NBC: All passengers must be seated one hour before flights arrive

[NewLIfeArea]

Source: NBC News and news services

NBC News reports the new steps include:

* Pat downs of passengers at airport security, concentrating on the upper torso and legs;
* Physical inspections of all carry-on bags at the gate;
* Requiring all passengers to be seated for the full hour prior to arrival;
* Banning the use of blankets and pillows one hour prior to arrival.

Read more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34595552/ns/us_news-security/

[high density]

1. The terrorists win again

Pat downs are ridiculous.

[crikkett]

49. Upper Torso = Boobs doesn't it? n/t

[Mojorabbit]

203. I have been felt up

multiple times by female tsa persons. I only fly if the need is dire anymore. To have to stand there while my breasts are felt up with my legs spread and a wand waved between them is absolutely horrendous to me.

[benny05]

70. Exactly

and this does *not* help the image of Obama's Administration being a Nazist or Socialist one.

Sigh.

[DWilliamsamh]

116. Really? What is YOUR plan for increased security? (N/T)

[krabigirl]

137. I'd like to take the risk.

[DWilliamsamh]

154. Well there are those that wouldn't.

Why do you get to decide the risk others must endure?

[krabigirl]

161. Ok, well maybe they could make another airline for people like me.

Sounds like you'd be comfy in nazi germany.

[DWilliamsamh]

164. Glad you are so realistic about the world..

And gee what did that take? Three responses before you trotted out the "Nazi" reference? That's gotta be a Godwin's Law record. Get a life.

[krabigirl]

239. Hmm, I still think you'd feel nice and safe in an extreme police state.

[THUNDER HANDS]

186. Attack Me Airlines?

has a nice ring to it, almost sounds like Acme.

[pnwmom]

207. Good idea. It would let the rest of us know which airlines would be safer.

Why would the terrorists go after our planes when they could go after the ones with no security?

[DWilliamsamh]

231. Made me smile....good one :-) (n/t)

[krabigirl]

242. go ahead and laugh..I really don't care.

People like you are completely brainwashed.

[DWilliamsamh]

255. If you really didn't care you wouldn't bother responding to a post that wasn't to you...

And yes I guess I am "brain washed" to want to discuss reasonable security measures to keep air travel as safe as possible, instead of just bitching about anything new as a step toward....(fill in your worst political insult here). What exactly is your problem?

[krabigirl]

234. No, they'd prefer to bomb the airlines full of sheeple. Besides, you won't

be able to leave your seats to tackle the crazed lunatic. lol.

I was kidding, but then again..

[Abq_Sarah]

189. That's a great idea

You can fly on the airline with no security and let's throw in no minimum safety standards. It's unlikely you'll be allowed to fly anywhere but over open ocean but hey... at least you won't have to worry about being inconvenienced.

[krabigirl]

235. With very good pre-boarding security, and a secure cockpit, I don't see the issue.

I'd prefer to take a risk than fly as a prisoner.

[NashVegas]

226. They Should Drive Instead

Why do you get to decide the restrictions others must endure?

[Scairp]

268. I would love to drive

Not sure how we would manage it to visit my husband's family in the English countryside, but perhaps we could sail over instead. Can people still do that? Also, they are planning to visit us next summer and I really find the idea that my sister in law and my 82 year old father in law and my young, teenage niece and nephews will be felt up at the airport just to come and see us. Or will we all have to go through this from now on instead of just the international travelers?

[damntexdem]

285. You'll understand the true risk when you sit down in a urine-soaked seat on your next flight.

Don't forget to fasten the seat belt!

[beardown]

174. Not that you asked me, but

Quit treating every non white industrial nation and peoples on Earth like our private quick store and weapons testing group. Quit invading other nations for happening to sit on our oil. Treat becoming energy independent as the same as a war like Ford and Carter declared.

Sure there will always be a few nutcases out there no matter what we do, but if we have allies instead of militarily controlled colonies out there they will do a substantial part of the intervention for us.

This will move the equation away from trading perceived security with a defacto police state for our constitutional rights which actually protect more people in more ways than strip searchs.

In the mean time, strip search and anal probe every single flyer, including the rich guys in the bypass lane, so we'll decide it's not worth it to spend a trillion a year on the military to protect our oil if we can't enjoy it on a flight without taking our clothes off and having a metal detector shoved up our asses.

[DWilliamsamh]

271. No joke....I like the way you think! (N/T

[KakistocracyHater]

196. bomb-sniffing dogs & other kinds of dogs

searching the luggage that goes into the hold of each plane using, again, dogs; it isn't flashy but it would work, so I guess that's why they don't do it. Yet.

[krabigirl]

240. I agree. Why arent there more true screening measures being used?

Rather than BS rules about not leaving your seat or reading a magazine. But no, that would make too much sense.

[DWilliamsamh]

274. Well they do use dogs for the lugage under the plane....

I'd like to see a a dog at every gate of every airport as well. I think that might take a very long time to train up enough dogs....I know with dogs, they must be given a break and can only work so many hours in a row so I'm not sure what the multiplier would be to get adequate coverage but dogs in the terminals would be a great step to take.

Another factor is I'm not sure how long it takes to train up a proper explosives sensitive dog or how specific they get, I/E. how many different explosives can one dog be trained to detect.

I like the idea over all though. Thanks for the response.

[atreides1]

219. One of the Brave

How does the last part of that song go? "...land of the free and the home of the brave."

[Puglover]

221. I'll tell you what.

My plan would not include not being able to take a piss one hour prior to arrival. I would think that if someone had a plan under this rule he might make his move 1 hour and 5 min. before arrival. :eyes: Jesus the stupid....

[DWilliamsamh]

275. I think the in seat rule....has to be looked at

there are definitely folks who can't hold on for an hour.....but I actually "get" the one hour thing for international flights - it's just to try and keep the plane from being brought down very close to destination - you know over a city and its suburbs. Is it perfect? No. I mean hell a terrorist taking down a plane over the ocean would send a statement too....

But I notice you didn't actually answer with anything constructive. My point is it is easy to complain and shoot holes in the idea. Security professionals have a very hard time with formulating measures precisely BECAUSE liberty and comfort have to be taken into consideration. The set of rules that would make airports and flights safe from every attack (except maybe a ground based missle) would never be able to be implemented precisely because comfort and liberty must be given high priority. This sensitivity is what causes the cracks that terrorists probe for and exploit.

[Puglover]

279. I wasn't aware that I had to

"offer something constructive" to comment on an idiot idea.

PS I worked for NWA for 31 years and having the psgrs sit for the final hour of ANY flight unless there is rough air is an foolish solution. If you gotta go you gotta go and people will just do it. The only thing this would do is make the psgrs and the cabin crews miserable.

[DWilliamsamh]

280. No you obviously don't HAVE to do a damn thing. (n/t)

[RainMickey]

259. Maybe we could start by......

not allowing anyone who is on a watch list from getting on a jetliner. Just sayin'...............

[DWilliamsamh]

276. AGREED!!!!! - Or at least single their a#$ out for additional and quite intensive screening. (N/T)

[mystieus]

129. I rather be pat down than blown up.

[DWilliamsamh]

156. Agreed. (N/T)

Every measure that is proposed, from chemical sniffers to hands off imaging units that can see under cloths have knee jerk reactors that decry the measures as the last step on the road to full police state with zero freedom left.

[high density]

180. Would you also feel safer flying naked?

I mean this guy had the 'bomb' material sewn into his undies. Aren't you terrified that the next dumbass from Yemen might be a bit more competent? The only way to really prevent this is to fully disrobe and fly naked.

[DWilliamsamh]

194. Ad absurdum?

No of course not...but increased measures are needed apparently....and the point I made here that every increased measure (from chemical sniffers, to dog patrols, to new imaging technologies is met with the same stupid objection: WE ARE BECOMING A POLICE STATE! WE ARE ON OUR LAST STEP BEFORE THE STORM TROOPERS CRASH THROUGH THE DOORS!!" Such bitching and moaning is ridiculous...try security in Israeli airports, or Italian airports. Would you be more comfortable with no frisking, but soldiers (make them national guard so as not to violate posse comitatus) walking the airports and check points with M-16's and side arms?

[OrwellwasRight]

223. Stupid Objection?

Yeah, just like those who said burning books was going a but too far? Should we also round up all the Muslims, because all of them are potential terrorists, and put them in special districts where we can watch them? Sounds like a great plan. It certainly worked well for Apartheid era South Africa and is working great in Israel today. Just where would you draw the line? Anywhere? He who would trade liberty for security deserves neither.

[DWilliamsamh]

228. I didn't say that and not one of the measure mentioned comes near ....

Turn down the hysteria. What relationship is there between body frisk before getting on a plane and internment camps for "all Muslims?" Slippery slope? Well that slope is about 1000 miles long and I was discussing steps at about the tenth mile mark. When you are ready for reasonable discussion get back to me.

[NashVegas]

227. Would You Please Pick a New Avatar?

You wouldn't take even 1/8 of the risks she did.

[DWilliamsamh]

230. LOL... That is too funny... you don't know me one bit...

I wager I have taken more risks on a personal level in my life than you could possibly imagine. Excuse me if I would like to engage in a discussion of REASONABLE security measures that are designed to reduce the risk of planes being blown out of the sky. There is difference between living a life willing to take risks (there is no perfect safety) and being fool hardy.

Yes, I could be hit by a bus tomorrow, but I will not be stepping into the street as I see one coming. You want to step into the street, and you hear the engine roar, have at it Hoss.

And yes I will be keeping my avatar. She was a hero of mine. (I hate the word "heroine" it is just too damn clunky)

[krabigirl]

236. Reasonable? lol! How much of your freedom will you trade for "safety"?

I bet you wouldn't object to being shackled to your seat, all in the name of "safety."

[DWilliamsamh]

256. Hyperbole isn't really a good method for discussion....

Why don't you tell me what your idea are to increase safety instead of just railing against what you inaccurately think I would be okay? Or just labeling things as infringement on freedom. I'l start I think there are practical problems with the last hour of flight rules. There are definitely folks who can't go a whole hour w/ out using the bathroom, so there needs to be some more fleshing out of the changes. I am actually will to discuss if you are.

[On the Road]

262. To Answer Your Question Seriously

The one step that could be taken that would dramatically reduce the chances of a 9-11 or other hijacking is to reinforce and secure the cockpit door.

In conjunction with existing security procedures, that makes it impossible for a hijacker to take control of the aircraft. (Or did they do that in the last five years and I missed it?)

I don't know if the new measures are needed or not. I just hope US airports don't end up like Israel.

[DWilliamsamh]

263. Cock pit doors were secured and reinforced in teh two years following 9/11...

And yes that is a BIG step in prevention of hijacking...

But the new measures - including most importantly pat downs - are designed to stop folks intent on setting off explosives or incendiaries in the cabin. To be honest the "must be seated for an hour prior to landing," measure is a bit of a mystery to me. How is being seated a preventative? Seems "no blankets" for the last hour gets more to the problem by not allowing anyone to "hide" what they are doing as the aircraft approaches it's destination. I guess being in your seat prevents you from doing anything nefarious in the bathroom close to landing.

But my original intent in the thread was as a counter to those decrying any additional security measures as indicative of a creeping "police state" devoid of freedom. I just don't see it that way, and am tired of every proposed measure being met with the same charges in addition to "invasion of privacy." These measures seem reasonable to me - but I can hold my water for more than an hour. The rules need clarification, and modification, for those who can't. Flying should not become an exercise in bladder control either.

[On the Road]

265. Not Arguing with Your Premise

The knee-jerk cries of a police state are indeed annoying. Personally, I wish they would relax some of them, but I don't sense it this time as a gimmick to scare the populace

[DWilliamsamh]

267. Agreed. (N/T)

[krabigirl]

237. seriously...

[DWilliamsamh]

264. Read my response to NashVegas. The same goes for you. (N/T)

[Kablooie]

245. That would not only be safer, it would be much more interesting.

[nonsequitur]

249. It would seem so. This is ridiculous.

[LeftHander]

283. Infants stowed in overheads diaperless....nt

[mainer]

2. Noooo..... for those of us with small bladders!!!

Besides, what's to stop bombers from just igniting one hour and ten minutes before landing?

[tblue]

12. The flight crew better have a mop on board!

Oh wait! A mop could be used as a weapon if it got in the wrong hands. Otoh, it could be used as a flotation device in case of a water landing. So, yeah, they should bring a mop!

My husband would absolutely explode if he couldn't get up to pee for a whole hour. No liquids starting 3 hours before landing, I guess.

[Po_d Mainiac]

25. No Brooms or mops allowed

Michele Bachmann uses them for alternates too commercial airlines...:evilgrin:

[Thickasabrick]

31. I wonder if we'll see an increase in Depends?? nt

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

67. Or catheters...

as long as the bag contains no more than three ounces of fluid.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

261. Someone could conceal something in Depends.

Better forget about diapers too.

[pasto76]

114. refusing someone bathroom priveleges will land them in trouble

Im not a lawyer or nuttin'...it's just like, what "we" do to punish prisoners of war. Allegedly.

SGT PASTO

[pnwmom]

149. Not if required by FAA. n/t

[shanti]

182. recent experience

flying from phoenix to sacramento last week. the red light was on (flight was bumpy) for a long time, and this guy kept arguing with the flight attendant that he HAD to use the restroom. she said no, but he did anyway...

[JCMach1]

200. Hey, they allow gallon size baggies... I know what I'm carrying!

[Ian David]

21. That would be stupid.

Considering how much they've paid for their seat, why would you blow yourself up early in the flight?

That would be such a waste.

Especially if you're waiting for that second bag of pretzels and tiny plastic cup of soda.

[frazzled]

37. If you need to pee more than once an hour, you have a medical problem

Enlarged prostate, diabetes, whatever. Go see your doctor. That's not a "small bladder."

[musicblind]

47. And some people do. n/t

[bemildred]

53. People with medical problems should not fly anymore.

It's too risky for them.
:sarcasm:

[skoalyman]

66. they should be catheterized at the gate

x( :sarcasm:

[frazzled]

56. My point was ... the problem should be fixed.

Which brings us back to health care, of course.

But honest, my husband started having to pee more and more over a number of years--something I didn't even notice until it became, frankly, embarrassing and intolerable. We'd leave the house to go to the grocery and he'd have to use the bathroom again. At restaurants, in airports and train stations, at Target. It was like having a 3-year-old around. Finally I told him he had to go to the doctor. He did, his prostate was enlarged (not a problem in itself), and he was given a generic med. Now he is a very big boy and only has to go the amount that a normal person does.

People shouldn't think they just have "small bladders." In my husband's case, it wasn't a very big deal, and medication was able to control it. For some people, it is a serious sign of the onset of diabetes.

I'm sure if there is some uncontrollable medical problem, you can get a doctor's note on a flight that will excuse you from the restriction. But don't forget to wash your hands after you tinkle!

(For a lot of people, the problem is simply too much beer. For you I have no sympathy. Just wet your pants, I don't care.)

[blueamy66]

153. really?

wow

[lostnfound]

76. Kids. You know, small humans. And senile folks. nt

[DBoon]

82. those who are pregnant as well

nt

[mainer]

77. But if everyone's lined up -- it could be far longer than an hour

You could stand in line a long time -- and suddenly the one hour's up. And you'll go for as long as two hours, esp. in a crowded coach section.

[shanti]

187. they don't let you stand in line anymore

at least on southwest they don't. there's a sign at the top of the cabin by the restrooms that says whether or not it is occupied.

[PDittie]

88. Why don't we just ban diabetics from flying, then?

[Patchuli]

117. I don't know if you are male or female

but some stages of life cause more frequent peeing. You have an empathy problem...perhaps you should take some sensitivity training.

[katkat]

120. gender

On average men need to pee every four hours, women every two.

[pnwmom]

131. Since when do we ban elderly people or people with medical problems from flying? n/t

[krabigirl]

135. many people do.

[SoCalNative]

158. Well some of us DO have diabetes

and have to pee a lot.

What are we supposed to do, wet ourselves in our seats?

[krabigirl]

166. yep...that's what they would say.

[Occulus]

204. Well, if the seat's good enough, so's the aisle. n/t

[dflprincess]

172. It could also be pregnancy

or a bladder infection or overactive bladder that makes you feel like you have use the bathroom. It could just be nerves if you don't like flying.

I've also had times when I've been bloated and having to run to the bathroom a lot when I started shedding extra water weight - many women have that experience.

However, I did hear on the news that exceptions will be made for bathroom trips.

[iamjoy]

181. Not Necessarily

I mean, perhaps one could argue that needing to pee more than once an hour is indicative of a medical problem, but what about children? Or, what about people who yes, have medical problems. Maybe they should address it, but is the reason they should take care of it so they can fly without an embarrassing incident?

Consider also, that a plane may have over 100 people on it, all trying to use 2 bathrooms. What happens if you get in line 65 minutes before the landing time and are still waiting 5 minutes later?

[krabigirl]

241. Yep.

But nope, questioning this shows that we don't care about "safety." lol. this country is a joke.

[No Elephants]

215. Not necessarily, but peeing more than once an hour is not the issue. What if you don't

get the urge (or the ability) to pee until the last hour of the flight? And isn't that often when food service is ending?

Can you imagine the lines for the johns that will start 1 hour and 15 minutes before the flight lands (or even sooner?

Most of all, what is the rationale for this rule? That one idiot in all of history did not get up his courage to make his attempt until he was almost at his destination? That the next idiot can't detonate 1 hour and ten minutes before the plane is due to land?

Honestly, the administration makes a knee jerk, dumbass rule and suddenly peeing during a specific hour is abnormal.

[saigon68]

218. Another reason why the Present Occupant won't be re-elected.

What an assinine rule.

[enlightenment]

232. The rationale is US airspace ,I'd think.

International flights are most likely within US airspace (and thus in US government jurisdiction) at the 1 hour mark.

[krabigirl]

133. i will NOT be flying anymore..

[vaberella]

201. Doctors notes do wonders when notarized. Prior notification to airline works as well. n/t

[No Elephants]

217. What does a notary have to do with it? Who brings a notary to their doctor's office?

[vaberella]

260. Banks do notarization with one person.

Just in case the airline might think it's fake. You have it notarized. However a call from your doctor and/or notification early on works.

[hobbit709]

3. Another chance for TSA to feel people up

Do you think that rule of not standing up will stop anyone with nefarious purposes in mind?

[truthisfreedom]

4. So the terrorists win.

This is beyond the pale. Airline travel now officially SUCKS. You can't even use the restroom during the last hour before arrival??? You have to give up blankets and pillows?

PAT-DOWNS IN SECURITY? We'll NEVER get through security now. AUGH!

[Gormy Cuss]

61. They're counting on pat-downs failing.

The real goal is to get passengers to accept the expensive and intrusive full body scan machines, the ones that produce an image of what's under your clothing, as a reasonable security check for each and every passenger.

I flew out of an terminal with one of these machines in place and if you objected to the scan you were pulled aside for a pat down and it was an upper body check much more than all over.

[alarimer]

253. If they do that I am getting a tattoo of a raised middle finger on my back

With the saying "FUCK TSA NAZIS" hopefully in some kind of ink that is visible on those xrays.

[Way2go]

5. Better yet, how about a background check

to determine if a passenger has the hard-to-detect "Patsy Syndrome".

[NewLIfeArea]

6. Shoe bomber

When Shoe bomber failed..
Must the shoe off before we enter gates..
Now we do over again..
Crazy...

[Bonhomme Richard]

9. More reasons not to fly. We have seriously become a nation of.....

Wussies. It amazes me that people actually leave their homes.

[Posteritatis]

13. I got chewed out at an airport for wearing boots

"Why are you wearing those?!", had to run them through detectors, got frisked a few more times myself, etc.

It was December and there was a snowstorm at both ends of my flight route.

Ugh.

[customerserviceguy]

44. The jihadis will try everything

until we are all locked in suspended animation chambers for the duration of the flight.

That's what happens when you treat everybody as a terrorist, instead of just selectively figuring out which asshat might be a real terrorist!

[DWilliamsamh]

118. And how would you propose to do that? (N/T)

[customerserviceguy]

183. Well, Nigerian origin

would seem to be a dead giveaway for most folks. Any predominantly Muslim country would be a red flag in my book.

What would really be good is to have a "trusted traveler" program, where you put out about a hundred bucks, you get a thorough background investigation, and after you get an ID card with biometric information stored on it (with a retina scan to verify identity) you get to bring whatever you want to on a flight, at least what you were permitted pre 9/11. Everybody else gets the enhanced security screening, because you're not wasting time on people with clean backgrounds.

There are numerous commonsense ways to figure out who to select for heightened security screening, but it might be "racist" or "religionist". Tough shit.

[whopis01]

238. You mean something like Clear?

Too bad not many people thought it was worth the money.

[slackmaster]

208. The Shoe Bomber is one of the most hated people on Earth

At least among air travelers. Now we have one more person to despise.

[Liberal_in_LA]

7. OMG...time to take Amtrak or Greyhound

[customerserviceguy]

43. It's a little tough to go to Europe that way

but maybe oceanliner traffic will increase now.

[krabigirl]

140. Yes, I am seriously thinking about an oceanliner. want to learn more..sounds glamourous too.

[AzDar]

251. Soon we'll hear of exploding luxury liners...Actually, I'm surprised that hasn't happened yet.

[slackmaster]

209. Screw Europe

Canada and Mexico have plenty of things to see and do.

So do the 49 US states that a person can drive to.

[Ian David]

8. Waiting for The TittyBomber to make us require all women to travel topless. n/t

[boppers]

45. Already happened.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bra_bomb

[Ian David]

78. Oh, wow. Boobies are dangerous. n/t

[DBoon]

84. I fear the suicide bomber with an exploding jockstrap (nt)

[dhpgetsit]

10. How long before

all passengers have to be catheterized and dressed in straight jackes for the duration of the flight?

[dkf]

11. How's about they coordinate their info?

That would be nice

[timeforpeace]

14. Dang. But I blame the terrorists, not the people trying to keep us safe.

[Posteritatis]

20. I'll blame them, too, if they're engaged in idiotic measures in response

React, react, react, that's all they can do. The next set of restrictions will themselves also be slavishly tied to the next media-friendly joke of an "attack," and will also contribute nothing to safety.

[BbeltAtheist]

113. Exactly

It seems that this is purely reactionary to the specific event... does not give me much confidence in our security considering that the next attack will likely use a different technique.

[pnwmom]

138. And if they didn't react they'd be blamed for that.

They're doing more than reacting. There are machines that would do a thorough screening, but we don't have enough of them -- yet.

[Posteritatis]

152. Banning objects in laps? Fluids below a certain absurd limit?

Snapping parts off nail trimmers?

No, sorry, the vast majority of what they're doing these days is just reactionary security theatre, done only so they can be seen doing something to react to the latest outrage in very, very specific detail, entirely independently of whether it makes anyone the least bit safer.

[customerserviceguy]

46. The people trying to keep us safe

do so by treating all of us as terrorists, instead of those who common sense would tell you would be most likely to be jihadis.

[LibDemAlways]

195. A few years ago at the airport in Seattle I watched while a very

elderly woman in a wheelchair had her shoes yanked off and was hoisted up to be wanded. The victim looked terrified. Her daughter stood nearby explaining that her mother had Alzheimers and started begging the TSA goons to leave her alone. They just ignored her pleas. It was a pathetic sight to watch.

A few days later I explained what I had witnessed to a group of neighborhood women. One of them actually came back with, "That old lady could have been a terrorist. The TSA people are to be commended." I just shook my head. Harassing helpless old people in wheelchairs makes no one safer. Maybe TSA should start coming up with some smart security measures that might actually do some good. However putting TSA and "smart" in the same sentence is a sad joke.

[ChazII]

59. Agree with you 100%.

[Iowa]

74. Bullshit. I would rather compromise my safety a tiny bit than live in a police state...

The odds of being harmed by a terrorist are minuscule. One is FAR more likely to be harmed by a police state than by a terrorist. Countless people have died for freedom, and many in this country just give it away. Pathetic.

[leftstreet]

102. +1

:applause:

[spooked911]

125. exactamundo

jeesh, this is insane

[krabigirl]

142. same here!!!

[THUNDER HANDS]

188. i didn't realize walking about an airplane was a cherished freedom?

[Iowa]

254. Most people understand that liberty is about far more than walking about an airplane...

Freedom is given up in tiny increments... Actually, you know what? It's your responsibility to educate yourself and keep up with current events and history, so I'm not going to explain it to you. I've noticed lately that many posters here waste a lot of time explaining the basics to a growing number of concrete thinkers and "literal" readers who lurk in the shadows and pop up to defend the status quo, always aligning themselves with power. This place could really use a slow lane for those who really don't quite "get" progressive ideology, and have difficulty reading between the lines because of it.

[Abq_Sarah]

193. So you'd also be in favor

Of people carrying firearms on airplanes, in federal buildings, schools, etc...?

Or is it only airport security that bugs you?

[Iowa]

211. Try to keep up, OK?

Most people can distinguish between the types of common-sense restraint you mention and police-state nonsense.

[ronnie624]

198. .

:thumbsup:

[OrwellwasRight]

224. Word. nt.

[defendandprotect]

81. None of this crap is going to keep you safe -- !!! And, unfortunately, the

"terrorists" are Cheney and Bush --

[bowens43]

93. these nonsensical new measures

will not make anyone safer.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

123. Your statement is proof that fear makes people lose their sense of judgment

What's to prevent a terrorist from pulling an explosive device (or detonator) out of his pocket while sitting down?

This is just security theater, like the ban on liquids, which resulted from a bunch of guys who didn't even have passports (and no airline will let you onto an international flight without a passport) talking big about blowing up airliners over the Atlantic.

These increased restrictions are part of getting us all to accept greater and greater control "for our own safety."

And the ninny scaredy-cats will just accept it and tell us that we have to "for our own safety."

[pnwmom]

150. They're going to be searching pockets. How will he have a detonator in his pocket?

[Posteritatis]

157. You really think they'll be able to check every pocket everyone has?

I've got five on me right now, and that goes up to nine (two internal) if I'm wearing my coat. Let's multiply me by a hundred and fifty people, whose carryon is also being rummaged through in more de

Nothing - nothing - short of a strip and cavity search is going to perfectly guarantee someone doesn't have anything on them, and the current let's-give-the-media-a-big-list-of-new-rules silliness is deep into diminishing-returns territory.

[pnwmom]

185. They say they have been. And they say to get to the airport 3 hrs. early. n/t

[JoeyT]

212. What's to prevent one from swallowing explosives?

None of this stuff actually makes you safer. It just gives you the illusion of security.

To quote Franklin: "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

[TheWatcher]

214. I blame people like you who would CHOOSE to live in a Police State

So you can be "safe" from fake boogeymen.

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -Benjamin Franklin (A Better man than you OR me.)

Why don't we just hide under our beds for the rest of our lives and let TSA workers poke and prod us so we are "safe" while we're sucking on our thumbs.

Christ, this country is so irretrievably gone.

[Iowa]

257. Well said TheWatcher...

It's surprising how many people popped up on this thread to sanction this gradual slide into totalitarianism. It seems like such a no-brainer, yet so many, even on a progressive site like this, seem to have no problem with it.

[dipsydoodle]

15. Air Canada announced ..............

that passengers on flights to the US would not be able to leave their seats in the final hour of flight, nor have access to cabin luggage.

I assume "nor have access to cabin luggage." refers to last hour but maybe the whole flight ? :shrug:

[Posteritatis]

18. It being Air Canada, the latter would create a lousier flying experience

So it makes sense that they'd lean in that direction.

[polly7]

28. Does that apply to all U.S. citizens coming to Canada, too?

Just wondering if it works both ways.

[Posteritatis]

33. I assume so if they're boarding in the US

When the US enacts a piece of security theatre Canada seems to follow immediately anyway, so I'm assuming it's also going to be the case for domestic flights up here.

[dipsydoodle]

99. Dunno. I forgot to post the link too.

See bottom of page : http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8430699.stm

[polly7]

105. Hey:)

I saw this at the bottom:

"Air Canada announced that passengers on flights to the US would not be able to leave their seats in the final hour of flight, nor have access to cabin luggage at that time."

I'm wondering about flights entering Canada, and if the same rules apply. It doesn't say anything about that, unless I missed it (again). Will have to do some research.

[dipsydoodle]

130. I think they subsequently added

"at that time" to correct the sense of that para.

[ixion]

16. and the descent into the police state continues

apparently no matter who is in the WH.

[Iowa]

75. Exactly right.

[havocmom]

17. Cool beans. Airlines will lose sales on their overpriced beverages

[dave123williams]

19. Amazing how their new rules happen only *after* an incident.

Welcome to your liberty being sucked out in the name of fighting 12 idiots from Yemen, and only AFTER one of them pulls a stunt.

I feel safer already.

[Posteritatis]

22. I love how the new rules are always meant to prevent one very, very specific scenario

God help us if someone ever claims to have an explosive contact lens or insulin syringe or toddler or something.

[izquierdista]

23. Fly Nudistair

Nothing to pat down, nothing to carry on.

[Hekate]

24. I have a deposit for a trip to Ireland next year. Greyhound/Amtrak is not an option. nt

[Newsjock]

26. The government has a vested interest in keeping you scared

No matter which party happens to be in power. TERRRRRRRRA!

[AngryAmish]

27. This is unworkable

Fantastic.

[Thickasabrick]

29. So...I'm assuming no Ipods or books either 1 hour before - great. Glad I'm not

flying for awhile.

[customerserviceguy]

48. I was wondering about that

There are so many times you cannot use an electronic device on an aircraft, but you can always read a book. If they try to take them away, then it's not worth flying any more.

[Odin2005]

30. The terrists win again!

:banghead:

[Submariner]

32. You can thank George W. Bush for all these airline hassles

If the incompetent pea-brain read his Aug 6, 2001 PDB, he might have had the thought to tighten up airport security and prevent the 911 fiasco.

Flying is one huge pain in the butt, and it's all due to a very partisan Supreme Court appointment of an AWOL DORK to the presidency.

[architect359]

34. For what its worth...

From the same article mid way down:

"New measures for at least 3 days
The extra measures were requested by the U.S. Transportation Security Administration and will initially remain in place for 72 hours, ENAC said in a statement."

So we'll see if it really is "initially" or longer.

[frazzled]

35. Anyone notice inspection of carryon bags had been very lax lately?

At least three out of the last four times we've flown, we've carefully packed those quart-sized ziploc bags with our under-3-oz liquids (makeup, shaving cream, etc.) ... and then promptly forgot to take them out at the security check. No one said boo to us any of these times, and I started to wonder if they even cared.

But the real problem if they start heavy-duty inspections domestically is that more and more people (myself included) are carrying their bags on board, because of the ridiculous fees charged for checking your baggage. It's going to be holy hell at the security lines if they have to start unpacking and more carefully checking all these bags.

God, I hate flying. (Despite having seen Up in the Air the other day.)

As for the being seated 1 hour before arrival. I don't think that is such a big deal. An announcement can be made 1 1/2 hours before the flight is to land, warning people they'd better go to the bathroom within the next 30 min. You can't hold your pee for 1 hour? Most 3-year-olds can. If you can't, you probably have a problem (enlarged prostate, etc.) that should be checked out by your doctor ... if you have health insurance, that is.

[customerserviceguy]

51. You really think that a planeload of people can all get their "business"

done within a half an hour?

I avoid fluids for several hours before and all during a coast-to-coast flight. Even though I'm allowed to be able to use the restroom, it's such a freaking hassle that it's just not worth it.

You are right about the inspections, the four flights I have taken this last year had far less intrusion when it came time to inspect my bags with the X-ray machine. A few years ago, I caught hell for trying to take some Snoqualmie Falls Lodge pancake mix in my backpack!

[frazzled]

58. Well, I don't think everyone has to go.

I take four and five hour flights and never go ... I can't stand those airline bathrooms.

To me, the biggest hardship is not being able to use a blanket the last hour. Jeebus, the cabins in those international fights are cold. I'd have to wear longjohns in the summer.

[beac]

65. I always travel with a big pashmina-type scarf to use as an blanket.

I am always freezing cold on airplanes.

My husband has to fly for business in about two weeks. He's already a grumpy traveler and these new measures might just push him over the edge.

[katkat]

122. I'm with you on needing a blanket. n/t

[LisaL]

178. Well, gee, since you are blessed with a good bladder, apparently

you think everyone else is also?
And never mind it makes no sense, because if someone wants to blow up a plane, there is no reason whatsoever for that someone to wait until the last hour just because this one allegedly did.

[SteveG]

62. Many High Blood pressure meds also

cause frequent urination. So now people who need to fly must go off their HBP meds at least a week or so before they fly, bad option.

[Gormy Cuss]

63. No, they're just expected to hold it for that hour

plus the time it takes on the ground between taxing to the gate, being able to get off the plane, up the gateway and through the gates to the nearest bathrooms where the lines are likely to be quite long since many other passengers from that flight and others are queuing up for some relief.

Another brilliant move by our crack TSA.

[DonkeyHoTay]

233. Just pee on the seats... that is, if you want this idiot rule revoked

Passive agressive protests worked for Ghandi!  Why not for
helpless airline passengers?  <<<cynical sarcasm
alert>>>

[HillWilliam]

73. Same deal just lately

We were organized to the teeth, determined to keep everything as smooth as possible. Nobody asked for anything. Whatever, we were set to cooperate fully and still maintain maximum dignity; meds baggied, doctors' notes in 'em, toiletries baggied... Well, it made stuff very easy to find when we got to the lodge and very easy to unpack when we got back home. No unwasted effort as it turned out.

[defendandprotect]

87. They don't care because they know who the terrorists are . . .

Bush and Cheney --

Without a full body cavity search and freezing the passenger in place

for the duration of the flight, it's all a joke.

But, eventually they'll probably get there!!!

Remember how they were transporting the 9/11 prisoneers on military flights!!!

[skepticscott]

155. Well, that's an hour

before the scheduled landing time. It's not that unusual to get to the airport and then have to circle for a while due to landing traffic. It can easily be half an hour to an hour longer, and that's only if it's a perfectly smooth flight and they even let you out of your seat prior to an hour before landing.

[LisaL]

177. Why the last hour only? It makes no sense at all.

Just because this guy allegedly tried to blow up the plane it the last hour, doesn't mean no one else could try to blow up a plane at some other time during the flight.

[Tx4obama]

36. SuperMax Prison or Gitmo?

So since he was arrested in Michigan I am assuming that after he can be released from the hospital he will be held in a SuperMax Prison until his trial, but I betcha the republicans will be hollering for him to be moved to Gitmo!

[NewLIfeArea]

38. SuperMax

as I say..

[notadmblnd]

41. Nah, he'll be held at one of the unlisted ICE castles

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7327679

http://restorefairness.org/wp-content/uploads/ICEFieldSubfield0909.PDF

[SoCalNative]

168. A better solution

is to put him back on a plane and shove him out the door sans parachute at about 30,000 feet....then show that video along with the safety presentation at the beginning of every fight.

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[katkat]

124. Nigeria

karma for all those spams.

[dixiegrrrrl]

40. Any way to tell if airline revenue is down because of all this TSA crap?

[PJPhreak]

42. For all the trouble and expense it takes to fly in the air...

It would a Chitload more fun to "Fly Low". and not too much more expensive either!

I would Fly Low in This....



2010 Hurst Challenger.

[bemildred]

50. Or, you could just refuse to fly.

Why pay that much money to be treated that badly?

[47of74]

54. Well, that's kind of hard when you're going overseas

God knows if there was an Amtrak like alternative I'd take that.

[bemildred]

55. I assume you have heard of ships?

But seriously, if you gotta go, you gotta go, but if not, then you are a tourist and you don't have to go anywhere and you can travel by any means you find suitable.

[Jkid]

96. Is there actual commercial passenger interatlantic ships exist?

[HipChick]

121. yes..there were pretty frequent in the 60's..my parents travelled on one..took 2 weeks

[krabigirl]

143. I'm seriously looking into taking an oceanliner.

[bemildred]

179. Yeah, I mean, what is the hurry anyway?

Slow travel has a lot to be said for it.

[MissDeeds]

52. Wasn't this guy seated

when he tried to ignite whatever it was in his clothing?

:eyes:

[kirby]

57. According to reports..

He had gotten up and went to the bathroom where he remained for about 20 minutes. He did this within the last hour of the flight.

[MissDeeds]

60. Thanks for the clarification n/t

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

69. So with the new rule change ...

... the next guy to try this will go to the bathroom 90 min before landing.

I don't see much difference between blowing up a plane at the end of a flight, and the beginning or middle. Airlines will simply have to remove all bathrooms and blankets.

:hi:

[Tx4obama]

64. Update...

Investigators say the suspect had more than 80 grams of PETN, a compound related to nitro-glycerin used by the military. The so-called shoe bomber, Richard Reid, had only about 50 grams kin his failed attempt in 2001 to blow up a U.S.-bound jet. Yesterday’s bomb failed because the detonator may have been too small or was not in “proper contact” with the explosive material, investigators told ABC News.

[LisaL]

68. The bomb was allegedly in his underwear. Bad news for all

of us who have to fly. After the shoe bomber, we have to take shoes off. What are they going to do now?

[Ian David]

79. Phase One: Outlaw Underpants. Phase Two: ? Phase Three: Safety! n/t

[Bette Noir]

136. The Underpants Gnomes are in charge if TSA?

[tinrobot]

85. Shoe bomber... now the underwear bomber.

Gives new meaning to the term "going commando"

[Lasher]

134. Hmm, I was hoping he'd burned his balls off.

Seems there's a good chance of that.

[bikebloke]

175. Now we'll have to remove our shoes...

AND our underwear before boarding a flight. Or maybe we can wear our underwear on the outside.

[shanti]

191. xray

we've already been warned of this...

[slackmaster]

210. PETN can be detected by chemical sniffers

It's not rocket science to catch the stuff.

[PM Martin]

71. As I said before and will say once again:

I have too much respect and desire for FREEDOM to ever be involved in law "enforcement".

[joeybee12]

72. Did the guy use a disposable lighter to light whatever it was?

Lighters and matches aren't banned...just ban them, end of problem.

[yodoobo]

86. You can't ban matches

effectively

They are made of paper. Invisible to metal detectors and xrays

Even the dumbest amongst us can find a way to smuggle a book of paper.

Just slip them in your pocket.
Or in your sock.
Or in your wallet.

[RamboLiberal]

89. He used a syringe to pour a liquid into what he had taped

to his underwear or body. No lighter apparently.

[santamargarita]

80. It won't be long before they put us in freight containers and...

load us like cargo.

[Bette Noir]

83. How surprised are the airlines going to be when more and more people

Fly less and less?

I've already stopped flying for most purposes. If the distance is less than 1500 miles, I'll drive, thanks.

[shanti]

192. its's kind of looking like

that's the point of this - to make sure less of us are willing to fly.

[rantormusing]

90. Sadly it's a jobs program

In a twisted way, if they are going to need people to screen at boarding. I never liked flying, even before TSA, cramped, and the air smells like close proximity, or stale whichever you prefer. My personal preference, is Amtrak, but i hear there are no more routes that allow you to smoke. I guess it magically seeped out of the smoker's car, into the air, and then back into the other train cars, GO SMOKE. ANyways, getting up and being able to walk around is a huge bonus for me, as well as going to another car to get grub and suds.

[d_r]

91. You are all going to think I'm nuts

But I've never really understood why you can get up and walk around in a plane any time you want.

We used to fly to disney world a lot when we lived in Michigan. It always occurred to me that the fastest and highest ride of the whole trip was the flight down there. But when you get in a roller coaster, you strap on the seat belt and it stays strapped on until the ride is over.

Yeah, I know a rollercoaster ride only lasts a minute. But every seat has a call light. I always thought that if you wanted to get up you should hit the call light and request it and they'd push a button and let you up.

You aren't supposed to get out of your seat belt in a car and walk around. You can walk around in an RV, but not a trailer pulled by a truck. In a plane you are going really fast, and you are up in the sky. Just up there, in the sky. Flying. A seat belt seems like a good idea to me.

I'm pretty sure I'm just nuts, but it has always seemed weird to me.

[frazzled]

92. Well, if you are on a 10-hour international flight

Sometimes you just need to get up to stretch your legs and get the blood flowing.

I've never seen that many people walking around planes; usually just to get up to go to the bathroom and return. Sometimes a parent with a cranky baby or toddler (and then I'm glad they're walking them around.)

[tinrobot]

98. You can get deep vein thrombosis if you don't move around.

If you're at risk, you need to get up and move around every 2 hours.

http://hubpages.com/hub/DVT-Can-Complicate-Long-Flights

[katkat]

128. why you need to walk around

Staying seated for more than two hours substantially increases the risk of DVT, deep vein thrombosis, blood clots in your legs.

[pnwmom]

146. On a long car ride, for the sake of your circulation, you ARE supposed to stop every 2 hours

and walk around for a while.

On a plane you're supposed to as well.

Otherwise, you'll end up like me -- with permanent damage from deep vein thrombosis after a cross-country flight. (And it was only 6 hours.)

15-20% of the population has an EXTRA risk factor for blood clotting -- and most of them don't know it. (I don't have it but I got a clot anyway.)

[madrchsod]

94. "...they all come to look for america,to look for america.."

[midnight armadillo]

173. I'm empty and aching and I don't know why

.

[Christa]

95. Ohhh

someone is going to feel me up.

Let me book a plane ticket to somewhere.

Anywhere.



:woohoo:

[Lorien]

97. The stupidity and over reaction never, ever ends

who is making these dim witted decisions?

[barbtries]

100. this is ridiculous.

motherfuckers.

[Lorien]

101. How about we just get the f*ck out of the Middle East and concentrate on

developing green renewable energies? Oh wait, what's the profit in THAT??

[liberation]

104. Technically the profit would be huge and we would rebuild our productive infrastructure

The funny part is that hundreds of millions of Americans are just too idiotic to figure out their interests have been subsumed in order to preserve the entitlement to profit by just a few people in our country, which contribute absolutely nothing in terms of actual value to our society.


We don't have universal healthcare because a few tens of CEOs and a few thousands of people working for the insurance "industry" would have to look for new jobs. We don't have green energy because big oil and the industrial military complex would also have to figure out how to turn a profit without having to suck the proverbial government tit.


Enough is enough... We're shitting were we drink from, destroying our future, and now... continue to give up our freedoms and quality of life to.... "preserve our freedoms" (which now I am starting to believe that "defending freedom" in this country really means "defending entitlement to profit by a few")

[wildcatter]

109. Too much sense...

[Sarah Ibarruri]

103. Flying has become a nightmare thanks to Islamic bombers.

Who else can be blamed?

[HipChick]

119. to be fair..The IRA were bombing UK airports before Islamic stole their ideas...

[Sarah Ibarruri]

126. Okay, but I'm talking about these days I'm living in

I have to fly up for a wedding and I'm really really honestly thinking of finding a way to ride the train.

[pundaint]

127. TSA and Government types who think that aggression = security

American voters who reelect people with that mindset.
People who pay elected officials to screw their population for profit

[katkat]

139. first bombing on U.S. soil

Those great guys in Meyer Kahane's group, the Jewish Defense League. They mostly got Egyptians and Palestinian-Americans, though, people who don't count. :sarcasm:

[Puglover]

222. I wonder if the person

you use as an avatar would offer such a simplistic assessment of the situation. Somehow I doubt it.

[katkat]

273. sure pug

Howard is in favor of blowing away Arab-Americans on U.S. soil. Not.

I'm sure he's just thrilled that a Boston cop on the bomb squad was blinded trying to deactivate one of the JDL bombs, too.

[Puglover]

278. I think you may have read this wrong.

I was responding to someone else.

[depakid]

106. Wouldn't want to be a diabetic on a flight to the states after this, either

Americans are such a profoundly fearful people that no set of requirements will too absurd.

[Posteritatis]

108. It's bad enough now

One of my friends was ordered by customs to prove her insulin was actually insulin by injecting it on the spot. Saner heads overruled the dumbass who pulled that stunt, but still.

[McCamy Taylor]

107. And this would stop someone with explosives hidden in his wig who wants to detonate

them in midair....how?

[ooglymoogly]

110. This all sounds soooooo.......Oh so Republican. kr nt

[krabigirl]

141. yep

[zenprole]

111. Fly Naked - it's the only way to be sure

No luggage, no money, not even eyeglasses.

Of course, Fatherland Security would then have to inspect or remove the fillings from your teeth. They need to be absolutely sure.

[Posteritatis]

160. I can see us all being sedated and shipped in small containers

... On the other hand, that would probably make the whole experience cheaper and much more pleasant...

[marasinghe]

269. think that'll do it? don't underestimate the stupidity of fascists - leaders and followers.

just wait for the homeland security brains trust to have their next 'eureka' moment & start imagining explosive gases up assholes, or bladders full of urea compounds. we'll be lucky if we're allowed to get on a flight without a rectal exam, a bladder palpitation & a frickin chastity belt to stop the shit from literally hitting the fan during the last hour of flight when you can't use the toilet.

we need a new airline; no, a new country, for normal people - where these stupid-ass nazis & their cowardly supporters - like the bunch you find on this same thread - can stay the fuck out of and let us go on with our lives, like humans have for thousands of years, before this bunch of stupid mass-murdering fascist fucks became either our government, or numerous enough to elect it.

[Unvanguard]

112. Ah, trains and busses. Love them. n/t

[Guilded Lilly]

115. Accent on the wrong sylLABle

I want to be safe when flying. I want to make sure all those loved ones are safe when flying. Safety measures within reason are always very welcome. Within reason.

But really.

You have to pay out your wazoo to get a ticket no matter what these days and pay an exhorbitant amount for extra baggage. You get harrassed if your wazoo is too big, not dressed in acceptable clothing or the person next to you in every-already-too-small-seat doesn't like your (fill in the blank from children to reading material to perfume). You can't make yourself warm because of no blankets, no pillows, and we haven't had genuine food or snacks for a long time. You can't bring your own drinks and MUST purchase them at outrageous prices right before you board your plane...(and by the way, what makes THOSE drinks any safer, really? Just more expensive) Women are getting frisked, men are getting shakedowns, mothers carrying children often have to stop, take off their childrens' shoes and TSA agents refuse to help or hold their children while requesting the mothers to do so(seen it happen twice) and often with extremely rude and obnoxious behavior from *security* that exceeds any professional demeanor. Now you can't use the restroom, get up, stretch your legs, etc etc blah blah blah an hour before you land...hey, how about we make people keep their hands on their heads the last hour, too!

I am genuinely hopeful everyone can get from point a to point b safely. But really, other than doing total strip searches, chemical body washes, invasive baggage trashing, massive dog sniffing stations and chaining people to their seats in *assume the position* mode...there is no 100% effective way to keep planes 100% safe.

The percentage of flights that go without a hitch are WAY WAY higher than those that don't. But I am sure that this new attempt will cause millions of overreacting regulations directed to make everyone very uncomfortable and angry to make the skies anything but friendly to fly.

[krabigirl]

132. this is ridiculous and will make it impossible to fly with toddlers

How will we get them to france this year? I am thinking seriously about taking a boat instead.

[katkat]

145. Cunard

I just looked a little at cunard.com. It takes a week to cross the Atlantic and costs about $1,000. If I didn't think I'd be seasick all the way across, I'd try this. The only way I manage that on planes is to be doped up with Dramamine, but half a day of being green is a lot different from a week.

[krabigirl]

162. thanks :) I get seasick, too. Sigh. I also need dramamine on planes.

Maybe someone needs to make an even faster boat :)

[Manifestor_of_Light]

171. The Queen Mary 2 is the newest ship they have.

I went on a cruise once from Florida to the Bahamas (3 days). It was part of a package deal with Disney World and they had kid-oriented cruises. They were called "The Big Red Boat" run by Premier--3 diff ships. Now Disney has their own ships.

I did not get sick because the ship was 780 feet long - that's pretty damned big. I couldn't even tell the ship was moving.

And as far as gaining weight - I ate all the fresh fruit, all the time. The elevators were small and useless so I ran up and down 7 flights of stairs. I am pretty sure I lost weight, even though I was eating all the time.

[krabigirl]

243. I would absolutely love to take an oceanliner...if I had the time.

I suppose I could settle for a cruise :). I find sea travel to be glamorous, but I'm sure it's because I've never tried it.

[katkat]

272. looking better every day

[pnwmom]

148. Babies will have to be changed in people's laps. n/t

[krabigirl]

163. You can't have anything on your laps. But the problem is (Semi) potty trained toddlers.

[pnwmom]

184. You can have a baby on your lap! You're not required to have a seat for

a baby under 2, actually.

[krabigirl]

197. well, you aren't allowed to have anything at all on your lap in the last hour...

[pnwmom]

206. A baby isn't a "thing" not allowed on a lap. A human baby, anyway. n/t

[THUNDER HANDS]

190. thank you, terrorists!

I kiiid, I kiiid.

:evilgrin:

[alp227]

144. This is outrageous...anyone saving up for a private jet?

First, a failed liquid bomb attempt led to water bottles being banned, and now this? I'm saving up for a private jet.

Being seated for a solid hour before landing? Hmm, maybe we'll hear of someone with a bladder infection suing the FAA. I think that airlines should make damn clear what the procedures are so that the passengers will be held responsible.

[mainer]

248. If you get a group together, it's not too bad

I've actually priced private jet charters, and if you get a group of, say, 10 people together, the cost per-passenger isn't that much more than a business-class ticket.

[Clear Blue Sky]

147. Yikes. No coffee before flights.

[Ed76638]

151. All because of some random fucktard from Nigeria.

Godfuckingdamn.

:grr:

[marasinghe]

270. don't forget the random-thinking fucktards in homeland security & their mindless supporters (n/t)

[BulletproofLandshark]

159. I'll never fly again.

This shit has gone far enough. I refuse to live my life in fear.

[krabigirl]

165. same here. enough is enough.

[buddysmellgood]

167. Let's just fly naked.

[mnhtnbb]

169. I'm glad we aren't planning any trips any time soon.

[rainbow4321]

170. "Little was different at the airport in Lagos, Nigeria"

So basically, whoever wants to do people harm can just see which countries are NOT enforcing the extra security measures and fly out of those countries.

[TheWatcher]

216. Oh, stop with the logic and enjoy your Police State, Citizen.

Being safe from fake boogeyman is more important than your silly concerns.

Next you'll be telling us the World Is Round, and other such old wives tales.

:sarcasm:

[Blasphemer]

176. Good lord. I know I won't be doing any traveling until this blows over. Not worth it... nt

[JCMach1]

199. Hate to point this out to TSA: The guy was SITTING IN HIS SEAT

Glad they have a CUNNING PLAN to stamp out terrorism.

[vaberella]

202. That's all? For all the exclamations I'll assume not a lot of people here are Black post 9/11.

The shit I went through at the airport. ~sigh~

[yurbud]

205. how did a guy get through with bomb material? every airport I've been at has sniffers

[No Elephants]

213. The one hour no pee, no poop rule is DUMB, DUMB, DUMB, DUMB, DUMB, DUMB, DUMB, DUMB, DUMB.nt

[Vinca]

220. So what if an hour and a half before the end of the flight

the bad guy goes into the bathroom? This is the stupidest response to an attack I've ever heard. How about posting a flight attendant near the restrooms to be alert for suspicious activity? If something doesn't smell right (pun intended), unlock the door and see what's going on.

[RedSock]

225. It's called "security theater" (eom)

[indepat]

229. We can eliminate all threat of terrorist acts on commercial passenger flights by simply eliminating

all commercial flights. See, that was easy. :P

[ohheckyeah]

244. What they need to do is

put Sky Marshals on flights. It worked quite well against hijackings.

[Kablooie]

246. What the hell? How does this crap help anybody?

[mainer]

247. "Normal urination" is said to be 5-8 times a day

according to:

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_often_should_the_average_person_pee

So if you leave out the hours a night when you sleep, "normal" pee frequency is 8x over 16 hours. Which is every two hours.

Now imagine you're on an airplane. Coach is full. There's a line for the bathroom. It's two hours before landing. You need to pee, but can't get near the john because of the line. Now imagine there's airport congestion and the plane has to circle for an hour or more, and everyone has to stay in their seat. That's three hours without a chance to pee.

Oh my. Even people with normal bladders are going to be unhappy.

Time to buy stock in Depends.

[alarimer]

250. Fuck this bullshit.

If these had been in effect, nobody would have been able to tackle the guy.

Boycott flying NOW. Everybody stop flying so this nonsense stops.

[WheelWalker]

266. +1 Roger that

:kick:

[24601]

252. What if you fly on ABC, CBS, or FOX - are the times different? n/t

[RainMickey]

258. Horse, meet the open barn door. n/t

[panzerfaust]

277. Forget babes-in-arms: There old guys with prostate problems, incompletely water-tight women ...

... people with salmonella from the airline food, etc

[AzDar]

281. Where does this end? Next we'll have the first attempt by a female jihadi

using the old Tampon Of Terror, and shortly thereafter, stirrups will be installed at the gates...

*Insert B. Franklin quote here*

[yellowcanine]

282. Only a matter of time before everyone gets strip searched before boarding.

Then when the terra-ists get around that one everyone flies naked.

[kiranon]

284. There is no 100% safe. A bit more courage and less fear and smarter

ways to stop terrorism are needed. El Al has it right when it questions all passengers before they board the plane but it may not work in a country as large as ours. Someone bent on blowing up a plane will eventually succeed no matter what TSA does. The current security "upgrades" are rather silly but I didn't expect anything better on a Christmas weekend from the government. I expect the whole thing will be looked at again and changed in short order. The way to survive is not to overreact - stay calm and if the government doesn't look at every passenger, there is nothing to stop the passengers from looking around and deciding for themselves if they wish to fly on a particular flight for rational or irrational reasons. There's risk in crossing the street. Risk is part of life and I don't expect all risk to be done away with and certainly not on an airplane when the U.S. has so many people out there and in this country who wish us ill.