Italy's crackdown on Gypsies reflects rising anti-immigrant tide in Europe

[Blue_Tires]

Source: WaPo

MILAN - This venerable city, long known for savory saffron risotto and the leggy models of Fashion Week, is moving to establish itself as something else: a zero-tolerance zone for Gypsies.

Sarkozy's planned crackdown on illegal immigration is introduced as legislation
Anti-Gypsy campaigns in neighboring France have sparked international criticism, with officials there in recent months deporting more than 1,000 ethnic Roma - a clannish people migrating west in large numbers from Eastern Europe. But with great bravado, Milan is taking the lead in responding to Italy's own "Gypsy Emergency."

Blaming rising crime on the new waves of Roma immigrants, authorities are moving to dismantle Milan's largest authorized Gypsy camp, Triboniano, a teeming shantytown of street musicians and day laborers that officials decry as a den of thieves. At the same time, Milan is bulldozing hundreds of small, impromptu camps inhabited by newer arrivals and issuing mass eviction notices to Roma families living in another long-established camp in the city's largest immigrant neighborhood.

"These are dark-skinned people, not Europeans like you and me," said Riccardo De Corato, who is Milan's vice mayor from Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi's ruling party and who is in charge of handling the camps. He later added: "Our final goal is to have zero Gypsy camps in Milan."


Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/10/11/AR2010101105815.html

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

1. Wait, what? WHAT? I thought only bad, unberlievable RW caricatures made by liberals spoke like that.

"These are dark-skinned people, not Europeans like you and me," said Riccardo De Corato, who is Milan's vice mayor from Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi's ruling party...

:wow:

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

2. I was going to edit out the "unberlievable" typo above, but I'm going to let it stay.

I like the unintentional meaning.

[Posteritatis]

11. BBC was talking to some of Italy's Minutemen-equivalents a few months back...

They said that some of the groups' opinions were vile enough that their policies forbade even quoting them. Ugh.

[Blue_Tires]

15. i was also shocked he could say that with a straight face...

in his official position, no less...

[krabigirl]

26. Those people exist in huge numbers in many countries.

Very anti-foreigner in many places. Not just here.

[Spider Jerusalem]

27. You're surprised?

We're talking about a country where football fans make monkey noises and chuck bananas on the pitch if a visiting team has black players. Spain has similar problems with racism; one wonders how much it has to do with both countries having a fairly deep reactionary and, well...fascist political undercurrent that neither has really much examined or addressed (look at the "Northern League" in Italy, for instance).

[NuttyFluffers]

31. i'm not surprised. most countries refuse to self-examine.

Americans get a lot of flack for every -ism out there, but at least we air out our closets regularly of skeletons. we may not know what to do with them as they sit there in the middle of the room, but at least we start by looking at them. the rest of the world, not so much...

[bos1]

3. 1930's-style antiGypsyism is exploding in Europe

Italy, Czech Republic, France... Reactionaries are in politics and using race and xenophobia in the most obvious, hamfisted ways, while neo-Nazi groups commit hate crimes

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bos1]

5. are you serious? anti-Gypsyism on DU?

or are you pulling my leg? I am pretty gullible

[Chulanowa]

6. Nope, I'm not kidding

There are a few ethnic groups that get shot at here on DU with surprising regularity - Roma, Mexicans, Arabs, and Native Americans, mostly. Thankfully most of the posts get deleted, but some of the posters get to stay around.

Just slap that alert button, s'all you can really do when you run into it.

[proteus_lives]

17. Don't forget Israelis.

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[proteus_lives]

19. I've missed your standard-issue accusations of racism and bigotry.

They've always brought a smile to my face.

And of course I ask you to link to evidence of said racism and then you run away as fast as you can. Good times.

"Nah, anyone expressing hate to Israelis or Jews gets tombstoned"

:rofl:

The I/P forum would be a ghost-town if that was true.

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[proteus_lives]

21. I missed the deleted comments.

I'm guessing, "Curse word, curse word, you're a racist, you're a racist, curse word."

Then you offer nothing and hitch the road. Am I right?

[Posteritatis]

10. The more active threads on this have *lots* of supporters of deportations and the like. (nt)

[JustAnotherGen]

7. Oh my!

"These are dark-skinned people, not Europeans like you and me," said Riccardo De Corato, who is Milan's vice mayor from Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi's ruling party and who is in charge of handling the camps.

Okay – now my dear heart is from Acri (Calabria). Ask him if he’s light skinned he’d say yes? Ask him if he’s white? He’ll say, “I’m not white! I’m Calabrese”. :rofl:

This not only shows the ‘outsider’ being mistreated – but it also shows how DIVERSE those who trace their heritage back to Italy by 1300-1500 years see themselves. The guy from Milan – we’re light.

The guy from down South who ‘owns’ the fact that his town was inhabited by both Greeks and North East Africans – sees no shame in ‘the others’ being there. And oh – by the way? I wonder if that Mayor has been to Palermo in the past ohhhhhhhhhhh saaaaaaaaaay – 1500 years? :rofl:

Assery keeps running its course all over the place.

[Romulox]

8. Shove impoverishing "globalism" down peoples', then call them a racist if they complain

There couldn't possibily be a nasty, equal (but opposite) reaction to such a course of conduct. Never. And by extension, corporatist/globalists have no responsibility whatever for the instability they have wrought.

[bos1]

9. this has nothing to do with so-called Globalism. Italy, France and Czech Republic

are playing racist politics in the most obvious and hamfisted ways

[Romulox]

12. Immigration has "nothing" to do with Globalism? A nonsensical assertion on its face. nt

[bos1]

13. If you study these cases, you will see that it is politicians using anti-Gypsyism to create reaction

and reaction = Reactionaries. If you don't know history, the world is a mystery.

[pampango]

14. "Across Europe, the politics of the far right is infecting us all with the need for a 'reasonable'

anti-immigration policy

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/oct/03/immigration-policy-roma-rightwing-europe

The recent expulsion of Roma, or Gypsies, from France drew protests from all around Europe – from the liberal media but also from top politicians, and not only from those on the left. But the expulsions went ahead, and they are just the tip of a much larger iceberg of European politics.

Incidents like these have to be seen against the background of a long-term rearrangement of the political space in western and eastern Europe. Until recently, most European countries were dominated by two main parties that addressed the majority of the electorate: a right-of-centre party (Christian Democrat, liberal-conservative, people's) and a left-of-centre party (socialist, social-democratic), with smaller parties (ecologists, communists) addressing a narrower electorate.

Recent electoral results in the west as well as in the east signal the gradual emergence of a different polarity. There is now one predominant centrist party that stands for global capitalism, usually with a liberal cultural agenda (for example, tolerance towards abortion, gay rights, religious and ethnic minorities). Opposing this party is an increasingly strong anti-immigrant populist party which, on its fringes, is accompanied by overtly racist neofascist groups. The best example of this is Poland where, after the disappearance of the ex-communists, the main parties are the "anti-ideological" centrist liberal party of the prime minister Donald Tusk and the conservative Christian Law and Justice party of the Kaczynski brothers. Similar tendencies are discernible in the Netherlands, Norway, Sweden and Hungary. How did we get here?

After the disintegration of the communist regimes in 1990, we entered a new era in which the predominant form of the exercise of state power became a depoliticised expert administration and the co-ordination of interests. The only way to introduce passion into this kind of politics, the only way to actively mobilise people, is through fear: the fear of immigrants, the fear of crime, the fear of godless sexual depravity, the fear of the excessive state (with its burden of high taxation and control), the fear of ecological catastrophe, as well as the fear of harassment (political correctness is the exemplary liberal form of the politics of fear).

[Wednesdays]

16. Gypsies?? WTF is this, the 1400's?

I thought this kind of bigotry was passe in Europe after Quasimodo and Esmeralda, or after Hitler, at the very least.

[bherrera]

22. It is not really bigotry

Job markets are difficult today. We in Europe observe a simple fact, if there is job problems, then the tendency is to remove a portion of the workers. And if the law allows this removal, then politicians seek favor and popularity by removing these immigrants. It is human nature. If there are a lot of jobs, then people love the immigrants because they do dirty work nobody wants to do, and they charge very little.

I am sure this problem happens in the USA too. If the job market is good, then there is no problem. Job market is bad, then it becomes a serious problem. And politicians will always do what wins elections.

[bos1]

28. No, it IS bigotry.

First of all look at his words -- his meaning is clearly bigoted. Also, if you look at the details of these cases, the immigrants are just a scapegoat, and they were the scapegoat well before the economic crisis. Also, the anti-Gypsy pogroms go against even the Gypsies who have lived in the country their whole lives, so it is not an issue of immigrants. Simply, Conservative/right wing politicians are using racism to gain more popularity for themselves, in the oldest and most obvious ways.

[pipoman]

23. There is a vast sub-culture of Roma Gypsies even here in the US.

[pipoman]

24. I have no experience

with Roma Gypsies in Europe, I do however have experience with them in the US. In the US Roma Gypsies often live outside the rules of our society. I have dealt with them fairly extensively. Many, not all, make their living by bilking people. Many, not all, buy things on credit with assumed names and stolen IDs. Many, not all, engage in illegal scams and schemes as well as theft for survival. It is a sect of organized crime which is recognized by law enforcement in every city in the US. It is a sect of society which is known and avoided by credit companies of all kinds.

All that said, the translation of DeCorato's words certainly don't sound good.

[bos1]

29. I do.

Mostly the Roma in Europe live the typical lives that all the lower income people live in Europe. Others are middle class and in fact "blend in" and aren't automatically identified as Roma. In no cases do they constitute any real threat to any economy (and they contribute many positives to some of the overly homogenized societies). Overwhelmingly the crooks, the embezzlers, the politicians and businessmen looting the countries' economies are NOT Roma, they are the so-called whites.

[Nihil]

32. I do too and pipoman is closer to the truth than you are.

Some do indeed "blend in" but they are not the majority by a long chalk.

It is the ones that choose not to blend in, the ones who choose to live
outside the society where they have chosen to live.

Yes, there are thieves, fraudsters, embezzlers and other criminals from every
other racial/cultural group too. That doesn't negate the fact that there are
more than enough from the gypsy/roma grouping.

The important phrase to remember from pipoman's post (.24) is "Many, not all".

[bos1]

34. The majority populations are thieving all across Europe and using Gypsies as a distraction

and a scapegoat. The majority of crime is by the majority populations (the white people, basically).

I understood perfectly the "many, not all" in the post, thank you. After living for years with the 1930's-type racism the "many, not all" white people in some parts of Europe have for Gypsies, I won't put up with this bullshit when I see it here or anywhere

[Nihil]

36. Nice wide brush you're using there!

Yeah, it's always "bullshit" and "1930's-type racism" ...

:eyes:

Have a nice day!

[krabigirl]

25. The cast time there were mass deportations of gypsies in Europe was before ww2, no?

Scary.

[KamaAina]

30. Final goal?

How does one reach a "final goal"? Through a final solution? :scared:

[pampango]

33. The four left blocs (not the right) in the European parliament oppose Roma treatment by France.

Resolution says France's actions violate Charter of Fundamental Rights.

http://www.europeanvoice.com/article/2010/09/meps-condemn-france-s-expulsion-of-roma/68841.aspx

The European Parliament today backed a resolution calling on French authorities “to suspend all expulsions of Roma”. The resolution expressed “deep concern at the measures taken by the French authorities” and other member states in “targeting Roma and Travellers”. The resolution was approved with 337 votes in favour, 245 against and 51 abstentions.

The Parliament added that it had concerns about the “inflammatory and openly discriminatory rhetoric” used during the expulsions. MEPs said that they believed the “mass expulsions” violated not only the EU's Charter of Fundamental Rights, but also EU citizen rights under freedom of movement rules.

The resolution criticised the European Commission for its “late and limited response” in reacting to the expulsions. The Commission is investigating whether the expulsions violated EU rules. MEPs called on the Commission and EU member states to step up their efforts to include Europe's more than ten million Roma in mainstream society. They called for more EU funding for education, housing, healthcare and job creation programmes for Roma communities.

The vote marked a victory for the Greens, the Socialists & Democrats (S&D), the Alliance of Liberals and Democrats (ALDE), and the European United Left/Nordic Green Left (GUE/NGL), all of whom banded together to criticise France.

MEPs from the centre-right European People's Party (EPP) (center-right), which includes the UMP party of France's President Nicolas Sarkozy, failed to stop the critical resolution from passing. The EPP and the European Conservatives and Reformists (ECR) (far-right) group drafted a rival resolution that did not criticise France.

[bos1]

35. awesome link, anti-Gypsism and the fight against it. thanks nt