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Edited on Fri Jul-11-08 07:38 PM by adsosletter
I admit that my post sounded culturally biased and ignorant of history, especially in the context of my initial OP about the archaeologists response to the possibility of bombing Iran.
"Every piece of heritage speaks a message."
Yes, it does. My comment was poorly thought out and badly expressed. (I knew what I meant...)
"For instance, I do believe it is important for western culture to preserve the material remains which speak to the basis of our conceptions of freedom, law, and social obligation (and not ONLY these, but they are high on my list). These things give us concrete references for our abstract ideas..."
"FOR INSTANCE..." that is an important qualifier... It IS important for western culture to preserve material remains that "speak to the basis of our conceptions of freedom, law, and social obligation" specifically because they provide concrete evidence for the formation of ideas about universal human rights as they have evolved over the millennia. That does NOT mean that other cultures and their material remains are of less value; the two things are not mutually exclusive, but in the context of the discussion it was poorly expressed. I did not intend it to mean that those are the ONLY material culture remains we should be concerned about preserving and understanding.
One of the greatest threats to our nation and the world at this time, imho, is the AMERICAN lack of historical memory regarding the formation of our current ideals regarding inherent, inalienable human rights, and the significance of the origins and evolution of those ideals (which have never been perfectly met but whose underlying philosophy demands universal expansion of the recognition of inalienable rights). This is what I was attempting (abysmally, as you so generously pointed out) with my comment that "...without education regarding the significance of the ideas material culture reflects, the value of the material culture itself remains unrecognized." The poster I was responding to maintained that it was possible to continue culture without the preservation of cultural remains and listed Magna Carta as an example. My intended point was that the existence of any material culture remains related to the formation and evolution of our concept of human rights, whether it is Hammurabi's Code, or Magna Carta, or the Declaration of Independence (feel free to add whatever you will) loses much of it's significance when people are not educated to realize the value of the ideals these documents witness to.
Because many Americans seem so emotionally and intellectually detached from the importance of the struggle and development which ushered in the Enlightenment ideas of universal humanity we are losing our freedoms, and continuing the cultural and economic imperialism of which you spoke. Yes, this has been the pattern in the past with western culture, but a real valuation of those Enlightenment ideas could very well help us save our own republic, and produce a different stance toward the rest of the world, in which we are capable of creating, or abetting, so much misery and injustice. It is in this context that I assert that, without education regarding the ancient origins, and struggles of the evolution of our ideals of justice, human rights, social responsibility, and the equality of all before the law, that the value of the cultural remains which witness to this (by no means all "western" or "Judeo-Christian") can (and here is how I should have expressed it) lose their value as material manifestations of important ideas.
This should not be taken to mean that material remains whose precise meanings are lost cannot serve as important, highly valued links to the past within cultures (as in the examples you cited, and which could be multiplied many times over).
"What a crock of bullshit. Your bias slip is showing here."
I don't believe I am biased in these issues, but I admit that I poorly worded it, and should have clarified the context. I am very aware of the role of cultural imperialism in history, and I understand its use as a tool of colonialism.
"Just because it's not some Western'material remains which speak to the basis of our conceptions of freedom, law, and social obligation', in your words, does it mean that the object/site in question is devoid of value to a culture and its people."
I never said, nor suggested that it was; the thought never entered my mind...but, again, I admit that I expressed it badly, both in context and expression.
"...if you're such an expert on the expansion of Western ideology YOU would know that cultural heritage is symbolically potent and vital to the identity of a culture."
I am not a cultural anthropologist; therefore, not a qualified expert. I never claimed such. My field is History. However, I am quite aware of the symbolic potential of material culture, and the destruction caused by the colonialism of which you speak. I was singling out the need for Americans (which I admit I did not specify) to educate themselves on the ideals, evolutions, and struggles that the material remains symbolize.
In the context of my OP it appeared that I was interested ONLY in the value and legitimacy of western material culture. This is not accurate about me, but I can see why it came across that way. I was trying to respond to the poster's proposition that material culture remains were unimportant to continuation of any given culture, although the example of Magna Carta sent me in the direction of the importance of those remains to western culture.
And I did, indeed, misread the direction of his thought.
EDIT: dropped a quotation mark... :dunce:
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