Exclusive: General Backs Off on Court Martials for Pregnant Soldiers

[RamboLiberal]

Source: ABC News

An Army general in Iraq backed away from his threat today to court martial female soldiers who get pregnant.

"I see absolutely no circumstance where I would punish a female soldier by court martial for a violation ... none," Maj. Gen. Anthony Cucolo III wrote to ABC News in an exclusive statement. " I fully intend to handle these cases through lesser disciplinary action."

Cucolo triggered debate, some of it angry, when his Nov. 4 policy forbidding pregnancy among his soldiers became public recently. His policy statement said violation of the rule could be punishable by court martial, and that it would also apply to the men who get female soldiers pregnant, even if the couple is married.

While legal and military experts said the order was proper, a spokeswoman for the National Organization for Women called it "ridiculous."

"How dare any government say we're going to impose any kind of punishment on women for getting pregnant," NOW President Terry O'Neill said. "This is not the 1800s."



Read more: http://abcnews.go.com/WN/general-backs-off-threat-court-martial-pregnant-soldiers/story?id=9399604

[WriteDown]

1. Easier solution....

Prohibit women from serving in combat areas. Will guarantee no soldiers get pregnant there.

[TwilightGardener]

2. Well, that would piss off NOW even more.

[WriteDown]

3. Perhaps....

but it is the easier solution. I used to date a girl who got kicked out of the military because she got pregnant (not mine).

[Paladin]

43. Just What We Need Around Here.....

....somebody like you, channeling Pat Buchanan and Phyllis Schaffley. Your disdain for women in the military is palpable. Try knuckle-dragging yourself into the 21st century.......

[RamboLiberal]

4. What century are you in?

U.S. Armed forces couldn't deploy period without the women serving currently.

[WriteDown]

6. Link to that? nt

[RamboLiberal]

9. I'm at work - google it yourself

Women are 15 percent of active military, 18 percent of reserves/guard. Being female myself I've read many stories in the past few years of how units would be hard pressed to deploy without the women in the units holding critical jobs. Think for one of the combat medical units for one deploying in both theaters. Many women serve in MP, combat support, pilots & support personnel for helicopter units, pilots and support for Air Force & Navy, etc.

BTW General Cucolo thinks they are awfully damn important to his units.

[WriteDown]

13. I did...

Came up with a goose egg.

[RamboLiberal]

15. Try this

“We literally could not have fought this war without women,” said Dr. Nagl, who is now president of the Center for a New American Security, a military research institution in Washington.

Of the two million Americans who have fought in these wars since 2001, more than 220,000 of them, or 11 percent, have been women.

Although women make up only 6 percent of the top military ranks, these war years have ushered in a series of notable promotions. In 2008, 57 women were serving as generals and admirals in the active-duty military, more than double the number a decade earlier. Last year, Ann E. Dunwoody was the first woman to become a four-star Army general, the highest rank in today’s military and a significant milestone for women. And many more women now lead all-male combat troops into battle.

In 2004 and 2005, Michael A. Baumann, now a retired lieutenant colonel, commanded 30 enlisted women and 6 female officers as part of a unit patrolling in the Rashid district of Baghdad, an extremely dangerous area at the time.

“We had to take everybody,” said Mr. Baumann, 46, who wrote a book about his time in Iraq called “Adjust Fire: Transforming to Win in Iraq.” “Nobody could be spared to do something like support.”


http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/16/us/16women.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&sq=g.i. jane&st=cse&scp=1

In many instances, for instance combat medic, the commanders in the field are even ignoring the orders about women in combat and quietly leaving the women assigned to their units indeed serve in combat.

I remember back during the first Gulf War all the speculation by the news media and conservatives about how America would howl over women coming back in body bags. Didn't happen. Republicans and many conservatives would like you to believe women can't serve in combat. Many women are proving them wrong.

[WriteDown]

16. And not being able to fight the wars would be bad how?

Seems like you've found the solution or maybe that was me :).

[RamboLiberal]

17. You know what - it would be nice if neither sex had to go to war

But I'm proud as a woman at least another falsehood has been proven wrong that women serve as well and can be as brave as any man.

Now I'm done arguing your stupid point with you. Ask the women serving if they don't think they are capable serving alongside their brother soldiers.

I bet back in the early 70's you'd have been one of the idiots arguing that women don't belong in the service academies. Or being in law enforcement, etc.

[WriteDown]

18. They can serve as well and be just as brave...

Except for when they're pregnant. Agreed?

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dgibby]

22. Disgusting remark.

Way to dis the troops.

[AlphaCentauri]

27. Let's not generalize and admit that there are some women that try to avoid service that way

there are always bad apples everywhere, even Lynndie England was pregnant at some point.

[Missy Vixen]

29. Yeah, and we all know that there have been no rapes at all in the military

:sarcasm:

You might want to refresh your memory re: the high percentage of women serving the military being raped by their colleagues. It's been in the news in the past six months, so I'm not doing your Google search, either.

:eyes:

[AlphaCentauri]

30. The General wasn't talking about rape

but I guess anyone with allegations about rape can go public and accuse the rapist.

[Missy Vixen]

31. He was talking about pregnancy

Pregnancy is a possible outcome from rape, is it not?

:sarcasm:

>but I guess anyone with allegations about rape can go public and accuse the rapist.<

Oh, yeah. That's going to happen. Women in civilian life have a tough time prosecuting their rapist. I'm sure the military is bending over backwards to make that happen.

:sarcasm:

[AlphaCentauri]

33. it is horrible to accuse our military men of black listing raped women

that is totally scary and that only happens in totalitarian regimes.

[Missy Vixen]

34. Oh, really?

Please do yourself and the rest of us a favor and do a Google search.

A huge percentage of female soldiers are raped yearly on military bases and while deployed into war zones. The military was discussing court-martialing pregnant soldiers. I'm sure there's more than one of those soldiers that got that way due to a sexual assault.

[Dogtown]

36. MV, he's going out of his way to

disrupt, w/o getting a TS.

[Missy Vixen]

40. Dogtown, then I'll quit talking to him.

Thanks for the heads-up.

Happy Holidays to you and your loved ones. :hi:

[Dogtown]

47. And for you and yours!

:hi:

[AlphaCentauri]

42. Dogtown, what is your take on her allegations about rape? n/t

[Dogtown]

46. drop dead

[Dogtown]

35. Still unecessarily rude

and adds nothing to the discussion.

[jmowreader]

37. Why is it a disgusting remark?

Read this:

http://www.sptimes.com/2004/09/19/Southpinellas/Get_pregnant__or_get_.shtml

It's about a woman who was recalled to active duty and spent the time between notification and reporting getting pregnant. It happens.

[Dogtown]

28. List your service!

Mine: 1st Cavalry Division (Airmobile) 1968-1969


You owe a lot of DUers an apology for your inference that any combat soldier has shirked his/her duty by malingering, most especially if you have not faced the dangers of combat yourself.

[AlphaCentauri]

32. I apologize to those who miss interpreted my comment

and did not follow to post #27

[dgibby]

21. Wrong!

I know of many women in the military who never missed a day's work during their pregnancies up until delivery. I personally know an OR nurse who worked all day in labor, then went down to L&D and delivered about 2hrs after finishing her shift.

The problem isn't with military women being pregnant. The problem is with the draconian Hyde amendment. Women who would prefer an abortion can't get one through the military, so they have to be shipped back to the US in order to be treated in a civilian facility.

[WriteDown]

23. In a combat zone?

Seriously? You patrolled with women who were 9 months pregnant?

[dgibby]

25. No.

I did not specify combat zone, but then, neither did you. I was addressing the content of your post.

[WriteDown]

26. I did...

Post #1.

[dflprincess]

45. My cousin was career Air Force (now retired)

and served up until her due date through 3 pregnancies. Though, she was an Academy graduate and an officer so maybe she was given more leeway because of her position and the amount that had been invested in her education. She was also fortunate to have a husband who wasn't threatened by being the primary caregiver when she was stationed away from the family (which wasn't often things were relatively peaceful when she was active duty - no multiple deployments).

[marshall]

49. Why not go whole hog and just bar women from the military altogether?

Save them a spot as candy stripers at the local VA hospital.

We're supposed to be moving toward equality. Pregnancy is not a disease, it is a natural condition.

[pipoman]

5. The General actually responded right here on DU last night

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4194491&mesg_id=4194730

[TwilightGardener]

7. Wow. Did not expect that! He does have a tough job. I feel for

all of those guys and gals over there--yes, even the commanders.

[WriteDown]

14. I saw that....

That was awesome!

[Occulus]

38. If that was in fact him, I have to wonder who else reads this site.

I cannot imagine that anyone official would bother to officially respond to anything being discussed here at DU unless discussions on this site are actually having an impact of some sort all by themselves, however small.

I'll let this stand as an example for people who ask, "what good are you doing sitting here and discussing this instead of DOING something about it".

[pipoman]

39. That was my first thought too

(is this really him), however, the profile is pretty believable as is the response. I think it is actually a response from him. Maybe someone in his office told him he was getting beat up over here or maybe a Google would have brought up the post he responded to. Pretty impressive that he cares enough to respond, and yes, I wonder too who else watches this site.

(Obviously not the Pres. and Dem. reps or maybe health care bill would look different)

[superconnected]

8. Thank you, General Cucolo!

[RamboLiberal]

12. My respect for him went up tenfold

Now if we could Obama administration to pay attention to what we post or even read us!

[Joe Chi Minh]

10. Won't they be disappointed not to be court-martialled? I mean it's not as if it would be a

black mark against them in the eyes of any future sane/half sane employer, though pilots, I officers, I expect might the see military more as a career.

[TwilightGardener]

11. Stupid post.

[Joe Chi Minh]

19. I wondered what the response might be. I''m not sure I understand

how desperate women soldiers are to remain in the forces, particularly given the nature of these wars.

I know poverty is frequently a major factor in relation to military recruitment in both our countries (UK, as well), but I get the impression there's an expression of a uniquely American-type of feminism in your post. Women are men - just with different bits and bobs, and my post would seem kind of medieval.

[dgibby]

24. Your ignorance of the military and military women in general

is astounding.

[CatWoman]

41. it was a completely stupid stance in the first place.

[wordpix]

44. everyone's missing the point----the military doesn't have enough soldiers

so now they have to take these harsh measures to keep the women.

Better solution: start the draft. Then we'll see how much America wants this war.

[Odin2005]

48. Thank goodness.

Many of these pregnant women were rape victims.

[bamacrat]

50. The bigger problem is that soldiers are willing to get pregnant to leave.

Obviously the morale is such that some want to leave that bad. Also soldiers need a release, would the Army rather provide prostitution services or allow soldiers to catch all sorts of STDs from local prostitutes? Or will this make the repeal of Dont as Dont Tell quick seeing as two men cant get pregnant? hahahah. right. But seriously pregnancy is a big thing and for soldiers to do that in order to come home says something about our "mission."