Cuts to Child Care Subsidy Thwart More Job Seekers

[RamboLiberal]

Source: NY Times

TUCSON — Able-bodied, outgoing and accustomed to working, Alexandria Wallace wants to earn a paycheck. But that requires someone to look after her 3-year-old daughter, and Ms. Wallace, a 22-year-old single mother, cannot afford child care.

Last month, she lost her job as a hair stylist after her improvised network of baby sitters frequently failed her, forcing her to miss shifts. She qualifies for a state-run subsidized child care program. But like many other states, Arizona has slashed that program over the last year, relegating Ms. Wallace’s daughter, Alaya, to a waiting list of nearly 11,000 eligible children.

Despite a substantial increase in federal support for subsidized child care, which has enabled some states to stave off cuts, others have trimmed support, and most have failed to keep pace with rising demand, according to poverty experts and federal officials.

That has left swelling numbers of low-income families struggling to reconcile the demands of work and parenting, just as they confront one of the toughest job markets in decades.

The cuts to subsidized child care challenge the central tenet of the welfare overhaul adopted in 1996, which imposed a five-year lifetime limit on cash assistance. Under the change, low-income parents were forced to give up welfare checks and instead seek paychecks, while being promised support — not least, subsidized child care — that would enable them to work.



Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/24/business/economy/24childcare.html?pagewanted=1&hp

[Orrex]

1. The only way to solve this is to enact more tax cuts for the rich

[happygoluckytoyou]

11. i donate annually to DEBUTANTE AID... so many wealthy young ladies cannot afford the finest wine at

their coming out party.... and what with the oil in the gulf, getting fresh shrimp for the cocktails is a positivly horrid experience

[Taverner]

14. I know huh? And if it gets worse, we can save everyone with one big tax cut on businesses

Making over 3B a year

[notadmblnd]

2. Why do people hate children?

Seem like, once they're born they have no value.

[proudohioan]

4. It certainly seems to be the case, especially with those "right to lifers". n/t

[Duchess]

5. I don't think people hate children...

They just don't want to pay to take care of other people's children. Some people choose not to have children because they choose to focus on other aspects of life.

I'm all for public education but I don't see the need to subsidize daycare for small children. Isn't there already a tax credit for each child?

Anyway, it's the parents responsibility. They will have to make some hard choices to support the children they chose to create.

[PassingFair]

7. All species reproduce, or they will quickly cease to exist.

It is the responsibility of, and in the best interest of, the species as a whole to
see to it that the offspring make it to adult-hood.

Pretty basic survival stuff.

[proudohioan]

8. It really is a societal problem.....

and being members of a society, we often have to 'pay' for/support things that we either don't like or don't concern us personally.

That's just part of the price of living in a society, I guess.

[notadmblnd]

9. Then let the mothers stay home and raise them

instead of making them go to work. Yes, in a perfect world we'd all stay home to raise our kids. We'd also not have dead beat dads that don't walk away from their responsibilities. For some reason, the women and children always have to bear the brunt of the results of people being too lazy to use birth control. But it takes two and just too many times the daddy get off scott free. I know my own father never paid a dime in child support and no court ever made him. Now I babysit for one of these mothers. I get paid 166.50 for 90 hours every two weeks. I not exactly yelling "I'm rich beoitch"

IMO, you are one of those people that hate kids, because you express that your all for punishing them because of their parents sins.

[Duchess]

15. I don't hate kids...

I agree that it really isn't fair when a father gets off scott free and the mother/children have to bear the brunt. It sounds like my father was a lot like your father. The adversity that his BS caused in my life actually was a valuable lesson. So, it might suck for the kids but they will learn more from the adversity than anything else.

If/when I have children it will be through adoption. There is absolutely no reason for half of the population to procreate (besides personal ego). A smaller population would actually make things better for all in the long run.

So, I'm all for policies put as much responsibility for raising a child on the parent. It shouldn't be a decision taken lightly and it shouldn't be a decision supported by the government. If you want a child...great. But you should be totally on your own to take care of it.

Public education makes sense. But beyond that the parents need to figure it out for themselves.

[Dappleganger]

17. "Learning valuable lessons" will not put food in their bellies or a roof over their heads.

"Parents need to figure that out for themselves."

I do believe you have made a wrong turn on the internet.

[notadmblnd]

23. And what a bout those that are parentless through no fault of their own.

My child's father died when he was 10 (we were married till death we did part). Then my job left the country, I should reconsider having him now? Should I adopt my little brown skinned child out now that I'm having financial difficulties and now rely on government $$s to support him? I can just imagine the people lining up to care for him. NOT! Shit happens in life, this is not a perfect world and because you resent a few cents coming out of your paycheck in taxes, you would deny a woman assistance with childcare?

Do you also decline driving on the roads because you have to pay a tax, or police or fire service? How about city/state and national parks? You you only eat what you hunt or make meals out of road kill? After all the government takes tax dollars to ensure your food supply is safe.

Why does public education make sense to you, when you could care less if children survive long enough to get to the public education system? Either you're very young and haven't lived long enough to experience many of life's little surprises or you've been very sheltered by someone else taking care of you.

[Duchess]

32. ...

I'm sorry to hear about your spouse. I've only been married about half as long but I don't know what I would do if I lost my wife. My condolences.

Shit happens in life

Exactly, shit happens in life. But we shouldn't look to the government/each other to pull us out of the fire every time shit happens. Especially, when we can do it ourselves or with the help of friends and family.

Parenting is one of those few responsibilities where I find any form of government intervention excessive. It is one of those things people need to figure out for themselves. Is YOUR child YOUR responsibility or is YOUR child everyone else's responsibility?

I don't have a single problem with taxes. I think the FDA is a great example of proper government function. Student loan programs and public education are others good examples. Taxes and government are very important. Without government life would be harsh, cold, and short.

Either you're very young and haven't lived long enough to experience many of life's little surprises or you've been very sheltered by someone else taking care of you

I'm not that young and I've had quite a few surprises in my life. I've worked multiple jobs and taken care of myself since I was 14. I learned early on to prepare for the worst and not to take on more than you are prepared to handle yourself. I paid for my own education. I chose education and training that was fairly hard to get, in high demand, and is flexible so that I would have the best chance of continued employment. I've learned to hunt in case I'm still unable to find employment.

Always be ready for the worst case scenario and don't plan with the best case in mind.
Even then, I know that shit happens that you aren't ready for...but that is when you gain experience by fixing the problem and doing the best with what you have. A good life isn't easy...why would you want to live without the struggle?

We all need to work together and rely on each other. But we need to rely on ourselves first and take it as a personal failure to need the help of someone else. Otherwise, there will only be people asking for help and none able/willing to give it.

[Iowa]

36. There are some problems with your position on this...

1) First, you can't just superimpose your life-experiences onto others. Example: You chose education and training that was fairly hard to get. Fair enough. And good for you. But you couldn't have done that had you not won the birth lottery and been endowed with the intellect and the psychological makeup to handle it. Not everyone is so lucky. This concept is one of the important things that separates progressives from the right. Progressives tend to believe that good fortune is only partially of our own making, that we are all vulnerable to life's pitfalls, and that the very best societies value good safety nets. Those on the right tend to believe that it should be every man, woman, and child for her/himself, that good fortune is earned/deserved, and that everyone should be able to accomplish what they have done.

2) The world has changed and your position is terribly outdated. When I was entering the workforce, there were plenty of jobs and a family could make it on one salary. Intellect/education didn't really matter. If you couldn't go to college, there were plenty of good-paying jobs in packing houses, factories, construction, etc. Not so today. I was just reading about a study (in the Chicago Tribune)... 64% of 2009 college graduates are back living with their parents. Many of our very brightest and motivated young people aren't getting jobs at all, and many of those who do find jobs are being paid wages that aren't even subsistence level. The economy has become horribly distorted in favor of the oligarchy and against working people. The middle class is fast disappearing. To expect young families to just stop having children until living wages are restored is nonsense. If progressives continue to be ignored by lawmakers, poverty level wages could be an issue for generations. Subsidizing child care is the very least we can do for young families who aren't being fairly compensated for their labor.

3) A society that is willing to spend trillions covering the gambling losses of bankers and funding wars about nothing should have no problem helping young, underpaid, working families procure decent child care.

4) Of all the outrageous tax expenditures you could oppose, it's incredibly odd that you would zero in on child care for young families who want/need to work. It is a position that is both cold and short-sighted.

5) You said, "But we need to rely on ourselves first and take it as a personal failure to need the help of someone else. Otherwise, there will only be people asking for help and none able/willing to give it." This is a complete fallacy; it is pure right-wing propaganda. You clearly have never worked with people who need help. Well I did... for years. Your perceptions about the psychology of seeking help are not only overly simplistic, they're wrong.

If asked to rank in order of preference how I'd prefer my tax dollars to be spent, child-care would be among the top five. And I say this as an old guy who followed a path similar to yours in that I always prepared for the worst, lived well below my means, made decent money, and so on. I realize that much of my good fortune was just plain luck... tweak just a few things and all the hard work in the world wouldn't have produced the same good result. You clearly don't get that, and by not getting that you reach erroneous conclusions.

[proudohioan]

43. Excellent post, Iowa!

You really hit the nail on the head.

:thumbsup:

[Iowa]

48. Thanks proudohioan.

[Orrex]

37. +1

Additionally, I would support a direct subsidy paid to stay-at-home mothers (or fathers), because they are doing essential and uncompensated work that directly affects the future health of society. It would be nice, therefore, if society would make an investment in those families.

[RamboLiberal]

10. Problem is we then pay the mother to stay home with her child

or settle for ad-hoc child care where she can find it.

I'd rather we make a short term investment in child care to allow the mother to do productive work and hopefully better her ability to earn a decent wage than to have to pay to have her sit home and lose her chances at education and enhanced job skills.

So we pay 4-5 years of child care and perhaps some after school care when the child gets old enough to be in school.

I wish we had young people and adults who took the responsibility to not have children till financially able and for stable marriages. But we never will. So let's solve the problem the best way we can. Better IMHO to pay for good-quality child care than pay later for prisons.

[Gormy Cuss]

12. +1. That's why child care subsidies are considered good policy

at least by some. It's a relatively short term investment with a longer term payoff.

[Lagomorph]

38. The problem seems to be....

...we can't afford to do either.

That whole "mandatory spending" thing is biting us in the ass, hard.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Duchess]

26. I didn't know the concept of responsibility was only for the right wing.

I support a woman's right to choose. If abortion were illegal I might support more government child care programs.

As it is now having a child is a choice. There are many options available to prevent or end pregnancy (Abortion, Birth Control(a huge variety), Vasectomy, tubal ligation, even abstinence ). Having a child is truly a decision with many options and off ramps. Even if the child is carried to term adoption is an option.

Those are the hard decisions to which I was referring. The decision to have a child or not can be a very hard decision with many variables to consider. But in the end it is still a choice.

With the freedom of choice comes the burden of responsibility. If you want a child and despite all available options decide to go through with the pregnancy then you get to live with the responsibility...until the child becomes an adult.

Ideally, sober reasoning and careful preparation would go into making a child. But that usually isn't the case. Often those the least prepared to raise a child are the ones who procreate. No one else should be held responsible for their mistakes. If the parents are unable to take care of the children then they should be given up for adoption or cared for by the state in an orphanage. There are opportunity costs for every choice...you can't have everything you want just because you want it.

It's not that I don't care about the kids...I just don't care about the parents who made an ill conceived choice. I'm more than willing to help support a child but not by helping the parent. They should either fulfill their responsibilities as a parent or give up their child.

We do have a societal responsibility for educating children so that they can make reasoned decisions. I would rather spend the child care money on sex education. We could roll it into the mathematics curriculum. If teenagers understood the statistics behind condom failure and Pregnancy/STD transmission rates then they might have the right tools to make good sexual decisions in the future.

That money could also be better spent improving the conditions of orphanages.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Duchess]

34. Well, I think DU might be a good place for me...

I may not totally agree with you but I'm willing listen to your perspective. Maybe you (or others on the forum) will make arguments or provide information that changes my mind/position.

I don't know how a forum can help someone grow/improve/learn if everyone is just patting each other on the back. I'm just trying to learn from others and share my perspective. I think there is room to respectfully disagree on a forum like this.

These are my opinions...feel free to challenge them. Maybe I will concede to your logic. Maybe I will will learn to debate my ideas more eloquently and change your mind. Maybe we will both change our minds and come to a common but different consensus. Who knows. I'm not looking to start fights just discussions.

(BTW you're probably right about the generalization)

[Dappleganger]

30. So, you'd rather go back to the days of rampant orphanages??

And I truly don't believe you have an inkling what real responsibility means. It's not just about YOU.

[Winterblues]

40. How very Progressive of you

Mine,,mine,,mine,,mine,,mine,, Does that about sum up your attitude?

[xxqqqzme]

45. Let's see what will it be this month?

Rent or food? Electricity or gas for the car so I can get to work? Such hard choices? This attitude really pisses me off. I worked full time, took classes at night AND raised two kids, had rent and car payments along w/ all the other expenses on $17,00/yr. More than once my electricity was threatened because I chose food over that bill. Are those the hard choices you suppose?



BTW, my kids turned out great!

[Bill McBlueState]

47. you don't want to force a talented person to stay in the home

for X years just because she chose to have a child.

New mothers have a very hard time completing graduate programs, for example, and subsidized child care helps to correct that.

[BuelahWitch]

49. How far do you think those "tax credits" go?

Not very damn far. Sometimes they have to be spent on other important things, like rent.

[proudohioan]

3. It's not even just low-income workers....

Escalating costs of child care affect middle-income workers as well.

As if we needed any more of them, it's one more unfortunate hurdle to jump over in this glorious capitalist economy.



:-(

[Dappleganger]

19. It sure is.

And many of those workers were barely making ends meet as it was. Those who stayed at home went to work (when they could find it!) because the other wage-earner was underemployed.

Once again, we are falling down backwards towards the cliff.

[proudohioan]

22. Falling backwards towards the cliff....

Boy you sure hit the nail on the head with that one! Have you read Elizabeth Warren's "The Two-Income Trap"? She goes into all of that, and it's really fascinating reading (of course I'm biased; I just adore Elizabeth Warren).

When I first got divorced in '98', I found it necessary to get full-time work and put my youngest in daycare. And even with a pretty good salary, that $500 per month day care really pinched. And I was LUCKY to find day care that cheap! I don't know what I would have done if the 2 older ones weren't in school all day. (and they, of course, were the infamous 'latch-key kids'.)

Life has just gotten rougher and rougher in the past 30 years (I blame it on Reaganomics) and it seems like the deck is continually stacked against us (the average folks)!

Always good to 'talk' to you, Dappleganger!

:hi:

[Dappleganger]

24. Funny you should ask about that book...

maybe it was you who recommended it (or someone else, can't recall), but I just finished it! Thank goodness for Amazon's used books, lol. ;0)

Very well-written, and frightening to say the least!

You hang tight my Friend. :hug:

[proudohioan]

27. I dunno? Maybe so?

But I'm glad you read it! I adore Amazon's used books as much as I adore Elizabeth Warren! Do you have any recommended reading for me?

Yes, you hang in there, too! Hey, at least our days of daycare $$$ worries are over!

:hug:

[Dappleganger]

29. Have you read 'The Big Short'?

If you haven't, I'd be happy to send it along to you if you have time to read it. Does DU have a book club to pass along books we've finished?? I have a few more E. Warren books to read as well.

Yes, those daycare prices are a nightmare! It used to be that extended family could help but if you don't have that luxury it really makes it hard to just stay afloat.

[proudohioan]

33. No, I haven't heard of it....

Oh, please fill me in; I have no job, so plenty of time for reading :thumbsup: here!

I don't know if DU has any kind of book club/exchange?

You could send it on, or I can get it from the library pretty quickly.

T.

:pals:

[xultar]

6. More evidence that people care more for the child BEFORE it is born.

[Dappleganger]

20. Not ever person has a child due to choice.

Lots of displaced family members around here...you can't say NO to family. Grandmothers take in their grandkids, aunts take in nieces and nephews, etc. We had one of our oldest daughter's friends living here for quite awhile last year due to her family trouble. If she hadn't moved in with us she would have run away (she was 16 at the time). You can't always plan for that.

[Jennicut]

13. I have worked in day care. I was payed pretty bad but the cost for the parents was very high.

I always wonder where the money really went to, because some of the centers were not the cleanest or in the best shape. Lack of good resources for the kids. It was a good job over the summer in between college semesters, but I felt bad for the kids at times. And this was in a wealthy town in Connecticut. Many people don't value children very much in this society once they are no longer fetuses. We ignore them, want them to grow up fast, and provide inadequate places for them to be in while their parents work. Some parents worked all day long. They saw the day care workers more then their parents.

[defendandprotect]

18. We need more government child care available 24/7 -- but we also need

a strong family planning program all over the planet -

beginning with subsidizng vasectomies!

[Jennicut]

21. I agree on that, and some people shouldn't have kids. Some

people feel obligated to out of family pressure and pressure from friends and society in general. I have two kids but wanted them by my own choice.

[notadmblnd]

25. I'll go even further. They need to be mandated in certain cases.

When a man has children by several different women and still refuse to pay for those children, he should be forced to become sterile.

[proudohioan]

31. I hate to say it, and will probably be bashed for it, but I agree with you...

I worked for a county govermnent child support unit for many years, and yeah, when you're getting men who have fathered 7 kids by 6 different women, and have no ability (or intent) on paying child support for any of them, you gotta stop that cycle.

I do realize that women have responsibility as well, and we can argue all day about that one, but honestly, it takes two to tangle. And when no one wants to be responsible, then I feel the government must step in.

[classof56]

35. No bashing here, and I say amen to this!

Always very easy to blame the woman and punish the children while men waltz along with whoever they can find to waltz with (I'm sure you get my meaning). Back in the day, the saying "she got herself pregnant" was the way that an unmarried mom-to-be was characterized with a sneer. Shame on her! But then I began to wonder, just how did she manage that??

And may I add, I'd far rather my tax dollars be used to benefit kids' day care so their parents can work than to finance big oil, CEOs and oh, yes, those ugly wars that are sucking up our country's blood and treasure.

Didn't mean to go on, but thanks for your post!

[proudohioan]

39. Yes, I would rather my tax $$$ go to day care, too.

A couple of years ago, I lived in a very large apartment complex with a lot of recent Russian immigrants. Those women were shocked that America did not have any subsidized day care. Apparently in Russia, this was the norm? What does THAT say about our country?

You know, there are so many things that we, 'the taxpayer', pay for (ie, WAR, ect..) that we don't necessarily support, have any personal stake in, or control over. We can't just pick and choose what our tax $$ go for.

Folks just seem to think that 'it's a given' and go along with the status quo. Yet I hear folks even right here on DU stating that they don't want THEIR tax $$ going to fund daycare (cuz they don't have kids), libraries (don't use 'em), health care (if you are too cheap to fork out money for insurance, I ain't payin' for your ER bill, and besides, you smoke, so you brought bad heath upon yourself) and on an on.... it just boggles the mind!

Yeah, talk about going on! LOL

Thank you for your input, classof56!

:hi:

[Lance_Boyle]

41. And women who have kids by many different fathers and refuse to get a job?

Should they be forcibly sterilized, too?

[notadmblnd]

42. yes

[Lance_Boyle]

44. Ouch. At least you are consistent with your position.

But I can't support forced sterilization absent a criminal conviction. It's a bitter pill to swallow even then.

[notadmblnd]

46. Yes, if the woman continually has children

then walks away from her obligations repeatedly, she should be sterilized also.