Libyan woman (pleas for reporters to help her & is) dragged from press by Gaddafi forces (Pic Heavy)

[Turborama]

Source: Telegraph (UK)

2:12PM GMT 26 Mar 2011

A distressed Libyan woman made a desperate plea for help on Saturday, slipping into a Tripoli hotel full of foreign journalists to show bruises and scars she said had been inflicted on her by Muammar Gaddafi's militiamen.

The woman, Iman al-Obeidi, said forces loyal to Moammar Gadhafi detained her at a checkpoint in the Libyan capital and raped her.

As reporters gathered to hear her story, security guards grabbed the woman and attempted to hood her before bundling her into a car and driving her away.

The plain-clothed government minders then shoved back and fought with reporters who tried to intervene and film the incident.

Read more: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8408506/Libyan-woman-dragged-from-press-by-Gaddafi-forces.html

---

(Distressing video at the link above)



AP - Iman Al-Obeidi, who said she spent two days in detention after being arrested at a checkpoint in Tripoli, Libya, and sexually assaulted by up to 15 men while in custody shouts to tell her story at the Rixos hotel in Tripoli Saturday March 26, 2011, after storming into the hotel's breakfast room to show her wounds to foreign media.

From: http://fr.news.yahoo.com/3/20110326/img/pwl-correction-libya-2942c9-241961499578.html







A Ministry of Information official, left, yells at the press to stop filming as he grabs Iman Al-Obeidi, who said she spent two days in detention after being arrested at a checkpoint in Tripoli, Libya, and was sexually assaulted by up to 15 men while in custody, in Tripoli Saturday March 26, 2011, after storming into the hotel's breakfast room to show her wounds to foreign media. A scuffle between hotel employees, information ministry officials and plain clothed police trying to grab her and stop the press for filming on one side and foreign media representatives followed. Two cameras were smashed on the ground and at least one reporter was beaten and kicked. Al-Obeidi was later taken in a car to an undisclosed location. Left and top right are unidentified foreign journalists . (AP Photo/Jerome Delay) ---(The blonde female reporter she was talking to is Lisa Holland from Sky News. Info. from me, Turborama)----

Libyan claims rape by soldiers, is dragged away

(AP) – 3 hours ago

TRIPOLI, Libya (AP) — A distraught Libyan woman stormed into a Tripoli hotel Saturday to tell foreign reporters that government troops raped her, setting off a brawl when hotel staff and government minders tried to detained her.

Iman al-Obeidi was tackled by waitresses and government minders as she sat telling her story to journalists after she rushed into the restaurant at the Rixos hotel where a number of foreign journalists were eating breakfast.

She claimed loudly that troops had detained her a checkpoint, tied her up, abused her, then led her away to be gang raped.

Her story could not be independently verified, but the dramatic scene provided a rare firsthand glimpse of the brutal crackdown on public dissent by Moammar Gadhafi's regime as the Libyan leader fights a rebellion against his rule that began last month.

Full article: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hduedcrUBz4h0cWjB_ixFB4EDJoA?docId=dd3121da9c4640509745c4c689a29c30

I've seen a video of this on Sky News and some old guy keeps trying to force his hand over her mouth. Chilling.

[brooklynite]

1. Probably just western propaganda...

...it's really only about the oil.

[Beacool]

16. Are you for real???????????

Yeah, the woman risked her life talking to the reporters because it was all a set up by the evil Westerners.

What has happened to countless women during these revolutions in the ME? Many, far too many, have been victims of beatings and gang rapes.

But, please, let that not disturb you and stay on your high horse.

Forget it, I'm going to the gym to relieve stress. Sometimes this place makes me ill.

x(

[joshcryer]

21. I think it was sarcasm but I appreciate your post.

:hug:

[Beacool]

58. Yeah, I seemed to have jumped the gun.

It's just that sometimes people write such outrageous things that I'm not sure anymore who is joking and who is serious.

Oh my, as I'm typing this, CNN is showing the video. The announcer is saying that they threw reporters to the ground, including CNN's cameraman and his camera. In the kitchen they pulled a knife on the woman and called her a traitor. They continued to remove the woman from the hotel and kept the reporters at bay. They were told that she was being taken to a hospital, she kept screaming that they were taking her to jail. Several countries are asking the Libyan government to produce the woman. I hope that she's still alive!!!

:(



:hug:

[brooklynite]

27. You missed my (sarcastic) point...

This was referring to the number of posts on DU that deny any legitimate purpose for being engaged in Libya and claim it's all to control the oil supply or part of a neo-con strategy to control the Middle East in general.

[Beacool]

57. Sorry, I read so much nonsense here that I thought you were being serious.

I apologize if I didn't realize you were being sarcastic.

:pals:

[dipsydoodle]

2. Sounds like Nurse Nayirah revisited

.

[ctsnowman]

5. Bingo.

I don't believe a damn thing the MSM puts out anymore.

[Turborama]

6. You should watch the video.

Reporters and what they report is heavily restricted from Tripoli. I'm amazed this made it out.

[Hannah Bell]

67. yeah, isn't it amazing? there are a number of amazing things about the story & the video.

[Turborama]

119. Wow, we agree on something.

I think that must be a first.

:kick:

[Name removed]

132. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Turborama]

7. Not funny. The woman claims she was raped by 15 men over 2 days.

She is clearly distraught and is physically assaulted during that video.

[dipsydoodle]

13. Wasn't meant to be funny

Just an analogy and maybe an accurate one.

[Turborama]

15. Well, I'm sure you have seen the same report I have on Sky News. Hence I am sure this is not fake

The Sky News video is even more chilling. You'd have seen that woman was not an actress and she really was traumatized/petrified and was desperate for help/to get her message out.

This is why I don't think your analogy works, if you really were being serious.

[dipsydoodle]

23. The propaganda from all sides

has reached a level that I simply don't pay credence to it any more

[joshcryer]

25. Nah, you have no evidence to support your view, but you chose the side of "she's a liar."

You see, the evidence that she was crying, clearly abused with scratches all over herself, and whisked away isn't evidence at all!

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dipsydoodle]

29. Do you try telling that

to the families of all who died innocently as a result of the original lie by the "nurse" aka the Kuwaiti Ambassador's daughter which tripped the first Iraq war which led to the second one. It is a fair analogy.

[joshcryer]

30. It's not fair because the "invasion" has already happend here. She had no reason to be a "witness"

...to her own atrocity, in fact, she would have been better off keeping her mouth shut, and she probably knew that, which is why she went to foreign reporters to tell of her ordeal.

This invasion is not predicated on this girls testimony, indeed, the continuation of this invasion is not predicated on this girls testimony, in fact, nothing this girl says has anything to do with the politics of the situation on the ground now.

No doubt the same atrocities are happing on both sides. Only this time we have evidence for it.

[Hannah Bell]

125. so how long is this intervention going to last, josh? i thought it was about to be wrapped up,

but it seems to be continuing.

[Poll_Blind]

12. Absolutely a possibility. If you haven't, the video is very much worth watching.

PB

[dipsydoodle]

14. Don't need to

Its on our home tv news here in the UK. In fairness to her she hasn't mentioned babies being turfed out of incubators - yet.

[marasinghe]

155. doubtful this lady would put herself in harm's way in the center of Tripoli, as a propaganda ploy.

She appears totally distraught; & there's the reporters' evidence.
Plus: there's independent conformation from hospital doctors & others,
of Libyan govt. sanctioned rape of women in rebel enclaves.

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2011/03/28-4

i believe you are being extremely unfair to this woman.

[joshcryer]

24. I don't recall Nayirah having to deal with a threat of disappearance for saying something.

:puke:

What kind of sick person would try to lie about being RAPED in a regime that would disappear her for saying so?

[highplainsdem]

138. +1,000,000,000. There's no real comparison to the fake "Nurse Nayirah" story,

which involved testimony to a Congressional caucus by someone who lied convincingly for several minutes, but was never in any sort of danger.

I realize people do have cognitive filters, and those who are so greatly opposed to this UN action that they would prefer not to believe the worst of Gaddafi might not only want to dismiss the video of that traumatized Libyan woman being dragged away from the Western reporters, but would automatically feel suspicion.

But there is absolutely no logic to arguing that this was staged. Unless you can somehow convince yourself that even the people dragging her away were actors and this was all beautifully planned and directed -- a "propaganda pageant" that would be almost impossible to pull off, as opposed to the fake "Nurse Nayirah" testimony from one person -- then you have an obviously traumatized woman who's now at great risk (and who may have been killed by now) after trying to tell her story to reporters. It doesn't make any sense to suggest she put herself at such risk for propaganda purposes.

And it takes a real stretch of the imagination, as well as failed logic, to compare her to "Nurse Nayirah."

[Very_Boring_Name]

31. You know, I took heat a few days back for saying there are pro-gaddafi posters on DU

But you're a perfect example. Woman with bruises and scratches on her face has a bag put over her head and is shoved into a car after she tells reporters she was raped by Gaddafi soldiers. Your first response? She must be lying.

[joshcryer]

34. Not "must," but rather, "might."

The continuation of the views here are that "more likely" but that would be the second or third response. ;)

Just nitpicking since I'm sure it would be nitpicked anyway.

[CrawlingChaos]

145. Yep, I'm wondering about this too

The scene was very, hmm...theatrical. While it's not possible to be completely certain, I think skepticism is understandable and appropriate.

[joshcryer]

159. What cements it for me is the response of the foreign press, and her very real injuries.

What we now know is that the Libyan government is admitting the woman was raped, and that two of the people involved in the affair have been fired, along with minders being told that journalists' affairs are not to be messed with. :shrug:

Certainly the Libyan government is siding with the people.

[Poll_Blind]

3. Horrible- everyone needs to see that video.Not our job to pay to overthrow their government, though.

Not when we have people who can't get a job or feed their family over here. Americans get to eat first on the American dime. Then we can give the rest away. We're broke and we borrow from the the biggest slave nation on Earth to pretend we aren't.

PB

[midnight]

4. I agree this is horrible... Read a story on D.U. yesterday about an 11

being sexually abused by many men in her community and they said it was this 11 year old fault.... We are not invading that country? Why? Because this rape happened in Texas... Anyways... Big abuse happening right here and I agree our dimes need to feed our American children before we engage in anymore Empire building...

[cali]

26. let me explain why your comparison is farcical

The 11 year old wasn't taken into custody by the authorities and then beaten and turned over to be raped. Now I'm against the Libyan action but still nonsense and idiotic comparisons bug the shit out of me.

[dkf]

8. She was tackled by the waitresses? How weird is that?

[Turborama]

9. Hands from hotel employees trying to grab her (pic)

I wouldn't be surprised if the 'staff' in that hotel who deal with foreign reporters are specially trained members of Gaddafi's secret police.

[Poll_Blind]

10. Not, actually, that weird. In repressive countries it's not uncommon for hotels or...

...other places frequented by foreigners to be partly staffed with employees who also work for the intelligence services for that country. And the waitress didn't just tackle her, she appeared to throw a hood over her head and shoulders, kidnap style. Specifically, examine seconds 37-42 in the video.

Not behavior one often sees in hospitality help in the West, don't you agree?

PB

[CJvR]

49. Not particulary.

In a place like Libya the goverment have agents everywhere, particulary around foreigners.

[Faygo Kid]

11. I hope she's still alive.

I fear this won't end well for her.

[elocs]

17. It's too bad she lives in a country with oil. Otherwise we would be morally obligated to help her

and the other rebels who would be slaughtered by Gadhafi.

[Turborama]

18. Sky News: 1st hand account by Lisa Holland (Article & Video)

3:17pm UK, Saturday March 26, 2011
Lisa Holland, foreign affairs correspondent

A shocking scene occurred in Tripoli on Saturday when a gun was pointed at Sky News after a woman tried to tell foreign journalists about being raped and tortured by Libyan officials.

A visibly very distressed woman burst into the breakfast room of the hotel where we are staying and attempted to speak out about an ordeal at the hands of Gaddafi supporters.

As correspondents here in Tripoli under the supervision of the Libyan government, we are not allowed to move around freely. However, it has become apparent to those in the city that there are a clutch of journalists in two hotels.

We were having breakfast in our hotel when the woman broke in and said she'd been picked up at a checkpoint in the city.

Full account and video: http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Sky-News-Sees-A-Woman-Bundled-Away-By-Minders-From-Tripoli-Hotel-After-Allegedly-Being-Raped/Article/201103415960663?lpos=World_News_Carousel_Region_1&lid=ARTICLE_15960663_Sky_News_Sees_A_Woman_Bundled_Away_By_Minders_From_Tripoli_Hotel_After_Allegedly_Being_Raped

[rug]

19. What was she arrested for?

[Zephie]

20. Not keeping quiet.

[joshcryer]

28. Speaking to reporters about her ordeal rather than Gaddafi forces who would've just raped her more.

And yes, that would have been the likely outcome if she went to the police over the matter. "Girl from Benghazi got raped, what should we do about it?" *unzip*

[rug]

32. The report says she was originally arested at a checkpoint in Tripoli. Anybody know for what?

[joshcryer]

33. She said she was from Benghazi, that is enough to stop her and detain her over.

And in war time, with a lot of war sentiment, I have no doubt that she was raped. Maybe the details are not exact, it might have been 14 men, but I don't care, the woman isn't fucking lying.

[rug]

36. Where does it say she announced at the checkpoint that she was from Benghazi?

I don't know if anyone is lying but I'm skeptical of propaganda on any side when people are being killed.

[joshcryer]

38. I responded as you wrote, see my 'note' below.

I was explaining how these things work. I can look for travel restriction guidelines, but I highly doubt it's different than say Cuba.

[joshcryer]

37. Note: very few autocratic countries allow people to travel freely within the borders.

Even some democratic countries (such as South Korea) require you to report where you are from and how long you plan to stay. This is not uncommon in the developing world. So she likely had to show her ID, it showed she was from Benghazi, she had no 'pass' to travel and was detained.

[greensleeve]

40. She is a member of the Obeidat tribe

and a relative of one of Gaddafi’s generals who defected to the rebels

[rug]

41. Interesting. Any more info or a link?

[joshcryer]

42. Thanks for porting that out, I wasn't aware of that until it was posted in the Revolution thread.

That also is reason to detain someone in these stressful times.

[Turborama]

43. How do you know? Have you got a link?

Welcome back to DU, BTW.

[joshcryer]

44. Posted on twitter by libyan4life. I cannot find any info about that tribe, maybe a diff. spelling...

...is in order.

[dipsydoodle]

59. Obeidat Tribe Causes Rifts in the Security Forces

The tribe of `Obeidat put pressure on its sons to quit the security forces loyal to the regime. Moreover, some reports emerged suggesting that Gen `Abdul-Fattah Younes Al-`Abidi, the Interior Minister, had broken away from Gaddafi following pressure by his tribe, `Obeidat, one of the biggest in Libya. In addition, it was reported that Gen Suleiman Mahmoud Al-`Obeidi had done the same, also after pressure by his tribe and a promise to forget all what he had done since September 1969 coup. As a partial result of the above, rifts grew within the ranks of the forces loyal to `Abdul-Salam Jaloud and they ultimately disintegrated.

http://www.onislam.net/english/culture-and-entertainment/media/451304-will-libyan-tribes-decide-qaddafi-fate.html

It doesn't follow that any tribes now anti Gaddafi are necessarily pro opposition other than maybe as a current convenience. When they finally get democratic elections almost any outcome is possible.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

35. "in the commotion a gun was pointed towards the Sky News team in an attempt to stop them filming"

That's one disturbing video. :(

[Turborama]

39. The Sky News report is now in the Videos Forum

Here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x567036

[ronnie624]

45. Well then,

obviously, our government is morally obligated to continue its aggression in Asia.

Bombs away!

[Turborama]

46. Asia?

Are you talking about Libya or Afghanistan?

[ronnie624]

47. I know Libya is in Africa,

but our government's focus is on the Middle East and other areas of Asia that are rich in resources.

[Lars77]

48. If people still don´t understand the difference between this and Afghanistan

They need to stop watching RT, take off their tinfoil hat, and go outside into the real world.

[ronnie624]

65. I keep up with current events and learn about US foreign policy via the internet.

Among other things, I've learned that the U.S. military has never been deployed for altruistic reasons.

My "real world" consists of working 60 hours a week and caring for an elderly mother, so there's no time left for "RT" or "tinfoil hats".

[chatnoir]

50. Distressing that there didn't seem to be much intervention

on the part of the foreign journalists. Unless there were only a few present...?

[joshcryer]

51. See post #35

And yes they did interfere, the other video shows the guy in the glasses getting tackled to the ground. He was forcefully trying to stop them from taking her and was taken away.

[chatnoir]

54. Thanks for pointing out the other video

I had only watched the vid from Sky News in post 39.

It still seemed like there was only the one in the checkered shirt trying to physically intervene. Just from what I could see in that clip there were others across the table sitting there and seemingly doing little but maybe it all happened so fast...

[Turborama]

55. Actually, the latest Sky News report is longer than that one & at the beginning you can hear and see

...male reporters trying to fend them off. They are shouting "GO AWAY, LEAVE HER ALONE" and trying to protect her.

I'll add the longer clip if/when it gets uploaded.

[joshcryer]

60. I cannot imagine many western males who would not react that way instinctivly.

The idea that a women would be questioned and violently taken away over a rape charge is highly unusual to us (though likely no big deal there, particularly since they didn't allow foreign media for decades). I'm just glad the guy appears to be OK, otherwise we'd hear some news reports about his detention and arrest for interfering in state business.

[Turborama]

61. The NYT managed to get a photo out showing one of the guys who was doing what I described...

[Hannah Bell]

112. what is he supposedly doing? he looks like he's saying, "here, here,

none of that, now, peaceful, peaceful..."

[Turborama]

143. Watch the videos. Why are you insisting on mocking their reactions? Is that all you've got left

After failing to back up you assertion that "something about this is fake"?

Floundering for something to latch onto and resorting to insulting the reporters for not reacting as forcefully as you'd like them to when they are surrounded by armed men in a country where reporters are disappearing.

Pathetic.

[Hannah Bell]

105. why wouldn't they "instinctively" cordon her off with their bodies &

tell the thugs to back off?

instead of ineffectual little protests of "oh here now, you can't do that"?

will the thugs assassinate the entire foreign press in their hotel?

and in fact, it's not the case that all foreign press were excluded from libya until recently. it seems to have varied on a country-by-country basis per this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Libya.

[Turborama]

109. They did, but a gun was pulled on them by one of the thugs & a "waitress" pulled a knife

I've already posted them donwthread but for your convenience...

http://edition.cnn.com/video/#/video/world/2011/03/26/nr.libya.woman.assault.cnn?iref=allsearch

&

http://edition.cnn.com/video/#/video/world/2011/03/26/robertson.libya.woman.cnn?hpt=C2

[Hannah Bell]

111. a gun & a knife, oh my. this was after the brave foreign correspondents

cordoned the woman off with their bodies, you say?

[Turborama]

114. Yes. n/t

[Hannah Bell]

118. i missed the cordon. can you point me to that footage?

[Turborama]

124. At the very begnning of Nic Robertson's video report downthread (& a participant's report 1:44 in)

[Hannah Bell]

127. i'm sorry, could you give me a post number? i;m not seeing nic in the headers.

[Turborama]

129. Look harder. It's at the bottom.

I've helped you enough.

[Hannah Bell]

133. thanks, found it. i see a cordon of about 5 men with their backs to the camera

huddled around something, but it doesn't seem to be her.

i think it's cnn's camera.

maybe i'm missing what you saw.

[Turborama]

137. Watch it again, carefully. The camera zooms in from over their shoulders and you can see her.

From 7 to 11 seconds in.

[Turborama]

142. Oh, I've noticed that I'd posted it just above in post #109, but you must have simply ignored it

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4789481

[Turborama]

139. Here's that video of the longer Sky News report I mentioned

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SHS22d6EPc

[polly7]

52. OMG

watching that, I felt like someone just punched me in the gut. What are the chances Amnesty or another human rights watch can locate and fight for this woman?

[Maine-ah]

56. I bet you bucks

that's the last time anyone is going to see that woman.

[pinboy3niner]

53. K&R

http://i948.photobucket.com/albums/ad321/pinboy3niner/LibyaUprising.jp

[Turborama]

62. NYT: Libyan Woman Struggles to Tell Media of Her Rape

By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK
Published: March 26, 2011

TRIPOLI, Libya — A Libyan woman burst into the hotel housing the foreign press in Tripoli on Saturday morning in an attempt to tell journalists that she had been raped and beaten by members of Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi’s militia. After struggling for nearly an hour to resist removal by Colonel Qaddafi’s security forces, she was dragged away from the hotel screaming.

“They say that we are all Libyans and we are one people,” said the woman, who gave her name as Eman al-Obeidy, barging in during breakfast at the hotel dining room. “But look at what the Qaddafi men did to me.” She displayed a broad bruise on her face, a large scar on her upper thigh, several narrow and deep scratch marks lower on her leg, and marks from binding around her hands and feet.

She said she had been raped by 15 men. “I was tied up, and they defecated and urinated on me,” she said. “They violated my honor.”

She pleaded for friends she said were still in custody. “They are still there, they are still there,” she said. “As soon as I leave here, they are going to take me to jail.”

Full article: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/27/world/middleeast/27tripoli.html?_r=1

[joshcryer]

63. Thanks Turbo, was looking for the NYT article that was mentioned but forgot about looking.

[midnight]

64. America's own example of human rights is compromised.

[Hannah Bell]

66. I'll say it. I think something about this is fake. Just my opinion.

go head, revile me. i don't care.

[joshcryer]

68. Which part?

Certainly she could be faking about being raped.

But I don't think the guards forcefully trying to remove her, putting a bag over her head, tackling reporters was staged at all.

I would indeed be shocked to learn that Gaddafi's people staged that.

[muriel_volestrangler]

69. What, faked by whom?

If you believe the people who took her away are Gaddafi's people (which surely they are, in Tripoli), then I don't see how it can be 'fake'. The incident makes Gaddafi's police look like thugs in front of the world media, so they wouldn't have staged it; it is possible that the woman hadn't actually been raped, but, if so, then she's just put herself in danger of being tortured or killed by Gaddafi's forces for the sake of a news story. Which seems pretty unlikely; it might be a suicide bomber mentality, but I'd say it's probably harder to do something knowing you're likely to be tortured afterwards than to kill yourself immediately.

If you do think she made it up just for the publicity, then it makes it rather like the people who set themselves on fire to make their political point - a horrible way to go, but one which is often seen as a selfless gesture for their cause. Is that how you see this?

[Hannah Bell]

74. funny that the thugs didn't confisticate the reporters' cameras & recording

devices instead.

if their aim was to prevent the story from getting out that is.

[Turborama]

76. They did. In fact they destroyed CNN's camera. See the article and videos I've just posted

There's nothing funny about this.

[Hannah Bell]

79. there must have been a few more cameras there, then.

i;m not laughing, dude.

[joshcryer]

82. Doesn't change the fact that they tried it.

:hi:

[Hannah Bell]

84. the terrible thugs "tried"? oh my.

[joshcryer]

88. Yeah, they're going to shut down the whole hotel to make sure the video doesn't leak.

:rofl:

They saw a camera, and decided it needed to be taken away. Some other cameras were not seen by the same individuals and were allowed to discreetly leave. What's the controversy? You initially claimed they never even tried it (hilarious uninformed position, that was).

[Hannah Bell]

99. but they couldn't see the other ones, or the woman as she "slipped" into

the hotel reserved for the foreign press, & then into the press conference room itself. not until she sat there for half an hour spilling her guts.

bad thugs! bad blind thugs!

to change the subject, the foreign press are kind of wimpy, aren't they?

i thought war correspondents were more rugged types. they act like frat boys at a tea.

"oh, where are you taking her! oh, no, you mustn't!"

i wonder if they ever get out of that hotel.

[joshcryer]

100. Yep, idiots.

Should've disappeared her rather than releasing her after being raped.

[Hannah Bell]

102. yes, 15 men for two days. why didn't they kill her? she's obviously upper class, as well.

lots of questions.

[joshcryer]

108. She was held for two days, not raped for two days. Fail.

[Hannah Bell]

113. only going by what i saw upthread. i saw it at du, it must be true.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4788098&mesg_id=4788121

[Turborama]

90. There were. The article I posted comes with a video where reporter tells of how he handed a cell ...

...phone to someone he trusted.

I suggest you watch that video, it's in post #75: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4788098&mesg_id=4788894

ETA I've found a direct link: http://edition.cnn.com/video/#/video/world/2011/03/26/nr.libya.woman.assault.cnn?iref=allsearch

You'll see how physical they got with the reporters who were trying to smuggle out their footage.

Your struggle to find some sort of conspiracy behind this has failed.

[joshcryer]

78. I believe you're misinformed.

There was BBC, Sky News, and CNN. In the chaos one of their videos got out. It's not very surprising. They obviously didn't want to risk getting flamed for taking all the cameras, as some cameras weren't at the scene.

CNN's footage appears to be cell phone footage.

[Hannah Bell]

81. it didn't look very chaotic to me. and it's my impression that more than *one* got out.

[joshcryer]

83. I've only seen one high def feed, the other looks like a cell phone.

We know that the CNN footage was taken.

[Hannah Bell]

85. not very efficient thugs, are they?

my goodness, you'd think they'd wait to grab her at home or something, not in full view of the foreign press during a press conference, after she'd been there for 40 minutes or so.

[joshcryer]

86. Not very thoughtful, sure, no one claimed they were smart. The woman was smart.

[Hannah Bell]

87. stupid thugs. they just don't think these things through.

unlike the clever woman who slipped through their surveillance at the luxury hotel housing the foreign press in tripoli, and then into the foreign press conference itself without a press badge.

clever, clever woman.

[joshcryer]

89. Yeah, idiots tried taking a camera when there were several around, pretty retarded.

Take one camera you gotta take 'em all.

[Hannah Bell]

91. yep, really dumb. i guess that's how khaddafi held onto power so long,

because of the stupid people working for him.

the stupid people he has monitoring the foreign press.

[joshcryer]

93. That's why he didn't allow foreign reporters for decades.

Can't have free info flow, has to be tightly controlled.

[Hannah Bell]

94. right, but now that he's at war, well, let them in. i wonder that he hasn't

thrown them out of tripoli.

since he is such a thuggish monster.

that's a pretty nice hotel.

reportedly.

[joshcryer]

95. He needs an arm for his propaganda machine. "Civilians being slaughtered" etc.

They are called "minders" for a reason. The US doesn't have anything like "minders."

[Hannah Bell]

97. what? cnn is an arm for khaddafis propaganda machine?

no minders in the us?

what are you talking about?

[joshcryer]

101. Ahh, uninformed opinions really don't matter to me.

Especially when they show no signs of becoming informed.

[Hannah Bell]

103. you;re the one who said cnn is in tripoli because khaddafi needs someone to

spread propaganda for him. just saying.

[joshcryer]

106. Amanpour most certainly wasn't going to actually get in the line of fire we know that much.

[Turborama]

104. Their constant kicking of the thread and helping to expose the brutality is appreciated though n/t

[joshcryer]

107. Only reason I don't mind responsing to the babble.

[Turborama]

110. Likewise. n/t

[Hannah Bell]

123. another question i have is about those women in the white headgear.

is that a typical waitress costume in libya? typical female garb?

it doesn't look like any pictures of libyan women i've seen before, not that i've seen many.

do you guys know the answer since you are experts?

[Hannah Bell]

116. babble like khaddafi excluded all foreign press until recently & the people

who mind the foreign press for dictators are complete idiots?

that kind of babble?

[joshcryer]

121. Wow, more than one sentence. Good job.

The junior Gaddafi said Libya intends to provide Western journalists on Friday access to Tripoli, the capital, and other cities, so they can corroborate the government's claim that the country remains under Gaddafi's control.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/gaddafis-son-denies-crackdown-loyalists-reportedly-shoot-opponents-in-streets/2011/02/23/ABCkcZQ_story.html

Anmanpour did a heroic job at that.

And yes, the minders are idiots, they should've let the woman be interviewed, then had her escorted to a police station to make a statement about her case.

Right now they're treating it as a rape case, as well they should, but they fucking blew it by being totalitarian propagandists.

[wordpix]

153. it looked chaotic to me and the woman looked TRUE-ly distraught

I understand the skepticism around here but this event did not look staged.

[muriel_volestrangler]

120. So, you are claiming that all those people are anti-Gaddafi Libyans, who infiltrated the hotel?

It was breakfast, despite your claims of 'a press conference' (that's why they're at a table with place settings, and there are waiters standing around).

To back your claim of 'fake', with your 'evidence' being that not all cameras were confiscated, you must be claiming that, in the middle of Tripoli, at the hotel where foreign correspondents are staying, 20 or more rebels managed to get in, pretend to be waiters, journalist minders and policemen, and stage a fake arrest - and then give the later answers from the police about whether she was 'sane' or 'insane'. Shit, if the rebels have that amount of control over Tripoli already, Gaddafi doesn't stand a chance.

I'm, not 'reviling' you; I'm laughing at you, by now. Your claims on this subject belong in the Sept 11 forum.

[joshcryer]

122. Nah, she just doesn't think it's thuggish to violently push people around and smash their cameras.

All the while trying to silence a lying woman about her false rape claims.

[Hannah Bell]

126. i'm not claiming anything. just asking questions. got a problem with that?

you certainly are reviling me, but i'm used to it. that's what happens when people color outside the lines.

[muriel_volestrangler]

128. No, you made a claim: "I think something about this is fake. Just my opinion"

So, tell us why you think something is fake. Don't pretend "I'm only asking questions". Back up your opinion. And stop trying to be such a bloody martyr. I am going to revile you on this subject, from now on. This has advanced from just sloppy thinking on your part, to a refusal to face facts, back up your opinion, or engage with DUers in a reasonable fashion.

[Hannah Bell]

130. i do think something about it is fake. i didn't say i'd pinned down what.

which is why i'm asking questions.

it is *because* i offered it clearly as an opinion only, without any strong argument as to why, that i am here asking questions, dear muriel.

there are some things that seem odd to me. so i am asking all these people who are oh so sure about everything hoping that their answers will lead to revelation.

no revelations have yet ensued & i must prepare for the coming day.

i will check bact at another time.

[muriel_volestrangler]

134. We tried 'answering you questions'

We've pointed out that this happens in Tripoli, where the police are on Gaddafi's side. The woman was clearly taken away by the police. Your one "I think this makes it fake" claim that I can see is "not all the footage was confiscated". So you think Gaddafi's side wanted this story to be shown after all, then.

You don't even have aweak argument. Just a kneejerk "this is fake in some way" response, with no effort on your part to respond to what people say. Just misinformation like 'a press conference' - yes, that was your claim. Completely wrong, of course, but you repeated it.

[Hannah Bell]

135. muriel, it's only your assumption that everyone on the hotel staff had

to be in on it (shows a lack of imagination on your part, i think) or that i think khaddafi's staff wanted the footage to be shown.

perhaps i mistook the report of the press conference *following* for whatever was going on before with all the cameras. so the journalists were all hanging out in the lobby or something with their cameras, is that it?

just asking some questions here, muriel.

[Name removed]

136. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hannah Bell]

147. i watched one of the videos & something rang false to me.

you can speculate on my motives all you like; doesn't mean you know shit about them.

[Turborama]

148. No need for speculation

Your M.O. is all here in black and white.

Written by you.

For everyone to see for themselves.

[Hannah Bell]

149. something is here, but not my motivations. believe what you like; your opinion

doesn't concern me. i could speculate about your motivations for promoting the shabby intervention in libya as well.

but i won't.

[Turborama]

150. One of the things I like about you is that you always have to have the last word

Which means lots of assistance in keeping OPs like this at the top.

Thanks.

[Name removed]

151. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Turborama]

152. I haven't speculated about your motivations. I have stated a fact that your M.O. is all here

...for everyone to see.

Modus Operandi, look it up.

I don't know if you read it but I said there's no need to speculate, you've made it obvious.

The latest evidence is that you say Gaddafi is 'terrible' in a sarcastic way. That implies that you think he's an OK kind of guy. Correct?

"Reportedly" with his regime doesn't mean shit. I'll only believe it when I see footage of her being interviewed. Until then I'll still be worried about her and her sister's well being.

Your continuous struggle to find the "something fake" has drastically failed and now the hypocrisy of you speculating about my motivations is taking you beyond fail.

To quote what you yourself just said.

"you can speculate on my motives all you like; doesn't mean you know shit about them."

[jzodda]

70. The video is disturbing enough on its own..Your reaction is just as disturbing

because if that was acting it was academy award level.

[Hannah Bell]

73. you think so?

[dipsydoodle]

77. Oh you reviled person you

:rofl:

:hug:

[joshcryer]

80. I agree, I think we've been quite civilized.

I believe your responses were met with more 'revile' because of the sentiment being overtly expressed. Easy to avoid that by posting uninformed quips.

[Hannah Bell]

92. ive been abused and ive been scorned

[dipsydoodle]

96. But not

shunned.:)

Howlin' Wolf - I've Been Abused : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7W10Eip67u4

[Hannah Bell]

98. winner! for our grand prize today, two tickets to the war zone of your choice.

[Turborama]

71. CNN International: Nic Robertson's report on this very disturbing incident (VIDEO)

Here: http://edition.cnn.com/video/#/video/world/2011/03/26/robertson.libya.woman.cnn?hpt=C2

[joshcryer]

72. These journalists are heros for how they acted.

One can bash the MSM all they want (and I might be right there bashing, for their faux news stories) but the reporters are real people and in tough situations they behaved as any sensible person who seeks the truth would.

[Turborama]

75. CNN International:Libyan woman bursts into hotel to tell her story of rape (article & longer video)

By the CNN Wire Staff
March 27, 2011 -- Updated 03:49 GMT (11:49 HKT)

=snip=

Government officials quickly closed in to stifle her. But she persisted, wanting the journalists, staying at the Rixos Hotel, to see Gadhafi's brutality firsthand.

International journalists, including CNN's staff, are not allowed to move freely in the Libyan capital and are escorted out of the hotel only on organized outings by government minders. This was the first time a Libyan opposed to Gadhafi attempted to independently approach the journalists here.

What followed was a disturbing scene of how Gadhafi's government operates.

Security forces moved to subdue the woman. Even a member of the hotel's kitchen staff drew a knife. "Traitor!" he shouted at her in contempt. Another staffer tried to put a dark tablecloth over her head.

One government official, who was there to facilitate access for journalists, pulled a pistol from his belt. Others scuffled with the journalists, manhandling them to the ground in an attempt to wrestle away their equipment. Some journalists were beaten and kicked. CNN's camera was confiscated and deliberately smashed beyond repair.

Full article (the longer video is on the left, halfway down): http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/03/26/libya.beaten.woman/index.html?hpt=T2

Found a link to the clip which shows the scuffle with the reporters and Don Lemon interviewing the LA Times' reporter Borzou Darahagi who witnessed the events unfold: http://edition.cnn.com/video/#/video/world/2011/03/26/nr.libya.woman.assault.cnn?iref=allsearch

[Turborama]

115. Al Jazeera English on this (Video)

I have to mention that Anita McNaught wasn't there and, at the time of making this report, can't have seen the footage of the "waitress" trying to put a bag over Iman al-Obeidi's head: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c44Exz46Ymw

[joshcryer]

117. Yep, officials are treating it as a rape case (as well they should), but I wouldn't be surprised...

...if they trotted out some black Africans as the culprits and did a live execution of them.

[marasinghe]

156. background info.

from Al Jazeera blogs, via Common Dreams:

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2011/03/28-4

[joshcryer]

131. Libyan State TV's view:

http://egyptday1.blogspot.com/2011/03/libyans-state-tvs-translated-response.html

I know what some posters in this thread will believe.

[joshcryer]

140. Libyan government is calling her a prostitute now, womans mother said she was bribed to change story

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/libyan-woman-offers-glimpse-into-workings-of-gaddafi-government/2011/03/26/AFNppLkB_story.html

[Turborama]

141. Interesting & disturbing, thanks. Well, apparently 5 men have been arrested...

Latest: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4789481

[Turborama]

144. Nic Robertson calls it a "total character assassination"...

[pam4water]

146. Some footage of her was just on CNN.

[cosmicone]

154. Doesn't pass the smell test.

She appears too well dressed to have been raped by 15 men over 2 days. Did the Gadddafi men allow her to get fully dressed (including the scarf) before she escaped?

How was she able to enter the hotel for foreign press and talk for a half hour?


The Western Press, hungry for some story after a news famine didn't check the background. Was she seen entering the hotel on the hotel's surveillance cameras? Did she walk/run to the hotel or was driven there?

Updated for correcting a typo.

[bobbolink]

157. Thank you for declaring yourself. YOu go immediately to the ignore list.

I don't tolerate those who either say "she wasn't really raped" or "she asked for it".

SHAME!

[joshcryer]

158. She didn't "escape" she was released. Do you think they'd release her naked?

It wasn't a "hotel for foreign press" and she met them at the breakfast table. Really simple stuff.

[Turborama]

160. Her lengthy interview with Anderson Cooper from last night...

Posted in the videos forum: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x570188