GOP objects to bill allowing recounts

[tiptoe]

Source: Politico

By BEN ADLER | 4/25/08 4:50 AM EST Updated: 4/25/08 12:26 PM EST

Voting rights activists who hoped the federal government would help local governments pay for paper trails and audits for electronic voting machines have gone from elation to frustration as they watched Republicans who supported such a proposal in committee vote against bringing it to the House floor.

The result: The elections in November will likely be marred by the same accusations of fraud and error involving voting machines that arose in the aftermath of the 2004 presidential race.

When New Jersey Democratic Rep. Rush Holt’s Emergency Assistance for Secure Elections Act came up for a vote in the House Administration Committee on April 2, the Republicans on the committee gave it their unanimous support. But two weeks later, those same Republican members voted against moving the bill to the House floor. It would have taken a two-thirds vote to push the bill to the floor; with most House Republicans opposed, the bill didn’t make it that far.

Larry Norden, director of the voting technology project at the Brennan Center for Justice at New York University’s law school, called the vote “a sad statement on how little Congress has done on the issue of making sure elections are as secure and reliable as possible.”
...


Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0408/9841.html

---

(empahses mine)

"Successful [electronic voting] attacks can only be detected by examining the paper ballots:" ( from Security Analysis of the Diebold AccuBasic Interpreter ...see e-Vote Hacking — Insecurity of Electronic VoteMark-Recording & -Counting Machines

Excerpts of Ian Sancho's 4/3/2006 interview with Brad Friedman re Florida Law under Jeb Bush admin (audio no longer avail at link given): http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=2843362#2843389

The only votes in a recount that you may manually examine are overvotes, undervotes and provisional ballots. All of those are ballots which cannot be read by the machine. So, while it doesn't state that it is illegal to read machine-read ballots, by stating that you are only lawfully allowed to check the ballots which are not machine-readable, the opposite of that is you can't check the machine-readable ballots.
...
Florida even only allows the recount if it's within 1/4 of 1%...What you've done here Harri Hursti Hack you've taken a landslide in one direction and make it a landslide the other direction, you would not have any legal right to examine those ballots even to look at the undervotes and overvotes under Florida law...

...which has led Roy Saltman -- who is the only scientist ever employed by the government to study elections in the 20th century -- to write to the Miami Herald and tell them directly: "Florida's laws are a threat to Democracy."

[SammyWinstonJack]

1. Planning stealing the '08 election, are they? The only way they can win election, btw.

[superkia]

10. As long as Clinotn can make Obama look bad enough to keep...

him and McCain close in the "polls", they will be able to steal it. Thats how they managed to do it before, show us close polls and we just think " damn we just lost it"! Thats why I think Clinton will stay to the end and do every nasty tactic she can until then. If she wasn't playing the republican style politics, I would love to see her stay in it until the end and get destroyed by Obama but seeing her hurting the D's chances is just not good for America...good for the elite but thats about it.

[Born Free]

47. I fear it is already too late...

They have been perfecting the software since 2000, they know where to add and where to subtrack to make it look plausible, swing a couple races to the other side that are not significant but swing the important races to the chosen few. Add to all of this the Clinton campaign tactics and you have the perfect setup, who is going to argue if McCain wins and they tell you the democrats were to angry at each other to vote for anyone but McCain. More war, more recession and they will get your social security too, that is the last big prize to "privatize" and send to Wall Street. If anyone suggest anything is wrong, just call them crazy, throw out the "get out the tin foil hats" jokes...trust the machines, they are your friends

[tiptoe]

48. Which is why re-enfranchisings, GOTV, pollings -- Pre-election and Approval and Exit --

are important tools for ferreting out where fraud in elections, on a state by state basis, might be happening. Exit pollings also should include query into METHOD OF VOTING, to capture data on whether a respondent's vote was by a PROVISIONAL means, the extent of which and amount which goes UNCOUNTED seem all-too-often a mystery.**

Secretaries of State can be replaced and fraud-prone voting methods/technologies overturned/managed, like Democrat Debra Bowen has been doing, ever since foiling $9 Billion Ken Lay-shill-and-crook Sch*tzenegger's election-fraud plans for California by defeating his appointee and recertifier of Diebold, Bruce McPherson, in 2006 in California:

...
Bowen is known for her pioneering work using the Internet to open government to computer users worldwide. In 1993, her first year in elected office, she successfully passed AB 1624 <1>, landmark legislation putting all of California's bill information on the Internet. In the years since, she has worked to protect privacy in the electronic age and to strengthen the auditing of electronic voting equipment to ensure the accuracy of the vote. Her emphasis on fair elections has made her popular with the progressive wing of the Democratic party.

On June 6, 2006, Bowen faced Deborah Ortiz, another state senator, in the Democratic primary to run against Bruce McPherson for the position of California Secretary of State. Bowen won the primary by a 61-39 margin ^[2]. On November 2, Bowen defeated Republican candidate for reelection McPherson by a margin of 3%^[3].

On August 3, 2007, Bowen withdrew approval and certification and conditionally re-approved three electronic voting systems (Diebold Election Systems, Hart InterCivic, Sequoia Voting Systems, and rescinded approval of a fourth system, ES&S Election Systems & Software), after a "top-to-bottom review of the voting machines certified for use in California in March 2007." ^[1][2]

Bowen was interviewed for the January 16, 2008 broadcast of The NewsHour with Jim Lehrer as to her efforts to ensure California ballot integrity. In March 2008, she was given the Profile in Courage Award by the John F. Kennedy Presidential Library and Museum.

Obama to Unveil “Massive” Nationwide Voter Registration Drive
Friday, April 25th, 2008

Chicago Tribune: Senior campaign official is expected to provide details on the 50-state push in a conference call Friday.

Effort seeks to bolster confidence in him as potential general election candidate.

Read more: http://thepage.time.com/2008/04/25/obama-to-unveil-massive-nationwide-voter-registration-drive




** "One other thing is that NY didn't count many of our provisional ballots. This could have affected the exit polls, but I'm not sure by how much." -- Bill Bored



"Do the Exit polls, in conjunction with the Pre-election polls and Approval polls, indicate that fraud was likely?" -- TruthIsAll

[LSparkle]

2. We need HUGE turnout in November to ensure they don't steal this

yet we're in this painfully protracted primary (!) that threatens
to SUPPRESS Democratic turnout ... I can only pray this is over
very soon and that we have adequate time to get behind our nominee.

[tblue37]

17. We *had* a huge turnout in 2004, but with their vote-switching electronic machines,

vote-suppression tactics, and skill at distibuting the machines in such a way that Dem-leaning districts had too few and those they had often didn't work, the Republicans still managed to steal it. And then they managed to arrange for a total suppression in the MSM of any discussion of the theft.

[truedelphi]

20. PLEASE start to understand this. It is about hacking the vote

And no matter how many people turn out, if the hackers can "switch" the vote from one column to the other, or zadd totheir column, we will witness yet another stolen election.

[alfredo]

49. That's the only way they can win. "Reps don't want fair elections" is how

we should frame this.

[AzDar]

3. K & R...

:kick:

[stillcool]

4. Oh well...

there is good news...28 states now require VVPB's, and 13 states have instituted standard recounts after each and every election. My state used optical scan, and we are one of the one's that does not do a standard audit...yet. Probably time for me to write and call the Secretary of State..again.

http://www.verifiedvoting.org/index.php

[katty]

5. golly gomer...surprise, surprise!!!

[Supersedeas]

51. unanimous consent doesn't mean squat to the Bush bots

[crimsonblue]

6. Even with repug's voting against, this should have passed.

There are 9 members on the committee (according the official site)-- 6 Dems and 3 GOPathetics.

Majority
• Rep. Robert A. Brady, PA-1
Chairman

• Rep. Zoe Lofgren, CA-16
Vice-Chairwoman

• Rep. Michael Capuano, MA-8
• Rep. Charles Gonzalez, TX-20
• Rep. Susan Davis, CA-53
• Rep. Artur Davis, AL-7

Minority
• Rep. Vernon Ehlers, MI-3
Ranking Member

• Rep. Dan Lungren, CA-3
• Rep. Kevin McCarthy, CA-22


What the fuck happened? Even the subcommittee on elections is split 4 Dem - 2 GOPathetics
source Committee on House Administration

[Liberty Belle]

18. How did Susan Davis vote? I have a few hundred friends in her district

and she is facing a challenger who is a PDA activist here.

[JustinL]

24. she voted yea

Only 2 Dems (Nick Rahall and Dennis Kucinich) voted nay. See post #23 below.

[Wilms]

29. Kucinch's statement:

snip

H.R. 5036 acknowledges that problems exist in our system of voting, and that without action now these problems will grow. For this reason the legislation has merit. While H.R. 5036 includes a provision to reimburse jurisdictions that convert their paperless voting system to one that includes a paper trail, it may also include optical scan technology. I have serious concerns with optical scan technology and its susceptibility to hacks and security breaches. Recent tests and research have demonstrated the ease with which a person can manipulate the configuration files to change votes. What's more, most of the equipment necessary to accomplish this can be purchased off-the-shelf at most technology stores.

Indeed, our voting system needs improvement, but replacing one flawed technology with another will do little to garner public faith in the electoral process. Let us make comprehensive electoral system reform a priority, and let us enact a policy that ensures system integrity, system security, and that each and every vote is counted.

snip

http://kucinich.us/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1753&Itemid=1

[MaineDem]

40. But at least the ballots can be hand-counted if necessary

I'm disappointed.

[Wilms]

41. You really can't support that statement.

It was necessary in the last two presidential elections. So what?

The reverse is true, often enough.

I hear this "But at least the ballots can be hand-counted if necessary" statement...word for word...so often it think it's merely parroted.

Perhaps it's another bit of mis-info from Lipari and Co.?

[MaineDem]

42. I do support the statement

I've observed it first-hand the last two cycles.

I've been involved in recounts...both optically scanned ballots and paper and pencil ballots.

I don't base my judgment on info or mis-information given out by anyone. Only what I've seen myself.

Take it for what's it worth to you.

[Wilms]

44. I asked specifically about the 2000 and 2004.

There wasn't a recount worthy of that title.

I'm happy for your recounts...more specifically, that you had triggers set off that allowed it.

-on edit...the following was written relative to another issue with NY and Optical Scan. Sorry for any confusion-

Do you know what the triggers are in NY????? You may want to know that before thinking NY is better off with OpScan than levers.

[tiptoe]

45. What are the triggers for recounts in NY?

[Wilms]

46. Discrepancies in the flat 3% audit state law calls for.

In a close race, a 3% audit could fail to detect fraud.

[ohio2007]

7. So if they lose by the slimmist count....there will be no "do over".

recounts are for losers ......




;)

[crimsonblue]

8. yeah i guess you're right...

I guess my belief that elections are the most sacred institution we have and therefore we should try our best to safeguard it was stupid. Silly me...

[BulletproofLandshark]

11. It's called "sarcasm"

[crimsonblue]

19. really?

[Sam Ervin jret]

9. We need to "out" those who voted against this legislation

and show how they flip flopped on the say so of BUCHCO.

Are the ReThugs who voted against bringing this to the floor the ones who are not up for reelection this term?

That would be very telling.

[totodeinhere]

12. Don't the Democrats control the House?

[madamesilverspurs]

13. Control of the House

is off the table, apparently.

[MaineDem]

30. Not by a big enough margin

We need a veto proof margin and we don't have that yet. Same in the Senate. There we really need 60 votes to get things done.

[totodeinhere]

31. Agreed. We need to elect even more Dems but not DINOS.

[tavalon]

36. So, let's put on our imagination caps for a minute and imagine a veto proof majority

What will the excuse be then?

[guyanakoolaid]

14. Appalling. Every "yes" voter needs to be gone... Charlie Gonzalez?

His dad was Henry B. Gonzalez, a legend and a people's champion in the House for many years.

I would love to hear the argument for why they voted yes.

:mad: :grr: :banghead:

[JustinL]

25. Don't you mean every "no" voter? A "yes" vote was in favor of the bill.

Most Dems (including Gonzalez) voted yea and most Repubs voted nay. See post #23 below.

[guyanakoolaid]

27. Er, correct. Still. I'd love to hear a decent reasoning.

:mad:

[HowHasItComeToThis]

15. I DON'T THINK REOUBLICANS HAVE WON ANY ELECTION SINCE 1980

THEY ARE A TINY MINORITY WITH ORGANIZATION AND WEALTH

[tiptoe]

37. here's a study, 1988-2004

Historical Elections: 1988-2004 Election Calculator Model

[crankychatter]

16. aren't recounts a Constitutionally protected right?

?

[Norrin Radd]

21. Sickening.

[Frisbee]

22. we're f__ked. 'nuff said. nt

[JustinL]

23. Here's the roll call.

clerk.house.gov

223 Democrats and 16 Republicans (239 total) voted yea. 2 Democrats and 176 Republicans (178 total) voted nay.

The two Democrats? Nick Rahall of West Virginia and...Dennis Kucinich.

Why the hell did Kucinich vote nay???

[Joanne98]

33. Whoa! Somebody needs to ask him.

[tiptoe]

34. statement above

#29

[judasdisney]

26. Naked open fascism

without hiding any of their contempt for democracy

[Monk06]

28. How can you export democracy to the world when you don't have it at home??????????

[Joanne98]

32. Has anybody asked them why they changed they minds?

Did they get a call from the WH?

[ckramer]

35. As my buddy Newman said

"When you control the mail, you control information!"

"I'll tell you a little secret about zip codes: they're meaningless. HeHe"

He really was talking about voting.

I'm Cosmo Kramer, I approve these messages.

[EFerrari]

38. Why would they do something like that?

:sarcasm:

[Wilms]

43. A lot of reformers didn't like this bill.

Like it or not, Holt isn't popular with some groups.

I'm sure they were thrilled.

[snot]

39. K&R'd

[tiptoe]

52. k for reminder

[LiberalFighter]

50. How does one know a ballot is readable (correctly) if it isn't thrown out?

[tiptoe]

53. name typo, it's: Ion Sancho

(not "Ian")