GM unveils Volt on company's 100th anniversary

[WriteDown]

Source: AP

DETROIT - General Motors Corp. Chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner unveiled the automaker's long-awaited electric car Tuesday and said the turmoil in U.S. financial markets should not affect government loan guarantees that would help the auto industry develop high-tech vehicles.
ADVERTISEMENT

Speaking to reporters at GM's 100th anniversary celebration, Wagoner said the $25 billion in loans were approved last year as part of an energy bill and should now be funded to help the industry build next-generation automobiles and meet government fuel economy standards.

"Really a relatively small fraction of the investment the industry will have to make to achieve these improvements was to be provided for by direct loans," Wagoner said. "We're just asking that those loans now be funded and that the rules and procedures to be able to draw against those loans be finalized promptly."

GM, Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC have been working to get Congress to fund the loans after months of tight credit markets, tepid sales and high gasoline prices....

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080916/ap_on_bi_ge/gm_centennial

---

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mzmolly]

1. DRILL BABY DRILL!

Oh wait, :bounce:

Awesome news! Now to wait for it to go on sale used. ;)

[TommyO]

2. I was actually one of those that watched GM's 100th anniversary launch

of the Chevrolet Volt. GM is absolutely moving forward with this car, it's as big a jump forward as the Honda Insight and Toyota Prius were, and will eventually lead to all-electric vehicles that don't require an energy source to top off the batteries.

When I'm ready for a new car in a few years, this will be one of them that I'm looking at (I currently drive a 2005, V6, 32mpg (HWY) Chevy Malibu)

[WriteDown]

3. Very cool...

I would have loved to be there.

[DainBramaged]

4. Ain't that Malibu da best? I took a 2006 to a GM auction a few weeks ago

33.6 MPG with FOUR of us and we averaged 62MPH BOTH ways 382 mile round trip. But, it isn't a Peeus so it isn't worthy on DU.

[TommyO]

5. I drive out to Chicago this past May

I averaged just over 65 mph and pulled in a real-world 32mpg on that trip. Is the previous generation Malibu the world's greatest car? No, but it fit my needs, and is affordable.

[EOTE]

7. I'm a big Malibu fan as well.

11 years ago when my dad was looking for something to replace his Tercel which was on its last legs, I picked him out a '97 Burgundy Malibu V6. We got it for about the same that we'd pay for a mid level Civic and the Malibu was much better equipped was much more comfortable (especially with 4 passengers) and had a V6 which the Civic certainly lacked. He averages about 28 mpg on it doing a lot of city driving. It's still running very strongly and he's very tough on his cars. My dad likes to drive his cars into the ground, but at only around 130k miles, it's still got quite a bit of life left in it. But when he does get around to picking up a new car, the current generation Malibu is at the top of my list. The Camry is just boring. I definitely prefer the current Malibu's interior. Plus, comparing 4 cylinder to 4 cylinder and V6 to V6, the Malibu gets better fuel economy than either the Accord OR Camry. You can also get a Malibu hybrid for around the same price as the 4 cylinder Japanese competition. I like to think of the Malibu as a hidden gem in the automotive world. There are lots of people who would never purchase one simply because they're Chevys, but it's their damn loss.

[TommyO]

9. Chevy, and all of GM, has been making huge strides in auto interiors

In all honesty, they needed to.

[WriteDown]

10. No doubt about that...

But not many will believe you on DU. If it has the Chevy badge, it is considered persona non grata on DU.

[DainBramaged]

18. Unless it says Toyota, it is shit here

[EOTE]

11. They never strived to be the king of the hill in that regard.

My dad's '97 Malibu had a 'handsome', I guess, interior. But that's not what the car was really meant to excel at. At the time, if I could have had a V6 Camry for the same price, I would have jumped at it. But the Malibu was several thousand less than either the Camry or Accord and ended up costing around the same as a Civic EX cost at the time. And it was much better equipped and roomier than the Civic and it had a V6 and got similar fuel economy. Yes, the current Malibus have a far nicer interior than my dad's does, but the Malibus have moved far more upscale over the past 5-6 years. The current generation Malibu is more of a direct competitor to the Camry and Accord, but unlike the Malibu from two generations ago that sought to undercut the competition by a huge price margin and offer less of a product, the current Malibu still seeks to undercut the price of the Accord and Camry, yet actually manages to surpass both in terms of amenities and interior quality and matches them in terms of reliability.

[CRF450]

12. Tell me about it, my 01 Trans Am interior is shit

But I love the car too much to hate the interior :p In fact I found a good right up on wrapping the interior panels and dash with a high quality vinyl or leather, then it would rival the interior quality of GM's new vehicles now.

[CRF450]

14. Even their performance cars can get 30mpg HWY.

Despite what the EPA ratings say now, the new Corvettes actually do get up 30mpg easy on the highways and interstates. My 01 Trans Am with the 6 speed manual got 31mpg on a 700 mile trip, surprised the hell out of me that such a powerful v8 can get decent fuel milage being that its in a lightweight aerodynamic car. GM's LSx v8's are awsome engines!

[AndyTiedye]

28. Why do These Cars Score So Badly on the EPA Mileage Ratings?

[EOTE]

33. Ummmm, they don't.

Even the 505hp Z06 averages 27mpg hwy. Do you know of any foreign vehicle with 500+hp that gets that mileage? How about 400+? Still no? GM is pretty much the only company now making high performance overhead valve engines. They've pretty much perfected the technique and now make by far the most advanced OHV engines in the world (not that anyone else is really making them, but that's a shame). For trucks and for sports cars like the Vette, Trans-Am, Z28 SS and such, GM makes some of the best engines in the world. An amazing combination of fuel economy, smoothness, low end torque and high RPM horsepower. GM's truck engines destroy Nissan's and Toyotas in terms of fuel economy when you compare models of equivalent power. Their sports cars are rather fuel efficient as well, but there's really no true foreign competition unless you bring in the 350z (somewhat equivalent fuel economy to the Vette, but far less power) or the far more expensive Skyline (similar power to the Vette, but far worse fuel economy).

[CRF450]

37. And people talk about how much of a dinosuar tech OHV engines are.

When either engine design has been around for about the same time. You hit it on money though, GM has pretty much perfected the OHV engine since the LS1 came out in 97.

[EOTE]

40. Hell, even the LT1s were beasts.

Not quite as free revving as the all aluminum LS1, but pretty damn solid none-the-less. My uncle had a 330hp GS Vette with an LT1 and managed to eke out just a bit more than 500hp out of it without using any kind of forced induction. GM knows OHV engines better than anyone. Even their OHV V6s like the bread and butter 231 (3800 series engine) were renowned for their power, smoothness and fuel economy. Just a few years ago you could pick up a massive 231 powered Buick that would get better fuel economy than the smaller Toyota Avalon it competed against, and even match the fuel economy of the even smaller V6 Honda Accords.

GM has been slow to adopt OHC engines, but I think they're doing it at the right pace. I mean, when you've got tried and true OHV engines, you should only replace them if you've got available technology that's evidently superior. I think they've done that with their new line of "high feature" V6s. We're already seeing lots of versions of the engine anywhere from 2.8 to 3.6 liters replacing the old 3800. The 3.6 with direct injection is quite awesome. It's going to be the base engine of the new Camaro and in that configuration will make a stout 300hp (damn near the output of the last Z28 SS and lighter too). I test drove an Oldsmobile Intrigue a few years after they came out and after they replaced the 3800 with the "Shortstar" (basically a Northstar V8 from Cadillac with two cylinders lopped off). I was expecting better performance, or at least more smoothness from the new engine, but it just wasn't there. In fact, I really missed the low end grunt of the 231. Since then, they wisely kept the old engine in their lineup until their new (quite impressive so far) lineup of engines became available.

[CRF450]

44. There torq monsters down low for sure, anywhere higher than 3500rpm...

The LS1 dominates. I'm really liking that new camaro! 300hp from a N/A v6 is not very common except in vehicles like the Nissan 350z and the Infinity G35. I expect the 3.6DI v6 will give an LT1 a run for its money but the LS1 still has about a good 50hp advantage plus more torq. Not only that, the new Camaro is a little heavier than the 4th gens, and IRS will take away some power over a solid axle.

[TommyO]

48. Another nice thing about the 3.6l direct injection engine

It gets its 304 horsepower on good ol' 87 octane fuel, no premium (+$$$) required.

[EOTE]

49. IRS? Sweet!

Frankly, I'd take the reduced weight and added fuel efficiency of the DI V6. The LS3 Camaros are going to be awesome as well, but the fact that you can get so much power in a 'base' Camaro seems awesome to me. And I wasn't aware that IRS would be standard. That's pretty sweet and should give many buyers a good reason to go with the new Camaro as opposed to the new Mustang. I used to own a Lincoln LS (from which the new Mustang is based) and the lack of IRS was very apparent when driving the new Mustangs. I'll take a little bit of power loss (hell, it's no where near the power loss associated with a torque converter) in exchange for the increased handling ability. If they can keep the weight down to less than 3600lbs, even the base Camaro should be an awesome performer.

[CRF450]

51. They say its gonna weigh around 3700lbs

You should see the Nurbugring track time for the Camaro. It was running better lap times than a BMW M3 E46. Thats much better than the base C5 Corvettes.

[EOTE]

52. Is that for the typical configuration?

3700lbs seems maybe slightly bloated, but hopefully they've done a good job of hiding that heft. I guess that extra weight is worth it with an IRS. I assume that the manual/V6 configuration will be the lightest, but I don't really know if the 3.6 is really all that much lighter than the LS3, if at all. Dear god, if the LS3 Camaros are providing superior performance to the C5 Vette for around 30k with the ability to haul around 4 people, I think Chevy's got themselves another big winner on their hands. I can't wait to see them on the road.

[CRF450]

53. The Pontiac G8 is closer to 4k lbs and is the same platform the...

Camaro will be built on, so I guess its to be expected for a coupe version of that platform. The G8 handles awsomely as well, SOOO much better than a Dodge Charger! As for the weight of the v6, I dont think it will be that much lighter than the LS3 because of the OHC config. They're physically a bit bigger and heavier than a OHV of the same displacement.

[EOTE]

50. Keep in mind, the V8 Camaros will be LS3s

There's not enough of a power difference between the DI V6 and the LS1 to justify making it an engine option. Just imagine how much overhead there is for tuning in that LS3. I'd imagine there will be lots of buyers looking to add blowers. Can't wait to see what the tuners like Calloway are able to get out of it.

[AndyTiedye]

38. Still Much Less Than People Are Reporting Here for the Corvette and Malibu

Just wondering why the EPA tests seem to understate the mileage on these vehicles.
That could be hurting GM quite a bit at the current gas prices.
Most people look at the EPA figures before buying these days.

I know that GM has always ruled among the "muscle cars",
and those mileage figures are pretty good for such big engines.

[EOTE]

41. Just what are the EPA figures?

I've always heard 27mpg for the current Z06 and 32mpg for the previous generation V6 Malibu. Do you have any numbers that contradict those?

[CRF450]

45. As quoted from Chevy's website...

6.2L LS3 V8
six-speed manual transmission 16/26
Six-Speed Paddle Shift with Automatic Modes 15/25

7.0 LS7 V8
six-speed manual transmission 15/24

[EOTE]

46. Those don't seem too far off from the actual numbers.

A little conservative, but not too much. I've actually heard of some LS7 owners who AVERAGE around 24mpg with an even mix of city and hwy driving.

[CRF450]

47. But it can easily give people the impression that its a gas guzzler

Similar to a truck or SUV, when its not.

[CRF450]

36. The EPA changed the way they rate cars because some Prius owners

Werent getting the advertised fuel milage. IMO I think the older ratings were more accurate as I'v continually beaten them in pretty much all the cars I'v driven. My 01 Trans Am is rated 19/28, the EPA now rates it 17/26. Again, I actually average around 22mpg, and it has gotten 31mpg on the interstate with the cruise control set at 74mph. My 04 Dodge Dakota gets much closer the older EPA numbers but still beats it on a daily basis, but it depends on what I do though. One tank I could get 15mpg, another I could get 18mpg.

The new Corvettes were rated the same as my car before the new ratings.

[Bake]

61. I just drove my '02 Taurus on a 1500 mile roundtrip

I got a little better than 29 mpg, at mostly 80-85 mph. I was surprised because I usually get around 25 on the highway. Must have been due to the fact that I checked the inflation on the tires ... actually, it WAS!!

But the Pukes skoff at actually using a tire gauge.

Bake

[zipplewrath]

6. Energy free car?

...eventually lead to all-electric vehicles that don't require an energy source to top off the batteries.

I am supposing that what you meant to say was an "on board" energy source. I'm not even sure that is the direction anyone is thinking. Merely that the source would be a smaller and smaller "engine" over time, which might include "solar" engines. Alternately, they could be fuel cells with a working fluid that could be purchased much like gasoline. I've been advocating "hybrids" for years (decades actually) because it allows one to optimize each aspect of propulsion around efficiency. The functional efficiency (i.e. the amount of energy utilized for it's purpose/ the amount of energy expended in the fuel) is on the order of 18%. (Stop and go, engine optimize around several speeds, waste heat dumped overboard, aero-drag, etc). There are many things that can be done to try to double that number (probably around 40% max out with internal combustion). Even more so, there are various engines that can get even more useful energy out of gasoline (small turbines etc.) but they are generally poorly suited to the current automobile demands. However as a pure "energy delivery" device for a hybrid, we could be talking huge improvements in efficiency (and reductions in many of the nastier exhaust gases).

[TommyO]

8. You're right, that's what I meant.

Right now, the gas/electric model of the Volt is a good one, pure electric propulsion, battery driven, with a backup source to charge the batteries. This is a far simpler model than the Prius and other hybrids which effectively bolt an electric motor onto their gas engines as a supplement.

[pdefalla]

13. Volt more efficient than Prius

How much better mileage does the Volt get over the Prius? The Prius gets pretty good mileage, around 45-50 mpg.

[TommyO]

15. No mileage figures have been released yet

[DainBramaged]

19. It will travel in excess of 640 miles on a tank of something

to power the generator.

[NickB79]

39. Cut that number in half and you'd be correct

Per CNNMoney.com:

"As the battery begins to run down as the car is in use, a small gasoline engine will turn on and generate enough electricity to drive the car about 300 miles."

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/11/autos/volt_official_reveal/index.htm?cnn=yes

I'm wondering if they either made the gas tank much smaller to make room for more batteries, or if their gasoline engine isn't nearly as efficient as they originally hoped for.

[harun]

16. Looks cool. I will cheer once we see the price and if we can actually buy it and

not just lease it.

[ClassWarrior]

20. The link says they're thinking it''ll sell for between $30,000 and $40,000.

But like with all new tech, that'll come down.

NGU.

[harun]

30. Great, I think if they get it < 30k it will be a good deal.

[CRF450]

17. Some more pics, check out the interior!!

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=987096

This car is starting to grow on me already even though I'm a performance car nut. I cant stand the looks of the Pruis, the Volt looks 10x better IMO.

[WriteDown]

23. Its like driving an...

Ipod classic. It is kind of nifty.

[BootinUp]

21. The price of this car

will be out of the range of most Americans. Don't get too excited.

[Godhumor]

22. The estimated 30,000 to 40,000 cost makes this a luxury car

I don't see many people switching to it just to make a "green" message.

[WriteDown]

25. Depends on your gas bill each month....

If you have to spend 500$ a month on car payments, but your monthly gas bill goes from 300$ to 25$ seems like that would be enticing.

[DainBramaged]

26. You miss the point, the first of anything is always the most expensive

as the numbers sold increase and technology improves, prices come down. I remember when carbon fiber cost millions, now you can buy carbon fiber parts (replacement/performance) for a little more than stock parts.

The Preus could sell for UNDER 20K without blinking an eye, but Toyota chooses to make a LARGE profit on each one. And NOT because of warranty holdbacks.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

31. And factor in the cost of extended warranty

I'd guess replacing the battery is not a $60 fee at Costco.

These will improve over the next few years, so I'll just keep repairing the old cars - both GM, one Mexican (non-union?), one Canadian (CAW) - both get 30+ mpg hwy.

[WriteDown]

24. Average new car on the road is 28K.....

This won't be far off. I think 30-40K is a steal considering your gas bill will greatly decrease.

[DainBramaged]

27. The Prius is out of the range of most Americans, get real

[KakistocracyHater]

29. EV1 they should have gone full speed on that

but they refused to sell that electric car, maliciously recalled ALL of them & crushed them all, except for 1 in an auto museum. "Who Killed the Electric Car", it was watching a company do something they hated & gleefully destroying. I can't understand why people didn't report their EV1 as stolen & whisked it out of the country to a safe place-GM even destroyed the blueprints. BUT that old guy designed a superior battery that Detroit spitefully refused to put in the EV1s in order to give the false impression that electric cars can't replace combustion engines. I want CALIFORNIA to become the capitol of the auto industry via Tesla Motors & anyone else willing to join the "electric revolution". The time is now.

[DainBramaged]

32. Fine, let's just keep rehashing the past and ignoring the future

Thanks for telling us something hundreds of others have spewed here before.

[jmowreader]

34. Wasn't the EV1 just an experiment?

I keep seeing all the bellyaching about GM destroying all the EV1s. Oh God, give it UP!

[DainBramaged]

35. Yes it was an experiment, which was why they were all leased.

But remember, if it isn't about Toyota or Honda, well, it just isn't, on DU!:eyes:

[dysfunctional press]

42. another reason they were leased is that they cost several hundred thousand apiece to make.

most of the people who had them probably wouldn't have been able to afford to buy them.

[jmowreader]

54. I feel ya...

Do you have much contact with the Buick Division? I really like the LaCrosse. (I think when you publicly state you like Buicks, you're officially old. Well...I must be officially old.)

[DainBramaged]

55. I am the original owner of a 1987 Regal T Type Turbo

one of ONLY 18 with a slick roof (NO sunroof or T-Tops) and bench seat. It weighs 600 lbs. Less than a Grand National. In bone stock shape with NO chips or exhaust mods, it went 13.7 @ 103+ in 1987.

I would really rather have a Buick.

[TommyO]

57. My 1987 car was a Ford Thunderbird Turbo Coupe

I loved that car, and on long trips it got me around 34Mpg, but with the intercooled turbo it had guts too. It wasn't a Regal T Type (or Grand National), but it was a great car.

[DainBramaged]

58. My ex had an 84 TBird Turbo, it was BIG fun.

I put some Mustang SVO turbo pieces (bigger turbo, exhaust mainfold, intercooler from a wreck) on it and it ran like stink. Not as fast as my Buick, but it was the "long distance" driver.

[IDemo]

43. Interesting history behind that experiment, though

Alan Cocconi, the designer of the electronics for the vehicle that became the EV1, later went on to found AC Propulsion. The company introduced the AC-150 EV Power System which is now licensed by Tesla Motors. So the two vehicles share a common heritage, but the Tesla remains the only one in production, at many times the cost of the EV1.

[KakistocracyHater]

56. hey foolio

once something has been pioneered people figure out a way to do it cheaper, much like how those Scary Movie franchises redo what cost sh*l**ds for the Matrix. It doesn't need to cost 100k now. Knowing the past it ought to be easy to find those engineers & start it up again quicker than I can tell yo to suck it!!!!

[DainBramaged]

59. Bite me

[DainBramaged]

60. Oh and Bob Lutz said on Colbert a photovoltaic roof for recharging will be an option

How fucking cool is that.

[KakistocracyHater]

62. soon being forever a day off

dodge that!