Prop 8 Opponents March Outside Mormon Temple in Westwood

[Poll_Blind]

Source: NBC (Los Angeles)

LOS ANGELES -- Hundreds of supporters of same-sex marriage rallied outside a Mormon temple in West Los Angeles on Thursday afternoon to protest what organizers called hefty financial contributions by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to the campaign supporting a measure that bans same-sex unions in California.

The rally began at 2 p.m. in front of the Los Angeles Mormon Temple then spilled onto Santa Monica Boulevard as sign-toting participants prepared to march to the nearby Federal Building in Westwood.

A line of police surrounded the protest. Officers began shutting down freeway ramps along the 405 Freeway, possibly in response to the march.

"No one's religious beliefs should be used to deny fundamental rights to others," said Lorri L. Jean, chief executive officer of the L.A. Gay & Lesbian Center. "Our civil rights are inalienable."

Read more: http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Protestors_Signal_Battle_over_Same_Sex_Marriage_Not_Over.html

---

Includes video, possibly even live video, of the event.

PB

[Auggie]

1. The Knights of Columbus were big supporters too

[defendandprotect]

7. Catholics ....

[northofdenali]

25. Dunno - my very elderly (92) mom has always been Catholic.

She's both pro-choice and pro-same sex marriage.

I don't think it's so much the type of "Christianity" you practice. I think it's whether or not you follow Christ's teachings and, therefore, are truly Christian.

Folks, don't forget to sign the Anti-Prop8 petitions floating around everywhere! (Check DU's GLBT forum to get started.)

[defendandprotect]

35. I was saying Knights of Columbus are Catholics ...for those who may not know --

Dunno - my very elderly (92) mom has always been Catholic.
She's both pro-choice and pro-same sex marriage.

I don't think it's so much the type of "Christianity" you practice. I think it's whether or not you follow Christ's teachings and, therefore, are truly Christian.

I'm a recovering Catholic ...

In order to belong to a church you usually support it --

that would seem to encourage its policies/teachings --

Though criticism is usually directed against the church/hierarchy, I do question

how any female supports an anti-female religion ...

or sits thru anti-homosexual rants without comment--

And especially given revelations of sexual abuse of children long hidden --

according to Italians, since beginning of church -- !!

[northofdenali]

36. Understood, d&p -

I think for Mom, it's more habit than belief anymore. She's fought with her parish priest over the same issues for about 50 years (same parish, different priests). And she sits through nothing that she doesn't agree with - without voicing her opinion. My spouse, who is a class A debater, will not try to argue with Mom. Or play poker against her. But that's a different story!

My point was not so much about Catholics, but about any religion that is so dogmatic and ingrained.

[defendandprotect]

43. I think it's better to stick with criticism of hierarchy ....

but glad that you accepted my comments on individuals as general --

Of course, these are all organized patriarchal religions and authoritarian --

and I hope soon they will fall with patriarchy, itself.

Certainly, no "god" nor nature has created a majority female gender as inferior to

males.

Let's hope that soon people all over the world will see thru these myths and stop

giving middle-men to "god" sway over their own free thought and free conscience --

gifts from a non-fascist nature and intended to be used--!!!

[Sarah Ibarruri]

16. We need to write them

Knights of Columbus Headquarters
1 Columbus Plaza
New Haven, CT 06510
[phone]
Email: [e-mail]

For specific inquiries, please consult the list below, or look through the Supreme Council phone directory.

General and Other Inquiries
Contact Us (General Inquiries)

Canonization Guild
Contact the Guild
Register to Join the Guild

Catholic Information Service
Contact CIS (Catholic Information Service)

Church Support
Request ChurchLoan Information
Request Vocation Information

Columbia Magazine
Contact Columbia

Employment
Submit Employment Inquiry

Financial Secretary Appointments - Ann Moran
[e-mail]

Gift Catalog
Request a Gift Catalog

Insurance
Contact Insurance

Membership
Update Contact Information
Request Membership Information

Military Councils - Col. Charles H. Gallina, USMC/RET
[e-mail]

New Council Development - Louis Barbour
[e-mail]

[Ken Burch]

30. You could infiltrate them and take over the Canonizaton Guild

"St Harvey of Castro St." anybody?

[customerserviceguy]

40. Not gonna work

I used to be a K of C about twenty-five years ago, when I had my head up the ass of religion. They'll just take protest as a sign that they've been effective at doing their job.

Besides, it wasn't white Catholics who torpedoed freedom, it was Latino Catholics and the black church that did this. The exit polls have shown this. Most Anglo Catholics don't give a crap about what the pope says anyway, they do their own thing. Even when I was a K of C, I knew more Catholic men who had a vasectomy than non-Catholic men who did. I was worried about having it done from a religious perspective, but it was rationalized as, "It's better for you to have one sin, and get it over with, than to have your wife commit a sin every day by taking the Pill."

When you're finding people to write to, find some black churches that don't understand the concept of freedom.

[defendandprotect]

44. Disagree .. KOC is probably tax-exempt + $1 MILLION is quite some help---!!!!

it wasn't white Catholics who torpedoed freedom, it was Latino Catholics and the black church that did this.

However, still too many surrendering their own free thought and personal conscience to

middle-men to "god."

Btw, how did you wake up --???

[customerserviceguy]

47. That's true, religion is the problem here

After my divorce, I went off to the Episcopal church, and after awhile there, I got away from Christianity totally. I was attracted to the Baha'i faith about fifteen years ago, but after about five years, figured that it was "Islam lite". After that, I'm perfectly fine without having some sky-father figure running things.

[defendandprotect]

48. What do you think about spirituality now... ?

inner spirituality ...or universal spirituality ...??

Still think there's one male "god" ....

How much has getting away from religion changed you, if at all --??

[customerserviceguy]

52. I guess I find "spirituality" to be something that each of us

has to define for ourselves. I certainly don't consider myself spiritual, I figure after we croak, whatever happens, happens to all of us.

Even if there was some sort of creator "god" (and I think it's all been possible without one), there is no evidence that such a being either still exists, has any power over day to day circumstances, or has been adequately "discovered" by existing religions. I don't deny the existence of one, because I similarly cannot prove that there is not one.

I know I used to be quite homophobic back in the mid-1980's, and I'd like to think I'm past that now. But, it's like growing up in a racist society, even if your parents were dead-set against the racism, and tried to bring you up thinking that we were all God's children (their characterization, as they have been and are still staunch Catholics), you still absorb racism from the surrounding culture. You have to watch for signs of racism or homophobia in your life, and try to see what it is that you do that perpetuates it, and what can eliminate it.

You don't need to believe in a "soul" to believe in the dignity of each human being.

[defendandprotect]

57. Nice reply ...

:)

[defendandprotect]

45. e-mailed ...

[6000eliot]

2. I wish for these people to feel just a portion of the heat

that they have directed at gay and lesbian people.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

3. Yes, and then...

They will whine about "Pink Nazis" and "Gay Stormtroopers", playing the victims for all they can.

These folks run sadly true to form.

[DRoseDARs]

8. Well actually, they did 160 years ago, it's just that they've forgotten what it's like.

It's not chutzpah if they're too stupid to know their own history. :shrug:

[FreeState]

4. live video on cbs2.com AMAZING

live video on cbs2.com

[Poll_Blind]

6. I'm watching it LIVE as well- I counted about 500 in the group....

...about 20 minutes ago. Do you know where they are heading?

PB

[Hawkeye-X]

5. California's AG really needs to investigate as to who started Prop 8

if it was started by an out-of-stater, it should be invalid. Especially Mormon morons.

Hawkeye-X

[nichomachus]

9. No, they're smart enough to get a local stooge to front for them n/t

[defendandprotect]

10. They + RCC were also largely nresponsible for defeat of ERA ---

a campaign they paid for with tax-exempt dollars --!!

[nichomachus]

11. The protests really don't bother them -- it's a sign they're doing God's will

when the world rejects you.

What the young gay men in WeHo need to do is dress up as Mormon missionary boys -- black pants, white shirts, ties, little black name badges, and book of Mormon -- and then fan out through the city holding kiss-ins at all the busy street corners and hanging out in bars.

That would drive the Mormons batshit -- kind of ruining "the brand."

[ToolTex]

12. Beautiful idea. Now lets get the LDS cult outlawed in California just like the

Scientologists are outlawed in Germany for being an illegal cult.

[Ellen Forradalom]

14. I volunteer to make out with my sister wives

[bkcc]

18. That is a fantastic idea.

I seriously hope that someone in L.A. reads your post and puts that plan into action.

[klebean]

27. they were in dressed in bl&wh in droves

so the "ruining of the brand" is an idea well implemented today.

However, it needs to be said that no matter what history, persecution, etc., Mormon folks know,
the deeper the fundamentalism, the clueless they are of the social issues at stake. Some get it.
Most Mormons don't.

[Ken Burch]

31. And then announce you're all going out for coffee...that'll REALLY twist the knife...

n/t.

[GinaMaria]

42. omg! that is genius!

Dress as Mormons, make out and then declare they have no 'right' to be together. Performance protest is my favorite. The more you make people laugh the more they will listen to you because they are waiting for you to make them laugh again. This is the best 'weapon' against the haters. Laugh and make others laugh while still making your point.

Look to local improv or comedy groups to join the protest.

This was the guidance another DUer gave me for a Nazi protest.... I've never forgotten it. Protests have lost some of their effectiveness, traditional ones anyway. It's time to change the way we do things, even how we protest. Comedy and laughter pull people toward you and your position.

Wish I could be there to see it. I hope people run with your suggestion.

[HooptieWagon]

13. Sorry, dumb question - Do Mormon's worship on Sundays?

That's when the protestors need to be surrounding the temple, and getting in Mormons faces. Make their day of worship a real hell.

[FreeState]

19. The temple is closed on sundays (all of them are) they worship in a different building

called a Ward house or Stake Center (depending on the area) thats were they are on Sundays. The temple is not open or used Sundays and Mondays - its open Tues- Sat

[Ken Burch]

32. Yeah, I remember hearing about them worshipping in "stake houses"

And I always wondered why they went to a Sizzler to pray.

[progressoid]

49. Wtih the early bird special you get an extra helping of Joe Smith mashed potatoes.

[Ken Burch]

50. ...and a bottomless cup of Postum.

n/t.

[djp2]

15. Tax exempt status

A big part of the protest is the Mormon Church tax-exempt status. If they were financially supporting the proposition and preaching it from the pulpit, they were advocating a political position and should lose that status. This goes for all churches. Keep to religion and stay out of politics!

[Gadzooks1]

17. I just heard a caller on KPFK say that several Mormons

came out of the church and beat four female protesters. The Mormons have a long history of violence, with a number of massacres to their credit. They also have a history of a rather different view on marriage than one man and one woman. While the church no longer officially sanctions bigamy, the cult of Mormonism still practices it with relative impunity.

[sasquatch]

20. Throw underwear at the temple, that's what I would do

[NJPuggle]

21. Candles. Light candles!

Light candles and sing a hymn important to and well-known by Christians. Lean your cheeks on one another's shoulders and hold the candle cups close to your faces so the candlelight is visible illuminating your faces. If photographers arrive, gaze at them together or gaze sadly past them, and either rock slowly arm in arm, or remain still. Flash a peace symbol. Make sure your candles and faces remain in clear shots for photographers.

When asked why you're there, say phrases like this and mean them:

"We're waiting for Jesus to come and show the world he loves us too, like he loves all humanity."

"We're offering peace to our Christian neighbors and that we know this issue was important to them. Well, it's important to us, too."

"We're here offering our prayer up to God."

"God is a God of love, and he told us to be here tonight to soften the hearts of our brothers."

Do this all night, every night. Keep doing it.

Idea 2: Holding lighted candles at night, gays and lesbians, as couples, walk out to the nearest field to this church and, standing together in position, form the shape of the cross.

THIS is how you work media.

DO IT!








Edited to add examples

[Richd506]

22. You know what I think we should do?

I think we should all go to Utah and try to get an amendment passed which legalizes same-sex marriage! It's unlikely it would pass but it'd be fun to piss them off for medling in other state's affairs...

[customerserviceguy]

41. You wouldn't like it

I lived there for six months in 2005, and when I saw them try to take bingo away from the old folks (it's gambling, you know!) I knew that I was living in a theocracy.

Best thing to do is just shut the door in the face of the missionaries, when they get their pimply-faced asses back to Utah at the conclusion of the mission, they practically kiss the ground when the plane touches back down in "Zion". They vow to never leave again!

[Joszef Pelikan]

23. I would like to see a Boycott

of Mormon businesses. Does anyone know where I can find a list of Mormon owned businesses?

[Joe Bacon]

28. Here is a blog site with lists of Mormon Prop 8 Supporters

http://mormonsfor8.com/

and here is a spreadsheet showing Mormons who contributed to 8:

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pe2023SzWXxE8wYX5qWeoIw

[ColbertWatcher]

33. (CHANGED) Better yet here is a link to a Kos diary ...

... http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/11/6/111146/963/314/655661

[Joszef Pelikan]

37. Thanks Joe and Colbert watcher.

[ColbertWatcher]

46. You're welcome and welcome to DU! n/t

[cooolandrew]

24. That's the way to do it shame them into behaving more decently and equal.

[northofdenali]

26. Why are people so SCARED of marriage?

Gotta get rid of the fear before we can rid them of prejudice. By any means possible - GO CALIFORNIA! This is terrific video, as well!

Mrs. & Mr. northofdenali - straight but never, ever narrow. :kick: & rec

[nolabels]

39. The better question is why people believe religion should be the gatekeepers for marriage

Our family went to Nevada and got our marriage license. We needed a license to qualify for our mortgage after living together for many years.
The best thing i can say about religion is it gives nut cases a way, place and time to occupy their minds and keeps them off the street :shrug:

[onager]

29. Do they try to pull this crap overseas?

I just wonder if they try to butt into politics outside their home turf, here in One Nation Under Jesus. I'm betting they don't...f!cking...DARE.

Asking because I run into their damn missionaries all the time in foreign countries. (Since I work in a foreign country, Egypt, it's easy for me to get to Europe. I also did some bid'ness travel in Asia and ran into the Morons there. e.g., older Japanese people are unfailingly polite and will listen to their drivel, but older Japanese will do that for door-to-door salespeople. Younger Japanese were not so polite.)

In fact, when I was getting ready to go to Prague last June, I ran across a couple of websites with Mormon missionaries chatting. They target kids and younger people with parties and get-togethers, and keep the Jebus-babble to a minimum until they have them hooked. Sort of like crack dealers, an analogy I find very fitting. But I'm just a Grumpy Atheist (tm).

Our government could take a tip from some foreign govts. In September I was in Hungary and heard an interesting story. Hungary is predominantly Catholic, and after the fall of Communism, the church tried to move right back in and do bid'ness as usual since the 13th Century.

In a small town outside Budapest, the Church re-opened a famous old school run by priests. And said only boys could attend.

The Hungarian govt. put a stop to that and it didn't even half-step. It informed the school that it would take girls as well as boys, or it would be closed down immediately and permanently. The One True Church backed down and admitted girls.

[lligrd]

34. Thanks, Just Signed And Sent In My Donation nt

[Mari333]

38. Black preacher Frank Stewart says on the video:

regarding the No on Prop 8 protests
"It didnt pass,they should SUCK IT UP"
shame on him.

[IndianaGreen]

55. Nothing like having a Black man support oppression against another minority group!

Shove the white Jesus up his black ass!

[Joe Bacon]

51. My girlfriend and I are the next Mor(m)on targets!

We know that because I'm Jewish and she's black that we are next on the Mor(m)on Church's hit list. We were badgered by a pair of Mor(m)on "missionaries" with their Yes on H8 shit that they tried to force on us. When we refused it then they made comments about how the God separated the races. We now know with comments like that, their real target is to overturn the Loving Vs Virginia decision.

I have news for those motherfuckers.

No matter how hard they try, they are not gonna tell me and my girlfriend who we can and cannot love. If they put an initiative on the ballot to tell me I cannot love my girlfriend, all hell is going to break loose. So help me, I'll rip their magic underwear off of them and shove it up their asses!

[RCinBrooklyn]

53. They ought to burn it down.

[ohio2007]

54. How many non mormon / non church goers voted downt prop 8 ? Shouldn't they rethink the protest ?

California voted against this proposition. I don't think it's a religious issue judging by the majority also voted for Obama

[sarcasmo]

56. Religions make me ill. Kick

[babydollhead]

58. kick