it makes it that much harder to keep up the gazan seige when Israel's 'main enemy' is willing to put down their guns.

so what now Israel? how are you going to snake out of peace this time?

[JeanGrey]

55. They aren't willing to "put down their guns". They never will be.

[Indydem]

28. How GENEROUS of them! n/t

[Dreamer Tatum]

33. What an amazing beau geste

Signaling a willingness to admit someone's right to exist.

These are truly exciting times.

[ohio2007]

38. They offer a ten years "cease fire"....then what happens when the time is up?

They have their '67 borders secure and take the rest saying "all bets are off" consider yourself wiped off the map ?

[Solon]

40. Ten years is a pretty good chunk of time for changes to be made...

If the borders are back to what they were in 1967, and the Palestinians allowed some stability to build a sustainable economy and a state of their own, then, in 10 years time, even Hamas will most likely not want to disrupt that by trying to attack Israel again. Basically everyone would take a breather, so to speak, and stability in the region would actually decrease discontent in the Palestinian population, especially if they are left alone to their own devices in economic development and political freedom.

[ohio2007]

81. 1967,1977,1987,1997,2007--> only need to observe what happens in six months

Golan heights is Syrian land taken in '67, if they sign a peace deal, will Syria stop supporting Hamas demand for a return to the 1948 border?

[PanchoBass]

43. Dialogue doesn't hurt

I don't know why some are allergic to talking to these dueling factions. There is nothing to lose really.

[darue]

45. Carter calls Gaza blockade a crime and atrocity - Palestinians in Gaza being "starved to death"

Carter calls Gaza blockade a crime and atrocity
Fri Apr 18, 2008 1:39 AM ET

By Jonathan Wright

CAIRO (Reuters) - Former U.S. President Jimmy Carter called the blockade of Gaza a crime and an atrocity on Thursday and said U.S. attempts to undermine the Islamist movement Hamas had been counterproductive.

Speaking at the American University in Cairo after talks with Hamas leaders from Gaza, Carter said Palestinians in Gaza were being "starved to death", receiving fewer calories a day than people in the poorest parts of Africa.

"It's an atrocity what is being perpetrated as punishment on the people in Gaza. it's a crime... I think it is an abomination that this continues to go on," Carter said.

Israel has been blockading Gaza most of the time since Hamas took control of the impoverished coastal strip in June last year, allowing only basic supplies to enter.

Israel has not accepted Hamas proposals for a truce including an end to Hamas rocket attacks on Israel and to Israeli attacks on Hamas personnel in Gaza and the West Bank. Israeli officials say a truce would enable Hamas to rearm.

Carter said Israel and its ally the United States were trying to make the quality of life in Gaza markedly worse than in the West Bank, where the rival Fatah group is in control.

"I think politically speaking this has worked even to strengthen the popularity of Hamas and to the detriment of the popularity of Fatah," he added. The United States has been trying to achieve the opposite outcome.

"EXAMPLE TO BE EMULATED"

Carter, who helped make peace between Egypt and Israel while president in the 1970s, said the Hamas leaders he has met so far told him they would accept a peace agreement with Israel negotiated by Mahmoud Abbas -- the Fatah leader and Palestinian president -- if the Palestinians approved it in a referendum.

Israel and the United States say they refuse to deal with Hamas as long as the Islamist movement does not recognize Israel's right to exist and renounce violence.

But Carter said Hamas, which won Palestinian parliamentary elections in 2006, had to be involved in any arrangements that could lead to peace.

"One of the reasons I wanted to come and meet with the Syrians and Hamas was to set an example that might be emulated by others... I know that there are some officials in the Israeli government that are quite willing to meet with Hamas and maybe that will happen in the near future," he added.

Carter's talks in Cairo were with former Palestinian Foreign Minister Mahmoud al-Zahar and former Interior Minister Saeed Seyam, who did not speak to reporters.

Zahar and Seyam came to Cairo on Wednesday after the Israeli authorities refused to let Carter into Gaza from the Israeli side. Carter has already met a West Bank leader from Hamas and is expected to meet overall leader Khaled Meshaal in Damascus.

Earlier on Thursday, Carter met Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak. No details were available from either side.

[darue]

46. Israel's war on orphans

The fate of hundreds of orphans is in the balance after Israel's army attacked their schools and residence. Israel has of late been waging a dirty war against established Islamic institutions in this southern West Bank town of nearly 200,000, the largest in the West Bank, Hebron.

Under the rubric of fighting Hamas, Israeli troops and agents of the Shin Bet, Israel's notorious domestic security agency, have been raiding and vandalising charities, orphanages, boarding schools and affiliated businesses.

The unprecedented campaign began mid-February when Israeli troops stormed two orphanages run by the Islamic Charitable Society (ISC), one of the oldest charities in Palestine, and the local Muslim Youth Association building. Having thoroughly terrorised hundreds of sleeping children, the soldiers moved to one building after the other, confiscating furniture, smashing glass, looting valuable items and leaving a trail of destruction.

Before they left, the Zionist vandals handed charity officials a tersely worded order signed by the local army commander stating that all the schools, orphanages, eateries, apartment buildings and support businesses owned by the charity were confiscated and that the Israeli army was the sole legal proprietor of all the expropriated premises.

As to the fate of more than 1,000 orphaned boys and girls, poor students, and charity employees, the army said: "it is none of our business. We are only carrying out orders."

Justifying the harsh action, Israeli military officials claimed that the ICS was connected with Hamas, a claim Hebron civil leaders and charity officials vehemently deny. Al-Ahram Weekly spoke to Mohamed Farrah, a lawyer and legal advisor to the charity.

"When we approached them, cited generalities and abstract issues, such as teaching the Quran and Islamic history and encouraging students to lead an Islamic lifestyle based on moral purity. I told them that if these things were indicting evidence, then the entire Muslim world from Jakarta to Casablanca belonged to Hamas. You are making a superpower out of Hamas," Farrah said.

Farrah argues that the Israelis are waging a dirty war on Islam as a religion under the pretext of fighting Hamas and other Islamic organisations opposed to the Israeli occupation of Palestine. "This is simply a brazen violation of our religious and human rights. Israel is an occupying power and it has no right to prevent us from teaching or practising our religion. If there is any tangible violation, let us know what it is, but making insinuations and concocting charges is unacceptable," he said.

Farrah urges the international community to intervene "because obviously we can't receive justice under Israel's unjust justice system. Here Israel is policeman, plaintiff, judge and enemy combined. How can we possibly receive justice under such circumstances when the occupation authorities view all Palestinians as guilty even if proven innocent?"

Demonstrating utter disregard for due process, the Israeli army went as far as raiding the kitchens and clothes inventories of the two orphanages, confiscating diary products, frozen meat, fruit and vegetables, refrigerators and baking ovens.

Meanwhile, the deadline for vacating the orphanages and boarding schools expired 8 April. Hundreds of orphans, with the encouragement of charity officials and foreign peace activists, decided to stay put "because this is our home and our school and we have no other place to go."

Last week, a group of Christian Peacemaking Team (CPT) activists from North America and Europe spent a night with the children at the main orphanage to boost their morale and help protect them from an expected storming of the building by the Israeli army.

On 7 April, the Popular Committee for Supporting Orphanages, composed of local community leaders, hosted a press conference at the Hebron Girls Orphanage, with dozens of peace activists, clergymen and journalists as well as some of the victimised orphan girls attending.

Farrah spoke at the conference, accusing the Israeli authorities of lying with regard to the charity's alleged connections with Hamas.

"They are making sweeping charges and allegations, but when we challenge them to prove these charges and allegations, they tell us they have secret evidence. I challenge our accusers to prove their charges, and if they can't, they should have the guts to admit that they made a mistake," he said.

Mohamed Salhab, head of the Muslim Youth Society, which was also closed down, argues that Israel had no right to invade, let alone close down and confiscate, Palestinian institutions. "We are based in Area-A, which according to the Oslo Accords, falls under exclusive Palestinian control. This is therefore an act of sheer aggression that is illegal and immoral."

Salhab accuses the Israeli army of acting like "gangsters and common criminals". "Where in the world would regular army troops storm nurseries and kindergartens and orphanages and terrorise children as little as four or even three years old?"

Salhab notes that some of the children are now having nightmares and displaying other signs of stress as a result of the storming by Israeli soldiers.

During the conference, Rabbi Arik Aschermann, head of Rabbis for Human Rights, spoke to the audience by speakerphone, saying that the closure and confiscation of the orphanages and boarding schools and affiliated institutions was "incompatible with the Jewish concept of justice". "If the army has any evidence, let them present it before a court of law." Aschermann added that Jews who follow the Torah could not accept what the Israeli army is doing in Hebron.

One US CPT member said he and his fellow activists would be at the orphanage if the Israeli army decides to storm the premises again. "We will videotape them and expose them all over the world," he said. Following the press conference, the peace activists moved to one of the targeted boarding schools, located in the Dweirban neighbourhood of Hebron's western suburb.

"Our people back home think that Israel is a true democracy, that it upholds human rights and civil liberties. Now, having witnessed Israeli behaviour, I can say that Israel is a fascist and terrorist state," said one activist from Canada.

A number of civic leaders in Hebron have expressed outrage at "the disgraceful reactions" of the Palestinian Authority (PA) to the Israeli army onslaught against local Islamic charities and institutions. Ahmed Kawasmeh said he was "110 per cent sure" that the Israeli campaign against the charities was "fully coordinated with the PA and the government of Salam Fayyad."

Kawasmeh added: "PA behaviour from the very inception suggests that they are silent accomplices in all of this. The PA simply wants to take over these charities in order to appease the enemies of Islam, especially the United States. Eventually, they want to dump thousands of orphan children unto the streets in order to obtain a certificate of good conduct from America and Israel."

Earlier this week, a representative of the Palestinian Interior Minister summoned an official from the Muslim Youth Association to propose a "deal" whereby Israel would cancel the closure and confiscation in exchange for the ISC administration agreeing to place the entire association under the authority of the PA Waqf (Religious Endowments) Ministry.

The Muslim Youth Association official dismissed the proposed deal as a "cheap conspiracy", arguing that the charitable institutions targeted by Israel were licensed and regularly overseen by the PA's interior and education ministries. One charity official intimated that donors in general don't trust the PA and wouldn't donate money to institutions run by Fatah operatives.

"If they take over the ISC, the society will collapse in a few months. This is why we would prefer that the Israelis close it down rather than see Fatah run it."

PA officials in Hebron dismissed "these strange charges" as "fictional". Hussein Al-Araj, Hebron's PA-appointed governor, said the Palestinian government was trying to solve the problem quietly and away from the media.

[Bonobo]

47. How dare he try to make peace!!

[burrowowl]

48. How dare Obama say

he shouldn't talk to Hamas!

GO JIMMY CARTER!

[Canuckistanian]

50. Is it really that simple?

Can Hamas really control it's radical element in exchange for statehood?

Or has no one ever asked before?

[Psephos]

52. Did Carter even make it up the airplane steps before Hamas reneged?

I give Carter points for sincerity.

But that's all he gets. Hamas is playing him for a maroon. I wonder how many laughs they had at his expense. They would literally rather die as martyrs than share any part of the Earth with Israel. (Their words, not mine.)

Here are some more, from the Hamas Covenant.

"There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."

"After Palestine, the Zionists aspire to expand from the Nile to the Euphrates. When they will have digested the region they overtook, they will aspire to further expansion, and so on. Their plan is embodied in the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion", and their present conduct is the best proof of what we are saying."

Don't take my word for it. Read the whole thing yourself.

http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/mideast/hamas.htm

Carter is deluded if he thinks he can negotiate with people who solemnly believe The Protocols of Zion. What's next, negotiate with Heaven's Gate Cult or Scientology?

[rayofreason]

53. The credulity on this thread...

...is incredible.

But then people cheered Neville Chamberlain in 1938 when he announced "My good friends, for the second time in our history, a British Prime Minister has returned from Germany bringing peace with honour. I believe it is peace for our time."

[JeanGrey]

56. He is just getting old and should really stay out of stuff like this.

He's always been anti-jew anyway.

[classysassy]

64. Pro justice

[Tommy_Carcetti]

67. "Anti-jew"

Here is exhibit one about the dangers of a society without a healthy church-state separation. Any criticizing of the government automatically is inferred to be criticizing of the religion, and people get angry.

The absolute ridiculous extremes some supporters of Israelis have taken to any criticizing of any sort of Israeli policy whatsoever is ludicrous.

[JeanGrey]

70. Yeah extremes are silly, which is why he should stick to building

homes.

[PaDem]

80. you know much about the situation in Israel/Palestine?

Didn't think so.

[JerseygirlCT]

57. That's the problem of course

You cannot negotiate in good faith with a negotiating partner not in the least concerned with good faith.

I don't believe Hamas is a legitimate negotiating partner, I'm afraid. I don't believe they have the least interest in peace - it's not in *their* interests. It IS in the interests of the Palestinian people, and there's the rub. They need real leaders, who are interested in the people, not in building individual power centers for themselves. They have never had that. And I think that's a large part of the impediment to a peaceful solution there.

[fascisthunter]

63. Carter... You are a True Diplomat and a Noble Man

thank you for trying for peace, unlike many others who seem determined to undermine your efforts. Those who claim peaceful negotiations are a waste of time have already excepted war as the only alternative.

[ItNerd4life]

65. And that's why Hamas continues to fire rockets

because the only peace they want is the peace of mind that Israel is wiped off the face of the earth. Some people can't be negotiated with because they only want war, it doesn't matter what you want. Carter was being naive.

Another way to look at it. Democrats can't negotiate with Bush because Bush only wants war.

[fascisthunter]

66. if you believe that you are lost

you have submitted to war, death and destruction and there is no point in talking to folks like you who are unwilling to try for peace. People who don't believe there is a chance for peace should be ignored at least on blogs.

[pegleg]

69. People who think others should be ignored - should be ignored nt

[darue]

74. civil society in a solverign Palestinian State will finish off Hamas if they don't disarm

at that point they would be considered a mafia and no one would want them making trouble anymore. they've agreed to a referendum. get some deals on the table and see what gets the OK vote. If one proposal fails, modify it and vote again. Eventually a deal will be offered, by israel and other nations that will win acceptance on all sides. Such a referendum should happen in Israel too. time to get the politicians and warlords out of it and let the people negotiate directly.

[ItNerd4life]

82. What is peace to people who don't want you to exist?

Hamas doesn't want Israel to exist. The only way peace will happen is Israel doesn't exist according to everything they have said and done.

Please explain why Hamas continues to fire rockets and butcher innocent men, women, and children even after Carter asked them not too?

[tidy_bowl]

68. You would have to be insane to believe Hamas. nt