Clarke Calls Iraq War 'Enormous Mistake'

[NNN0LHI]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040627/ap_on_re_us/iraq_richard_clarke&cid=519&ncid=1473

ORLANDO, Fla. - The invasion of Iraq (news - web sites) was an "enormous mistake" that is costing untold lives, strengthening al-Qaida and breeding a new generation of terrorists, former White House counterterrorism czar Richard Clarke said Saturday.


"We did exactly what al-Qaida said we would do — invade and occupy an oil-rich Arab country that wasn't threatening us in any way," Clarke said before giving the keynote address at the American Library Association's annual convention in Orlando. "The hatred that has been engendered by this invasion will last for generations."


Clarke, a counterterrorism adviser to the past three presidents, wrote the book "Against All Enemies," which strongly criticizes the Bush administration for making Iraq a top priority and for underestimating warnings about al-Qaida before the Sept. 11 attacks.


Clarke said the United States will lose the war on terrorism if it loses the battle of ideas against extremists in the Middle East.

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[orthogonal]

1. More like a miserable failure

"Enormous mistake"?

More like a http://www.whitehouse.gov/president/gwbbio.html">miserable failure.

[Branjor]

2. The link doesn't work. n/t

[Sparky McGruff]

12. Then try the link at the bottom of the page.

Then try the "miserable failure" link at the very bottom of the page. It's on every page at DU.

[demoman123]

17. Actually, it's a crime. Or rather, a crime spree. N/T

[teryang]

3. The FBI cleared them, what a joke n/t

[54anickel]

I would be interested in a review of Moore's movie by Clarke. n/t

[teryang]

6. I'm not

I don't need a government career employee to interpret anything for me.

The FBI bears a major responsibility for 911.

[54anickel]

7. Interpret for me? No, I'd just like his opinion on some of the points

made in the movie, not just on the FBI or the Saudi quick exit.

[teryang]

8. He is a witness to history

I think his testimony as such is important. I don't care what his opinion is.

[nolabels]

10. Would that change if people wanted to know what your opinion was also?

I often find people here so enlightening, many bring the best they have while others think people owe them (thats okay it takes all kinds,don't it). I also find it easy to dismiss much of the garbage the get filtered to us through the mass disinformation machine.

But all that stuff they do just makes the truth just that much powerful (once we found out how we have been lied to) and I do thank you for your opinion

[teryang]

11. The difference between a an actor in events

...and a spectator is crucial. Clarke cannot be a witness to events in which he played a role and an expert whose opinion is entitled to much weight at the same time.

My opinion as a non-participant in the greatest national security blunder of recent history, is entitled to more weight than Clarke's as are many others here. If you don't understand the probative differences, that reflects on your ability to evaluate evidence in its different modes and its respective sources not mine. His statement concerning the FBI and the Saudi exodus is simply a case in point which proves his opinion is hopelessly biased.

[nolabels]

13. I understand why he cannot have the position as being objective

In the neutral sense, but I not willing to dismiss anything he has to say. The prosecution in court mostly don't dismiss everything the accused has to say. I would be interested in knowing how why the assumption could be so false, why they would have believed them to be true. Then also why all these stories with false pretense build on each other to create a spin in their self.

They present fantasies based on fantasies because of the very real fear they have, a fear in which they will be seen as deceptive all along. They have to do things so much in such a way that they even have tell themselves the lies over enough so they even believe them. It's just like a religion (they are like junkies in essence).

I can see some secrecy and security measures but would think we would need about only 5% of what we currently have to secure the boarders of the US. These people, they are pieces of empire, mostly for an empire the people here in the US never signed up for. Why should are sons and daughters be sent off to protect interests of global multinationals who even now only want reap the benefits of what they can steal from us?

A piece of that puzzle in knowing why they think like this would be in such a person as Clarke and that is what I was getting at.

[teryang]

14. I wouldn't dismiss "anything he says" either

His statements as to fact are important and should be considered. An opinion unsubstantiated with facts and in fact contradicted with we we know about the circumstantial evidence should be disregarded.

His remarks about the hasty Saudi exodus are self serving and conclusory. I submit that he has both no personal knowledge concerning any "investigation" of such departing immigrants or visitors because there was none and therefore has no basis for a persuasive opinion (on this particular point).

[nolabels]

15. I think I should have stated my opinion about opinion earlier

Which is that most things are a kind of opinion based on agreed assumptions. Some more changing than others, but opinion. (my bad)

Red is Red, but to a dog rummaging for scraps left by his master, it's just another shade of grey

I disagreed with most everything I heard the man say in them televised hearings, but eh thats just me. I just liked to listen to it for a scope of which I could understand how these people like to use these so called "testimony" encounters to further this crusade of deceptions they seem so willing to perpetuate.

I do have contempt for these kind of people for the simple reason they seem to have much the same contempt for us and the rest of the other people that inhabit the world. We are just things to them.

[nolabels]

9. Good for you

Looking at the truth, ie. anybodies and every bodies opinion, the facts and evidence, results and whatever else we can come up with is our best hope. I am in the process of answering with a few choice words this blanket E-mail sent me by the Kerry campaign especially about this part of letter

The Bush-Cheney campaign must pull this ad off of its website. The use of Adolf Hitler by any campaign, politician or party is simply wrong.

If we cannot discuss and relate about history..........well anybody can guess the rest :shrug:

"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws.' - Plato (427-347 B.C.)"

http://www.miniluv.com/mt/mt-comments.cgi?entry_id=47

Btw I do understand what is good for goose is good for the gander, and just because you are working to diffuse the theory of implications is not indication the theory will work.........George

On edit:I always try to remember who brought up the subject first, they are usually the ones with the most to lose. John Kerry a Hitler sympathizer, next they will probably want me to believe that he came over with them little green men :tinfoilhat:

[54anickel]

16. Thanks, I think. I would be curious to know more of why he thinks

making the Saudi exit a big part of the movie was a mistake on Moores part. Is this one of those areas that they've done plenty of CYA action that it would be the easiest to rebuke? I'd like his thoughts on what parts of the film Shrubco will try to refute and what "evidence" they might try to base their arguments on.

Sort of a heads up, because you know that if there is one point in the film that is easily refuted, they will try to use it to refute it all. Much like the NRA did for Moores Columbine film. I didn't do the homework on that film and so had no comeback for the NRA argument with the B-i-L on the spot.

I just like to get as many talking points as possible for the B-i-L as well as for my own curiosity.

Not sure if I've explained myself well enough, but I just prefer to get as much input as possible and do my own critical thinking and analysis.

[Demeter]

4. So Let's Not Compound the Error

Get the Hell out of IRAQ NOW!

[nolabels]

5. He also states

The United States' ideological credibility has been undermined by revelations of the mistreatment of Iraqi prisoners at the Abu Ghraib prison and the release of documents that showed U.S. government attorneys conducted a legal analysis of what constituted torture, Clarke said.

Which proves to me quite well that all the dinosaurs that roam around the beltway missed the boat. Yea, we here the United States of America don't need worry about any problems we our selves create, we can just focus on every other real or imagined problem we created for other people.

This man is really pitiful and poor scared man, he thinks his enemies are around every corner, and is helped to create the world he wanted to perceive in some way.

To rationalize torture and murder as mere mistreatment, to euphemistically say you will take them out (bomb them from the sky till there is no movement is seen)

I don't know how big Hell is but if there is such a place, I am sure they will invent a way to make it bigger :nopity: