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Timefortruth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:51 PM
Original message
CNN: Bush 51 Kerry 46!
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slinkerwink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:52 PM
Response to Original message
1. WTF?!?!?!
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keithyboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
36. It's official: WE hate our freedoms!
We hate our democracy, our liberty, our justice, our way of life.
That's what this poll says to me.
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Kadie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:55 PM
Response to Original message
2. HUH?
OK, something is wrong here! :wtf:
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LynzM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:55 PM
Response to Original message
3. Dude!
What the *&#$^????

I thought people were starting to pay attention to all the CRAP that BushCo is getting away with....

Hopefully this poll is just as inaccurate as most? *crosses fingers*

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shockingelk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #3
33. within MOE ...
The change is within the margin of error, so it can be "wrong" and atr the same time not inaccurate ... plus one has to consider that the Bush campaign has been burning money and putting on a constant full court media blitz just not to loose ground. They can't swim against the current forever.
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KissMyAsscroft Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
4. Polls are pointless...


it always fluctuates wildly...its way too early to freak about this.

It's going to be close, though.
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Direckshun Donating Member (303 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
69. ...
KissMyAsscroft is right.

It's too early. Let's start freaking out when the more accurate polls come out in the fall.
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TheDonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
5. haha, it's bullshit. Even if it were correct, a 5 point lead for a "war"
time president has got to hurt. Kerry has yet to pick his VP and let out an advertising explosion
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curlyred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
6. isn't that the only poll in the whole list where Bush is ahead?
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DaveSZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. All other polls have Kerry ahead
This proves that CNN has sold out.
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OilemFirchen Donating Member (535 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
7. Gallup has been a puggie poll since Nixon
By contrast, look at the Zogby poll directly following. Bush 44, Kerry 47. Much more reliable.

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fearnobush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #7
86. Zogby is perhaps the most reliable. The Media whore polls
are done on the cheap. CNN poll also samples 40% Repuke, 34%Dem. Also. 2 days before the 2000 election Zogby was the only poll that had Gore ahead by 1 to 3pts. The rest had Chimp at 3 to 5pts up. Gore won 51% of the vote. Zogby wins. (So did Chimp, go figure?)
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ronatchig Donating Member (350 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
8. I just hope
these clowns actually believe this. One wonders if they have been at the GOP Kool Aid or if they are so myopic as to not realize the facts as they really are in America..
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davhill Donating Member (854 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:57 PM
Response to Original message
9. It strains my credibility
I live in a very strongly Republican area and I don't get a sense of anywhere near that spread. It must be that Bush supporters are keeping their opinions to themselves except when polled.
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liarliartieonfire Donating Member (448 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. Bush's support is more like 35%
in the REAL world, that is.

I really think he's barely at 40.
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Indiana_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
10. this situation seems to reflect my life as a whole lately!! n/t
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enki23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
12. bush has a $106 million money advantage
Edited on Mon Apr-19-04 04:01 PM by enki23
can't remember the exact numbers, except that it's between 30 and 50-something times as much money as kerry. anything short of a collosal fuckup of truly, TRULY gargantuan proportions, it's in the bag. even then (considering the iraq war is just a few hairsbreadths from truly gargantuan) it's still probably in the bag.
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soleft Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:58 PM
Original message
Pundits will explain this as being a post press conferenc bump
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Yavin4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
13. Didn't Know Diebold Also Did Polling
Boy, that company sure does get around.

Seriously, after all that has come out, if Bush wins, this country is beyond help. I'm moving to Vancouver.
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Poiuyt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
14. CNN/Gallop polls
CNN/Gallop polls usually show bush ahead nationwide. Most of the other polls show Kerry leading.

On the other hand, the state by state surveys show bush leading the Electoral College race.
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lancdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #14
75. I think they're basically tied electorally
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alittlelark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:59 PM
Original message
So long as they fake high #'s for *
They stand a chance of using BBV to steal the office again.
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displacedtexan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
15. 3 Magic Words: Margin of Error
In this case, the MOE is +/- 4.
The reality of the poll could be Bush 47/ Kerry 50.

Gallup is just doing its part as a wholly owned subsidiary of the BFEE.
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #15
74. THANK YOU!!!
We need to learn how to read these polls. Look for the margin of error. Add and subtract the margin of error from each result. You will see that the race is still a dead heat, and this is assuming that the polls are capturing representative samples (which I doubt).

The media spins it pro-Bush. One reason for this is that Bush is president and Bush's campaign has a lot more money to spend on ads.

No station wants to annoy BushCo right now. They want those advertising dollars. They want access to press interviews.

Don't let these polls discourage you!
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Tempest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:00 PM
Response to Original message
16. Gallup is way off from all the other polls
Zogby International Poll

Kerry: 47%
Bush: 44%


InsiderAdvantage/Creators Syndicate poll

Kerry: 43%
Bush: 37%


Newsweek Poll

Kerry: 46%
Bush: 42%


American Research Group Poll

Kerry: 50%
Bush: 44%

etc.

Even Faux has Kerry beating Bush.

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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:00 PM
Response to Original message
18. CNN polls - Bad: Rasmussen 45(B) - 46(K)

CNN polls are notoriously unreliable, and I've seen speculation that they manipulate results to work ratings. I don't even like them when they go the way I want them to go because I always think there's a "story idea" behind it.

Their sampling group size and the margin of error are enough to completely reverse these results within five minutes.

Rasmussen has a different take

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/Presidential_Tracking_Poll.htm
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nolabels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #18
71. Is what is scary is how uninformed most of the people living in the US are
Met some guy scared out of his wits after he had been listening to AIR AMERICA and what *co was doing. I asked him if had a computer and got online to check out any political sites. A BIG no is what I got, he didn't even have a computer. We are working on a disadvantaged curve here, so it really is amazing in that any of the the numbers look like this.

The Corporate interests have a very acute need to have things go their way this time around and are pulling out the stops were ever possible. If you lived in California during the installation of the Arnie as Gropenator Govenator. You might know about this.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/War%20on%20Terror_April%20Press%20Conference%202.htm
(snip)
58% Say U.S. Will Succeed in Iraq

46% Say U.S. Safer Since 9/11

Is U.S. Safer than before 9/11?
Yes 46%
No 39%
Not Sure 15%
RasmussenReports.com

Best Strategy for War on Terror
Fight Back Aggressively 44%
Work for International Solution 48%
RasmussenReports.com

Election 2004


April 18, 2004--President Bush's Press Conference had a modestly positive impact on public perceptions in Iraq.

On the two nights following the Press Conference, 46% say the U.S. is safer today than it was before 9/11. Just 39% disagree. Those figures represent a net improvement of eight points compared to data collected before the Press Conference. At that time, just 41% said the U.S. was safer and 42% said it was not.
(snip)

I guess we might be living in parallel universes, I listened to two or three minutes on the radio, hearing the fool and never came to that conclusion of being safer or being in a better position.
Of course taking note that most large nations rot from the inside before outside forces ever have an effect is what I like to keep in mind first.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 08:56 PM
Response to Reply #71
93. 58% US will succeed in Iraq............Succeed at what? Succeed how?
Impossibly muddy question. The answer is worthless.

Note that 48% still prefer a negotiated international solution.
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nolabels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #93
97. I don't think you could get more than two or three here at DU to agree....
about all the things that could possibly happen in Iraq. I agree, but what I was trying to point out, is the the Corporate Media spins out that *co is confident (regardless if they are or not) and then on cue the corporate media spits out they are leaning to *co.

I also try not to believe anything Corporate media spins out. I even find it even easier to think the opposite, which a lot of times is correct.
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webtrainer Donating Member (265 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
19. How Bush #s went up in the last two weeks . . .
I'll never know.

I wonder if the wording on the question, specifically the words "Massachusetts Senator" skews it a bit.

There is a little note that says "Names rotated".

Does that mean the names are rotated per respondent or for each iteration of the poll?

Nader takes away 2 points from Kerry, 1 from Bush, which leaves only 1% voting because they like Nader himself. Work to do!
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davhill Donating Member (854 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #19
70. Who is it Who would vote for Nader
If Nader is running and for Bush if he is not? The anybody but Kerry vote?
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NeoConsSuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
20. the same poll is front page at USAToday.com
bottom line, Kerry has to start getting his message out. I would say that mainstream media should start giving him equal time, but we know that mainstream media is reich-wing.

Kerry had a 50-44 lead over Bush in March when the primaries were in full force and his face was on front page news. He was in the media every day then, as Bush is now.

The problem is not his message, no one is hearing it.
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shockingelk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #20
39. the headline
USA today sub-headline reads "Job rating at 52% despite Iraq, 9/11 hearings"

s/b

"Job rating at 52% despite $millions of ads and full WH cabinet concentrating on media interviews"
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hedda_foil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
21. ABC/WaPo poll is coming out today.
According to The Note, it should be VERY interesting.
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:04 PM
Response to Original message
22. Screw polls!!!!
They are inaccurate, contrived, unreliable and manipulative.
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daleo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:05 PM
Response to Original message
23. They ask "undecideds" who they lean toward
And include these in the poll. That might explain something, although I don't know enough of the ins and outs of the U.S. electorate (e.g. undecideds likelihood to actually vote) to know for sure.
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Chicago Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #23
94. They did a piece on NPR about Gallup's interview techniques
that said pretty much the same thing. The interviews totally pressure people into an answer. The techniques seemed flawed.
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still_one Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
24. just the opposite of what Zogby said
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plcdude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
25. notice that all the other
polls have Kerry ahead now why just report on one of them? Makes you go hmmmmmmmmmmm.
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Vinceklortho Donating Member (21 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
26. Ruh roh.
Someone ask this question....

What's the difference between Kerry and Bush AGAIN?!

So far (as of last week) Kerry has been Bush-lite, not what the lefties want.

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matcom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. care to elaborate?
or is that the extent of your 'insight'
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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:08 PM
Original message
I'm agreeing with him for the most part these days
I am really being turned off to Kerry on a daily basis and am now firmly in the "undecided" column for 2004.
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qanda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
47. I haven't gone that far *yet*
But, Kerry seems to lack so much that it's hard to make arguments about why I should cast my vote for him in November. I hope he chooses a vp that can bring some life and conviction to his campaign because as it stands right now I can barely watch him without feeling sick that he's the Democratic nominee.
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malachibk Donating Member (780 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #47
64. Did you people watch MTP??
Come on! He was SMART, LOGICAL, he ANSWERED QUESTIONS, and came across as HONEST. What the hell do you want him to do?? He's not my favorite, but he's WAAAAAAAAAAY better than Bush. COME ON!! Undecided?? Ugh
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Carolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #47
79. couldn't have said it better
that's why I am so sorry the primary season was contracted and all the other voices were apparently doomed after Iowa and NH.

That daily chorus of voices against Bush along with all the other stuff that has come to light recently would have been great.

As for Kerry, I also feel "as it stands right now I can barely watch him without feeling sick that he's the Democratic nominee." I didn't think his MTP performance yesterday was that great and besides he was orange.
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Vinceklortho Donating Member (21 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. Glad to!
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Walt Starr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Are you the keymaster?
hee hee.
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buddy22600 Donating Member (426 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. No, I'm the gatekeeper
My $.02...

Polls are effectively useless right now. When the Dem convention happens, Kerry will likely top bush by over 10 points.

When the repub convention happens, bush will likely tie Kerry again.

The only thing you can take from that, is that usually after a convention a candidate has the lead, but bush will only be in a tie, his money mostly gone in order to stay tied up to his convention and about worn out trying to dodge every bullet fired from Kerry, MoveOn, and the unions.

Kerry has it in the bag.
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Vinceklortho Donating Member (21 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. Yes.. are you the Gatekeeper?
Must... release.. Zuul.
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qanda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #26
41. I asked that question last week on the reparations thread
And I was told by at least six people to vote for Bush or Nader then. Well, if enough people's concerns are thrown to the side in favor of blind support for Kerry then get ready for four more years of Bush.
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buff2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #26
45. Are you one of the "lefties?"
Somehow I rather doubt it.
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Vinceklortho Donating Member (21 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #45
48. Oh yes I am.
Are you a leftie?

I'm way left of Gandhi on polticial compass.

VinceK
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buff2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #48
56. Yes I am a leftie
And proud of it! :hi:
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oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 10:33 PM
Response to Reply #26
96. Who, in your opinion, would be an acceptable candidate for the "lefties"?
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
29. It's all about the sample
Gallup is using a more conservative bias than the other polls, thus Bush is winning. With such a small sample, a minor disagreement can have a big effect. Some polls believe Dems and Repubs vote in equal numbers, some give one party or the other a slight edge. Some use strict historical breakdowns of who is likely to vote, others have more complicated formulas to try to catch changing trends. There are a lot of variables.

Who knows which one is correct. What it all shows is what we know: Bush will be hard to beat, but we are on the right track.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
34. CNN's Schneider....
America is rallying around its president. If the last couple weeks don't do in Bush, nothing will.
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Timefortruth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #34
40. He and Wolfie make CNN worse than Faux.
At least at Faux the pretense that they are unbiased is thinly veiled, CNN really pretends that it is news.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. Agreed.
And any time things heat up for Bush the CNN anchor will say "Well, we'll have to leave it at that, I'm sure this story isn't over"....while they never probe the story.
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sspiderjohn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #40
60. Wolf looks really short -- what is he, about 5'3"? n/t
nt
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sampsonblk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
35. What is so surprising??
Bush obviously lied. How hard is that to see? Problem is, John Kerry hasn't shown people why that means they should vote for him to replace the liar. "But I can beat Bush" isn't going to work now.

This is the same poor campaign Kerry ran in the primaries. He is going to need help from a lot of people at the grassroots level.
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0rganism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #35
82. Kerry ran a poor campaign in the primaries? WTF?
Sen. John Kerry certainly wouldn't have been my first choice in the primaries, but my state hasn't even had its primaries yet and Kerry's already a sho-in. At first, I thought he was running a lousy campaign, but the more I look at what happened, the more I see Kerry's running a BRILLIANT campaign.

For months, the media was glowing over Dean and Clark, and they were running strong in the polls, but John Kerry snuck in behind 'em. Various accounts claimed his campaign was in disarray, not mobilizing the grassroots, when in fact Kerry was operating under their radar. He ran a flawless primary campaign, and now he's running the best damned general campaign he can, given the whore press.

Right now he's letting the bush campaign blow lots of money on useless attack ads while the preznit hoists himself on his own petard. Of the many polls that came out over the last month, only CNN's has chimpy mccokespoon out in front. For a challenger to be running ahead, tied, or (if we presume CNN's poll to be accurate) even slightly behind at this time shows the softness of shrub's position.

Sen. Kerry is playing it smart, saving his fire for when it can do the most damage. My admiration for his political judo skills grows by the day.
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sampsonblk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-20-04 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #82
100. WTF is right!
"...the more I see Kerry's running a BRILLIANT campaign."

I hope the Kerry people don't hold that view. Kerry was chosen by the voters. Not because of anything he did, but because they didn't want to run the risk of picking Dean.

Exit polls show it pretty clearly. A large percentage of the Dems who voted for Kerry did so in spite of campaign and with a total disregard for Kerry's views. They picked him because he's a war hero and seemed to be the one to beat Bush. I have never seen anything like it. Neither had most pundits apparently.
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
37. OMG
PURE WHORING from Schneider and Blitzer for Bush.

PURE WHORING!

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Nevernose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
38. Every other poll from that period favors Kerry
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54anickel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
42. Should Shrub be reelected or is it time for someone new -
Edited on Mon Apr-19-04 04:27 PM by 54anickel
43 re-select
51 someone new
6 undecided

On edit, sorry different poll than CNN
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dawn Donating Member (876 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:27 PM
Response to Original message
43. I don't even look at the polls anymore.
Every day there's a new one. They seem so meaningless.
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wasichu Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
46. everyone believes polls when Kerry is ahead
but not when he is down.
Why is that?
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buff2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #46
51. Same reason freepers don't believe
the polls when bush's down,but when he's up they do. Why is THAT?
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sugarman Donating Member (96 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
49. Let's organize a one-day boycott...
...of CNN to protest media bias. I'm sure we all make up a sizeable percentage of viewers of CNN. Let's get all of the prominent bloggers to join us. We need to flex our muscle...
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Carolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #49
80. and put NO CNN stickers on our cars
wear them or carry placards of them at rallies ... like CNN with a red line through it.

It won't upset repukes and freepers 'cause they think CNN is librul!

It's a win/win. Piss off Candy, Wolf and Bill without antagonizing the gun nut zealots of the right.
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West Coast Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
50. Kerry spends little on advertising, stays w/in margin of error
just think....every week a new book comes out that makes Bush look even worse, and the GOP has to spend $10 million a week to keep even in the polls.
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MikeG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:45 PM
Response to Original message
52. It's a poll of "likely" voters not "registered" voters.
These polls always skew Republican.
W was also leading in this poll from 4/5-4/8
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sugarman Donating Member (96 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. is there anyway we can organize to influence the media?
Could we organize a media boycott?

I've been trying to promote this idea, but no one seems to be listening...
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LynzM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #53
57. And I keep reading it...
I think it's good, but no idea how you'd effectively manage it. Other than making news ourselves that they would be somehow forced to cover.... Anyone out there with good ideas/insight!?!?
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sugarman Donating Member (96 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #57
62. I do...
We need to email prominent bloggers in mass. I've already emailed them. But more people need to email them. Also we need to kepp floating the idea on DU until more people get interested...
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freetobegay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
54. And People called me an idiot
Edited on Mon Apr-19-04 05:06 PM by freetobegay
Because I said just as of yesterday the majority of Americans are sheeple! AM I still an idiot today?
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number6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
55.  N=767 likely voters nationwide
767 ? a sample of less than 800 people, what a joke !
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cureautismnow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #55
61. Precisely...
...and how many polled were "likely" Rep., how many "likely" Dem.'s, and how many "likely" Indies?

They don't ever tell you. I suspect 400+ of the respondents were Rep.'s.

In other words, it's a biased meaningless poll.
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:04 PM
Response to Original message
58. I believe that as much as I believe a Soviet Poll showing Brezhnev ahead
EXACTLY as much.
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
59. That is not nice to see....but......
Edited on Mon Apr-19-04 05:13 PM by Stuckinthebush
It just doesn't matter.

All that matters are the State by State numbers. We saw in 2000 that we can win the popular vote but lose the presidency.

What do those battle ground states look like? I haven't seen recent polls in OH and PA which are necessary for us to win.

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mumon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
63. RELAX - IT'S WITHIN THE MARGIN OF ERROR!
"N= 767?????"

And Zogby's got better numbers...

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Onlooker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
65. We spent a decade cowering before the right-wing
The Democratic leadership spent more than a decade cowering to Republican insults and threats. It's going to take awhile to turn it around, but slowly it's happening. We have to keep up the pressure, and sooner or later independents will break in our favor and Repugs will lose some of their motivation.
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Democat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #65
66. The problem is that most of the Democratic cowards are still in office
How many of our senators and congresspeople stand up to Bush every day compared to how many Republicans stood up to Clinton. It's shamefull how weak our elected officials are. It will take many years to clear out the wimps and replace them with fighters.
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Carolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #66
88. exactly, it's Republicans
who are coming out and exposing BushCo: Dick Clarke, Paul O'Neill, Bob Woodward, Kevin Phillips, John Dean, former republican Wesley Clark who didn't hesitate to call himself liberal and point out why the Democratic Party is RIGHT on the issues...

With few exceptions -- Robert Byrd, Ted Kennedy, Charlie Rangel, Sheila Jackson Lee -- our folks have been a pathetic bunch of wimpocrats. The party's failure to stand united, consistently and vociferously against Bush since the shenanigans following 11/7/2000 has been sickening. It has also been a LOSING strategy.
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AlinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:41 PM
Response to Original message
67. I'm reading "1984" again. These poll numbers sound like
something out of the Ministry of Truth.
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Aquarian_Conspirator Donating Member (148 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 05:43 PM
Response to Original message
68. Here is why this poll makes perfect sense.
On either side of any average there is a half that is above, and a half that is below. Half of the US population has a below average IQ. Guess which half supports Bush? And, the more we try and take away that half's warm blanky, the tighter their white knuckled grip becomes. "No, no take away blanky! Blanky goooood!!! Waaaaah-waaaaah"
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Snellius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
72. Kerry has still not clearly distinguished his policy from Bush
Kerry condoned Bush's change in policy on the West Bank and Gaza. He condoned the assassination of the leader of Hamas. He continues to support our presence in Iraq, just as ,out of necessity, Bush has moved toward Kerry's position, by dumping the problem in the lap of the U.N. Any damage done to Bush in the last month has been self-inflicted. With so much bullshit, the truth takes time to catch up.
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 06:05 PM
Response to Original message
73. If CNN keeps up these lies ....then it will EMPOWER US to STAND!!!!!
So BRING IT ON CNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Carolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:12 PM
Response to Original message
76. Republicans don't read
Where I live, I see more and more W '04 or Bush-Cheney '04 bumper stickers, particularly on large SUVs with blonde suburbanite Stepford wives and children aboard. They like their tax cuts and their oil!
Sorry for the stereotype, but hey, if the shoe fits ...

The sad thing is that these people have money and access to computers, books, every imaginable resource but they don't question, they don't challenge, they don't read. Their status quo is grand while the rest of the world be damned. They are entitled, they have earned their place or lot in life... And all the latest stuff, particularly the anti-Bush books and the revelations via 60 minutes and the 9/11 commission, are just tools to bring down a Christian man, tools that come from disgruntled rejects.

One such individual whom I was friends with but whose company I find harder and harder to tolerate because of her blind faith in the Republican Party and God (and yes, they go hand in hand), is an attorney. A damn good one, too. But she reads NOTHING aside from stuff relative to work except for magazines like People. She is pro-war, anti-tax, anti-abortion and pro-Bush ... She won't even consider voting for a Democrat, not now, not ever :shrug:

It's truly scary. This poll may be CNN Bushit and may be within the margin of error, but the unread/uninformed sheeple, the true believer freepers, and the wealthy Stepford Bushistas are out there and they vote, in polls and in elections.
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dolstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:15 PM
Response to Original message
77. No, the only thing incredible is the inability of DU'ers to acknowledge
the possibility that voters just might prefer Bush to Kerry.
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bluedog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:16 PM
Response to Original message
78. does N=767 mean
number of people polled??? If so this poll is ridiculus .

CNN/USA Today/Gallup Poll. April 16-18, 2004. N=767 likely voters nationwide. MoE ± 4.

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0rganism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #78
83. yes it does
and yes it is
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devinsgram Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:31 PM
Response to Original message
81. If it's CNN it can't be true.
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Phelix_Dacat Donating Member (8 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
84. The poll is worthless
Polls done over the weekend favor republicans. This one was done over a weekend.

You want a poll done during the weekdays of likely voters. Otherwise it's just another pushpoll imnsho.
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TrueD Donating Member (41 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #84
89. Not really
Pollster take into account skews such as "weekend." The trick to polling is the skew that's employed by the pollster. That's why polls vary between pollsters. They try to deskew their sample based on day or geography or any of a thousand variables. It's the art of polling.


For example, polls during the week to homes favor democrats because they are statistically more likely to be home for whatever reason. The poll is reskewed for that time knowing there is a skew. Same thing for weekends and nights and holidays. Also the population sample is deskewed for people who have phones, etc.

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Zero Division Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
85. Don't look at individual polls for an accurate picture
Given many of the responses on this thread and in others that deal with individual poll results, I think it's safe to say that not enough DUers look at the trends found in multiple polls. Although this site has been posted many times before here, I'll post it again:

http://www.radiofreemonkey.com:8080/charts/

Look at this chart, for example (this is accurate up to the 18th of April)

http://www.radiofreemonkey.com:8080/charts/img_bush_kerry_spread.gif
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Snellius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 07:46 PM
Response to Original message
87. If it's any consolation, Dick Morris says it looks bad for Bush.
Edited on Mon Apr-19-04 07:47 PM by Snellius
Heard Dick Morris on Hannity's radio show this afternoon, and he had poor Hannity almost in tears over his dire predictions. He said the fact that Rove had spent almost $50 million in blitz ads, just at the point when Kerry was the most vulnerable to being pre-cast in an unfavorable light, and still have the race pretty much a standoff, was a huge failure on Bush's part, blowing his best chance to create a negative image of his opponent, a chance he will not get again. Morris declared if the election were held today Kerry would win.

True or not. It's an interesting indication of how -- when truth be told -- how reluctant the conservative support for Bush really is. When Bush collapses, he will collapse quickly and utterly. There are just too many, too afraid of being carried along in the landslide that will take him down.
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Timefortruth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #87
92. That doesn't make me feel better at all.
Dick Morris is a total moran, he is never right about anything. He is even an embarrassment to Faux.
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Iceburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 08:06 PM
Response to Original message
90. Remember 1948 ... Give 'Em Hell Harry vs. The Polls
Try not to get discouraged ... these polls are highly dubious. And most importantly never forget the 1948 election.

http://history1900s.about.com/cs/trumanharry/a/deweytruman.htm

<snip>
On the morning after the 1948 presidential election, the Chicago Daily Tribune's headline read

"DEWEY DEFEATS TRUMAN."

That's what the Republicans, the polls, the newspapers, the political writers, and even many Democrats had expected. But in the largest political upset in U.S. history, Harry S. Truman surprised everyone when he, and not Thomas E. Dewey, won the 1948 election for president of the United States.
....

Give 'Em Hell Harry vs. The Polls


The polls, reporters, political writers - they all believed Dewey was going to win by a landslide. On September 9, 1948, Elmo Roper was so confident of a Dewey win that he announced there would be no further Roper Polls on this election. Roper said, "My whole inclination is to predict the election of Thomas E. Dewey by a heavy margin and devote my time and efforts to other things.

Truman was undaunted. He believed that with a lot of hard work, he could get the votes. Though it is usually the contender and not the incumbent that works hard to win the race, Dewey and the Republicans were so confident they were going to win - barring any major faux pas - that they decided to make an extremely low-key campaign.

Truman's campaign was based on getting out to the people. While Dewey was aloof and stuffy, Truman was open, friendly, and seemed one with the people. In order to talk to the people, Truman got in his special Pullman car, the Ferdinand Magellan, and traveled the country. In six weeks, Truman traveled approximately 32,000 miles and gave 355 speeches.3 <p> On this "Whistle-Stop Campaign," Truman would stop at town after town and give a speech, have people ask questions, introduce his family, and shake hands. From his dedication and strong will to fight as an underdog against the Republicans, Harry Truman acquired the slogan, "Give 'em hell, Harry!"

But even with perseverance, hard work, and large crowds, the media still didn't believe Truman had a fighting chance. While President Truman was still on the road campaigning, Newsweek polled 50 key political journalists to determine which candidate they thought would win. Appearing in the October 11 issue, Newsweek stated the results: all 50 believed Dewey would win.

h3]The Election
By election day, the polls showed that Truman had managed to cut Dewey's lead, but all media sources still believed Dewey would win by a landslide.

As the reports filtered in that night, Truman was ahead in the popular votes, but the newscasters still believed Truman didn't have a chance.

By four the next morning, Truman's success seemed undeniable. At 10:14 a.m., Dewey conceded the election to Truman.

Since the election results were a complete shock to the media, the Chicago Daily Tribune got caught with the headline "DEWEY DEFEATS TRUMAN." The photograph with Truman holding aloft the paper has become one of the most famous newspaper photos of the century.


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Cocoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
91. scroll down
there's other polls there, including a Zogby one with a larger sample that has Kerry ahead.

Why highlight the bad one?

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jackstraw45 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 10:21 PM
Response to Original message
95. George Bush: Hero of the STUPID
I'm really ready to pull my hair out.

Are we living in the twilight zone?
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are_we_united_yet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-19-04 11:56 PM
Response to Original message
98. Sorry don't buy it
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BadGimp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-20-04 12:42 AM
Response to Original message
99. This is why they rolled back their ad spending
They needed to divert some of their funds to buying off as many of the polling outfits they could.

OK it's stretch but how far off can it be???
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SKKY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-20-04 02:24 AM
Response to Original message
101. I think we're in good shape...
We haven't even heard our first debate yet. Get these two guys face to face and Kerry will absolutely clean his clock. We all know what Kerry has in his closet. But Bush has many, many things he doesn't want to get out. I'm feeling pretty optimistic. Someone posted that if the last 2 weeks don't kill bush then nothing will. Well, wait until we turn control of Iraq over to the Governing Council in June. What happens after that will definitely seal his fate.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-20-04 06:34 AM
Response to Original message
102. bizzarro worLd
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