STOCK MARKET WATCH, Monday November 24

[ozymandius]

Source: du

STOCK MARKET WATCH, Monday November 24, 2008

COUNTING THE DAYS
DAYS REMAINING IN THE * REGIME 57
WHERE'S OSAMA BIN-LADEN? 2587 DAYS
DAYS SINCE ENRON COLLAPSE = 2878
Number of Enron Execs in handcuffs = 19
ENRON EXECS CONVICTED = 10
Enron execs conveniently deceased = 3
Other Arrests of Execs = 54

---

U.S. FUTURES &
MARKETS INDICATORS>
NASDAQ FUTURES-----------------------------S&P FUTURES

---

AT THE CLOSING BELL WHEN BUSH TOOK OFFICE on January 22, 2001
Dow - 10,578.24
Nasdaq - 2,757.91
S&P 500 - 1,342.90
Oil - $27.69/bbl
Gold - $266.70/oz.
$1 USD = EUR 1.06678
$1 USD = JPY 116.6200

In recognition of those prescient of the Dow's precipitous return of Bush values (9/29/08): JuneBourder and AnneD

AT THE CLOSING BELL ON November 21, 2008

Dow... 8,046.42 +494.13 (+6.14%)
Nasdaq... 1,384.35 +68.23 (+5.18%)
S&P 500... 800.03 +47.59 (+6.32%)
Gold future... 791.80 +43.10 (+5.44%)
30-Year Bond 3.66% -0.04 (-0.97%)
10-Yr Bond... 3.17% +0.02 (+0.73%)






GOLD,EURO, YEN, Loonie and Silver

---

PIEHOLE ALERT

Heads Up!
Preliminary info on appearances by Bush & Co. throughout the country. Details & links are added as they become available so check back. And if you know more, are organizing something, or would like to, contact [e-mail]

For information on protests and other actions Citizens For Legitimate Government

---

Read more: du

[ozymandius]

1. Market WrapUp: If We Make It Through December

BY BRIAN PRETTI

.....

We all know that the character of the US labor market has been weakening for some time now. No mystery and no incredible revelation at all. It’s time for a very quick review of the leading indicators of headline payroll employment. What are they telling us about what lies ahead, despite the weakness we’ve already seen? It just so happens that if we look at monthly payroll additions or losses from a quarterly perspective, the latest combined three months of job losses through October in headline payrolls is a number that has only been seen historically right smack in the midst of official US recessions. But, as always, it’s what is to come that is most important to our decision-making.

.....

Onward to the key leading indicators of headline payroll employment. And I’ll keep it light on the explanation as I’ve walked through these in a prior Financial Sense discussion. Temp employment. History is clear on the fact that in past cycles rate of change in temp employment has both peaked and troughed ahead of headline payroll trends. The following graph is clear on the concept. For now, the annual rate of change in both temporary and headline payroll employment trends is in near freefall. In the past, freefall experiences usually V bottom. Will it be so again? Just stick around and we’ll find out. When businesses feel confident about the forward outlook, they will test the labor market waters by first hiring temps.

.....

I’ve always been a fan of the household employment survey that accompanies each establishment, or headline payroll report. Why? Because it has also done a pretty darn good job of leading the headline rates of change at major peaks and troughs. Admittedly, these lead times can be incredibly short in terms of being a few months. Nonetheless, you can see what I’m talking about below. Again, at least as of now, no sign of a turn. Freefall in trend intact.

http://www.financialsense.com/Market/wrapup.htm

[Tansy_Gold]

31. "Freefall in trend intact."

They still don't get it. It's jobs. It's industry. It's MAKING THINGS THAT PEOPLE NEED.

Unless and until they get it --- Are you listening, Messrs. Obama and Richardson and Summers and Geithner? --- and start putting their recovery focus on jobs, NOTHING WILL IMPROVE.

NOTHING.



Nothing plus nothing means nothing, and that's saying something


by



Tansy Gold
(edited typo, ugh)

[ozymandius]

2. Today's Report

10:00 Existing Home Sales Oct
Briefing.com 5.07M
Consensus 5.05M
Prior 5.18M

http://www.briefing.com/Investor/Public/Calendars/EconomicCalendar.htm

[UpInArms]

39. Chicago Activity improves - remains in negative territory - last month rev'd downward further

http://www.reuters.com/article/bondsNews/idUSNAT00459920081124

NEW YORK, Nov 24 (Reuters) - U.S. economic activity ticked
up in October from a 28-year low the previous month, as
industrial output improved after production resumed in areas
stricken by late-summer hurricanes, a report from the Federal
Reserve Bank of Chicago showed on Monday.

A less-volatile three-month moving average of economic
indicators remained near its lowest since 1982, indicating an
increasing likelihood that a recession has begun.

The Chicago Fed said its National Activity Index was minus
1.06 in October, up from a revised minus 3.11 in September,
originally reported at minus 2.57. September's original figure
was pegged initially as the lowest since January 1982; the
revised number puts the September reading at the lowest since
May 1980.

The index has now been negative, indicating below-trend
growth, for 15 straight months dating back to August 2007.

...more...

[UpInArms]

51. US Existing Home Sales fall 3.1% in October

http://www.reuters.com/article/bondsNews/idUSN2148518520081124

WASHINGTON, Nov 24 (Reuters) - The pace of sales of existing homes in the United States fell 3.1 percent in October to a 4.98 million-unit annual rate, while the median home price dropped to its lowest in more than four years, a National Association of Realtors report showed on Monday.

Economists polled by Reuters were expecting home resales to set a 5.00 million-unit pace. September's figure was revised downwards to 5.14 million from 5.18 million.

"Many potential home buyers appear to have withdrawn from the market due to the stock market collapse and deteriorating economic conditions," said Lawrence Yun, NAR chief economist.

The inventory of existing homes for sale slipped 0.9 percent to 4.23 million from 4.27 million in September. The median national home price declined 11.3 percent from a year ago to $183,300, the lowest since March 2004 when the median price was $183,200.

The percentage drop in prices was the biggest since the NAR started keeping records in 1968.

"We have favorable affordable conditions, but we need more than that to give buyers with jobs the confidence they need. Without home price stabilization, there will not be an economic recovery," Yun told reporters.

...more...

[ozymandius]

3. Oil prices rise above $50 on Obama economy team

SINGAPORE – Oil prices rose above $50 a barrel Monday in Asia as investors gained some confidence from reports that U.S. President-elect Barack Obama has chosen an economic team to tackle what could be the worst slowdown in decades.

Light, sweet crude for January delivery was up 59 cents to $50.52 a barrel in electronic trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange by midafternoon in Singapore. The contract Friday rose 51 cents to settle at $49.93.

...

"The lack of clarity as to who exactly is in charge of steering the U.S. economy is really hurting the equity markets," said Victor Shum, an energy analyst with Purvin & Gertz in Singapore. "So putting together the new team gives a bit of a reassurance to the market, even if Obama isn't president yet."

...

In other Nymex trading, gasoline futures rose 0.97 cent to $1.07 a gallon. Heating oil was steady at $1.70 a gallon while natural gas for December delivery jumped 18 cents to $6.66 per 1,000 cubic feet.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/oil_prices

[ozymandius]

4. President-elect Obama rolling out economic course

CHICAGO – Eager to calm economic anxieties, President-elect Barack Obama is rolling out an economic vision that will require congressional cooperation even before he settles into his new desk in the White House's Oval Office.

Obama will introduce his new economic leadership team Monday, a key step toward enacting a huge new economic recovery plan that aims to save or create 2.5 million jobs over the next two years.

The plan is likely to far exceed the $175 billion Obama proposed during the campaign. It would include an infusion of money for infrastructure projects, new environmental technologies and tax cuts for low- and middle-income taxpayers. It will not call for tax hikes for the wealthy.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081124/ap_on_go_pr_wh/obama_economy_47

[ozymandius]

5. Official: Richardson to be commerce secretary

NEW YORK – President-elect Barack Obama has chosen New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson to be commerce secretary, adding a prominent Hispanic and one-time Democratic rival to his expanding Cabinet.

Obama planned to announce the nomination after Thanksgiving, according to a Democratic official familiar with the discussions. The official was not authorized to speak publicly about the negotiations and did so on condition of anonymity.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081124/ap_on_el_pr/obama_cabinet

[Hugin]

6. So, to undermine it the Bushies flush the rest of the cash yesterday...

That's what it looks like to me.

[ozymandius]

8. I expect the Bush administration to become more beligerent

toward the goals of the Obama administration even until noon on January 20th. This is not a surprise to me at all. Just like rock-n-rollers with a severe case of arrested development, the White House tee-vees have yet to be thrown through the windows and doors have not been kicked off their hinges - yet.

But I digress. The Bushies clearly intend to trash the place.

[Hugin]

10. Sadly, I agree.

As it was foretold.

[tclambert]

27. Like the bitter divorcee who burns the house down, and then says, "OK, you want the house?

You can have it!"

[Pale Blue Dot]

24. What Barack Obama Needs to Know About Tim Geithner, the AIG Fiasco and Citigroup

From "The Big Picture" blog:

If the rule of driving money to the strong banks (see “View from the Top: A Prime Solution to the US Banking Crisis”) safety and soundness is to be effective, it must be applied to all. And now you know why we have questions about the nomination of Tim Geithner to be the next Treasury Secretary. If you look at how the Fed and Treasury have handled the bailouts of Bear Stearns and AIG, a reasonable conclusion might be that the Paulson/Geithner model of political economy is rule by plutocrat. Facilitate a Fed bailout of the speculative elements of the financial world and their sponsors among the larger derivatives dealer banks, but leave the real economy to deal with the crisis via bankruptcy and liquidation. Thus Lehman, WaMu, Wachovia and Downey shareholders and creditors get the axe, but the bondholders and institutional counterparties of Bear and AIG do not.

Few observers outside Wall Street understand that the hundreds of billions of dollars pumped into AIG by the Fed of NY and Treasury, funds used to keep the creditors from a default, has been used to fund the payout at face value of credit default swap contracts or “CDS,” insurance written by AIG against senior traunches of collateralized debt obligations or “CDOs.” The Paulson/Geithner model for dealing with troubled financial institutions such as AIG with net unfunded obligations to pay CDS contracts seems to be to simply provide the needed liquidity and hope for the best. Fed and AIG officials have even been attempting to purchase the CDOs insured by AIG in an attempt to tear up the CDS contracts. But these efforts only focus on a small part of AIG’s CDS book.

The Paulson/Geithner bailout model as manifest by the AIG situation is untenable and illustrates why President-elect Obama badly needs a new face at Treasury. A face with real financial credentials, somebody like Fannie Mae CEO Herb Allison. A banker with real world transactional experience, somebody who will know precisely how to deal with the last bubble that needs to be lanced - CDS.

Last Thursday, we gave a presentation to the New York Chapter of the Risk Management Association regarding the US banking sector and the long-term issues facing same. You can read a copy of the slides by clicking here.

As part of the presentation (Page 17-21), IRA co-founder Chris Whalen argued the case made by a reader of The IRA a week before (see “New Hope for Financial Economics: Interview with Bill Janeway,”) that until we rid the markets of CDS, there will be no restoring investor confidence in financial institutions. Here is how we presented the situation to about 200 finance and risk professionals in the auditorium of JPM last week. Of note, nobody in the audience argued.

http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/11/what-obama-geithner-aig-fiasco/

Good article. Much more at the link.

[Demeter]

37. Discussion: Why Did Paulson Give Every Bank Money?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4525077

[ozymandius]

7. Joint Statement by Treasury, Federal Reserve, and the FDIC on Citigroup

Reproduced in full here:

Washington, DC -- The U.S. government is committed to supporting financial market stability, which is a prerequisite to restoring vigorous economic growth. In support of this commitment, the U.S. government on Sunday entered into an agreement with Citigroup to provide a package of guarantees, liquidity access, and capital.

As part of the agreement, Treasury and the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation will provide protection against the possibility of unusually large losses on an asset pool of approximately $306 billion of loans and securities backed by residential and commercial real estate and other such assets, which will remain on Citigroup's balance sheet. As a fee for this arrangement, Citigroup will issue preferred shares to the Treasury and FDIC. In addition and if necessary, the Federal Reserve stands ready to backstop residual risk in the asset pool through a non-recourse loan.

In addition, Treasury will invest $20 billion in Citigroup from the Troubled Asset Relief Program in exchange for preferred stock with an 8% dividend to the Treasury. Citigroup will comply with enhanced executive compensation restrictions and implement the FDIC's mortgage modification program.

With these transactions, the U.S. government is taking the actions necessary to strengthen the financial system and protect U.S. taxpayers and the U.S. economy.

We will continue to use all of our resources to preserve the strength of our banking institutions and promote the process of repair and recovery and to manage risks. The following principles guide our efforts:

* We will work to support a healthy resumption of credit flows to households and businesses.
* We will exercise prudent stewardship of taxpayer resources.
* We will carefully circumscribe the involvement of government in the financial sector.
* We will bolster the efforts of financial institutions to attract private capital.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/newsevents/press/bcreg/20081123a.htm

[Hugin]

9. "We will continue to use all of our resources to preserve the strength of our banking institutions"

Everyone else can go suck an egg... (If they can afford one)

[ozymandius]

12. That's where this generation's crisis managers and those of eighty

years ago widely diverge. Eighty years ago, the banks were allowed to fail to save the dollar. Why would anyone allow money to flow into areas where direct and immediate assistance to consumers would not be realized? In short: FDR's managers made sure people could eat and afford to eat.

Today we have the opposite scenario. Crisis managers are killing the dollar to save the banks.

[Hugin]

15. What gets me is that it isn't a permanent save.

I think it's abundantly clear that dollars flow up through the economy to the banks. So, I have this hypothesis
that pumping money to the lowest tiers would float everything, but, I guess we'll never see if this is the case.

Oh, and Grandma... Forget about that operation.

[ozymandius]

17. The in-laws have informed us that any inheritance is gone.

They have lost around six years of investment progress due to value retracement over the past six months. Both MiL and FiL are children of immigrants who grew up in depression-era Chicago. They have returned to the practice of their parents by keeping cash-on-hand.

[tclambert]

29. YES! The bailout should have gone to the bottom of the economic ladder.

That's the input side. Money flows UPHILL. If the people who can't pay on their mortgages got help so they could pay on their mortgages, there would be fewer foreclosures, less of a glut on the housing market, fewer upside down mortgages, fewer "toxic" mortgage backed securities, etc., etc. And the benefits would flow uphill to the giant financial companies posthaste.

Of course, that would have meant helping PEOPLE, middle class people at that. Not a Bush Republican thing to do.

[Changenow]

38. This is the tax increase,

the privatization of social security and the nationalization of 401ks all rolled into one.

What can someone who wants to come out of this whole do? There is nothing left.

[Demeter]

46. Emigrate, If You Are Young Enough

Had I a Crystal Ball, I would have done so in 1999. Now there's no point to it. Bush has destroyed my economy, and I'm unable to bear the change of nations, even if any one would let me in.

[Changenow]

56. I wish I could

You are absolutely right.

[ozymandius]

16. Press release from Citigroup

New York – Citi (NYSE: C) today announced that it has reached an agreement with the U.S. Treasury, the Federal Reserve Board, and the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. (FDIC) on a series of steps to strengthen Citi's capital ratios, reduce risk, and increase liquidity, as described below:

CAPITAL

* The U.S. Treasury will invest $20 billion in Citi preferred stock under the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP).
* Citi will issue an incremental $7 billion in preferred stock to the U.S. Treasury and the FDIC as payment for a government guarantee on $306 billion of securities, loans, and commitments backed by residential and commercial real estate and other assets.
* As a result of the asset guarantee, the $306 billion portfolio will have a new risk weighting of 20%, thus freeing up an additional $16 billion of capital to the company.
* Citi will issue warrants to the U.S. Treasury and the FDIC for approximately 254 million shares of the company's common stock at a strike price of $10.61.
* Citi also has agreed not to pay a quarterly common stock dividend exceeding $0.01 (one cent) per share for three years effective on the next quarterly common stock dividend payment.

The program significantly strengthens Citi's key capital ratios by generating approximately $40 billion of capital benefits as follows:

* $20 billion from the TARP investment.
* $3.5 billion, the portion of the $7 billion of preferred stock fee recognized for capital purposes.
* $16 billion of capital benefits resulting from the asset guarantee.

Citi's Tier 1 capital ratio for the third quarter ended September 30, 2008, on a pro forma basis, for the October TARP capital injection and the new capital generated by today's announcement, subject to Federal Reserve Board approval, is expected to be approximately 14.8% and its TCE/RWMA ratio would be approximately 9.3%.

RISK REDUCTION
Under the guarantee, Citi will assume any losses on the portfolio up to $29 billion on a pre-tax basis, in addition to Citi's existing reserves; the government entities will assume 90% of any losses above that level and Citi will assume the balance. Citi will retain these assets on its balance sheet and realize the associated cash flow.

LIQUIDITY
In addition to its extensive access to existing liquidity sources, Citi has been provided expanded access to both the Federal Reserve's Primary Dealer Credit Facility and the discount window, resulting in strong additional liquidity resources should they be needed. Citi also has access to the yet-unused Federal Reserve's Commercial Paper Funding Facility and intends to issue debt under the FDIC's Temporary Liquidity Guarantee Program.

The agreement also provides that an executive compensation plan, including bonuses, that rewards long-term performance and profitability, with appropriate limitations, must be submitted to, and approved by, the U.S. government.

"This weekend, the U.S. government and Citi worked together in an unprecedented way to address market confidence and the recent decline in Citi's stock price," said Vikram S. Pandit, Chief Executive Officer. "We reached an agreement based on an innovative market solution to further strengthen our capital ratios, reduce risk, and increase liquidity. We appreciate the tremendous effort by the government to assure market stability.

"We are committed to streamlining our business and providing outstanding banking services to our clients around the world. We will continue to focus on opportunities and alternatives to further enhance the company's overall position and value," Mr. Pandit concluded.

The transaction has been unanimously approved by the Citi Board of Directors.

http://www.citigroup.com/citi/press/2008/081124a.htm

[UpInArms]

42. White House says unaware of any Citigroup rescue talks

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE4AM2C520081123

ABOARD AIR FORCE ONE (Reuters) - White House spokeswoman Dana Perino said on Sunday she knew of no talks going on between banking giant Citigroup and the federal government for financial aid.

Speaking to reporters traveling with President George W. Bush, who is returning to Washington after attending the Asia-Pacific summit in Peru, Perino declined to comment on whether the president supported a federal rescue package for Citigroup.

Citigroup is reeling from the economic slump gripping the United States and its stock tumbled last week. Citigroup's board was reported to have met on Friday to discuss the bank's options, touching of speculation about a possible government rescue.

awe - such confidence inspiring words

:puke:

[DemReadingDU]

44. liars

[JNelson6563]

47. Brevity is the soul of wit.

Well put. :toast:

[Tansy_Gold]

66. cold-blooded liars

goddess-damned liars

filthy stinking liars

and I'm out of words because there are none to describe this kind of pathological lying.


Tansy Gold

[Tansy_Gold]

68. And by the way, at the moment I'm including Obama in that group

Enraged,


Tansy Gold

[ozymandius]

11. U.S. stock futures climb after Citi rescue

S&P 500 futures rose 15.6 points to 807.60 and Nasdaq 100 futures rose 14.75 points to 1,105.75.

Dow industrial futures added 88 points.

....

The big news over the weekend was the rescue package for Citigroup, which is getting a $20 billion capital infusion and guarantees on as much as $306 billion of its troubled assets. Citi will issue $7 billion in preferred stock with an 8% dividend and the government will be in the charge of executive compensation.

Citi's shares jumped 39% in pre-open trade.

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/us-stock-futures-climb-after/story.aspx?guid={223B0E95-C272-47B7-BCFA-2ECF65583015}&dist=msr_2

[Festivito]

13. Debt: 11/20/2008 10,655,457,229,922.30 (UP 3,133,706,694.40) (Little, mostly FICA.)

(Public debt down little. FICA side of debt changed. Same as day before.)

= Held by the Public + Intragovernmental(FICA)
= 6,393,926,893,617.82 + 4,261,530,336,304.52
DOWN 189,695,810.14 + UP 3,323,402,504.50
(NOTE: Excel 2007 cannot handle ten-trillion plus to the penny. It zeroes the penny.)

Source: Debt to the penny:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

THINKING IN BILLIONS: 3 or 4 dollars per billion in a 300-Million person America.
If every American, man, woman and child puts in $3.33 each THAT'S 1B$.
A family of three: Mom, Dad, Child: THEIR SHARE IS TEN BUCKS in a 1B$ federal program.
I hope that is clear. However, I'd suggest using $3 per 1B$ to underestimate it.
Use $4 per 1B$ to overestimate the cost when thinking: Is a federal program worth it?
Aid to Dependant Children: 2B$/yr =$8/yr(a movie a year) Family of 3: $24/yr(an hour of bowling)
(I hate those end to end dollars to the moon and back, or years to spend $100/second. Just say'n)
If you read this and have a suggestion or comment, good or bad, I'd love to see it.

ANALYSIS:
There were 23 reports in the last 30 to 31 days.
The average for the last 23 reports is 8,285,547,190.01.
The average for the last 30 days would be 6,352,252,845.67.
The average for the last 31 days would be 6,147,341,463.55.
There were 252 reports in 365 days of FY2007 averaging 1.99B$ per report, 1.37B$/day.
There were 253 reports in 366 days of FY2008 averaging 4.02B$ per report, 2.78B$/day.
There were 35 reports in 51 days of FY2009 averaging 18.02B$ per report, 12.37B$/day.

PROJECTION:
GWB** must relinquish the presidency in 61 days.
By that time the debt could be between 10.7 and 11.4T$.
It could be higher. It could be lower.

HISTORICAL:
President's term begins and ends on Jan 20.
(Guess who might want to hide the Reagan Bush years. Jan 20 data is missing before 1993.)
01/20/1993 _4,188,092,107,183.60 WJC Inaugural
01/22/2001 _5,728,195,796,181.57 WJC (UP 1,540,103,688,997.97)
11/20/2008 10,655,457,229,922.30 GWB (UP 4,927,261,433,740.73 so far since Bush took office.)

Fiscal Year ends: Sep 30
Borrowed in FY1993: (Maybe later.)
Borrowed in FY1994: 281,261,026,873.94
Borrowed in FY1995: 281,232,990,696.07
Borrowed in FY1996: 250,828,038,426.34
Borrowed in FY1997: 188,335,072,261.61
Borrowed in FY1998: 113,046,997,500.28
Borrowed in FY1999: 130,077,892,735.81
Borrowed in FY2000: _17,907,308,253.43 Bill alone
Borrowed in FY2001: 133,285,202,313.20 Bill and George
Borrowed in FY2002: 420,772,553,397.10 All George
Borrowed in FY2003: 554,995,097,146.46
Borrowed in FY2004: 595,821,633,586.70
Borrowed in FY2005: 553,656,965,393.18
Borrowed in FY2006: 574,264,237,491.73
Borrowed in FY2007: 500,679,473,047.25
Borrowed in FY2008: 1,017,071,524,650.01
Borrowed in FY2009: 630,732,333,009.90 so far this fiscal year.

LAST FIFTEEN REPORTS OF ADDITIONS TO PUBLIC DEBT(NOT FICA):
10/30/2008 +008,339,266,330.60 ------------*********
10/31/2008 +045,215,290,348.09 ------------**********
11/03/2008 -000,572,269,490.77 --- Mon
11/04/2008 +000,314,469,904.16 ------------********
11/05/2008 -000,077,530,396.02 ----
11/06/2008 +056,540,493,221.63 ------------**********
11/07/2008 -000,129,624,570.02 ---
11/10/2008 -000,178,876,517.33 --- Mon
11/12/2008 +000,116,562,137.90 ------------********
11/13/2008 -037,830,308,231.82 -
11/14/2008 +039,714,906,312.49 ------------**********
11/17/2008 -001,168,758,314.18 -- Mon
11/18/2008 +035,027,406,490.17 ------------**********
11/19/2008 -000,433,628,717.22 ---
11/20/2008 -000,189,695,810.14 ---

144,687,702,697.54 Total of 15 above reports.

Heavy borrowing seems to start after 09/18/2008.
US borrowed $990,825,426,663.23 in last 63 days.
That's 991B$ in 63 days.
More than any year ever, except last year, and it's 97% of that highest year ever only in 63 days.
And it is over 100% of ANY dismal Bush, for any dismal Bush-year, ONLY IN 63 DAYS NOT 365.

For a prettier and more explanatory view of our nation's debt:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock

(Debt to the penny keeps changing. Stuff is missing. Best to keep our own history.) YESTERDAY'S POST LINK:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3612356&mesg_id=3612383

[tclambert]

30. You're saying the debt could reach $11T before GWB leaves office?

A year ago, I thought 10 was unreachable. It's amazing how our dear President has continually managed to exceed my expectations.

[Festivito]

65. A 700B$ oops adds to a debt quickly. Not as fast now.

I think they took the money out of the money supply and have it stuck in the Federal Reserve. It keeps inflation down, lets buddies buy good properties really cheap, but it kills lending and destroys car sales, one of the last things we make in the USA.

No one cares that we aren't buying Mexican washers and dryers. Or, wherever they're built these days.

[Festivito]

64. Debt: 11/21/2008 10,655,468,648,978.00 (UP 11,419,055.70) (Tiny day.)

(FICA up, Public down. A teeny-tiny change. I think they already borrowed the money and put it into the Fed. Just a guess, but we'd be paying the interest.)

= Held by the Public + Intragovernmental(FICA)
= 6,393,775,797,295.81 + 4,261,692,851,682.26
DOWN 151,096,322.01 + UP 162,515,377.74
(NOTE: Excel 2007 cannot handle ten-trillion plus to the penny. It zeroes the penny.)

Source: Debt to the penny:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

THINKING IN BILLIONS: 3 or 4 dollars per billion in a 300-Million person America.
If every American, man, woman and child puts in $3.33 each THAT'S 1B$.
A family of three: Mom, Dad, Child: THEIR SHARE IS TEN BUCKS in a 1B$ federal program.
I hope that is clear. However, I'd suggest using $3 per 1B$ to underestimate it.
Use $4 per 1B$ to overestimate the cost when thinking: Is a federal program worth it?
Aid to Dependant Children: 2B$/yr =$8/yr(a movie a year) Family of 3: $24/yr(an hour of bowling)
(I hate those end to end dollars to the moon and back, or years to spend $100/second. Just say'n)
If you read this and have a suggestion or comment, good or bad, I'd love to see it.

ANALYSIS:
There were 23 reports in the last 30 to 31 days.
The average for the last 23 reports is 8,177,283,271.60.
The average for the last 30 days would be 6,269,250,508.23.
The average for the last 31 days would be 6,067,016,620.87.
There were 252 reports in 365 days of FY2007 averaging 1.99B$ per report, 1.37B$/day.
There were 253 reports in 366 days of FY2008 averaging 4.02B$ per report, 2.78B$/day.
There were 36 reports in 52 days of FY2009 averaging 17.52B$ per report, 12.13B$/day.

PROJECTION:
GWB** must relinquish the presidency in 60 days.
By that time the debt could be between 10.7 and 11.4T$.
It could be higher. It could be lower.

HISTORICAL:
President's term begins and ends on Jan 20.
(Guess who might want to hide the Reagan Bush years. Jan 20 data is missing before 1993.)
01/20/1993 _4,188,092,107,183.60 WJC Inaugural
01/22/2001 _5,728,195,796,181.57 WJC (UP 1,540,103,688,997.97)
11/21/2008 10,655,468,648,978.00 GWB (UP 4,927,272,852,796.43 so far since Bush took office.)

Fiscal Year ends: Sep 30
Borrowed in FY1993: (Maybe later.)
Borrowed in FY1994: 281,261,026,873.94
Borrowed in FY1995: 281,232,990,696.07
Borrowed in FY1996: 250,828,038,426.34
Borrowed in FY1997: 188,335,072,261.61
Borrowed in FY1998: 113,046,997,500.28
Borrowed in FY1999: 130,077,892,735.81
Borrowed in FY2000: _17,907,308,253.43 Bill alone
Borrowed in FY2001: 133,285,202,313.20 Bill and George
Borrowed in FY2002: 420,772,553,397.10 All George
Borrowed in FY2003: 554,995,097,146.46
Borrowed in FY2004: 595,821,633,586.70
Borrowed in FY2005: 553,656,965,393.18
Borrowed in FY2006: 574,264,237,491.73
Borrowed in FY2007: 500,679,473,047.25
Borrowed in FY2008: 1,017,071,524,650.01
Borrowed in FY2009: 630,743,752,065.60 so far this fiscal year.

LAST FIFTEEN REPORTS OF ADDITIONS TO PUBLIC DEBT(NOT FICA):
10/31/2008 +045,215,290,348.09 ------------**********
11/03/2008 -000,572,269,490.77 --- Mon
11/04/2008 +000,314,469,904.16 ------------********
11/05/2008 -000,077,530,396.02 ----
11/06/2008 +056,540,493,221.63 ------------**********
11/07/2008 -000,129,624,570.02 ---
11/10/2008 -000,178,876,517.33 --- Mon
11/12/2008 +000,116,562,137.90 ------------********
11/13/2008 -037,830,308,231.82 -
11/14/2008 +039,714,906,312.49 ------------**********
11/17/2008 -001,168,758,314.18 -- Mon
11/18/2008 +035,027,406,490.17 ------------**********
11/19/2008 -000,433,628,717.22 ---
11/20/2008 -000,189,695,810.14 ---
11/21/2008 -000,151,096,322.01 ---

136,197,340,044.93 Total of 15 above reports.

Heavy borrowing seems to start after 09/18/2008.
US borrowed $990,836,845,718.93 in last 64 days.
That's 991B$ in 64 days.
More than any year ever, except last year, and it's 97% of that highest year ever only in 64 days.
And it is over 100% of ANY dismal Bush, for any dismal Bush-year, ONLY IN 64 DAYS NOT 365.

For a prettier and more explanatory view of our nation's debt:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock

(Debt to the penny keeps changing. Stuff is missing. Best to keep our own history.) YESTERDAY'S POST LINK:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3615962&mesg_id=3615982

[ozymandius]

14. German business confidence plummets

German business confidence has plummeted to lows not seen since the early 1990s in the latest evidence that Europe’s industrial powerhouse has suddenly been thrown into reverse.

The Munich-based Ifo index reported its business climate index had fallen much more sharply than expected from 90.2 in October to 85.8 in November, the lowest since February 1993.

...

The index’s precipitous fall highlights the dramatic effect slowing global demand has had on Europe’s largest economy, which had relied largely on exports, and more recently corporate investment, to power growth. In contrast to the UK and US, German consumers have not fared as badly – the country has not seen a house price collapse and lower oil prices have boosted spending power.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e9ae19da-ba0c-11dd-8c07-0000779fd18c,dwp_uuid=70662e7c-3027-11da-ba9f-00000e2511c8.html

[ozymandius]

18. Asian Stocks Decline; Financial Shares Drop on Profit Concern

Nov. 24 (Bloomberg) -- Asian stocks fell on mounting signs the credit crisis is hurting profits at financial companies as recessions in the world’s biggest economies deepen.

Suncorp-Metway Ltd., Australia’s third-largest insurer, dropped 3 percent in Sydney after increasing its forecast for bad loans. Standard Chartered Plc lost 6.4 percent in Hong Kong after the London-based lender said it will sell stock to bolster its finances. Banking shares fell even as Citigroup Inc. won a U.S. government guarantee on $306 billion of troubled assets. BHP Billiton Ltd., Australia’s largest oil company, climbed 6.8 percent after crude climbed.

....

Most Asian markets fell today, with Japan shut for a holiday. The MSCI Asia Pacific excluding Japan Index lost 0.6 percent to 205.19 as of 6:54 p.m. in Hong Kong. Financial stocks were the biggest drag. The gauge is down 61 percent this year, leaving it at 8.7 times estimated profit, about half its valuation at the start of 2008.

South Korea’s Kospi Index slid 3.4 percent, Singapore’s Straits Times Index retreated 2.5 percent and Hong Kong’s Hang Seng Index declined 1.6 percent. Air China Ltd. tumbled in Hong Kong after losses on hedging contracts tripled.

Thailand’s SET Index fell 2.9 percent, led by Bangkok Bank Pcl, after economic growth slowed more than expected in the third quarter as exports cooled and violent political protests curbed domestic spending.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=anFtk0LegyQA&refer=home

[ozymandius]

19. Fed Pledges Top $7.4 Trillion to Ease Frozen Credit (Update1)

Nov. 24 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. government is prepared to lend more than $7.4 trillion on behalf of American taxpayers, or half the value of everything produced in the nation last year, to rescue the financial system since the credit markets seized up 15 months ago.

The unprecedented pledge of funds includes $2.8 trillion already tapped by financial institutions in the biggest response to an economic emergency since the New Deal of the 1930s, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. The commitment dwarfs the only plan approved by lawmakers, the Treasury Department’s $700 billion Troubled Asset Relief Program. Federal Reserve lending last week was 1,900 times the weekly average for the three years before the crisis.

When Congress approved the TARP on Oct. 3, Fed Chairman Ben S. Bernanke and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson acknowledged the need for transparency and oversight. Now, as regulators commit far more money while refusing to disclose loan recipients or reveal the collateral they are taking in return, some Congress members are calling for the Fed to be reined in.

.....

William Poole, former president of the Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis, said the two programs are unlikely to lose money. The bigger risk comes from rescuing companies perceived as “too big to fail,” he said.

The government committed $29 billion to help engineer the takeover in March of Bear Stearns Cos. by New York-based JPMorgan Chase & Co. and $122.8 billion in addition to TARP allocations to bail out New York-based American International Group Inc., once the world’s largest insurer. Yesterday, Citigroup Inc. received $306 billion of government guarantees for troubled mortgages and toxic assets. The Treasury Department also will inject $20 billion into the bank after its stock fell 60 percent last week.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=arEE1iClqDrk&refer=exclusive

---

The virulently growing monetary obligations are crushing us. My thoughts turn medieval toward Bernanke and Paulson.

[ozymandius]

21. Treasury Traders Paid to Borrow as Fed Examines Repos (Update1)

Nov. 24 (Bloomberg) -- Owners of Treasuries may soon get paid to borrow as the U.S. tries to break a logjam in the $7 trillion-a-day repurchase market.

Treasuries are in such high demand that investors are lending cash for next to nothing to obtain the securities as collateral through so-called repos, which dealers use to finance their holdings. The problem is many parties involved in repos aren’t delivering the bonds because there is no penalty for not doing so, causing “fails” to exceed $5 trillion, according to the Federal Reserve Bank of New York.

Now, an industry group is trying to fix the mess, which New York Fed Executive Vice President William Dudley said could cause U.S. borrowing rates to rise if not rectified. The Treasury Market Practices Group wants to impose a “penalty” on failed trades, a move that may result in borrowers who put their Treasuries up as collateral for loans effectively receiving 2 percent interest.

....

The disruption in the repo market comes as the Treasury steps up debt sales to finance a record budget deficit and the bailout of the nation’s banks. Gross issuance of Treasury coupon securities will rise to about $1.15 trillion in fiscal 2009 from $724 billion last year, according to New York-based Credit Suisse Securities USA LLC, one of the 17 primary dealers that are obligated to bid at the government’s auctions.

“The more chronic fails disrupt the Treasury market, the more it reduces its liquidity and efficiency,” Dudley said in a Nov. 12 interview. “Over time, this could have some negative consequences for the ability of the U.S. Treasury to raise money at the lowest cost possible. Reduced liquidity also affects other markets as the Treasury market is used to hedge positions in other security classes.”

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=anf.Bv7jZkTM&refer=us

[BelgianMadCow]

23. Spending Trillions without oversight, it's simply incredible.

I am rather speechless. Through reading the SMW thread, I was already aware of the immense borrowing going on, but to see it agglomerated...

[Dr.Phool]

28. Where are the police? AKA Congress.

We've had a couple of dog and pony show hearings so far, but nothing of substance.

Had they impeached this SOB at some point, any point in the last 2 years, a lot of this could have been prevented. Since we can only have one President at a time, let's get rid of one. But, that would require a little time and actual work, rather than screw up their holiday recess, and interfere with their fundraising for the 2010 mid-terms.

[tclambert]

33. When the numbers get that big, they become hard to grasp.

I joked in a few posts about a suggestion for a government jobs program I heard of: building a pyramid. But we kind of are. A pile of $7.4T in paper money (in ones) would weigh more than the Great Pyramid of Giza.

[Tansy_Gold]

67. medieval is the key word

pre-enlightenment

[ozymandius]

20. Block Trades Disappear in U.S. as Volatility, Losses Increase

Nov. 24 (Bloomberg) -- Block trades, dwindling in the U.S. for a decade because of electronic markets, have all but disappeared as the credit crisis and near-record volatility dissuade investors from selling equity in chunks.

Transactions of 10,000 shares or more at the New York Stock Exchange have dropped by half since 2006 as investors avoided the risk of getting whipsawed by price swings. Block trades, which banks sometimes facilitate by purchasing shares from investors and then selling to clients, represented 9.4 percent of volume on Nov. 17, the lowest since the credit crisis intensified in September, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.

.....

1929 Record

The magnitude of U.S. stock market swings will soon surpass the record set in 1929 as the 80-year-old Standard & Poor’s 500 Index heads for it steepest annual loss, Krag “Buzz” Gregory, a derivatives strategist at Goldman Sachs Group Inc., wrote in a Nov. 21 report. Realized volatility, a gauge of stock-price moves, for the S&P 500 has risen to 66 percent for the last three months, the highest since reaching 68 percent following the crash of 1929, he added.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&refer=exclusive&sid=aMevfq5nQ9H0

---

Dang! There's that number again... 1929.

[ozymandius]

22. MONEY MARKETS-Year-end worries overshadow Geithner, FDIC

LONDON, Nov 24 (Reuters) - The cost of raising sterling and dollar funds on the interbank market stayed high relative to expected policy rates on Monday due to bank caution on lending ahead of the year-end period.

The drive to reduce counterparty risk in the run-up to the end of the year, when banks traditionally hoard cash to boost their balance sheets for accounting purposes, overshadowed some money market-friendly news from the United States at the weekend.

.....

The premium for three-month sterling interbank funds over expected central bank rates as measured by Overnight Index Swaps was last indicated at around 230 basis points, marginally wider than Friday.

That spread, a key gauge of banks' financial health and willingness to lend, is almost as wide as at any point during the 15-month financial crisis.

http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idUSLO71883920081124

[UpInArms]

25. dollar watch

http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYBOT_DX&v=i

Last trade 87.020 Change -0.638 (-0.82%)

US Dollar May Finally See Breakouts During Volatile, Holiday Week

http://www.dailyfx.com/story/currency/eur_fundamentals/US_Dollar_May_Finally_See_1227327755524.html

The US dollar is at a crossroads this week. On the one hand, congestion has been the rule of thumb for much of the currency market. On the other, fundamentals and underlying volatility suggest stability is waning. With a concentrated shot of event risk, growing threats to the credit and financial markets, and the unusual trading conditions expected to come along with the holiday, the chances for a breakout are intensified. First and foremost, it is important to consider what influence the US market holiday (Thanksgiving) will have on price action. One thing is for certain, liquidity will thin out as US banks and exchanges will be close on Thursday, and speculative interest from the country will be depressed through the entire week. Beyond this fact, we can have one of two reactions from the FX market. Either the drop in volume will maintain trends of congestion or its will leverage already extraordinary levels of volatility and potential incite breakouts.

Whichever outcome the market is destined for will likely depend on the influence of broad risk sentiment trends have over FX. We saw a temporary jump in risk aversion this past week, brought on by another series of indicators and reports that suggests the financial crisis could easily take a nasty turn for the worst in the very near futures. In fact, bond default risk hit a new record high, the benchmark Dow 30 tumbled to a new six-and-a-half year low and the dollar and Japanese yen found their way to new highs. And, while some of these moves have since retraced, the symbolic push has already been made. Looking ahead, the most immediate concern regarding the health of the markets is that the three major US auto manufacturers are on the brink of collapse. While we have already seen a few financial institutions go bankrupt, the failure of these American staples would signal the credit crisis has indeed made the jump from Wall Street to Main Street; and further that the second round effects of the crunch will be far more pervasive. Considering officials seem to already be reaching the limitations of the current TARP program (in addition to monetary policy and providing liquidity), a new intensity could spell disaster.

Aside from the constant ebb and flow of risk sentiment, the dollar may also take its cues from the economic calendar. While much of the data scheduled would be considered second tier at this point; the intensified scrutiny over the severity of the oncoming recession will refocus fundamental traders’ interests. The foreshortened trading week concentrates all the data into three days. The greatest threat of event risk lies with the first revision to third quarter GDP. While this is a second reading, there is the probability for a significant change to the headline gauge and component figures. Personal consumption will be particularly important as the failure of this vital sector could extend and intensify the economy’s slump. Further gauging the health of the consumer, personal income, spending and confidence readings will refine expectations of whether they will help or hinder the much-anticipated recovery.



...more...

Euro Unchanged Against US Dollar Despite Dismal Data - What Gives?

http://www.dailyfx.com/story/currency/eur_fundamentals/Euro_Unchanged_Against_US_Dollar_1227307881923.html

Given that the Euro/US Dollar pair ignored confirmation that the Euro Zone is officially in recession, there is little reason to believe that a negative string of economic data will do anything to alter the single currency’s short-term prospects. Instead we will look to key economic reports to gauge likely reactions out of domestic and global stock market indices. Before massive losses in global financial markets, currency traders would often buy currencies with the highest yields and with the best interest rate prospects. Yet we see that the direct opposite has been true of the Euro as of late; the single currency sold off sharply on signs that the European Central Bank would keep interest rates higher than many traders had expected. ECB President Jean Claude Trichet has since softened his rhetoric on inflation, however, and interest rate traders have priced in a virtual certainty that the European Central Bank will cut rates by a sizeable 50 basis points at its December 4 meeting.

With current market conditions in mind, we may have to keep a close watch on mid-week German and late-week Euro Zone CPI estimates for the month of November. Any indications that CPI inflation remains high will almost certainly dampen expectations for ECB rate cuts, and the Euro could by extension decline against the safe-haven US Dollar and Japanese Yen. Otherwise we will watch market reactions to US and other global economic event risk. A holiday-shortened week in North America may make for especially volatile trading on illiquid trading conditions.

...more...

[nolabels]

32. It's called denial, I guess we are somewhere nearing the end of that cycle........

if you compare it to what happened to Argentina. It's going to happen in the US but probably ten times worse no doubt. Their numbers looked the same way as our US numbers but ours just happen to be on bigger scale and some things going on in a different sequence. Many other things seem the same the though, especially the effort to try and borrow a way out of it. The most clear thing is of a government disconnected from it's citizens and signing them up to obligations that they probably didn't want to make.

Argentine economic crisis (1999–2002)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argentine_economic_crisis_(1999-2002)

[Ghost Dog]

48. Euro extends gains as US stocks accelerate rally

Mon Nov 24, 2008 10:36am EST NEW YORK, Nov 24 (Reuters) - The euro extended gains versus the U.S. dollar on Monday ... In midmorning trading in New York, the euro rose more than 2 percent to trade as high as $1.2880, a two-week high <EUR=>. The euro was also 2.6 percent higher at 123.77 yen <EURJPY=>.

/.. http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idINN2450478420081124?rpc=44

______
also:

[UpInArms]

26. Barbarians of Yore Perish in Bonfire of Inanities

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&refer=columnist_helyar&sid=aU5S.Ev1XnRg

In the fall of 1988, giants walked Wall Street, causing corporate America to tremble and capturing the public imagination in best-sellers.

Salomon Brothers' John Gutfreund challenged his traders to a million-dollar hand in ``Liar's Poker.'' Michael Milken trafficked in junk bonds and intrigue in ``Den of Thieves.'' Leveraged-buyout rivals Henry Kravis and Ted Forstmann vied to acquire RJR Nabisco in ``Barbarians at the Gate.''

In the fall of 2008, Lilliputians walk what's left of the Street. Last month, the nine biggest banks' leaders were summoned to Washington by Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson, who said he had an offer they couldn't refuse.

They would get the first chunk of a $250 billion government infusion of capital into the banking system. Uncle Sam would pay each of the assembled banks as much as $25 billion for a new class of preferred stock -- and impose some onerous terms, like capping executive pay. Just sign the term sheet, Paulson said; this wasn't negotiable. And they did.

So how did this once-proud breed manage to go from bestriding the business world to groveling in Washington? It's a pertinent question as we near the 20th anniversary of the climax of the roaring '80s: On Nov. 30, 1988, Kohlberg Kravis Roberts & Co. bid a record-smashing $25 billion to win the battle for RJR Nabisco.

(Full commercial disclosure: ``Barbarians at the Gate,'' which I co-wrote with Bryan Burrough, has been re-issued in hardback to mark that anniversary.)

Gold Paving

The road from there to here was hardly straight downhill. For long stretches, it was gloriously paved with gold. It ended ``Thelma and Louise''-style, with banks plunging off a cliff, for a simple reason. Bankers refused to settle for being bankers.

The old role of Wall Street -- to advise and finance American business -- was thought to be for remnants of the white-shoe crowd. They had no imaginations, no aspirations, no places in the Hamptons. Wall Street became increasingly and fatefully a business of blue smoke and mirrors.

...more...

[Demeter]

34. "Bankers refused to settle for being bankers"

And Paulson and Bernanke and Bush are enabling them.

The upshot of trying to save this Structured Finance Ponzi scheme will truly be a "Bonfire of the Vanities". Or more like a nuclear Holocaust, where nothing, no life, is spared, and the ground is sterile for hundreds of years.

[Tansy_Gold]

35. And sadly, Demeter, that's why some of us here DO cheer

the massive declines in the DJIA. Not because we want to see fortunes destroyed but because we know it may be the only way to bring about a real recovery.

Goddess but it's so fucking scary these days.



Tansy Gold

[Demeter]

36. I Thought The Weekend Was Bad!

Towards the end of the WE Thread I thought people reading it would be driven to suicide (having the flu, I'm already suicidal and make allowance for it)--and now I'm depressed like the deer in the headlights, and the markets haven't even opened!

The CitiGroup announcement goes beyond outrageous. We can't pay off the 500+ TRILLION of gambles that the "financiers" made with their "structured finance"! Even if money moved at the speed of light there is no way these debts can be honored.

These criminals MUST be asset-stripped, power-stripped, and freedom-stripped. They knew what they were doing, and did it anyway, and continue to do it in the light of day. Has anyone heard that these structured financial products are no longer being written? OF COURSE NOT! THEY STILL ARE MAKING AND TAKING THESE TOXIC BETS, BECAUSE THEY GET THEIRS FIRST!

I could scream with frustration. I guess I just did!

In case anyone is wondering, the link to the Weekend Economist thread follows:


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x403816

[AnneD]

54. Morning Marketeers.......

:donut: and lurkers. I head off to the fist 'vacation' I have had in a long time. I am flying up early tomorrow to the Burbank Airport and visit my daughter in Valencia Ca. I have to work around her schedule but the vacation will involve State Hwy 1, an convertible if I can get one, and a road trip. It's something I have always wanted to do. I wish I had more time because I would take the entire road, but for my first trip, it will do. We will visit San Francisco and Chinese food and a steak will be involved. I may post I may not, but you can bet I'm having le bon temps.

I have been giving our economy much thought. I said that hubby and his lessons were a lagging indicator. He lost 3 student in nearby Katy but he gained 4. So we are not certain where we stand but we have tightened up the budget s bit more and I will be giving up the car to go to work when I come back. We are doing major belt tightening. The land lord raised the rent another $25. Even though we can afford it-we think this raise is out of line. This is the incentive we need to save for a down on a house. Our costs for storage, elect., gas, studio rental (hubby can't teach in clubhouse any more and lot rent is edging up closer to what an apartment or home rents for in this area. Once we hit that point-we buy.

I have an idea for a new challenge. One day, let's make our end of the year economic predictions and then in at the end of next year we post them and see who came the closest. You make your predictions, and state why you are making your prediction. Now Obama is a wild card but that should make it even more interesting. In your predictions include....The price of gold, the price of oil, and approximation of the S&P and the DJIA and any other things that might happen (will the cubbies finally win). We will pick a date to post then knock ourselves out. The only rule is no changing posts after a certain date...Any takers?

Happy hunting and watch out for the bears.

[specimenfred1984]

60. You said the magic word "Criminals"

Until our new gov't treats the criminals like criminals, nothing will recover and nothing will happen except for more and more crime. The Obama prez-elect status is stopping NOTHING, the crimes continue unabated.

[bain_sidhe]

71. Heh. After reading that

All I could think was, thank god(dess) it's the weekend & the market's closed...

Oh, wait... :-(

Seriously, though, why do you put the Weekender in the Editorials forum instead of the Economy forum? Seems like more economy-minded folks might see it in the Economy forum... (of course, it's entirely up to you, just asking.)

[Demeter]

82. Originally, I Put It in the LBN

But the moderators never let my posts stay there. I think it's personal. Doesn't matter what it is, either.

I figure that in Editorials, WE gets the widest possible viewing. And it's important to educate ourselves with as much factual data as we can get, and examine this data from as many viewpoints as possible. This is THE defining issue for the forseeable future, not a niche interest.

[Changenow]

41. The stock market isn't going to crash

at least the numbers won't. The dollar will crash to save the stock market.

They know exactly what they are doing. In plain sight we are watching them destroy what little is left of the American Dream.

[DemReadingDU]

43. There are stops in place to prevent a complete meltdown

But I do think there will be a day or two whereby people are going to try to sell whatever they have and just get out of the stock market.

[MilesColtrane]

40. No one in charge is mentioning this.

The only solution proffered is pouring freshly minted bucks onto their balance sheets. The concept that this is happening partially because of trusts forming isn't even entertained. In fact, when a meglo-bank gets shaky, the solution is merger... even more conglomeration.

Congress and BushCo™ have completely bought into the mindset that these companies must remain enormous or else they won't be able to compete on a global scale.

Even if the toxic mortgage instruments are eventually covered and these financial monsters regain some black ink there's nothing preventing this type of thing from happening again unless anti-trust legislation breaks them up.

[Tansy_Gold]

45. And that's exactly why I commented regarding a "break-up"

of GM, an of course that was only one example.

Several weeks ago, when AIG was in the process of collapsing, there was talk about splitting off its toxic portion and leaving the "healthy" insurance business as a separate and profitable business. The toxic arm would wither and die, and a "healthy" AIG would emerge.

THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN, and I don't recall hearing any more of it.

We need to revisit "DAVE" and consider just sitting down with the billionaire bloats at the top of GM, Citi, AIG, whatever, and going over their corporate structure one entity at a time. Break 'em up and let the bad ones fail. I have a feeling it would happen quickly and (realtively) painlessly. A few extremely wealthy folks might find themselves reduced to a few million$, but a few millions of real people might be kept out of cardboard boxes.


Tansy Gold, who isn't stupid

[Ghost Dog]

49. Energy, banks stocks help Europe shares surge 5 pct

Mon Nov 24, 2008 10:14am EST LONDON, Nov 24 (Reuters) - European shares surged 5 percent in afternoon trade on Monday... At 1508 GMT, the FTSEurofirst 300 index of top European shares was up 4.7 percent at 797.07 points after rising as high as 799.22 points. U.S. stocks .DJI .SPX .IXIC were up 2.2-2.6 percent.

Energy stocks tracked crude oil CLc1, which jumped 3 percent. BP (BP.L: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), Royal Dutch Shell (RDSa.L: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), gas producer BG Group (BG.L: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) and Tullow Oil (TLW.L: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) added between 4.5 and 9.6 percent.

Barclays (BARC.L: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) surged 9.7 percent and Lloyds TSB (LLOY.L: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) was up 8.4 percent.

/.. http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idCALO69576420081124?rpc=44

[Ghost Dog]

50. EU mergers and takeovers (Nov 24)

Fascinating stuff... http://www.reuters.com/article/companyNews/idUKPRWP1420081124?symbol=SAN.MC&sp=true

[antigop]

52. WSJ: Summers offers big picture advice to hedge fund

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122748629920251779.html

In 2006, Lawrence Summers resigned as president of Harvard University and took a position as a part-time managing director with D.E. Shaw Group, a New York hedge fund with a reputation as one of the most secretive trading outfits in the world.

D.E. Shaw is known for using sophisticated computer-based quantitative strategies to make money on fleeting movements in the stock and bond markets. The fund has been a top performer, returning 15% to 20% a year over the long term, and in two decades has grown into a global powerhouse. But like many funds, it has taken hits in the credit crisis.


During his time at D.E. Shaw, Mr. Summers came into its midtown Manhattan office once a week, usually Wednesdays. He consulted with its executive committee and gave advice about his views on macroeconomic trends. He didn't make specific investment decisions or meet with clients, according to a person familiar with the firm.

Mr. Summers declined to comment for this article.

[TrogL]

53. Loonie Watch

Highlights

Current:

Loonie: Toronto Stock Exchange:

30-day and 90-day vs.greenback:



30-day vs. Euro, Yen, UK Pound and Swiss Franc




Currency Comparison: http://members.shaw.ca/trogl/looniewatch.html

Detailed analysis: http://quotes.ino.com/exchanges/?r=CME_CD

Up-to-the-minute graph: http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=CME_CD.Y%24%24&v=s&w=5&t=l&a=1

Historical values http://www.x-rates.com/d/USD/CAD/data30.html

2008-10-13 Monday, October 13 0.840336 USD
2008-10-14 Tuesday, October 14 0.862143 USD
2008-10-15 Wednesday, October 15 0.84717 USD
2008-10-16 Thursday, October 16 0.83661 USD
2008-10-17 Friday, October 17 0.846024 USD
2008-10-20 Monday, October 20 0.834934 USD
2008-10-21 Tuesday, October 21 0.819135 USD
2008-10-22 Wednesday, October 22 0.800256 USD
2008-10-23 Thursday, October 23 0.795355 USD
2008-10-24 Friday, October 24 0.785238 USD
2008-10-27 Monday, October 27 0.773096 USD
2008-10-28 Tuesday, October 28 0.772678 USD
2008-10-29 Wednesday, October 29 0.812876 USD
2008-10-30 Thursday, October 30 0.817728 USD
2008-10-31 Friday, October 31 0.817728 USD
2008-11-03 Monday, November 3 0.842744 USD
2008-11-04 Tuesday, November 4 0.869414 USD
2008-11-05 Wednesday, November 5 0.862813 USD
2008-11-06 Thursday, November 6 0.84631 USD
2008-11-07 Friday, November 7 0.845309 USD
2008-11-10 Monday, November 10 0.83696 USD
2008-11-11 Tuesday, November 11 0.83696 USD
2008-11-12 Wednesday, November 12 0.813273 USD
2008-11-13 Thursday, November 13 0.812282 USD
2008-11-14 Friday, November 14 0.816927 USD
2008-11-17 Monday, November 17 0.8188 USD
2008-11-18 Tuesday, November 18 0.817194 USD
2008-11-19 Wednesday, November 19 0.808407 USD
2008-11-20 Thursday, November 20 0.77821 USD
2008-11-21 Friday, November 21 0.778271 USD

Current values

http://quotes.ino.com/exchanges/?r=CME_CD)

Market            Open   High    Low   Last  Change    Pct Time
CD.Y$$ Cash     0.7913 0.8166 0.7906 0.8107 +0.0336 +4.32% 13:01 
CD.Z08 Dec 2008 0.7900 0.8100 0.7900 0.8100 +0.0331 +4.26% 11:04 
CD.H09 Mar 2009 0.7987 0.7987 0.7987 0.7987 +0.0210 +2.69% 10:04 
CD.M09 Jun 2009 0.7805 0.7806        0.7781 -0.0008 -0.10% set 15:07 
CD.U09 Sep 2009 0.9350        0.9340 0.7787 -0.0004 -0.05% set 15:07 
CD.Z09 Dec 2009 0.7000 0.7000 0.7000 0.7784 -0.0006 -0.08% set 15:07 
CD.H10 Mar 2010 0.8800 0.8800 0.8800 0.7781 -0.0008 -0.10% set 15:07 
  

Other combinations: (http://quotes.ino.com/exchanges/?c=currencies)

Market          Open    High    Low     Last    Change   Pct 
AUSTRALIAN $/CANADIAN $ (CME:ACD)
ACD.Z08 Dec 2008 0.7939 0.7939 0.7939 0.7939 +0.0084 +1.06%   
BRITISH POUND/US$ (SMALL) (NYBOT:MP)
MP.Z08.E Dec 2008 (E) 1.5016 1.5160 1.4996 1.5100 +0.0323 +2.17%   
EURO/BRITISH POUND (NYBOT:GB)
GB.Z08.E Dec 2008 (E) 0.8458 0.8458 0.8458 0.8458 +0.0004 +0.05%     
EURO/JAPANESE YEN (NYBOT:EJ)
EJ.Z08.E Dec 2008 (E) 119.800 123.885 119.800 123.885 +4.935 +4.14%    

Blather (from http://quotes.ino.com/exchanges/?r=CME_CD)

The December Canadian Dollar was higher overnight due to short covering as it consolidates some of last week's decline. Stochastics and the RSI are oversold but remain neutral to bearish signaling that sideways to lower prices are possible near-term. Closes below October's low crossing at 76.86 would renew this fall's decline while opening the door for additional weakness into early- December. Closes above the 20-day moving average crossing at 81.87 are needed to confirm that a short-term low has been posted. First resistance is the 10-day moving average crossing at 80.41. Second resistance is the 20-day moving average crossing at 81.87. First support is last Thursday's low crossing at 79.83. Second support is October's low crossing at 76.86.

Analysis

:wtf:

The graphs are saying the loonie gained four cents since opening. Granted, the graphs are usually off (the numbers say 3.3), but the morning drivein said nothing - they were more excited about the Citigroup thing. Probably something bad happened to the greenback.

One thing they did point out was that Canadian bank stocks were way down even though they had absolutely no exposure to current economic problems. Not good for me - I'm trying to get a line of credit. Possibly some bargains, though.

On another note, holy crap look at the Euro!!

[TrogL]

69. closing numbers and blather

Highlights

Current values

http://quotes.ino.com/exchanges/?r=CME_CD)

Market            Open   High    Low   Last  Change    Pct Time
CD.Y$$ Cash     0.7913 0.8166 0.7906 0.8081 +0.0310 +3.99% 15:01 
CD.Z08 Dec 2008 0.7900 0.8150 0.7900 0.8082 +0.0313 +4.03% set 14:59 
CD.H09 Mar 2009 0.7987 0.7987 0.7987 0.8093 +0.0316 +4.05% set 10:04 
CD.M09 Jun 2009 0.7805 0.7806        0.8099 +0.0318 +4.07% set 15:07 
CD.U09 Sep 2009 0.9350        0.9340 0.8111 +0.0324 +4.16% set 15:07 
CD.Z09 Dec 2009 0.7000 0.7000 0.7000 0.8108 +0.0324 +4.16% set 15:07 
CD.H10 Mar 2010 0.8800 0.8800 0.8800 0.8105 +0.0324 +4.16% set 15:07
 

Other combinations: (http://quotes.ino.com/exchanges/?c=currencies)

Market          Open    High    Low     Last    Change   Pct 
AUSTRALIAN $/CANADIAN $ (CME:ACD)
ACD.Z08 Dec 2008 0.8002 0.8002 0.8002 0.8002 +0.0063 +0.79%   
BRITISH POUND/US$ (SMALL) (NYBOT:MP)
MP.Z08.E Dec 2008 (E) 1.5016 1.5168 1.4996 1.5115 +0.0338 +2.27%   
EURO/BRITISH POUND (NYBOT:GB)
GB.Z08.E Dec 2008 (E) 0.8458 0.8511 0.8458 0.8511 +0.0057 +0.67%     
EURO/JAPANESE YEN (NYBOT:EJ)
EJ.Z08.E Dec 2008 (E) 119.80 125.20 119.80 125.20 +6.25 +5.25%      

Blather (from http://quotes.ino.com/exchanges/?r=CME_CD)

The December Canadian Dollar closed higher on Monday and above the 10-day moving average crossing at 80.65 signaling that a short-term low has been posted. Stochastics and the RSI are oversold but turning neutral hinting that a low might be in or is near. The high-range close sets the stage for a steady to higher opening on Tuesday. Closes above the 20-day moving average crossing at 81.99 are needed to confirm that a short-term low has been posted. If December renews last week's decline, October's low crossing at 76.86 is the next downside target. First resistance is the 20-day moving average crossing at 81.99. Second resistance is the reaction high crossing at 87.24. First support is last Thursday's low crossing at 76.92. Second support is October's low crossing at 76.86.

Analysis

The TSE jumped up nicely. The loonie gained over three cents (or probably more accurately the greenback took a tumble).

[specimenfred1984]

55. C bailed out so they can charge you $39 late fees, offer BS loans, deny credit

to people who really need it, invent criminal CDOs, register offshore to avoid taxes, pay CEOs 100s of millions, bribe gov't officials and buy a lot more propaganda!

For anyone asking "how does this help America", FUCK YOU LOSERS, it doesn't.

[TheWatcher]

57. This Rally the past two trading days really illustrates one thing.

I mean, as fake as it is, there is a bit of reality behind it.

Wall Street is getting everything it wants. The Geithner appointment sends a clear message that "It's Business As Usual."

I won't even comment on the Citi Bailout. That speaks for itself.

Right now it seems as if Wall Street is having it's own Big Party, aside from the usual manipulation, based on the retention of the Status Quo.

Nothing has changed. There is Nothing New Under The Sun.

As for where the Market might be headed, the two working theories I have right now is a big Meth Party up to about 8500-9000, then 6400. This isn't going to last, as all the other artificial manipulation and support has failed in the past.

Now, the other one is a bit more interesting. I keep bringing up the 2002 lows because that's the last time we were here. Everyone who pays attention to the Market remembers the conditions in 2002. The Market was sliding into that abyss, and it appeared that reality was going to finally take hold of everything in our financial system, and that the Game was finally up.

But on October 9th, there was a massive, unexpected rally that set the World on it's ears. It lasted for two to three trading days, and we all remember what happened after that.

The Real Estate Bubble, and Dow 14000.

The Most Artificial Market Environment in History.

The question is simple.

Can they do it again?

That seems to be what is taking place right now. An attempt to duplicate 2002, and reflate the Bubble all over again. What the catalyst will be this time to fuel the Bullshit I do not quite have my finger on yet, but if they think they can pull it off, you better believe they will try it.

If they DO pull it off, my suggestion is ride the damn thing for all it's worth, get your houses in order, and prepare yourselves as best you can. Because when the next one collapses, that will probably be it.

I have no idea how they could pull this off a third time.

But then again, if they are successful, no one could have ever thought they could do it this time either.

We underestimate at our peril.

By the way, it looks like the Rumors were true. Citi's time WAS up.

[specimenfred1984]

59. I can't "ride it for what it's worth", it's worth nothing

I got out of stocks 1 year before the Naz bubble too, it's was a clear fraud. I think there are some real companies here that'll do well, but I can't speculate on their stock prices until some sort of actual and enforceable regulations are in place, otherwise the stock prices jump around 20% a day. Capitalism is only as good as it's regulations.

[TheWatcher]

61. A Fair Assessment fred.

And I understand where you are coming from with that. You are right.

As far as the regulation you and I would seek happening in our lifetimes, I don't think it will ever come to pass to be honest with you.

The criminals aren't going to regulate themselves, and we no longer have a representative government willing to do anything that resembles actual governing, or serving the interests of The People, to whom they are SERVANTS, not AUTHORITIES, as they like to refer to themselves now.

[snot]

73. here, here!

"Capitalism is only as good as its regulation."

[specimenfred1984]

58. Good for Wall St. = bad for Main St.

Yet another huge contradiction in fascist America: oil up 10% and corrupt C gets 100s of billions of our money = unaffordable energy and much higher taxes for everyone except corporations. There's a conflict of interest in the entire system when speculators/hedge-funders/bank's greed makes stock prices go up when the actions are clear negatives for the long run interests of all of America.

America's entire system of finance, government and capitalism itself is dying, murdering itself with it's own selfishness, shortsightedness and crime. Once and for all Americans, start using the word "CRIME".

[Roland99]

62. At the close - Another big gainer

DJIA 8,443.39 +396.97 +4.93%
Nasdaq 1,472.02 +87.67 +6.33%
S&P 500 851.81 +51.78 +6.47%
Global Dow 1,393.11 +97.27 +7.51%
Dow Util 370.30 +3.96 +1.08%
NYSE 5,313.53 +353.74 +7.13%
AMEX 1,301.04 +97.12 +8.07%
Russell 2000 436.80 +30.26 +7.44%
Semcond 191.20 +10.25 +5.69%
Gold future 819.50 +27.70 +3.50%
Oil $54.69 +4.57
30-Year Bond 3.76% +0.09 +2.51%
10-Year Bond 3.34% +0.17 +5.46%

[ozymandius]

70. True Believer blather to follow suit -

S&P 500 Surges 6.5%, Benefits From Citi Bailout
Dow +396.97 at 8443.39, Nasdaq +87.67 at 1472.02, S&P +51.78 at 851.81

(BRIEFING.COM) Stocks and commodities soared Monday on news of a government rescue plan for Citigroup (C 5.85, +2.08) that includes a direct $20 billion investment and $306 billion in asset guarantees. The S&P 500 rose 6.4%, with gains bolstered by short-covering and bargain hunting.

Shares of Citi plunged 60% last week, sparking the need for a bailout. The Treasury will buy $20 billion in Citigroup preferred stock using TARP funds, bringing the Treasury's total investment in Citi to $45 billion. In addition, the Treasury, Fed and FDIC will provide guarantees for up to $306 billion of troubled assets in exchange for $7 billion in preferred stock and warrants for 254 million shares of common stock at a strike price of $10.61. Citi will absorb the first $29 billion in losses on the troubled assets and then 10% on any remaining losses, while the government will cover the remaining 90% in losses.

Under the deal, Citi must get an executive compensation plan approved by the government and must not pay a quarterly dividend larger than $0.01 without government consent.

President-elect Obama unveiled his economic team, confirming that New York Fed President Tim Geithner is the Treasury Secretary nomination. Obama said that a "big" economic stimulus package is needed, but did not give any specific numbers. Obama did not say he would postpone raising taxes on the richest Americans as some had hoped for, but will listen to what his economic team says about letting the Bush tax cuts expire.

In economic news, existing home sales continue to show signs of stabilization at very depressed levels. October existing home sales fell 3.1% month-over-month on a seasonally adjusted annual basis to 4.98 million, which is close to the consensus estimate of 5.00 million. The median home price decline of 11.3% year-over-year to $183,300 is the largest on record.

All ten sectors posted a gain. The financial sector rose the most, spiking 18.5% -- the most in its 20 year history -- with Citi climbing 55%. Defensive sectors underperformed on a relative basis as utilities rose only 1.3% and Treasuries fell as investors showed an increased willingness to take on risk.

Meanwhile, commodities rallied 5.4% as oil prices spiked 9.1% to $54.48 per barrel and gold rose 4.0% to $823.70 per ounce. The strength in the stock market and a 2.4% decline in the dollar fueled the buying interest.

The S&P 500 is now up 14.9% from its more than 10-year low reached on Nov. 21, but is still down 42.0% year-to-date.
..Nasdaq 100 +6.3%. ..S&P Midcap 400 +7.5%. ..Russell 2000 +7.4%.

[Max_powers94]

63. Good day but Oil needs to stay under 60 dollars for a few years

[ozymandius]

72. Every company deemed "too big to fail" needs either voluntary or involuntary busting.

The Citi deal has rolled around and festered in my mind and gut all day. This tactic is the epitome of insanity. Define insanity by the most conventional means. That is what it is. So this is supposed to fix everything? Even after Abu Dhabi's billions to keep this hemorrhaging leviathan from capsizing?

I do not launch into this mini-screed for purely selfish reasons that focus on relieving myself of psychological and physiological tumult. My point is to examine, quite publicly, the wholesale larceny committed against future generations. No indication of moderation is apparent. The intent to commit theft in the future has already been announced.

Citibank consumed Travelers Insurance. Insurance companies invest heavily in real estate during the good times as a hedge against the bad times. The real estate model is broken by the very institutions that fueled its stratospheric arc. Now Citi is being eaten from two ends: bad debts issued from their shitty credit card bidness, debt issued to support unsustainable business models and collapsing real estate values from their insurance wing.

No small-cap company would be either so lucky or considered for such a rescue effort among the Bernanke/Paulson crowd. Not even a thousand small-cap companies would receive such help in one stroke of a pen. That's because they're not Citi. Or AIG. Or Bear Stearns.

Criminals all.

[Tansy_Gold]

74. ITA, Ozy. Totally

Like you, I've had this emotional nausea all day. I feel on the verge of tears or rage all the time.

If I didn't have to commit X number of hours a day to gainful employment, I would write more, but suffice it to say for the moment that I do not see ANYONE who has benefited from these bailouts being asked to give up anything. Those who have suffered are asked to pay more; those who have benefited the most handsomely continue to take home more.

Obama should be speaking out. Instead, he has in less than two weeks become just another enabler. He has assembled an economic team of recycled fat cat insider enablers.

Fuck him. Fuck his sophisticated wife, his two lovely daughters, his empty promises.

He's not one of us. If he ever was, he left us behind and wrote us off. He used us. He walked all over us.

Haven't I given him enough time? Bullshit. He named his economic team today. They're different faces (well, some of them) with the same policies as the old faces. No change at all. None.



Tansy Gold

[AnneD]

75. I have been dissapointed by his choice of Economic Leaders......

I can only hope he comes to his senses and make wise choices. There a hungry unemployed people. Hungry and unemployed people can become angry mobs.

[Tansy_Gold]

77. He's made his choices, and I suspect he actually made them

months ago.

It's not like he didn't have any expectations of winning the election. I mean, give me a fucking break. He ran for president and didn't have any idea who he'd name to his cabinet if he won, facing an immediate crisis?

Bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit.

Liar. Liar. Liar.

Don't ask, don't tell? LIAR

Roll back tax cuts for the uber wealthy? LIAR

New faces in the administration? LIAR.

Main Street over Wall Street? LIAR. LIAR. GODDESS-CURSED LIAR.


Many many many years ago there was a sportswriter for the Chicago Daily News named Bill Furlong. He dared, back in the very early 1960s, to criticize one of the Chicago teams in a manner that many fans found objectionable. I don't remember what the issue was, but I do remember Furlong's response. He had simply called it like he saw it and gave his honest opinion. "'Tis better to be honest and hated," he wrote, "than corrupt and despised."




Tansy Gold

[Ghost Dog]

78. He will have to choose to go with the military option

to deal with that situation.

Mark my words.

:(

[Dr.Phool]

76. Anybody who has any dealings with Citi, should cancel them immediately.

[Tansy_Gold]

79. Many can't

Pay off a credit card balance? A mortgage? With what?

It's easy to pull out savings or checking account balances, or sell stock (at a loss) but not so easy to pay off a debt.

[Dr.Phool]

81. Yeah, I know. I'm glad I resisted their 1,000 or so offers.

Never liked them. They've always been international corporate pirates. They were at the heart of a lot of IMF and World Bank third world looting.

[specimenfred1984]

83. Sad but true, O's appointing 1 criminal liar after the other and agreeing to throw

our money at their criminals organizations. The only "hope" is that the underlings who actually create policy will start enforcing U.S. and international laws.

[Tansy_Gold]

84. they will follow the leader

And he will follow the REAL money, not the money that put him in the white house but the money that will be his in 4 or 8 years when he walks away.

Asshole. Lying asshole.



Tansy Gold

[tclambert]

85. Does anyone even remember how to file an antitrust suit?

Does anyone know how to win one? The giant corporations have perfected their defense: ship you a warehouse full of documents pertaining to the case.

The story goes when IBM's antitrust suit was dismissed, they talked to a guy who ran an industrial-sized paper shredding facility, and asked him how long it would take to transport his plant to their documents. He said, "You mean how long to transport your documents to my plant?" They said no, and showed him their warehouse of antitrust-related papers they wanted to shred. The warehouse at the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark where they hid the Ark of the Covenant would have fit in one small corner.

[Dr.Phool]

80. ArcelorMittal may lay off 2,400 in Indiana

ArcelorMittal may lay off 2,400 in Indiana
Posted by Sarah Hollander/Plain Dealer Reporter November 24, 2008 12:17PM
Categories: Breaking News, Economy, Manufacturing, Real Time News

ArcelorMittal and United Steelworkers Local 979 said the partial-pay layoffs that began at its Cleveland operations earlier this month are still voluntary, although the world's largest steelmaker said today that it will lay off up to 2,444 workers at its Burns Harbor, Ind., plant in January.

"Potential workforce reductions are a direct result of the extraordinary economic environment we are facing and the company hopes to return workers to their jobs as market conditions warrant," ArcelorMittal said in a written statement.

ArcelorMittal has reduced North American production by 40 percent, including idling both of Cleveland's blast furnaces. The USW represents about 1,450 workers at the Cleveland mill.

http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2008/11/arcelormittal_may_lay_off_2400.html