Wright Says His Words Were Twisted

[jefferson_dem]

Source: NYT

Wright Says His Words Were Twisted

By Julie Bosman

In his first wide-ranging interview since video clips of his inflammatory sermons were aired, the Rev. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. defended himself over the controversy, saying that his words were twisted.

Mr. Wright, Senator Barack Obama’s former pastor, gave an interview to Bill Moyers on Wednesday, to air on PBS tomorrow.

“I felt it was unfair,” Mr. Wright said, according to excerpts of the interview released Thursday. “I felt it was unjust. I felt it was untrue. I felt for those who were doing that, were doing it for some very devious reasons.”

<SNIP>

“It’s to paint me as something — ‘Something’s wrong with me. There’s nothing wrong with this country … for its policies. We’re perfect. Our hands are free. Our hands have no blood on them,’” he said. “That’s not a failure to communicate. The message that is being communicated by the sound bites is exactly what those pushing those sound bites want to communicate.”

When asked what the people who aired the clips “wanted to communicate,” Mr. Wright said, “I think they wanted to communicate that I am unpatriotic, that I am un-American, that I am filled with hate speech, that I have a cult at Trinity United Church of Christ. And by the way, guess who goes to his church, hint, hint, hint? That’s what they wanted to communicate.”

Mr. Wright, who has acted as Mr. Obama’s spiritual mentor and retired in February as pastor of Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, said that he has never heard Mr. Obama repeat any of his controversial statements.

“Absolutely not,” Mr. Wright said. “I don’t talk to him about politics. And so he had a political event, he goes out as a politician and says what he has to say as a politician. I continue to be a pastor who speaks to the people of God about the things of God.”

Read more: http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/04/24/wright-says-his-words-were-twisted/

[navarth]

1. Bill Moyers and Rev. Wright....I can't wait

[NJmaverick]

2. In time the truth will come out about this man

People will slowly discover he is not the black boogie man, that so many sleazy individuals painted him to be.

[juajen]

3. I hope he asked him about his new home of over 10,000 square feet

in a gated community in chicago? You know where the beginning construction loan was over one million dollars with a ten million dollar line of credit? I really want to know about this home.

[jefferson_dem]

5. Why do you care so much about the man's home?

Do you wish to pay him a visit?

[superconnected]

149. Because we aren't republicans who let people like bush/cheney get off for fraud.

We definitely need to know about obama and his shady business deals or we'll become just like the turn-their-head to corruption republicans.

[Vanje]

7. And all of Hillary's friends sleep in their cars, I suppose.

[JBShakes]

9. As a Clinton supporter...

you're not REALLY going to go sniffing around "shady real estate deals" where none may exist, are you?

Just sayin' is all.

[bermudat]

12. You are quoting O'Liely word for word.

Where is your concern about the palatial homes of Pat Robertson, Hagee, et. al. If you are not paying for his home, what do you care?

[Judi Lynn]

13. Oh, GOD! Don't get anyone started who has read about Robertson's dealings with Charles Taylor,

Robertson's oil business in California, his race horses, diamond investing business his employees have discussed, describing his trips to Africa during which he prays with his staff that the "harvest" will be bountiful, etc., etc.

Jesus H. Christ on a pogo stick. You couldn't possibly get a Christian minister more obsessed with the material world than Pat Robertson.

[Betsy Ross]

18. Careful, the H. stands for Huseyin! LOL! eom

[Judi Lynn]

24. Pat Robertson really doesn't want you to mention that!

He's series!!1!1!!!1!!!

[DesertFlower]

22. i believe it's being paid for by the church. nt

[Critters2]

67. Which would be a professional boundaries violation if another pastor

accepted it. Retired clergy in the UCC are to cut all official ties with churches they've served. Having the church pay your mortgage is an ongoing relationship, and professionally inappropriate.

[DrZeeLit]

111. So, you're saying retired pastors do not accept gifts from former parishes?

That's absurd.

On what planet do you reside?
I've known a lot of pastors/priests receiving gifts from the parish -- trips, cars, appliances.
These ministers/pastors/priests aren't elected officials -- they're revered members of a community -- elders, still visible mentors.
They don't disappear. Most usually stay at the last parish; some even have houses built near the rectory or nearby.


Unless we have been a member of Trinity, we have no idea about Reverend Wright.
I doubt he could have been a pastor for as long as he served and been perceived as the Hannity Clip Crowd fingered him.

I'm constantly shaking my head at the dimwitted diversions played out in the media, and HERE.

Geez..... last time I looked at the LAW, guilt by association wasn't even LOGICAL.

[Critters2]

119. I reside on this planet, and I understand professional ethics.

Ongoing mortgage payments made by one's former congregation is not a gift. It's a relationship. And therefore a boundaries violation. So is maintaining membership in one's former parish, living near one's former parish.

[RaleighNCDUer]

179. LOL.

He was retired, not banished. Who gives a fuck? So it is a relationship. Why should he not have a relationship with the parish he's served for 40 years?

[Critters2]

184. Because he's bound by a pastoral code that says he won't.

All of us are supposed to be abide by these principles, no matter how large our parish, no matter how famous we are, no matter how many of our parishioners are running for president. He took the same vows I did the day he was ordained. I'd like him to keep them. That seems reasonable.

[RaleighNCDUer]

185. Is it calling you out to say that you are a liar?

You're a UCC cleric?

Easy to say, on an anonymous politcal board.

[Critters2]

186. Yep, that's what I'm saying. I'm a UCC pastor. Whether you believe it or not. nt

[RaleighNCDUer]

187. And I'm a secret agent.

Shh, don't tell anybody.

[Critters2]

188. I've been quite honest about being a UCC pastor since I started

posting on DU. Whereas, this is the first I've heard of your secret agent status. I think one of us isn't being honest.

[RaleighNCDUer]

191. I'm not supposed to talk about it. nt

[Window]

35. Why is that any of your business. He's not running for any public office. Damn.

[cyndensco]

47. Why do you have a problem with him owning a 1M home?

Is he not entitled?

[Igel]

104. Because it gives great insight into one

of the precepts that the church, under his tutelage, espoused:

Eschew middle-classedness.

10k sq ft house? He's doing a great job of avoiding even the appearance of being middle class.

Oddly, in the case of other preachers who live beyond their needs and beyond most people's wants there are cries of, "How many poor people could be helped with that money?" with the usual citations about selling everything you have and giving it to the poor. Here it's, "Hey, he's entitled to it."

[Tim4319]

55. So what he bought a huge house!!!!!

This government has done far less then Rev Wright has, and they are robbing the treasury blind. How about investigating where that money is?

[madrchsod]

57. so do i !!!

look at all the links to this "house"...makes me wonder what he does on the side to afford such a mansion



http://www.suntimes.com/business/867629,CST-NWS-wright29.article

http://www.newsmax.com/kessler/obama_wright_pastor/2008/04/13/87617.html

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/03/27/obamas-former-pastor-builds-a-multimillion-dollar-retirement-home/


i think someone in chicago better start investigating these loans and lines of credit...there`s something that needs to be exposed before obama get`s the nomination.


:woohoo::crazy: :woohoo::crazy: :woohoo::crazy: :woohoo::crazy: :woohoo:

[AvaMae]

112. SO DO I! Jeremiah Wright's house...

He built his church from a membership of 87 to a membership of 8000...this is a mega church..but his digs are not as elaborate as the Pope's, or either of Hillary's two houses.

There are numerous ministries, the church responds to the community it has, from parenting to
prenatal, to AIDS awareness, AIDS ministry, Gay and Lesbian ministry, after school programs,
and many many more...

After Fox ran the edited snippet deliberately taken out of context, there were continued threats
against Wright, the church and others associated with him... including his new home....

Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Pat Buchanan, Joe Scarborough, Chris Mathews, Lou Dobbs, Krauthammer,
New Gingrich, Bill O'Riley, not a single one ever bothered to obtain or play the sermons in context,
all trashed Wright.

They are no more deserving of their positions than was Don Imus...

[RamboLiberal]

125. Maybe you ought to read the links you post

Trinity United Church of Christ, 400 W. 95th Street, Chicago, is listed as the landowner on the permit.

The Rev. J. Bennett Guess, communications director for the United Church of Christ national office, said local congregations decide how to spend their own money. At Trinity, pastors spend cash based on the contributions to their church, he said.

"It is customary and appropriate in many Christian denominations, including the United Church of Christ, for local churches to offer housing provisions for retiring clergy, especially in cases where pastors have served long-term pastorates," Guess said in a statement.

"We support efforts by our 5,700 local churches to ensure that retiring pastors and spouses have continuing housing, adequate pension and health care, as an expression of our continuing appreciation for their years of service. Each local UCC congregation is free to honor a retiring pastor in ways it feels most appropriate to address the needs of that clergyperson's circumstances."

http://www.suntimes.com/business/867629,CST-NWS-wright29.article

BTW, from my understanding most United Church of Christ churches are mostly white.

I don't necessarily like that religion spend their money on lavish buildings or that any clergy lives in lavish housing from the Pope, to bishops, to pastors, to rabbis to imams, but what the hell business is it of ours?

We're not voting on anyone's pastor!

[RaleighNCDUer]

160. IOW, it's not his house? He just will occupy it until he dies

then the church will turn it over to the next ranking pastor who retires?

[ginnyinWI]

80. if you don't like the size of Rev. Wright's home,

then you are free not to vote for Wright for president.

[Danieljay]

89. The man has every right to be financially abundant. What the eff is up with Dems hating the rich?

If you think money and being rich is bad, I'll bet your broke.

[RamboLiberal]

139. I remember a ton of DU'ers condemning John Edwards

for his multi-million dollar mansion! Yet wouldn't he have been one helluva president for the poor and the working stiffs?

[salin]

170. and Al Gore... and John Kerry

all three would have done good work for the poor and working stiffs.

[Quantess]

204. OMG it's HUGH!!!1

Seriously, who says this is a big deal? Why don't we investigate all his neighbors in the gated community as well, if we're so concerned!

[Nitrogenica]

4. I have seen a body of good work by this man and his church that far outweighs a 20 second sound bite

[Vanje]

6. kicking it for Rev. Wright

Jesus harshly criticized the scribes and pharisees, rich men, money changers, and hypocrites.

Wright is a Christian . The real thing.

[jjr5]

20. Amen!

[MADem]

8. Of course they were -- he actually meant Damn!!!! God!!! America!!!!

Wright should shut the FUCK up if he wants to help his protege. But I guess he doesn't want to help the guy--it's more important that he make HIS points. Maybe he doesn't like the fact that his protege has gone so far afield and up the ladder of success, or something.

Everytime the guy opens his mouth, he provides sound bites. Best way to prevent that is to ZIP IT.

Here he is, doing the nudge-wink about Obama's renunciation of his comments. He might have simply said "Awww, I know he didn't really MEAN it--he's just conning the dumb folks and covering his ass!"

He added, “I do what I do. He does what politicians do. So that what happened in Philadelphia where he had to respond to the sound bytes, he responded as a politician.”

Talk about UNHELPFUL.

[Window]

43. No. He should not shut the fuck up. He is the one who has been smeared.

This shit had no business being aired and used to try to destroy two good men. I'm sure Rev. Wright, as a black man, is tired of being told to just shut the fuck up and go to the back of the bus. That's the fucking problem.

What in hell ever happened to separation of church and state anyway.

If it costs Sen. Obama the nomination, then it wasn't for him and he doesn't need it.

Enough is fucking enough.

[BigDDem]

65. "He should not shut the fuck up"

I agree!!! Keep talking "Reverend!"

[MADem]

103. Actually, you're quite right!! Talk ON, Reverend, Talk ON!!! Don't apologize!

Stand up and tell everyone what's WRONG with them!! Do it repeatedly, on every television venue available to you! Plaster your face on every program from the VIEW to LENO and back again!

I wish him thousands of bookings in the months ahead...really!!!

[Window]

109. Damn skippy.

Tell me again what office Rev. Wright is running for.

Try listening to one of his sermons, not a 20-second sound byte, you might learn something.

[MADem]

102. No business being aired? Excuse me? Why the fuck did he SELL THOSE SERMONS in the

church gift shop? At a HEFTY, healthy price?

This isn't his homemade private sex tape, here, this is a group of public sermon he's been making money off of for YEARS. It's part of a GREATEST HITS DVD box set.

No business being AIRED???

:rofl:

How fucking detached from reality do you have to be to say something like that? By their WORK we shall know them--like it, or not.

[Window]

108. How fucking detached from reality do you have to be to pretend

you don't know what the fuck I'm referring to. You know damned well that certain sound bytes were selectively used and played ad nauseam to anger and arouse hatred in assholes like you.

Cut the bullshit.

[MADem]

148. Oooooh, fuck/fuck and FUCK! Someone's terribly cranky!

Sound bites or no sound bites, "God Damn America" isn't "Say, neighbor, would you like a piece of PIE?"

But if you want/need to think that such an intemperate remark, in a church setting, with children present, is just Hunky Dory and nothing to look askance at, well, you go right ahead and do that! And you go on thinking that "God Damn America" means "How do you do?" or "Nice weather we're having," and those mean old people airing the tape that the Reverend himself made, and sold (ka-ching, ka-ching), are somehow twisting "God Damn America" to mean....oh, I dunno..."God Damn America" maybe?

Whatever gets you through the night, there, pal!

[haymakeragain]

171. Was that the entire sentence? "God damn America."

Or was there something before and after it? Did he walk up to the podium and look out over the assembled and shout "God Damn America!!"

Then walk out? Or was there more?

[MADem]

173. If that's a real question, YOUTUBE is your friend and can give you the answer you seek.

I've seen the whole sermon, BTW.

I've never heard a three word sermon, and I wager neither have you.

Stop acting like context matters to the vast majority of voters in America. It doesn't.

Losing battle. You're not going to win hearts or change minds.

[stillcool]

198. God Damn America!

Blowback
excerpted from the book
Blowback The Costs and Consequences of American Empire
by Chalmers Johnson
Henry Holt, 2000
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Blowback_CJohnson/Blowback_BCJ.html

p8
The term "blowback," which officials of the Central Intelligence Agency first invented for their own internal use, is starting to circulate among students of international relations. It refers to the unintended consequences of policies that were kept secret from the American people. What the daily press reports as the malign acts of "terrorists" or "drug lords" or "rogue states" or "illegal arms merchants" often turn out to be blowback from earlier American operations.
p9
One man's terrorist is, of course, another man's freedom fighter, and what U.S. officials denounce as unprovoked terrorist attacks on its innocent citizens are often meant as retaliation for previous American imperial actions. Terrorists attack innocent and undefended American targets precisely because American soldiers and sailors firing cruise missiles from ships at sea or sitting in B-52 bombers at extremely high altitudes or supporting brutal and repressive regimes from Washington seem invulnerable. As members of the Defense Science Board wrote in a 1997 report to the undersecretary of defense for acquisition and technology, "Historical data show a strong correlation between U.S. involvement in international situations and an increase in terrorist attacks against the United States. In addition, the military asymmetry that denies nation states the ability to engage in overt attacks against the United States drives the use of transnational actors that is, terrorists from one country attacking in another."
The most direct and obvious form of blowback often occurs when the victims fight back after a secret American bombing, or a U.S.-sponsored campaign of state terrorism, or a CIA-engineered overthrow of a foreign political leader. All around the world today, it is possible to see the groundwork being laid for future forms of blowback.
------------------------------------------
Terrorism(by definition)strikes at the innocent in order to draw attention to the sins of the invulnerable. The innocent of the twenty-first century are going to harvest unexpected blowback disasters from the imperialist escapades of recent decades. Although most Americans may be largely ignorant of what was, and still is, being done in their names, all are likely to pay a steep price-individually and collectively-for their nation's continued efforts to dominate the global scene. Before the damage of heedless triumphalist acts and the triumphalist rhetoric and propaganda that goes with them becomes irreversible, it is important to open a new discussion of our global role during and after the Cold War...
------------------------
"Blowback" is shorthand for saying that a nation reaps what it sows, even if it does not fully know or understand what it has sown. Given its wealth and power, the United States will be a prime recipient in the foreseeable future of all of the more expectable forms of blowback, particularly terrorist attacks against Americans in and out of the armed forces anywhere on earth, including within the United States. But it is blowback in its larger aspect-the tangible costs of empire-that truly threatens it. Empires are costly operations, and they become more costly by the year. The hollowing out of American industry, for instance, is a form of blowback-an unintended negative consequence of American policy- even though it is seldom recognized as such. The growth of militarism in a once democratic society is another example of blowback. Empire is the problem. Even though the United States has a strong sense of invulnerability and substantial military and economic tools to make such a feeling credible, the fact of its imperial pretensions means that a crisis is inevitable. More imperialist projects simply generate more blowback. If we do not begin to solve problems in more prudent and modest ways, blowback will only become more intense.

The American Empire: 1992 to present
from the book
Killing Hope
by William Blum
2004 edition
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Blum/American_Empire_KH2004.html

Following its bombing of Iraq in 1991, the United States wound up with military bases in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Bahrain, Qatar, Oman and the United Arab Emirates.
Following its bombing of Yugoslavia in 1999, the United States wound up with military bases in Kosovo, Albania, Bulgaria, Macedonia, Hungary, Bosnia and Croatia.
Following its bombing of Afghanistan in 2001-2, the United States wound up with military bases in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Georgia, Yemen and Djibouti.
Following its bombing and invasion of Iraq in 2003, the United States wound up with Iraq.
This is not very subtle foreign policy. Certainly not covert. The men who run the American Empire are not easily embarrassed
And that is the way the empire grows-a base in every neighborhood, ready to be mobilized to put down any threat to imperial rule, real or imagined. Fifty-eight years after world War II ended, the United States still has major bases in Germany and Japan; fifty ears after the end of the Korean War, tens of thousands of American armed forces continue to be stationed in South Korea.
"America will have a continuing interest and presence in Central Asia of a kind that we could not have dreamed of before," US Secretary of State Colin Powell declared in February 2002. Later that year, the US Defense Department announced: "The United States Military is currently deployed to more locations then it has been throughout history."

A Brief History of U.S. Interventions: 1945 to the Present
by William Blum
Z magazine , June 1999
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Blum/US_Interventions_WBlumZ.html
The United States carried out extremely serious interventions into more than 70 nations in this period.

[tidy_bowl]

174. A racist is a racist...

..you don't get a pass just because the color of your skin. I believe we must condemn all racism if we are to rise above this nasty and harmful discourse.

[stillcool]

197. He is not a pinata...

for you to trash and bash. He is a human being who has led an exemplary life. If you don't like him don't go to his church. If you don't want him to defend himself, quit attacking him. He is a person, not some dog for you to kick. I surely hope you are judged in the same way you judge others...condemnation prior to investigation. Julius Streicher would be so proud.

[redtornado]

10. His words were not "twisted" as he claims

They were outright quoted word for word. How do you say the government invented AIDS to kill off people of color and try to weasel out of it. He said what he said and thats it.

[Judi Lynn]

16. That story has been discussed for decades. He didn't start it. n/t

[Dave From Canada]

23. No, he didn't start it, but he did decide to preach it to his congregation as fact. Don't make

excuses for such bad behavior.

He has also stated that the government knew about Pearl Harbor and refused to act, and that the government is responsible for bringing drugs into black neighbourhoods to kill black people.

[Soylent Brice]

30. the government IS (partly) responsible for the drug epidimic

http://www.constitution.org/abus/narc/day1main.htm

Shadowy origins of 'crack' epidemic: http://www.constitution.org/abus/narc/day2main.htm

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/CIA/Contra_Cocaine_Trafficking.html

links courtesy of: http://www.serendipity.li/cia/cia_lynx.html#cia_and_drugs

[RaleighNCDUer]

31. The government IS responsible for bringing drugs into black

neighborhoods - not to necessarily kill black people, but to kill the black civil rights movement. It broke the chain of political activism that stretched from the 40s through the 60s, and replaced it with drug gangs. Organizations that in the 60s were politically oriented morphed into gangs by the late 70s. While the CIA was running the drugs up from Colombia.

[madrchsod]

66. that happened to the black panthers in chicago

the "man" backed the black gangs instead of the panthers..the cops killed several of the panther leaders and that was it..

[stillcool]

200. Gary Webb. Remember?

http://www.gnn.tv/videos/video.php?id=30

Gary Webb - United States
Gary Webb's Death: American Tragedy
by Robert Parry
www.consortiumnews.com, December 9. 2006

The CIA Probe
Still, Gary Webb had set in motion internal government investigations that would bring to the surface long-hidden facts about how the Reagan administration had conducted the contra war.
The CIA's defensive line against the contra-cocaine allegations began to break when the spy agency published Volume One of Inspector General Hitz's findings on Jan. 29, 1998.
Despite a largely exculpatory press release, Hitz's Volume One admitted that not only were many of Webb's allegations true but that he actually understated the seriousness of the contra-drug crimes and the CIA's knowledge.
Hitz acknowledged that cocaine smugglers played a significant early role in the Nicaraguan contra movement and that the CIA intervened to block an image-threatening 1984 federal investigation into a San Francisco-based drug ring with suspected ties to the contras, the so-called "Frogman Case."
On May 7, 1998, another disclosure from the government investigation shook the CIA's weakening defenses.
Rep. Maxine Waters, a California Democrat, introduced into the Congressional Record a Feb. 11, 1982, letter of understanding between the CIA and the Justice Department.
The letter, which had been sought by CIA Director William Casey, freed the CIA from legal requirements that it must report drug smuggling by CIA assets, a provision that covered both the Nicaraguan contras and Afghan rebels who were fighting a Soviet-supported regime in Afghanistan and were implicated in heroin trafficking.
The next breach in the defensive wall was a report by the Justice Department's inspector general Michael Bromwich. Given the hostile climate surrounding Webb's series, Bromwich's report opened with criticism of Webb. But, like the CIA's Volume One, the contents revealed new details about government wrongdoing.
According to evidence cited by Bromwich, the Reagan administration knew almost from the outset of the contra war that cocaine traffickers permeated the paramilitary operation. The administration also did next to nothing to expose or stop the crimes.
Bromwich's report revealed example after example of leads not followed, corroborated witnesses disparaged, official law-enforcement investigations sabotaged, and even the CIA facilitating the work of drug traffickers.
The report showed that the contras and their supporters ran several parallel drug-smuggling operations, not just the one at the center of Webb's series._The report also found that the CIA shared little of its information about contra drugs with law-enforcement agencies and on three occasions disrupted cocaine-trafficking investigations that threatened the contras.
Though depicting a more widespread contra-drug operation than Webb had understood, the Justice report also provided some important corroboration about a Nicaraguan drug smuggler, Norwin Meneses, who was a key figure in Webb's series.
Bromwich cited U.S. government informants who supplied detailed information about Meneses's operation and his financial assistance to the contras.
...Please read more...
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Heroes/Gary_Webb.html

http://www.zmag.org/ZMag/articles/Gary%20Webb.htm

Interview with Gary Webb

By Joe Taglieri

Gary Webb used to be an investigative reporter for the San Jose Mercury News. It was his dream job. He was writing award-winning stuff for the paper, and he got along great with his editors. Every tough piece he wrote, they stood by him. He felt secure. His paper had his back, he thought.

But that all changed after Webb linked the CIA to the birth of the crack cocaine trade in South Central Los Angles during the early 1980s. His series, ominously titled "Dark Alliance--The Story Behind the Crack Explosion," focused on two cocaine traffickers operating in San Francisco and Los Angeles throughout the decade. The series showed that while supplying tons of South American powder to Ricky Donnell Ross, who the Los Angeles Times billed as LA's first "King of Crack" in a 1994 profile, Norwin Meneses and Danilo Blandon, the Nicaraguan dealers were also heavily active in organizing and raising funds for the Contras, a CIA-organized paramilitary army. Webb's reporting strongly infers, but never explicitly states, that these drug-dealing counterrevolutionaries received a stay-out-of-jail-free card courtesy of the CIA and a host of other compliant federal law enforcement agencies, which looked the other way as tons of Meneses's coke entered the United States.

When Webb's series first appeared in August 1996, an initial brief period of silence turned into public outcry. Via the Internet, Webb's Mercury News stories reached millions of people across the country and the world. "Dark Alliance" peaked especially significant interest in South Central, where members of the community have for years harbored suspicions about the government's role in the drug trade that continues to ravage their neighborhood. Since crack obviously wasn't exclusively an LA thing by 1996, it wasn't long before inner cities around America were buzzing about the CIA-crack story in the Mercury News--that relatively obscure West Coast daily, which, thanks to the Internet, they could now read online. Protest marches were organized around the country, and the Congressional Black Caucus and others called for a federal investigation based on the questions raised by "Dark Alliance."

[haymakeragain]

33. Pearl Harbor is still being debated, the CIA connection to crack is

documented. You've heard of Tuskeegee? What he says is not all that far from reality, and might be accurate. Are you a 75 year old African American? If not, I doubt that you have had the same life-experiences as Jeremiah Wright, so don't be so quick to dismiss what he says. Our government has a sordid record at best.

[Tim4319]

60. Amen!!!

[madrchsod]

64. "air america"during the south east asian wars....

the cia and others with in the military were responsible for escalating the heroin epidemic in the 60`s. i know that for a fact.

[darue]

51. all of which is true

maybe you need to learn somethings or two

[AvaMae]

117. No he didn't start it...

There are those who claim the US DID know the attack on Pearl Harbor was planned...

..................just not when.

[tavalon]

124. Um, Dave from Canada,

our government is partially responsible for bringing drugs into black neighborhoods. As well, our government did know about Pearl Harbor and we're still pulling the same ops these days - last big one was 9/11 LIHOP or MIHOP, take your pick, they both are defendable. So, Canadian Dave, you might want to brush up on American History and please don't get it from an American textbook. We lie, a lot, to ourselves and anyone else who will listen.

[RaleighNCDUer]

27. He did say it, and did not try to weasel out of it.

And he's not the only one to believe it.

After knowing about the Tuskeegee experiment, and the CIA seeding disease in US subway systems, WHY would you DISBELIEVE?

[Chovexani]

44. Because it is scientifically impossible, it is absolute bunk

By everything we know and understand about biology and viruses. Unless Wright and the rest of the crackpot AIDS conspiracy theorists have made some extraordinary leaps in scientific discovery in which case they should share them with the world for the betterment of humanity.

Tuskegee happened and was heinous, the CIA connection to the crack epidemic was proven a long time ago, NO ONE IS DISPUTING THE GOV'T IS IMMORAL ENOUGH TO DO IT. What is in dispute is that it is scientifically possible. Actually no, it's not in dispute, not by anyone with a rudimentary understanding of high school biology.

There is a reason this stupid conspiracy theory has been floating around for decades and has never been proven, and is only espoused by people like Tony Brown. This is in the same quack bin as "HIV doesn't cause AIDS" and 90% of the 9/11 "Truth" movement. It does us no good to be spreading it like it's true, and in fact I question the motives of anyone doing so--by lumping this crazy shit in with actual things the gov't has done, it discredits the incidents which HAVE been proven (read: CIA and crack, etc.).

[RaleighNCDUer]

77. I never said it was genetically engineered.

I just said the government is responsible - nobody knew what a smallpox virus was in the 1700s, but that did't keep them from using smallpox as a weapon against the Native Americans.

You think that Ft Dettrick doesn't have people looking at every little bug that pops up worldwide, to see how it can be used as a bio-weapon? The growth vectors of AIDS defy rationality, UNLESS it had a helping hand. I believe it was originally used not as a weapon against blacks per se, but against communists - it's first spread was in Africa where Cuban soldiers were helping insurgents fight the colonial government in Angola, so we have two 'safe' vectors - a war zone in Africa, and isolated Cuba. The government underestimated it, and it spread across Africa, and also from Cuba into the Dominican Republica and Haiti - jumping from the Caribbean sex trade into the gay community in NY and SF. To the upper-class whites who run the CIA, it never occurred to them that a sexual disease in Africa could ever be a threat to the US.

It is certainly no more far fetched than the CIA seeding American subway systems with a lethal disease (the flu) to track the spread vectors of airborne disease.

[AvaMae]

118. BECAUSE IT IS SCIENTIFICALLY IMPOSSIBLE....

Apparently not...

http://www.salon.com/news/1998/12/cov_23news.html

[tidy_bowl]

37. Exactly...

....I can't understand why so many here at DU support this man. Just because he is Obama's pastor? I abhor racism, period. ANYONE, anyone who displays such racist comments should be shunned and denounced in the strongest terms. Let's not support bigotry.

[butterfly77]

42. I knew who he was before I knew he was Obama's pastor...

and I heard some of his sermons and they weren't any of the soundbites you seem to enjoy so much. First of all I don't believe he is a racist and you must be shunning a certain portions of the United States because there is a lot of it to go around.


The only one I will be shunning is Hillary Rodham Clinton!What you need to do is denounce Hillary for her race baiting and trying to frighten people to believe if someone knows someone of different opinions or ideas then that automatically makes you and that person one and the same, you sound stupid! Did you hear hillary at the debate throw out the name Farrakhan, who in the hell was she trying to frighten if anything she lost voters,seven in my immediate family...

[AvaMae]

120. I knew who he was before I knew he was Obama's pastor

There is a tape of Gov. Rendel of PA praising Farrakhan... who has been heading up a number of
programs for black youth in S. Chicago.... Rendel was Hillary's right hand man this week. She wants Obama condemned by association for both the Underground WEatherman he met in 2000, and an achievement award Farrakhan received from Wright.... even though Rendel praises Farrakhan, and Bill pardoned two Underground Weatherman members....

Obama is commited to taking the higher ground, and does not wish the campaign to degrade to
the politics of personal destruction.... but the pundits praise Hillary for every nasty she's used...

[Tim4319]

68. As a black man that is in his 60 plus years,

it is hard to discredit many of the things he spoke about. I am not sure how old you are. I am a black 36 years-old, and I used to watch "Eyes On The Prize" that used to come on PBS. To sit in front of my TV and see all of the things that were done to black people, just 40 some-odd years ago, I can understand his sentiment! To see a 13 year Emmitt Teel killed for supposedly whistling at a white woman. To see a church bombed on Sunday morning that eventually killed 4 black girls. To see police dogs and water hoses turned on women and children who were seeking equality. Not mention the countless other cross burnings, lynchings and killings of black people that happened just to see no one brought to justice, can mess with your head. So, if Rev. Wright is upset, after all of these years black people are still being killed with no one being brought to justice I totally understand. The whole Jena Six situation, Megan Wright, Sean Bell...... The list goes! And, to constantly be told that things are better, and to not see changes at the rate that there should be, will mess with you! So, I refuse to call a man a bigot who has live through some times that has effected a whole race of people.

That is my peace!

[AvaMae]

121. As a black man that is in his 60 plus years....

Small comfort... I know... but you need to know someone tried...


http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_dallas_b_080419_god_damn_america_3f.htm

[RamboLiberal]

131. Exactly - Imagine you are a man serving you country as a

Marine, then a corpsman who's trusted with the life of LBJ yet you can't go to the restroom, drink from a fountain, eat at a 5&10 lunch counter, and are treated as less than a man in many areas.

And you know that still many of those you preach too can apply for a job and subtley still be denied because of the color of their skin. And don't tell me that doesn't go on cause I see it with the people I work with. Yeah, talk about bitter.

I'm a 55 year old white woman and I'm still bitter about openings that weren't there for me because of my gender. But I've seen that improve immensely. There hasn't been equal improvement IMHO for blacks yet!

[JoFerret]

40. I think his words have been taken out of context

...and used and misused. The Rev. Wright is clearly not a monster. That said - a few of the words - not to mention the tone - come across as cruel and - yes - a bit twisted. Or at the very least ill-chosen and unfortunate. I tend to see religiosity is disturbing. You certainly see that in the white ranters of the born-again and fundamentalist movement.
There are exceptions.
But why anyone would put themselves in the thrall of such things is beyond me.

[CreekDog]

79. My pastor formally protested participation in the Yankee Stadium 9/11 memorial

by a representative of our denomination. He was one of just five pastors in our whole denomination to initiate this. It made the New York Times.

Should I be held to account for this? I wasn't a member there at the time, but I joined later.

Second, anybody know why these pastors protested? Anti American? Nope. Anti other religions? Nope too. In a nutshell this is what they opposed:

"Religious syncretism" exhibits blending of two or more religious belief systems into a new system, or the incorporation into a religious tradition of beliefs from unrelated traditions.

Why should I account for every political opinion my pastor has uttered? Why should I was be held to account for the stand that my pastor took in 2001?

But the thing that bothers me is that I could be called anti American, anti other religions or against the 9/11 ceremony (which I'm not). And I don't disown his position. The basis for taking it is in keeping with our denomination's (and beliefs) on co-mingling other religious beliefs alongside Christianity by our clergy. I'm not a pastor, I don't have to be that exacting, I see why he does have to be that exacting.

Do you see how complicated this is and why based on media reports, one cannot accurately and fully understand why things are said in pulpits and why people stay? Do you understand that you simply don't know the depth, reasoning or full explanations without seriously researching them? And do you understand that going to church is not "supporting" a pastor and donating money to church is not "giving money to a pastor"?

This isn't just to you but to those that make sweeping generalizations about this based on not enough information. Yes, you don't *know* why we put ourselves through this and in 100 hours, I don't think I could explain it, nor should I have to.

[JoFerret]

88. All nuts

.

[darue]

49. they may well have done so, no one's proven otherwise

they have means and motive.

funny that the primary racial group with immunity is white European.

[Tim4319]

59. Have you ever heard of the Tuskegee Experiment?

This is how a black man can say AIDS is used to kill off black people.

<<Snip>>

The United States government did something that was wrong—deeply, profoundly, morally wrong. It was an outrage to our commitment to integrity and equality for all our citizens. . . . clearly racist.
—President Clinton's apology for the Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment to the eight remaining survivors, May 16, 1997

For forty years between 1932 and 1972, the U.S. Public Health Service (PHS) conducted an experiment on 399 black men in the late stages of syphilis. These men, for the most part illiterate sharecroppers from one of the poorest counties in Alabama, were never told what disease they were suffering from or of its seriousness. Informed that they were being treated for “bad blood,”1 their doctors had no intention of curing them of syphilis at all. The data for the experiment was to be collected from autopsies of the men, and they were thus deliberately left to degenerate under the ravages of tertiary syphilis—which can include tumors, heart disease, paralysis, blindness, insanity, and death. “As I see it,” one of the doctors involved explained, “we have no further interest in these patients until they die.”

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0762136.html
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/health/may97/tuskegee_5-16.html

[OneBlueDotBama]

158. Hillary, Bill & Health Management Assoc. of Arkansas

For those that are not aware of the Clinton's involvement in tainted blood being shipped around the world, google HMA & Clinton. It's not very pretty. I would ship the right wing whack-job sites and look and the Canadian reporting and the movie Factor 8.

http://www.factor8movie.com/

[AvaMae]

116. HIS WORDS WERE TWISTED, OUT OF CONTEXT...

If you don't know about this..... then you don't know what else the Rev. Wright knows that you don't.


http://www.salon.com/news/1998/12/cov_23news.html

[classysassy]

150. Were you there

during his sermon?if not shut your republican piehole.?

[YvonneCa]

164. Welcome to DU. n/t

[EFerrari]

180. Enjoy you're stay. n/t

[stillcool]

199. Can't imagine why he would..

think such a thing

1931 - Dr. Cornelius Rhoads, under the auspices of the Rockefeller Institute for Medical Investigations, infects human subjects with cancer cells. He later goes on to establish the U.S. Army Biological Warfare facilities in Maryland, Utah, and Panama, and is named to the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission. While there, he begins a series of radiation exposure experiments on American soldiers and civilian hospital patients.

1932 - The Tuskegee Syphilis Study begins. 200 black men diagnosed with syphilis are never told of their illness, are denied treatment, and instead are used as human guinea pigs in order to follow the progression and symptoms of the disease. They all subsequently die from syphilis, their families never told that they could have been treated.

1935 - The Pellagra Incident. After millions of individuals die from Pellagra over a span of two decades, the U.S. Public Health Service finally acts to stem the disease. The director of the agency admits it had known for at least 20 years that Pellagra is caused by a niacin deficiency but failed to act since most of the deaths occurred within poverty-stricken black populations.

1940 - Four hundred prisoners in Chicago are infected with Malaria in order to study the effects of new and experimental drugs to combat the disease. Nazi doctors later on trial at Nuremberg cite this American study to defend their own actions during the Holocaust.

1942 - Chemical Warfare Services begins mustard gas experiments on approximately 4,000 servicemen. The experiments continue until 1945 and made use of Seventh Day Adventists who chose to become human guinea pigs rather than serve on active duty.

1943 - In response to Japan's full-scale germ warfare program, the U.S. begins research on biological weapons at Fort Detrick, MD.

1944 - U.S. Navy uses human subjects to test gas masks and clothing. Individuals were locked in a gas chamber and exposed to mustard gas and lewisite.

1945 - Project Paperclip is initiated. The U.S. State Department, Army intelligence, and the CIA recruit Nazi scientists and offer them immunity and secret identities in exchange for work on top secret government projects in the United States.

1945 - "Program F" is implemented by the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission (AEC). This is the most extensive U.S. study of the health effects of fluoride, which was the key chemical component in atomic bomb production. One of the most toxic chemicals known to man, fluoride, it is found, causes marked adverse effects to the central nervous system but much of the information is squelched in the name of national security because of fear that lawsuits would undermine full-scale production of atomic bombs.

1946 - Patients in VA hospitals are used as guinea pigs for medical experiments. In order to allay suspicions, the order is given to change the word "experiments" to "investigations" or "observations" whenever reporting a medical study performed in one of the nation's veteran's hospitals.

1947 - Colonel E.E. Kirkpatrick of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission issues a secret document (Document 07075001, January 8, 1947) stating that the agency will begin administering intravenous doses of radioactive substances to human subjects.

1947 - The CIA begins its study of LSD as a potential weapon for use by American intelligence. Human subjects (both civilian and military) are used with and without their knowledge.

1950 - Department of Defense begins plans to detonate nuclear weapons in desert areas and monitor downwind residents for medical problems and mortality rates.

1950 - In an experiment to determine how susceptible an American city would be to biological attack, the U.S. Navy sprays a cloud of bacteria from ships over San Francisco. Monitoring devices are situated throughout the city in order to test the extent of infection. Many residents become ill with pneumonia-like symptoms.

1951 - Department of Defense begins open air tests using disease-producing bacteria and viruses. Tests last through 1969 and there is concern that people in the surrounding areas have been exposed.

1953 - U.S. military releases clouds of zinc cadmium sulfide gas over Winnipeg, St. Louis, Minneapolis, Fort Wayne, the Monocacy River Valley in Maryland, and Leesburg, Virginia. Their intent is to determine how efficiently they could disperse chemical agents.

1953 - Joint Army-Navy-CIA experiments are conducted in which tens of thousands of people in New York and San Francisco are exposed to the airborne germs Serratia marcescens and Bacillus glogigii.

1953 - CIA initiates Project MKULTRA. This is an eleven year research program designed to produce and test drugs and biological agents that would be used for mind control and behavior modification. Six of the subprojects involved testing the agents on unwitting human beings.

1955 - The CIA, in an experiment to test its ability to infect human populations with biological agents, releases a bacteria withdrawn from the Army's biological warfare arsenal over Tampa Bay, Fl.

1956 - U.S. military releases mosquitoes infected with Yellow Fever over Savannah, Ga and Avon Park, Fl. Following each test, Army agents posing as public health officials test victims for effects.

1960 - The Army Assistant Chief-of-Staff for Intelligence (ACSI) authorizes field testing of LSD in Europe and the Far East. Testing of the European population is code named Project THIRD CHANCE; testing of the Asian population is code named Project DERBY HAT.

1965 - Project CIA and Department of Defense begin Project MKSEARCH, a program to develop a capability to manipulate human behavior through the use of mind-altering drugs.

1965 - Prisoners at the Holmesburg State Prison in Philadelphia are subjected to dioxin, the highly toxic chemical component of Agent Orange used in Viet Nam. The men are later studied for development of cancer, which indicates that Agent Orange had been a suspected carcinogen all along.

1966 - CIA initiates Project MKOFTEN, a program to test the toxicological effects of certain drugs on humans and animals.

1966 - U.S. Army dispenses Bacillus subtilis variant niger throughout the New York City subway system. More than a million civilians are exposed when army scientists drop lightbulbs filled with the bacteria onto ventilation grates.

1967 - CIA and Department of Defense implement Project MKNAOMI, successor to MKULTRA and designed to maintain, stockpile and test biological and chemical weapons.

1968 - CIA experiments with the possibility of poisoning drinking water by injecting chemicals into the water supply of the FDA in Washington, D.C.

1969 - Dr. Robert MacMahan of the Department of Defense requests from congress $10 million to develop, within 5 to 10 years, a synthetic biological agent to which no natural immunity exists.

1970 - Funding for the synthetic biological agent is obtained under H.R. 15090. The project, under the supervision of the CIA, is carried out by the Special Operations Division at Fort Detrick, the army's top secret biological weapons facility. Speculation is raised that molecular biology techniques are used to produce AIDS-like retroviruses.

1970 - United States intensifies its development of "ethnic weapons" (Military Review, Nov., 1970), designed to selectively target and eliminate specific ethnic groups who are susceptible due to genetic differences and variations in DNA.

1975 - The virus section of Fort Detrick's Center for Biological Warfare Research is renamed the Fredrick Cancer Research Facilities and placed under the supervision of the National Cancer Institute (NCI) . It is here that a special virus cancer program is initiated by the U.S. Navy, purportedly to develop cancer-causing viruses. It is also here that retrovirologists isolate a virus to which no immunity exists. It is later named HTLV (Human T-cell Leukemia Virus).

1977 - Senate hearings on Health and Scientific Research confirm that 239 populated areas had been contaminated with biological agents between 1949 and 1969. Some of the areas included San Francisco, Washington, D.C., Key West, Panama City, Minneapolis, and St. Louis.

1978 - Experimental Hepatitis B vaccine trials, conducted by the CDC, begin in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco. Ads for research subjects specifically ask for promiscuous homosexual men.

1981 - First cases of AIDS are confirmed in homosexual men in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco, triggering speculation that AIDS may have been introduced via the Hepatitis B vaccine.

1985 - According to the journal Science (227:173-177), HTLV and VISNA, a fatal sheep virus, are very similar, indicating a close taxonomic and evolutionary relationship.

1986 - According to the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (83:4007-4011), HIV and VISNA are highly similar and share all structural elements, except for a small segment which is nearly identical to HTLV. This leads to speculation that HTLV and VISNA may have been linked to produce a new retrovirus to which no natural immunity exists.

1986 - A report to Congress reveals that the U.S. Government's current generation of biological agents includes: modified viruses, naturally occurring toxins, and agents that are altered through genetic engineering to change immunological character and prevent treatment by all existing vaccines.

1987 - Department of Defense admits that, despite a treaty banning research and development of biological agents, it continues to operate research facilities at 127 facilities and universities around the nation.

1990 - More than 1500 six-month old black and Hispanic babies in Los Angeles are given an "experimental" measles vaccine that had never been licensed for use in the United States. CDC later admits that parents were never informed that the vaccine being injected to their children was experimental.

1994 - With a technique called "gene tracking," Dr. Garth Nicolson at the MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, TX discovers that many returning Desert Storm veterans are infected with an altered strain of Mycoplasma incognitus, a microbe commonly used in the production of biological weapons. Incorporated into its molecular structure is 40 percent of the HIV protein coat, indicating that it had been man-made.

1994 - Senator John D. Rockefeller issues a report revealing that for at least 50 years the Department of Defense has used hundreds of thousands of military personnel in human experiments and for intentional exposure to dangerous substances. Materials included mustard and nerve gas, ionizing radiation, psychochemicals, hallucinogens, and drugs used during the Gulf War.

1995 - U.S. Government admits that it had offered Japanese war criminals and scientists who had performed human medical experiments salaries and immunity from prosecution in exchange for data on biological warfare research.

1995 - Dr. Garth Nicolson, uncovers evidence that the biological agents used during the Gulf War had been manufactured in Houston, TX and Boca Raton, Fl and tested on prisoners in the Texas Department of Corrections.

1996 - Department of Defense admits that Desert Storm soldiers were exposed to chemical agents.

1997 - Eighty-eight members of Congress sign a letter demanding an investigation into bioweapons use & Gulf War Syndrome.

[Hissyspit]

201. Bullshit.

He's been taken quite out of context.

Enjoy yourself here.

[rhett o rick]

205. PLEASE include links to the actual quote. nm

[Qutzupalotl]

11. They were twisted after being taken out of context.

He was saying that God condemns America for killing innocents in Hiroshima and elsewhere. But Obama's political opponents twisted that to say Wright was teaching his followers to damn America. That's a big difference. I've seen that here on DU, from supposed progressives.

[duhneece]

72. Amen, Q

We will see most of our Democratic party candidates smeared, lied about, misquoted, and worse--Rev Wright spoke truth. He said what needed to be said.

[RamboLiberal]

134. Just start a thread here on Hiroshima and Nagasaki

and there will be more DU'ers arguing that America didn't need to drop the bombs than those arguing for it. And many of those comments will be as harsh or harsher against the U.S. Govt as anything Wright said. I've seen and participated in those threads in GD in the past.

[Love Bug]

14. He's not helping Obama by doing this interview

He's just helping to keep the issue alive.

[RamboLiberal]

133. Who cares - this good man's name has been trashed by

the lazy f'ing media. Maybe his speaking out will help, maybe it won't. But I'd rather see this man speak out about what was done to him than have him shut up just so Obama can win. If the stupid voters of this country vote against Obama b/c of his pastor then so be it. Maybe 4 more years of Repuke rule will get their heads out of their butts!

[RaleighNCDUer]

183. Right. Everybody would be better off

if the lies were left unrefuted.

Particularly Hillary and McCain.

[Love Bug]

15. He's not helping Obama by doing this interview

He's just helping to keep the issue alive.

[darue]

52. standing against the right wing and punching them back in the face is job #1

that's how this is going to be won. by beating them and fighting back. not by hoping the issue dies away.

[Tim4319]

71. Because they will never let it die!

[Blue_Tires]

17. ttt

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

26. Simply ,Wright said something

in his opening according to what it says ,It seems he says his words are twisted, there Wright got it right.His words are indeed twisted.Falwell didn,t understand why nobody was there to greet him at the republican convention and he did not believe that he was not invited. But Bush was already in, Obama is not in.
That,s the difference.

If Obama can turn his back on all the people that live in places where the jobs have been dried up for twenty five years ,than what is his problem with turning his back on Wright? Does he owe Wright something?

I really don,t think Wright is doing Obama any favors by going on tv.There is no way for wright to demonstrate any fundamental value of those twisted words and statements.

Is anybody going to believe a word he says? Outside of his church fallowing I mean?

Do you think Obama can convince Wright to just go dry up?

[darue]

54. obama hasn't turned his back on people in area with bad job prospects

for fucks sake, he wants to help them. you should know that by know. get over your sad little hurt feelings and grow up. he wasn't talking about any one in particular. you have no business being upset with what he said. you're just playing right into the hands of the fascists.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

152. Thats a good du response

He lacks experience . He,s a good democrate and a good senator.

[Phoonzang]

19. I really wish he would shut up and go away

Doesn't help Obama to have him start yapping now. Wait until December.

[trickyguy]

21. Rev. Wright did say "God damn America". Heard the clip several times.

So what can he do to undo what he said. Not much except to engage in some double-talk like in this post.

I can understand his anger with America. But I don't understand his trying to white-wash what he said.:evilgrin:

[thereismore]

28. What he said was we should not imlpore God to bless America, because what we do

is telling God to damn America. Get it? I didn't think so. You are on Ignore, so don't respond.

[oasis]

32. Ignore function=Alarm clock snooze button. Eventually, ya gotta wake up.

:boring: In the meantime, enjoy your time in Obama's DU echo chamber.:hi:

[CreekDog]

83. was he asking God to damn America?

[oasis]

91. I don't think so, but preachers should refrain from such offensive language.

Leave it to Obama to seek out that particular preacher to be his mentor.

[CreekDog]

93. then what's the controversy? using the word "damn"?

:popcorn:

[oasis]

96. I've been scolded many times by "born agains" for using the term "god damn".

Now what do you suppose church folk think of a preacher who uses that term?

And don't use the folks in Wright's congregation for your answer.

[CreekDog]

98. were you swearing or using it as part of a theological lesson

God damns sin. Saying that is not wrong.

If you say, "God damn this stupid car" --that's just plain swearing.

If you understand the difference between the two, then chances to have productive exchanges increase radically.

[oasis]

156. Doesn't matter whether or not I understand it. The damage is done. (eom)

[Critters2]

142. He was preaching to the folks in his congregation,

so if they're not offended, it's no one else's business.

He doesn't serve a born again congregation.

[oasis]

155. Wrong, It's everybody's business now. (eom)

[AvaMae]

146. then what's the controversy? using the word damn?

Preaching while black

A way to get at Obama

[EFerrari]

181. Leave it to narrow minded people to spit at someone like Wright.

Really, it says so much more about you.

[AvaMae]

107. Rev Jeremiah Wright

MSNBC has just played another Wright snippet and condemned it
out of hand, from the Bill Moyer interview to be aired
tomorrow..  .... the several pundits claiming Obama HAS to
respond...

If you pull up any of the YOUTUBE entries that you can find
doing a search under "Fox Lied",
you will find the full text of the sermon Wright gave where he
said "God Damn America for killing innocents."  And
quoted several chapters and verses in the Bible as he made the
case for it...weaving it together with US policy since
inception against native Americans, blacks, red, brown and
yellow nations, and QUOTING a Reagan appointee Ed Peck,
Ambassador to Iraq, saying 'Chickens Come Home to Roost' for
foreign policy that has affronted the extremists (mostly
Muslims) who don't have a country to go to war, but have
people determined to do harm to as many of as they can... 

Of Significance is that bin Laden SAID he did 9/11 because of
US meddling in the middle east, and referenced in particular a
military base in Saudi Arabia which has since been
dismantled... 

In all the looping that all the networks did of the original
edited version produced by Fox, the second phrase of Wright's
statement is omitted....'for killing innocents'.... Wright was
addressing the buildup to war, waring that there innocent
lives lost, that we were going for revenge and that always
involved the death of innocents.   All of which has turned out
to be true.  

There is one other thing that Wright says in some of the
snippets that NO ONE BELIVES.... and some connect to the
Tuskegee Experiment (Google if you don't know what this is).

Wright had high praise for Bill Clinton in his
"Government's Change/God Does Not Change sermon..but no
one seems to know about the link below....


http://www.salon.com/news/1998/12/cov_23news.html

The right wing attack on the Rev. Wright, a decorated veteran,
by racist bigots who themselves avoided service, is a modern
day version of another black man lynching.  I don't know that
any mortal has the right to critique how a minister weaves day
to day events with the Bible to preach to his congregation
from his pulpit...its never been done.  I do know that we will
have to watch the
pundits bring Barack Obama down if we don't put a stop to it. 

[oasis]

157. If there is a political advantage to be taken, any politician will take it. (eom)

[humbled_opinion]

203. Well that is a little bit of a stretch....

Context is a messy thing.... I don't really like it at all. He didn't say what you said he said God Damn America for its actions of course you can spin it anyway you want and leave it out there and then only come back after it is an issue and context it all...but I am done with that... It was ugly and Obama should have had better judgement then to stay in the church with Wright having views like this.

Its hard to escape the lack of judgement part on Obama.... Why did Oprah leave that same church? eventually someone is going to figure it out that she knew her image would suffer if she stayed in that church with Wright.... If it gets proven that Oprah had better judgement then Obama the show is over for him in the GE...

Just saying.

[oasis]

29. "God damn America". Rev. Wright meant it in a nice way.

:rofl:

[haymakeragain]

34. Uhh, what was that whole sentence, the one with

"God damn america" in the middle of it? since it is so important to you jingos, please give us the whole sentence. I mean, if it hurt your sensibilities so badly, you must know the entire sentence and in what context he said it, or are you just being a simpleton jingo?

[oasis]

38. Okay here goes: "Not god bless America...God damn America" Rev. Wright.

Felling better now?

[haymakeragain]

41. Still being a dick I see, that's not the entire sentence and you should

make yourself aware of the entire sentence, and for that matter, the context of the sentence before you look like more of a jingoistic dick.

So what was the entire sentence?

[RaleighNCDUer]

39. It's called a 'Jeremiahad'.

Later in the same book the Lord again reveals the intent of his prophecies of disaster:

Jeremiah 26:3 Perhaps they will listen and each will turn from his evil way. Then I will relent and not bring on them the disaster I was planning because of the evil they have done.

Jeremiah 26:13 Now reform your ways and your actions and obey the LORD your God. Then the LORD will relent and not bring the disaster he has pronounced against you.

Jeremiah 36:3 Perhaps when the people of Judah hear about every disaster I plan to inflict on them, each of them will turn from his wicked way; then I will forgive their wickedness and their sin.

These verses in Jeremiah are like islands of hope in a terrifying sea of fire. Prophecies of judgment are often worded as if God hates the people and that their fate is sealed. Our Lord goes to such lengths in firing words of doom at people not because there is no hope of them escaping the prophesied disasters, but precisely because there is hope. Prophecies are worded to seem final, not because everything is set in concrete, but to arm the prophecies with sufficient power to blast people back to reality. Our loving Lord goes to the extreme of what seem angry, hate-filled words as a last-ditch effort to snap his loved ones out of the complacency that is threatening their eternity. In his grace, he is giving them a foretaste of what it would be like unless they get serious with God, the only one who can save them. So most prophecies are not declaring the inevitable future but are detailing what the target audience can expect if they do not change their hearts.

It is not our purpose here to explore prophecies of blessings, but Scripture is clear that the same principle applies: a change of heart – this time a change for the worse – can also nullify prophecies of blessings (1 Samuel 2:30; Jeremiah 18:7; Ezekiel 33:13).

(Ooops - I lost the link - but it is self explanatory. The prophet, or preacher, calls for the wrath of god should the people or the nation NOT change their ways. But then, you really do know that already, don't you. I'm a fucking atheist, and I know it.)

[oasis]

74. Too bad the media won't offer that explanation. I have no problem with

what Wright said, but many other American voters do.

[darue]

95. the media has got to stop driving perceptions. it must be stopped, and it ends this election.

if it doesn't end, we can just stop talking about 'democracy' because it'll be nothing but a hollow joke.

[LanternWaste]

167. Then possibly it's part and parcel *our* responsibility to

Then possibly it's part and parcel *our* responsibility to divest the American voters of this myth by explaining context.

Heck, I'm a Clinton supporter and have been doing just that at my office since this whole thing began.

But then again, my support for either candidate doesn't preclude me doing that and I realize that I hold a minority position on that...

[darue]

56. grow up and stop playing the republican game.

think for one god damned moment. the evil this country has done calls on god to damn the country not bless is. not a big fucking deal. I don't agree but it's a concept well within his rights as a preacher to say it. are you on feerepublic blasting Falwell?

[oasis]

76. Read post # 74. Obama has a giant problem with Wright's comments.

You'd better grow up and get to work on separating that Dynamic Duo in the minds of the American public.:think:

[darue]

81. ya, his comments about saying what a pol has to say... another thing to grind on and on about

who doubts that that happens? who would doubt that every politician, every one, says things they 'have to' to _be_ politicians? That's the definition of politician in a representative democracy. he's representing lots of people and has to take their oppionins into account, and so... has to say some things. big deal.

[oasis]

90. Yes big deal. And another reason why the party should nominate Hillary. (eom)

[darue]

94. you think she's anything but a completely sold out corporate-flunky?

if she isn't exactly that, then she MUST be saying things "she HAS to"

I'll vote for her if she's the nominee, but I don't think it's going to happen.

[RaleighNCDUer]

190. No, Oasis has a big problem with Wright's comments.

That's Oasis' problem, not Obama's or America's.

[CreekDog]

97. you know, God does damn people in the bible

look it up.

and look straight ahead, don't turn around --trust me on this. piss God off and he does damn you. sorry to break it to you. :shrug:

[oasis]

159. You don't have to be sorry "breaking the news" to me, it's the other voters

all over this great land that have a problem with the Rev.'s comments.

Perhaps you could take out a newspaper ad and try to explain it to them. ;-)

[CreekDog]

161. You're special

most people don't get a "sorry". :rofl:

[LanternWaste]

168. Or perhaps we all could as the truth is quite important, yes...?

Or perhaps we all could as the truth is quite important, yes...?

[bobthedrummer]

73. Most Christians understand the context-God does damn nations that has leadership asking God to bless

their evil. I don't expect non-believers to grasp that fact.

Should be an outstanding Bill Moyers Journal.

K&R

[oasis]

78. Bill Moyers will be aired one night. "God damn America" will be aired until November.

Doesn't really matter what the non-believers take on it is. Wright has become Obama's Willie Horton.

[RaleighNCDUer]

106. That's why it is lost on the fundies.

If you want good biblical information and have two sources, a fundie and an atheist, ask the atheist.

Fundies are equally non-believers as are atheists, but the atheists know WHY.

[LanternWaste]

169. Sheesh. I wouldn't ask either one.

Sheesh. I wouldn't ask either one. When it comes to Biblical biases, one's as bad as the other...

[CreekDog]

82. was he asking God to damn America?

?

[AvaMae]

123. Just so you don't ever embarrass yourself....

Wright said:

"God Damn America for killing innocents. Its in the Bible."


And you don't have a dog in this fight....until the right wing crazies make a characiture of
something else from someone else, out of whole cloth, and then condemn them for it...

Its an old republican trick...

That's why everyone believes John Kerry lied, and Al Gore invented the internet.

It has to stop.

[Straight Shooter]

130. "God Damn America for killing innocents. Its in the Bible."

The Republicans consider a fetus to be an innocent, regardless of its stage of development.

Just sayin'

[AvaMae]

140. God Damn America for killing innocents. Its in the Bible."

Yes, and white preachers have said asked for God's damnation on the heads of those who
believe in a woman's right to choose, on Gays, on feminists, and I don't know what all...

..........it was right wing republicans who lifted the snippet out of context and worked themselves
up into such righteous indignation that only a lynching would make them feel better.... They are no better than Imus to lose their shows and venues... Just that none of us demanded it.

They're STILL using Wright to go after Obama...

[Straight Shooter]

144. "white preachers have said asked for God's damnation on the heads of those ..."

On the "heads" of those, meaning those individuals. But never "God. damn. America." See the difference? Damning individuals versus damning an entire nation.

Obama is solidly pro choice. He will have to do some fancy footwork on how he can be so committed to Christ and yet be pro choice. The fundies never give an inch on that issue. Never.

Personally, I don't give a rat's a**, as I don't believe in some paternalistic entity in the sky who vacillates between malevolence and benevolence towards humanity.

[RaleighNCDUer]

166. No responsible preacher could ever say such a thing --

19. Behold, I say that these things all shall come upon this nation and the people of Jerusalem.
20. And Jesus looked about and said, Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou cruel city of Jerusalem, that slays the prophets in the streets and kills the holy men whom God has sent to you!
21. Lo, I would oft have gathered you as children to the fold of God; but you would not.
22. You have rejected God, and now your house is desolate, and you shall see me not again till you can say,
23. Thrice blessed is the son of man who comes as son of God.


What a rabble rouser. Anybody who talks like that should be crucified.

[tavalon]

127. Did you hear the whole phrase?

There was more and in context, it isn't so damning. But heck, it's more fun to demonize than to find out the truth, isn't it?

[Uncle Joe]

176. The keyword you used is clip, watch the whole interview with Moyers.

Do you believe God blessed slavery or genocide against the Native Americans, or the government experimenting on blacks by letting them suffer through Syphilis or interning innocent and patriotic Japanese Americans in detention camps while their sons, brothers and fathers fought and died in Europe to become the highest decorated unit in the entire war? Do you believe God loved or blessed those things? If you do, I can't imagine you're speaking of the same God that sent Jesus Christ to die on the cross.

[Time for change]

25. Well said

I hope he does more of this kind of thing.

[DinahMoeHum]

36. BTW, Wright served our nation in uniform. Where are the dog-tags

on his detractors???? Buncha bed-wetting chickenhawk pansies.

:evilfrown:

[katerinasmommy]

45. Wright needs to shut up

I don't understand what is wrong with this man and I frankly don't understand why an Obama supporter would find this interview to be a positive thing. LOOK at what he's saying:

"Asked his response to the senator's speech, Wright said, "He's a politician, I'm a pastor."

"I do what I do. He does what politicians do," Wright said. "What happened in Philadelphia, where he had to respond to the sound bites, he responded as a politician.""


In other words, Obama is just another politician who says what he has to in order to get elected. I'm an Obama supporter, have been from the beginning and this INFURIATES me. That is BLATANTLY untrue. Does he WANT Obama to be seen in the way that flies in the face of what Obama has been standing for? If he didn't mean to say it that way he should STILL shut up. Obama should take this opportunity to REJECT and DENOUNCE this guy immediately for mischaracterizing him.

[YvonneCa]

163. Welcome to DU. n/t

[Rex_Goodheart]

46. A full of crap "pastor" who got busted

How crass of anybody to use his own words against him! This man even went so far as to include as a doctrine of his church that black people should not participate in white America's "middleclassness".

Witness Wright's ridiculous strawman argument:

“It’s to paint me as something — ‘Something’s wrong with me. There’s nothing wrong with this country … for its policies. We’re perfect. Our hands are free. Our hands have no blood on them,’”

Nobody claimed nor insinuated any such thing.

On the other hand, where does Wright ever declare that blacks must share in the responsibility for their condition?

[madrchsod]

58. maybe you should ask someone who goes to his church......

[crankychatter]

101. Raw materialism is bad

you like it, you live it.

the Rev has another idea.

so find a different church.

[EFerrari]

202. Inpenetrable stupidity. n/t

[ut oh]

48. The Clintons seeked counsiling from the very same...

When the Monica thing happened...

Wasn't this just recently posted? MM thread I believe...

So, what do the Hillary supporters have to say about that, or is that more of the 'sweep it under the rug and whistle' acitvity?

[AvaMae]

110. The Clintons seeking counselling from Rev. Wright...

Yes, the day the Star report was due, and Bill Clinton had to confess to a group of pastors from all over the country, and beg forgiveness and prayers, and go into counselling... and all of them returned to their churches to tell their people how repentent he was....

...................and Hillary never admitted she even knew him.... even after the picture surfaced of him with Bill at the White House...

Rather, she stood in front of cameras...and no doubt Richard Mellon Scaife, and said "He would not be my pastor."

Its one of the little things that I have tucked away in my mind.... don't think Hillar can win
fair and square, and if she does somehow managed to take it down and dirty, I won't have a problem
not voting for her. And that from someone who loved them, worked for them, supported them,
all through their White House years and beyond...

[DrZeeLit]

153. I just wish ONE reporter would have said, "OH, but he was your pastor,

when Bill asked him to pray at the White House. You know, during Bill's 'unfortunate incident? Or were you not involved in that?"

Just one.
Just one person to point out what a SHAM she is.

But nobody has the balls.

Darm!

[NM Independent]

50. I can't wait to see him set some people straight.

Everything he says has been either twisted, taken out of context, or is just too painfully truthful for the nation to take.

I feel bad for him, and frankly agree with nearly every word he says. I think the outrage is caused by people not being able to be honest with themselves.

[Rex_Goodheart]

53. You agree that our government

invented AIDS? To deliberately harm people?

I doubt that you do... I think your defense is b.s... just as Wright's will be on PBS.

[wellst0nev0ter]

69. Not Quite Sure Where AIDS Came From Exactly

But Bill Cosby seems to think exactly the same thing. I guess it's time for (white) America to throw one of it's favorite Negroes under the bus now :sarcasm:

[RamboLiberal]

128. You know what - there are a lot of conspiracy theories about

what our government has known and done. FDR permitted Pearl Harbor, the JFK assasination theories, UFOs, CIA bringing drugs to the inner city, the 9-11 theories (which flourish in a forum right here on DU), etc. We build whole TV and radio shows around this stuff. But if black america has a conspiracy theory and Rev Wright dares preach about it somehow that taints Obama? Please!

[AvaMae]

145. I can't wait to see him set some people straight....

No, the outrage was caused by the Freepers, who discussed kicking it to Rush Limbaugh. The next think I knew, Sean Hannity had it, and from there it was picked up or (for all I know) transmitted to MSNBC, CNN..

[L4TRUTH]

61. Did anyone hear when he asked for forgiveness for saying God D*mn?

If anyone bothered to listent to more than a few seconds of the sermon, they would have heard him ask for forgiveness for using "God D*mn."

Here's the quote "turn to your neighbor and tell them to forgive him for using the God d*mn, but it is in the Bible though, blessings and cursings are in the Bible."

No, it does not absolve him from saying it in the first place, but it showed me that he recognized that he crossed the line. And that's what we want, right? Forgiveness, anyone?

[Straight Shooter]

75. How many times has Bill Clinton asked for forgiveness for his indiscretion?

In fact, Rev. Wright was one of those he asked.

How does Rev. Wright react, years later? Has he forgiven? No, by God. Instead he channels "Elvis the Pelvis" in his sermon, like a prepubescent boy imitating a peepshow.

[L4TRUTH]

85. He asked for forgiveness?

I don't remember Bill Clinton askin for forgiveness. I do believe he said that "It's nobody's business but ours."

However, it doesn't matter to me whether someone asks for forgiveness. I think we can give it anyway. And "Elvis the Pelvis"? So what? Maybe inappropriate, but I've seen worse in other churches. I don't think that's something to stone the man over. <shrug>

[Straight Shooter]

87. He did. That's what the prayer breakfast was all about.

There were a multitude of ministers there, including Wright. I don't know who was in charge of choosing guests, but I think Jesse Jackson had something to do with it, IIRC.

I've never seen a minister gyrate his pelvis in church. Thank God.

[L4TRUTH]

114. Again, nothing to STONE the man over

[RaleighNCDUer]

165. Yah. It's tough, being a Lutheren.

Ya know, not all churches are alike. And no church or preaching style is more appropriate than any other.

Part of being a progressive is a willingness to see the world through lenses other than your own.

[madrchsod]

62. you can`t trust anyone who is a United States Marine

someone who helped in getting an american pilot released during the balkan war and helped bill clinton when he was caught with monica around his dick. a man who is well respected in his church,the surrounding community and with in the religious community at large..

yes the man is clearly dangerous only to those who have`t a clue about the man and his congregation...

[struggle4progress]

63. Former Marine. Former Navy hospital corpsman. Three Presidential commendations.

And a pastoral willingness to challenge his listeners

[madrchsod]

70. i forgot he was a corpsman....saving lives -how awful!

remember--> once a Marine always a Marine...

[DutchLiberal]

84. Rev. Weight doesn't need to defend himself. He spoke the truth. He can be proud of himself.

He's a real patriot. :patriot:

[coriolis]

86. Yawn. Just another hypocritical shitbag lying fuckwad preacher.

They're a dime a dozen.

[YvonneCa]

162. Welcome to DU. n/t

[doc03]

92. His words are twisted alright! He blamed America for everything

wrong in the world today and he said "Don't God bless America, God Damn America".

[darue]

99. oh please. talk about out of context. are you so blind you think we've done no wrong?

America WILL be held responsible for it's actions. He sure didn't 'blame' the US for 'everything'

[doc03]

105. Well actually he only blamed white Americans I guess n/t

[darue]

135. well who else has been running the country? n/t

[RamboLiberal]

126. I bet you didn't take an extra hour or two to research

and read/listen to his full sermons. Nope, bet you depended just on that loop the F'ing media chose to play hundreds of times and continues to play.

Well I sat down for a number of hours and watched/listened/read as much of his sermons I can find. It's no wonder he has 8,000 members in his church. He's a damn fine speaker and a biblical scholar. I can testify those loops were way out of context.

I hate the self-rightous chattering class on TV (almost all white) who ask why Obama stayed in the church for 20 years yet couldn't do their friggin jobs and research the story!

Also this goes to Hillary and her minions who continue to take advantage of this!

[stlsaxman]

100. Only Bill Moyers is able to bring us the truth about Rev. Wright- 3 easy steps for you bashers...

On Friday there are 3 things you can do to get the facts about the man-

1) Sit in front of your TV and STFU...

2) Open your mind...

3) Watch and listen to Bill Moyers interview Rev. Wright...

If you're not careful you might learn a lot about the man that the Nazis don't want you to know!

You may be surprised.

[GoldenOldie]

113. For those who hear only what they want to hear.....

I recommend that Rev. Wright be allowed to appear (nationally) before all those who are so ready to crucify him. I also recommend that those who choose to use him as their political bait be forced to sit, listen, and look at photo's: lynchings/"strange fruit;" Tuskegee experiments, White Sands explosions, Affects of extreme dosage of radiation on children and adults, affects of LSD.......Our government using "WE THE PEOPLE," who were never informed or asked to be parties to AMERICA's secret experimentation. Rev Wrights slide-show should also consist of photo's of New Orleans and the Gulf Coast, Iraqi and Afghan children dead and others with arms and legs blown off and their homes and villages destroyed. Photo's of AMERICAn flag draped coffins returning home.....oops, sorry, that's not allowed! Photo's of our severely wounded troops returning home waiting to be given the care they were promised.

Having spent many years working within a military medical facility and having had the opportunity to learn the stories of men and women who had actually been lab rats for "AMERICA," and with Rev. Wright not only a Marine but a Medic, I know damn well he speaks from the heart and with a shit-load of experience. Rev. Wright doesn't offend GOD, he only offends those whose political ox has been gored.

As for the Clinton's, I lost any respect or regard for them that I ever held. They have no trouble destroying Rev. Wrights life and reputation after using him as a photo-op in counseling Bill in his sexual addiction......as Bill likes to say, "Give me a break?"

I am an old white woman, and I approve this message.

[fascisthunter]

115. Reverend Wright's Words Were Twisted, Chopped and Taken Way out of Context

Then again, those promoting the idea that Rev. Wright's words were "hatefilled", or "untrue" are also in denial of the issues our country is presently faced with. They deny reality then make up lies to do so. I think is safe to say those people are liars or have a political axe to grind in this primary season.

Our so-called "media" is corporately controlled propaganda to keep those getting screwed at bay.

[GeorgeGist]

122. He ought to know ...

he's been twisting words to gain wealth and power for a long, long time. Conceited fool.

[darue]

137. that is so fucked it's almost sad. n/t

[EFerrari]

182. Sad.

[juno jones]

129. Oh shit.

They are about to throw BILL MOYERS under the goddam bus.

Because I think he has a clue about the true stature of Rev. Wright.

[Orsino]

132. They were not twisted by the media; they were taken out of context...

...in such a way as to make uncomfortable many of the people who might otherwise have agreed with him. The twisting occurred within the frightened, insecure minds unable to let themselves creach the same conclusions.

[Mimosa]

136. Black preachers, Christianity, and TRUTH

Black preachers, Christianity, Voudou and TRUTH
Posted by Mimosa


I cannot see the point of contributing to Democratic underground website since whoever owns it makes sure it is paid for by LOTS of targeted advertising. Look at the forums. ADS pay for this and make a profit.

I cannot start a topic unless I give money. I'm going to pass for now. I co-administer a forum where we haven't asked for contributions and every poster/member can post topics and replies.Here's the link to Vincent and Morticia's Speakeasy. Please visit.

http://vincentandmorticiasspeakeasy14846.yuku.com /

But here is my point: the media and most mainstream white people know nothing about African American religion. The Christian faith of black people is ferocious and has strengthened slaves and free coloured people since America was founded.

I get sick when I see on TV the shallow racebaitng which goes on against black and white people of FAITH. How many white people have ever attended black churches regularly? Less than 1%? If you all did you would understand the strength which black Christianity *exactly as preached by Rev. Wright* has given to the community and helped blacks OVERCOME racism for 300 years in the New World.

I realised my own Madrina would be subjected to the media distortion which has been mocking and caricaturing the mission of Jeremiah Wright if I or any of her parishioners had ever chosen to participate in politics. For an easy example, when young 6 or 7 year old boys started disobeying their parents and getting into trouble, she would advise parents to spank them or keep them away from TV and games. She brought up 7 children who are successful, who went to school and didn't get in trouble. She told the parents of the neighbourhood to discipline their children with love. In summer and after school ids frequently hung around the 'church' which also had a storefront botanica. Reverend Gamble (Lorita Hunnicutt Mitchell is featured in Ron Davis' "American Voudoun) of New Orleans marched for human rights and for just causes. She also had said to her kids and others: "Better I should spank you now than you go astray and be shot by the police later on."

After living in Nevada for awhile, Reverend Lorita Hunnicutt Gamble went back to New Orleans and continues her preaching and helping people today.

[classysassy]

151. Amen

you are so on target,God bless you.

[RamboLiberal]

138. Videos from this church

http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=TRINITYCHGO

White Activist Catholic priest defends Wright to a Faux News Reporter. Part One: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiSutcBArDU
Part Two: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBKeCIDGvwY

Even Huckabee cuts Wright more slack than many Dems. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNwMPNxwHmQ&feature=related

[RamboLiberal]

141. Imagine how Faux News, Limbaugh, Hannity, O' Reilly

would twist the words of this black preacher if he were alive today! Imagine them playing this in an endless loop!

"God didn't call America to engage in a senseless, unjust war. . . . And we are criminals in that war. We've committed more war crimes almost than any nation in the world, and I'm going to continue to say it. And we won't stop it because of our pride and our arrogance as a nation. But God has a way of even putting nations in their place." .... then predicted this response from the Almighty: "And if you don't stop your reckless course, I'll rise up and break the backbone of your power."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/20/AR2008032003021.html

[RamboLiberal]

143. Martin Luther King - what was said about his speech on Vietnam

On April 4th, 1967, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. gave a sermon at the prestigious Riverside Church, an interdemoninational church in New York City. The sermon was called Beyond Vietnam-A Time to Break Silence.

The reaction to this speech was swift and decisive:

"demagogic slander that sounded like a script for Radio Hanoi"
-Time Magazine

"diminished his usefulness to his cause, his country, his people."
-The Washington Post

"the most dangerous and effective Negro leader in the country."
-FBI memo

http://jazmen8.dailykos.com/

After he spoke out against the war in Vietnam in 1967 his then deputy Andrew Young described the response thus:

"Nationally, the reaction was like a torrent of hate and venom. This man who had been respected worldwide as a Nobel Prize winner and as the only person in America who was advocating change without violence, suddenly applied his nonviolence ethic and practice to the realm of foreign policy. And no, people said, it's all right for black people to be nonviolent when they're dealing with white people, but white people don't need to be nonviolent when they're dealing with brown people. As a Nobel Prize winner we expected people not to agree with it, but to take it seriously. We didn't get that. We got an emotional outburst attacking his right to have an opinion."

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/gary_younge/2007/01/post_920.html

The speech: http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/mlkatimetobreaksilence.htm

Imagine that in 1967 we had 24/7 cable nets with the likes of Limbaugh, Hannity, O' Reilly and all the rest - imagine what a traitor they would paint MLK. He would've been treated like Rev. Wright and any politician would've run from him.

[Vanje]

147. Eeuuw. Whats that smell

It smells like GDP in here.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

154. How do you take a preachers word

out of context ! If any of it makes sense the preacher stays and when it don,t or hits a sour note the preacher goes and thats about all there is to that. When the note runs sour it,s this way folks -the congregation will say to the preacher, The time for change has come!And when it comes the preacher goes! Wright or wrong it makes no difference when the congregation will proclaim the time for change has come!

I guess Wright flew the coup befor the congregation got around to doing what congregations do~!

Drove my chevy to the levy but the levy was dry.


And as the saying goes, if you can,t take the heat get out of the kitchen!
And remember ,being ready is better than not.

[haymakeragain]

172. Is your keyboard defective?

just curious

[Critters2]

189. He retired. He wasn't fired. Just reached retirement age. nt

[lonestarnot]

175. Can't be bothered with facts now can we.

[fbahrami]

177. A Sane Voice

among all the rhetoric.

I watched Rev. Wright on PBS and I have to say his are the *only* words that make any sense to me. I mean, I can no longer listen to any politician - Billary and Obama included. Rev. Wright is right: history has shown that this government (as well as all others) have failed their people, lied, and killed innocents.

What's controversial about this historical truth?

[Uncle Joe]

178. Nothing is controversial about it, if you can get past the fear of accepting

our own national humanity with all the virtue and vice, that go with it. I believe the biggest stumbling block people run in to with this is pride.

There is a proverb in the Bible

"Pride goes before a fall
and a haughty spirit before destruction"

I believe we as a people would be much better off if we could broaden our vision and change our "God Bless America" mentality to "God Bless Earth".

This isn't intended as a slam against atheists or agnostics.

[Hissyspit]

192. Obama Pastor: I Had Death Threats

Source: Guardian UK

Obama pastor: I had death threats

Jeremiah Wright re-emerges to say his church has been threatened with attack just as the Democratic race heads for its last big contest

Paul Harris in New York The Observer, Sunday April 27 2008
This article appeared in the Observer on Sunday April 27 2008 on p35 of the World news section. It was last updated at 00:00 on April 27 2008.

Racial divisions loomed over the Democratic race last night as Senator Barack Obama's controversial pastor Reverend Jeremiah Wright admitted his church has received bomb threats.

Wright, whose fiery sermons on America and race relations have stirred anger among some critics, has re-emerged into the headlines just as Obama and Senator Hillary Clinton kick off 10 days of campaigning in Indiana.

In his first interview since videos of Wright preaching began a storm of recrimination, Wright was asked by PBS journalist Bill Moyers if he had received death threats. 'Yes ... and bomb threats at the church,' Wright replied. 'What have we gotten into here? People ... telling us how they are going to wipe us off the face of the earth in the name of Jesus.' He also described how journalists had been harassing church members, including one who was dying in a hospice.

Read more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/apr/27/barackobama.hillaryclinton?gusrc=rss

---

Mods: Although this interview broadcast on Friday, this Sunday article is the first I have seen the 'death threat' info reported in MSM. If not LBN enough, please move to General Discussion.

[stillcool]

193. of course..

who would expect anything less? Nobody is really interested in who the man is, or what his life has been about. He is a pinata, to abuse according to personal taste.

[MadMaddie]

194. And yet the hate Mongering right wing preachers spewing their

filth on the airwaves...and the O'Leilly's and the mainstream media don't even mention it...

[stillcool]

195. they encourage it..

what did they think was going to happen?

[fascisthunter]

196. Yet Rush Limbaugh Can Apparently Encite a Riot to Happen at a Dem Convention

enough is enough

[rhett o rick]

206. With respect, why do we have so many threads discussing Obama's pastor? For Dem's to focus

on this issue is distracting and exactly what the right wing wants. It is one thing to defend someone but another to continually revisit the issue.

[ryanmuegge]

207. "How many years did Cheney serve?" = awesome.

oh, that part was delightful to hear.