Gen. Shelton (III): Iraq went so wrong because of Bush administration 'lies'

[sabra]

Source: foreign policy - Thomas Ricks

In his new memoirs, former Joint Chiefs Chairman Gen. Hugh Shelton offers an interesting twist on why Iraq went so badly: He argues that Rumsfeld elbowed aside Gen. Richard Myers and the other members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and also intimidated and flattered Gen. Tommy R. Franks while working directly with him, and so basically went to war without getting the advice of his top military advisors.

...

Shelton also writes that there was no reason to go war against Iraq. "The fact is that we had Iraq contained and they were not a threat." (419) Also, "There was absolutely no link between him (Saddam) and 9/11." (474) No big revelations, but I was glad to see this stated so flatly by a former high official.

His bottom line: "President Bush and his team got us enmeshed in Iraq based on extraordinarily poor intelligence and a series of lies purporting that we had to protect American from Saddam's evil empire because it posed such a threat to our national security." (474-475)

Just in case you weren't paying attention, he elaborates on that charge later in the book. "Spinning the possible possession of WMDs as a threat to the United States in the way they did is, in my opinion, tantamount to intentionally deceiving the American people." (488)

Read more: http://ricks.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/10/13/gen_shelton_iii_iraq_went_so_wrong_because_of_bush_administration_lies

[sakabatou]

1. Tell me something I don't know

[Roland99]

2. "The fact is that we had Iraq contained and they were not a threat." (419)

uh...Gen. Anthony Zinni said that BEFORE the damned invasion!

[Demeter]

3. Worse yet, we were already starving the children of Iraq before the invasion

what with all the no-fly-zone, economic sanctions, etc.

Now they glow in the dark with their depleted-uranium-damaged damaged genomes....
without power, water, peace, etc...

[yurbud]

13. even if they weren't contained, they were no military threat to us or even Israel

no one is going to attack or invade Israel and risk getting nuked.

[creon]

39. true

Iraq was in box with no way out. Every time Saddam stuck his head ut of the box, all that we needed to do was hit him over the head.

There was no problem; merely a minor irritant.

[Bigmack]

4. Wait... where's all the folks...

who gave us the finger when we had those streetcorner vigils/protests about the invasion? Why aren't they apologizing all over the place.

We said all of this shit!

I actually made a deal with some people I knew on the "support the President" side who were coherent enough to talk to. I told them that we'd talk 5 years after the war ended, and if there was a huge war and a mess afterward.. if all the stuff about WMDs and involvement in 9-11 proved to be lies, they would apologize and put that apology in the paper. I promised that if any of the stuff turned out to be true. and the war was over quickly and Iraq was stabilized, then I would do the apology.

I've contacted them, and the best I got was... "Well, it's not over yet... things could turn out for the best."

Do they really not remember how wrong they were?

[Diclotican]

5. Bigmack

Bigmack

They know how wrong the was, but would never admit it, becouse of the prestiqe it would be to admit, not just that they was wrong, but WHO wrong they was....

The former administration, from GWB and downward should be arrested, and put into trial, for war crimes, aggresive war, and other warcrimes against humanity.. I would bet, if they ever got to trial, they could end up as the Nazi-German leders after world war two.. A international criminal war tribual is the only way to make them responsible for what they did....

We all know, how wrong they war, but to admit that they was wrong... That's hard one. And as long as GWB and the rest of the criminal gangs is free, it wil take decades to most americans to understand what happend

Diclotican

[LiberalArkie]

37. When my dad died in 1992, he still blamed the Democrats for lying and forging

information that forced Nixon to resign.

[Diclotican]

41. LiberalArkie

LiberalArkie

That tells is all... Nixon was a bad person, who's crimes was clear as a winter day... But many belive he to be a hero anyway.. Who was forced out of office.. What they forgot, is that if Nixon was not leaving office, he would have been impeatced, and then maybe be arrested and put into a prison cell for many years... So I guess leaving office was the best move mr Nixon ever did as president

Diclotican

[Iowa]

12. Yep. I stood on the courthouse lawn with maybe 15 others protesting the war...

A local "pastor" held a counter-rally a few blocks away and had maybe a thousand people. Now that we know they were wrong, they have all scurried back under their rocks. Idiots.

[saigon68]

24. They are the Tea Baggers-- and THEY AREN'T GOING AWAY

[Iowa]

30. Yep. And at the time they had a demogogue "pastor" to whip them into a frenzy...

It wasn't pretty. The air was filled with stupid that day.

[No Elephants]

17. Wrong about WMD's, yes, but they don't really care if we had a valid reason to invade.

Republicans have at least a dozen rationalizations for that invasion, starting with "Iraq is better off without Saddam," "we brought democracy to the Middle East--soon they'll all want it--and we'll be safer" and so on.

Of course, Israel and Lebanon long had democracies and, while we eliminated a secular dictator unlawfully, we put sharia law into the Iraqi Constitution and, in general, wrecked our own Constitution and waved bye to the rule of law in our own land, but facts are irrelevant to the devoutly worshipful--of both Parties.

[Blue_Tires]

21. hell, where are all the politicians and media pundits

who knowingly propped this up for years??

[NewJeffCT]

40. Isn't that where the "Get a Brain, Morans" guy is from?

an counter anti-war protest?

[L0oniX]

6. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[old mark]

7. I am SURE the MSM will be all over this one! I can't wait for the coverage on GMA

tomorrow.

But maybe I shouldn't hold my breath...


mark

[Roland99]

8. only if by tomorrow you mean December 43rd, 2148

[old mark]

10. I guess I was too fired up.....nt

[Scurrilous]

9. K & R

:thumbsup:

[marias23]

11. Surprise: Its All About OIl

Lots of interesting comments about the war bekow, but it all doesn't matter 'cause it was about oil. Bush was just doing his part to keep the West's capitalist system fueled. That's why the elction was stolen: Bush was the last gasp of the oil industry - unfortunately we now live with the results of this petroleum economy.

[bullwinkle428]

14. "Hey Condi...kin ah still fahr that guy??"

[aquart]

15. Not exactly.

It went wrong because we aggressively invaded a nation that never attacked us. We were wrong from the first boot on the ground. The first bomb dropped. WE WERE WRONG TO GO THERE.

Saying the truth: they had no weapons of mass destruction (which is why we felt confident of succeeding)but we wanted to invade anyway because they had oil would have not made the invasion "right." It was always WRONG.

[No Elephants]

16. Bushco's lies, media complicity--and public silence from people like Shelton

unless a book deal comes along, well after the fact.

If you're interested in his book, please borrow it from your library rather than buy it.

Also, try to catch the PBS piece on Daniel Ellsberg and how he found his moral compass by remembering his oath was to the Constitution, not to any President or to secrecy. (Principles don't get anything good done in the "real world," my ass.)

[Scuba]

18. +1

[SomeGuyInEagan]

34. +1 Shelton is a gutless profiteer. n/t

[Scuba]

43. On what basis? While serving..

... he was duty-bound to follow any lawful order. Since then, he's been honor bound and ethically bound to speak out (IMHO).

[hulka38]

42. So true.

Include the top Pentagon brass and the leadership of the opposition party and the picture begins to resemble reality.

[Evasporque]

19. As long as Paint Chip Eating Republicans believe they have tax cuts...

The US could nuke France because they are dolphins from outerspace set to destroy our way of life.

no one would care.

[Bragi]

22. ++++ For Fabulousness!

[xchrom]

20. recommend

[Bragi]

23. That's why the Bushites are being charged and tried

Oh wait. Nevermind.

[jgraz]

29. You need to look forward, not back.

You know, look forward to a world with a million fewer Iraqis. :banghead:

[madokie]

25. Hang 'm high

the whole crew of traitors
Show the world we mean business

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

26. Iraq went wrong way before GWB

When GHWB sent us to war, 9/11 hadn't happened yet.

[disillusioned73]

27. We gotta look forward my friends... can't get faux noose

angry with us..:sarcasm:

"Spinning the possible possession of WMDs as a threat to the United States in the way they did is, in my opinion, tantamount to intentionally deceiving the American people." (488)

This sounds like a man that wishes to testify for prosecution of WAR CRIMES, just a hunch..

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

28. K & R

[louis-t]

31. Still blaming "bad intel". It was mis-interpretation of intel

by neo-cons that wanted a war.

[Quantess]

32. OH MY GOD!!! REALLY???

/sarcasm

[Renew Deal]

33. Shelton is given a lot of the blame in one of Ricks books.

Looks like Shelton is doing some blame shifting.

[indimuse]

35. KNR! n/t

[indimuse]

36. KNR! n/t

[creon]

38. First lie

Lie number one:

Iraq had WMD.