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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 01:55 PM
Original message
Womens March is officially the largest ever
Over one million people and more are still arriving

as per C-span live
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livetohike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
1. Goodbye Bush!
Let's hope everyone is registered to vote.
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. they are telling them if "you're not registered you're wasting your time"
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
42. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ashling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #42
45. Could be. There are a lot of strange things in this world
Edited on Sun Apr-25-04 07:00 PM by ashling
they just don't care enough. Republican policies hurt women, men, and families.
:dem:

just to clarify this post: #42 said that not all of them were Dems, and that repugs care about women's rights. After I posted they removed #42
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PaDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #1
49. WHY don't we get these same people
plus more, and march right into the WH and clean house NOW. We can't afford to wait for an election that might NOT take place. There's more than enough "goods" on these thugs for many convictions.
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VolcanoJen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:01 PM
Response to Original message
2. Could that be true?? Linky, anyone?
Reuters still says "hundreds of thousands," and that the 1992 march drew 500,000. They also noted that the largest march ever was an anti-Vietnam War rally in 1969, which drew 600,000.

Hundreds of Thousands Protest Bush Abortion Policy

Rate that story a 5, while you're there!

Very good and encouraging news, AZDem!
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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #2
32. You just know if the whore media admit to 100's of thousands, it's well
over a million or more.

Great news.

Maybe we ARE waking up!
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54anickel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #2
34. It's been freeped. Its current average rating is 3.26 with 1198
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uncertainty1999 Donating Member (223 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
3. I think I'm going to cry I'm so happy!!!
:-)
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livetohike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Welcome to DU!
:hi:
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uncertainty1999 Donating Member (223 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #4
78. thank you!
I enjoy hiking, too :-)
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. welcome to DU uncertainy 1999
:hi:
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. Me, too
Let me add my welcome to the others. :hi:
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Katha Donating Member (287 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:09 PM
Response to Original message
7. Gave it a five!
Reading about the seventy-six year old woman with a coat hanger and a sign that said "Never Again" gave me chills.
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barbaraann Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:10 PM
Response to Original message
8. Hehe. Wait till they see the numbers in NYC for the GOP Convention.
:-)
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. I'm looking forward to that, Barbaraann
Let's hope it stays peaceful in NY
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Calm Like A Bomb Donating Member (128 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #8
37. I was thinking the exact same thing.
It's time to go, Georgie!
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Democat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
9. Right wing Yahoo headline "Thousands Protest Bush Policies on Abortion"
Assholes.
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #9
18. Hundreds of thousands protest Bush abortion policy~ Reuters
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kwyjibo Donating Member (612 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
10. wish I could be there
I'm so excited for all of the people there. It's such an amazing feeling to be a part of a protest, and to know that you're not alone in your beliefs and values.. to be a part of the biggest march on washington has got to be an amazing feeling. I can't wait to see pictures.
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slinkerwink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. welcome to DU!!!!
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livetohike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. Welcome to DU!
:hi:
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kwyjibo Donating Member (612 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. :D
thanks to both of you! how sweet :)
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GCP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #16
36. Kwyjibo
As in "Fat balding North American ape" - courtesy of the Simpsons!

Welcome:toast:
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Dulcinea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 05:17 AM
Response to Reply #10
79. Here's a link:

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/04/25/abortion.protest.ap/index.html

Check out the video & the photo gallery!

I also just want to say I'm a 38-year-old mother of 2 with a minivan, Boy George's target demographic, & I was there in spirit all the way!
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bread_and_roses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
11. This is wonderful, wonderful
...I wish I could have gone too. That's what they should remember, those creatures watching from the White House...how many of us couldn't be there. There would not be room in Washington's streets for all of us.
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ewagner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #11
19. Just saw the pics from CSPAN
..before they "lost the feed".

I haven't seen anything like that since the civil rights rallies of the'60s.

Politicians had better sit up and listen.
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0rganism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #19
65. Don't be silly; it's just another focus group
Our political establishment can't be expected to respond to every focus group that comes knocking at the door, right?
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Robbien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 02:47 PM
Response to Original message
17. Reuters: Hundreds of Thousands Protest Bush Abortion Policy
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Hundreds of thousands of protesters rallied on the National Mall on Sunday to show support for abortion rights and opposition to Bush administration policies on women's reproductive health issues.

Hefting signs reading "Fight the Radical Right," "Keep Abortion Legal" and "U.S. Out Of My Uterus," pink- and purple-shirted demonstrators flooded downtown Washington for a daylong March for Women's Lives.

The abortion issue was the centerpiece of the march's broad protest against the policies of President Bush, including his stance on funding international family planning. No U.S. funds may currently be used for any family planning agency that mentions abortion to patients.

"Vote That Smirk Out of Office," was a characteristically political placard targeting Bush, but Dorothy Smith, 76, of Eldridge, Missouri, carried an emblem she made herself -- a wire coat hanger draped with a sign reading "Never Again."

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=4931548§ion=news

And some good pictures!
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cally Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
20. GREAT
:bounce: :bounce:

I wish I could have been there. :grouphug: for all of us so frustrated we weren't there. I went to a small one in SF yesterday organized by a HS student. Many young folks there and great speakers. Still, I want to be in DC right now.
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llmart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. Oh my goddess!
The picture just gave me goosebumps! I am absolutely ecstatic about the turnout. Wish I could be there also, but I am in spirit. Pro choice all the way!
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icymist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #20
55. That photo says more than any news reporters' numbers!
Bush is toast!
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cally Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
21. snarf--16 counter protesters arrested
for not having a permit. Just on CNN. ROFLMAO. :bounce:
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. lovely sign here-- "God Hates You"
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John F. Kerry Donating Member (1 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. Typical Religious Fundamentalists
This picture says a thousand words. Thanks for posting it. It is just one of many proofs that the religious right cannot be reasoned with. Look at the neanderthal stance of that guy in the pic! Do you care to "debate" with someone like that? LOL
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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #22
30. Looks like the moran man to me, LOL!!
You girls are great. You do indeed know how to protest!! Wish more men had the moxie that you all have.
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icymist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #22
60. Maybe this guy thinks he's God?
Wow! Is he ever getting his blood pressure up!
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smirkymonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #22
66. What an F**ing Ape!
Does anyone else see the irony in the statement "God Hates You

Another simian for Bush* :argh:
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Catfight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #66
103. Yes..LOL. the irony, oh the irony...God, hate, almost as funny as
Bush's WMD joke.
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Bill McBlueState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #22
67. does his sign say "drunkards" at the bottom?
I dunno, that seems like a really funny thing to toss into the mix.

*lol*
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Robbien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
24. 1,150,000 March on Washington, D.C. to Voice Opposition
Official Crowd Count Largest Ever for Women's Rights Rally in The Nation's Capitol

WASHINGTON, April 25 /PRNewswire/ -- An estimated 1,150,000 descended on the National Mall in Washington, D.C. today to give an urgent wake-up call to government leaders and the nation-women's lives are at risk and lawmakers stop intruding on a woman's right to access critical reproductive health services and make deeply personal decisions about her health and life.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040425/nysu015_1.html
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. WOOT!!! Let's hear it for all the women and men who were in DC today
wish I could have been there to show my support.:bounce:
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Triana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #24
87. Why He*L is this Story...
...in the FINANCIAL section? Excuuuse me? Why is it buried in the Finance section?

Can there BE a more blatant attempt to HIDE this story from the public? WTF?

:mad:
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #87
88. Don't worry, that's not a story, it's a press release
That's where they put their press releases.
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hellbound-liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 04:22 PM
Response to Original message
25. I notified CNN of the official count. Here's my letter to the Newstips
section of their web page:

Dear Editors, I realize it will do no good to give you this information but I have to point it out to any of your subordinates who might see it that you are drastically minimizing the turnout at the rally in D.C. today. I know your bosses in the Bush Administration don't want this to get out but it is out and it's not going away!

1,150,000 March on Washington, D.C. to Voice Opposition to Government Attacks on Women's Reproductive Rights and Health
Sunday April 25, 4:43 pm ET
Official Crowd Count Largest Ever for Women's Rights Rally in The Nation's Capitol

<snip>

WASHINGTON, April 25 /PRNewswire/ -- An estimated 1,150,000 descended on the National Mall in Washington, D.C. today to give an urgent wake-up call to government leaders and the nation-women's lives are at risk and lawmakers stop intruding on a woman's right to access critical reproductive health services and make deeply personal decisions about her health and life.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040425/nysu015_1.html
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #25
33. Not an official count
The Park Service used to do official counts and stopped because every single group -- right wing or left -- complained they undercounted.

There is no official count and the article you cite is a press release.

I have no doubt the number is huge. I have every doubt that it's 1.15 million.
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54anickel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. At least they are giving an explaination of how they came up with the
number. Where'd CNN get theirs?

Using standard crowd estimate methods, March participants were counted in designated grids on the National Mall, which are designed to hold a predetermined number of people. The March also verified this count by assigning 2,500 volunteers to stand at key entry points to the March area and at bus drop-off locations and count people by placing March stickers on participants as they entered these entry points.

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Athame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #25
76. CNN 11:00 PM News on the left coast
still saying "as many as 300,000" or just simply "thousands".

ABC had fairly good coverage of both DC and LA with undeniable pictures and some decent sound bites, but not a hint about it until 15 minutes into the newscast. First, a fire in Riverside, Estee Lauder's death, something about Falluja, and of course, Michael Jackson about to be arraigned. :grr:
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flamingyouth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:11 PM
Response to Original message
28. EXCELLENT!
I was there in spirit!!! :bounce:
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Shopaholic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. I love how AOL spun the story
They reported the march, it's size, etc., on the main Welcome page--then you clicked on the story and they had a picture of a woman who looked like an absolute witch. Guess what the subtext was there? Can't show a picture of the overall size of the march or a photo of a normal person. . . growl. . .
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crossroads Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #28
38. I Was Too...
God bless these women for the courage of their convictions!
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dbt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
31. May the women save us from ourselves!
Notice how you can't get a million men to show up for anything. On the other hand more than a million women will turn out for an important cause--and it will look to us males like they did it at the drop of a hat!

Please may the women turn out in droves this November. When that happens, bu$h is beyond toast!

:bounce:
dbt

One Nation Under Goddess works for me...
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DavidMS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #31
56. Um... there were quite a few men there
I was there (withe the DU delegation). I figure at least 10% of the turnout was men.

The coolest part was that LynSin brought "George" her stickerd and markered smaller-than-life George W. Bush Standie. He got lots of attension. We asked people to help us send him home. We also passed out lots of DU bumper stickers.

Lookign forward to joining DU in NY this summer if possible.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #56
70. Thank you!
I had to work this afternoon, and I was afraid I wouldn't make it on time if I tried to attend the rally for a little while.

A friend of mine came down from NYC with her husband, who insisted on marching, even though he is in his 70s.

Thank you to all the men out there who respect and support a woman's right to choose! :loveya:

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Athame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 01:29 AM
Response to Reply #56
77. Good for you, DavidMS, and thank you
:thumbsup: :kick: :thumbsup: :kick: :thumbsup: :kick:
I had been planning almost a year to go, but at the last minute I could not because of a conference at work that I could not get out of. But one of the men in my office went in my place and carried my banner and wore my sash....the purple sash that says, "Every child a wanted child" I wore in marches for many years. Had put it away because I truly thought we had won that struggle.

This is a human issue. We need all hands and feet on deck. They were out in force today and I have tears in my eyes looking at the pictures.
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rfkrocks Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:23 PM
Response to Original message
39. Go sisters
Bobby Kennedy,MLK jr and the others were with you in spirit today:yourock:
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sonias Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
40. I am so proud of all the women and men who showed up
I really wish I could have been there. I was there with you my sisters and brothers in spirit. Thank you each and every one of you for representing us. You rock!!!

Sonia
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demnan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:36 PM
Response to Original message
41. It was a wonderful march
lot's of fun.
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fortyfeetunder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:48 PM
Response to Original message
43. I too, was there in spirit
I couldn't stay in DC another week but I would have been there otherwise. Glad the turnout was FANTASTIC!

:kick:
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:51 PM
Response to Original message
44. What right?
How does GW Bush get away with this?

"The abortion issue was the centerpiece of the march's broad protest against the policies of President Bush, including his stance on funding international family planning. No U.S. funds may currently be used for any family planning agency that mentions abortion to patients."

This is not the Govt.'s right to withld funding due to the personal view of the Pres. Another sign the Dems in Congress are not doing their jobs for the people. This should have been vehemently opposed long ago!
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okieinpain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 07:03 PM
Response to Original message
46. you couldn't tell from the liberal media. I've heard quotes of
a few thousands. I thought it was going just okay.
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #46
48. The GOP stopped the Park Service from releasing an estimate!
Fox is saying hundreds of thousands - and noting no Park Service estimate.

Man - getting any news out that is not far right is a battle when the right wing GOP control the media
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 08:19 PM
Response to Reply #48
51. Not true
The Park Service stopped issuing estimates some time ago because no group was ever happy. That included right wing and left wing groups. They couldn't win so they stopped trying.
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #51
57. so Muddle, do you think the figure is closer to 1.5 million
or 500,000?
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #57
61. I have never met a group yet that didn't overestimate
So I would choose the lower of the two which is still a ton of folks.
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #51
58. Source that.
I'd be interested in knowing if your allegation is true. My close friends live in DC, and that's not what I've heard.

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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #58
62. How about this
From alternet even:

"No one knows for sure how many protesters were there; the National Park Service, which used to count crowds on the Mall, got out of that business after its estimate put the Million Man March at more like 400,000, prompting Louis Farrakhan to threaten a lawsuit."

http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=14978
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #62
63. Thank you for your quick response.
Clearly, I heard wrong.

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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. No problem, glad to help
When I lived in DC, every group -- of all political pursuasions -- would inflate its numbers. Mostly it was just wishful thinking or bad math. But each and every group bitched at the Park Service. They finally gave up. So, personally, I estimate down for every group because they were always wrong in the other direction.

Even then, 500,000 or so is an amazing achievement.
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cap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 05:28 AM
Response to Reply #64
80. bull... they have to know ....
they can't be orders of magnitude off in their estimates. Otherwise, they wouldn't know how many police to station for crowd control. We never had differences of opinion in this magnitude. I lived in DC for many years. We always had demonstrations and demonstrators and police did come up with differing numbers -- but they never used to be orders of magnitude off. Go read the Washington Post from the 60's, 70's, 80's and 90's. Watch how the counts varied.

This is just politics and trying to influence the media by depressing the number of turnout.
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 06:14 AM
Response to Reply #80
82. The counts varied by hundreds of thousands
The Million Man march was off by almost half of what they claimed. Even in The Post today, the estimates are around 750,000. That's huge, but 400,000 different than the claim.
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cap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #82
89. there's a known methodology for ensuring sufficient security...
Same as in Iraq.... Shinseki could give us a number that would have a reasonable chance of ensuring security.

they know.... it's just so politically convenient to downplay the power of the people!!! Go back to the sixties and look at the articles and pictures in the Washington Post of the demonstrations going on and the order of magnitude between protesters' estimations and the police estimation. They were much closer than today.

Believe me, with the protests against the World Bank and WTO, they sure as hell know how to staff the police force to adequately protect downtown DC.

Boy, given the implications of terrorism and homeland security, they better know how to staff the police force appropriately. If the Park Police don't know how to estimate and staff appropriately, they should be fired.

There will always be discrepancies but not in terms of orders of magnitude.
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #89
91. They stopped making public predictions
Because of complaints from both sides of the political spectrum. Clearly, they know how to staff for protests.

The discrepancy in this case was about 400,000 or one third of the claimed result.
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cap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #91
92. the Park Police needs to have the courage of its convictions
and post the number. The other thought is this... if they are understaffing, shouldn't there be a public discussion of the numbers? People who wildly inflate their numbers will lose credibility on either side of an issue. Nothing like openness and asking for evidence to back up your opinion.

It's not so hard to take some aerial photos of a demonstration. That would be one of the first things I would look at to ascertain what the real number is.

A demonstration of 1,000,000 people would mean that this demonstration ranks with some of the largest on the mall ever. Surely, you can begin to compare photos with other demonstrations.

We should not have estimates that are orders of magnitude off. It's ridiculous to see press reports ranging from 250,000 to 1.1 million people. The American people have a right to know what the impact of a demonstration is. The press is not doing its job.
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #92
93. The Park Police can't win
The groups ALWAYS overestimated. Every time the Park Police released the results, the groups complained.

That's why I'm sticking with the DC police at about 750,000.
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cap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #93
98. the difference can not be an order of magnitude ....
250K needs a whole lot fewer number of Park Police than 1 million.
750 needs a good bit fewer number of Park Police than 1 million.


I can respect a 20-30K difference of opinion...but not 100's of thousands. Somebody is not doing their job...either Park Police aren't ensuring adequate security or the press is not covering the number of demonstrators properly.

The American public has a right to know how many people are showing up on the mall to demonstrate.
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #98
101. Lay the blame on the organizers who CLAIM more
The police staffed for a protest with a 750,000 permit. They didn't complain.
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cap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #101
109. sometimes more do show up and the police call for reinforcements...
eom
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #109
110. Usually that's for trouble
Standard patrols don't need reinforcements.
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fudge stripe cookays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-29-04 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #80
113. PP was taking names
and trying to get accurate counts.

They had folks stationed all up and down parade routes. If you were there and didn't sign in, go to the Planned Parenthood and give em your name. They're still trying to get right numbers.
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bobbyboucher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #51
95. I knew you'd show up spinning,
rapidly.
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #95
96. Who's spinning?
I am going with the police estimates of 750,000. I like some sense of reality in my life.
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cap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #96
99. muddleoftheroad....I've notice that you are not
really onboard with the DU platform any of the threads I've seen you post on. When will you start agreeing with us on some issue????

You end up obfuscating alot.
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 10:33 PM
Response to Reply #99
106. There is no DU platform that I know except voting for Kerry
So, I'm batting 1,000%.

And as for the rest, pardon someone injecting a little accuracy into an issue. You can't have that, can you?
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cap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #106
108. no, but look at the way your posts trends
you are quite contrary ... and there's no cheerleading on typical Democratic issues...

I should start seeing a little bit more agreement here and there ...

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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #108
111. I am not a rah rah kind of guy
I think you would be happier if I spent my days going, "me too" on the threads where I agree.

I would find that boring, though it does happen at times when that is my mood.

Usually, I prefer to discuss ideas and debate them. What is the point in me discussing endlessly gay marriage, for instance. I am for it. I consider it a given as a civil rights issue. Where appropriate, I do mention that it is a big problem in the black community (hell even in my family) because many are against it.

I do find that many here have what I would call suburban sentiments. Having lived urban poor most of my life, I find that means I disagree with attitudes sometimes.
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Il_Coniglietto Donating Member (217 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 07:31 PM
Response to Original message
47. Hilarious stuff: Pro-life article
March For Abortion Attracts Lower Numbers Than Expected

"Though organizers expected as many as one million people in Washington today to march in support of abortion, police estimated that only a quarter of that number actually attended the pro-abortion rally. While media outlets varied in their description of the numbers, some estimated that only "tens of thousands" participated.

"There are no official estimates of the crowd size as the National Park Service no longer tallies official crowd counts. However, CNN reported that Washington D.C. police estimated that 250,000 people participated in the pro-abortion march.

"That pales in comparison with the one million that leading abortion advocates predicted would attend.

...

"Pro-life groups say the estimates also wrongly include pro-life counterprotesters. While as many as 100-200,000 people may have been in Washington on Sunday for the event, several thousand of those were pro-life advocates."

http://www.lifenews.com/nat471.html

Spin, spin, spin...
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #47
69. Well it probably DID include
the 16 "Christian" coalition members who opted to leave their assigned demonstration area to get arrested.

So make the count 1,499,984....
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PassingFair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-29-04 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #47
114. Hey
This must be the place where Muddle gets his figures! Finally, his secret lair.
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
50. I just got back,...both exhilarated and exhausted *LOL*,...
,...it was one of the most uplifting experiences of my life because the support was so well-rounded and diverse. ALL walks of life participated!!!! Although I heard there were some real buttholes (apparently a real puny group) who behaved ridiculoulsy obnoxious, I guess I got lucky because I saw nothing of it.

All I can say is,...being in that literal sea of humanity made me know that, all things really are possible: the hope and love and unity were so inspiring,...I simply cannot find the words to begin to describe such things. Most of all, I felt more "safe" and "secure" and at peace than ever before, as a woman.

I don't doubt for a minute that over a million people were there! Geez, by 9am, the place was almost packed. Although, I must say that, if C-span is reporting a million, the numbers at the major anti-war protests (esp. Feb. & Mar. 2003 and Mar. 2004) were seriously underreported.

For those who were unable to make it, I sincerely hope that you will still feel within yourselves the inspiration of our unity. You were with us in spirit,...and we were with you in spirit, too!
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Gingersnapsback Donating Member (150 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. Shake your bootie, shake your fists!
I was there and there were far more than the 2 anti war protests I went to last year that had at least 250,000. There were way over a million! there today!!!
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. Wasn't it above awesome!!!
I was sincerely surprised at the flood of support!!!

I know for sure that I will carry this experience with me until the day I die,...and ever after that!!!
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #50
59. "I don't doubt for a minute that over a million people were there!"
Neither do I.

Some of our conservative DUers, on the other hand...

:eyes:

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Iceburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:31 PM
Response to Original message
54. 57 Countries! ...thats 10X bigger than the Bushster current coalition
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tigereye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #54
68. hope * and Co are shaking in their boots
good for all who participated. :yourock:
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2Design Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 11:56 PM
Response to Original message
71. This was a wonderful event.....the papers do not do it justice
I got home in time for the nightly news on the hampton roads channels. They had nothing on the news. Then I searched the internet and most of them were running the same AP story by Elizabeth xxxx

If you look at the picture we covered the whole mall space, so how many is that? A lot.

The speeches were great. Although the media focused on abortion, the story was about a much broader subject. Womens lives. Their whole life. Their reproductive rights. Their right for information. Their right to keep that information private. Their right to take out library books without being spied on. Right to education about choices. The right to have a choice beyond abstinence which is where this administration is spending all the funding that used to go to planned parenthood.

The anti abortion demonstrators only line parts of pennsylvania avenue because that is all they had a permit for. They had their typical gross pictures, and prayed, and used Christ picture to advocate their view. What I did not see, was any signs about them being annoyed with Bush for not allowing women planned parenthood, or the use of condoms in order to prevent unplanned pregnacies. They seemed to only have a partial view of the bigger picture. A very narrow judgemental view, that only God can truly judge.

I also did not see the protesters who called us murders with signs calling the the war mongers, murders. There were no pictures of the chidren or women killed in all the wars and most recently the pre emptive war of Bush's choosing.

The prochoice/prolife group, us who were marching for women's lives were interested in allowing all people choice. We are for life and allowing the anti abortionist to not have a abortion. We also are for them not wanting to use birth control or in anyway taking care of their health or the health of the women having babies.

The speakers were extraordinary. They spoke for women around the world and infered the UN resolution that did not pass because the USA did not support it. This would have allowed women in many countries access to information about parenthood, and reproductive rights. Unfortunately, the US government does not want women to be educated on how to take care of themselves.

Very informative. High spirited.
Whose house?
Our house!!!!
The White House!!!
The house of the people.
And the people will be taking it back.
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 12:16 AM
Response to Original message
72. Only 1 out of 50 Democratic voters nationwide could attend
IOW Bush is going down.
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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 12:25 AM
Response to Original message
73. was kerry there????
anybody know?
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2Design Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 12:47 AM
Response to Reply #73
74. kerry was not there. He met on friday with the Nral
Kerry's daughter was there. I did not see her, but her picture appears on www.iht.com site...there is no story there though.

Kerry met on friday with NARAL Pro-Choice America

Dean was there and I saw him. Most of the speakers were women.
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #74
104. Kerry's daughter was there- awesome...
Glad the Kerrys were represented!
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bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 01:17 AM
Response to Original message
75. Right on, sisters!
In solidarity.
Bob
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 05:47 AM
Response to Original message
81. imagine how many people could get together protesting
more then just one single Bush issue.

suppose there'd be a protest against Bush's

- abortion policy
- environmental policy
- economic policy
- foreign policy
- civil rights policy
and there's probably more

then this womens protest would be the second largest, by a long shot.

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dusty64 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 06:44 AM
Response to Original message
83. Lets hope each of
these marchers votes and bring a few others with them.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
84. Report from the Dallas News:
Huge throngs march on Washington in support of abortion rights
03:27 AM CDT on Monday, April 26, 2004


From Wire Reports



WASHINGTON – Abortion-rights activists turned out by the hundreds of thousands Sunday, packing the National Mall with a sea of pink signs and a warning to the White House that they will vote in November.

The ACLU and Planned Parenthood, along with about 1,400 other groups, organized the March for Women's Lives after a series of legislative setbacks that they say could lead to a reversal of Roe vs. Wade, the 1973 Supreme Court ruling that legalized abortion nationwide.

Organizers estimated a turnout of 1 million. Although the U.S. Park Police no longer gives official crowd counts, the Associated Press quoted police sources as informally estimating the number at 500,000 to 800,000.
(snip)

"There were 50 million women in our country eligible to vote who did not vote in the 2000 election," Ms. Clinton said. "When you go home, between now and the election, I want you to start asking people around you if they're registered to vote."
(snip)


AP
Demontrators march down Pennnsylvania Avenue in Washington, D.C., on Sunday during a reproductive rights rally and march.


http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/042604dnnatmarch.e9b3.html
(Free registration required)

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Gingersnapsback Donating Member (150 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #84
85. Please read this to understand the urgent issues and spread the word.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #84
100. So who's afraid of the big bad million?
What is up with always keeping the count under a million?

I was there for a march in 93 and we felt we had a million easy and they said we only had 200,000 to 500,000. What is it about admitting a MILLION people care enough about something to show up for it.

You just can't tell me that the count has not passed a million at some of these marches, with the U.S population being what it is.

Wonder when the park police will admit it? They are not releasing a count to the media, but you can bet your buns they counted for security reasons, and party strategists paid some agency for estimates too, I'm sure.
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #100
102. Police Chief Ramsey came as close to verifying the 1 million+ as he could
He, of course, is politically limited in what he can say about any kind of official count, but do note that he said it appeared the march organizers met or exceeded their goal of 750,000. Nuance is everything, and Ramsey knows it.
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 10:34 PM
Response to Reply #102
107. 250,000 nuances?
Not likely. Ramsey is many things, a diplomat is not really among them. I daresay the protesters from the IMF no doubt agree with me on that.
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AJ BENDER Donating Member (130 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 08:36 AM
Response to Original message
86. Hooray for the Women !
:yourock:

They have thrown down the gauntlet to the Chimp...massive turnouts indicates to me that a lot of people in this country ARE PISSED OFF TO NO END regarding the fascist direction our country has taken over the last four years....MILLIONS will be coming to NYC this summer to stand up against the Repukes. A great big salute & thanks to all of the organizers & participants who made this event a great success...We must take their cue and hit the streets this summer a let the opposition to these treacherous scum be known.


:yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock:
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Hobarticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 12:16 PM
Response to Original message
90. This is the best news I've seen all month...
It means there's still hope.
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ehrnst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 01:28 PM
Response to Original message
94. See the NARAL photo gallery o' the March
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Logansquare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
97. I was there! Reports of the death of feminism are greatly exaggerated
to paraphrase Mr. Twain. I was overjoyed at the hundreds of thousands of young women (and men) marching on Sunday. Every snarky journalist who ever wrote that women's rights are irrelevant to generation Y can jump off a cliff!
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argyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 10:11 PM
Response to Original message
105. Great news.Let's break this record in New York City in September.
xx
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2Design Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 11:55 PM
Response to Original message
112. Great event to pull in more women for democrats
If women want to be treated better, get better pay, get better jobs, not be open to assault, be in charge once they are pregnant and not have to give up their bodies to the state to decide things for them ...yes I think we can get repubs...

No women once pregnant is going to want to give up their decision making to the state or federal government and right now the way the laws have been written this year at the federal level and in previous years in some states....that is exactly what is happening.

Courts are deciding whether a woman has to have a cesarian. Courts are deciding a fetus is more important than the women. Catholic Hospitals have always had this. If the choice is between saving the mother or saving the baby, they will save the baby.

Most woment do not want to give up this much control over their pregnant bodies......this is a HUGE issue and once women truly realize what the government is doing.......they are going to revolt
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